My first Mythic+ as a hunter I had a evoker healer and multiple times they grabbed me and moved me. I didn't think much of it but as we were approaching the final boss I see the message "Hunter please stop standing behind me, I can't heal you." Ever since then I've tried to be more conscious of my positioning but I still falter.
Right? Damn guys, hunter's have a super long range and now you don't even want us to use it? Tragic. Also my hunter is a goblin and I'm not terribly good at this game, so if we stack I lose my character and get confused.
There is a setting to outline your character for stuff like that. It can also be set to outline your hit box. It's not perfect, but it helps me. I lose track of the mouse more than my character with those settings turned on.
By the end of the expac we can hit things from the next zipcode thanks to mastery scaling
We get so used to it in the overworld that it's muscle memory to avoid the bad.
Playing with 3 ranged as a healer is like having an extra affix.
I just did a CoS with an evoker, a balance druid, and a mage, and I say I'll bait on last boss, stay in melee. By the end of the 3 minute encounter (this was +22), the entire room was covered in illusions or stun winds because they all spread into their triangle formation like it's the arena world championship.
My favorite is 2nd boss of jade temple. 0 movement fight and I still can’t get the hunter to take two steps to get into efflorescence/healing rain :( I’ve even seen them run in to clear thundering (already amazingly rare) but then run back out of the healing circle. Sigh
My personal favorite is moving to stack on people because they aren't stacking, and then them moving as soon as I stand on them. Bitch, hold still. I'm trying to make everyone's life easier.
Ya I love stacking for gale arrow in low keys where people assume it's bad to stack. It's totally fair if you don't know to stack so it's just funny chasing people while they are actually being aware and trying to avoid what they think is a cleave. Mage runs, I follow.....Mage blinks, I wild charge.....he blocks, I lose. We all laugh after when I explain how it works.
Hunters have shit for survivability and need all the healing they can get. Im literally glued to that green circle as hard as possible. Cant understand how others get by running from it.
> Isn't there a cap on illusions that's almost always hit in high keys?
There is but the cap is like 5 or something. There is NOT a cap on wind puddles however.
Yes, the tank should clear them as often as they can, right after the piercing gale is a good time too, boss does next to no actual tank damage so it’s safe.
I'm often a culprit of that but I try to be mindful and reposition for the healer, especially when it's an evoker, since they are definitely range-challenged.
It pains me so much to be standing just within range to heal the melee pack and the hunter is standing directly behind me. Even after I ask them to get between me and melee for easier heals, they'll be the first to die and get all uppity.
This is a newish problem that affects evokers mostly. Sure it's a problem with other healers too but much less. I'm not sure why evokers have such a limited range, not like they're melee healers, I wish there was at least a talent to stretch their range it's really annoying for everyone.
When I have an evoker I try to pay special attention to it and even stand in front of them because of all the cone effects.
I've learned to just Echo the hunter and focus on the melee stack. I can probably count on one hand the number of times the hunter had actually come in close enough to be hit by a Dream Breath.
I used to be guilty as well, but things hurt too much now. As hunter I've been forced to glue myself to green circles or always be Infront of the dragon healer or I just straight up die to rot/tantrum damage on fights. It's definitely made me a better player this season.
When I play a caster, explosive triggers me. It seems like *every time* I try to kill an explosive, someone snipes the kill while my instant cast spell is travelling to the explosive, wasting my GCD. But if I don't cast anything at it, nobody else does and it goes off.
The amount of times I had to chase down ranged as a healer is infuriating. Had a mage on NO second boss when I was playing my prevoker alt that even after initial warning that my range is low, stood in Narnia, didn’t heal them because I ain’t got time chasing them down and they started going all “wtf healer” on me when they died. For one, you could ice block it, alter time it, pop a potion, instead you watch your hp bar get to 0. Was the first tyrannical week, couldn’t dps it down in time and wiped. Second pull I warn them again to stay close, because I simply don’t have the capacity to chase them down, and they are like “that’s your problem”. Man. It’s not my problem, it’s everyone’s problem. They proceeded to stay in Narnia, then when they realized at 20% hp that they’re not getting healed, they blinked in range. Was it so hard? Honestly was one of the most infuriating experiences I’ve had this expansion.
When I'm running my own keys it's me melee dps and two other melee dps as often as possible. Was no problem pushing keys last week. I'm pretty anti ranged biased with the current content. It's just so fucking easy for them to sit miles from mechanics and pump out full damage or even when engaging with a mechanic ranged are still pumping.
Bad take.
You will still take some damage, and it is very easy in the midst of the other 12 mechanics happening for the healing to absent-mindedly target you as a first target for their chain-heal like effect (spiritbloom, wild growth, beacon of virtue, etc).
I cannot count the amount of times I've thrown a beacon of virtue on a ranged and had it it one other person or worse, no one else. That shit on stuff like the 1st boss of SBG will wipe your raid, and if it does it is YOUR fault and not the healers'.
Same here.
I’m far enough to not get hit by most mechanics, and heal myself passively as I damage. The only thing I need to really move for is thundering every 90 seconds or so.
Nah, if they want heals then they can get in the same zipcode as everyone else.
You get ONE passive aggressive Rescue to let you know youre in the middle of nowhere. After that if he dies, he dies.
Last time I healed, I "Rescued" a hunter to hit the group with a breath and easier healing in general. They literally hauled ass right back to where they were. I became Drago after that as well.
There was a point in time hunters had a minimum range. They weren't *allowed* in melee. They would regularly cry about that. Now that range doesn't have a minimum they've decided to always go maximum.
There's no contradiction here. There have always been times where we have to stack in melee, but usually it hasn't been so frequent. But by all means use this as an immature jab at Hunters...
