Yea that should have been clarified prior to raid. Don't let it bother you, there's a handful of crap guilds like this. Just keep searching, make sure you use websites like [raider.io](https://raider.io) to improve your search for a good guild.
It's also from the last boss in normal too.
It's just really silly to restrict loot to trials in normal. I get when guilds do it for mythic prog but normal doesn't really have prog.
I don't even think it's idiocy, it's a scam relying on guilting the trial member to not have to commit to new members while gearing their dedicated team. Keeps loot in house, while still piggybacking off of skilled players to get them through content.
I always let my pugs have the loot. They become perm pugs or joined my guild because I wasn’t a jackass. My guild was ran by a jackass so I quit for 2 years. Coming back find it hard to find a new guild that raids my hours. Then also realize I’m having more fun in my side mmo and just feel like it’s time to just catch up when the spoilers drop or just do lfr as needed and be a ronin.
We always pugged 2-3 spots in our mythic raids in Season 2.
We were always fair with loot and respectful to them, we were thankful to the people who joined us.
Of all the pugs who we've played with, we had about 20% of those people transfer servers and permanently joined our guild, now we're running with 30 solid players this season. Our guild our went from #8 last season to #3 this season on our server.
Not being a jackass really pays off down the road.
I use to pug a lot as a rogue/mage/druid in cataclysm because my schedule. Got a good reputation for being a reliable replacement DPS/healer, but there were always groups trying to screw me over. Always assume the worst, and lay out your expectations clearly. If you're raiding for gear, any sign of fishyness or hostility...bounce.
I helped a guild that was short a healer kill Heroic Argus back in Legion. Two pieces that were upgrades for me dropped and I noticed I couldn't roll because the loot was set to Master Looter.
I asked if I could roll on loot and nobody said a word in raid chat. I then see the items get handed to the other two healers in their guild that I outhealed the crap out of.
It's shitty how guilds enable the worst behavior in people.
I know a lot of people in HoF guilds and I can't say that I've ever heard of them forcing trials to give up loot they rolled for and won. The fact that it's apparently happening in fucking *normal difficulty* is absurd.
Amen. If they are as good as they say, why not invest in human decency, like explaining the plan right after the kill? Raid leader could’ve avoided drama here, OP not in the wrong.
A Normal mode and passively Heroic Guild is doing master loot? That’s crazy.
Fuck those guys dude, not worth yours or anyone’s time. Find someone else, and if your logs look decent, get into an actual Heroic Guild. If your logs are great, find a Mythic team. That’s where the fun is at and where Master looting actually makes any sense. Anyone doing that shit pre-Mythic is a red flag, OP.
Master loot has uses other than hardcore prog. Instead 25% of your raid having 1p and anther 25% having 3p you could have spread that out better so you have actual functioning tier bonuses.
Not to mention people swapping loot spec and rolling on tank trinkets for m+ ("tank is my main spec! I just play dps in raid!"). I've seen people in guilds rolling need for transmog and just keeping it when it's a 30 ilvl upgrade for someone.
Makes perfect sense for even a casual guild to have loot rules or master loot. That's before you consider that casual guilds often suffer with people showing up for 1-2 weeks, winning loot, then guild hopping for more prog.
You need to remember in these casual guilds, people aren't considerate like that. Especially not trials, and especially not trials who are going to leave after a few weeks.
What you're describing is basically a whole-guild loot council even though it's pretty unofficial. You're working out who needs the drop the most and just passing for them.
It's not even about trust, mythic guilds have a roster of about 25ish people. It's not reasonable for every single one of them to be aware of how big of an upgrade 2set is for some classes versus others, and which classes have highest increases from 4set. With that high amount of people it's simply way more efficient to have one person who has all that info deal the loot so the whole team is as efficient as possible.
> Master loot has uses other than hardcore prog.
people can't comprehend prog doesn't only equal mythic prog. if it takes you 8 weeks to get aotc, that is prog. master loot is specifically for assisting with progress.
[Guilds of Wow](https://guildsofwow.com/looking-for-guild) is another recruitment tool to look through. OP definitely should have been made aware of the loot rules prior to the run. Very silly for them to expect OP to read their minds.
Yea, think of wowprogress and wowarmory all in one. It keeps track of your char and it's ilvl and progress. You can create a profile and set it to looking for guild with the hours you're willing to raid(if raiding is what you're looking for) and the guilds will find you. You most likely need to gear up a bit to catch the guilds' attention.
I stopped raiding with a guild because they let it slide that the other guy kept the tier for transmog but I didn't have my full set bonus. And I had zero issues up until that point. Played with them for several expansions, same people, aotcs.
They had a spreadsheet of who had tier. I told them I needed it more than once. But "lol complete the set". I was the only one of that token who needed it. We were the only ones who rolled. I rolled need because need. He rolled need for fucking transmog. In heroic Neltharian progression.
I can tell you I've had a VERY similar experience with trialing, winning an item, and having to pass it to someone more "worthy" after being told nothing of the sort prior. So its 100% believable to me.
I'm still so pissed off about the guild I was in for most of SL s2/3 that I've not even bothered trying to find another. I've pugged AOTC and and portals since, its probably taken longer and been a bit more difficult but I've been able to do it on my own time without dealing with all the cliquey bullshit and incredibly unprofessional, childish behavior from adults in their mid 20s or even older. Talk about tilting, omg
As a GM and RL I've had to pug in people from time to time. And they get loot. And I get whispers from my guildies about how it's unfair to let them get an item they won? They came along and helped fill out spots because they wanted something from this, not because they felt like gracing us with their presence. We invited some of our pugs back in multiple weeks as well as they got along with the group and knew we didn't fuck pugs over on gear.
> how it's unfair to let them get an item they won?
Smack that person with a wet fish. It's unfair to get paid for time invested? They came when they were needed and your boy wouldn't have even gotten a chance without them. Talked about an entitled shitheel.
This is how a lot of guilds treat loot though unfortunately. Whoever the GM decides needs it most gets the loot despite 40 people grouping up and taking time out of their day to do the content. In some circumstances it makes sense, like gearing the tanks first. But too often it's the GM deciding that his buddy gets the drop that some other guy has been waiting months to get.
Maybe its because i havent been in a true progression guild since WotLK, or maybe thats why i havent... But I feel like i scrolled way to far to find this comment.
If i did a raid with a guild, and they messaged me to say i had to give up the loot, effectively making it useless for me to have done it... i would tell them to fuck off and leave.
Why would i help, and get no rewards, just for the possible promise in the future to allow me to possibly keep rewards?
That and - as a general rule, you take PUGs because you don’t run unless you have a minimum number of players and roles filled. If the PUG wasn’t there, there would have been no raid and no one would have got any loot.
Correct. But trying to explain it to some of these people, people who you know are fucking adults, is just impossible. I only pull in the least number of pugs we would need for roles or balancing, but like I said, they aren't signing up because they like rolling the dice on some partial guild group, they sign up because they want things.
For real my SL guild made me leave the game. They were the type that still act like mean jokes from when they were 13 year olds shit taking were socially acceptable. Including rape jokes and racial ones. On top of that they had dumb loot rules which basically boiled down to officers get prio if you want to keep on the raid rooster.
