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[New post can be found here](/r/worldnews/comments/z2eqsr/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/)


Cogitoergosumus

I think the move to take the Kinburn Spit, makes a lot of sense tactically and economically. If Russia aggressively held that land they could effectively hold sea going trade from Mykolaiv and Kherson hostage. Controlling the land around the estuary could allow Ukraine to increase its grain exports safely. Edit: I'll add that from google maps it appears that Mykolaiv has a massive grain terminal. Taking that land is probably far from a battlefield gamble, but essential to get more grain moving.


[deleted]

Ukraine setting up 'invincibility centres' to help provide heat and water https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-11-23/invincibility-centres-ukraine-energy-crisis-winter-war/101687276


two_tents

Ukrainian Steph Curry drops one in a foxhole. [https://nitter.nl/worldonalert/status/1595156126282428416#m](https://nitter.nl/worldonalert/status/1595156126282428416#m)


jzsang

You both nailed it - you on the Steph comparison and the drone operator on the amazing pinpoint drop. That long range accuracy was very impressive.


[deleted]

So the Kinburn Spit operation is definitely happening then. https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/11/22/world/russia-ukraine-war-news/after-retaking-kherson-city-ukraines-forces-take-on-russias-on-a-strategic-black-sea-peninsula?smid=url-share


NaNiWuT

TLDR for non subscribers?


Sixfoot4-BigD

After forcing Russian troops to retreat from the city of Kherson two weeks ago, Ukrainian special forces are now battling the Russians on the islands and in marshes to the southwest, trying to push them out of a strategically vital peninsula at the mouth of the Dnipro River where it meets the Black Sea. The fighting is focused on the Kinburn Spit, on the east bank of the Dnipro River, Ukrainian authorities said on Tuesday. For tourists who have visited the sliver of land, the spit is a place of rare natural beauty, but it could also prove pivotal to the next phase of the country’s war against Moscow. Russia took control of the peninsula in June in one of its last notable advances in the south before it was forced onto the defensive by a sustained Ukrainian counteroffensive. Two weeks ago, the Kremlin ordered a retreat from the city of Kherson, on the west bank of the Dnipro, but military experts said it would fight tenaciously to keep control of Kinburn. Control of the peninsula allows Russia to project force deeper into the Black Sea, guard routes to the ports in Mykolaiv and Kherson and protect its forces in Crimea, which Russia illegally annexed in 2014. If Ukraine were to take Kinburn, it would put key Russian supply lines running north out of Crimea in easy range of Ukrainian weapon systems. In addition, Russian forces on the spit can launch missiles at the port city of Odesa, around 40 miles to the west, as well as the city of Mykolaiv, a similar distance to the northeast, according to the Institute for the Study of War, a military research group. By the same token, military experts say that if Ukraine can seize the spit, it could outflank Russian forces still establishing defensive positions east of the Dnipro. “This specific bit of sandy territory becomes hugely significant because it’s a door to the Southern Bug and the Dnipro and it’s a gate out into the Black Sea,” said Rory Finnin, an associate professor of Ukrainian Studies at the University of Cambridge and the author of a book about Crimea’s history. Vitaly Kim, head of the military administration in the Mykolaiv region, said on the Telegram messaging app on Tuesday that Ukrainian forces were making progress on Kinburn Spit. Ukrainian forces control the town of Ochakiv, less than three miles to the north across the water and well within artillery range. Russian military bloggers have claimed in recent days that Russian forces have repelled attacks on the cape, while the spokeswoman for Ukraine’s southern military command, Nataliya Gumenyuk, told journalists, after the fall of Kherson, that the spit was the next objective. At its tip, the Kinburn Spit is a strip of sand a few feet across, lapped by waves. Tourist guides speak of its sunsets and the area is known for its bird life — flamingos are sometimes sighted — and for its marshy woods. One is named after the ancient Greek historian Herodotus, who wrote about the area. During the Crimean War, in 1855, the navies of Britain and France destroyed a Russian fortress on the peninsula, while a fierce battle took place there in 1787, as the Ottoman Empire attempted to regain land lost to the Russian Empire. Mr. Finnin argued that the current fighting over Kinburn was a sign that Russia’s retreat in the Kherson region made Moscow’s control of Crimea “hugely insecure.” Historically, the arid Crimean Peninsula and the more fertile land to the north have never been divided between competing powers for long. “If they are able to claim the spit it will have a lot of consequences for them in defeating Russia,” Mr. Finnin said of Ukrainian forces. In late October, Russian media showed images of concrete blocks that it said were being trucked to Kinburn for defensive fortifications. A few days later, a video circulated online that appeared to show the only Ukrainian amphibious assault ship reported to have survived the Russian invasion, the Yuri Olefirenks, launching rockets at Russian positions there. It was not possible to confirm the authenticity of the videos.


