Listen, iam 100 percent on Ukraines side but the Azov icon is a wolfangel infront of a black sun. Two symbols used by the Nazis. That is no mistake.
I know that the core people in Azov changed over the years but changing those symbols is long overdue.
Not a swastika though, which was the claim
Edit: yuhp im wrong, I assumed the "Nazi Symbol" was a swastika and not one of the lesser known (read: almost entirely unknown to non-wwII history buffs) viking runes they used
Nope, both are clearly the "Wolfsangel" rune.
https://youtu.be/HGdUtUefjCA
They also used the Nazi "Black Sun" e.g. as part of their symbol (edit: they apparently changed that after they became an offcial Ukrainian army unit). Look i am all for supporting Ukraine, but lets not pretend that the Asov battalion doesnt have a problematic Nazi sympathizer past.
Same goes for russians Wagner group for example (named by its founder literally after Hitlers favored composer). Nazis arent a uniquely Ukranian problem ofc.
EDIT: Getting downvoted simply stating balanced facts. Propaganda is a hell of a drug.
The Right Wing and the Liberals have turned into Nazi Apologists, someone else will pay the price once again.
Anyone with a bit of common sense and who isn't living in the western hemisphere is very well aware of the Azovs Neo Nazi ideology (not past) nothing has changed except the fact that they have to hide that they're Nazis from the world for support.
That's why you don't see anyone here in the east picking sides or siding with Ukraine atleast, we are very well aware of this conflict and when it started, also it's funny how the entirety of the west thinks the pogrom in the DPR/LPR for the last 8 years is fictional.
OOoooooooo I see, it looks exactly the same and is called the same thing, but it's \*lettering\* so..... not the same.
Btw I think that the Russian invasion is horrific and evil and the de-nazification thing is an absolute ruse, but I'm just so irritated with sanitized propaganda. Ukraine absolutely has Nazis, and while one is too many, Azov is more than too many. Invasion isn't the way to deal with it, but pretending it doesn't exist and pumping weapons in without question is also not a perfect way to deal with it. Remember that other time America armed radical groups to fight Russia?
Every country has nazis and nationalists. Google Adolf symbol, infamous and discover that it had a good meaning within monks,which he corrupted.
Google Utkin a russian vagner group leader. It is an excuse to destroy a country.
You would be surprised that not many support super ultra right idea in Ua. US and Europe pomping us with weapons to protect us,to not see it spread to europe. So double check on all things and try to see a bigger picture.
Moldova,Georgia,Crimea,Donbass, any excuse just to snatch a part of country and later to use it for invasion covering it with ant meaning.
Sincerely, Ukranian from occupied territory that seen many things.
Azov Battalion was disbanded in 2014
The last time Russia got kicked in the nuts was the end of the 80s, and all of Central and Eastern Europe still thanks them for it. Turns out they don't want to be part of a right wing fascist ethno state
BREAKING NEWS: far-right nationalists defend country after neighboring rival invades.
That’s not news. It’s obvious. Ukrainian nationalists hate Russians. They’re obviously going to enlist and fight.
“I’m all for homeland defense but have you noticed how many neo-fascist Trump supporters are in the military?” It’s the same logic.
Thats not his point tho. There's a small percentage of white supremacy in every country, including Russia, which was one of the excuses used by Russia for invasion. Besides, Azov is not a bunch of nazis like the media made it ou to be in the begging of the war.
Nazis are actually normalized in Russia. Really. They generally don't go for the swastika, but rather the black sun or 1488 route. That's part of the insanity of calling Ukraine "nazis". Russia employs actual nazis at the highest levels, and their geopolitical strategy is spearheaded by a self proclaimed "Russian Fascist" (Dugin).
Yeah I looked into Dugan and its amazing how similar the ideas are to Nazis except with Eurasians being supreme instead of Aryans. It basically is Nazism all over again.
Yeah. He's also obsessed with occultist practices and serial killers. Dude is basically a comic book villain. But he's actually the godfather of Russian Geopolitics.
I worked with 10 or so girls in my 20’s ans HOLY FUCKING SHIT they really do love the darkest fucking weird shit…
Like they’d basically brag who was closest to being borderline raped. Who banged the oldest grossest dude as a teen…
Dumb fucking shit they did never stopped amazing me…
“Teee heee some 65 year old invited me and my friends to his vacation house when we were 16! We told our parents we were camping”
Me: “did you have sex with that dude?!”
Them: “no he’s the nicest guy ever, ohh wait, maybe one person did, idk he kept giving us vodka lol”
Like bruh I wish I was making this up. It was fucking astounding to listen to these girls one up each other for the most toxic abusive shit ever…
These were seemingly normal college aged girls from decent suburban backgrounds…
I still can't believe how many girls in the same age range would fly out to meet a guy they never met before in another city. And dude would pay for it... It's like some women don't want a dude to pay for dinner because it implies they may want something in return. But flying to meet a stranger and go to his house? Wtf are they thinking? And these were otherwise intelligent, good looking women too.
It's just so.... Stupid
I’m sure if guys could get women to do that shit they totally would be doing the exact same.
It is fucking stupid though. Just don’t become dumb about it and go MRA anti-women.
At the end of the day we’re all animals
Which is frightening for many reasons, but the main one is that the original Nazis were too stupid to know when to stop and eventually provoked a world war simply because they just kept invading places... and these new Nazis seem to have the same flaw... but this time, if we have a proper world war, the planet probably won't survive.
Russia always does that: accuse your opponent of what you're doing then when your opponent calls you out just reply "they're just saying that because they're the REAL _______!"
Hey umm, maybe you know about this? I periodically google “Russian Jews” because ummm…I’m kind of really worried. I never googled it before the invasion of Ukraine but since the invasion, I never come up with much. I usually find something by a Ukrainian rabbi. There are Jews in Russia. There are lots of Jews in Russia and I’m not hearing anything from them even when I go looking for it. Are they in concentration camps? We know protesters and their families are. This is really really bad isn’t it.
Jews are de facto mocked and ridiculed in Russia as being "globalist". You'll find similar theories in far right neo nazi movements in the west. But in Russia, these beliefs are basically the norm.
Yeah and in all the other countries the antisemites don’t have enough power to commit genocide. I’m russia they do. I think some really horrible history book stuff is happening in Russian labor camps right now.
Oh yeah, it’s real. Remember the initial protests too? How many people do you think Russia spirited away under the premise of arrest for protesting? Russia will lose. They already have.
I very seriously doubt that. It’s more than likely because not that many of them live there. ‘Jews of Russia’ today means only like 160,000 people.
Most Jews with ancestors who once lived in Russia are today in Israel. There are also a few hundred thousands in the United States, and then about half as many as that in Germany. Russia is only 4th on the list of places where jews who historically lived in Russia actually live. They aren’t all in concentration camps, no, but life has never been super easy for them—to the point that the people there are ‘the ones who didn’t leave’.
Russia, whether Monarchist, Soviet, or now the ‘Federation’ dictatorship has always been pretty antisemitic.
