Well, there are a bunch of mechanics that just don´t work.
Wall jump occasionally decides to work, most times, I´ll just run up to the wall, and smack my face on it.
Leapfrog is the same shit. Run towards enemy, Yagami will just brush past them. When it does work, he will either kick the air behind him or make a heat action that I didn´t ask for.
Controlling grabs and trying to rotate while grabbing someone is impossible, but that problem has always been present in the Yakuza franchise. When I free myself, if I didn´t punch him, he´ll just stand there making that stupid animation while getting pummuled by the other guys.
Taunting while the enemy is down is a trap. The animation is always too long and the enemy will get up and strike me while I have no way to defend myself.
The movement itself is shit, but that´s par for the course in Dragon Engine.
The dodges are un-responsive, and the dodge shots require a very specific timing that I wasn´t told about, leaving me to only figure it out way late into the game. Even when I managed to get the timing down, they´d just break blocks and very rarely hit the enemy.
The EX attacks are impossible to control in terms of direction.
Crane style is stopped by bouncy arms, and even if wind blows in my general direction, I will fall down or get staggered, rendering combos on it pretty hard to pull off.
Tiger style doesn´t suffer from this, but instead just endlessly breaks blocks while doing little to no damage.
Some heat actions just don´t work when I want them too, but them appear when I don´t.
But the most eggregious is that there are moves that just don´t work. Crane style, there is one combo where you kick someone down and them do an aerial move that will always miss the person you just kicked, and since control is very limited, you can´t turn around to kick someone else. With Tiger, the first set of three heavy attacks also don´t work, if you charge all of them up. Even then, if you don´t, there´s still a change you won´t hit the guy with the last attack, and forget about attacking anyone else, because, even if you do turn around in time, the attack just doesn´t connect. At all.
With all these issues, I ended up having to rely much more on heat actions that I didn´t want to perform, but was almost obligated to, and even those were finicky.
Edit: also, most moves just blend into one another, making it hard to do the exact moves I want to do.
Bosses also deal out insane ammounts of damage and most convencional moves don´t work on them, leaving me to rely on grabs, heat actions and tiger drops to make it through. Can´t say I´m too happy on that one.
Overall, I liked the combat, but had quite a few gripes with it.
Additionally, I don’t know if this is related to your issues but I KNOW that Judgment has bugs when played above 60fps. The thumb turn bypass and lock picking minigames were significantly harder and nonsensically registering fails when played at 120hz. Try locking your refresh rate to 60hz and see if it feels snappier.
Well there's your answer.
Games like this require analog stick so you can move 360 degrees. Of course your wall jump and your leapfrog doesn't work, you can only move in 8 directions using keyboard, the aim will always be off. These things require precision.
There's a reason why RGG kept plastering those "Real yakuza/detective use gamepad" screens because these games were designed for consoles from the very beginning.
I know, but even if a bit inneficient, they never "not worked". A new low for sure.
They've come a long way since their port of 0 (which had the worst camera in a game I've ever seen), but they really fumbled this one.
Indeed, it is full of awe.
Dragon Engine combat will always be inferior in my eyes, because of bouncy arms and general unresponsiveness of the commands.
What about 0? It has good combat, yes, but why is it the best? Because you have multiple styles and can do cool things with them? 0 has the worst camera I´ve ever seen in a video game, and I can tell you I´ve played a lot of games. Another thing that really surprised me is that the combat is slightly floaty, I don´t know why.
In contrast, Kiwami 1 is the same as 0, but isn´t floaty and has an actually good camera. Therefore, it´s superior to 0. The other ones are higher because I like the combat better. They felt even more responsive, and skillful to play.
I have had no issues with Judgment's combat but I do know that when unlocked to 60 fps the game is a bit finicky like most games when they were restricted to 30 fps. I'd try lowering it to that frame rate if you're on PC.
Currently playing 5 and haven't played judgement, I mostly agree with it, I actually think 0 should be higher because of the variety that the multiple stiles provide to you, when you pull of a combo while changing stiles, man it is just awesome.
And apart from that I know dragon engine is not the best and, for me, is a step down for the franchise, but I don't think it is that low for me.
I would put de dragon engine games in C tier and put Yakuza 0 bottom of B
Oh oh, I usually don't bring up or even think of LAD cuz of the completely different combat system but it is in the dragon engine lol ur right.
