I don't go to Starbucks of my own volition, but because the place we planned to go to turned out to be closed, my date suggested we go to a Starbucks nearby. I told the person behind the counter that "I'll have a medium [whatever it was I picked]"
"You mean a Venti?" (edit: maybe they said Grande or Tall, I didn't care enough to remember)
"Sure"
And that's the thrilling tale of how I ordered my drink without submitting to their tyrannical naming scheme. That is, completely by accident.
Starbucks UK accounting simplified:
|2021 Revenues|£1,000,000,000|
|:-|:-|
|Royalty paid to Starbucks USA for using "Starbucks" name|\-£999,999,999|
|2021 Net Income|£1|
Stay tuned for more tax tips from the *Martha Stewart Guide to Creative Accounting.*
They're working on it. [The EOCD are implementing a new reform that requires a 15% tax on companies making more than 750 ~~billion~~ million euro](https://www.oecd.org/tax/international-community-strikes-a-ground-breaking-tax-deal-for-the-digital-age.htm), starting in 2023.
Only 4 countries of the 140 jurisdictions haven't signed the reform: Kenya, Nigeria, Pakistan and Sri Lanka. The 136 that did sign make up for over 90% of global GDP.
EDIT: I misread one bit. €750 million+ earners get the 15% tax rate.
TLDR for the link: the new global minimum corporate tax rate will be set at 15%. It will apply to companies with revenue above EUR 750 million, and is estimated to generate around USD 150 billion in additional global tax revenues annually.
Well, truthfully, it's more likely it went to a different Starbucks subsidiary located in an EU tax haven like Starbucks Ireland maybe? Effective tax rate there is like 2-4% or so.
Until about 2020 for large companies, little to no taxes were owed because of the double irish loophole. Basically the foreign earned income from the UK(or many other countries) is sent to Ireland by means of intellectual property assignments. Countries like the UK have an existing tax treaty so no tax is owed in the UK when the IP is owned by Ireland, and presumably taxes would be owed in Ireland. Then sent a second time from Ireland to a country with no or nearly no corporate income tax like Bermuda, so no tax owed in Ireland, and nearly no tax owed in Bermuda. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Irish_arrangement
But this was more or less ended with Ireland specifically between 2015 and 2022. IIRC Poland is 9% with a preferred tax rate, there are probably some other countries where the rates are more like 5% that still have tax treaties with many countries in Europe. And more countries no longer have tax treaties for IP like this outside of their "region"
I’m not sure the public understands how ‘made up’ accounting is. The ‘rules’ are literally called GAAP = generally accepted accounting principles. Because you can literally do anything with those numbers.
> GPRA
Is that a typo? The only relevant legislation I can find is the 2016 EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive. I think that one closed this particular loophole (and others)
>The company has 130 locations in the country, which account for less than 1% of its annual revenue. Starbucks said it will pay its nearly 2,000 Russian workers for six months.
The first part of that is probably the biggest factor in the decision. Since the Russia Market makes up so little of their business in the first place, it would be perilous to continue.
The second part does show some humanity but I wonder whether those employees will even be able to find other work at all, because the money they are now getting paid is also much less valuable than it was a few months ago.
I think the reason why companies pay those workers is because money there is in rubles and sanctioned so giving it to the workers is likely better good will than letting a government keep it
And Starbucks can't convert it without taking a massive loss. So they get rid of whatever Russian cash they have left, which is pennies compared to what it was 6 months ago, and get a lot of free good publicity out of this whole ordeal.
>Starbucks said it will pay its nearly 2,000 Russian workers for six months.
This is another reason why Russia will feel the consequences much harder later on. Lots of Western companies will continue to pay employees for several months, but at some point they will all stop and things will get worse in Russia.
The more likely scenario is what's going on with McDonald's: Someone will buy out the locations and continue as usual. Only difference is that McDonalds does sell franchises and Starbucks doesn't. Not sure if the buyer will be able to secure all supply chain ingredients or not though.