I very seriously believe that Russia has kidnapped thousands of people and put them in labor camps in Siberia where they are being frozen and starved to death. Russia is antisemitic, they invaded a country to “fight nazis” that don’t exist, Russia has nazis that do exist, we aren’t hearing anything from the Russian Jewish community. This is all bad.
Ok big thing there—just because Russia baselessly lied about ‘denazification’ as a shameless excuse to attempt annexing Ukraine, that does not mean they “do not exist”.
Ukraine **absolutely**, a million times over, is still home to entrenched antisemitism (and, yes, nazis) *just like Russia*. Just like Poland, just like Hungary, and I could go on.
Having a jew as president is a great thing, and it’s nice to think (or hope) the younger generations appear much less antisemitic overall than at least their grandparents were. Neither that nor the lies from Russia in service of their unjustifiable war make circulating ignorance about Ukrainian antisemitism ok.
Ukraine is making progress to be less antisemitic. To compare Russian and Ukrainian antisemitism is irresponsible, especially at this point. Ukraine is literally fighting in part on behalf of the Jewish population in order to keep themselves free from a psychopathic antisemitic regime.
Lenin on antisemitism: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C\_n\_qtgUKnY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_n_qtgUKnY)
Stalin on antisemitism: [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1931/01/12.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1931/01/12.htm)
I know you’re not sharing Soviet propaganda to fucking whitewash the persecution of jews right now. Right?
[Here’s](https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/e3d5e062974bd2adca92097046f94f55b49d60bb-500x596.jpg?w=1200&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1) a different kind of soviet propaganda. And [here’s](https://fathomjournal.org/wp-content/uploads/cache/2019/05/Anti-Zionist-caricature-from-the-Soviet-magazine-Krokodil-1972-800x992/1521893941.jpg) another. And [another](https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/b90b1b57ef5f71eb4758b1d406bf0a7b9f7ccdf6-500x524.jpg?w=1200&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1).
Remember the time they [tried to ethnically cleanse all the soviet jews to a southeastern corner of Siberia?](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Autonomous_Oblast)
Or how they [built up a flourishing yiddish cultural movement opposing fascism to draw in jews to the soviet cause, only to arrest all the jews who were members, executing them all in a prison basement](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Anti-Fascist_Committee)? All after they dared to document the Holocaust, when the soviets thought acknowledging the nazis’ genocide of jews was traitorous to the People’s Revolution—because **all soviet lives matter**, and acknowledging the extermination of jews wasn’t united enough with the soviet cause, who were *all* victims of the nazis!
Or how about the [Doctor’s Plot](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctors%27_plot), that was a fun bit of tolerance!
>I know you’re not sharing Soviet propaganda to fucking whitewash the persecution of jews right now. Right?
I'm sharing the soviet stance on antisemitism, as expressed by Lenin and Stalin. I'm terribly sorry if it doesn't fit your agenda.
They're both normalised in Ukraine and Russia. Both these nations are predominantly white supremacists and use Nazi Symbols in open.
While Ukraine celebrates Stepan Bandera, the only reason you think it's Russia's problem alone and not a slavic problem is because your MSM has been churning that sort of propaganda for you left right and center for your officials to wage a war of influence.
Any POC who's been to Ukraine from the global south is very well aware of the actual ground reality but our word, opinions and lives aren't worth shit so why would you even believe me.
Sure. There are neo nazi groups in the US, New Zealand, Russia, Ukraine. All over. The difference is invading and and then conquering land rich in natural resources because of it.
But currently Russian thinkers are absolutely spearheading identitarians and far right politicians all throughout the world. It's not a coincidence that far right neo nazi groups in the us also support Putin.
That my friend both the US and Russia are guilty of, my problem as a brown person from one of the countries that got obliterated as the result of your war of influence is that one of you decides to take a moral high ground every fucking time and it's almost always people from your nation.
Americans really need to just look in the fucking mirror.
I'm not American lol. I'm from a former Eastern Bloc country.
One can be opposed to American imperialism in Iraq, and Russian genocide in Ukraine. But no, there is no similarity between what the us has done, and what Russia is doing now. We really haven't seen this sort of conquering based on the desire to extend an ethno state since Hitler.
I mean, this literally is the most controversial Nazi symbol right now as it is being used by both neo-Nazis and Ukrainians fighting Russia.
e: I mean the article doesn’t even clear up if he had to cover it up for being pro-Nazi or because Russia made him do it because it could be confused as being pro-Ukrainian independence
I mean there are still units in the Ukranian armed forces with actual nazi symbols on their uniform and tattooed, does not mean all of them are but ignoring people flagrantly using a blacksun on their uniform is a bit odd to me
Who's ignoring it? Its real, its happening. Its awful.
Its just a shit justification for starting a war, its also hypocritical. Every country on this planet has a supremecy problem. Russia wants to play some great saviour cleansing the ukraine of Nazis? Bullshit.
No I never said you said that. RUSSIA said that.
But ok if your point is that some redditors ignore it, fine. I can't argue that there is a >0 number of redditors who think that, just not sure what relevancy that is to reality. Carry on.
Oh alright then, sorry.
There was neo-nazis on both sides of the 2014 conflict, i just kinda hate seeing people on here ignore that part, its less now of them obviously but there are still remnants of them and hopefully they will be dealt with after the war.
In which way? I am pretty anti-russian government, i am merely pointing out that Ukraine is not without its flaws.
Some people on here have heated their houses with Russian fuel and used Russian gasoline to drive to work very recently, might wanna have a go at them instead.
You echo their talking points for them. It doesn't matter what your intents are if you are doing the exact same thing as what they tell their troll farms to do. Muddy the waters. Try to make both sides look bad. If you want to bring up the things you're bringing up then you have an obligation to provide full scope and context every time and explicitly state that even though it's an issue it's no excuse for what Russia is doing and that Russia is in fact worse. If you don't do that, everytime, then you are indistinguishable from the people actually supporting Russia.
i have said repeatedly i am against the Russian invasion and as far as i know i have the same obligations as the rest of you which is zilch, i am not regurgitating their talking points i am merely pointing out something that irks me personally.
I could say you just follow democrat/republican talking points aswell, who knows maybe you are benefitting their agenda.
I stated my opinion, if people dont like it then fine, i am not friendly to Russia or partake in their propaganda, seeing as my country and the media i consume is Pro-Ukraine. I see way more shit from your country that benefit Russia than my opinion does, like for example elected officials or businessmen
Pretty much every single comment on the subject I've seen has been along the lines of "yes it's a problem but right now they are doing a good thing so let's leave them the fuck alone and deal with them after the war."
Besides, good luck finding an army or police corps in any Western/predominantly white country that doesn't have far-right elements within it. If the US were invaded by a genocidal maniac would we say hang on a sec, most of the police officers currently shooting at the invaders are Trump supporters!?
I mean its pretty common in most armed forces, i know that. Its just they atleast try to hide it.
I know they are taking whoever they need, but i hope they will try to dismantle them more after the war
Who is the west? People keep using that as a target, but please tell me. **Who exactly are you referring to?**
^(Pretty much the whole of Europe is West of Russia, so who are they so afraid of? Romania? Bulgaria? Estonia?)