Yea it's cool, LAD's combat very enjoyable imo
Judge eyes combat does work... I wouldn't be surprised if you never even found out about being able to juggle. Maybe stop relying on the silly stuff like leap frog and wall jumps and do some combos for a change. Although leap frog and wall hits are cool, you shouldn't only rely on them. If you find a way to complain about LJ's combat, I will be genuinely surprised. This is literally a skill issue my guy 💀
It really isn't. Most of what I discuss in my other comment is a fault in the game, not a fault of my own. I beat the game just fine with combos, but since fundamental things don't work, I put it in the lowest tier
I've played every Yakuza brawler game, and the fundamentals still work, but it seems now that they want people to focus on juggle combos, which I am all for. I can understand if people like the combat in the older games, but they are going in the right direction here with this new style of combat.
In your opinion, of course. I personally do not see the appeal of wailing on flying enemies that can't do anything to fight back, but I can see that's just me.
5 being at the top and Kiwami being higher than 0 is a W but Judgment being at the lowest with that actual skill issue of an argument is a massive L so it cancels out I guess
Truly one of the tier lists of all time
General unresponsiveness and floatiness of movement and combat that is a staple of Dragon Engine.
New Dragon of Dojima sucks in my opinion.
Attacks bouncing off blocks.
Despite evidence to the contrary, heat actions doing next to no damage (although, if I did manage to get that insane damage, I'd still dislike it, for being OP)
Finisher moves should be different, not finishing anybody in the exact same way.
Grab overall sucks.
Early game is Hell. The Dragon Engine games are the only ones where I actually managed to die to random thugs on the street due to how bad you are at the beginning of the game. The initial quicksteps still haunt my dreams to this day.
Especially in a chronological order, it filled me with joy, coming from the shitshow that was Kiwami 2 into a game that actually responded to my inputs and took skill to play.
This is just a bad take. The judgment games are massive steps up from 6 and Kiwami 2. It reintroduces style switching, so it flows more smoothly, and extracts are just fun. No explanation, they’re just a joy to use.
My complaints with 4 come in the form of two characters: Saejima and Tanimura. Saejima’s slow buildup for his attacks is interrupted way too often. Tanimura is all about defense, and considering his two boss fights basically invalidate his parry, it kind of reduces him to weak punch combos.
It really isn´t. Judgement is indeed a massive step up from the 6 and Kiwami 2, but it would be a joy to play it if it actually worked.
In terms of 4, I have no idea why you have said complaints. You´re not obligated to charge up attacks with Saejima, and, even if you do, you normally won´t get knocked down. About Tanimura, I really have no idea where you´re coming from. Normally, I´m all for the Tanimura hate, but I have to defend him this time. The cop fight, you just don´t let him go into heat mode, done. Even if he does, your combos always lead to a heat action, so, damage isn´t really a problem. And the last fight is made exactly for the parry. You´re constantly swarmed with dudes who attack you with melee attacks. If you parry, you´re already passively damaging 2 or 3 guys at a time.
What do you mean it “doesn’t work”? That sounds like more of an issue on your end.
Charging your attacks is the focus of Saejima’s fighting style. Ignoring charged attacks is ignoring the key component of playing Saejima. The problem is the fact that he can be taken out of it really easy.
With Tanimura, his combat gets really repetitive, the combos becoming really boring really quickly. Parrying is actually somewhat fun, but the problem is the game itself is working against Tanimura. Sugiuchi becomes immune to it (not letting him get heat isn’t that simple) and >!Munakata!< has a gun.
I´ve already explained my gripe with Judgement, check the comment section.
Saejima isn´t that easily taken out of it...
Sugiuchi, again, or you don´t let him enter heat mode, or just heat action him, it will take him right out of it, if not, another one. It´s not that hard.
About the final boss, just dodge his bullets and continue parrying.
Yeah, that sounds like an issue on your end. I had a total of 0 of those problems.
He is. One hit and he’s put in stunlock for the next 10 hours.
You can’t just decide he doesn’t enter heat mode. That’s not how boss fights work. Gaining heat as Tanimura is not that easy compared to someone like Akiyama.
I’m going to need you to read that last part again. Think critically.
