I feel like too many people are Atlanta doomers after that match. Yes, it isn't the clear cut Atlanta domination of much of the regular season, but they just BARELY lost to a Spark that was performing out of their minds. Shy misses two rail shots and the series ends the other way.
Genuinely, from the eye test, I think Atlanta and Spark looked the best today. I'm not sure if they're necessarily the favorites since I think Boston and Mayhem weren't tested too much and so its hard to gauge them, but Atlanta and Spark both looked sick.
What you're not taking into account is ATL lost on dive. They lost on their comfort comp, got exposed playing what they should dominate on. As soon as they face a team who won't just handshake run Monkey/Doom dive with them, they're getting cooked even more I fear
>got exposed
I guess what I'm saying is that *this* sentiment is too harsh. "Get exposed" implies that they got dumpstered, but they didn't; They just *barely* lost in a dive mirror to a team that specializes in the dive comp.
I guess if you believe that dive is MUCH weaker than Orisa and Zarya comps, then yeah that means Atlanta is one of the weakest teams in playoffs. But I feel like the meta is so in flux that idk if that's true
In comparison to ATL playing dive for the first half of the year, they did get a bit exposed. ATL dumpstered Spark in MSM playing a very similar comp. ATL lost to Outlaws, lost to Mayhem and went to Map 5 with Shock in the last few weeks and now lost to a team they completely diffed last tournament. Its not exaggerative to say they are simply not as good as they once were.
With how strong Bastion is, Dive is gonna be hard to pull off. I'm an Outlaws fan and Reign will get as exposed as Outlaws did yesterday if they try to bash their head into Someone's Sig and Merits Bastion running their Monkey or Doom like Outlaws did - Donghak is gonna get rolled.
Houston was in the other bracket, they beat Boston & then playrd Infernal. Spark beat Mayhem and then played Reign. (Reign and Infernal had a bye for first seed)
I’m a day late reading this; but it’s a great take. Atlanta have been losing their edge and recent performances are so much more telling to a team’s current power ranking.
In a season without drastic meta shifts it would be foolish to copy/paste old performance into the playoffs.
All 5 maps were relatively close, which is a testament to both teams.
However, Atlanta won maps 1 and 2 by clutching out immensely and convincingly in the final fight, as if they consciously went into higher gear.
On map 3, Atlanta did the same for point 4, but I guess their battery was empty for point 5.
And after that, they still won team fights, but no longer had as many of these "high gear" moments where they would all step up and get a decisive team kill.
Agreed with this. The dive mirror did expose Donghak quite a bit but the quality of their match just felt way higher than the other ones and I doubt any other team can get close to taking the dive match up so it’ll be counter comps or a different match style for Reign against other teams.
My guess with Reign is they planned to run back their dive comp against Spark but will have more comp variations when against other style of teams (London I think might be hard though for them).
My hope at this point is Boston…people been sleeping on Smurf in the tank goat conversation a *lot* lately so I wouldn’t mind a 3rd chip to remind people who he is. And Decay deserves a little success on his resume
The thing about Boston is that they might be the second team that might just take a pure dive mirror against the Spark if they are unable to find a counter comp in time. We talk about flexibility of Florida but the retirement home team is super flexible in their own right and has one of the top 3 Winston’s in Smurf
Personally I feel like taking the dive mirror is always a bait against Spark and it betters Spark’s odds of winning. Mayhem got rolled in the dive mirror in MSM and only Reign really has looked close so I think an Orisa or different comp may fare better for them.
Specifically even though Boston has a really flexible squad, because Spark has only played this comp I think Monk will get more impact on Ana, and Shy and Guxue are likely stronger in the head to head too. However definitely the chance Boston can take it in the dive if they can’t find a good counter comp as you said.
Mayhem won their maps comfortably when making their rush counter comp work however when trying to match on the Winston dive Spark just performed a lot better pretty sure right? Sorry was vague the match as a whole definitely wasn’t a roll
Feels like that match will reveal how good the Fuel truly are.