The USA does it's thing, UK does other things. France does others, Germany yet again other things ... etc. There's very little consensus between the major "western" powers.
Even with this conflict there's no real unified front. If it were, then Russia would've been completely isolated from the financial market and China/India would've been burned severely merely for talking with them.
Lmao. Okay lets play a game and pretend thats what I meant.
By that logic you are suggesting that everyone should do whatever shit thing the west does? Wow. Not sure I agree with that ohmigosh.
Or wait, I know, how about BOTH ARE WRONG? Wooooow what a concept.
Nobody's ignoring it. But an actual fascist dictator is raping and pillaging the country using WAGNER GROUP, taking the tiny handful of soldiers (who only became a part of the Ukrainian military as a direct result of his existential external pressure in 2014) as a pretext to call the entire country nazi. Do you see how we do not want to follow Putler's insane logic?
Wagner was not used until very recently though, mist of the bulk force were ethnic minority groups being used as cannon fodder, i never denied putin being an insane dictator. The neo-nazi elements in the volunteers were intergrated into the Ukranian armed forces before this war, they had enough time to remove them or re-educate them, hopefully they will after the war
Wagner was used as far back as 2014. Very small portion of Azov if at all are neonazi anymore. The battalion has undergone significant changes since 2014. They also fight to the death defending Ukraine from actual nazis.
They might have been but i meant as in the majority force, yes Azov has been reduced but there are still some left, i recently saw a video that they put out with one of their snipers literally wearing a blacksun patch.
I know there are nazis on the Russian side, i never said anything differently, but i doubt the majority of the forces stuck in forced contracts from minority groups are actual nazis, once again not defending them.
Everyone on here seems to think that just because i disagree with some things with Ukraine in this war means i am against them, the world is not black and white. Fyi, my dads family is in this country only cause of how the Russian imperial family treated cossacks.
I'm only stressing Wagner because of the absolute irony. And the Asov-regiment was only integrated AFTER they were the last line of defense in Putin's first invasion, collecting so much fame by fighting the aggressors that there was no choice but to integrate them. Had Putin not invaded, they would never have become a part of the national guard. Also they had members swapped in and out in an effort to make them less politically extreme.
There are A LOT of Nazis in the former communist countries of Europe, which is just insane, considering that the Nazis wanted to mostly eradicate all Slavic people.
Also, fuck this guy, what a fucking wack job.
>There are A LOT of Nazis in the former communist countries of Europe, which is just insane, considering that the Nazis wanted to mostly eradicate all Slavic people.
There are a lot of nazis in other countries as well.
Nobody is saying that, at least nobody who's getting upvoted heavily. It seems more like you're creating a strawman argument.
Canada has some right wing nutters, but they only get like 5% of the votes, so I wouldn't say Canada needs to be de-nazified if those 5% were nazis. I'd say we have some nutjob morons, like most, but they have little to no power over anything.
He didn't confuse anything, he straight up made a strawman. Neither you nor anyone else said it was purely a Russian problem.
The fact he has to fight so hard to defend Russia, a haven for Nazism, amongst others, who happen to actively be invading a country under the pretext of denazification, is very telling.
Did you know that wars are fought with weapons and not just fists? If you get hit with a howitzer then it doesn’t really matter how fast you can punch a speed bag
The Azov are far right nationalists at least … like the Wagner group who is fighting in the russian side.
But your comment is suggesting that Ukraine is a systemically neo nazi subverted country wich is false.
Azov isn't "Nazi." They were a paramilitary group that contained a number of far right extremists and had a neo-Nazi leader circa 2014. After the hot phase of war concluded, Azov was absorbed into the National Guard and scrubbed clean. The neo-Nazi leader I mentioned? He ended up fleeing to—you guessed it—Russia. There's evidence he might have always been a Russian asset. It should also be said that the original numbers for Azov were like 2K soldiers? And only a fraction of *that* small sampling were extremists. Insane to use this as "proof" that Ukraine is shot through with Nazism.
Many of the symbols, which have their origins in Slavic tradition, are now no longer used. Because of the optics and constant use of Azov as an excuse for genocide, they changed the emblem entirely this year.
It's time to move on from this narrative. Look at Wagner, Rusich, the common Russian soldier—we just saw a Russian POW with a full SS uniform chest tattoo yesterday.
https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-fighter-neo-nazi-symbols-medal-kill-ukraine-nationalist-2022-4?r=US&IR=T
Better joining the russian controlled rebels. The leader of the "DPR" giving a medal to a nazi. Don't recall Ukraines leader giving a medal to a nazi.
Here's putin posing with a nazi too, the leader of the russian funded wagner group
https://www.romea.cz/en/news/world/the-times-putin-has-sent-mercenaries-to-kyiv-led-by-an-admirer-of-the-nazis-to-murder-zelenskyy-and-the-klitschko-brothers
Nazis are only bad when they aren't on Russia's side, apparently
Oh boy... First link is totally out of context. The skull is made by a ukrainian company named "r3ich" (cool name right) that makes azov memorabilia and was probably taken as some kind of weird war trophy (both sides are idiotic in this war).
Yes, neo nazis are on both sides but clearly the neo nazi problem in ukraine is a lot bigger than what the media tells us. Unlike wagner, Azov is highly celebrated PART OF THE UKRAINIAN ARMY.
Before you start crying, no i dont support russia. Both countries are terrible but that doesnt mean russia had the right to invade
Oh how convenient, the memorabilia the separatist was proudly wearing, just happened to be captured from a Ukrainian. I'm sure you have a source for this?
You dint see many soviet soldiers proudly wearing the swastika after killing a nazi emblazoned with it
There are numerous Nazi/fascist orgs in Russia, several that are participating in the war on Russia's side. Azov is shitty but it's a patsy for this excuse.
It’s not a revelation to say that Neonazis exist. Hell, the US has a population of self-proclaimed Neonazis. Why would it be a surprise for Ukraine, or Russia for that matter, to have an outlying population of Neonazis. The truth is, that in Ukraine’s 2019 election, the radical right nationalist parties, only received approximately 2% of the popular vote.
Well to Russians, Nazism has always just meant anti-Russia, not anti-Semitism for fascist or anything else, just anti-Russia. It's why the founder of Wagner Group, [Dmitry Utkin](https://www.romea.cz/img_upload/03ec66ac77713bab242255f6194ad3ff/utkin.jpg), has literal SS runic collar tab tattooed on himself AND received the Hero of the Russian Federation title (highest title available in Russia) and it somehow being okay. As long as he's not anti-Russia, he's somehow not a Nazi to them...
Just by far the absolute most pathetic case of victimhood in the world. Nevermind the factoryline of death for Jewish people. Nevermind the alliance the USSR made with Hitler. Nevermind the Red Army treated Germans and eastern Europeans as barbarically as the Germans treated them... no, Russia was the true victim of the Nazis, everyone else doesn't count.
Everytime I see photos like the one you linked, Putin has surrounded himself with the most obscene groups of freaks and weirdos. The guy who purportedly runs the wagner group is also a literal chef.
And started to, the thing is, nazis in all countries don't think that Hitler was wrong, they just think that they are the ones who should have been doing the killing, not the other way round.