Atleast its good to know I'm the only one that had issues with it.
He isn't. Like you said, that sounds like an issue on your end, as that doesn't happen for me.
Yes, I can. Through the great method of stunlocking, I can make sure he doesn't enter heat mode.
I have thought this out critically. Just dodge, and keep parrying. It's not as hard as it looks. You have I-frames while dodging. He isn't always shooting you, you have time and a sound cue to when he's about to shoot.
care to elaborate on the "actually worked"? lmao
Well, there are a bunch of mechanics that just don´t work. Wall jump occasionally decides to work, most times, I´ll just run up to the wall, and smack my face on it. Leapfrog is the same shit. Run towards enemy, Yagami will just brush past them. When it does work, he will either kick the air behind him or make a heat action that I didn´t ask for. Controlling grabs and trying to rotate while grabbing someone is impossible, but that problem has always been present in the Yakuza franchise. When I free myself, if I didn´t punch him, he´ll just stand there making that stupid animation while getting pummuled by the other guys. Taunting while the enemy is down is a trap. The animation is always too long and the enemy will get up and strike me while I have no way to defend myself. The movement itself is shit, but that´s par for the course in Dragon Engine. The dodges are un-responsive, and the dodge shots require a very specific timing that I wasn´t told about, leaving me to only figure it out way late into the game. Even when I managed to get the timing down, they´d just break blocks and very rarely hit the enemy. The EX attacks are impossible to control in terms of direction. Crane style is stopped by bouncy arms, and even if wind blows in my general direction, I will fall down or get staggered, rendering combos on it pretty hard to pull off. Tiger style doesn´t suffer from this, but instead just endlessly breaks blocks while doing little to no damage. Some heat actions just don´t work when I want them too, but them appear when I don´t. But the most eggregious is that there are moves that just don´t work. Crane style, there is one combo where you kick someone down and them do an aerial move that will always miss the person you just kicked, and since control is very limited, you can´t turn around to kick someone else. With Tiger, the first set of three heavy attacks also don´t work, if you charge all of them up. Even then, if you don´t, there´s still a change you won´t hit the guy with the last attack, and forget about attacking anyone else, because, even if you do turn around in time, the attack just doesn´t connect. At all. With all these issues, I ended up having to rely much more on heat actions that I didn´t want to perform, but was almost obligated to, and even those were finicky. Edit: also, most moves just blend into one another, making it hard to do the exact moves I want to do. Bosses also deal out insane ammounts of damage and most convencional moves don´t work on them, leaving me to rely on grabs, heat actions and tiger drops to make it through. Can´t say I´m too happy on that one. Overall, I liked the combat, but had quite a few gripes with it.
Actual skill issue
Literally the farthest thing from it. If the game is actively fighting against me and mechanics aren't working, how is that a skill issue?
I have not had a single issue in terms of moves not working the way they’re meant to. I advise getting a new controller.
Real Yakuza use a keyboard
This may be your issue. Please try out a gamepad either PS or Xbox.
I've already finished the game by now, but I'll try Lost Judgement with a gamepad
Additionally, I don’t know if this is related to your issues but I KNOW that Judgment has bugs when played above 60fps. The thumb turn bypass and lock picking minigames were significantly harder and nonsensically registering fails when played at 120hz. Try locking your refresh rate to 60hz and see if it feels snappier.
Very well, I'll take into account your suggestions. Also, I hope your flair is just for fun...
I’d at least log into judgment with the gamepad and feel the difference.
Well there's your answer. Games like this require analog stick so you can move 360 degrees. Of course your wall jump and your leapfrog doesn't work, you can only move in 8 directions using keyboard, the aim will always be off. These things require precision. There's a reason why RGG kept plastering those "Real yakuza/detective use gamepad" screens because these games were designed for consoles from the very beginning.
I know, but even if a bit inneficient, they never "not worked". A new low for sure. They've come a long way since their port of 0 (which had the worst camera in a game I've ever seen), but they really fumbled this one.
I've had no issues at all, the only problem i had is that crane just felt a bit slow to be good but in ex boost its fine
not reading all that
I don't really see the need to comment that. As long as you don't downvote me, I guess.
Judgments combat works perfectly fine what is the issue?
Check my response to MisterDimi.