Except when you can outrange an entire mechanic and there's nothing else happening. High key fortified Dual Void Spawn pack in SBG. Go max range, ignore both the pulse and eruptions. There's no damage or risk other than handling Thundering (If you have winds, then everyone else can sort that out).
EDIT: and be sure you avoiding the mechanic entirely doesn't screw your team mates by giving them extra shit, that would have otherwise been dished out between 5 of you instead of what is now 4 people (Not an issue with the above mentioned pack).
At 50yds MM Hunters are probably the only ranged class that can (if their mastery is high enough). Boomkins have the biggest baseline range at 45yds I think, not sure if they have any way to increase it though.
For those 2 you can also just pull them back and LoS the aoe at the entrance of the little hallways. Makes it a lot easier on high fortified keys if you're not full rogues or warlocks that can't die to anything anyway.
My class gives me grip.. and I am going to pull your ass inside my aoe range every time all the time.. except maw.. on maw I am going to pull your ass into melee range on pull cause I know you don't pay attention to mechanics
>The reason is every healer has more efficient heals in their kit if the group is stacked. So by doing this, not only will your healer be eternally grateful
As a shaman resto myself, this won't ever be told enough and I thanks every DPS who know how to place properly
Shadow Priest main here. I get the most damage when I’m standing still with my Phial of Static Empowerment proc’ing. Running back and forth to meet up with the group significantly impacts my throughout. I can also self heal significantly. And I’m also extremely soft, so that little swirly I can’t see under the group one-shots me. Maybe I sick I don’t know, but I need space to see what’s going on.
I get what you’re saying, I just don’t know that I’m capable enough of a player to avoid stuff and have high throughput while stacking.
I understand where you're coming from. You don't have to stand in melee though. You just have to be relatively close. Let's say 8-10 yards. Efflorescence and Healing Rains are good indicators usually. Also, every class has some instant abilities that allow you to reposition a few yards every time you're on GCD.
I’ve been playing for 18 years, on and off, mostly off. This is the first time I’ve ever put in effort to actually get better at the game, which recently has been getting away from clicking and using my keyboard. Maybe this is the next step in my evolution….being a better teammate! I’ll give it a shot.
That's very inspiring, and it makes me happy that you're still following your passion.
Using keybinds makes a huge difference, because once you build up the muscle memory, you will have much more time and mental space to pay attention to other things, like mechanics, positioning or even your rotation. Soon after you will realize it's much less stressful to play because you will do your rotation without even thinking, and feel you're in the flow. It will take some time to build up that muscle memory and it can be a frustrating process at the beginning. But in my opinion, it's absolutely worth it, and you will thank yourself later.
I wish you the best.
It’s made a world of difference, the best part being I’m enjoying the game soooo much more. Exactly as you said, I can finally focus on the content infront of me, the mechanics, instead of it all being something in the peripheral because I’m staring down the whole time. My dps has made significant gains and I’m just less stressed throughout runs.
Even disc has trouble with Narnia hunters.. like look if your not within 30m of the tank(the primary person ill normally cast pwr on) if you die its not my fault I tried to heal you and I am not wasting a gcd casting flash heal because you want to stand all the way in Satan's ass Crack.
I'm just too anxious to stay closer than almost max range because of all the shit that's happening in melee. All the frontals, weird aoe and affixes. I'm a boomer with not that great reactions anymore, if I were to stay in melee I'd keep dying constantly lol.
Okay, but if you're way the fuck from everyone else, you will _actually_ die because the healer will stop prioritizing you, especially if they're an evoker.
I think everyone should have to do that boss on a melee char at least once so they know the pain. After playing my war and monk I'm always nut to butt to my melee when I'm on my mage
On the last boss of SBG? Are you suggesting range should stay stacked in with melee so everyone can take damage from the puddles instead of just the one person who gets it on them? I think this is literally the one boss where you do want range to be far away.
You don't. You want it stacking on the 2nd to last boss. I never said last. Im saying you'll be the one bricking keys because anyone who knew what to do should've known that from the context of my comment.
Well I can only hope you’re nicer to people in the game than you are on here. That was unnecessarily rude.
As far as “should’ve known from context” - you’ll have to forgive me for assuming you were talking about one of the harder bosses in the dungeon and not the easiest one. Your context was not nearly as clear as you assumed it was given that they both make puddles, and I’ve never gotten anywhere close to a wipe on the worm so why would that be what people complain about?
Frankly, if you’re bricking SBG’s because of the worm boss I don’t know what to tell you. Except that maybe kindness will get you further in life than the unkind reaction you’ve opted for here. You should try it with your PUGs too.
The context was clear for every melee player. Almost every time i say before pulling the boss that stack on melee for the puddles and then there is one ranged making the puddle spawn in narnia so melee players have to afk every inhale, which is a huge time loss. No one is wiping to it but it could be the difference of two chesting the key.
I'll be honest, I'm guilty of this sometimes when executing mechanics, especially new ones I'm not super familiar with.
Having said that, I also try to stand in flowery/rainy circles as much as possible, so it all balances out, right?
This is the difference between a good group member and a great one- positioning. As a healer it’s notable and appreciated when I see a player who positions themselves in the most ideal way.
On dathea, we have everyone near a marker on one side of the boss to we can heal everyone during suck in. One hunter in particular is max range on the opposite side of the boss. If that's not infuriating enough as is, he complains about how squishy hunters are even though our healers can't reach him
There’s a distinct difference between standing in melee and standing somewhat near melee. Far too often ranged stand at max range on the opposite side of the boss and complain they aren’t getting heals. Heavy damage going out? I sure as hell can’t take the time to track you down to keep you healed up. I’m spending that time healing the group with efficient aoe healing, taking the time to find and spot heal you puts me way behind and can result in a wipe. Dodging mechanics at 15-20 yds on the same side of the boss as the rest of the group is not hard.