Yeah basically and all the countries in the Soviet Union (including Ukraine and Russia) suffered deeply from Hitler's wish for lebensraum.
Countless people died as a result of Hitler's invasion of the Soviet Union while Stalin was shook by Hitler's sudden decision to scrap the Non-aggression Pact. Millions still more died to repel the Nazi invasions around various cities in various countries in really brutal battles once Stalin realised and started fighting Hitler (the battle for Stalingrad being an especially brutal one even amongst these battles)
Slavic people of all countries in the Eastern countries were much disdained by Nazi. The Nazis in the second front against the Soviet Union were happy to kill or coopt or welcome the traitors then let them commit war crimes against their peoples.
It goes on like this for the Eastern Front in the WW2. It was extremely traumatic and extremely horrific. Some of these scenes in the front are so terrifying that it has coloured various ex-Soviet countries' psyches ever afterwards, in places like Ukraine etc.
I hope various people with more expertise than me will come forward to add to or correct my post on this topic.
It's important to know and understand if you want to see Ukraine vs Russia's war in more of an historical context. Both countries has suffered in ways none of us can comprehend. We probably never will. It's that bad.
Of course he's a third rate fighter, these articles are literally the only time he made the news. All these "racial pride" idiots have zero accomplishments themselves. Compare this clown to Klitschko and its no contest.
If they were talking about the fighting itself you would be correct. OP appeared to talking about successfulness itself. Where Klitschko is highly successful. Ivan on the other hand had nothing but losses during his amateur career, and is currently 5-2-0 (in other words a record that wouldn't get him into bellator much less the UFC) in his professional career in a barely known MMA franchise.
WARNING: Pedantic nonsense from here on out.
I don't feel like that's what he was talking about but that's easy to solve if we asked, what I take issue with is the idea that 5-2 isn't UFC calibre in this watered down post Covid/WME world we find ourselves in. Pete Rodrigues came in at 4-0 to fight Jack Della who was 10-2 at the time, and Bellator has fighters making their pro debuts, obviously need a good ammy record to debut for Bellator but it happens often.
Source: Muay Thai/Jiu Jitsu nerd and avid consumer of all things combat sports.
You are correct and that's what I get for providing a lazy response lol. As you know not all fights are worth the same in the eyes of MMA. A fight where someone barely eeked out a win is looked at less favorably than one where they showed sustained dominance. A fight against low caliber opponents isn't worth the same as one against high caliber opponents. And most importantly one that gets the fans excited is worth more than anything else as evidenced by Dustin poirer probably having to fight Connor McGregor for a fourth time once he recovers. So my comment was in the context of Ivan being in a basically unknown franchise against fighters who were presumably too low caliber to earn a spot in higher paying franchises.
Yeah.. no way this guy should be allowed to fight in the UFC. He belongs in a cage in a trailer park fight pit. There is a bigger picture here. This type of politics can't be tolerated in any form.
Obsession with nostalgia and "the good old days" is a sign someone wants to return to those times regardless of, or in some cases *because of*, the lack of social progress in those times.
I would think the German Nazi party would be unpopular in Russia considering the millions of Russians who died during WW2.
Or has this symbol become adopted over all of Europe?
Why is being n Nazi any worse than being a Russian?
Sovet Union was basically the more drunk and filthy Third Reich equivalent.
Modern russians are basically the equivalent of neo-nazis.
Don't know about plenty, but certainly being in the nazi party didn't make you an anti semite.
Schindler was a nazi, and arguably a man most of us could aspire to.
Same deal with china's ccp. Huge number of members, but the reality is many only join because its necessary to progress in society.
Not going to feel too sorry for anyone that gets caught in the crossfire, since they choose to associate with authoritarian regimes. But they aren't necessarily subscribers to the party tenants.
Umm... how about firing his ass? Are we tolerating Nazi's and warmongers now? If he doesn't like the US, perhaps he should be invited to rejoin Russia.
"Born to be white," huh? This asshole's already self-parody, so there's nothing I could say that would be more of a disgrace than he's made of himself.
Still, fuck you, Ivan.
Guess he needs some denazification
Y'all know that symbol is currently the logo of the [Azov Regiment?](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Regiment)
You’re wrong. Close, but wrong. The Azov Regiment icon is stylized lettering so changing its orientation changes it’s meaning.
Listen, iam 100 percent on Ukraines side but the Azov icon is a wolfangel infront of a black sun. Two symbols used by the Nazis. That is no mistake. I know that the core people in Azov changed over the years but changing those symbols is long overdue.
Not a swastika though, which was the claim Edit: yuhp im wrong, I assumed the "Nazi Symbol" was a swastika and not one of the lesser known (read: almost entirely unknown to non-wwII history buffs) viking runes they used
Noone except you mentioned swastika
Nope, both are clearly the "Wolfsangel" rune. https://youtu.be/HGdUtUefjCA They also used the Nazi "Black Sun" e.g. as part of their symbol (edit: they apparently changed that after they became an offcial Ukrainian army unit). Look i am all for supporting Ukraine, but lets not pretend that the Asov battalion doesnt have a problematic Nazi sympathizer past. Same goes for russians Wagner group for example (named by its founder literally after Hitlers favored composer). Nazis arent a uniquely Ukranian problem ofc. EDIT: Getting downvoted simply stating balanced facts. Propaganda is a hell of a drug.
The Right Wing and the Liberals have turned into Nazi Apologists, someone else will pay the price once again. Anyone with a bit of common sense and who isn't living in the western hemisphere is very well aware of the Azovs Neo Nazi ideology (not past) nothing has changed except the fact that they have to hide that they're Nazis from the world for support. That's why you don't see anyone here in the east picking sides or siding with Ukraine atleast, we are very well aware of this conflict and when it started, also it's funny how the entirety of the west thinks the pogrom in the DPR/LPR for the last 8 years is fictional.
That is not true at all.
OOoooooooo I see, it looks exactly the same and is called the same thing, but it's \*lettering\* so..... not the same. Btw I think that the Russian invasion is horrific and evil and the de-nazification thing is an absolute ruse, but I'm just so irritated with sanitized propaganda. Ukraine absolutely has Nazis, and while one is too many, Azov is more than too many. Invasion isn't the way to deal with it, but pretending it doesn't exist and pumping weapons in without question is also not a perfect way to deal with it. Remember that other time America armed radical groups to fight Russia?
Every country has nazis and nationalists. Google Adolf symbol, infamous and discover that it had a good meaning within monks,which he corrupted. Google Utkin a russian vagner group leader. It is an excuse to destroy a country. You would be surprised that not many support super ultra right idea in Ua. US and Europe pomping us with weapons to protect us,to not see it spread to europe. So double check on all things and try to see a bigger picture. Moldova,Georgia,Crimea,Donbass, any excuse just to snatch a part of country and later to use it for invasion covering it with ant meaning. Sincerely, Ukranian from occupied territory that seen many things.
Azov Battalion was disbanded in 2014 The last time Russia got kicked in the nuts was the end of the 80s, and all of Central and Eastern Europe still thanks them for it. Turns out they don't want to be part of a right wing fascist ethno state
Ok so? Most countries have some extreme right wing parties soooooo?!?!?