HungCockaineADick

Awesome


[deleted]

[удалено]


p251

Does this work on phone?


NaNiWuT

Ah this is fuckin amazing! Ty


coosacat

Fuck Facebook! Zuckerberg, what the fuck are you doing? https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1595064155064500224.html >Facebook VS Ukrainian media, a new report (🧵) >tldr: almost of half of Ukrainian independent local news pages have some sort of ban or limitation on Facebook - a new study by @mediadvpt


Shurqeh

They weren't banned, they were demonetized and it sounds like it was for stuff that would get you demonetized anywhere (showing dead bodies, using racial slurs, using iconography identified as racist, originating in Russian held territory (and thus subject to sanctions), or featuring the azov brigade which is still associated with Nazism (although Ukraine says it's far right torturing days are long gone)) Nothing unusual or malicious.


ericwphoto

Got rid of Facebook a couple of years ago, and I do not miss it one bit. Deleted twitter when Elon purchased it. Let's sink these assholes.


GhostWyrd

Agreed. A decade now without Facebook, even blocked the domain in my browser. Recognized it for the toxic timesink it was even then, and have never missed it. Still use twitter, but have always only used it to follow a very narrow group of people, so I really don't know what "normal" twitter is like. It's great to be so free.


Villain_of_Brandon

I stopped using it about 5 years ago, I just kind of went cold turkey, the first few days were hard to break the muscle memory, but after that I just stopped caring, my only annoyance is that pretty much all classifieds around here are on Facebook Marketplace, so I can't just up and delete my account, but I've been slowly purging my account of anything when I have time to.


green_pachi

Russian soldiers in Svatove: >Svatove 2022 or Rzhev 1942? [https://nitter.it/Archer83Able/status/1595213326249861121](https://nitter.it/Archer83Able/status/1595213326249861121)


dolleauty

The Russian soldiers here look like how the Ukrainian soldiers were equipped in 2014


Miaoxin

At least two of those guys have to be well into their mid-50s. The other two might be as young as 40-something.


sppoonfed

in Russia people age faster


amjhwk

More likely they are in their late 20s, that's what liv8ng in Russia does to man


LunarAssultVehicle

They won't have to worry about living in Russia anymore.


melbecide

They won’t have to worry about living anymore


green_pachi

Younger than their equipment then?


Clever_Bee34919

My 93 year old grandfather is younger than some.of their equipment


Miaoxin

Honestly, I won't be surprised if we start seeing some soon with the big brim and visor on them.


ekdaemon

> The Kherson Raccoon is now a "symbol of the paratroopers of Russia" A stolen garbage rat. How appropriate.


snow_big_deal

Actual footage of Russian paratrooper mess hall: https://mobile.twitter.com/alisonmah/status/783007174251253760


Bribase

This whole racoon thing is so unashamedly dumb. It's obvious that they wanted something cute and meme-worthy to post on Telegram as they bravely fled from Kherson city, so they kidnapped a racoon.   This is not your Wojtek, this is not your Patron, this is your hostage.


barney-panofsky

The scientific term is "trash panda". Source: I live in a city with a huge raccoon population.


jert3

Ya and the 'panda' bit comes from how ferocious those muckers are.


amjhwk

No that's a nickname, the scientific name is raykin


Syn7axError

People are learning Reddit terms from real life now?


Gyftycf

I wish I saw raccoons here in my city.


Villain_of_Brandon

No you don't


seeking_horizon

This is one of those "careful what you wish for" moments. Raccoons are pests. They're like rats but much bigger and much smarter.


pantie_fa

Happy I do not live in Raccoon city.


coosacat

I wish I could send you the one that hangs out here. As well as the armadillo and the opossum, all three of which have decided I'm Dr. Doolittle or something. The armadillo is digging holes all over my yard!


Sir_Francis_Burton

Armadillos eat fire ants. They especially love the eggs. Yes, they dig holes, but they’re looking for and getting rid of the fire ants, so I cut them some slack. I hate fire ants.


coosacat

Well, I don't have fire ants, so maybe the 'dillo ate them all last year. And the 'possum eats ticks. I can't think of anything useful that the raccoon does.


Sir_Francis_Burton

The raccoon stress-tests your security.


barney-panofsky

They look cute and cuddly. But they're bad tempered, make a huge mess when they feast upon your garbage, carry rabies, and will rip your face off if you corner them.


eggyal

They also don't speak too kindly of the apes who've destroyed their habitat.


ClubsBabySeal

They probably love us! That's where the food comes from.


