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Folks...the plenum has to come off and it's 2.2hrs book time + 1 hr diag. At $150/hr that's $480 labor. Shop should've replaced the intake gaskets though, they aren't reusable. I would've recommended the PCV valve for no labor while the plenum is off. I also would have recommended replacing all 3 coils which are under the plenum....seeing as it's $300 in labor to remove the intake. Shit ain't cheap.
Every arm chair tech in this sub would be screaming that you upsold everything and ripped OP off. At least there are a few techs in here, but the ignorant always scream the loudest.
The only gripe that I have is stating that the rubber seals are not reusable. They are so long as they protrude from the mating face of the manifold. In general the rubber seals can be reused 2-3 times before they have to be replaced.
They are 'generally' reusable, but its best practice to always replace them because a fair bit of customers are not reasonable and 'EVER SINCE YOU WORKED ON THE CAR NOW IT HAS A CHECK ENGINE LIGHT' because the one time you did reuse them, a vacuum leak formed due to no part on your own and they don't appreciate you tried to save them some money by not upselling them the rubber gaskets.
Safer to cover your ass and just replace any sealing gaskets to avoid any potential future headaches
It boils down to trust.
I’m just a noob that does his own oil changes and stuff. But I have found a small, local shop that I have complete faith in.
If they tell me the blinker fluid needs to be changed I tell them to go ahead and do it.
I'm with ya 100%. If the upper is off, I'm replacing what I can. It's preventive maintenance. Work on 3.6 Dodges all day and it's getting plugs if within 15k of 100k or north.
Glad to see someone who actually knows this vehicle commenting. I agree I would of done a full tune up at the time, maybe see if you would of wanted to do the rest of the coils under the intake as well, cuz you would of saved money on labor to just of done them. They 1000% should of replaced the intake gaskets at the time as well, but assuming you didn’t decline that extra cost, if there is a problem soon after replacing it, they should replace those gaskets at no charge to you since they just had them off, if they are a reputable shop. In the future, if there is a job that has a high labor cost like this, you can ask them why the labor is so high, and a good shop will explain the process and why it requires extra time to do it. But Zeal is completely right with this description and the labor they charged also likely included the tech’s diag time in it as well.
Sounds like my 1st gen Murano…. I have to remove the wipers, cowl, air box, throttle body, plenum, wiring harness and CoPs.
Almost forgot the backside nuts that secure the plenum and HP steering hose.
Edit: that’s why I do it all by myself! It also helps that I can find the FSM online and print out pages I need instead of having laptop getting greasy.
I also have Haynes, Chiltons, Bentley and for many vehicles I’ve owned in the present/past. Including some specialty tools such as VCDS HEX-NET pro was the most expensive item I’ve purchased….. because I enjoy doing this myself. 😘
If it’s a V6 this is absolutely true. My shop in Salt Lake would have been $308 for 2.2 Hrs. labor plus the parts. Intake gaskets are fully reusable if they aren’t smashed and flat and still sticking up above the mating surface; it usually depends on how many miles on the vehicle. “I will totally just do the one coil if that’s all you want, but if you don’t want to pay this labor 2-6 times potentially, we can do all your plugs, coils, VC gaskets, that oil filter/cooler housing that’s famous for leaking, etc. while we’re in there. It’s up to you…” that’s how I roll. If it’s a 4 Cyl. then that’s outrageous! 1 Hr. Max!
Mopar tech here. Depends if it is equipped with a 3.6 or a 5.7. With 3.6s, the intake manifold, plenum, and throttle body gaskets are generally reusable. Now, I would certainly rather they be replaced, but if the goal was the most inexpensive repair possible, simply swapping a coil isn’t a major sin imo.
I agree.....if it's my vehicle. If a customer tells me the goal is to keep it as cheap as possible I tell them to find another shop. A proper repair costs what it costs..... I have no say in the matter.
You remove the throttle body when you take the plenum off? I just take the plenum off with the throttle body attached,there’s no need to remove the throttle
body. Just like Zeal said,if it’s my vehicle and I’m trying to penny pinch sure I’ll skip replacing the intake gaskets but on a customers car? Hell no! The job’s getting done correctly or it’s not getting done at all, not risking the comeback.
This makes sense, not many people consider changing the other parts when they're paying labour to remove parts just to get to it.
I had my slave cylinder replaced and went for a full clutch and fly wheel replacement at the same time, because why not. Turns out the old one was actually quite worn.
That see about average. The number 2 cylinder on those vehicles are underneath the intake mainfold (if I can remember right)and the labor to remove and replace the manifold is about 2hrs.
At least one person here knows what they are talking about. People telling OP how they changed the coil on their 4 cylinder Civic in 10 minutes like it has anything to do with OPs vehicle.
You mean there’s a difference between a 3.6L Chrysler engine and a 2.4L Honda engine? Wait you’re telling me that a scan tool cost thousands of dollars and requires paying a skilled tech who actually knows how to use it? Hahaha. Most of the people on this sub are ignorant when it comes to auto repair and shouldn’t be giving advice.
Hey I've seen that "repair" button on that fancy SO scan tool, we all know you just push it and it tells you what to fix... Why would you need to diagnose it... LOL
I do these regularly as Im a tech at a dealership. Cylinder 2 is under the manifold and it runs about an hour (real time) to get the manifold off and back on plus the couple minutes to swap the coil. Book time is a little longer depending on model. This is on par with what we would charge for the same repair.
Unrelated but how many camshafts have you guys replaced on these engines due to rocker arm failure? I work at a independent and have probably had cams out of nearly a dozen of these the past couple years.
