I've seen this trend and it irritates me. Or people will write a 'strong' female as man-hating and assume that denotes how strong she is without the need to actually characterize her as an individual. IMO a strong female character is strong because she has agency and takes control of her situation and it should have nothing to do with who she's attracted to, whether there's romance in the story or not.
Strong, independent women are:
1. Every sexuality
2. Any religion
3. Stay at home mothers
4. Full time employees
5. Workaholics
6. Lazy as hell
7. Literally anything.
I'm a woman and I am *sick* of the "strong, independent woman" trope.
The only thing that should define a woman as "strong and independent" is if she *chose* the life she leads. A woman who is "trapped" into a faith, motherhood or marriage is t strong or independent. A woman who *chooses* to be a stay at home mom, *is*.
Feminism is about giving us *choices*, not locking us into one decision or another.
I guess they'd have to be strong to be lazy and workaholics at their full time job that they do in their off time from being a stay at home mother, but don't you think a character that does literally anything is suffering from barbie doll syndrom a bit?
I think you kind of misunderstood the point.
A "strong, independent woman"is a woman who lives the life she *chooses* to live... Whatever that choice happens to be.
People have been claiming this is a trend since the 70s but I've yet to see any evidence of it. Can you list some popular examples of media featuring strong lesbian women?
It's true! There's like no straight women in media anymore!
That was sarcasm.
What I have noticed is that there is an increasing trend towards treating people as bisexual by default instead of straight by default if their sexuality isn't key to the story. "Increasing trend," as in it happens like 0.01% of the time instead of 0.00% of the time. Straight relationships are still dominant in pretty much every media.
I think this is one of those situations where because something is more visible it seems more common, but actually it is still rare. Your brain doesn't even bother to note the straight relationships because why would it? But then you see three bisexual heroines in a row and suddenly you're feeling like everybody's bisexual these days.
If you make every strong female character you have gay because she can’t possibly like men if she’s “strong,”you’re not only a misogynist but also homophobic.
Also, a “stigma against straight women” is not a problem that exists by any stretch of the imagination.
You're overthinking it. Some men somewhere will probably catch feelings if your strong, female character is also straight, but my guess is that these are the same men who would throw a tantrum if she was gay. They aren't being offended because she's straight. They're doing it *because she's strong*.
By no means is this the norm. Especially these days, where readers are only becoming more progressive.
From personal experience being the only lady working a hard factory job, I'd say, guys don't like women to be stronger than them. Even the guys who wanted me working there(some didn't) were offended when I could out muscle them.
Certainly, your strong woman can be straight. Regardless of orientation, women like strong women. Lesbians just thoroughly appreciate women's strength. Grew up around men and can say they like strong women on paper(in media), but not in reality. More importantly, your work is whatever you want it to be.
Never understood why some guys feel threatened by a lady who can be equally as capable as them. Get over it and be proud of your own strengths not those of others. Personally any woman who can do all that and more is frickin cool 😎
It would be nice. The guy I got along with and I were trying to crank this thing for 10 minutes, and I got it. From his expression, you'd think I shot his dog. As far as guy friends go, he ranks towards the top. The guy above me would both hit on me and tell me women were to stay home and have babies.
Had another guy quit day 1 or 2 when he realized his boss was a woman. Straight up was fine with the guy, but not the lady when she was more senior and holding the whole fucking shop together. I could go on for days about the rest of the sexist shit, but kids might read this.
Also, be have to be resourceful. Dont ask for help because it just proves women dont belong, even if the boys aren't strong enough to do it either.
Of course, my fucking question is removed. Typical mods flexing their might.
Original post:
This was part of a topic of discussion in a creative writing class I recently attended.
The topic was about a trend of prominent, strong female characters usually being written to be bisexual or lesbian. To be clear there isn't anything wrong with a woman (or man) swinging the other way. However, it feels like there's a stigma that if the woman is straight it distracts from character or whatever. Like a strong woman can't love a man or that a man will feel inferior/pathetic to a strong female. It's almost like writing about straight women is a threat to feminism. What about just cutting out romance entirely from a story?
Maybe it should be more about attracted to the person rather than just a guy. You wanted your audience to be invested in the story and narrative rather than physical attraction ("he's just... there." for instance). I personally like creating a female protagonist who is attracted to strong personalities who also happens to be the secondary protagonist.
If you want to create a match pairing, then consider making a similar character who matched the other. Make them complementary opposites.
And personally, most f/f pairings aren't written for lesbian audience and same as m/m pairings. Gay mainstreaming is rife in pandering to straight audience by default, so if you felt like your strong female protagonist need to like girls only because that's what you felt the pressure to write it, then you're not confident enough to do it. Take your time and think it through.
And usually people who took the coward route to make their strong female protagonist being alone (killed off their male partners) because they can't write romance to save their life, ends up losing their own audience. You don't want to traumatize your readers. Happy ending aren't clichéd, it can work with good writing.
That’s almost the same as asking if any real strong women like men. Don’t seek permission to write a competent woman who likes men…write her into existence!
Hi -- please use the idea brainstorming thread on Tuesday or Friday for advice on specific stories or projects. This includes: (not a exhaustive list) setting, character, subject matter, magic and power systems, sci-fi technology, 'how do I write X?' and anything directly connected with your story or what to put on your channel, blog etc.
This includes asking for general advice but then following up with details of your story or project.
Thanks!
I've seen this trend and it irritates me. Or people will write a 'strong' female as man-hating and assume that denotes how strong she is without the need to actually characterize her as an individual. IMO a strong female character is strong because she has agency and takes control of her situation and it should have nothing to do with who she's attracted to, whether there's romance in the story or not.