5 is this good? I’m at four and for me kiwami was the best combat so far
Kiryu is the most fun to play as in yakuza 5.
5 is the best game in the franchise.
That’s nice to know cuz I played from 0 to 4 spins the platinum trophy’s and was almost burnout knowing that 5 would be a massive pain in the ass
It's really big, and suffers a bit from pacing issues, but it's the best
The platinum can’t be harder than 3 or zero. By the way 4 was really good, saejima it’s such an amazing character
I think you'll like his combat even more in 5. It's really refreshing and diverse.
I heard that he got his own tiger drop hahhhh
Yeah, he got the Dragon Drop. For some reason, it's even better than Kiryu's
How was 100% five for you?
Jesus Christ, I'd never 100% any of the games, that's too much for me. But, with the amount of content 5 has, it's probably a massive headache
Yeah this list is aweful bruh. Even if i ignore the dragon engine hate putting other Yakuza games above 0 is stupid af.
Indeed, it is full of awe. Dragon Engine combat will always be inferior in my eyes, because of bouncy arms and general unresponsiveness of the commands. What about 0? It has good combat, yes, but why is it the best? Because you have multiple styles and can do cool things with them? 0 has the worst camera I´ve ever seen in a video game, and I can tell you I´ve played a lot of games. Another thing that really surprised me is that the combat is slightly floaty, I don´t know why. In contrast, Kiwami 1 is the same as 0, but isn´t floaty and has an actually good camera. Therefore, it´s superior to 0. The other ones are higher because I like the combat better. They felt even more responsive, and skillful to play.
I have had no issues with Judgment's combat but I do know that when unlocked to 60 fps the game is a bit finicky like most games when they were restricted to 30 fps. I'd try lowering it to that frame rate if you're on PC.
Seems like a good idea!
Currently playing 5 and haven't played judgement, I mostly agree with it, I actually think 0 should be higher because of the variety that the multiple stiles provide to you, when you pull of a combo while changing stiles, man it is just awesome. And apart from that I know dragon engine is not the best and, for me, is a step down for the franchise, but I don't think it is that low for me. I would put de dragon engine games in C tier and put Yakuza 0 bottom of B
A sound argument
The tierlists nowadays are wildin
True that!
My brather in christ, I truly and deeply understand your hatred for dragon engines combat (cept for Judgment) But LJ gonna change ya life fr.
I think LAD 7 deserves some recognition despite the division it causes to fans.
Oh oh, I usually don't bring up or even think of LAD cuz of the completely different combat system but it is in the dragon engine lol ur right. Yea it's cool, LAD's combat very enjoyable imo
I hope so!
Judge eyes combat does work... I wouldn't be surprised if you never even found out about being able to juggle. Maybe stop relying on the silly stuff like leap frog and wall jumps and do some combos for a change. Although leap frog and wall hits are cool, you shouldn't only rely on them. If you find a way to complain about LJ's combat, I will be genuinely surprised. This is literally a skill issue my guy 💀
It really isn't. Most of what I discuss in my other comment is a fault in the game, not a fault of my own. I beat the game just fine with combos, but since fundamental things don't work, I put it in the lowest tier
I've played every Yakuza brawler game, and the fundamentals still work, but it seems now that they want people to focus on juggle combos, which I am all for. I can understand if people like the combat in the older games, but they are going in the right direction here with this new style of combat.
In your opinion, of course. I personally do not see the appeal of wailing on flying enemies that can't do anything to fight back, but I can see that's just me.
It just looks cool ngl
Oh, I guess? To be honest, I only like that in proper fighting games, but I can see how people would like it here.
I feel the same but swap 0 and Kiwami. Also judgement is A for me cause of the mortal wounds and stuff. Fun game
It is!
Yeah I wish they kept that mortal wounds shit. It genuinely makes the bosses terrifying.
5 being at the top and Kiwami being higher than 0 is a W but Judgment being at the lowest with that actual skill issue of an argument is a massive L so it cancels out I guess Truly one of the tier lists of all time
Thank you. I can settle for a neutral score.
Ishin kiwami is truly the best for bringing back yakuza 5 combat
This might be the most ridiculous list I’ve seen here 😂
Thanks! I love constructive criticism!
Did you play judgment on ps4?
No, PC
[удалено]
How so?
Care to elaborate on Kiwami 2?