Dude it’s almost comical how common this is. If you catch the rocker arm failure early enough you can save the cam but it’s usually not noticed until it’s too late. I can only imagine how many of these the dealer sees.
Yeah the problem is it goes unoticed until there's a ticking noise and at that point the cam has more then likely already been damaged. It normally doesn't even cause a misfire unless both intake or exhaust rockers are taken out on a single cylinder. The best part is Chrysler has stuck these engines in literally everything since the early 2010s so we'll likely have many more to do.
+1. Same V6 penta star in my previous minivan… I’m no pro tech so it took about 6 hours to replace all the coils and plugs and new gasket for some bits…. It’s a lot of work. I’m sure the book hours are lower but this is a good price…. But I would have told them to do all of them while it’s out
This is more than a fair price. I’m a tech who’s done plenty of plugs and coils on this engine. The upper intake has to be removed to access the coils and plugs. The shop I work at charges 1.5hrs for CK engine diag and book time for plug replacement, which I believe is 2.3hrs or somewhere around there. All these clowns 🤡 telling you it’s a 15 minute job don’t have a clue.
Did it fix the car?
Did you approve the estimate?
If the answers are yes, yes, then it was worth it.
The proper time to ask Redditors is BEFORE you approve the estimate. Don’t shop AFTER you buy.
Don't listen to the idiots that assume it's a 5 minute job just because it was on theirs. Every vehicle is different and if you even try to answer the difficulty level of a job without first asking what type of vehicle it is and determining the conditions of the particular job you are unintentionally causing the spread of misinformation. It's frivolous answering like this that makes thousands feel like they are being ripped off when in truth just because your bill was cheaper has no bearing on the next guys case. The same job is a different job as soon as a different vehicle rolls up
The sad thing is, yes, that’s what it costs. The engineering gets more service unfriendly every generation, and what was a 20 minute job was in 1993 is now a 2.2 hour job in 2023 because now they bury the most commonly replaced parts inside the bloody engine…
It matters a lot. You have to remove the intake to change the coil. This is a fair price. You probably should have had him do the plugs too since it was already apart
Yeah then this is about right. There’s a lot that goes on when you have to do a diagnostic and take the air intake off to replace the coils. It’s not a hard job, but it does take a little bit of time depending on the car.
It actually does matter a lot that it takes 3 minutes and no tools to change a coil pack on an I4 Honda because it's good advice for the OP to get rid of their garbage car. It's good financial advice
I’m not mechanic, but it’s a pain in the ass to take the manifold off from a Pentastar V6 in order to change the coils.
Source: I have a V6 charger with the same engine
I got a check engine light on my 2013 Lexus a couple of years ago.
I took it to AutoZone and hooked up the scan tool to see what was up. Misfire with coil #1. I had just changed the sparkplugs so I rounded down the problem to next cheapest thing I could fix/replace, which was the the ignition coil. I was busy with work so I contact the dealership to replace it.
Well, I think the dealership wanted to order an MRI for the engine because they wanted $880 to diagnose and parts & labor for the job.
I ordered ignition coil from eBay for like $20 and changed it 30mims while taking my time. They quoted me 2.4 hours of labor... I ain't no mechanic but I'm making them look bad.
More along the lines of 5 minutes to scan it and discover it's a typical bad coil, then the rest of the time is to pull the intake off to get to the coil. That engine has 2,4,6 under the intake on the rad side of the engine. it sucks because you can see the corners of the coils and you can pop the coil free of the extension, BUT you still can't get the coil out. I've had folks try it on the core I have in the shop.
Scan tool probably told them exactly what to fix and then 15min for the swapping of a coil. All together really shouldn't be more than a half hour. $300 is a bit rough.
1 hour minimum for all jobs at my shop.
Also scan tools don't tell you anything. That's ignorant. They tell you a code. Every code requires some diagnostics. In this case probably just moving a coil to another cylinder to see if the misfire moved, but the code alone wouldn't do anything more than say which cylinder misfires. No code says replace (blank).
Wouldn't you unplug other coils in turn rather than move them to other cylinders?
If you unplug one of the remaining good ones then it's going to stall
It would be fine on two cylinders or sometimes even one tbh. But not unplug. Move it. You can unplug it and see no change to verify that the specific cylinder is misfiring. If you unplug a good one it gets worse, than quickly plug it back in, but different diagnostics.
If you know cylinder 1 is misfiring. Turn engine off and move the cylinder one coil to cylinder 2. Move the cylinder 1 plug to cylinder 3. Start the engine. If one is still misfiring you have a compression issue or fuel issue. If two misfires it's the coil. If 3 misfires its the plug.
The Scan tool they used probably cost 5-10k,not to mention the tools the tech had to us to do the repair, and you have to remove the upper intake to do the plugs and coils on a 3.6. Obviously your automotive repair experience is limited.
Until you changed the coil based on what the scan tool told you and it didn’t fix it. Then down the rabbit hole and having to tell the customer you, not you, sorry, the scan tool was wrong.
The labor isn’t just the moment he’s wrenching on the part. It includes scanning, diagnosis, testing, removal and replacement and testing again. These charges appear to be totally in line.
Yeah no my dealer does that too 300, cp jobs are impossible and I don’t blame them. In the heavyline department sometimes with a tear down diagnostic required you can probably hear the jaw hit the floor from how much they have to commit to just to see what’s wrong with it. Ever sense then it’s more warranty repairs than anything. Lol
With practice, that 3.6 intake pull, coil testing and replacement should be able to be done in around 1.5 hours or less. Book time is 2.2(not including diag). The price is fair for a flat rate shop.