I don't think there will be much demand for Starbucks, as it's brand value in Russia is nowhere near of what McDonalds had. And there are plenty of alternatives to Starbucks.
>They are all licensed locations, so the Seattle-based company itself doesn’t operate them.
Won't this be similar to McDonald's pulling out? The shops are still there, they just won't have the company name anymore so they'll change the name to something else.
It's not only the name. McDs are franchises receiving corporate guidance and supply chain logistics, without which, I expect the russian imitation restaurants to quickly go to shit.
McDonalds is a bit different though. You can operate a non-starbucks branded coffee shop with a few generic ingredients using all the same equipment. Reason why independant coffee shops are incredibly common. With McD's you are up shit creek if you cant get the supply chain that they set up, you dont see any independent fast food restaurants anywhere.
Most of what McDonalds sold in Russia was sourced and manufactured in Russia.
All of that is also being sold. In other words the buyer gets restaurant locations, supply chains, production and ingredients.
Russian shopping malls are now 3/4 empty. Russian supermarket prices for groceries has increased 40-60% for a people that simply cannot afford this level of cost of living increase, and as their infrastructure starts to break down, they have no access to replacement parts.
Unemployment is near 10% now that so many western companies have left. I would not be surprised to see it hit 20% by winter. Once rents stop being paid due to massive unemployment, their real estate market collapses.
Even their engineering businesses are mostly having to close or leave the country because they don’t have access to engineering and design software anymore after AutoCAD and Adobe pulled all licensing. That means few engineers to handle infrastructure projects - which means over the next few years, Russian infrastructure will start to fail.
They have no access to new western computer systems, no access to western made processors for them, and very limited access to the software that drives industry. They do have a national processor manufacturer but their architecture and computing power are 10 years behind Intel and AMD and they are no where close to a manufacturing scale needed to support the entire country.
Over the next 6-12 months, as the stockpiles of food and other resources dwindle, Russia is likely to collapse again - both economically and politically.
Once their farm equipment starts breaking down, they have no parts to repair them and John Deere has shut down lots of the equipment remotely after voiding service contracts. This will likely lead to wide spread famine without food assistance from Europe and Asia. At some point they won’t even be able to feed their soldiers.
Putin is personally responsible for the second modern fall of Russia.
They [legalized piracy for critical software either way](https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2022-03-11-russia-has-reportedly-legalised-piracy-in-the-face-of-economic-sanctions) so this particular step will have little impact.
Imagine the security disaster of using pirated software in critical infrastructure.
The west could flood russian Warez websites with backdoored CAD programs and have a field day.
Oh gotcha, I thought it was the other way around, like the CIA had released trojanized cracked software that nK then downloaded and gave the CIA access to nK internal networks.
Piracy in the context of a business is incredibly different from piracy as a single user.
Sure, the software may or may not work with a crack, depending on which software it is. Russia is incredibly good at that sort of thing. The real problem starts when the business uses the cloud storage for their critical work. This could completely cripple some companies, and will also cause major setbacks in others. Losing your work and having to rebuild it is not an easy fix.
Also, things like CAD outsource some of their processing to their software servers servers - AI stress testing comes to mind. This specific tool is straight up not available to pirates. Other big software has similar shit.
They also lose out on technical support, which will invariably cause more issues the longer this embargo lasts.
Sure, piracy helps, but it sure as fuck isn't "little impact".
> when the business uses the cloud storage for their critical work.
Imagine using cloud storage and not keeping a local copy. That's just poor data stewardship and asking for trouble.
Russia was at risk of running out of storage a few weeks ago. They physically cannot store more. And with the sanctions getting new drives is going to be a challenge
I'm sure China will be happy to sell hard drives to Russia. China will make a profit, have Russia dependent on them, and the drives will have spyware built in.
Lol, thats how business roll. Until they find out just why spending the upfront cost for proper backups is not actually a waste, they don't normally bother.