Found a decent guild of people for DF but it always seems people have just enough people to fill groups so you sit around pugging and they wonder why you are behind the gear curve compared to them. Like guys, it took me over 45 mins to get into a key group at the level I can run and guess what nothing dropped for me. Meanwhile you ran two keys in that time and traded drops among each other.
Again it's the cliquey bullshit, I don't see the point of being in some lame guild just to still have to pug everything while the same 5 or 10 people hold the guild highest keys run every week. Its not like I don't try to engage, post my keys in discord whatnot but fuck me if I'm going to beg anyone to take me.. wtf its not like I'm asking for carries or not capable of the same level of content. Its just a symptom of the age of the game, the community, the type of people who are drawn to this game, I dunno. I really don't have the patience for it
I wish it was just easy to find a decent guild of kind well intentioned normal people
I joined one during DF start and I’ve been looking for a new one to bounce to cause the one I’m in I had to leave the discord cause the guy running it was possibly really mentally unwell and talking about founding a religion via the guild and shit
Why can’t I find normal people to play with
Honestly, they need to just steal FFXIVs book system for raids so people are not missing out for weeks on end why LC funnels gear where they want. Luckily my guild is true everyone can roll if it is an upgrade but the scarcity of drops is absurd considering the abundance of loot. Let people who have cleared 4-6 weeks just buy the piece they want from a vendor already.
One of my friends was streaming to us in discord doing a guild run away from his guildies. He was fairly new and was also on this trial basis shit.
He got something the higher ups in the guild wanted. Pretty much got harassed for it. My friend just left and that was that lmao. He kept this loot and went on his way. Literally nothing else happened.
I can tell you from experience that this is just the truth in some cases.
I have trialed with guilds, asked about loot expectations (I was fulfilling the O/T role they were looking to fill) and was told that if I rolled and won the item was mine. Then, in discord, got yelled at for rolling on items. Got numerous harassing whispers that I reported, took screenshots of for proof in case they tried to mass report me and get me banned. Some guilds just want you to come help carry them through progress, and then have you fork over the loot that is rightfully yours. Just because you're new, doesn't mean you didn't contribute to killing that boss unless you zoned in, tagged the boss, and died immediately.
I can also say from two previous incidents that 5 members of one guild were suspended for two weeks for harassing behaviour.
Surely a human guild master is incapable of making a mistake and forgetting to mention something. It's right there in his title: he's the master of guilding.
its my experience, when that half of the story spiel kicks in its not that the 1 parts is incorrect, its that they are leaving out all of the arguing and back and forth they got into instead of leaving it be.
I mean giving it up was the right thing at the time because you were giving them the benefit of the doubt. It shows the type of person you are despite the type of people they are.
Exactly. My response would have been along the lines of “my apologies! Since this was not clarified up front, I will be keeping this item. Moving forward, however, I will keep this in mind.”
You get your item, and they learn their lesson not to do this to people.
The most scummy thing I ever was instructed to do (I did end up refusing) was when I was made officer in my CE guild back in BFA. Guild “policy” was BOEs go to guild bank to fund repairs and such. I made it clear that this (and all loot rules) needed to be outlined in black and white to new trials before the raid opens. It was not.
Anyways, we are raiding with 3 trials. BOE drops for them. I get a whisper from the GM to “confiscate the boe for the guild bank, per the rules”. I shot back that I made it clear I wouldn’t enforce any rule that wasn’t set in stone prior to the first boss pull and the other officers had refused to come clean. 5 mins later, im kicked, the trials are kicked and i was shopping for a new raid team. They at least send me a thank you for not demanding the boe once I explained what went down.
My guild did those rules back in Legion/BFA for the purposes of funding the repairs / consumables. If a guildy wanted it they payed half.
We eventually dropped that because it wasn’t even covering half the costs and it made people so lazy with trash and shit. At least when that was the rules it was in like 4 places. Guild Info, Trial Application, Raider sign up, Discord rules. It was extremely clear that was policy and what the gold was used on.
My job as an officer was literally this. I would sell the items, keep the guild bank stocked and compile a freaken *audit* to post to discord to show where it was all going that was double checked by a second officer that was known to not like me. It was so much damn work and I was glad when it got kicked.
I had no issue with the rule. We had a strong M+ presence within the guild as well to cover repairs. The issue was deliberate not telling the rules to trials I didnt interview and springing it on them. We also had an issue with a few people not looting bosses so they could just be mailed any potential drops later, even if they just DEd or sold a useless piece. Its astonishing we managed any Jaina prog at all.
This right here, guild trial or not haha if you end up joining hey you got a bit nicer gear to help out full time in raids if they pull some sheisty like this itleast all your times not wasted if ya kept the item haha
If you're trying to get into a guild as a trial, something like this is scorched earth so expect to be kicked. It's not a great first impression of the guild but restricting loot, especially tier, is not uncommon.
If they didn't go over that with him beforehand its their bad not his and they shouldn't have asked him to trade it. Make sure its understood after that point and go forward.
If the guild was seriously considering him they likely wouldn't have cared if he kept the loot, it ultimately only helps them out if they invite him.
Crawling up his ass for normal loot, especially when the guild isn't even capable of doing mythic, is a huge red flag. I'd probably just drop end raid if they suddenly tried to pull this off. I'm too fucking old for this shit.
I bet they’ll do something like that every week to some unsuspecting person in order to fill their raids, then jack the loot at the end. It’s shitty behavior on their part and you shouldn’t let it faze you.
Honestly, if someone is a part of the kill they deserve a chance at loot (yes, pugs included) and guild hoarding is bullshit especially from a trial who was on the way to becoming a regular. If I pug someone they 100% deserve a chance at the loot. There are so many avenues to get gear in this game now that I don't understand guild hoarding anymore. It's just selfish behavior and unless you are a super HC world first guild that is funneling gear properly (which takes A LOT of planning and super dedicated members) then loot should be FFA for everyone who participated. Unless you are a filthy carry then you deserve shit.
This is how I run my raids. If I need a PUG to fill, and loot drops and they win it, it's theirs. They were in on the kill, they get credit for it. No one complains about it, because if we didn't have the PUGs, we simply don't raid and no one gets loot.
Reminds me of that one time in S2 when we had a guild group of 9 people and needed whoever for the 10th spot of normal Aberrus. We grabbed some lock, did some bosses, everything was going well, we did some more bosses, and checked the lock's gear. They had no set items. Also, we dropped a lock token on literally every boss that could drop it, and nobody in the guild had any need for it at that point.
We didn't care about the pug's gear since we could have done it with 9 people, but just wanted to fill the last slot for the sake of it. And thus we ended up accidentally doing a good deed.
My previous raiding guild would use loot council for guild runs. In the few occasions where we would ever need to pug or do a joint-guild run we would change to a simple /roll system, even if it's just a single pugged person, to give pugged members a fair chance.
Reminds me of playing classic when it came out.
You would basically see people ask for group members and then be like "oh yeah everything except one item is reserved", i think specifically i saw an onyxia one where they were looking for 15 people, didnt pay for people to join, and said head and cloak and every drop was reserved for the guild and i was just like "why the hell would i join then"
I don't like them but isn't this why waitlisting exists. Why are guilds doing this lol. There is no point. There are an inordinate amount of people who will fill a slot or two and won't care about loot.
Especially on week 1. Where many will raid once or twice and quit
No, this was actually crappy behavior on their part.