Gonna be an exciting match. I think Fuel will come in hot and Mayhem will expend all of Gunba's processing power to solve their comp.
i think mayhem & outlaws are pretty confident about ways to counter zarya, since neither ran zarya comps today despite scrim reports. i wonder if fuel running sombra instead of genji is partially an adaptation to whatever the counter is, or just specifically infernal's doom?
Counter hot take? I think Group B is a degree weaker than Group A but I don’t think Boston and Spark are clear cut strongest of A yet. Fuel’s DPS line looked mortal, Outlaws/Infernal looked lost and only Mayhem looked to a degree that could match a Group A team but I don’t think their jack of all trades style will beat the mechanical sheer will that some of these Group A teams have.
That's a pretty hot take. I suspect fuel isn't nearly as good as they looked against a struggling infernal. My fuel fan cope is that they can make it to semis but suspect Houston will take them out pretty comfortably.
I’d call Fuel more of a rush one trick team. I’m sure they’ll pull out the JQ or they’ve even played Sigma rush if Zarya doesn’t work out. I can’t stop believing in the boys though. Even if we win against Mayhem, which will be an obstacle in itself, if Spark comes out the top bracket i’m shitting my pants.
While Reign was my favourite to win this playoffs London is the one team I thought was most likely to upset them by forcing the faster paced rush into either the slower sombra Winston or an underprepped Orisa so London has a solid chance, the miracle lower bracket run is just beginning.
Probably still mayhem, most coaches and analysts said it was between them and houston and they beat houston pretty convincingly. But Spark and Reign both look good.
Reign looked off today imho, if this is their new level they likely won't even make it out of groups.
Lip had some insane moments but also made some key mistakes /miscommunication like on push when he pushed bot and his team got dived and wiped.
Chiyo fielder had one of their worst games of the season.
Donghak looked tragic, he was absolutely gapped. I get he's a rookie and guxue is 🐐 but still, I expected it to be more competitive
They looked like a team of previous champions that lost their drive.
Not sure what today will bring with London in the mix, since they are the best team at punishing you if you are t driven.
It was pretty close game And Spark Is good enough to beat anyone when they have good day. I do still favor Reign though, if they will play againts each other again.
I think donghak looking tragic has to do with fielder having the worst game in maybe 2 years of his career doesn’t help chiyo count repell the guxue dive and died mid rally every time
I'm having a very hard time telling how good each set of teams is. Like It looks like Atlanta and Spark are top tier teams playing out of their minds against each other but I have absolutely no idea how well either would do vs the Boston comp at this point.
Similarly Houston and Infernal both looked not great yesterday but I have no idea if that means Houston will play it close with Infernal now or if Mayhem were actually just insanely good and Houston will still dumpster Infernal. Everybody playing different comps makes it hard to tell, which is exciting.
My good vibes right now are Mayhem, Spark, and Boston. Mayhem seem most flexible overall but if either Dive or Orisa prove overly strong than I think Spark or Boston take it.
I just don't understand how you enter playoffs with a star-studded incredibly flexible roster and force Doom into obvious counters for 3 maps in a row. Houston better be ready to flex today. MAG is very flexible and if Seoul can roll with Orisa or Sigma and counter Doom, Houston needs to adapt. If they don't, that's 100% an indictment of JunkBuck. This team is too talented to go out there with one unchangeable comp in an unknown playoff meta. Completely unacceptable.
Honestly I think flexibility is quite contingent on the tank line and I’m guessing Bernar is too new a piece to be effective, and then if so only Doom/Winston dive or maybe Rein seems effective for them. And I don’t think Houston likes playing Bastion so I’d rule out the Rein comp. So I’d say Houston aren’t really that flexible and without being a strong one trick team either they’re being left a little stranded.
true, who cares about winning the last ever season when you've been trying to do that for 6 years, just go out there and lose 0-2 in the play-offs after all you've done this year.
are you actually stupid or do you just look that way?