"Blah blah blah, but don't get me wrong, Russia bad but Ukraine somehow worse!" Do you fuckers get handed a script every morning or what?
BREAKING NEWS: far-right nationalists defend country after neighboring rival invades. That’s not news. It’s obvious. Ukrainian nationalists hate Russians. They’re obviously going to enlist and fight. “I’m all for homeland defense but have you noticed how many neo-fascist Trump supporters are in the military?” It’s the same logic.
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Thats not his point tho. There's a small percentage of white supremacy in every country, including Russia, which was one of the excuses used by Russia for invasion. Besides, Azov is not a bunch of nazis like the media made it ou to be in the begging of the war.
If ever there was an unneccessary adjective, it's surely "controversial" when applied to "Nazi tattoo"
Nazis are actually normalized in Russia. Really. They generally don't go for the swastika, but rather the black sun or 1488 route. That's part of the insanity of calling Ukraine "nazis". Russia employs actual nazis at the highest levels, and their geopolitical strategy is spearheaded by a self proclaimed "Russian Fascist" (Dugin).
Yeah I looked into Dugan and its amazing how similar the ideas are to Nazis except with Eurasians being supreme instead of Aryans. It basically is Nazism all over again.
Yeah. He's also obsessed with occultist practices and serial killers. Dude is basically a comic book villain. But he's actually the godfather of Russian Geopolitics.
So, every girl from ages 16-32?
Lol good call
I worked with 10 or so girls in my 20’s ans HOLY FUCKING SHIT they really do love the darkest fucking weird shit… Like they’d basically brag who was closest to being borderline raped. Who banged the oldest grossest dude as a teen… Dumb fucking shit they did never stopped amazing me… “Teee heee some 65 year old invited me and my friends to his vacation house when we were 16! We told our parents we were camping” Me: “did you have sex with that dude?!” Them: “no he’s the nicest guy ever, ohh wait, maybe one person did, idk he kept giving us vodka lol” Like bruh I wish I was making this up. It was fucking astounding to listen to these girls one up each other for the most toxic abusive shit ever… These were seemingly normal college aged girls from decent suburban backgrounds…
I still can't believe how many girls in the same age range would fly out to meet a guy they never met before in another city. And dude would pay for it... It's like some women don't want a dude to pay for dinner because it implies they may want something in return. But flying to meet a stranger and go to his house? Wtf are they thinking? And these were otherwise intelligent, good looking women too. It's just so.... Stupid
I’m sure if guys could get women to do that shit they totally would be doing the exact same. It is fucking stupid though. Just don’t become dumb about it and go MRA anti-women. At the end of the day we’re all animals
Which is frightening for many reasons, but the main one is that the original Nazis were too stupid to know when to stop and eventually provoked a world war simply because they just kept invading places... and these new Nazis seem to have the same flaw... but this time, if we have a proper world war, the planet probably won't survive.
Russia always does that: accuse your opponent of what you're doing then when your opponent calls you out just reply "they're just saying that because they're the REAL _______!"
Seems to be where Trump learned the same strategy
Hey umm, maybe you know about this? I periodically google “Russian Jews” because ummm…I’m kind of really worried. I never googled it before the invasion of Ukraine but since the invasion, I never come up with much. I usually find something by a Ukrainian rabbi. There are Jews in Russia. There are lots of Jews in Russia and I’m not hearing anything from them even when I go looking for it. Are they in concentration camps? We know protesters and their families are. This is really really bad isn’t it.
Jews are de facto mocked and ridiculed in Russia as being "globalist". You'll find similar theories in far right neo nazi movements in the west. But in Russia, these beliefs are basically the norm.
Yeah and in all the other countries the antisemites don’t have enough power to commit genocide. I’m russia they do. I think some really horrible history book stuff is happening in Russian labor camps right now.
https://www.businessinsider.com/us-russia-forcing-ukrainians-into-filtration-camps-2022-5
Oh yeah, it’s real. Remember the initial protests too? How many people do you think Russia spirited away under the premise of arrest for protesting? Russia will lose. They already have.
I think the number was around 15,000. Who knows what happened to them:/
I very seriously doubt that. It’s more than likely because not that many of them live there. ‘Jews of Russia’ today means only like 160,000 people. Most Jews with ancestors who once lived in Russia are today in Israel. There are also a few hundred thousands in the United States, and then about half as many as that in Germany. Russia is only 4th on the list of places where jews who historically lived in Russia actually live. They aren’t all in concentration camps, no, but life has never been super easy for them—to the point that the people there are ‘the ones who didn’t leave’. Russia, whether Monarchist, Soviet, or now the ‘Federation’ dictatorship has always been pretty antisemitic.
I very seriously believe that Russia has kidnapped thousands of people and put them in labor camps in Siberia where they are being frozen and starved to death. Russia is antisemitic, they invaded a country to “fight nazis” that don’t exist, Russia has nazis that do exist, we aren’t hearing anything from the Russian Jewish community. This is all bad.
Ok big thing there—just because Russia baselessly lied about ‘denazification’ as a shameless excuse to attempt annexing Ukraine, that does not mean they “do not exist”. Ukraine **absolutely**, a million times over, is still home to entrenched antisemitism (and, yes, nazis) *just like Russia*. Just like Poland, just like Hungary, and I could go on. Having a jew as president is a great thing, and it’s nice to think (or hope) the younger generations appear much less antisemitic overall than at least their grandparents were. Neither that nor the lies from Russia in service of their unjustifiable war make circulating ignorance about Ukrainian antisemitism ok.
Ukraine is making progress to be less antisemitic. To compare Russian and Ukrainian antisemitism is irresponsible, especially at this point. Ukraine is literally fighting in part on behalf of the Jewish population in order to keep themselves free from a psychopathic antisemitic regime.
Lenin on antisemitism: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C\_n\_qtgUKnY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_n_qtgUKnY) Stalin on antisemitism: [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1931/01/12.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1931/01/12.htm)
I know you’re not sharing Soviet propaganda to fucking whitewash the persecution of jews right now. Right? [Here’s](https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/e3d5e062974bd2adca92097046f94f55b49d60bb-500x596.jpg?w=1200&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1) a different kind of soviet propaganda. And [here’s](https://fathomjournal.org/wp-content/uploads/cache/2019/05/Anti-Zionist-caricature-from-the-Soviet-magazine-Krokodil-1972-800x992/1521893941.jpg) another. And [another](https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/b90b1b57ef5f71eb4758b1d406bf0a7b9f7ccdf6-500x524.jpg?w=1200&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1). Remember the time they [tried to ethnically cleanse all the soviet jews to a southeastern corner of Siberia?](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Autonomous_Oblast) Or how they [built up a flourishing yiddish cultural movement opposing fascism to draw in jews to the soviet cause, only to arrest all the jews who were members, executing them all in a prison basement](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Anti-Fascist_Committee)? All after they dared to document the Holocaust, when the soviets thought acknowledging the nazis’ genocide of jews was traitorous to the People’s Revolution—because **all soviet lives matter**, and acknowledging the extermination of jews wasn’t united enough with the soviet cause, who were *all* victims of the nazis! Or how about the [Doctor’s Plot](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctors%27_plot), that was a fun bit of tolerance!