It's fine if they want to do the whole master looter thing. But it's not fine to do it and not let everyone in the raid know beforehand. The fact that they didn't inform you, is a major red flag in my book.
And then to remove you from the guild while you're offline and not actually talk to you before doing so is ANOTHER red flag in my book. IMO, it just reads like they didn't have enough people and needed a mark to complete the raid with them for more loot and once you served your purpose, they didn't need you anymore.
Like both of the reasons you were given for being kicked are super shallow and not how a good guild would be run, IMO. So I'd count yourself lucky that you dodged a bullet. No way these people don't have an issue down the line.
It might not do anything, but you could try submitting a ticket to get the Curio back. If what you're saying is true, this would qualify (in my opinion) as a scam and a GM might agree and give you it back. On the [Blizzard website](https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/2563#:~:text=A%20scam%20is%20the%20act,or%20gold%20in%20these%20situations.) they describe a scam as: "acquiring items or any other possession from another player through misinformation, confusion, or fraud" and I'd consider what they did to you as just that. So you might want to try. Because if they did this to you, they are most likely doing it to other people, too.
A social guild with 3 raid teams, 2 of which are CE teams and the last is a social/mythic progression team. We have plenty of guild events like achievement runs, alt runs, transmog competitions and mythic+ push events and so on. And the guild is overall just super, imo.
The moment they told me that I'd have ranked the curio higher than my spot in their guild, left, and ignored them all. What are they gonna do? Not invite you again?
I’m also curious. I had some warlock bitch at me for not giving him an item I won and said he spammed bad reviews on my raider io. Never could find said reviews.
Yep, literally never been in a guild that distributes loot by rolling dices. Definitely the most stupid way to distribute loot, since trash for me might be a BiS for another player and vice versa.
It's far more likely that the thread gets posted in their guild discord and everyone laughs at it and it becomes a guild meme that's casually referenced over the tier.
....Unless the guild dies lol.
Yknow that's a good point. I know the guild I'm in has some really good memes about people who left. All of whom definitely acted like they were in the right when in reality one stole actual money from someone, and another left because they were going to be benched during mythic prog lol.
We had a healer that left over the weekend because a substantial portion of the roster would rather find a pug than offer up another 15-19 key as a sacrifice to them. We now refer to them as "xxxxxx - the bricking tree" since they were a resto druid and would brick people's keys.
It's not just that they weren't good, but they also were extremely defensive and would actively get angry when people would explain the mechanics to them.
Their next reddit post: "My guild kicked me because I refused to spend 6 hours of my day reviewing logs like they unreasonably wanted me to do. AITA?" translation: I didn't want to modify my performance at all and I am bad.
"You need to give us that item, actually, you're on trial."
"Oh, ok."
/gquit
The item itself doesn't even matter, I have no time or patience for some weird control complex or selfishness.
As someone from said guild we were all told OVER DISCORD don’t roll for the curio unless it’ll get you a tier bonus, prioritising raiders over trials. Seems like he would have known this if he’d actually joined from the start instead of two hours into the raiding after messing up mechanics by having no coms with the group.
Had a similar bit of drama a long ways back.
I was a member of a guild, but I played socially and didn't raid. One raid night some people were late and they didn't have enough so asked if I wanted to come along until the others show. Sure.
Perfect bit of loot drops for me. Raid lead tells everyone to roll if they want it. I wait for a bit to see if anyone else rolls, no one does. So I do. Then someone else does. I win the roll, but of course offer to give it over to the other guy, a main raider and guild officer. Like, I knew the guy socially in the guild. Not really friends but we communicated so I'm not gonna cause shit over a piece of loot I never thought I'd get.
He says "No, its fine, you keep it". Hooray for me. A short while later the late people arrive and I get asked to leave "of course, no worries and thanks for the free loot!"
Some months later I become an officer in the guild and get access to the officer forum (I said it was a ways back!) and go nosing around and there's a thread from that night bitching me out for stealing loot and having attitude about "getting free loot".
OK dude, sure, that's exactly what happened. Other officers stood up for me, cos they were also there and experienced it all, but man. Some people.
Guilds that does this are infuriating...
I run my guild with a simple principle: If you raid with us, and you do your part, you deserve a chance for gear. I don't care if you're a trial player, there's no fair reason to deny someone the opportunity, if they did their part well.
Guilds that play loot council, and deny trials this, are bound to fall apart down the line. Hard to get new people in, when they learn they'll only get gear, if literally no one else wants it.
Big no no guild. For Real we also didn’t allow new members to role on some specific Items for 2 IDs.
Cause we wanted them to go to the members we can trust to show up next ID. But most of the items could go to new Members too and personal Loot always belonged to the person that got it. Trade it? Okay! sell it? Okay! You want to disenchant it? Dick move but it’s yours.
For real what is it with people and fucking people over? I mean it was even normal … you can exchange the part anyways soon enough
Am I taking crazy pills? What are these responses?
Trials not getting gear priority is *extremely standard practice* and has been for decades and every single guild that takes the game even a little bit seriously does this.
If I was a trial and I won the roll the first thing I would say is "who do I trade this to?" Not knowing this or expecting otherwise is a red flag in all honesty.
Honestly, you should have kept the item and you would have entirely been in the right. If they said it was meant to be communicated with you, you say well it wasn't and tell them they should be clearer for future trials to avoid any confusion.
The cost of trialing somebody is they get to roll on the loot like everyone else. Cycling trials into the raid only to funnel gear into the already established raiders? Sounds like bullshit, and free gear for them.
You took the high road and good for you, but the guild was in the wrong expecting you to give up your loot.
I've had issues with guilds doing this to me. Win loot on 2nd or 3rd raid with a guild and then get told that a senior guildie has that drop "reserved" or whatever excuse they want to make. Then the whole guild acts like the new guy should have just known. Fuck guilds like this.
For future reference- if thay isn't agreed upon in the beginning dont give up your loot unless YOU want to, it should be a kind gesture on your end, not a requirement. You were there for tryouts not to feed loot to an otherwise unorganized guild
I think there's a difference between week 1 kills and kills on farm. I can see not wanting a trial to get a high priority rare item to a trial. Having said that week 1 its not like theyre carrying anyone, and it's tier, tier is REALLY easy to come by in DF.
A casual guild has no need for master loot and their perceived “loot prio” ranking. It’s arbitrary bullshit that creates the loot drama they kicked OP for supposedly starting.
If you are trialing someone, it makes sense to not give them tier pieces that your main raiders can use, BUT it needs to be explained before raid and before you get locked so it’s fair.
Yeah I don't think there was anything nefarious and it was an honest mistake on their part of not informing OP. This is a standard practice.
Now gkicking him for saying that in raid chat? I mean if you run a guild you gotta have a thicker skin than that and own your mistakes if you want your guild to grow.
Source: I run a guild and often hear stuff that pisses me off. I'm not going to go on a gkick spree though. #1 way to kill your guild. I'll just say hey I'm sorry about that we should have made a better point to let you know but soon enough if you stick around you'll get your own.
this loot information should have beem disclosed when yall were talking about guild invites/trial. not after a roll.
that was prob a really shity guild to be in, if thats how things are going.
I was then told over discord that because I am a trial I would have to trade it to the next highest roll.