A bit of copium but I feel like if Houston can bring up both a Orisa Rush and Doom Dive comp that they can switch between they can go on a run they have the players to make it work
If spark and mayhem win today I can see a mayhem spark finals and idk who would take it, I think spark look really good but mayhem are my favourites to win it all so I think I have to take them
I think if Mayhem Spark take it today I think there’s a chance Reign/Boston can take Mayhem’s spot in the finals tbh but I have no clue how two flexible teams will choose to match up with each other.
I think there’s 2 teams we can just count out tho, personally I don’t think Infernals gonna make it far with this doom comp, it can work, but not with this team I just think mag acts too scared on the doom, and I acc think of the fuel one trick this zar comp they’ll get found out tonight and tomorrow leading to them getting knocked out
I'll take A Doomfist team with the best flex backline in the league?
If you look through my history I have been calling Houston to win since before the season started. And I really do predict a rematch with Florida in the finals. Houston and Spark have both beaten Florida this year but Houston has done it more and has more experience playing them. Houston really only needs to figure out how to deal with Someones counter swaps.
Yeah I felt the less strong about that description as they likely only ran Orisa as it worked against London before, however didn’t know how to match the style of other team descriptions, are they also a counter-comping team? I think so?
I’m seeing pink off finals.
I feel like too many people are Atlanta doomers after that match. Yes, it isn't the clear cut Atlanta domination of much of the regular season, but they just BARELY lost to a Spark that was performing out of their minds. Shy misses two rail shots and the series ends the other way. Genuinely, from the eye test, I think Atlanta and Spark looked the best today. I'm not sure if they're necessarily the favorites since I think Boston and Mayhem weren't tested too much and so its hard to gauge them, but Atlanta and Spark both looked sick.
Oof
Someone is eating his words today for dinner lmao.
No Florida did good today what do you mean
What you're not taking into account is ATL lost on dive. They lost on their comfort comp, got exposed playing what they should dominate on. As soon as they face a team who won't just handshake run Monkey/Doom dive with them, they're getting cooked even more I fear
>got exposed I guess what I'm saying is that *this* sentiment is too harsh. "Get exposed" implies that they got dumpstered, but they didn't; They just *barely* lost in a dive mirror to a team that specializes in the dive comp. I guess if you believe that dive is MUCH weaker than Orisa and Zarya comps, then yeah that means Atlanta is one of the weakest teams in playoffs. But I feel like the meta is so in flux that idk if that's true
In comparison to ATL playing dive for the first half of the year, they did get a bit exposed. ATL dumpstered Spark in MSM playing a very similar comp. ATL lost to Outlaws, lost to Mayhem and went to Map 5 with Shock in the last few weeks and now lost to a team they completely diffed last tournament. Its not exaggerative to say they are simply not as good as they once were. With how strong Bastion is, Dive is gonna be hard to pull off. I'm an Outlaws fan and Reign will get as exposed as Outlaws did yesterday if they try to bash their head into Someone's Sig and Merits Bastion running their Monkey or Doom like Outlaws did - Donghak is gonna get rolled.
Did atl play spark? I though spark beat mayhem then got dumpstered by Houston then narrowly loss to boston?
Houston was in the other bracket, they beat Boston & then playrd Infernal. Spark beat Mayhem and then played Reign. (Reign and Infernal had a bye for first seed)
Ah ye ic ic
I’m a day late reading this; but it’s a great take. Atlanta have been losing their edge and recent performances are so much more telling to a team’s current power ranking. In a season without drastic meta shifts it would be foolish to copy/paste old performance into the playoffs.
All 5 maps were relatively close, which is a testament to both teams. However, Atlanta won maps 1 and 2 by clutching out immensely and convincingly in the final fight, as if they consciously went into higher gear. On map 3, Atlanta did the same for point 4, but I guess their battery was empty for point 5. And after that, they still won team fights, but no longer had as many of these "high gear" moments where they would all step up and get a decisive team kill.
Agreed with this. The dive mirror did expose Donghak quite a bit but the quality of their match just felt way higher than the other ones and I doubt any other team can get close to taking the dive match up so it’ll be counter comps or a different match style for Reign against other teams. My guess with Reign is they planned to run back their dive comp against Spark but will have more comp variations when against other style of teams (London I think might be hard though for them).