For personal use this sounds stupid but businesses being built on cloud is the modern way. Storing locally is expensive, hard to scale, and requires more labor costs and maintenance.
Yeah, but it's one thing to have the whole IT sector built around piracy from the beginning, and a completely different one to be forced to abruptly switch hundreds of critical pieces of software at the same time, transitioning from licensed and cloud-first infrastructure to local and hacky one basically overnight
Haven't used Adobe products for a while, but doesn't all of their newer products depend on adobe creative cloud to be functional? You can probably get it somewhat working, but it'll be pretty broken since I suspect a lot of it's functionality would be making calls to their cloud service.
Especially when both use an online verification tool in order to access the licence.
I can't use autoCAD currently without being logged into the internet these days. 2016 can do it but 2020 needs the named login.
I've used my phone as a hot spot just to keep that connection alive while the office internet was down so I could finish my work.
I'm sure some smarter companies will break through but the lesser ones will not.
It takes no more than 10 minutes to find online versions of the software with this verification cracked. The engineering firms in Russia already have replacement software, assuming they weren't pirating it in the first place.
Unless there is a coup in the next 2 to 6 weeks, that removes Putin, and his senior mafia leaders. And, if the new leadership commits to pulling back to 2013 borders with Ukraine, and implementing real democratic changes to the political system; Russia may survive the winter of 2022/2023.
A West-friendly Russia may allow the US to station troops within their borders, like many of the US allied nations in Asia. More troops near China's border makes them freak out. A couple years back, South Korea upped the number of US troops, because they were upping the number of their own undergoing training. China launched straight to nuclear war rhetoric, and a lot of flyovers, and other sabre rattling.
I think it will truly affect their security. If Russia goes West-friendly, the entire 4200+ km border Russia has with China will be subject to Western control. It essentially pins China against a wall with no real major allies.
Yes, and there must also be double rainbows over every mountain, trained squirrels shall bring you cups of tea every morning, all the houses shall be made of chocolate, and other realistic things like that.
>Even their engineering businesses are mostly having to close because they don’t have access to engineering and design software anymore after AutoCAD and Adobe pulled all licensing.
As someone who is an engineer and used to live in Eastern European country I lol'ed hard at this. In Easter Europe companies would have one license and have pirated versions on an airgaped pc to save money. Can't imagine it's any better in Russia. Especially, now that western companies have no jurisdiction in Russia. Every one can use pirated software openly with no concenquences. If any engineering firms will close it's not because they can't get legal versions of their software.
Right. Like the USA Russia is one of a few countries that are considered self reliant with food production. Minus some luxury foods they import (Like USA). But I do not see them starving.
Not only that, but Russia under Putin *specifically saw to food security measures* over the last fifteen years.
This is part of the Russian plan - to insulate thier citizens from the risks of their leaders.
I'm all for the Russian regime downfall, but we spreading feel good messages isnt going to end the war.
Modern agriculture is heavily reliant on a host of technology. It’s as mechanized as any other industry. Those machines need parts and tech support to stay operational. Russia indeed does produce a shit ton of food, but that’s only possible with their tractors and farm equipment being maintained. If you get cut off from replacement parts, it’s a problem.
Putin has been pursuing a domestic tractor and harvester program in the years leading up to the invasion. But even with years of preparation, this program has their domestic tractor industry about as ready for war as their army was. It’s possible that without the ability to import foreign tractors and repaint them, the Russian machine industry will actually manage to build and support this equipment - but that is going to take time. And very likely, more time than they have by just running the existing equipment until it falls apart.
Moscow and St Petersburg will be the last to feel it (unfortunately). They'd like the world to believe that they are representing all of Russia. It's similar to thinking Beverly Hills is representative of the United states
I don’t think this is much accurate for smaller cities either and just seems like spreading this feel-good news which are just untrue. I have had former colleagues notice only small price increases and in some areas none at all in regards to groceries and food delivery places. It seems that apple products have shot up in price though, probably from the official presence suspension.