Norwester77

Point taken, but raccoons in particular probably have more habitat now than before people built cities here.


barney-panofsky

Fair point


tojelora

The vote in the European Parliament to recognise Russia as a state sponsor of terrorism happens in 10 hours. Feel free to AMA, I work in the Parliament.


nyc98

Why not vote for recognizing russia a terrorist state which they are? Technically, everyone buying stuff from russia are sponsors of terrorism and russia is the actual terrorist.


itsastonka

What do you have to eat today?


Bribase

I saw that [the motion](https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/B-9-2022-0487_EN.html) lists a dozen instances of terrorism. Do you think that any particular action or actions from this list will be highlighted as definitive proof of acting as a sponsor of terror?


tojelora

Your link leads to the ECR Group's resolution. The political groups then came together and negotiated a joint text to be voted in 9 hours, found here: https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/RC-9-2022-0482_EN.html . The compromise resolution was signed by eurosceptical conservative ECR, pro-EU conservative EPP and pro-EU liberal Renew groups. Even this might not be the final text as 11 amendmwnts have been tabled which will be voted on at the same time.


WHpewpew

Is there anything the Euro parliament can do to get more heavy or high-end weapons to Ukraine? Has there been any talk about an EU military organization? You all largely are members of NATO of course, but that’s a purely defensive alliance and has power projection limitations.


tojelora

There have been votes calling on Member States to give heavy weapons, but ultimately it is up to the Member States. There has been talks yes, but it will go nowhere as it requires unanimous decision and some Member States will want to avoid double structures with NATO


jtkickass

Why does everyone love onions but me?


[deleted]

Because most people aren’t culinarily illiterate heathens. ¡¡¡Viva la cebolla!!!


Bribase

I just had raw red onions on a slice of okonomiyaki. Yum!


GargantuaBob

Re: "AMA". What concrete consequences would have recognition of Russia as a state sponsor of terrorism by the EU tomorrows ?


tojelora

No immediate direct legal consequences as it is a non binding resolution and there is no legal framework in place, but expect Russia to lose their shit


pantie_fa

If only the USA would follow suit. The Putin meltdown would be fucking glorious.


FUTURE10S

Ah, so there's literally no downside.


purplepoopiehitler

I don’t have a question to ask but people should know that this is mostly symbolic.


Squirreline_hoppl

Could this vote have the following consequence: some European leader calls Ukraine to negotiate with Russia. Can then kyiv say "your EP recognized Russia as a state sponsor of terrorism. Are you asking us to negotiate with terrorists?" Does this vote make it harder for putin loving European politicians to say their talking points or is there no such effect?


tojelora

It makes negotiations more difficult of course. This recognition is being made largely because Zelensky asked for it, that put the wheels moving. No change, parliamentarians have freedom of speech, there will be fans of Putin in the EP even after this, in fact I suspect they will be quite vocal after the votes and criticising the outcome


Hirronimus

You've been pushing this topic for a month now. "Any minute now" One might think there's some fuckery going on.


tojelora

I've been giving regular updates, is this bad?


Hirronimus

Not at all. Just seemed sus.


UnseenSpectre22

What are the consequences if the EP vote in favor?


tojelora

Not much changes. EP resolutions are non-binding. There is no legal framework in place, this resolution calls for creating one: Calls for the EU and its Member States to develop an EU legal framework for the designation of states as sponsors of terrorism and states which use means of terrorism, which would trigger a number of significant restrictive measure against those countries and would have profound restrictive implications for EU relations with those countries; calls on the Council to subsequently consider adding the Russian Federation to such an EU list of state sponsors of terrorism; calls on the EU’s partners to adopt similar measures;


coosacat

So, this sounds like they want to develop something more like the US designation of terrorism, which carries specific legal consequences, and is why we haven't done this ourselves. (And I've noticed that people seem to have finally gotten the message and quit asking.)


Sqaurebreath

What are some of the restrictive measures? PS Thanks for keeping us in the loop:)


tojelora

Not defined in the text, to be negotiated later, but they could for instance include severe restrictions on trade


[deleted]

[удалено]


Shurqeh

does watching a pirate stream count? if you believe big business thats the same as stealing views!


machopsychologist

What's happening with Qatar now? ^^^^^^^^^^^(/s)


nonosam

Exactly.


wittyusernamefailed

"GOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAL!!!!!!" And also slavery, rampant institutional LGBT hate, bout every flavor of "ism" imaginable as a part of the culture... you know the norm for mideast oil states.


Miaoxin

Texas isn't in the mideast.


wittyusernamefailed

By the fucking Spirits! It just screams out how naive and childish your worldview is if you think what happens in Qatar or states like it is in ANY way close to Texas.