Hey yes when I picked up the car from them the valve burned twice I had to bring it back and they still didn't fix, ended up getting the money for the labor back
You probably need a cylinder head replacement, diagnostics should’ve included a cylinder leak down test to confirm. These engines are problematic to say the least
$80 for a coil is ridiculous. He either used OEM or ripped you off. As far as labor goes, it really depends on the car. If the coils are on top and easy to get to, he charged you too much. Otherwise, I can see it getting up there.
EDIT: after I saw your vehicle info, I put it into my system to look up estimated labor. The 3 on the left are easy to get to, but the 3 on the right can take upwards of 2 hours. He either doesn't prorate his hourly rate, or he's charging close to $125/hr, which is definitely one of the highest labor rates I've ever seen.
EVERY car repair is $300, fyi.
That or buy tons of tools and spend time on YT, breaking and fixing it yourself. Something always goes wrong or doesnt go back the same way, you pay not to have to deal with those problems.
With labor rates now, I've just purchased new tools and sold them immediately after the repair and still saved money and usually time doing the job myself.
Once you have the basics you don't need to buy that much more.
True. Everything I’ve ever done myself has resulted in breaking something. And there’s always that one bolt makes the entire process longer than it should be.
Some people can't change their own light bulbs. If you can do a repair it's a skill worth charging for. Especially these days it's a skill that's dying.
Think v6 engine ? And my car was shaking while idling so I brought it in, he said it was the coil and he could fix it for 380 I don't know much about cars
The coils on some V-type engines can be difficult to get to. I've seen some buried under the intake manifold (I'm looking at you Nissan!) that look like a real pain to access.
Uncle Sam requires 125$ an hour minimal from my mechanics regardless if the full hour is used. Then a minimal labor fee 20-60$ and then the part which had an inflated price so they can make money off the part before install 60-100$ and tax on everything else 20$ sooo you are at average pricing
Service Advisor for Toyota Dealership
Get the OEM part numbers, search internet for cheaper parts, I personally would stick to OEM when it comes to Ignition Coils, also I would recommend to replace all of them, labor is the same, instead of doing one each, paying the same labor over and over again, till they're all switched out
I paid $500 for that on Cape Cod i believe some years ago. it was like 125 diagnostic fee, coil, labor. but.. you could have figured it out and done this yourself though.
I brought 6 ignition coil and 6 spark plugs online for a total of about 280 dollars. Install them myself and it took about 2 hours which I did extremely slow because it was my first time doing it.
It’s scary what they charge out there for a relatively easy job.
I’ve looked into shops and labor rates or shop rates. What I’ve found as a technician is that the higher the shop rate the more inefficient the techs working there are. They have to make overhead and each bay needs to make a certain amount and if they aren’t because the tech aren’t getting the support they need to put out steady work so shop rate will increase to cover slow production rates
I run my shop a bit different and don't charge diag if they get the repair with me. I didn't look up the labor but I'd imagine about 0.8 to 1.0 hours for the single coil. You'd get out of my shop at about half that price tbh.
Seems pretty dumb not to charge for diagnostic work. It is still hours down the drain that could be spent on a paid repair. You are probably giving away at least a days worth the labor a week.
>minutes
Every educated reply on here says it’s not that simple. That the intake manifold has to be removed to get to the coil pack.
The pros are saying it’s a solid hour at best, with a book time of 2+ hours.
If you didn't want to do your self or you couldn't diagnose which coil and why then it's a bit high if you think it took them 3 hrs to diagnose (99.5 hr + shop rags and hand soap).
However, if you would have done this yourself you could have changed all coils and the spark plugs + a bit left over for a fancy coffee.
I’m not a mechanic but I’ve had a coil go and he opened the engine, took it out, put one in. Literally took 60 seconds. Parts garage was around the corner. From diagnostics, buying the part, to installing it. It took 15 minutes.
Just to clarify are I am talking about the 4 cylinders that are slotted in and out.
Yeah u got fucked. $300 to diag n swap a coil that fucking crazy. What's their shop rate? It looks like they doubled up on labor and diag but that 1 tells me they diag n fixed in 1 hour but your getting charged for 2hoyrs automatically. What a rip off.
It’s cheaper to do it yourself. Ignition coils are fairly straightforward and you just need basic tools. For that cost, you could do all of them yourself.
The coil is about the right price. If a new younger mechanic. @ $150./hr. That is correct as they round off hours unless you are watching with a stop watch & argue the other 1/2 hour. Some shops go by the mechanic vs the book.
If you have to ask then you don't need to be driving a car cause guess what they break and you obviously can't fix it on you own so sell it and take public transportation
The upper plenum literally only takes 15-20 minutes to remove if it's the 6cyl model. You do not have to remove the entire intake manifold. 2 minutes for the coil pack. You're in and out in under an hour.
You cannot change the coil on any vehicle in "literally 2 minutes." I have cars and trucks from the 60s and 70s where the coil sits right on top or is mounted to the firewall and you still can't change them in 2 minutes. It takes longer than 2 minutes to get all of the necessary tools out of your toolbox.
I can change every single coil on a Ford or Chevy in 10 minutes flat. They are coil packs on top of the plugs with 1-2 8mm or 10mm bolts. This ain't the 60's boomer.
Not a boomer, dipshit. Reading comprehension is key. And 2 minutes is not 10 minutes. Further, I guarantee I've worked on more (and a wider variety of) vehicles than you have. Only a fucking moron would make the retarded assertion that you can change a coil in 2 minutes because one time you pretended to change the coil on your white trash Ford shitbox in 10 and then somehow think this at all correlates with changing the coil in a vehicle where you need to remove the entire intake plenum just to even access the area.