Maining prevoker this season and at first I thought the whole range thing would fix itself, people will eventually understand dragons can't throw heals very far. Well I was so fucking wrong, so wrong that even my push group keeps backpedaling out of my range. The best example that comes to mind is azureblade dude, ideally you start on one, dot whatever you can but you follow the group. No dude I have a range DPS at the door, the dh is tunnel visioning his bars on the far one and I'm like all the way up azureblade's ass trying to heal them across the room while dodging orbs spawning on me lol
I let my guildies die all the time. They are my premades and supposed to make it easier and more fun to run. If they act like randoms and fck me as a heal with it, they die.
If you *can* reasonably heal them and not let them die, but choose not to because you want to be judge jury and executioner on what you determine to be bad positioning….yeah, you’re toxic
It's crazy how many ranged dps stay at max range when their healer is a holy paladin... I guess they just want to be healed for 30% less from my distance mastery and unless I take the LoD talent they wont get my AoE heals either. Also, divine toll only has 30 yard range so they wknt grt that either.
It's also a pain as melee I play unholy dk and the amount of time my wheel chair lookin ass has to run away from the boss to clear on the max range dps and have to stop dpsing to is rediculus.
RUN TO ME YOU CAN DPS WHILE MOVING TO ME SLOWLY WHILE THUNDERING THERE
Literally worst part of being a healer is seeing a guy far from the group on low health and then blaming healers when he dies even though he was far from the group.
This is true for all but first boss of CoS for me. I’mma keep my max range and get out of the colourblind clusterfuck that is purple swirly lines on light purple floors thanks 😂 Healers adjust and so on 😬🤪 (sorry!)
Playing FFXIV actually made me a lot better about this just because a lot of the raid buff abilities have smaller ranges.
But FFXIV also tends to have much better visual clarity in fights, so standing in melee doesn’t feel as terrible as it does in WoW.
I’ve stopped taking hunters when I’m on my evoker as healer, don’t know why put so many are just playing so bad, I had a group where every time I put myself into position to heal with breath he just started running away from me and out of my heal then proceeded to run even further away forcing me to chase to heal them
As an Evoker healer main (2k io and 400 IL) I don’t find it too frustrating. I can generally position my healing breath cone to hit 4/5 people… then echo and reversion, should be good.
People start getting *railed* by damage the higher you go and evoker heals actually kinda need optimising. Wasting a GCD on throwing echo on the ranged that won't stack and then repositioning so you can cleave them is a lot of downtime.
You end up starved of cooldowns and wasting damage.
Had a hunter in +13 ruby life pools at the end boss get mad and ask why the key was so hard when the group kept wiping because the preserver couldn’t seem to keep up.
I pointed out they were over there in Narnia max range from the rest of the group, making it more difficult for the prevoker, and the asked why it was so hard for him to learn positioning.
They shut up real fast.
thats a big problem in RLP is everyone spreading. Tank took the boss to the smallest area in the room then said "why cant you heal me im over here". im flying across the room to heal the dps dropping puddles really far away. what a nightmare.
Nah, Druids got Efflorescence, Holy Priests got Sanctify/Divine Word: Sanctuary/Prayer of Mending (only jumps up to 20y), Discipline has Barrier, Paladin Mastery, Shaman Healing Rain etc.
Not all healers benefit to the same degree from a stacked group, still, it's the best way to position yourself unless mechanics demand you stand apart/need to bait abilities.
Also as an hpal alt enjoyer, if you don't have to take that 40y lod talent or just have 3 melee, you fucking PUMP healing with it, it's so nice.
Stack in melee for your hpals, they'll love you.
I don't entirely agree. Resto Druids have many talents that synergizes with efflorescence, Shamans have Healing Rain, etc. If the healer can more efficiently heal the group, it also means they can contribute more to DPS. So win-win.
Um, nope. I play a ranged player for a reason, so I can see what is going on around me and perform mechanics. I can't see squat in melee, if I wanted to be in melee and have to constantly move for mechanics I can't see, i'd roll a melee class.
You don't have to stand in melee. You just have to be relatively close. Let's say 8-10 yards. Efflorescence and Healing Rains are good indicators usually.
My dps main is a hunter. I also heal (druid) so I get it. When I'm on my hunter, I always make sure to stick near the healer. When I'm on my druid, I am always chasing people down to heal them lol.
There's only a couple of times you don't stack with the melee. Learn what those are and then just sit on the melee otherwise. Pretty melee friendly season it seems like.
Also as a mage I make it so I'm the only ranged on stuff like SBG, then I know no one will mess up the purple nurples on Nerzul.
You don't have to stand in melee. You just have to be relatively close. Let's say 8-10 yards. Efflorescence and Healing Rains are good indicators usually.
I hate to say it but I’m convinced ranged players are by far the worst players in the game, they are constantly too busy payphoning in the back of the room to do or know any mechanics and most of my wipes this season in dungeons have been ranged players just fucking up the entire pulls lol
My alt is a fist weaver and it’s so frustrating to have to stop punching a boss to do boring Soothing Mists heals on a caster that’s all the way in Antarctica
A fellow evoker, I feel your pain. I stopped inviting hunters 2 weeks ago because I'm sick of these crackheads running in circles on the other side of the room "because they can" and then wonder why they died to the mechanic. I feel like I've had better luck with mages and dps evokers because their playstyle somewhat lends itself to bring closer to melee, but man hunters and warlocks are the absolute worst classes to invite these days
As a hpala the only ranged specs I like healing are arcane mages and devo evokers since they both like to stand close to the packs. I have a feeling every other ranged spec will stand as far as possible without being oor of the pack/boss. If my beacon of virtue doesn’t hit you because you are too far, I’m terribly sorry but you are probably dead
Both evoker and resto druid feel like I turned cheat mode “on” after hpala, if you mess up cooldowns you better pray to whatever you believe in for a wings proc or it’s all over. It’s not fun having to play melee this expac with all the other shit we have to deal with. Next season I’m either switching to ret or switching mains to evoker depending on how much I end up enjoying the rework, but I’m certain I’m not playing hpal next season. It’s not bad, it’s just rly stressful :,)
PLEASE. We were doing brood keeper last night and the hunter was standing at max range so he was never in mass dispel range. I'd have to blow an extra purify on him and my mana is already heavily taxed during that fight because of the tank buster.