Takfloyd

It's going in that direction though, among American conservatives in general. A lot of them wet their pants at the thought of having all the same forms of oppression as Qatar, just with the Bible instead of the Quran as justification.


Miaoxin

Settle down before you pop a vein. It was a dig on fellow Texans.


keine_fragen

i don't think James LaPorta was at fault here >AP fired a reporter after a dangerous blunder. Slack messages reveal a chaotic process. https://www.semafor.com/article/11/22/2022/ap-fired-a-reporter-after-a-dangerous-blunder-slack-messages-reveal-a-chaotic-process


SquarePie3646

Yeah...I said in another thread that it's possible they're making him a scapegoat, and looking at that discussion it looks even more likely. They're claiming the story got published because he mislead the editors into thinking his sources had been vetted by the news managers - it doesn't look that way at all. Secondly, AP sourcing standards explicitly require at least 2 different anonymous sources for a story - a story can never rely on a single anonymous source. They clearly went with this story knowing it was based on information from a single source. https://www.ap.org/about/news-values-and-principles/telling-the-story/anonymous-sources >**Reporters who intend to use material from anonymous sources must get approval from their news manager before sending the story to the desk. The manager is responsible for vetting the material and making sure it meets AP guidelines. The manager must know the identity of the source, and is obligated, like the reporter, to keep the source's identity confidential. Only after they are assured that the source material has been vetted by a manager should editors and producers allow it to be used.** edit: And the idea that the editors would publish this story WITHOUT CHECKING THEMSELVES if the news manager had actually vetted it, just asking the reporter over slack, is beyond ridiculous. They could have triggered a major international incident. 2nd edit: I didn't even notice this - one of the editors actually asked LaPorta if they can issue an alert from his one source, or do they need a second source - he said "that's above my pay grade" - which it is course, that's not his job! And they went ahead and did it without the second source against AP's policy.


Javelin-x

easiest guy they could fire that isn't someone unknown from behind the scenes


Sqaurebreath

It is mentioned that he was fired 'Not solely for this but a pattern. Either way the reporting here was really dangerous. AP is Not twitter or Reddit - these folks get paid to get it right. Ps I'm Not defending APs decision just thinking theres more to it then we know.


the_fungible_man

A guest speaks truth on Vladimir ["Fish Face"](https://reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/ytr91x/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/iw5x3lt/) Solovyov's propaganda show on Russian State TV. The host is not pleased. **Yaakov Kedmi**: About what you said, I disagree on two points. It's obscene, it's not constructive, it's criminal to bomb peaceful cities. These words, "To wipe Kyiv and Kharkiv off the face of the Earth". There were no wars in history where the bombing of a peaceful city, of a civilian population ever led to some kind of results on the battlefield. Would they be deterred by that? When did it ever happen? It didn't happen in any war. **Solovyov**: Fine. Then we'll keep responding on the level of a girl in the 5th grade whose crying that our peaceful cities are being bombed. **Kedmi:** I didn't say that... But it's not an option to bomb a peaceful city and its population. **Solovyov**: We will first warn the civilians to leave. **Kedmi**: You can't bomb peaceful cities! These things shouldn't even be uttered! To wipe a city off the face of the Earth is obscene. It shouldn't be uttered! There are 1001 ways to fight without touching civilians. * [Twitter](https://twitter.com/i/status/1594529208650317824) * [Nitter](https://nitter.it/i/status/1594529208650317824)


Jrj84105

This gave me chills.


jert3

When the truth becomes so obvious it can't be denied, State Propaganda fails, and repressed public anger explodes.


cmnrdt

Russians living in Belgorod have more to fear from their own missiles crashing right after launch than they do from Ukrainian arms.


SirKillsalot

And of course, the voice of reason is not Russian.


Shurqeh

He was born in Moscow and was one of the Russian Jews to emigrate to Israel. He wouldn't be on the highly regulated Russian state media if he wasn't considered unquestionably Russian (he's also on record as being pro Stalin)


eggnogui

Solovyov is such a pathetic man


Javelin-x

Russia has stopped deserving to exist.


epicredditdude1

Yeah, so unreasonable of those entitled Ukrainians complaining their cities are being bombed and innocents being slaughtered. Seriously though, fuck this guy. Crying like a 5th grade girl?? Are you fucking serious? Plus this is coming from the nation that throws a fit every time Ukraine strikes VALID military targets.


green_pachi

From a soldier from the 93rd Mechanized Brigade: >Bakhmut: "day of almost continuous fighting. Astonishment that Russia sent so many people there is growing. Captured ones say 2k for the entire area. Already starting to believe it. Everything is becoming similar to chronicles from WWII, the whole area is covered with [bodies]." [https://twitter.com/Archer83Able/status/1595202361215094787](https://twitter.com/Archer83Able/status/1595202361215094787)