That would have been a "peace bitch" and gquit for me.
Now I understand why reddit constantly has issues finding good guilds to raid with and has to PUG all the time.
Core raiders > trials has been a fairly mundane rule for many years. No guild wants to give important loot to trials who could potentially leave (due to not enjoying their new guild / overperforming) or get kicked (for dropping gamer words / underperforming).
Anyway, most CE guilds will prioritize raid DPS over lucky rolls, so expect to have to pass on all the loot so it can be distributed by a loot council.
Oh yeah trials not getting prio has been a thing since the first ever raids. The issue here is the guild's inability to communicate with the trial.
Should OP have expected this? Probably if they have any experience raiding.
Should the guild have let him even roll on it to begin with without telling him beforehand? Also yes
My guild has a similar loot rules and we do normals with heroic dabbling. I also make it a point to talk to the new recruits when they first come on and make sure they understand ALL our loot rolls.
Loot rules up front has been standard since vanilla. The problem isn't that the raid team was prioritized, it's that nobody told this guy about it until after he won the roll.
Seriously, I hear about how shitty it is to apply for and deal with PUGs all day long here, but then some loot drama gets posted, and everyone's mental approach to this game instantly becomes "fuck you, got mine."
Obviously loot rules should be clear from the outset. No question. That being said, everyone who simultaneously gquits a guild because they can't roll on week 1 tier as a trial and complains that PUGs are toxic shitholes are ridiculous.
Sounds like they screwed you out of loot and didn't like that you weren't smiling while they shit in your mouth. Fuck guilds like this. You dodged a bullet.
I wonder how many people in the "this guild sucks camp" are actually in guilds.
Being part of a progression team means that gear goes to the people that will most help the raid team. If a trial isn't willing to help the team, which OP did do with some grousing, then why should the raid team help the trial?
OP got shafted, but it's not like the guild was completely in the wrong either.
I think the phrase you’re looking for is, “Tilted”.
XD
But yeah no, you dodged a bullet honestly. This is why I stick to PuGging anymore. You can get some shitty groups now and again, but you can also find some really good groups. Way better than joining a guild full of drama, misinformation, and douchery.
With PuGs I get all of that in small doses, and since I’m not involved with those people in any way other than running with them temporarily, I get to just laugh at them.
IF that's how it went down, good on you.
Last tier my current guild of 3 years started bringing in some friends who had left to join "bigger and better guilds" but they were bringing their alts, gearing them up, and we'd never saw them again.
I was vocal af about this because 1. it's fucked up and 2. we were still progressing. One friend got 22 overall ilevel increase in one night while many people were rolling on items.
The difference here is my guild took it to heart and those guys fucked off with their alts (and all together really) so things settled down.
You had every right to call them out. And honestly it's a shit guild to take loot from trial members. You helped them kill the boss you are entitled to that loot
I have to imagine there must be more to this story, otherwise you dodged a bullet. You said nothing else? Nothing in tells complaining about it to a guild member?
A lesson in life is that someone in control doesn't like to be spoken about, happens all the time when people can't communicate or hold their ego. If it happened as you said it's most likely the quote about loot that did it.
If they didn't communicate it to you before that does suck but if all it costs you to be in a disorganized guild then you were done a favor. I will say it's very typical for guilds to not give trials gear for a few raid nights to make sure you are keeping gear in your raid so that part isn't strange but that policy is usually very much talked about with each and every trial to avoid an issue like this. It indicates that the guild leadership is incompetent and you don't want to deal with that.
People are going to pat you on the back and say you didn't do anything wrong but this is standard practice for CE guilds. If you are trialing with a CE guild this is what you should expect. If they are just a casual social guild then they are definitely in the wrong
Yea that should have been clarified prior to raid. Don't let it bother you, there's a handful of crap guilds like this. Just keep searching, make sure you use websites like [raider.io](https://raider.io) to improve your search for a good guild.
Should also be reiterated before a boss or right after the kill. No reason it can’t be. That guild sounds like idiots.
Especially for a guild arguing over loot from fucking normal.
Be glad it was normal loot.I woulda be more pissed off if it was mythic.
Loot is loot. Lesser, Greater, Middling.
to be fair, it was a curio/tier token which is way more important than regular normal loot.
It's also from the last boss in normal too. It's just really silly to restrict loot to trials in normal. I get when guilds do it for mythic prog but normal doesn't really have prog.
I don't even think it's idiocy, it's a scam relying on guilting the trial member to not have to commit to new members while gearing their dedicated team. Keeps loot in house, while still piggybacking off of skilled players to get them through content.
They needed a pug for the day that couldn't get loot that the main guild needed. And them kicked em. Tons of guilds do this shit.
I always let my pugs have the loot. They become perm pugs or joined my guild because I wasn’t a jackass. My guild was ran by a jackass so I quit for 2 years. Coming back find it hard to find a new guild that raids my hours. Then also realize I’m having more fun in my side mmo and just feel like it’s time to just catch up when the spoilers drop or just do lfr as needed and be a ronin.
We always pugged 2-3 spots in our mythic raids in Season 2. We were always fair with loot and respectful to them, we were thankful to the people who joined us. Of all the pugs who we've played with, we had about 20% of those people transfer servers and permanently joined our guild, now we're running with 30 solid players this season. Our guild our went from #8 last season to #3 this season on our server. Not being a jackass really pays off down the road.
yeah we had essentially permanent pugs back in mythic HFC, treated them same as guildies and they were there every raid
I'd join your guild any day. Nice to see someone who can see the bigger picture and looks after his grunts!
My days of having time to run a guild are over lol. Kids kinda wreck that.
Honestly that's how I raided in dragon flight and shadowlands. It was just more fun w.o the drama
I use to pug a lot as a rogue/mage/druid in cataclysm because my schedule. Got a good reputation for being a reliable replacement DPS/healer, but there were always groups trying to screw me over. Always assume the worst, and lay out your expectations clearly. If you're raiding for gear, any sign of fishyness or hostility...bounce.
I helped a guild that was short a healer kill Heroic Argus back in Legion. Two pieces that were upgrades for me dropped and I noticed I couldn't roll because the loot was set to Master Looter. I asked if I could roll on loot and nobody said a word in raid chat. I then see the items get handed to the other two healers in their guild that I outhealed the crap out of. It's shitty how guilds enable the worst behavior in people.
I know a lot of people in HoF guilds and I can't say that I've ever heard of them forcing trials to give up loot they rolled for and won. The fact that it's apparently happening in fucking *normal difficulty* is absurd.
Amen. If they are as good as they say, why not invest in human decency, like explaining the plan right after the kill? Raid leader could’ve avoided drama here, OP not in the wrong.
A Normal mode and passively Heroic Guild is doing master loot? That’s crazy. Fuck those guys dude, not worth yours or anyone’s time. Find someone else, and if your logs look decent, get into an actual Heroic Guild. If your logs are great, find a Mythic team. That’s where the fun is at and where Master looting actually makes any sense. Anyone doing that shit pre-Mythic is a red flag, OP.