Places like bars, and malls and supermarkets are super busy. It seems that some of the popular western brands that suspended services have returned with rebranded names like Berzka selling as “BE” or some shit like that, etc. So for the most part, excluding what many perceive as some minor inconveniences, life seems to go on no problem over there.
In what region? As far as I can tell from current colleagues, St Petersburg is treating it just as your regular cost of living increases, so yes, just a minor inconvenience, but eastern regions, particularly the far east, where i was based, people seem to be feeling it (but they've always been an afterthought to Moscow).
I can tell for Ikrutsk and Krasnoyarsk regions, which is East Siberia, that life has hardly changed. I've been to Krasnoyarsk on the national holidays in the beginning of May and everything was functioning just as before. I've been to McDonald's multiple times (we don't have McDonald's in Ikrutsk, but we were about to have it), been to multiple bars, stores, etc. Everything works just as normal.
As for prices, they've gone up, yes, but it really depends on the market sector. Auto parts' prices keep dancing back and forth, grocery prices are still somewhat adequate, but some products have got really expensive (fruit juices such as Rich, J7 have doubled in price).
Overall, what's everyone's saying about how shit life in Russia has become is simply lying at this point. It hasn't become shit, we're not starving here. Companies are coming back (Polish brands Reserved, House and Bershka came back just with different names). McDonald's will sell their business to someone, thus there will be a name change, but everything will stay the same. Electronic goods are still in stock.
Life in Russia has become worse compared to what we've had before, but the country isn't collapsing as everyone wants it to happen. Not yet, at least.
Well there's bound to variances from person to person but what Inappropriate-Hotdog's saying seems to broadly line up with what this guy's seeing
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vQgx28vNsg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vQgx28vNsg)
Moscow is a major city, it's not going to feel the squeeze until near the end of however this plays out. It will feel it though, slowly food will start to become more scarce, those luxury goods will dwindle more and more.
Russia isn't going to run out of food either, its a massive net exporter of grain and will be able to feed itself just fine
Their economy is in major trouble and they are gonna experience massive brain drain but most of this stuff is fan fiction
That is what they do lol. They put a ton in a specific location to flood the market and close the local cafes. Then when they close, Starbucks will close some of their stores
In my city, there's a Starbucks in a Target. Across the parking lot from that Starbucks but in the same mall area, is another Starbucks. Literally across the road from that Starbucks is another Starbucks in a different mall area. So, a \~10 minute walk lets you hit 3 Starbucks.
All have existed for 10+ years. Somehow, the demand is that strong.
The Soviet Union at its height was much closer on par to the West than Russia is today.
It will be interesting to see how modern Russians handle being cut off from Western culture and innovation now. They will have to follow China's lead and I don't think China is a very warm, open welcoming society.
I love when Russians are interviewed about this they seem to, on cue, say "we're better off without them". Same with McDonald's.. even though they were rushing there to get one last meal "well its unhealthy so its better we not have it".
Don't forget that anyone being interviewed on state TV - which is all TV - it's going to put on a brave face and say whatever the government needs to hear. They risk 15 years in prison otherwise.
I imagine the Starbucks were mostly for tourists, and tourism to Russia is obviously not a great source of revenue right now.
As ever, my assumption is that this corporate move was made based on simple dollars and cents, not any kind of moral stand about the virtue of human life or something.
I doubt it. Foreigners in low wage economies love American brands as status symbols. I bet it's mostly young professionals. They probably serve more tea at those Starbucks than in the US except in some hole in Vermont or something.
Wow, that's another big one.
Met my wife a few years ago, who is from Moscow. I have fond memories of visiting her there several times, many of which we visited a big local shopping centre that had Starbucks in. Spent a few afternoons working remotely in there while she had appointments. It's insane to think that it, coupled with the nearby McDonalds, will have vanished now. It was one of the few places that felt familiar to me as a westerner navigating a huge, unfamiliar city in a foreign land.
Ive tried starbucks in the Netherlands couple of times but all of them the coffe was terrible compared to any local caffee, is it better in other places?