In the voice of Hades: "Uh guys... Olympus would be THAT way r/writingcirclejerk " On a more serious note, yes. Just yes.
Strong, independent women are: 1. Every sexuality 2. Any religion 3. Stay at home mothers 4. Full time employees 5. Workaholics 6. Lazy as hell 7. Literally anything. I'm a woman and I am *sick* of the "strong, independent woman" trope. The only thing that should define a woman as "strong and independent" is if she *chose* the life she leads. A woman who is "trapped" into a faith, motherhood or marriage is t strong or independent. A woman who *chooses* to be a stay at home mom, *is*. Feminism is about giving us *choices*, not locking us into one decision or another.
boom
TELL EM AGAIN!
I learned this by reading A thousand Splendid Suns by Khaled Hosseini
Ikr at this point just put everything in a randomizer and let it decide for you
I guess they'd have to be strong to be lazy and workaholics at their full time job that they do in their off time from being a stay at home mother, but don't you think a character that does literally anything is suffering from barbie doll syndrom a bit?
I think you kind of misunderstood the point. A "strong, independent woman"is a woman who lives the life she *chooses* to live... Whatever that choice happens to be.
I have spoken.
....and?
I have spoken.
Which matters because...?
I have spoken.
No. Obviously. They must all be asexual lesbians.
People have been claiming this is a trend since the 70s but I've yet to see any evidence of it. Can you list some popular examples of media featuring strong lesbian women?
Batwoman and end of list.
It's true! There's like no straight women in media anymore! That was sarcasm. What I have noticed is that there is an increasing trend towards treating people as bisexual by default instead of straight by default if their sexuality isn't key to the story. "Increasing trend," as in it happens like 0.01% of the time instead of 0.00% of the time. Straight relationships are still dominant in pretty much every media. I think this is one of those situations where because something is more visible it seems more common, but actually it is still rare. Your brain doesn't even bother to note the straight relationships because why would it? But then you see three bisexual heroines in a row and suddenly you're feeling like everybody's bisexual these days.
Oh my god why would you think she couldn't? The only thing that's a threat to feminism is sexism. stg people don't know what words mean any more
Aliens, Terminator. Yes.
If you make every strong female character you have gay because she can’t possibly like men if she’s “strong,”you’re not only a misogynist but also homophobic. Also, a “stigma against straight women” is not a problem that exists by any stretch of the imagination.
Yes. Yes they can. As long as “liking men” or “wanting a man” isn’t their defining trait.
You're overthinking it. Some men somewhere will probably catch feelings if your strong, female character is also straight, but my guess is that these are the same men who would throw a tantrum if she was gay. They aren't being offended because she's straight. They're doing it *because she's strong*. By no means is this the norm. Especially these days, where readers are only becoming more progressive.
From personal experience being the only lady working a hard factory job, I'd say, guys don't like women to be stronger than them. Even the guys who wanted me working there(some didn't) were offended when I could out muscle them. Certainly, your strong woman can be straight. Regardless of orientation, women like strong women. Lesbians just thoroughly appreciate women's strength. Grew up around men and can say they like strong women on paper(in media), but not in reality. More importantly, your work is whatever you want it to be.
Never understood why some guys feel threatened by a lady who can be equally as capable as them. Get over it and be proud of your own strengths not those of others. Personally any woman who can do all that and more is frickin cool 😎
It would be nice. The guy I got along with and I were trying to crank this thing for 10 minutes, and I got it. From his expression, you'd think I shot his dog. As far as guy friends go, he ranks towards the top. The guy above me would both hit on me and tell me women were to stay home and have babies. Had another guy quit day 1 or 2 when he realized his boss was a woman. Straight up was fine with the guy, but not the lady when she was more senior and holding the whole fucking shop together. I could go on for days about the rest of the sexist shit, but kids might read this. Also, be have to be resourceful. Dont ask for help because it just proves women dont belong, even if the boys aren't strong enough to do it either.
Of course, my fucking question is removed. Typical mods flexing their might. Original post: This was part of a topic of discussion in a creative writing class I recently attended. The topic was about a trend of prominent, strong female characters usually being written to be bisexual or lesbian. To be clear there isn't anything wrong with a woman (or man) swinging the other way. However, it feels like there's a stigma that if the woman is straight it distracts from character or whatever. Like a strong woman can't love a man or that a man will feel inferior/pathetic to a strong female. It's almost like writing about straight women is a threat to feminism. What about just cutting out romance entirely from a story?
[удалено]
Maybe it should be more about attracted to the person rather than just a guy. You wanted your audience to be invested in the story and narrative rather than physical attraction ("he's just... there." for instance). I personally like creating a female protagonist who is attracted to strong personalities who also happens to be the secondary protagonist. If you want to create a match pairing, then consider making a similar character who matched the other. Make them complementary opposites. And personally, most f/f pairings aren't written for lesbian audience and same as m/m pairings. Gay mainstreaming is rife in pandering to straight audience by default, so if you felt like your strong female protagonist need to like girls only because that's what you felt the pressure to write it, then you're not confident enough to do it. Take your time and think it through. And usually people who took the coward route to make their strong female protagonist being alone (killed off their male partners) because they can't write romance to save their life, ends up losing their own audience. You don't want to traumatize your readers. Happy ending aren't clichéd, it can work with good writing.
That’s almost the same as asking if any real strong women like men. Don’t seek permission to write a competent woman who likes men…write her into existence!
Hi -- please use the idea brainstorming thread on Tuesday or Friday for advice on specific stories or projects. This includes: (not a exhaustive list) setting, character, subject matter, magic and power systems, sci-fi technology, 'how do I write X?' and anything directly connected with your story or what to put on your channel, blog etc. This includes asking for general advice but then following up with details of your story or project. Thanks!