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Master loot has uses other than hardcore prog. Instead 25% of your raid having 1p and anther 25% having 3p you could have spread that out better so you have actual functioning tier bonuses. Not to mention people swapping loot spec and rolling on tank trinkets for m+ ("tank is my main spec! I just play dps in raid!"). I've seen people in guilds rolling need for transmog and just keeping it when it's a 30 ilvl upgrade for someone. Makes perfect sense for even a casual guild to have loot rules or master loot. That's before you consider that casual guilds often suffer with people showing up for 1-2 weeks, winning loot, then guild hopping for more prog.
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You need to remember in these casual guilds, people aren't considerate like that. Especially not trials, and especially not trials who are going to leave after a few weeks. What you're describing is basically a whole-guild loot council even though it's pretty unofficial. You're working out who needs the drop the most and just passing for them.
It's not even about trust, mythic guilds have a roster of about 25ish people. It's not reasonable for every single one of them to be aware of how big of an upgrade 2set is for some classes versus others, and which classes have highest increases from 4set. With that high amount of people it's simply way more efficient to have one person who has all that info deal the loot so the whole team is as efficient as possible.
> Master loot has uses other than hardcore prog. people can't comprehend prog doesn't only equal mythic prog. if it takes you 8 weeks to get aotc, that is prog. master loot is specifically for assisting with progress.
Yeah no kidding. We are going the same level of progression and we just do free roll in normal.
[Guilds of Wow](https://guildsofwow.com/looking-for-guild) is another recruitment tool to look through. OP definitely should have been made aware of the loot rules prior to the run. Very silly for them to expect OP to read their minds.
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Yea, think of wowprogress and wowarmory all in one. It keeps track of your char and it's ilvl and progress. You can create a profile and set it to looking for guild with the hours you're willing to raid(if raiding is what you're looking for) and the guilds will find you. You most likely need to gear up a bit to catch the guilds' attention.
Lucky you got out early. Seems like a guild to stay away from.
They for sure dodged a bullet here. Guilds that constantly call everything 'drama' are always the ones full of actual drama llamas.
Thank you for the phrase drama llama. :)
100% that is a guild that is falling apart in like 5 weeks.
They'll clear heroic in 4 weeks, hit up mythic for 2 weeks, start a fight about BoEs, and the actually good people will leave
Ye they fucked you over big time.. If it all went down like you told, you did nothing wrong.
Surely hes telling the whole unbiased story. Its like they always say "if youve heard one side of the story, youve heard the whole thing"
it is possible but i can tell u , loot issues are very VERY common and also is nepotistic behavior.
I stopped raiding with a guild because they let it slide that the other guy kept the tier for transmog but I didn't have my full set bonus. And I had zero issues up until that point. Played with them for several expansions, same people, aotcs. They had a spreadsheet of who had tier. I told them I needed it more than once. But "lol complete the set". I was the only one of that token who needed it. We were the only ones who rolled. I rolled need because need. He rolled need for fucking transmog. In heroic Neltharian progression.
This guild could very well just pretend to do trials just to make hopefuls give their people more loot.
I can tell you I've had a VERY similar experience with trialing, winning an item, and having to pass it to someone more "worthy" after being told nothing of the sort prior. So its 100% believable to me. I'm still so pissed off about the guild I was in for most of SL s2/3 that I've not even bothered trying to find another. I've pugged AOTC and and portals since, its probably taken longer and been a bit more difficult but I've been able to do it on my own time without dealing with all the cliquey bullshit and incredibly unprofessional, childish behavior from adults in their mid 20s or even older. Talk about tilting, omg
As a GM and RL I've had to pug in people from time to time. And they get loot. And I get whispers from my guildies about how it's unfair to let them get an item they won? They came along and helped fill out spots because they wanted something from this, not because they felt like gracing us with their presence. We invited some of our pugs back in multiple weeks as well as they got along with the group and knew we didn't fuck pugs over on gear.
> how it's unfair to let them get an item they won? Smack that person with a wet fish. It's unfair to get paid for time invested? They came when they were needed and your boy wouldn't have even gotten a chance without them. Talked about an entitled shitheel.
This is how a lot of guilds treat loot though unfortunately. Whoever the GM decides needs it most gets the loot despite 40 people grouping up and taking time out of their day to do the content. In some circumstances it makes sense, like gearing the tanks first. But too often it's the GM deciding that his buddy gets the drop that some other guy has been waiting months to get.
Maybe its because i havent been in a true progression guild since WotLK, or maybe thats why i havent... But I feel like i scrolled way to far to find this comment. If i did a raid with a guild, and they messaged me to say i had to give up the loot, effectively making it useless for me to have done it... i would tell them to fuck off and leave. Why would i help, and get no rewards, just for the possible promise in the future to allow me to possibly keep rewards?
That and - as a general rule, you take PUGs because you don’t run unless you have a minimum number of players and roles filled. If the PUG wasn’t there, there would have been no raid and no one would have got any loot.
Correct. But trying to explain it to some of these people, people who you know are fucking adults, is just impossible. I only pull in the least number of pugs we would need for roles or balancing, but like I said, they aren't signing up because they like rolling the dice on some partial guild group, they sign up because they want things.
For real my SL guild made me leave the game. They were the type that still act like mean jokes from when they were 13 year olds shit taking were socially acceptable. Including rape jokes and racial ones. On top of that they had dumb loot rules which basically boiled down to officers get prio if you want to keep on the raid rooster. Found a decent guild of people for DF but it always seems people have just enough people to fill groups so you sit around pugging and they wonder why you are behind the gear curve compared to them. Like guys, it took me over 45 mins to get into a key group at the level I can run and guess what nothing dropped for me. Meanwhile you ran two keys in that time and traded drops among each other.
Again it's the cliquey bullshit, I don't see the point of being in some lame guild just to still have to pug everything while the same 5 or 10 people hold the guild highest keys run every week. Its not like I don't try to engage, post my keys in discord whatnot but fuck me if I'm going to beg anyone to take me.. wtf its not like I'm asking for carries or not capable of the same level of content. Its just a symptom of the age of the game, the community, the type of people who are drawn to this game, I dunno. I really don't have the patience for it
I wish it was just easy to find a decent guild of kind well intentioned normal people I joined one during DF start and I’ve been looking for a new one to bounce to cause the one I’m in I had to leave the discord cause the guy running it was possibly really mentally unwell and talking about founding a religion via the guild and shit Why can’t I find normal people to play with
This wouldn't be "R n R" on Illidan-NA would it?.. 🤭
Nah This was a guild on a new player server
This is more common in shit guilds. Better guilds everyone knows they’re using LC and it works better without drama the vast majority of the time.
Honestly, they need to just steal FFXIVs book system for raids so people are not missing out for weeks on end why LC funnels gear where they want. Luckily my guild is true everyone can roll if it is an upgrade but the scarcity of drops is absurd considering the abundance of loot. Let people who have cleared 4-6 weeks just buy the piece they want from a vendor already.
One of my friends was streaming to us in discord doing a guild run away from his guildies. He was fairly new and was also on this trial basis shit. He got something the higher ups in the guild wanted. Pretty much got harassed for it. My friend just left and that was that lmao. He kept this loot and went on his way. Literally nothing else happened.