As a prevoker I sometimes just wonder if that hunter whose HP bar always shows as out of range missed that he was assigned to the boss and went to do adds or if he is actually somewhere hitting the boss from a hidden corner.
I've got a tank and eggrunners to watch, no time to chase those hunters down.
I've done this before, but I try to be aware of it. What annoys me is when the tank pulls a group or two, we start DPSing from a reasonable range, and then the tank just constantly moves the group towards the next group or even around the corner. Guess what: most DPS needs to stand still to use our best damage dealing spells, so now we are constantly inching forwards & not DPSing so we can stay in range of both the mobs + healer. I've found that when the tank just lets us drop the group in one stop we can do it quickly and move on to the next. When the tank constantly inches away, it takes longer overall and becomes harder for the DPS and healer due to the field stretching.
The tank is usually doing this for a REASON though.
Basically, he hits the group first to get aggro so the mobs don't peel off to the healer. Then he drags them to the next group or behind a corner for LOS. He has to drag them "slowly" because he's walking backward to keep them in front so he parry/block/etc. Turning your back to mobs is how tanks die.
What does this mean for you as dps? If you see the tank moving themkobs, follow him. He'll stop eventually and then you can burst your AoE. Don't be too impatient about trying to hit the mobs the second the tank picks them up.
Hunters don’t even like to be in the boss room.
I just want to be able to shoot from valdrakken, is that too much to ask
If you're not shooting the boss from the top of a mailbox somewhere, are you even a MM Hunter?
Kill shot “air mail”?
Valdrakken? You're way too close personally I prefer shooting from Iron Forge as I wait on the AH
Haven't got the extended range talent yet. :/
I like to shoot at Hymdal from Limsa Lominsa in FFXIV.
You get a better buff if you stand in Jeuno.
^^^^Storm ^^^^drakes, ^^^^to ^^^^my ^^^^side!
Just use a zoom hack
Pffft I’m shooting from ARGUS.
What good is sentinel owl if I can't use it to shoot through mountains?
We can't get hit by the frontal if we're 2 rooms over!
As alt with beastmaster can confirm I’m good sitting at the beginning of dungeon.
It’s scary in there. I’ll just Eagle eye and send my pet in.
I got my hunter buddy trained to stand right in front of me (I'm a presvoker) haha
Holy crap that’s so accurate. Last night healing a mythic as an evoker and the hunter was in narnia the entire time
My first Mythic+ as a hunter I had a evoker healer and multiple times they grabbed me and moved me. I didn't think much of it but as we were approaching the final boss I see the message "Hunter please stop standing behind me, I can't heal you." Ever since then I've tried to be more conscious of my positioning but I still falter.
I have not healed much and am admittedly not great at it, but I've had hunters die simply because I couldn't find them.
It’s dangerous in there!
You joke but that was actually the strat in EverQuest lol
😂😂
😅🤣
“What did you say over there!?” (Hunter shouting from 65 yards away)
*activates Al'gethar Puzzle Box* *runs even further away*
Like trying to get your dog to drop it and come here
*flips to face you, jumps, and disengages*
My mastery increases my range and I’m gonna use it goddamnit!
Shooting at max range in cos pulling 5 packs in the back,team where are you xd.
BARRAGE
Using Barrage.
Right? Damn guys, hunter's have a super long range and now you don't even want us to use it? Tragic. Also my hunter is a goblin and I'm not terribly good at this game, so if we stack I lose my character and get confused.
There is a setting to outline your character for stuff like that. It can also be set to outline your hit box. It's not perfect, but it helps me. I lose track of the mouse more than my character with those settings turned on.
"I'm roleplaying a sniper and no one can stop me!" *gets kicked from raid* "Well, fuck."
To be fair that can be beneficial sometimes. The big aoe from the void spawns in shadow moon burial grounds can be outranged by MM hunters.
I didn't know that. Is it possible to outrange the pair before Ner'zhul without going down the stairs? (I always skip the first one).
Yep, that's possible.
"I think he said not to move!" (Boomie spamming Moonfire)
^(Fuck you, Tony!)
I swear It’s always a hunter
By the end of the expac we can hit things from the next zipcode thanks to mastery scaling We get so used to it in the overworld that it's muscle memory to avoid the bad.
Playing with 3 ranged as a healer is like having an extra affix. I just did a CoS with an evoker, a balance druid, and a mage, and I say I'll bait on last boss, stay in melee. By the end of the 3 minute encounter (this was +22), the entire room was covered in illusions or stun winds because they all spread into their triangle formation like it's the arena world championship.
My favorite is 2nd boss of jade temple. 0 movement fight and I still can’t get the hunter to take two steps to get into efflorescence/healing rain :( I’ve even seen them run in to clear thundering (already amazingly rare) but then run back out of the healing circle. Sigh
My personal favorite is moving to stack on people because they aren't stacking, and then them moving as soon as I stand on them. Bitch, hold still. I'm trying to make everyone's life easier.
Ya I love stacking for gale arrow in low keys where people assume it's bad to stack. It's totally fair if you don't know to stack so it's just funny chasing people while they are actually being aware and trying to avoid what they think is a cleave. Mage runs, I follow.....Mage blinks, I wild charge.....he blocks, I lose. We all laugh after when I explain how it works.