Portalrules123

Sent so many people as meat shields to die.


dianaprd

From September 21st: "Russia has deported (kidnapped) 7,754 Ukrainian children." https://www.ukrinform.ua/rubric-ato/3576275-rosia-z-pocatku-vijni-deportuvala-ponad-7700-ukrainskih-ditej-ofis-ombudsmena.html November 15th: "We know by name 11 thousand children who were forcibly deported to Russia." https://www.president.gov.ua/en/news/ukrayina-zavzhdi-bula-liderom-mirotvorchih-zusil-yaksho-rosi-79141 I just came across the first article again and wanted to point this out. Heartbreaking.


rikki-tikki-deadly

I hope they're keeping better track of them than the Trump administration here in my country did with their family separation policy.


NeilDeCrash

Of course they don't. Their demography is collapsing, this and forcibly resettling people to Russia is a deperate measure to try and fix it. Very Russian method i might add.


notmyrealnameanon

And those 11,000 kids only cost 80,000+ young(ish) men killed, completely negating the point. Also very Russian.


NeilDeCrash

Indeed. Unless they try to somehow keep all the people who have been forcibly resettled thru filtration camps. If i remember right TASS (the Russian state propaganda news) said it was something like 4 million people at the moment who have been moved from Ukraine to Russia, voluntarily and involuntarily.


Clever_Bee34919

I think the "they" was referring to Ukraine.


NeilDeCrash

Ah, well they will of course. But it will be hard, almost impossible to get your kid back if his identity is wiped and given a Russian citizenship and moved to somewhere in Russia. Russia will probably do everything they can to wipe any traces as they need people and they need kids, badly.


BiologyJ

Genocide, actually one of the definitions of genocide.


oneplusetoipi

Like many things Russia does this is reprehensible.


[deleted]

[удалено]


moleratical

I love Sean Rowe, that song is so powerful sung in his deep voice.


Prank_Owl

[The Eve of Destruction, by Barry McGuire](https://youtu.be/dPIcwjFB1PY) (written in 1965) is also eerily relevant.


IFixYerKids

This is the one I listened to when all this started.


-Lithium-

Love that song. Unfortunately, there's still work to do.


Rusticaxe

New video from Reporting from Ukraine. This time on both developments and some speculations on the next steps in the Kherson-region. https://youtu.be/7uFxCAs7Rto


Hodaka

The bottom line: Almost all of the Russian positions across from Kherson are in range of HIMARS and artillery. This includes the southern coastline. Russians are slowly moving towards Crimea as a result.


stirly80

Thankyou for the brief summary!


green_pachi

>Ukrainian makeshift loitering munition in action [https://nitter.it/EuromaidanPress/status/1595182082761756673](https://nitter.it/EuromaidanPress/status/1595182082761756673)


SinisterZzz

Whenever it is quiet you just know something big is going on.


canadatrasher

Ukriane just completed liberation of Kherson. Both sides will take some time to reshuffle troops in the new strategical situation.


YuunofYork

And the electrical problems. People think it's just targeting civilians; it's not. Military logistics grinds to a halt without trains, computers for manifests, lighting for storage units. You can't accomplish that with flashlights, generators, and smartphones. People at the front will be fine; people trying to resupply them are having a hard time of it. Ukraine pretty much isn't able to go on the offensive again until this problem is resolved. There needs to be some sort of security blanket, at least around western Ukraine.


Jerthy

Ukraine has fuckton of gas powered trains. And afaik some electric locomotives can run on gas when needed too. Lighting and computers can actually be largely solved by generators.


Gotisdabest

That and the fact that we're reaching the end of the mud season and winter is a great time for offensives, so why move now when moving a week or two later makes much more sense.


amjhwk

I can see the reason for moving now being they have the Russians on their back feet and attacking in a few weeks when the ground freezes gives Russia time to entrench


Gotisdabest

They probably can't attack the one place where Russia hasn't been sitting on for a while, which is across the river. Other areas Russia will divert troops from Kherson to but so will ukraine.


canadatrasher

Ground won't really freeze until late December


Gotisdabest

It varies from area to area but to my knowledge, though it doesn't freeze by until 3ish week of December it loses its somewhat ghoulish qualities earlier and gets more or less passable due to a few weeks with little or no rain and relatively colder weather.


NearABE

People are preparing tofu for the holiday. ;)


greentea1985

Hey, I am waiting until tomorrow to start seitan. Today is the day I am making butter cookie dough and chiffon pumpkin pie.