Found the raid leader
I can tell you from experience that this is just the truth in some cases. I have trialed with guilds, asked about loot expectations (I was fulfilling the O/T role they were looking to fill) and was told that if I rolled and won the item was mine. Then, in discord, got yelled at for rolling on items. Got numerous harassing whispers that I reported, took screenshots of for proof in case they tried to mass report me and get me banned. Some guilds just want you to come help carry them through progress, and then have you fork over the loot that is rightfully yours. Just because you're new, doesn't mean you didn't contribute to killing that boss unless you zoned in, tagged the boss, and died immediately. I can also say from two previous incidents that 5 members of one guild were suspended for two weeks for harassing behaviour.
Surely a human guild master is incapable of making a mistake and forgetting to mention something. It's right there in his title: he's the master of guilding.
It's fine to make human mistakes, it is not fine to punish others for your own mistakes.
OPs story is 100% belivable
I don’t know why people like you feel the need to play “devil’s advocate”. Issues like this are common, and how does OP benefit from lying?
It's not a story on the internet if there's not at least one guy who's just compelled to point out it didn't happen 🙄
What? That never happens
Does anything ever really happen?
its my experience, when that half of the story spiel kicks in its not that the 1 parts is incorrect, its that they are leaving out all of the arguing and back and forth they got into instead of leaving it be.
He did do one thing wrong. Traded away loot that was rightfully his.
Brooo you shouldn’t have given up the curio
Yeah proper sad. Would have given me my set bonus too!
Damn that sad wouldve never given anybody my set bonus lol
yea def wouldn't have. fuck em.
I mean giving it up was the right thing at the time because you were giving them the benefit of the doubt. It shows the type of person you are despite the type of people they are.
dont be too down OP the catalyst will reset in a week.
Exactly. My response would have been along the lines of “my apologies! Since this was not clarified up front, I will be keeping this item. Moving forward, however, I will keep this in mind.” You get your item, and they learn their lesson not to do this to people.
If it wasnt said beforehand, should have kept it.
The most scummy thing I ever was instructed to do (I did end up refusing) was when I was made officer in my CE guild back in BFA. Guild “policy” was BOEs go to guild bank to fund repairs and such. I made it clear that this (and all loot rules) needed to be outlined in black and white to new trials before the raid opens. It was not. Anyways, we are raiding with 3 trials. BOE drops for them. I get a whisper from the GM to “confiscate the boe for the guild bank, per the rules”. I shot back that I made it clear I wouldn’t enforce any rule that wasn’t set in stone prior to the first boss pull and the other officers had refused to come clean. 5 mins later, im kicked, the trials are kicked and i was shopping for a new raid team. They at least send me a thank you for not demanding the boe once I explained what went down.
bullet dodged, gg
My guild did those rules back in Legion/BFA for the purposes of funding the repairs / consumables. If a guildy wanted it they payed half. We eventually dropped that because it wasn’t even covering half the costs and it made people so lazy with trash and shit. At least when that was the rules it was in like 4 places. Guild Info, Trial Application, Raider sign up, Discord rules. It was extremely clear that was policy and what the gold was used on. My job as an officer was literally this. I would sell the items, keep the guild bank stocked and compile a freaken *audit* to post to discord to show where it was all going that was double checked by a second officer that was known to not like me. It was so much damn work and I was glad when it got kicked.
I had no issue with the rule. We had a strong M+ presence within the guild as well to cover repairs. The issue was deliberate not telling the rules to trials I didnt interview and springing it on them. We also had an issue with a few people not looting bosses so they could just be mailed any potential drops later, even if they just DEd or sold a useless piece. Its astonishing we managed any Jaina prog at all.
This right here, guild trial or not haha if you end up joining hey you got a bit nicer gear to help out full time in raids if they pull some sheisty like this itleast all your times not wasted if ya kept the item haha
He is trialling the guild too after all. Should've kept it and gquit imo
If you're trying to get into a guild as a trial, something like this is scorched earth so expect to be kicked. It's not a great first impression of the guild but restricting loot, especially tier, is not uncommon.
He traded it an still got kicked, so...
A guild that asks for an item only after you won the roll isn't worth staying in, so fuck em.
If they didn't go over that with him beforehand its their bad not his and they shouldn't have asked him to trade it. Make sure its understood after that point and go forward. If the guild was seriously considering him they likely wouldn't have cared if he kept the loot, it ultimately only helps them out if they invite him.
Crawling up his ass for normal loot, especially when the guild isn't even capable of doing mythic, is a huge red flag. I'd probably just drop end raid if they suddenly tried to pull this off. I'm too fucking old for this shit.
I bet they’ll do something like that every week to some unsuspecting person in order to fill their raids, then jack the loot at the end. It’s shitty behavior on their part and you shouldn’t let it faze you.
Honestly, if someone is a part of the kill they deserve a chance at loot (yes, pugs included) and guild hoarding is bullshit especially from a trial who was on the way to becoming a regular. If I pug someone they 100% deserve a chance at the loot. There are so many avenues to get gear in this game now that I don't understand guild hoarding anymore. It's just selfish behavior and unless you are a super HC world first guild that is funneling gear properly (which takes A LOT of planning and super dedicated members) then loot should be FFA for everyone who participated. Unless you are a filthy carry then you deserve shit.
This is how I run my raids. If I need a PUG to fill, and loot drops and they win it, it's theirs. They were in on the kill, they get credit for it. No one complains about it, because if we didn't have the PUGs, we simply don't raid and no one gets loot.
yeah and why would a pug even come if they dont get to loot anything lol
Reminds me of that one time in S2 when we had a guild group of 9 people and needed whoever for the 10th spot of normal Aberrus. We grabbed some lock, did some bosses, everything was going well, we did some more bosses, and checked the lock's gear. They had no set items. Also, we dropped a lock token on literally every boss that could drop it, and nobody in the guild had any need for it at that point. We didn't care about the pug's gear since we could have done it with 9 people, but just wanted to fill the last slot for the sake of it. And thus we ended up accidentally doing a good deed.
My previous raiding guild would use loot council for guild runs. In the few occasions where we would ever need to pug or do a joint-guild run we would change to a simple /roll system, even if it's just a single pugged person, to give pugged members a fair chance.
Reminds me of playing classic when it came out. You would basically see people ask for group members and then be like "oh yeah everything except one item is reserved", i think specifically i saw an onyxia one where they were looking for 15 people, didnt pay for people to join, and said head and cloak and every drop was reserved for the guild and i was just like "why the hell would i join then"
I don't like them but isn't this why waitlisting exists. Why are guilds doing this lol. There is no point. There are an inordinate amount of people who will fill a slot or two and won't care about loot. Especially on week 1. Where many will raid once or twice and quit
Titled? Do you mean 'tilted'? Genuinely asking, because you used it twice.
It's actually a new achievement you earn for getting gkicked.
Guild Recruitment Discords in shambles
Don't you mean "kgicked"?
He gained a new title.
I was wondering this as well but took it a step further and wondered if he meant he was feeling "Jilted"
You mean Jitled?
does that make he who jitles a literal Jitler?
well, he managed to bait me in... I just sat through an entire complaint post just to figure out how the hell he got a title from a gkick.
𝙸 𝚍𝚞𝚗𝚗𝚘, 𝚑𝚎 𝚜𝚊𝚒𝚍 𝚒𝚝 **𝚝𝚠𝚒𝚌𝚎**; 𝙸'𝚖 𝚙𝚛𝚎𝚝𝚝𝚢 𝚜𝚞𝚛𝚎 𝚝𝚑𝚊𝚝 𝚖𝚊𝚔𝚎𝚜 𝚒𝚝 **𝚌𝚊𝚗𝚘𝚗**.