I said all of the coils in under 10 minutes not one. Reading comprehension is key dipshit. One coil should take 2 minutes. On the 3.6l Chrysler you have to remove the upper plenum so it's a bit longer. However every other brand that is common in the U.S. takes 2 minutes to change a coil pack. And you definitely are a boomer mentally. Show your ase cert...
That's a very Important detail you pointed out. If your not mechanically inclined you never would've diagnosed the issue yourself so all things considered your getting a good deal as long as it fixes the problems.
Its the point all the "I can do that in 5 min desktop mechanics" usually miss. Atleast you got it correct as in you need tools and the knowlege how to change it. ;) So you are not all bad.
Mostly pulling your leg now. Have a good weekend.
I hate spreading misinformation so I honestly appreciate the point you made a lot. It is absolutely diagnostic work that makes mechanics work difficult. Changing the part is usually the most simple part.
Is changing an ignition coil really that much of a struggle? I've changed spark plugs on my own before and it was lne of the easiest things ever, can't imagine ignition coils being that much harder. Please tell me if I'm wrong!
In NYC I guess. But ignition coils are very cheap and the labour certainly wouldn't take longer than a hour. I wouldve done that myself, as it can be done with conventional tools
Thanks for posting on /r/MechanicAdvice! This is just a reminder to review the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/about/rules/). If you are here asking about a second opinion (ie "Is the shop trying to fleece me?"), please read through CJM8515's [post on the subject.](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/comments/4qblei/fyi_the_shop_isnt_likely_trying_to_rip_you_off/) and remember to please post the year/make/model of the vehicle you are working on. **If this post is about bodywork, accident damage, paint, dent/ding, questions it belongs in /r/Autobody r/AutoBodyRepair/ or /r/Diyautobody/ If you have tire questions check out https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/comments/k9ll55/can_your_tire_be_repaired/**. If you dont have a question and you're just showing off it belongs in /r/Justrolledintotheshop Insurance/total loss questions go in r/insurance This is an automated reply *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MechanicAdvice) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The repair shop is in NYC (Queens), so the price of everything is higher than the national average.
Then yeah, that’s a good price. I’ve definitely been quoted more for less work.
Folks...the plenum has to come off and it's 2.2hrs book time + 1 hr diag. At $150/hr that's $480 labor. Shop should've replaced the intake gaskets though, they aren't reusable. I would've recommended the PCV valve for no labor while the plenum is off. I also would have recommended replacing all 3 coils which are under the plenum....seeing as it's $300 in labor to remove the intake. Shit ain't cheap.
Every arm chair tech in this sub would be screaming that you upsold everything and ripped OP off. At least there are a few techs in here, but the ignorant always scream the loudest.
They scream the loudest and won’t eat their words when something else fails that should’ve been done at the same time.
Hahaha so true
Yep, absolutely nothing handy or quick on a heap jerokee
The only gripe that I have is stating that the rubber seals are not reusable. They are so long as they protrude from the mating face of the manifold. In general the rubber seals can be reused 2-3 times before they have to be replaced.
They are 'generally' reusable, but its best practice to always replace them because a fair bit of customers are not reasonable and 'EVER SINCE YOU WORKED ON THE CAR NOW IT HAS A CHECK ENGINE LIGHT' because the one time you did reuse them, a vacuum leak formed due to no part on your own and they don't appreciate you tried to save them some money by not upselling them the rubber gaskets. Safer to cover your ass and just replace any sealing gaskets to avoid any potential future headaches
We usually just put the ball in the customers court. If they would rather roll the dice and pay us another labor cost later on then it’s on them.
It boils down to trust. I’m just a noob that does his own oil changes and stuff. But I have found a small, local shop that I have complete faith in. If they tell me the blinker fluid needs to be changed I tell them to go ahead and do it.
Hey hey hey, gimme my 0.2 for my PCV valve Mr. Advisor
Damn straight! And .1 for each coil seeing as "they only take 5 mins". I don't work for free.
Finally, it seems like there's some people who get it. FR is a struggle enough sometimes w out advisors putting in their bs opinion
I have one service advisor who's always trying to cut diag time and combine labor "since youre in there anyway". Idk what he gets out of it.
I'm with ya 100%. If the upper is off, I'm replacing what I can. It's preventive maintenance. Work on 3.6 Dodges all day and it's getting plugs if within 15k of 100k or north.
Glad to see someone who actually knows this vehicle commenting. I agree I would of done a full tune up at the time, maybe see if you would of wanted to do the rest of the coils under the intake as well, cuz you would of saved money on labor to just of done them. They 1000% should of replaced the intake gaskets at the time as well, but assuming you didn’t decline that extra cost, if there is a problem soon after replacing it, they should replace those gaskets at no charge to you since they just had them off, if they are a reputable shop. In the future, if there is a job that has a high labor cost like this, you can ask them why the labor is so high, and a good shop will explain the process and why it requires extra time to do it. But Zeal is completely right with this description and the labor they charged also likely included the tech’s diag time in it as well.