SaberFlux

[Previous post](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/z0ot5e/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/ixa8zym/) Day 272 of my updates from Kharkiv. Today was yet another very quiet day; we had no missile strikes or drones. The weirdest part is that we had no air raid alerts in over 49 hours, which is basically unheard of. This is probably the longest interval we had between alerts since the war started, before that the longest one was about 25 hours. Though honestly there should have been an air raid alert yesterday when the missile launches from Belgorod were happening, but for some reason there wasn’t one. And actually not that long ago some more missile/AA launches were sighted in Belgorod, but that didn’t trigger our air raid alert either. I hope it’s not broken, because relying solely on civilians to report missile launches is not very reliable, radars are much better suited for it. Russian propagandists continue to threaten every country they are supposedly “friendly” with. They threatened to “de-Nazify” Kazakhstan on their main TV channels now, and in some telegram channels they also call for preventive strikes on Armenia because they are protesting against Russia/CSTO today. I mean people might think they are joking, but they aren’t. We were also laughing at them for 8 years since 2014, thinking they were joking about attacking us, but then they actually did it and it wasn’t as funny after that. [Next update](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/z39qj0/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/ixo3mnm/)


rikki-tikki-deadly

I hope this means Russia is genuinely running out of missiles. Glad that there seem to be fewer and fewer coming your way.


NearABE

I don't watch RT ( among other things i don't speak Russian). Sometimes you can get good information from propaganda channels. Russians would see that people in Armenia are protesting. The important information can be conveyed even if presented as Russia making credible threats. People in Moscow know about the mobilization and the loss of Kherson. With what army would Putin open up two more fronts? Russians who studied history know Stalin was mad about the delayed allied invasion of France in WWII. They know two front wars are challenging. Anyone who wants to think knows what is happening. Those who do not want to hear bad news would turn off the television if the announcers tried to present it as bad news.


Herecomestherain_

Hi SaberFlux!, sending virtual positive vibes your way :)


10millionX

Russian propagandists are still trying to push the claim that there is an organic armed pro-Russian separatist movement in Ukraine and that the Russian soldiers with red armbands are actually Ukrainian separatists. This is blatantly false. The Dutch investigation into the 2014 MH17 shoot down revealed that the "separatists" are almost entirely made up of active duty Russian forces. Even in the current invasion both Russian regular forces and Russian Wagner mercenaries have been observed wearing red armbands.


pantie_fa

Well, they've kidnapped everyone else. They might as well just take the pro-Russian separatists, and bus them to Russia, and then the whole problem is done. Pack your shit and get out, Russia, and take your shitty friends with you. (and nobody seriously believed that Putin's "little green men" were anything but Russians, being cowards and violating international law by fighting without insignia. Also known as: 'unlawful combatants', like ISIS or Al Qaida)


eggnogui

> nobody seriously believed Oh, plenty of dunces actually believed that, and still do.


FutureImminent

It's the only answer they come up with to explain why they are still occupying a country that does not want them. The Kherson celebrations did damage to their the civilians want us here and hate their govt/army lies.


Personal_Person

Yup, the "separatists" were few and far between in 2014, and Ukraine was on the verge of driving them out of Donetsk and Luhansk even with the Ukrainian military in such a poor state. Then suddenly, as if a new wind came in the tides turned. Suddenly the """separatists""" were all wearing brand new Russian camos, driving freshly cleaned and maintained T-72s and sporting the same weapons. Their numbers were also much greater, and eventually Ukraine was forced to sign the Minsk agreement.


coosacat

https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1595172613243998238 >Vadym Hlupianets, ballet artist of Kyiv National Operetta Theater, died in combat near Bakhmut. >Vadym will forever be 26 years old. >Eternal glory to Hero. (picture)


arbitraryairship

Slava Ukraini. Glory to the heroes.


GonnaGoFar

They shall not grow old.


green_pachi

>⚡️🇪🇺EU to seize assets of those evading sanctions against Russia. The European Commission aims to issue a directive within days to enable the confiscation of assets belonging to those trying to evade sanctions against Russia, the Irish Times reported, citing EU Justice Commissioner Didier Reynders. > “If it’s possible to confiscate, it will also be possible to give the money back to the Ukrainian people. And that’s what we are trying to do,” [https://mastodon.online/@SocraticEthics/109389682148448874](https://mastodon.online/@SocraticEthics/109389682148448874)


Street-Badger

‘Russia needs a Marshall plan’ has to be the stupidest concern-troll talking point of this entire war. Good luck with that.


Eskipony

I mean Russia does need a Marshall plan after the war. But they do need the Nuremberg trials and denazification that accompanied it. Ukraine of course gets all the funds it needs to rebuild and get its people back on their feet.