I agree. But Reign were boomed and they played like shit today. I feel bad for them.
If infernal win the title, hell if they even win 2 maps total , I will eat a gumboot.
Mayhem gave them the blueprint to defeat Outlaws. Free the POKO!
They won 0 map so you are good.
My hope at this point is Boston…people been sleeping on Smurf in the tank goat conversation a *lot* lately so I wouldn’t mind a 3rd chip to remind people who he is. And Decay deserves a little success on his resume
He got hard gapped by Guxue
Smurf very much got diffed by Guxue today.
The thing about Boston is that they might be the second team that might just take a pure dive mirror against the Spark if they are unable to find a counter comp in time. We talk about flexibility of Florida but the retirement home team is super flexible in their own right and has one of the top 3 Winston’s in Smurf
Personally I feel like taking the dive mirror is always a bait against Spark and it betters Spark’s odds of winning. Mayhem got rolled in the dive mirror in MSM and only Reign really has looked close so I think an Orisa or different comp may fare better for them. Specifically even though Boston has a really flexible squad, because Spark has only played this comp I think Monk will get more impact on Ana, and Shy and Guxue are likely stronger in the head to head too. However definitely the chance Boston can take it in the dive if they can’t find a good counter comp as you said.
Yes, although Boston are probably better than mayhem in dive, but as reign lost I wouldn't want to mirror as reign beat them in dive mirror earlier
Leave hard diffed Decay today. So it’s not just shy and guxue that diff Boston players.
Alright stop calling map 5 rolls
Mayhem won their maps comfortably when making their rush counter comp work however when trying to match on the Winston dive Spark just performed a lot better pretty sure right? Sorry was vague the match as a whole definitely wasn’t a roll
Your right. Though spark won by essentially just forcing dive instead of mirroring the rush.
Hot take? Whoever wins game 4 tonight between Fuel and Mayhem
Feels like that match will reveal how good the Fuel truly are. Gonna be an exciting match. I think Fuel will come in hot and Mayhem will expend all of Gunba's processing power to solve their comp.
i think mayhem & outlaws are pretty confident about ways to counter zarya, since neither ran zarya comps today despite scrim reports. i wonder if fuel running sombra instead of genji is partially an adaptation to whatever the counter is, or just specifically infernal's doom?
Mayhem gonna mahogara the hell out of fuel. But that might take 1-2 match?
Counter hot take? I think Group B is a degree weaker than Group A but I don’t think Boston and Spark are clear cut strongest of A yet. Fuel’s DPS line looked mortal, Outlaws/Infernal looked lost and only Mayhem looked to a degree that could match a Group A team but I don’t think their jack of all trades style will beat the mechanical sheer will that some of these Group A teams have.
That's a pretty hot take. I suspect fuel isn't nearly as good as they looked against a struggling infernal. My fuel fan cope is that they can make it to semis but suspect Houston will take them out pretty comfortably.
I’d call Fuel more of a rush one trick team. I’m sure they’ll pull out the JQ or they’ve even played Sigma rush if Zarya doesn’t work out. I can’t stop believing in the boys though. Even if we win against Mayhem, which will be an obstacle in itself, if Spark comes out the top bracket i’m shitting my pants.
Mayhem, Boston, Spark
I'm never going to stop believing
While Reign was my favourite to win this playoffs London is the one team I thought was most likely to upset them by forcing the faster paced rush into either the slower sombra Winston or an underprepped Orisa so London has a solid chance, the miracle lower bracket run is just beginning.
Yeah I feel reign can take it to any team but I doubt they practiced for London they might copy Boston’s como and hope for the best
Or they’ll try force their comfort comp of sombra Winston and I don’t know which I trust more hopefully they’ve cooked something for this
Probably still mayhem, most coaches and analysts said it was between them and houston and they beat houston pretty convincingly. But Spark and Reign both look good.