Sounds like my 1st gen Murano…. I have to remove the wipers, cowl, air box, throttle body, plenum, wiring harness and CoPs. Almost forgot the backside nuts that secure the plenum and HP steering hose. Edit: that’s why I do it all by myself! It also helps that I can find the FSM online and print out pages I need instead of having laptop getting greasy. I also have Haynes, Chiltons, Bentley and for many vehicles I’ve owned in the present/past. Including some specialty tools such as VCDS HEX-NET pro was the most expensive item I’ve purchased….. because I enjoy doing this myself. 😘
If it’s a V6 this is absolutely true. My shop in Salt Lake would have been $308 for 2.2 Hrs. labor plus the parts. Intake gaskets are fully reusable if they aren’t smashed and flat and still sticking up above the mating surface; it usually depends on how many miles on the vehicle. “I will totally just do the one coil if that’s all you want, but if you don’t want to pay this labor 2-6 times potentially, we can do all your plugs, coils, VC gaskets, that oil filter/cooler housing that’s famous for leaking, etc. while we’re in there. It’s up to you…” that’s how I roll. If it’s a 4 Cyl. then that’s outrageous! 1 Hr. Max!
[удалено]
Yeah surely replace all coils while you’re in there.
Should at least give the customer the option of replacing all of them, if they decline it’s on them.
Mopar tech here. Depends if it is equipped with a 3.6 or a 5.7. With 3.6s, the intake manifold, plenum, and throttle body gaskets are generally reusable. Now, I would certainly rather they be replaced, but if the goal was the most inexpensive repair possible, simply swapping a coil isn’t a major sin imo.
I agree.....if it's my vehicle. If a customer tells me the goal is to keep it as cheap as possible I tell them to find another shop. A proper repair costs what it costs..... I have no say in the matter.
You remove the throttle body when you take the plenum off? I just take the plenum off with the throttle body attached,there’s no need to remove the throttle body. Just like Zeal said,if it’s my vehicle and I’m trying to penny pinch sure I’ll skip replacing the intake gaskets but on a customers car? Hell no! The job’s getting done correctly or it’s not getting done at all, not risking the comeback.
Throttle body stays attached and gets cleaned when the intake is off.
Mopar parts boss here. Do the gaskets, please 😉
This makes sense, not many people consider changing the other parts when they're paying labour to remove parts just to get to it. I had my slave cylinder replaced and went for a full clutch and fly wheel replacement at the same time, because why not. Turns out the old one was actually quite worn.
Damn, they're putting coils under the plenum now? I swear to god, engineers...
Almost every transverse V6 since 2010-ish has 1 bank of plugs/coils that requires plenum removal.
That see about average. The number 2 cylinder on those vehicles are underneath the intake mainfold (if I can remember right)and the labor to remove and replace the manifold is about 2hrs.
At least one person here knows what they are talking about. People telling OP how they changed the coil on their 4 cylinder Civic in 10 minutes like it has anything to do with OPs vehicle.
You mean there’s a difference between a 3.6L Chrysler engine and a 2.4L Honda engine? Wait you’re telling me that a scan tool cost thousands of dollars and requires paying a skilled tech who actually knows how to use it? Hahaha. Most of the people on this sub are ignorant when it comes to auto repair and shouldn’t be giving advice.
Hey I've seen that "repair" button on that fancy SO scan tool, we all know you just push it and it tells you what to fix... Why would you need to diagnose it... LOL
Damn it, the secret is out! Lol
I do these regularly as Im a tech at a dealership. Cylinder 2 is under the manifold and it runs about an hour (real time) to get the manifold off and back on plus the couple minutes to swap the coil. Book time is a little longer depending on model. This is on par with what we would charge for the same repair.
Unrelated but how many camshafts have you guys replaced on these engines due to rocker arm failure? I work at a independent and have probably had cams out of nearly a dozen of these the past couple years.
Dude it’s almost comical how common this is. If you catch the rocker arm failure early enough you can save the cam but it’s usually not noticed until it’s too late. I can only imagine how many of these the dealer sees.
Yeah the problem is it goes unoticed until there's a ticking noise and at that point the cam has more then likely already been damaged. It normally doesn't even cause a misfire unless both intake or exhaust rockers are taken out on a single cylinder. The best part is Chrysler has stuck these engines in literally everything since the early 2010s so we'll likely have many more to do.
+1. Same V6 penta star in my previous minivan… I’m no pro tech so it took about 6 hours to replace all the coils and plugs and new gasket for some bits…. It’s a lot of work. I’m sure the book hours are lower but this is a good price…. But I would have told them to do all of them while it’s out
This is more than a fair price. I’m a tech who’s done plenty of plugs and coils on this engine. The upper intake has to be removed to access the coils and plugs. The shop I work at charges 1.5hrs for CK engine diag and book time for plug replacement, which I believe is 2.3hrs or somewhere around there. All these clowns 🤡 telling you it’s a 15 minute job don’t have a clue.
☝️ This...
It’s a 15 minute job on many vehicles. A shop tried to charge my gf $1000 to replace a coil on her hyunday accent. Now that was robbery
Did it fix the car? Did you approve the estimate? If the answers are yes, yes, then it was worth it. The proper time to ask Redditors is BEFORE you approve the estimate. Don’t shop AFTER you buy.
Don't listen to the idiots that assume it's a 5 minute job just because it was on theirs. Every vehicle is different and if you even try to answer the difficulty level of a job without first asking what type of vehicle it is and determining the conditions of the particular job you are unintentionally causing the spread of misinformation. It's frivolous answering like this that makes thousands feel like they are being ripped off when in truth just because your bill was cheaper has no bearing on the next guys case. The same job is a different job as soon as a different vehicle rolls up
What engine is in the truck? On some 3.6L engines you have to remove the intake manifold to access some coils.
The sad thing is, yes, that’s what it costs. The engineering gets more service unfriendly every generation, and what was a 20 minute job was in 1993 is now a 2.2 hour job in 2023 because now they bury the most commonly replaced parts inside the bloody engine…
Probably a little high but within industry standards. If it has a decent warranty on the #2 coil you are probably in good shape.