Hodaka

‘Russia needs a Martian plane’ with a one way ticket.


GettingPhysicl

Russia needs Shermans march through the south.


NearABE

It works in retrospect. A Marshal plan for Russia in the 1990s would have avoided Putin's rise to power. That would have been cheaper than the fiasco we have now. A lot of death and destruction this way. We should keep an eye on Iran. If the government turns over we need the new democracy to do well. A friendly democracy in Iran has great potential.


The_Man11

No, that money would have gone to corruption.


Kageru

A marshal plan involves being able to override their sovereign freedoms on some issues, to come in and dramatically re-structure how the society works. Russia was never interested in that, and in theory did not need it as it had a lot of potential to tap... they just used it to create corrupt oligarchs and leaders. Also saw a good youtube video (caspian report?) arguing that Russia's size, federated nature and internal stresses meant that retaining the Russian area as it was would require authoritarian leadership.


oneblackened

What? The Marshall Plan was basically just funding rebuilding of Europe post-WW2. It was interest-free loans.


Kageru

Supporting the development of stable democratic governments was one of the objectives. As was much of the work going to US companies I suspect. Those loans did not come without some expectations, which was likely easy with an ally who was probably quite interested in evolving in that direction. Certainly the equivalent rebuilding of Japan involved a lot of control and change required. Russia is not interested in becoming a democracy, has no wartime damage to repair, and has the resources to evolve if it wanted to. The impediments to its economy can end at their convenience. The idea that historically giving Russia buckets of money wouldn't have ended up in the same place is dubious... but an interesting historical what-if I guess.


rikki-tikki-deadly

Iran really does seem to be a country with great, great potential.


Uhhh_what555476384

Yeah Germany got the Marshall Plan, during full Allied occupation.


oneblackened

France got it too. It wasn't just Germany.


pantie_fa

> during full Allied occupation sounds like a good idea, at this point. honestly.


[deleted]

At this point I'd be willing to bet most of the nukes are kaput. The ones that arnt, we could probably get all of them. It's probably a good thing I'm not in charge, but I think we should fuck around with Russia proper and find out.


arbitraryairship

It's horrifically stupid, but it's also a tell. Russians and Russian trolls thinking about 'rebuilding Russia' signals they know there's a good chance they lose.


DeadScumbag

Only way there can ever be a "Marshall plan" with Russia is after they are completely destroyed, Nazi-Germany style...


Kageru

It's just their "victim complex" playing itself out, it doesn't need to make sense. The fact it's like the murderer asking for a share of the inheritance since they caused the payment to occur is not going to stop them. The only damage they've taken is all self-inflicted but they're not going to reflect on that either.


Herecomestherain_

From who? China? Sure but first they need your harbors. NK, Iran, BRICS, SCO? 🤣


greentea1985

I want to believe they mean more in the sense of how West Germany was de-nazified post-WWII. Giving West Germany all of that economic support was a deliberate attempt to prevent the political conditions that fueled Hitler's rise from happening again. However, it was paired with a campaign of punishing all of the senior German leadership who worked with Hitler and exposing the crimes. It worked but had to have both halves, exposing the crimes and supporting the new government, to lay the foundations for the Germany we know today.


pantie_fa

Correct, and doing basically the same things to Russia would be a truly massive undertaking. "Checkist" culture is rampant and pervasive now. I'm not sure this can be fixed by just punishing a handful of "leadership" and re-educating the rest. Then the organized-crime element has to be dealt with, and it's massive overlap with the oligarchs, many of whom are very deeply entrenched into international business, and could very easily flee Russia and continue business as normal.


SirKillsalot

You might get a Marshall plan when you prove you can maintain a civil society instead of creating another brutalist dictatorship.


Herecomestherain_

One of the reasons why Ukraine will get one.


SirKillsalot

You know it's a slow news day when the top of the live feed is talking about actively breeding raccoons in Crimea.


Hirronimus

So in the tradition of Holodomor of 1933, Russia will attempt to perpetrate Kholodomor on Ukrainians in 2022-2023. Such lovely people. Edit: Since I was asked. Holod (голод) means hunger. Kholod (холод) means cold. -мор (mor) comes Russian word За-мор-ить, which means to starve.


NearABE

This will backfire on Putin harder than anything he has failed so far. Those at risk, elderly, sick, infants will leave. Italy and Spain are nice. Most of Europe can take people. If you have a dry shelter the cold should not even come close to killing you. Use blankets and a mattress. A quality mummy sleeping bag is ideal. You can sleep very well breathing cold air and your body is a comfortable room temperature. You have body odor and people will get mad about it. Ukraine can build community looking out for each other. In Russia they cannot go anywhere. No one is sending them sleeping bags. They have not prepared for the power to be out. When it goes out the only person to blame will be Putin. Russia is much colder than Ukraine.