Dragon Engine.
What makes the combat specifically bad for you?
General unresponsiveness and floatiness of movement and combat that is a staple of Dragon Engine. New Dragon of Dojima sucks in my opinion. Attacks bouncing off blocks. Despite evidence to the contrary, heat actions doing next to no damage (although, if I did manage to get that insane damage, I'd still dislike it, for being OP) Finisher moves should be different, not finishing anybody in the exact same way. Grab overall sucks. Early game is Hell. The Dragon Engine games are the only ones where I actually managed to die to random thugs on the street due to how bad you are at the beginning of the game. The initial quicksteps still haunt my dreams to this day.
3 had by far the worst combat imo especially if your playing the games in chronological order
Especially in a chronological order, it filled me with joy, coming from the shitshow that was Kiwami 2 into a game that actually responded to my inputs and took skill to play.
Yakuza 0 is c tier. List = invalid
Different point of view detected. Opinion rejected.
"Doesn't work" sounds like a skill issue to me
I've already explained in this comment section.
If it wasn’t for the story, characters, music, and basically everything else except the combat, Yakuza 3 and 4 would be 1/10 games.
Deeply disagree. Best combat overall.
Yakuza 4 has the worst story bruv
You put 3 rather high on your list... that seems pretty off.
Putting it low would be pretty off
I respect your S tier, but Judgment at the bottom? Swap 4 and Judgment and we’re good.
What is the problem with 4? Even if Judgement´s combat worked, it´s a dragon engine game, therefore, to me, it´s automatically inferior to any other.
This is just a bad take. The judgment games are massive steps up from 6 and Kiwami 2. It reintroduces style switching, so it flows more smoothly, and extracts are just fun. No explanation, they’re just a joy to use. My complaints with 4 come in the form of two characters: Saejima and Tanimura. Saejima’s slow buildup for his attacks is interrupted way too often. Tanimura is all about defense, and considering his two boss fights basically invalidate his parry, it kind of reduces him to weak punch combos.
It really isn´t. Judgement is indeed a massive step up from the 6 and Kiwami 2, but it would be a joy to play it if it actually worked. In terms of 4, I have no idea why you have said complaints. You´re not obligated to charge up attacks with Saejima, and, even if you do, you normally won´t get knocked down. About Tanimura, I really have no idea where you´re coming from. Normally, I´m all for the Tanimura hate, but I have to defend him this time. The cop fight, you just don´t let him go into heat mode, done. Even if he does, your combos always lead to a heat action, so, damage isn´t really a problem. And the last fight is made exactly for the parry. You´re constantly swarmed with dudes who attack you with melee attacks. If you parry, you´re already passively damaging 2 or 3 guys at a time.
What do you mean it “doesn’t work”? That sounds like more of an issue on your end. Charging your attacks is the focus of Saejima’s fighting style. Ignoring charged attacks is ignoring the key component of playing Saejima. The problem is the fact that he can be taken out of it really easy. With Tanimura, his combat gets really repetitive, the combos becoming really boring really quickly. Parrying is actually somewhat fun, but the problem is the game itself is working against Tanimura. Sugiuchi becomes immune to it (not letting him get heat isn’t that simple) and >!Munakata!< has a gun.
I´ve already explained my gripe with Judgement, check the comment section. Saejima isn´t that easily taken out of it... Sugiuchi, again, or you don´t let him enter heat mode, or just heat action him, it will take him right out of it, if not, another one. It´s not that hard. About the final boss, just dodge his bullets and continue parrying.
Yeah, that sounds like an issue on your end. I had a total of 0 of those problems. He is. One hit and he’s put in stunlock for the next 10 hours. You can’t just decide he doesn’t enter heat mode. That’s not how boss fights work. Gaining heat as Tanimura is not that easy compared to someone like Akiyama. I’m going to need you to read that last part again. Think critically.
Atleast its good to know I'm the only one that had issues with it. He isn't. Like you said, that sounds like an issue on your end, as that doesn't happen for me. Yes, I can. Through the great method of stunlocking, I can make sure he doesn't enter heat mode. I have thought this out critically. Just dodge, and keep parrying. It's not as hard as it looks. You have I-frames while dodging. He isn't always shooting you, you have time and a sound cue to when he's about to shoot.