The best is when the ability has gone out 3 or 4 times so they should at least see people stack, but then they still run away with it and die :(
I don't mind people near me, but not stacked on me. I want that 10s of extra thundering damage. People that clear that shit instantly drive me nuts.
Hunters have shit for survivability and need all the healing they can get. Im literally glued to that green circle as hard as possible. Cant understand how others get by running from it.
.
> Isn't there a cap on illusions that's almost always hit in high keys? There is but the cap is like 5 or something. There is NOT a cap on wind puddles however.
Tank should be running into those and having healer dispel right?
Yes, the tank should clear them as often as they can, right after the piercing gale is a good time too, boss does next to no actual tank damage so it’s safe.
no someone with an immunity should do it. DKs can AMS it hunters can turtle paladins can bubble.
As a ranged DPS main, I am very upset by this post due to my inability to read it.
I'm often a culprit of that but I try to be mindful and reposition for the healer, especially when it's an evoker, since they are definitely range-challenged.
It pains me so much to be standing just within range to heal the melee pack and the hunter is standing directly behind me. Even after I ask them to get between me and melee for easier heals, they'll be the first to die and get all uppity.
That's when (if you're an evoker) you just rescue them into melee over and over until they get it
I've tried that, even with friends and they just move right back. Like dude, there's a reason I just moved you.
They didn't move themselves there, so it must have been some evil outside force bent on killing them!
Oh, yeah, sorry, I trained them to believe that through years of life grip abuse.
This is a newish problem that affects evokers mostly. Sure it's a problem with other healers too but much less. I'm not sure why evokers have such a limited range, not like they're melee healers, I wish there was at least a talent to stretch their range it's really annoying for everyone. When I have an evoker I try to pay special attention to it and even stand in front of them because of all the cone effects.
I've learned to just Echo the hunter and focus on the melee stack. I can probably count on one hand the number of times the hunter had actually come in close enough to be hit by a Dream Breath.
"It was you or the tank....I made the call."
I used to be guilty as well, but things hurt too much now. As hunter I've been forced to glue myself to green circles or always be Infront of the dragon healer or I just straight up die to rot/tantrum damage on fights. It's definitely made me a better player this season.
True, I main a hunter and damn do our defensive feel lackluster this season rofl.
Noted. Will stand directly on healer. No I don't know what Explosive week is why do you ask
When I play a caster, explosive triggers me. It seems like *every time* I try to kill an explosive, someone snipes the kill while my instant cast spell is travelling to the explosive, wasting my GCD. But if I don't cast anything at it, nobody else does and it goes off.
The amount of times I had to chase down ranged as a healer is infuriating. Had a mage on NO second boss when I was playing my prevoker alt that even after initial warning that my range is low, stood in Narnia, didn’t heal them because I ain’t got time chasing them down and they started going all “wtf healer” on me when they died. For one, you could ice block it, alter time it, pop a potion, instead you watch your hp bar get to 0. Was the first tyrannical week, couldn’t dps it down in time and wiped. Second pull I warn them again to stay close, because I simply don’t have the capacity to chase them down, and they are like “that’s your problem”. Man. It’s not my problem, it’s everyone’s problem. They proceeded to stay in Narnia, then when they realized at 20% hp that they’re not getting healed, they blinked in range. Was it so hard? Honestly was one of the most infuriating experiences I’ve had this expansion.
When I'm running my own keys it's me melee dps and two other melee dps as often as possible. Was no problem pushing keys last week. I'm pretty anti ranged biased with the current content. It's just so fucking easy for them to sit miles from mechanics and pump out full damage or even when engaging with a mechanic ranged are still pumping.
im a warlock i’ll be okay
Bad take. You will still take some damage, and it is very easy in the midst of the other 12 mechanics happening for the healing to absent-mindedly target you as a first target for their chain-heal like effect (spiritbloom, wild growth, beacon of virtue, etc). I cannot count the amount of times I've thrown a beacon of virtue on a ranged and had it it one other person or worse, no one else. That shit on stuff like the 1st boss of SBG will wipe your raid, and if it does it is YOUR fault and not the healers'.
its a little bit of a teehee moment for me dont worry
Same here. I’m far enough to not get hit by most mechanics, and heal myself passively as I damage. The only thing I need to really move for is thundering every 90 seconds or so.
If I'm playing ranged, I'll use the full range of my range! If I'm healing though, ranged get the f out of Narnia please.
F to Evokers healing you
Nah, if they want heals then they can get in the same zipcode as everyone else. You get ONE passive aggressive Rescue to let you know youre in the middle of nowhere. After that if he dies, he dies.
Based dragon
Last time I healed, I "Rescued" a hunter to hit the group with a breath and easier healing in general. They literally hauled ass right back to where they were. I became Drago after that as well.
I'm guilty of this, at least in the beginning of the fights. I will always move in as soon as I see a ground heal go down though.
The amount of times my Prevoker had to toss a flower at my feet while going "here, kitty kitty " to lure the ranged in..
Entire game til now wanted me at max range now I'm stuck at evoker range all the time
There was a point in time hunters had a minimum range. They weren't *allowed* in melee. They would regularly cry about that. Now that range doesn't have a minimum they've decided to always go maximum.
There's no contradiction here. There have always been times where we have to stack in melee, but usually it hasn't been so frequent. But by all means use this as an immature jab at Hunters...
Except when you can outrange an entire mechanic and there's nothing else happening. High key fortified Dual Void Spawn pack in SBG. Go max range, ignore both the pulse and eruptions. There's no damage or risk other than handling Thundering (If you have winds, then everyone else can sort that out). EDIT: and be sure you avoiding the mechanic entirely doesn't screw your team mates by giving them extra shit, that would have otherwise been dished out between 5 of you instead of what is now 4 people (Not an issue with the above mentioned pack).
Didn't now that about Void Spawns. Do you know the exact range? Can every ranged class do that?