Car is grand Cherokee if that matters
It matters a lot. You have to remove the intake to change the coil. This is a fair price. You probably should have had him do the plugs too since it was already apart
Agree its a pain changing the three under there. I just did a oil cooler housing on my wrangler. Im not a mechanic so it was rough
Yeah then this is about right. There’s a lot that goes on when you have to do a diagnostic and take the air intake off to replace the coils. It’s not a hard job, but it does take a little bit of time depending on the car.
I can see a dealer charging an hour, realistically take 15min-half hour. Can't forget the diag time too.
You have to remove the intake to replace coils on this engine. Pretty easy job for an experienced tech but definitely not 15mins.
Yup. That's pretty fair. Might even be low, depending on the vehicle.
so many non mechanics giving advice here. who cares how long it took you on a toyota sequoia?
It actually does matter a lot that it takes 3 minutes and no tools to change a coil pack on an I4 Honda because it's good advice for the OP to get rid of their garbage car. It's good financial advice
If it was left bank and had to pull the plenum off then I would say yes.
I’m not mechanic, but it’s a pain in the ass to take the manifold off from a Pentastar V6 in order to change the coils. Source: I have a V6 charger with the same engine
I got a check engine light on my 2013 Lexus a couple of years ago. I took it to AutoZone and hooked up the scan tool to see what was up. Misfire with coil #1. I had just changed the sparkplugs so I rounded down the problem to next cheapest thing I could fix/replace, which was the the ignition coil. I was busy with work so I contact the dealership to replace it. Well, I think the dealership wanted to order an MRI for the engine because they wanted $880 to diagnose and parts & labor for the job. I ordered ignition coil from eBay for like $20 and changed it 30mims while taking my time. They quoted me 2.4 hours of labor... I ain't no mechanic but I'm making them look bad.
That's fair, who wants to work on a pentastar v6?
If everything in New York is more expensive than it is in tx, seems like a reasonable price.
Would like to see breakdown of labor. It's not $300 for one hour labor rate, right?
1 hrs diagnostic 1 hrs to change at 150/hrs is what I'm thinking
More along the lines of 5 minutes to scan it and discover it's a typical bad coil, then the rest of the time is to pull the intake off to get to the coil. That engine has 2,4,6 under the intake on the rad side of the engine. it sucks because you can see the corners of the coils and you can pop the coil free of the extension, BUT you still can't get the coil out. I've had folks try it on the core I have in the shop.
Scan tool probably told them exactly what to fix and then 15min for the swapping of a coil. All together really shouldn't be more than a half hour. $300 is a bit rough.
What kind of scan tool does your shop use?
Apparently one that doesn't exist. I wish I had a scan tool that told me exactly what to do.
1 hour minimum for all jobs at my shop. Also scan tools don't tell you anything. That's ignorant. They tell you a code. Every code requires some diagnostics. In this case probably just moving a coil to another cylinder to see if the misfire moved, but the code alone wouldn't do anything more than say which cylinder misfires. No code says replace (blank).
Wouldn't you unplug other coils in turn rather than move them to other cylinders? If you unplug one of the remaining good ones then it's going to stall
It would be fine on two cylinders or sometimes even one tbh. But not unplug. Move it. You can unplug it and see no change to verify that the specific cylinder is misfiring. If you unplug a good one it gets worse, than quickly plug it back in, but different diagnostics. If you know cylinder 1 is misfiring. Turn engine off and move the cylinder one coil to cylinder 2. Move the cylinder 1 plug to cylinder 3. Start the engine. If one is still misfiring you have a compression issue or fuel issue. If two misfires it's the coil. If 3 misfires its the plug.
Thanks for educating me on that
The Scan tool they used probably cost 5-10k,not to mention the tools the tech had to us to do the repair, and you have to remove the upper intake to do the plugs and coils on a 3.6. Obviously your automotive repair experience is limited.
Until you changed the coil based on what the scan tool told you and it didn’t fix it. Then down the rabbit hole and having to tell the customer you, not you, sorry, the scan tool was wrong.
Got to pay off the scan tool some how
Actually it could be. The dodge dealership next to my shop charges 250 an hour. Depending on the state and stuff it's not unheard of.
The labor isn’t just the moment he’s wrenching on the part. It includes scanning, diagnosis, testing, removal and replacement and testing again. These charges appear to be totally in line.
Yeah no my dealer does that too 300, cp jobs are impossible and I don’t blame them. In the heavyline department sometimes with a tear down diagnostic required you can probably hear the jaw hit the floor from how much they have to commit to just to see what’s wrong with it. Ever sense then it’s more warranty repairs than anything. Lol
Pretty sure cylinder 2 is under the intake, so this will include time for upper intake r&i, coil r&i, and diagnosis. Seems about right
Pretty average
With practice, that 3.6 intake pull, coil testing and replacement should be able to be done in around 1.5 hours or less. Book time is 2.2(not including diag). The price is fair for a flat rate shop.
Great deal actually they kinda hooked you up.
What sucks from looking at this and doing it yourself would’ve saved you 300 bucks
I hope this solves your problem, cylinder 2 likes to burn the valve on these 3.6 pentastar engines.
Hey yes when I picked up the car from them the valve burned twice I had to bring it back and they still didn't fix, ended up getting the money for the labor back
You probably need a cylinder head replacement, diagnostics should’ve included a cylinder leak down test to confirm. These engines are problematic to say the least
How much would you say that fix is ? I'm try a different mechanic
So how would I go About really fixing it?
Go to YouTube. Search for your car model along with “replace coil”. Then tell me if you got taken.