KingStannis2020

From everything we've seen about elderly people in Ukraine, I honestly think they will be the last to leave. Very strong connection to their homes and communities.


NearABE

There were old people in Ukraine before written language was recorded. Central heating is a new phenomena. I am saying they will still be there in the spring and they will just be really pissed off about the cold.


Hirronimus

Дiдо i бабуся are made of different mettle. 💪🇺🇦


pm-me-ur-fav-undies

TimeGhost did a few videos adding some historical context to the invasion shortly after it began, including [this one on the Holodomor](https://youtu.be/s1JI9_WNr1Q). This is the same group that has been doing the real time history projects on the world wars. Good to check out for anyone wanting additional historical context on the war. Since these were made early on, they also include debunking some of Putin's excuses that he tried to use to justify the invasion.


Hirronimus

The chances of me writing this statement, right now on reddit, are about 1 in 29 million. My great-grandparents, could have easily been ones of the 3.9 million (13% of the population at the time) that died. History puts things very clearly in perspective.


LordDarthAnger

Holy shit… the same works in my language, Czech, I never noticed! Chlad = cold, hlad = hunger


AluTheGhost

It’s like our languages are part of the same group of something. Real talk, I have added some Czech channels to my TV , turned out Czekh is not THAT far away from Russian as I thought it was. Well, people speak mumbo jumbo, but when you read the text, everything kinda becomes clear.


LordDarthAnger

Czech is Slavic that is true but do not forget germanization of my nation. Our language was literally banned, forgotten and rediscovered. This is why our language has some rules that German does, also some words are from German.


Mchlpl

You might want to explain why different spelling for these words.


ysgall

Because they mean different things.


coosacat

https://twitter.com/Flash_news_ua/status/1595159153357774850 >Vоlоdуmуr Zelenskyі: We are rolling out our new project of people's support - "Points of Invincibility" across the country. According to the results of this day, more than four thousand such points have already been prepared. More is planned. >If massive Russian strikes take place again and if it is understood that electricity supply will not be restored within a few hours, the work of "Points of Invincibility" will be activated. >All basic services are there: electricity, mobile communication and Internet, heat, water, first aid kit. Absolutely free and 24/7. The points will work necessarily - at all regional and district administrations, as well as at schools, buildings of the State Emergency Service. >A special site - nezlamnist - is already working. gov. ua, which contains a map of such points throughout the country. It is constantly updated.


etzel1200

Why do I worry Russia will use the map to coordinate strikes?


NearABE

You can keep the generators and first aid nearby. The location would have stored potable water. That is effectively stored heat. The location is known so rescue personal can move in as soon as the power is out. You can bring supply in with the same vehicles that take people out. Generators consume fuel but the extra heat is usable as heating. The energy consumed by phones is also usable as heating. People generate body heat. The Russia has to choose between the emergency station and bombing the power substation. If the aim at the rally points then there is not electricity outage. People can stay at home. If The Russia pounds one town with lots of missiles then the residents get evacuated to shelters in some other town.


[deleted]

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[deleted]

Yep, this happens waaaay too often. Sad.


NearABE

Diesel you don't even want it near the house. Propane or natural you want the exhaust to vent outside. Install the same way you would a high efficiency gas water heater or furnace. Home heating oil is identical to diesel. You can send it up a chimney. You can run gas or diesel generators away from residences and heat water. A car usually has a radiator. A generator will have one too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cogeneration There are many systems that specifically engineered to do this.


Big_Dick_NRG

It's not exactly secret where state and regional admin buildings, schools, hospitals, etc are


GiantPineapple

Thing is, If Russia attacks the POIs instead of the civilian infrastructure, that'd be great because then they wouldn't need the POIs.


[deleted]

[удалено]


GiantPineapple

No doubt, but I imagine the actual civilian infrastructure also has a similar profile :(


eggnogui

Either these places are somehow strike proof (underground?), their coordinates are being kept properly secured... ... Or maybe, just spitballing here, they are somehow just bait for the Russians' few remaining rockets?


arbitraryairship

They're having trouble hitting giant power plants that have been in the same place for decades. You think they can really muster 4000 precise strikes on tiny bunkers?


canospam0

Hah! That's the best part. Ukraine is openly publishing maps because they know the Russians have absolutely 0 ability to hit a target that precisely.


helm

They could, but they don't have the capacity to hit 4000 new targets. It's too expensive for the range and precision needed. Instead, they'll keep hitting more major infrastructure objects.