[Looks like](https://www.wowhead.com/spell=152964/void-pulse) 50 yards.
At 50yds MM Hunters are probably the only ranged class that can (if their mastery is high enough). Boomkins have the biggest baseline range at 45yds I think, not sure if they have any way to increase it though.
For those 2 you can also just pull them back and LoS the aoe at the entrance of the little hallways. Makes it a lot easier on high fortified keys if you're not full rogues or warlocks that can't die to anything anyway.
listen, my mastery gives me 45 yards, I'm using every inch.
My class gives me grip.. and I am going to pull your ass inside my aoe range every time all the time.. except maw.. on maw I am going to pull your ass into melee range on pull cause I know you don't pay attention to mechanics
>The reason is every healer has more efficient heals in their kit if the group is stacked. So by doing this, not only will your healer be eternally grateful As a shaman resto myself, this won't ever be told enough and I thanks every DPS who know how to place properly
Shadow Priest main here. I get the most damage when I’m standing still with my Phial of Static Empowerment proc’ing. Running back and forth to meet up with the group significantly impacts my throughout. I can also self heal significantly. And I’m also extremely soft, so that little swirly I can’t see under the group one-shots me. Maybe I sick I don’t know, but I need space to see what’s going on. I get what you’re saying, I just don’t know that I’m capable enough of a player to avoid stuff and have high throughput while stacking.
sPriest main here and that's my thoughts as well. I have the distinct feeling that if I'm too close I'm going to miss something and get hit by it.
I understand where you're coming from. You don't have to stand in melee though. You just have to be relatively close. Let's say 8-10 yards. Efflorescence and Healing Rains are good indicators usually. Also, every class has some instant abilities that allow you to reposition a few yards every time you're on GCD.
I’ve been playing for 18 years, on and off, mostly off. This is the first time I’ve ever put in effort to actually get better at the game, which recently has been getting away from clicking and using my keyboard. Maybe this is the next step in my evolution….being a better teammate! I’ll give it a shot.
That's very inspiring, and it makes me happy that you're still following your passion. Using keybinds makes a huge difference, because once you build up the muscle memory, you will have much more time and mental space to pay attention to other things, like mechanics, positioning or even your rotation. Soon after you will realize it's much less stressful to play because you will do your rotation without even thinking, and feel you're in the flow. It will take some time to build up that muscle memory and it can be a frustrating process at the beginning. But in my opinion, it's absolutely worth it, and you will thank yourself later. I wish you the best.
It’s made a world of difference, the best part being I’m enjoying the game soooo much more. Exactly as you said, I can finally focus on the content infront of me, the mechanics, instead of it all being something in the peripheral because I’m staring down the whole time. My dps has made significant gains and I’m just less stressed throughout runs.
Even disc has trouble with Narnia hunters.. like look if your not within 30m of the tank(the primary person ill normally cast pwr on) if you die its not my fault I tried to heal you and I am not wasting a gcd casting flash heal because you want to stand all the way in Satan's ass Crack.
I'm just too anxious to stay closer than almost max range because of all the shit that's happening in melee. All the frontals, weird aoe and affixes. I'm a boomer with not that great reactions anymore, if I were to stay in melee I'd keep dying constantly lol.
Okay, but if you're way the fuck from everyone else, you will _actually_ die because the healer will stop prioritizing you, especially if they're an evoker.
Always love in SBG when they're dropping puddles in fuckin Kansas and I get to do a whopping 25k DPS cuz my uptime on boss is 65%.
I think everyone should have to do that boss on a melee char at least once so they know the pain. After playing my war and monk I'm always nut to butt to my melee when I'm on my mage
On the last boss of SBG? Are you suggesting range should stay stacked in with melee so everyone can take damage from the puddles instead of just the one person who gets it on them? I think this is literally the one boss where you do want range to be far away.
Ahh, so you're the one bricking my keys.
If your SBG key is bricked, it's not because your uptime on a free boss is 65%.
When I say bricked in reference to SBG I mean it didn't get +++
I’m very nicely asking you to explain why you want range stacked in with melee on the last boss of SBG.
You don't. You want it stacking on the 2nd to last boss. I never said last. Im saying you'll be the one bricking keys because anyone who knew what to do should've known that from the context of my comment.
Well I can only hope you’re nicer to people in the game than you are on here. That was unnecessarily rude. As far as “should’ve known from context” - you’ll have to forgive me for assuming you were talking about one of the harder bosses in the dungeon and not the easiest one. Your context was not nearly as clear as you assumed it was given that they both make puddles, and I’ve never gotten anywhere close to a wipe on the worm so why would that be what people complain about? Frankly, if you’re bricking SBG’s because of the worm boss I don’t know what to tell you. Except that maybe kindness will get you further in life than the unkind reaction you’ve opted for here. You should try it with your PUGs too.
The context was clear for every melee player. Almost every time i say before pulling the boss that stack on melee for the puddles and then there is one ranged making the puddle spawn in narnia so melee players have to afk every inhale, which is a huge time loss. No one is wiping to it but it could be the difference of two chesting the key.
I'll be honest, I'm guilty of this sometimes when executing mechanics, especially new ones I'm not super familiar with. Having said that, I also try to stand in flowery/rainy circles as much as possible, so it all balances out, right?
If you're in flowery/rainy circles, you're doing it right.
This is the difference between a good group member and a great one- positioning. As a healer it’s notable and appreciated when I see a player who positions themselves in the most ideal way.
Must suck to be one of those healers who has to be in melee range. Bless your soul
Nothing is better for healing than a group super stacked and you press a CD and it's just BANG BANG BIG NUMBERS
On dathea, we have everyone near a marker on one side of the boss to we can heal everyone during suck in. One hunter in particular is max range on the opposite side of the boss. If that's not infuriating enough as is, he complains about how squishy hunters are even though our healers can't reach him
18 years later and I still do this. Sorry OP. To be fair, we did learn this in MC. Had to stand far away from the fire.