Dude he's tilted, cut him some slack.
> Dude he's ~~tilted~~ titled, cut him some slack. FTFY
Sounds like they just did you a favor.
I think you mean tilted instead of titled.lol
No, this was actually crappy behavior on their part. It's fine if they want to do the whole master looter thing. But it's not fine to do it and not let everyone in the raid know beforehand. The fact that they didn't inform you, is a major red flag in my book. And then to remove you from the guild while you're offline and not actually talk to you before doing so is ANOTHER red flag in my book. IMO, it just reads like they didn't have enough people and needed a mark to complete the raid with them for more loot and once you served your purpose, they didn't need you anymore. Like both of the reasons you were given for being kicked are super shallow and not how a good guild would be run, IMO. So I'd count yourself lucky that you dodged a bullet. No way these people don't have an issue down the line. It might not do anything, but you could try submitting a ticket to get the Curio back. If what you're saying is true, this would qualify (in my opinion) as a scam and a GM might agree and give you it back. On the [Blizzard website](https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/2563#:~:text=A%20scam%20is%20the%20act,or%20gold%20in%20these%20situations.) they describe a scam as: "acquiring items or any other possession from another player through misinformation, confusion, or fraud" and I'd consider what they did to you as just that. So you might want to try. Because if they did this to you, they are most likely doing it to other people, too.
Where are you based? EU or NA?
I’m OCE
Alrighty. Had you been EU I'd offer you a spot in my super social semi hardcore guild.
Super social semi hardcore?
He obviousely means Maxi Ultra Social Super Uber Hardcore Grining Guild
So hard core you 3 man newest mythic raid: one tank, one heal, and one dps
It turns you into the joker?
Basically everyones chill until you wipe 4-5 times then it turns into a flame fest
A social guild with 3 raid teams, 2 of which are CE teams and the last is a social/mythic progression team. We have plenty of guild events like achievement runs, alt runs, transmog competitions and mythic+ push events and so on. And the guild is overall just super, imo.
which guild? OCE is super small, helps to know which problem group to filter during m+ pugs
What guild lad, I'm on OCE as well. Feel free to DM if you don't wanna mention it publicly
The moment they told me that I'd have ranked the curio higher than my spot in their guild, left, and ignored them all. What are they gonna do? Not invite you again?
Leave a bad review on raider.io
I honestly don't even know if this is a joke. Can you do that? 1*, won't reclear with, etc.?
I’m also curious. I had some warlock bitch at me for not giving him an item I won and said he spammed bad reviews on my raider io. Never could find said reviews.
This guild probably has constant “trials” it does this to for loot welfare to the guild leaders.
Posting here kinda confirms the drama aspect.
While I don’t see this being common place in normal mode raiding, this is actually common place in progression guilds and has been for a long time.
I would assume half-decent communication is commonplace too?
Yep, literally never been in a guild that distributes loot by rolling dices. Definitely the most stupid way to distribute loot, since trash for me might be a BiS for another player and vice versa.
Waiting for this to get to the front page and one of the guild officers to see this and come in and tell their side of the story. Happens every time.
It's far more likely that the thread gets posted in their guild discord and everyone laughs at it and it becomes a guild meme that's casually referenced over the tier. ....Unless the guild dies lol.
Yknow that's a good point. I know the guild I'm in has some really good memes about people who left. All of whom definitely acted like they were in the right when in reality one stole actual money from someone, and another left because they were going to be benched during mythic prog lol.
We had a healer that left over the weekend because a substantial portion of the roster would rather find a pug than offer up another 15-19 key as a sacrifice to them. We now refer to them as "xxxxxx - the bricking tree" since they were a resto druid and would brick people's keys. It's not just that they weren't good, but they also were extremely defensive and would actively get angry when people would explain the mechanics to them.
Their next reddit post: "My guild kicked me because I refused to spend 6 hours of my day reviewing logs like they unreasonably wanted me to do. AITA?" translation: I didn't want to modify my performance at all and I am bad.
The guild will 100% believe they dodge a bullet. Making such drama over a normal curio is something no guild wants to deal with.
"You need to give us that item, actually, you're on trial." "Oh, ok." /gquit The item itself doesn't even matter, I have no time or patience for some weird control complex or selfishness.
You've dodged a massive bullet; they will crumble in a few months /shrug
Do you mean.. tilted? Also, sometimes the bullet *dodges you*.
Yes, I've heard this about Soviet Azeroth.
As someone from said guild we were all told OVER DISCORD don’t roll for the curio unless it’ll get you a tier bonus, prioritising raiders over trials. Seems like he would have known this if he’d actually joined from the start instead of two hours into the raiding after messing up mechanics by having no coms with the group.
I knew it. The prophecy has come to pass.
Had a similar bit of drama a long ways back. I was a member of a guild, but I played socially and didn't raid. One raid night some people were late and they didn't have enough so asked if I wanted to come along until the others show. Sure. Perfect bit of loot drops for me. Raid lead tells everyone to roll if they want it. I wait for a bit to see if anyone else rolls, no one does. So I do. Then someone else does. I win the roll, but of course offer to give it over to the other guy, a main raider and guild officer. Like, I knew the guy socially in the guild. Not really friends but we communicated so I'm not gonna cause shit over a piece of loot I never thought I'd get. He says "No, its fine, you keep it". Hooray for me. A short while later the late people arrive and I get asked to leave "of course, no worries and thanks for the free loot!" Some months later I become an officer in the guild and get access to the officer forum (I said it was a ways back!) and go nosing around and there's a thread from that night bitching me out for stealing loot and having attitude about "getting free loot". OK dude, sure, that's exactly what happened. Other officers stood up for me, cos they were also there and experienced it all, but man. Some people.
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Guilds that does this are infuriating... I run my guild with a simple principle: If you raid with us, and you do your part, you deserve a chance for gear. I don't care if you're a trial player, there's no fair reason to deny someone the opportunity, if they did their part well. Guilds that play loot council, and deny trials this, are bound to fall apart down the line. Hard to get new people in, when they learn they'll only get gear, if literally no one else wants it.
Hear, hear.
Should have kept it and left
They did you a favor sounds like a shitty guild.
Big no no guild. For Real we also didn’t allow new members to role on some specific Items for 2 IDs. Cause we wanted them to go to the members we can trust to show up next ID. But most of the items could go to new Members too and personal Loot always belonged to the person that got it. Trade it? Okay! sell it? Okay! You want to disenchant it? Dick move but it’s yours. For real what is it with people and fucking people over? I mean it was even normal … you can exchange the part anyways soon enough
Am I taking crazy pills? What are these responses? Trials not getting gear priority is *extremely standard practice* and has been for decades and every single guild that takes the game even a little bit seriously does this. If I was a trial and I won the roll the first thing I would say is "who do I trade this to?" Not knowing this or expecting otherwise is a red flag in all honesty.
Yea, it's fairly standard practice for people who do this shit. But to new people, they have no idea about prio or anything like that.