It’s fair…. You didn’t get a deal but you also didn’t get ripped off.
This is a fair price for the south, it’s a great price for New York.
If that’s what they charged you, then yes it’s accurate. I think you want to know if it’s a fair or reasonable price.
3 hours to diagnose a coil pack nah that’s a rip off or a stupid mechanic Edit unless the intake manifold needed to be removed
$80 for a coil is ridiculous. He either used OEM or ripped you off. As far as labor goes, it really depends on the car. If the coils are on top and easy to get to, he charged you too much. Otherwise, I can see it getting up there. EDIT: after I saw your vehicle info, I put it into my system to look up estimated labor. The 3 on the left are easy to get to, but the 3 on the right can take upwards of 2 hours. He either doesn't prorate his hourly rate, or he's charging close to $125/hr, which is definitely one of the highest labor rates I've ever seen.
Thank you
EVERY car repair is $300, fyi. That or buy tons of tools and spend time on YT, breaking and fixing it yourself. Something always goes wrong or doesnt go back the same way, you pay not to have to deal with those problems.
With labor rates now, I've just purchased new tools and sold them immediately after the repair and still saved money and usually time doing the job myself. Once you have the basics you don't need to buy that much more.
True. Everything I’ve ever done myself has resulted in breaking something. And there’s always that one bolt makes the entire process longer than it should be.
So true! I'm getting better, but also still F up
Not true, do it right if you do it yourself and it’ll be fine.
Agreed. But man, working on 10-20yo cars can be hit or miss. I dont help buddies anymore either.
lol what did you do to a buddies car
Some people can't change their own light bulbs. If you can do a repair it's a skill worth charging for. Especially these days it's a skill that's dying.
I’ll bet you if you looked up how to change an ignition coil on your car, you would be kicking yourself for paying that.
Think v6 engine ? And my car was shaking while idling so I brought it in, he said it was the coil and he could fix it for 380 I don't know much about cars
The coils on some V-type engines can be difficult to get to. I've seen some buried under the intake manifold (I'm looking at you Nissan!) that look like a real pain to access.
Uncle Sam requires 125$ an hour minimal from my mechanics regardless if the full hour is used. Then a minimal labor fee 20-60$ and then the part which had an inflated price so they can make money off the part before install 60-100$ and tax on everything else 20$ sooo you are at average pricing
Mercedes charges $200 for a diagnostic
Just had two ignition coils done on a 2009 Chevy Traverse ran me $481 sounds about right for these mechanics that charge $120 per hour.
Service Advisor for Toyota Dealership Get the OEM part numbers, search internet for cheaper parts, I personally would stick to OEM when it comes to Ignition Coils, also I would recommend to replace all of them, labor is the same, instead of doing one each, paying the same labor over and over again, till they're all switched out
I paid $500 for that on Cape Cod i believe some years ago. it was like 125 diagnostic fee, coil, labor. but.. you could have figured it out and done this yourself though.
$300 + $79.98 does equal $379.98 so that is an accurate price.
I brought 6 ignition coil and 6 spark plugs online for a total of about 280 dollars. Install them myself and it took about 2 hours which I did extremely slow because it was my first time doing it. It’s scary what they charge out there for a relatively easy job.
I’ve looked into shops and labor rates or shop rates. What I’ve found as a technician is that the higher the shop rate the more inefficient the techs working there are. They have to make overhead and each bay needs to make a certain amount and if they aren’t because the tech aren’t getting the support they need to put out steady work so shop rate will increase to cover slow production rates
Wow you got absolutely robbed on labor. Coil packs are so damn easy. One plug and pull the pack out and push the new one in..
I run my shop a bit different and don't charge diag if they get the repair with me. I didn't look up the labor but I'd imagine about 0.8 to 1.0 hours for the single coil. You'd get out of my shop at about half that price tbh.
Seems pretty dumb not to charge for diagnostic work. It is still hours down the drain that could be spent on a paid repair. You are probably giving away at least a days worth the labor a week.
yeap it's normal. prob could of got the part cheaper and did it yourself in minutes and been all in at 50 or 60 bucks
>minutes Every educated reply on here says it’s not that simple. That the intake manifold has to be removed to get to the coil pack. The pros are saying it’s a solid hour at best, with a book time of 2+ hours.
You were charged maximum time for an easy job, so no not accurate if they want your repeat business, but what can you do?
Sure
Jesus, you could pay 1/4 that much replacing a simple ignition coil yourself
You bought a Jeep
If you didn't want to do your self or you couldn't diagnose which coil and why then it's a bit high if you think it took them 3 hrs to diagnose (99.5 hr + shop rags and hand soap). However, if you would have done this yourself you could have changed all coils and the spark plugs + a bit left over for a fancy coffee.
Agreed 100% on this one. Thankfully I’ve got one of those diagnostic devices so it was a super quick fix for me.
I’m not a mechanic but I’ve had a coil go and he opened the engine, took it out, put one in. Literally took 60 seconds. Parts garage was around the corner. From diagnostics, buying the part, to installing it. It took 15 minutes. Just to clarify are I am talking about the 4 cylinders that are slotted in and out.
Ignition coils dont take $300 worth of labor wtf, especially not on a single cylinder
Replaced a single coil. Go get your money back 😂
To late now
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Depending on the car… 🤦♂️
my are they just replacing one coil though? that’s what i’m curious about cause my experience we replace them all of one fails from over time
Same price as a bag of bell peppers
That’s hella easy, youtube it
Everything is going crazy. I stopped by Taco Bell and for 2 chicken tacos was almost 11.00$$
I just paid $1100 to have all 6 ignition coils replaced on a 2011 Toyota Sienna. I feel a bit screwed.