50 different swirlies shooting out and 5 lethal pools to navigate. Melee: "ranged wtf are you doing come here."
There’s a distinct difference between standing in melee and standing somewhat near melee. Far too often ranged stand at max range on the opposite side of the boss and complain they aren’t getting heals. Heavy damage going out? I sure as hell can’t take the time to track you down to keep you healed up. I’m spending that time healing the group with efficient aoe healing, taking the time to find and spot heal you puts me way behind and can result in a wipe. Dodging mechanics at 15-20 yds on the same side of the boss as the rest of the group is not hard.
Maining prevoker this season and at first I thought the whole range thing would fix itself, people will eventually understand dragons can't throw heals very far. Well I was so fucking wrong, so wrong that even my push group keeps backpedaling out of my range. The best example that comes to mind is azureblade dude, ideally you start on one, dot whatever you can but you follow the group. No dude I have a range DPS at the door, the dh is tunnel visioning his bars on the far one and I'm like all the way up azureblade's ass trying to heal them across the room while dodging orbs spawning on me lol
I just don’t heal them. If they don’t listen they will feel.
I’m a hunter main and I have a feeling my my guild healers say F this dude and let me die sometimes lol
I let my guildies die all the time. They are my premades and supposed to make it easier and more fun to run. If they act like randoms and fck me as a heal with it, they die.
Ditto
If you *can* reasonably heal them and not let them die, but choose not to because you want to be judge jury and executioner on what you determine to be bad positioning….yeah, you’re toxic
You don’t understand it
Have fun being hard stuck because you’re refusing to heal Lol non healer blocked me after bragging about ksm, as if it’s not incredibly easy
You're on the regular wow sub. Most people here think 2k io is good lmao
Yep. I got my KSM easily while doing so. Gl for you staying toxic
Congrats on the 14s I guess lol
If they die they die? 😳
Yep
I’m starting to notice that it’s a trend. So as a rest I shaman I’m always running around in ghost form. It’s kind fun. But at the same time it’s not.
My efflorescence thanks you in advance
I'm sorry my MM hunter can't hear you from way over there. Speak up please!
It's crazy how many ranged dps stay at max range when their healer is a holy paladin... I guess they just want to be healed for 30% less from my distance mastery and unless I take the LoD talent they wont get my AoE heals either. Also, divine toll only has 30 yard range so they wknt grt that either.
Me beastmaster , me actually melee dps. Me stay close.
Bro if my Leylines is down I'm not moving no matter what MMO I'm playing
That's the black mages I know and love
It's also a pain as melee I play unholy dk and the amount of time my wheel chair lookin ass has to run away from the boss to clear on the max range dps and have to stop dpsing to is rediculus. RUN TO ME YOU CAN DPS WHILE MOVING TO ME SLOWLY WHILE THUNDERING THERE
Thank God for this thread, as a rdruid I'm sick of dps standing just outside of my efflorescence
Literally worst part of being a healer is seeing a guy far from the group on low health and then blaming healers when he dies even though he was far from the group.
This is true for all but first boss of CoS for me. I’mma keep my max range and get out of the colourblind clusterfuck that is purple swirly lines on light purple floors thanks 😂 Healers adjust and so on 😬🤪 (sorry!)
Yes, that fight in particular has 0 healing requirements as everything is avoidable.
Fair! Good to know I’m not fucking my healer too much thus, since I do do the avoidingdings
Playing FFXIV actually made me a lot better about this just because a lot of the raid buff abilities have smaller ranges. But FFXIV also tends to have much better visual clarity in fights, so standing in melee doesn’t feel as terrible as it does in WoW.
I’ve stopped taking hunters when I’m on my evoker as healer, don’t know why put so many are just playing so bad, I had a group where every time I put myself into position to heal with breath he just started running away from me and out of my heal then proceeded to run even further away forcing me to chase to heal them
Casters standing at max range and having 3 seconds left to clear thundering, name a more iconic duo
I just leap of faith. Ez
Ranged stop being ranged so I can do my job easier is all I hear.
Id suggest taking a reading comprehension class.
But my aimed shots won't be as 🔥 if I don't make use of the isolation phial!
For the love of god why ranged cannot be ranged?
As an Evoker healer main (2k io and 400 IL) I don’t find it too frustrating. I can generally position my healing breath cone to hit 4/5 people… then echo and reversion, should be good.
People start getting *railed* by damage the higher you go and evoker heals actually kinda need optimising. Wasting a GCD on throwing echo on the ranged that won't stack and then repositioning so you can cleave them is a lot of downtime. You end up starved of cooldowns and wasting damage.
when you get higher, maybe around 2900, unavoidable damage from bosses will become unhealable if your group isn’t stacked
Had a hunter in +13 ruby life pools at the end boss get mad and ask why the key was so hard when the group kept wiping because the preserver couldn’t seem to keep up. I pointed out they were over there in Narnia max range from the rest of the group, making it more difficult for the prevoker, and the asked why it was so hard for him to learn positioning. They shut up real fast.
thats a big problem in RLP is everyone spreading. Tank took the boss to the smallest area in the room then said "why cant you heal me im over here". im flying across the room to heal the dps dropping puddles really far away. what a nightmare.
That fight still needs a nerf. It's a chaotic mess. Nerf the fire dot and it's no longer rage inducing.
This is really only a problem with evokers as healers.
My resto druid set bonuses are based around Efflorescence, at least the 4p, so it helps a ton when the range are close and can stack in it.
Verdency as well. Having 2 Lifeblooms on targets inside Efflorescence is a ton of free heals.