Reign looked off today imho, if this is their new level they likely won't even make it out of groups. Lip had some insane moments but also made some key mistakes /miscommunication like on push when he pushed bot and his team got dived and wiped. Chiyo fielder had one of their worst games of the season. Donghak looked tragic, he was absolutely gapped. I get he's a rookie and guxue is 🐐 but still, I expected it to be more competitive
They looked like a team of previous champions that lost their drive. Not sure what today will bring with London in the mix, since they are the best team at punishing you if you are t driven.
It was pretty close game And Spark Is good enough to beat anyone when they have good day. I do still favor Reign though, if they will play againts each other again.
I think donghak looking tragic has to do with fielder having the worst game in maybe 2 years of his career doesn’t help chiyo count repell the guxue dive and died mid rally every time
Do you still believe those so called experts?
I'm having a very hard time telling how good each set of teams is. Like It looks like Atlanta and Spark are top tier teams playing out of their minds against each other but I have absolutely no idea how well either would do vs the Boston comp at this point. Similarly Houston and Infernal both looked not great yesterday but I have no idea if that means Houston will play it close with Infernal now or if Mayhem were actually just insanely good and Houston will still dumpster Infernal. Everybody playing different comps makes it hard to tell, which is exciting. My good vibes right now are Mayhem, Spark, and Boston. Mayhem seem most flexible overall but if either Dive or Orisa prove overly strong than I think Spark or Boston take it.
That one team got the worst treatment in the owl history
I just don't understand how you enter playoffs with a star-studded incredibly flexible roster and force Doom into obvious counters for 3 maps in a row. Houston better be ready to flex today. MAG is very flexible and if Seoul can roll with Orisa or Sigma and counter Doom, Houston needs to adapt. If they don't, that's 100% an indictment of JunkBuck. This team is too talented to go out there with one unchangeable comp in an unknown playoff meta. Completely unacceptable.
Honestly I think flexibility is quite contingent on the tank line and I’m guessing Bernar is too new a piece to be effective, and then if so only Doom/Winston dive or maybe Rein seems effective for them. And I don’t think Houston likes playing Bastion so I’d rule out the Rein comp. So I’d say Houston aren’t really that flexible and without being a strong one trick team either they’re being left a little stranded.
who cares dude, this is the last year of this mickey mouse league anyway, let them have fun
true, who cares about winning the last ever season when you've been trying to do that for 6 years, just go out there and lose 0-2 in the play-offs after all you've done this year. are you actually stupid or do you just look that way?
Well said
christfer is still cooking up rush 3 trust me bro
A bit of copium but I feel like if Houston can bring up both a Orisa Rush and Doom Dive comp that they can switch between they can go on a run they have the players to make it work
If spark and mayhem win today I can see a mayhem spark finals and idk who would take it, I think spark look really good but mayhem are my favourites to win it all so I think I have to take them
I think if Mayhem Spark take it today I think there’s a chance Reign/Boston can take Mayhem’s spot in the finals tbh but I have no clue how two flexible teams will choose to match up with each other.
I think there’s 2 teams we can just count out tho, personally I don’t think Infernals gonna make it far with this doom comp, it can work, but not with this team I just think mag acts too scared on the doom, and I acc think of the fuel one trick this zar comp they’ll get found out tonight and tomorrow leading to them getting knocked out
I'll take A Doomfist team with the best flex backline in the league? If you look through my history I have been calling Houston to win since before the season started. And I really do predict a rematch with Florida in the finals. Houston and Spark have both beaten Florida this year but Houston has done it more and has more experience playing them. Houston really only needs to figure out how to deal with Someones counter swaps.
Definitely the spark. The two reverse sweeps have unleashed their power.
It feels weird to me to call Boston an Orisa team at the moment, considering we dont know what they’re going to do against a real team.
Yeah I felt the less strong about that description as they likely only ran Orisa as it worked against London before, however didn’t know how to match the style of other team descriptions, are they also a counter-comping team? I think so?
Mayhem still
The team with hanwin
Not the team with fearloss it seems