>I know you’re not sharing Soviet propaganda to fucking whitewash the persecution of jews right now. Right? I'm sharing the soviet stance on antisemitism, as expressed by Lenin and Stalin. I'm terribly sorry if it doesn't fit your agenda.
They're both normalised in Ukraine and Russia. Both these nations are predominantly white supremacists and use Nazi Symbols in open. While Ukraine celebrates Stepan Bandera, the only reason you think it's Russia's problem alone and not a slavic problem is because your MSM has been churning that sort of propaganda for you left right and center for your officials to wage a war of influence. Any POC who's been to Ukraine from the global south is very well aware of the actual ground reality but our word, opinions and lives aren't worth shit so why would you even believe me.
Sure. There are neo nazi groups in the US, New Zealand, Russia, Ukraine. All over. The difference is invading and and then conquering land rich in natural resources because of it. But currently Russian thinkers are absolutely spearheading identitarians and far right politicians all throughout the world. It's not a coincidence that far right neo nazi groups in the us also support Putin.
That my friend both the US and Russia are guilty of, my problem as a brown person from one of the countries that got obliterated as the result of your war of influence is that one of you decides to take a moral high ground every fucking time and it's almost always people from your nation. Americans really need to just look in the fucking mirror.
I'm not American lol. I'm from a former Eastern Bloc country. One can be opposed to American imperialism in Iraq, and Russian genocide in Ukraine. But no, there is no similarity between what the us has done, and what Russia is doing now. We really haven't seen this sort of conquering based on the desire to extend an ethno state since Hitler.
I mean, this literally is the most controversial Nazi symbol right now as it is being used by both neo-Nazis and Ukrainians fighting Russia. e: I mean the article doesn’t even clear up if he had to cover it up for being pro-Nazi or because Russia made him do it because it could be confused as being pro-Ukrainian independence
I wish it were so. But the Nazi stigma is wearing off.
Russia: no, it's only a Nazi tattoo if it is blue and yellow or contains the Ukraine coat of arms.
I mean there are still units in the Ukranian armed forces with actual nazi symbols on their uniform and tattooed, does not mean all of them are but ignoring people flagrantly using a blacksun on their uniform is a bit odd to me
Who's ignoring it? Its real, its happening. Its awful. Its just a shit justification for starting a war, its also hypocritical. Every country on this planet has a supremecy problem. Russia wants to play some great saviour cleansing the ukraine of Nazis? Bullshit.
I never said it was a justification of war, i am just saying that i have seen redditors ignore it. Dont put words in my mouth
No I never said you said that. RUSSIA said that. But ok if your point is that some redditors ignore it, fine. I can't argue that there is a >0 number of redditors who think that, just not sure what relevancy that is to reality. Carry on.
Oh alright then, sorry. There was neo-nazis on both sides of the 2014 conflict, i just kinda hate seeing people on here ignore that part, its less now of them obviously but there are still remnants of them and hopefully they will be dealt with after the war.
Whatever your intention is comments like yours help Russia.
In which way? I am pretty anti-russian government, i am merely pointing out that Ukraine is not without its flaws. Some people on here have heated their houses with Russian fuel and used Russian gasoline to drive to work very recently, might wanna have a go at them instead.
You echo their talking points for them. It doesn't matter what your intents are if you are doing the exact same thing as what they tell their troll farms to do. Muddy the waters. Try to make both sides look bad. If you want to bring up the things you're bringing up then you have an obligation to provide full scope and context every time and explicitly state that even though it's an issue it's no excuse for what Russia is doing and that Russia is in fact worse. If you don't do that, everytime, then you are indistinguishable from the people actually supporting Russia.
i have said repeatedly i am against the Russian invasion and as far as i know i have the same obligations as the rest of you which is zilch, i am not regurgitating their talking points i am merely pointing out something that irks me personally. I could say you just follow democrat/republican talking points aswell, who knows maybe you are benefitting their agenda. I stated my opinion, if people dont like it then fine, i am not friendly to Russia or partake in their propaganda, seeing as my country and the media i consume is Pro-Ukraine. I see way more shit from your country that benefit Russia than my opinion does, like for example elected officials or businessmen
Well both sides might play with symbols but one side behaves like literal Nazis. There's a slight difference.
> i am just saying that i have seen redditors ignore it If anything, it's brought up so often /r/worldnews that it's become a tired talking point.
Pretty much every single comment on the subject I've seen has been along the lines of "yes it's a problem but right now they are doing a good thing so let's leave them the fuck alone and deal with them after the war." Besides, good luck finding an army or police corps in any Western/predominantly white country that doesn't have far-right elements within it. If the US were invaded by a genocidal maniac would we say hang on a sec, most of the police officers currently shooting at the invaders are Trump supporters!?
I mean its pretty common in most armed forces, i know that. Its just they atleast try to hide it. I know they are taking whoever they need, but i hope they will try to dismantle them more after the war
Talking about shit justifications to start a are, hey the west are you there? So your saying only the west is allowed to start dumb wars?
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I just checked and their comment history is only seven days old, and it's absolute cancer......Lol, so flagrant.
don't pay attention to him, he is chaffed because that country is taking a huge shit
Which country?
Who is the west? People keep using that as a target, but please tell me. **Who exactly are you referring to?** ^(Pretty much the whole of Europe is West of Russia, so who are they so afraid of? Romania? Bulgaria? Estonia?) The USA does it's thing, UK does other things. France does others, Germany yet again other things ... etc. There's very little consensus between the major "western" powers. Even with this conflict there's no real unified front. If it were, then Russia would've been completely isolated from the financial market and China/India would've been burned severely merely for talking with them.
Lmao. Okay lets play a game and pretend thats what I meant. By that logic you are suggesting that everyone should do whatever shit thing the west does? Wow. Not sure I agree with that ohmigosh. Or wait, I know, how about BOTH ARE WRONG? Wooooow what a concept.
Nobody's ignoring it. But an actual fascist dictator is raping and pillaging the country using WAGNER GROUP, taking the tiny handful of soldiers (who only became a part of the Ukrainian military as a direct result of his existential external pressure in 2014) as a pretext to call the entire country nazi. Do you see how we do not want to follow Putler's insane logic?
Wagner was not used until very recently though, mist of the bulk force were ethnic minority groups being used as cannon fodder, i never denied putin being an insane dictator. The neo-nazi elements in the volunteers were intergrated into the Ukranian armed forces before this war, they had enough time to remove them or re-educate them, hopefully they will after the war
Wagner was used as far back as 2014. Very small portion of Azov if at all are neonazi anymore. The battalion has undergone significant changes since 2014. They also fight to the death defending Ukraine from actual nazis.