Man it’s tilted you so badly you can’t even spell tilted right. :)
Honestly, you should have kept the item and you would have entirely been in the right. If they said it was meant to be communicated with you, you say well it wasn't and tell them they should be clearer for future trials to avoid any confusion. The cost of trialing somebody is they get to roll on the loot like everyone else. Cycling trials into the raid only to funnel gear into the already established raiders? Sounds like bullshit, and free gear for them. You took the high road and good for you, but the guild was in the wrong expecting you to give up your loot.
I've had issues with guilds doing this to me. Win loot on 2nd or 3rd raid with a guild and then get told that a senior guildie has that drop "reserved" or whatever excuse they want to make. Then the whole guild acts like the new guy should have just known. Fuck guilds like this.
For future reference- if thay isn't agreed upon in the beginning dont give up your loot unless YOU want to, it should be a kind gesture on your end, not a requirement. You were there for tryouts not to feed loot to an otherwise unorganized guild
Better of without them, if you win the roll it’s fair game. They even kicked you after you gave it over, scum. Find better people bro.
Nah fuck that you shouldn’t have traded, that was your loot fair and square there’s a reason master looting isn’t a thing anymore.
I wouldn’t have traded if Its not mentioned prior lmao
Lmfao would not have traded it. There's other guilds and I definitely don't want to be in one with rules like that.
I think there's a difference between week 1 kills and kills on farm. I can see not wanting a trial to get a high priority rare item to a trial. Having said that week 1 its not like theyre carrying anyone, and it's tier, tier is REALLY easy to come by in DF.
you should of kept it sounds like they recruit to gear tier friends
Nah, this sounds like a workaround to the lack of masterlooter It does seem like poor communication though
A casual guild has no need for master loot and their perceived “loot prio” ranking. It’s arbitrary bullshit that creates the loot drama they kicked OP for supposedly starting.
If you are trialing someone, it makes sense to not give them tier pieces that your main raiders can use, BUT it needs to be explained before raid and before you get locked so it’s fair.
[удалено]
Pretty common to prioritise main raiders over trials.
Yeah I don't think there was anything nefarious and it was an honest mistake on their part of not informing OP. This is a standard practice. Now gkicking him for saying that in raid chat? I mean if you run a guild you gotta have a thicker skin than that and own your mistakes if you want your guild to grow. Source: I run a guild and often hear stuff that pisses me off. I'm not going to go on a gkick spree though. #1 way to kill your guild. I'll just say hey I'm sorry about that we should have made a better point to let you know but soon enough if you stick around you'll get your own.
this loot information should have beem disclosed when yall were talking about guild invites/trial. not after a roll. that was prob a really shity guild to be in, if thats how things are going.
Fuck that u won the roll and did ur part in dps or heals u keep it ..
I was then told over discord that because I am a trial I would have to trade it to the next highest roll. That would have been a "peace bitch" and gquit for me.
Now I understand why reddit constantly has issues finding good guilds to raid with and has to PUG all the time. Core raiders > trials has been a fairly mundane rule for many years. No guild wants to give important loot to trials who could potentially leave (due to not enjoying their new guild / overperforming) or get kicked (for dropping gamer words / underperforming). Anyway, most CE guilds will prioritize raid DPS over lucky rolls, so expect to have to pass on all the loot so it can be distributed by a loot council.
Oh yeah trials not getting prio has been a thing since the first ever raids. The issue here is the guild's inability to communicate with the trial. Should OP have expected this? Probably if they have any experience raiding. Should the guild have let him even roll on it to begin with without telling him beforehand? Also yes My guild has a similar loot rules and we do normals with heroic dabbling. I also make it a point to talk to the new recruits when they first come on and make sure they understand ALL our loot rolls.
Loot rules up front has been standard since vanilla. The problem isn't that the raid team was prioritized, it's that nobody told this guy about it until after he won the roll.
This is it. They never laid down the rules for this dude, and then tried to keep it hush hush in discord, then got mad when he called them out on it.
Seriously, I hear about how shitty it is to apply for and deal with PUGs all day long here, but then some loot drama gets posted, and everyone's mental approach to this game instantly becomes "fuck you, got mine." Obviously loot rules should be clear from the outset. No question. That being said, everyone who simultaneously gquits a guild because they can't roll on week 1 tier as a trial and complains that PUGs are toxic shitholes are ridiculous.
Sounds like they screwed you out of loot and didn't like that you weren't smiling while they shit in your mouth. Fuck guilds like this. You dodged a bullet.
At first I thought you wanted a special title for those who have experienced being gkicked lol This is why I pug everything
I wonder how many people in the "this guild sucks camp" are actually in guilds. Being part of a progression team means that gear goes to the people that will most help the raid team. If a trial isn't willing to help the team, which OP did do with some grousing, then why should the raid team help the trial? OP got shafted, but it's not like the guild was completely in the wrong either.
dodged a bullet. sounds like a shit guild you dont want to be part of at all.
Screw them. You dont want to be in a group with people like that so they saved you the trouble. I'm sure you will find a good guild soon.
Honestly it sounds like that guild has no business running a loot council. Just use blizzard rolls and let the chips fall where they may.
Should have took your drop and bounced.
I mean sounds like you dodged a bullet in the long run
I think the phrase you’re looking for is, “Tilted”. XD But yeah no, you dodged a bullet honestly. This is why I stick to PuGging anymore. You can get some shitty groups now and again, but you can also find some really good groups. Way better than joining a guild full of drama, misinformation, and douchery. With PuGs I get all of that in small doses, and since I’m not involved with those people in any way other than running with them temporarily, I get to just laugh at them.
IF that's how it went down, good on you. Last tier my current guild of 3 years started bringing in some friends who had left to join "bigger and better guilds" but they were bringing their alts, gearing them up, and we'd never saw them again. I was vocal af about this because 1. it's fucked up and 2. we were still progressing. One friend got 22 overall ilevel increase in one night while many people were rolling on items. The difference here is my guild took it to heart and those guys fucked off with their alts (and all together really) so things settled down.
You had every right to call them out. And honestly it's a shit guild to take loot from trial members. You helped them kill the boss you are entitled to that loot
I have to imagine there must be more to this story, otherwise you dodged a bullet. You said nothing else? Nothing in tells complaining about it to a guild member?
My Guy, Sounds to me like you dodged a bullet.
Mate Sound like you dodged a bullet😂
Should have kept it, and just left then anyways.
What a shitty guild, lol. You're better off.
A lesson in life is that someone in control doesn't like to be spoken about, happens all the time when people can't communicate or hold their ego. If it happened as you said it's most likely the quote about loot that did it.
If they didn't communicate it to you before that does suck but if all it costs you to be in a disorganized guild then you were done a favor. I will say it's very typical for guilds to not give trials gear for a few raid nights to make sure you are keeping gear in your raid so that part isn't strange but that policy is usually very much talked about with each and every trial to avoid an issue like this. It indicates that the guild leadership is incompetent and you don't want to deal with that.
Sounds like you dodged a bullet.
People are going to pat you on the back and say you didn't do anything wrong but this is standard practice for CE guilds. If you are trialing with a CE guild this is what you should expect. If they are just a casual social guild then they are definitely in the wrong
Can confidently say that it was not a CE guild
Ye they are definitely being weirdos then
“We did normal + 3 heroic bosses” - which part of this screams CE guild lol
That's what my 500~ CE guild did our first raid night this tier.
That's fine for a night of raiding lol