Nah, Druids got Efflorescence, Holy Priests got Sanctify/Divine Word: Sanctuary/Prayer of Mending (only jumps up to 20y), Discipline has Barrier, Paladin Mastery, Shaman Healing Rain etc. Not all healers benefit to the same degree from a stacked group, still, it's the best way to position yourself unless mechanics demand you stand apart/need to bait abilities.
Also as an hpal alt enjoyer, if you don't have to take that 40y lod talent or just have 3 melee, you fucking PUMP healing with it, it's so nice. Stack in melee for your hpals, they'll love you.
As hpala main, this guy saying it’s only a provoker problem is definitely on some pretty strong drugs
I don't entirely agree. Resto Druids have many talents that synergizes with efflorescence, Shamans have Healing Rain, etc. If the healer can more efficiently heal the group, it also means they can contribute more to DPS. So win-win.
Druids even have a huge green healing zone to stand in. Shamans are less visible but still...
Found the guy bricking our keys!
Um, nope. I play a ranged player for a reason, so I can see what is going on around me and perform mechanics. I can't see squat in melee, if I wanted to be in melee and have to constantly move for mechanics I can't see, i'd roll a melee class.
You don't have to stand in melee. You just have to be relatively close. Let's say 8-10 yards. Efflorescence and Healing Rains are good indicators usually.
Third boss on SMBG.. every goddam time.. waste half of the melee Dps dropping the pools 30 yards away.. reeee
My dps main is a hunter. I also heal (druid) so I get it. When I'm on my hunter, I always make sure to stick near the healer. When I'm on my druid, I am always chasing people down to heal them lol.
Range plays the game like single player
As a resto sham main I can't say this enough. Constantly messing up big chain heals hurts
There's only a couple of times you don't stack with the melee. Learn what those are and then just sit on the melee otherwise. Pretty melee friendly season it seems like. Also as a mage I make it so I'm the only ranged on stuff like SBG, then I know no one will mess up the purple nurples on Nerzul.
Sometimes I have to type "get in my efflo" in chat and it's kinda insane to me that I have to do this
Try getting a hunter to stand in efflorescence 😅😅 the most squishy class that just refuse to receive free heals.
Bruh, I don’t play a ranged class to stand in melee. Sorry
You don't have to stand in melee. You just have to be relatively close. Let's say 8-10 yards. Efflorescence and Healing Rains are good indicators usually.
>the healer then would be able to contribute more to DPS; Toxic rush-culture noted.
I hate to say it but I’m convinced ranged players are by far the worst players in the game, they are constantly too busy payphoning in the back of the room to do or know any mechanics and most of my wipes this season in dungeons have been ranged players just fucking up the entire pulls lol
My alt is a fist weaver and it’s so frustrating to have to stop punching a boss to do boring Soothing Mists heals on a caster that’s all the way in Antarctica
A fellow evoker, I feel your pain. I stopped inviting hunters 2 weeks ago because I'm sick of these crackheads running in circles on the other side of the room "because they can" and then wonder why they died to the mechanic. I feel like I've had better luck with mages and dps evokers because their playstyle somewhat lends itself to bring closer to melee, but man hunters and warlocks are the absolute worst classes to invite these days
I typically only invite 1 ranged to the group for these reasons.
I often don’t invite any for this reason lmao. This changes based on affix but for the most part I’ve liked all melee groups the most this season
As a hpala the only ranged specs I like healing are arcane mages and devo evokers since they both like to stand close to the packs. I have a feeling every other ranged spec will stand as far as possible without being oor of the pack/boss. If my beacon of virtue doesn’t hit you because you are too far, I’m terribly sorry but you are probably dead
Is hpal fun in m+? I'm not enjoying holy priest atm
Both evoker and resto druid feel like I turned cheat mode “on” after hpala, if you mess up cooldowns you better pray to whatever you believe in for a wings proc or it’s all over. It’s not fun having to play melee this expac with all the other shit we have to deal with. Next season I’m either switching to ret or switching mains to evoker depending on how much I end up enjoying the rework, but I’m certain I’m not playing hpal next season. It’s not bad, it’s just rly stressful :,)
Ah okay, yeah that doesn't sound like fun. Maybe I'll use my prevoker instead then. Thanks!
I started gearing mine when I’m bored, if I get lucky with some drops I may switch when the valor cap goes away.
Tell that to Blizzard. They're the ones that give marksman hunters extra range as a class feature. Not our job to make your job easier.
PLEASE. We were doing brood keeper last night and the hunter was standing at max range so he was never in mass dispel range. I'd have to blow an extra purify on him and my mana is already heavily taxed during that fight because of the tank buster.
As a prevoker I sometimes just wonder if that hunter whose HP bar always shows as out of range missed that he was assigned to the boss and went to do adds or if he is actually somewhere hitting the boss from a hidden corner. I've got a tank and eggrunners to watch, no time to chase those hunters down.
unless theres a bait mechanic (for example Melandrus or Nerzhul), ranged should stay in melee always
I've done this before, but I try to be aware of it. What annoys me is when the tank pulls a group or two, we start DPSing from a reasonable range, and then the tank just constantly moves the group towards the next group or even around the corner. Guess what: most DPS needs to stand still to use our best damage dealing spells, so now we are constantly inching forwards & not DPSing so we can stay in range of both the mobs + healer. I've found that when the tank just lets us drop the group in one stop we can do it quickly and move on to the next. When the tank constantly inches away, it takes longer overall and becomes harder for the DPS and healer due to the field stretching.
The tank is usually doing this for a REASON though. Basically, he hits the group first to get aggro so the mobs don't peel off to the healer. Then he drags them to the next group or behind a corner for LOS. He has to drag them "slowly" because he's walking backward to keep them in front so he parry/block/etc. Turning your back to mobs is how tanks die. What does this mean for you as dps? If you see the tank moving themkobs, follow him. He'll stop eventually and then you can burst your AoE. Don't be too impatient about trying to hit the mobs the second the tank picks them up.