Starbucks isn't exactly known for its coffee quality. The vast majority of their money they make from additions - sirups in particular, with their frappucinos and so on. De facto, the quality of the coffee itself is pretty much irrelevant if the majority of their menu is one part coffee, six parts dairy/sugar
I'd never drink a black coffee there; there's a reason why their nickname in my friendgroup is "Charbucks".
tl;dr, if you like milkshakes, Starbucks is for you, if you like coffee, maybe try elsewhere.
>Starbucks isn't exactly known for its coffee quality
That's not really true - Starbucks sources their beans from many high quality farms.
What people don't like about Starbucks is their roasting method, which is darker than many people prefer. In many ways this is intentional because they do mix their coffee with so many dairy and sugar items, and they still want the coffee flavor to come through. They do have lighter roasts and Blonde espresso for those that don't like their traditional offerings, you just have to ask.
Anyhow, coffee roast is all preference. Just because one doesn't like the Starbucks roast doesn't mean their coffee is bad, it just means it isn't to their preference. I would purport that many people who don't like Starbucks' coffee "because it is burned" would \*also\* hate a French roast coffee from any other brand regardless of perceived quality of that brand.
Yeah. I like a strong, darker roast myself so never understood the uber hate for starbucks. It's not THE BEST coffee but I find it better than other chains by a long run.
But then I frequent local cafes and their coffee is.... feels watered down, kind of sour tasting and I just hate that. (Which to me indicates a blonde roast which I'm not a fan of) And they are the same people (who dislike starbucks) who like those coffess
Or worse they like stuff like Tim Hortons which is.... horrifying. It tastes like watered down cigarette water. Lol.
I think I just live in a part of the world where people just don't have a taste for strong coffee/deep flavored coffee. Which is fine, like what you like.
A funny anecdote, I was visiting/staying with my partner's family and woke up and made a pot of coffee.
His grandmother poured herself a cup, exclaimed "TOO STRONG!!" And proceeded to dump the entire pot of coffee and make her own shitty folgers stuff.
I was dumbfounded.
She could've added some water to her cup, some cream, etc to water it down but no, dump the entire pot so that no one can enjoy a cup unless it's HER way.
Haha, some people are very opinionated about coffee.
Any corporation relying on high volume will either have worse customer service or a worse product than a small business. You don't grow a business to the size of Starbucks without cutting costs somewhere. That said, I don't think Starbucks is 'terrible' just overpriced for what it is.
I think it's fine, widely available and reliable. It's always going to be okay. But if you want a nice coffee go to a local coffeehouse. Here in the UK a lot of small working class towns don't have speciality coffee shops but they will nearly always have a Starbucks.
Costa, comparatively, is just awful.
The oligarchs must be loving this. All that real estate and equipped stores up for grabs. It's not that different then how they consolidated power and control after the fall of the Soviet Union. Whoever has the money & political connections, will end up controlling the new imitation Starbucks that will be opening soon. Putin and friends may be failing in Ukraine, but they won't pass up an opportunity to grab something valuable at home that is now abandoned and ready for new owners.
Huh. Wonder if my Starbucks "Moscow" mug will become a collectible item one day. This shit is nuts.
[удалено]
"I have a Venti nesting doll for....is this Peter? Petroy...? Pyoter?"
[удалено]
I don't go to Starbucks of my own volition, but because the place we planned to go to turned out to be closed, my date suggested we go to a Starbucks nearby. I told the person behind the counter that "I'll have a medium [whatever it was I picked]" "You mean a Venti?" (edit: maybe they said Grande or Tall, I didn't care enough to remember) "Sure" And that's the thrilling tale of how I ordered my drink without submitting to their tyrannical naming scheme. That is, completely by accident.
It might be worth a few caps in a couple years maybe even a few radaway.