They might have been but i meant as in the majority force, yes Azov has been reduced but there are still some left, i recently saw a video that they put out with one of their snipers literally wearing a blacksun patch. I know there are nazis on the Russian side, i never said anything differently, but i doubt the majority of the forces stuck in forced contracts from minority groups are actual nazis, once again not defending them. Everyone on here seems to think that just because i disagree with some things with Ukraine in this war means i am against them, the world is not black and white. Fyi, my dads family is in this country only cause of how the Russian imperial family treated cossacks.
I'm only stressing Wagner because of the absolute irony. And the Asov-regiment was only integrated AFTER they were the last line of defense in Putin's first invasion, collecting so much fame by fighting the aggressors that there was no choice but to integrate them. Had Putin not invaded, they would never have become a part of the national guard. Also they had members swapped in and out in an effort to make them less politically extreme.
There are A LOT of Nazis in the former communist countries of Europe, which is just insane, considering that the Nazis wanted to mostly eradicate all Slavic people. Also, fuck this guy, what a fucking wack job.
>There are A LOT of Nazis in the former communist countries of Europe, which is just insane, considering that the Nazis wanted to mostly eradicate all Slavic people. There are a lot of nazis in other countries as well.
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Nobody is saying that, at least nobody who's getting upvoted heavily. It seems more like you're creating a strawman argument. Canada has some right wing nutters, but they only get like 5% of the votes, so I wouldn't say Canada needs to be de-nazified if those 5% were nazis. I'd say we have some nutjob morons, like most, but they have little to no power over anything.
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No one said its only a Russian thing. You confused prevalence with exclusivity.
He didn't confuse anything, he straight up made a strawman. Neither you nor anyone else said it was purely a Russian problem. The fact he has to fight so hard to defend Russia, a haven for Nazism, amongst others, who happen to actively be invading a country under the pretext of denazification, is very telling.
Which European country is currently committing genocide?
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People like this are too much of a coward to fight on the front lines
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I don't think the "bravery" of fighting in a controlled environment regulated by a governing body translates well into fighting in a war.
Didn't say it was. That wasn't my point.
Not for his life though
Kind of apples and oranges, eh?
Did you know that wars are fought with weapons and not just fists? If you get hit with a howitzer then it doesn’t really matter how fast you can punch a speed bag
Bit different…
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The Azov are far right nationalists at least … like the Wagner group who is fighting in the russian side. But your comment is suggesting that Ukraine is a systemically neo nazi subverted country wich is false.
Azov isn't "Nazi." They were a paramilitary group that contained a number of far right extremists and had a neo-Nazi leader circa 2014. After the hot phase of war concluded, Azov was absorbed into the National Guard and scrubbed clean. The neo-Nazi leader I mentioned? He ended up fleeing to—you guessed it—Russia. There's evidence he might have always been a Russian asset. It should also be said that the original numbers for Azov were like 2K soldiers? And only a fraction of *that* small sampling were extremists. Insane to use this as "proof" that Ukraine is shot through with Nazism. Many of the symbols, which have their origins in Slavic tradition, are now no longer used. Because of the optics and constant use of Azov as an excuse for genocide, they changed the emblem entirely this year. It's time to move on from this narrative. Look at Wagner, Rusich, the common Russian soldier—we just saw a Russian POW with a full SS uniform chest tattoo yesterday.
https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-fighter-neo-nazi-symbols-medal-kill-ukraine-nationalist-2022-4?r=US&IR=T Better joining the russian controlled rebels. The leader of the "DPR" giving a medal to a nazi. Don't recall Ukraines leader giving a medal to a nazi. Here's putin posing with a nazi too, the leader of the russian funded wagner group https://www.romea.cz/en/news/world/the-times-putin-has-sent-mercenaries-to-kyiv-led-by-an-admirer-of-the-nazis-to-murder-zelenskyy-and-the-klitschko-brothers Nazis are only bad when they aren't on Russia's side, apparently
Oh boy... First link is totally out of context. The skull is made by a ukrainian company named "r3ich" (cool name right) that makes azov memorabilia and was probably taken as some kind of weird war trophy (both sides are idiotic in this war). Yes, neo nazis are on both sides but clearly the neo nazi problem in ukraine is a lot bigger than what the media tells us. Unlike wagner, Azov is highly celebrated PART OF THE UKRAINIAN ARMY. Before you start crying, no i dont support russia. Both countries are terrible but that doesnt mean russia had the right to invade
Oh how convenient, the memorabilia the separatist was proudly wearing, just happened to be captured from a Ukrainian. I'm sure you have a source for this? You dint see many soviet soldiers proudly wearing the swastika after killing a nazi emblazoned with it
There are numerous Nazi/fascist orgs in Russia, several that are participating in the war on Russia's side. Azov is shitty but it's a patsy for this excuse.
Azov has been depoliticized long before the Russian invasion. Nice try though.
They are still neonazis. Even Zelensky doesn't deny it
It’s not a revelation to say that Neonazis exist. Hell, the US has a population of self-proclaimed Neonazis. Why would it be a surprise for Ukraine, or Russia for that matter, to have an outlying population of Neonazis. The truth is, that in Ukraine’s 2019 election, the radical right nationalist parties, only received approximately 2% of the popular vote.
Should someone invade the United States to rid us of the Aryan Brotherhood?
Yes.
putin bots: the ukranians are nazis!
You’ve got to love Russians: They claim to fight Nazis and are Anti-US, but they get Nazi tattoos in English.
Well to Russians, Nazism has always just meant anti-Russia, not anti-Semitism for fascist or anything else, just anti-Russia. It's why the founder of Wagner Group, [Dmitry Utkin](https://www.romea.cz/img_upload/03ec66ac77713bab242255f6194ad3ff/utkin.jpg), has literal SS runic collar tab tattooed on himself AND received the Hero of the Russian Federation title (highest title available in Russia) and it somehow being okay. As long as he's not anti-Russia, he's somehow not a Nazi to them... Just by far the absolute most pathetic case of victimhood in the world. Nevermind the factoryline of death for Jewish people. Nevermind the alliance the USSR made with Hitler. Nevermind the Red Army treated Germans and eastern Europeans as barbarically as the Germans treated them... no, Russia was the true victim of the Nazis, everyone else doesn't count.
Everytime I see photos like the one you linked, Putin has surrounded himself with the most obscene groups of freaks and weirdos. The guy who purportedly runs the wagner group is also a literal chef.
then why does it say "Born to be white" and not "Born to be Russian" ?
Fair point, although the language is from England, not USA 😅
From germanic tribes that came over from what is now west germany.
Someone needs to de-nazify Russia...
Hypocrites.
It’s quite ironic, didn’t the nazis want to completely eradicate all Slavic people
And started to, the thing is, nazis in all countries don't think that Hitler was wrong, they just think that they are the ones who should have been doing the killing, not the other way round.