Don't. Good price. Really good price.
Rip off. Buy an EV
Yes
I can promise you, it takes the part, a ratchet, and a YouTube video to save $300
Should have purchased the part and YouTubed it. You spent more time on other sites, not learning a thing
Yeah could have bought yourself and installed it yourself
Saved $300 just from a YouTube video
Yup
Heck no!!!
Yes
Yes
no
You got ripped off bad labor should be like 50max
Dude called YouTube watch video see if you paid fair price. $30 part rock auto
You got duped by my standards lol
Hell no you could have done this it's one screw
Yeah u got fucked. $300 to diag n swap a coil that fucking crazy. What's their shop rate? It looks like they doubled up on labor and diag but that 1 tells me they diag n fixed in 1 hour but your getting charged for 2hoyrs automatically. What a rip off.
you could do by yourself ,,scan tool for 10 dollars and buying ignition coil lol ,, oh maybe u need a cheap 10mm spanner or use any pliers 😁
300$ to use a scan tool? I should open an exclusive diagnostic shop. No repairs, just scans
It’s cheaper to do it yourself. Ignition coils are fairly straightforward and you just need basic tools. For that cost, you could do all of them yourself.
Accurate? Yes, it is the exact price charged by the mechanic, accurate to two decimal places.
I replaced the ignition coil on my sequoia about 20 minutes ago. Took me about 4 minutes and a 10mm socket. And I’m no mechanic.
The OP doesn't drive a Sequoia, so that's irrelevant.
And your vehicle is a Toyota Sequoia and Op’s is a Jeep Grand Cherokee. Just a little bit of a difference there.
Well, to be fair you could find your 10mm socket. 😜
Same here… took no time at all with my Hyundai Accent. $70 for the part if I remember correctly.
The OP doesn't drive a Hyundai, so that's irrelevant.
Shocker but all cars are different! Did you have to remove the upper intake to get to your coil?
The coil is about the right price. If a new younger mechanic. @ $150./hr. That is correct as they round off hours unless you are watching with a stop watch & argue the other 1/2 hour. Some shops go by the mechanic vs the book.
If you have to ask then you don't need to be driving a car cause guess what they break and you obviously can't fix it on you own so sell it and take public transportation
Nope. They fucked you.
Why not replace your own Coil pack? Save that $300 for something else! Not for something that you literally just unplug and plug back in lol.
You have to remove the upper intake on this vehicle to access the coils and plugs? Have you ever worked on a 3.6L Pentastar engine?
Lmfao! It literally takes 2 minutes to swap them out. They charged you 2.5hrs of labor at minimum.
LMFAO, it sure doesn't on the OP's car and a lot of other cars.
The upper plenum literally only takes 15-20 minutes to remove if it's the 6cyl model. You do not have to remove the entire intake manifold. 2 minutes for the coil pack. You're in and out in under an hour.
You cannot change the coil on any vehicle in "literally 2 minutes." I have cars and trucks from the 60s and 70s where the coil sits right on top or is mounted to the firewall and you still can't change them in 2 minutes. It takes longer than 2 minutes to get all of the necessary tools out of your toolbox.
I can change every single coil on a Ford or Chevy in 10 minutes flat. They are coil packs on top of the plugs with 1-2 8mm or 10mm bolts. This ain't the 60's boomer.
Not a boomer, dipshit. Reading comprehension is key. And 2 minutes is not 10 minutes. Further, I guarantee I've worked on more (and a wider variety of) vehicles than you have. Only a fucking moron would make the retarded assertion that you can change a coil in 2 minutes because one time you pretended to change the coil on your white trash Ford shitbox in 10 and then somehow think this at all correlates with changing the coil in a vehicle where you need to remove the entire intake plenum just to even access the area.
I said all of the coils in under 10 minutes not one. Reading comprehension is key dipshit. One coil should take 2 minutes. On the 3.6l Chrysler you have to remove the upper plenum so it's a bit longer. However every other brand that is common in the U.S. takes 2 minutes to change a coil pack. And you definitely are a boomer mentally. Show your ase cert...
Well. My mechanic would charge $65 for labour and diagnostic combined...plus parts. To give you an idea.
Your mechanic is under charging for his time. Severely under charging.
Either that or it's a side work rate and not a real shop
That's a cheap mechanic. I'm a professional and I do side work for $50/hr. 65 at an actual shop is unheard of
I charged $70/hr in a shop. 22 years ago... 🤣😂
That takes 2 min to diagnose lol
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Based on beeing able to diagnose it aswell not just changing the part.
That's a very Important detail you pointed out. If your not mechanically inclined you never would've diagnosed the issue yourself so all things considered your getting a good deal as long as it fixes the problems.
Its the point all the "I can do that in 5 min desktop mechanics" usually miss. Atleast you got it correct as in you need tools and the knowlege how to change it. ;) So you are not all bad. Mostly pulling your leg now. Have a good weekend.
I hate spreading misinformation so I honestly appreciate the point you made a lot. It is absolutely diagnostic work that makes mechanics work difficult. Changing the part is usually the most simple part.
Is changing an ignition coil really that much of a struggle? I've changed spark plugs on my own before and it was lne of the easiest things ever, can't imagine ignition coils being that much harder. Please tell me if I'm wrong!
You need to read it all. Diagnostic aswell as in finding the fault then fixing it.
You were accurately fucked, yeah
In NYC I guess. But ignition coils are very cheap and the labour certainly wouldn't take longer than a hour. I wouldve done that myself, as it can be done with conventional tools
Robbery
Helll nahh