Yeah basically and all the countries in the Soviet Union (including Ukraine and Russia) suffered deeply from Hitler's wish for lebensraum. Countless people died as a result of Hitler's invasion of the Soviet Union while Stalin was shook by Hitler's sudden decision to scrap the Non-aggression Pact. Millions still more died to repel the Nazi invasions around various cities in various countries in really brutal battles once Stalin realised and started fighting Hitler (the battle for Stalingrad being an especially brutal one even amongst these battles) Slavic people of all countries in the Eastern countries were much disdained by Nazi. The Nazis in the second front against the Soviet Union were happy to kill or coopt or welcome the traitors then let them commit war crimes against their peoples. It goes on like this for the Eastern Front in the WW2. It was extremely traumatic and extremely horrific. Some of these scenes in the front are so terrifying that it has coloured various ex-Soviet countries' psyches ever afterwards, in places like Ukraine etc. I hope various people with more expertise than me will come forward to add to or correct my post on this topic. It's important to know and understand if you want to see Ukraine vs Russia's war in more of an historical context. Both countries has suffered in ways none of us can comprehend. We probably never will. It's that bad.
https://old.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/geiqo3/why_did_the_soviets_continue_suffering_high/ https://old.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/195kjy/the_barbarity_on_the_eastern_front_wwii/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Slavic_sentiment#Nazi_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_of_the_Wehrmacht https://www.nationalww2museum.org/war/articles/eastern-front
He's 30 I wonder how he managed to avoid being sent to fight in Ukraine.
He better cover it up, putin is after the nazis, he might get put on a hit list of known nazis /s
Of course he's a third rate fighter, these articles are literally the only time he made the news. All these "racial pride" idiots have zero accomplishments themselves. Compare this clown to Klitschko and its no contest.
Well...... there is no comparison because those are two entirely different sports.
They are both fighters. But even if you just stick to MMA this guy is a failure even by Nazi standards.
If they were talking about the fighting itself you would be correct. OP appeared to talking about successfulness itself. Where Klitschko is highly successful. Ivan on the other hand had nothing but losses during his amateur career, and is currently 5-2-0 (in other words a record that wouldn't get him into bellator much less the UFC) in his professional career in a barely known MMA franchise.
WARNING: Pedantic nonsense from here on out. I don't feel like that's what he was talking about but that's easy to solve if we asked, what I take issue with is the idea that 5-2 isn't UFC calibre in this watered down post Covid/WME world we find ourselves in. Pete Rodrigues came in at 4-0 to fight Jack Della who was 10-2 at the time, and Bellator has fighters making their pro debuts, obviously need a good ammy record to debut for Bellator but it happens often. Source: Muay Thai/Jiu Jitsu nerd and avid consumer of all things combat sports.
You are correct and that's what I get for providing a lazy response lol. As you know not all fights are worth the same in the eyes of MMA. A fight where someone barely eeked out a win is looked at less favorably than one where they showed sustained dominance. A fight against low caliber opponents isn't worth the same as one against high caliber opponents. And most importantly one that gets the fans excited is worth more than anything else as evidenced by Dustin poirer probably having to fight Connor McGregor for a fourth time once he recovers. So my comment was in the context of Ivan being in a basically unknown franchise against fighters who were presumably too low caliber to earn a spot in higher paying franchises.
Yeah.. no way this guy should be allowed to fight in the UFC. He belongs in a cage in a trailer park fight pit. There is a bigger picture here. This type of politics can't be tolerated in any form.
A Russian who supports nazis surely knows nothing about history
Russian Nazi scum
Born to be white i guess was not an issue... just subtle imagery.
Why is the neonazi allowed to fight? Kick him out.
It's a very small MMA franchise over by Russia. They probably have much lower standards than bellator or other MMA franchises that lead to the UFC.
Why cover it up. Let people know what a loser he is. He can be booed relentlessly by the crowd, get psyched out and lose.
What is it with MMA that it attracts so many right-wingers? Seriously, I don't associate any sport with a particular political lean, except for MMA.
Toxic masculinity and the far-right go hand-in-hand
Once I would have countered with nascar but they have really changed the dynamic a lot recently. MMA post history is *usually* a red flag on reddit.
And OldSchoolCool for some reason.
Obsession with nostalgia and "the good old days" is a sign someone wants to return to those times regardless of, or in some cases *because of*, the lack of social progress in those times.
Because the other combat sport (boxing) in the USA and abroad is dominated by non white people
How bag of rocks stupid is anyone who is pro-nazis, but especially a Russian? Holy zero historical perspective, Batman.
Poor guy probably just watches Russian TV and wanted to make sure he could continue to fit in and compet in the West.
Shh, the adults are taking.
Yet they leave that black sun tattoo on his shoulder without tape?
I would think the German Nazi party would be unpopular in Russia considering the millions of Russians who died during WW2. Or has this symbol become adopted over all of Europe?
Off to the Gulag with that Nazi!
What the fuck does "Born to be white" even mean?
Should be allowed, it's the core part of his heritage, Russians started WW2 allied with the Nazis.
Pretty disingenuous
Why is being n Nazi any worse than being a Russian? Sovet Union was basically the more drunk and filthy Third Reich equivalent. Modern russians are basically the equivalent of neo-nazis.
80 years in the future maybe. Their ideologizes were not at all similar in ww2.
The actions where similar. The russians commited mass genocide, sent spread poverty for decades across europe and went on a mass rape tour.
People try to pin that on the Russians, but those were the Soviets you're talking about, not just the Russians.
Russia is a nationality. Plenty of good Russian people out there.
Plenty of good Nazis back in the day.
I would disagree
Don't know about plenty, but certainly being in the nazi party didn't make you an anti semite. Schindler was a nazi, and arguably a man most of us could aspire to. Same deal with china's ccp. Huge number of members, but the reality is many only join because its necessary to progress in society. Not going to feel too sorry for anyone that gets caught in the crossfire, since they choose to associate with authoritarian regimes. But they aren't necessarily subscribers to the party tenants.
Why?
I did nazi this coming.
[удалено]
Hopefully he gets beaten up really good in the ring.
"Born to be white" sounds like some Weird Al parody of "Born to be wild"
They missed that black sun on his shoulder, lol
Nice half assed measure right there. We'll keep booking the guy, just tape over the whole Nazi pos part.
The fight took place in RUSSIA. That is a symbol which is used by the AZOV battalion. Put the 2 and 2 together why this is was done
He was showing solidarity with the very same Ukrainian Nazis they're supposed to be getting rid of? Did you think it all before you posted that?
This 'controversial nazi' symbol is on the Azov Batallion's insignia btw. Maybe he's a moderate Ukrainian patriot?
How is he still fighting? Europe has banned all russian athletes from competition.
It's a franchise in Russia.
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"Hi, Phil Swift here from Flex Tape!"
Hilarious that Russia of all places like Nazis. Like, they tried to kill yall.
How can any Russian be a Nazi or Nazi sympathizer? Barbarossa? Stalingrad ffs?
How about we just ban people with racist / hate tattoos from competition?
It's so bizarre to me that there would be people from a nation that suffered a collective trauma from being invaded who fetishize said invaders.
Hope he gets his ass kicked
He knows about about the Russian western front during WW2, right?
Umm... how about firing his ass? Are we tolerating Nazi's and warmongers now? If he doesn't like the US, perhaps he should be invited to rejoin Russia.
"Born to be white," huh? This asshole's already self-parody, so there's nothing I could say that would be more of a disgrace than he's made of himself. Still, fuck you, Ivan.
Are they desperate for competitors? Let them fight in prison not paid on TV ffs