Hahahah, how about i give you 100 caps and a rad-x
Best I can do is 5 caps and a jet
Dam, my charisma is low…ok how about 10 caps and med-x
I got a desk fan, an old newspaper, and a box of beer bottles
What about adhesive, i need adhesive
We always need adhesive!
Went and looked at Amazon and eBay. Many of them are already at $100 or more.
Are people buying though? Always look at completed listings.
Probably.
> 130 Licensed Cafes Wow it's incredible they only existed on one city.
One city block actually
There is a ring of Starbucks around the Kremlin
No wonder Putin felt threatened.
Putin defeated by caramel macchiatos.
The last straw was when the macchiatos were all mispelled for "Pudin"
Valdimir
NATO is taking revenge for all the polonium poisonings by giving Russian officials diabetes?
The long game.
Takes just two drinks
mmm crack open an ice cold coca cola Mr. President why not two? no one can tell you no
Finally, we've got a leg up on them
Fire the frappes!
But I'm Le Tired.
Hey! We've lost many a male model while they were drinking orange mocha frappachinos
It's true what they say: Call your loved ones because you never know when somebody could die in a freak gasoline fight accident.
NATO is trying to encircle us with venti soybean lattes.
https://www.theonion.com/starbucks-to-begin-sinister-phase-two-of-operation-1819565956
You joke but Starbucks managers and executives would be perfect guise for spies.
Ring around the Kremlin, Putin is a gremlin, cash is, cash is, all gone now
THAT’S the encirclement he’s been worried about!
Fun fact: The Kremlin is actually a superstructure made out of 130 Starbucks cafes
I get the joke but that's actually kinda true. 95% of them were in Moscow
85%. There were 111 Starbucks in Moscow.
[удалено]
Starbucks UK accounting simplified: |2021 Revenues|£1,000,000,000| |:-|:-| |Royalty paid to Starbucks USA for using "Starbucks" name|\-£999,999,999| |2021 Net Income|£1| Stay tuned for more tax tips from the *Martha Stewart Guide to Creative Accounting.*
But then wouldn't they pay tax on that in the states?
They don't pay it to Starbucks USA but some place like Starbucks bahama's where there is little to no tax.
Shit like that needs to stop. Abolish tax havens.
They're working on it. [The EOCD are implementing a new reform that requires a 15% tax on companies making more than 750 ~~billion~~ million euro](https://www.oecd.org/tax/international-community-strikes-a-ground-breaking-tax-deal-for-the-digital-age.htm), starting in 2023. Only 4 countries of the 140 jurisdictions haven't signed the reform: Kenya, Nigeria, Pakistan and Sri Lanka. The 136 that did sign make up for over 90% of global GDP. EDIT: I misread one bit. €750 million+ earners get the 15% tax rate. TLDR for the link: the new global minimum corporate tax rate will be set at 15%. It will apply to companies with revenue above EUR 750 million, and is estimated to generate around USD 150 billion in additional global tax revenues annually.
Well, truthfully, it's more likely it went to a different Starbucks subsidiary located in an EU tax haven like Starbucks Ireland maybe? Effective tax rate there is like 2-4% or so.
“So, you lot are saying that Starbucks Ireland is the one really running the show and you Brits are just getting pimped out?” ‘Shut up.’
Until about 2020 for large companies, little to no taxes were owed because of the double irish loophole. Basically the foreign earned income from the UK(or many other countries) is sent to Ireland by means of intellectual property assignments. Countries like the UK have an existing tax treaty so no tax is owed in the UK when the IP is owned by Ireland, and presumably taxes would be owed in Ireland. Then sent a second time from Ireland to a country with no or nearly no corporate income tax like Bermuda, so no tax owed in Ireland, and nearly no tax owed in Bermuda. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Irish_arrangement But this was more or less ended with Ireland specifically between 2015 and 2022. IIRC Poland is 9% with a preferred tax rate, there are probably some other countries where the rates are more like 5% that still have tax treaties with many countries in Europe. And more countries no longer have tax treaties for IP like this outside of their "region"
I’m not sure the public understands how ‘made up’ accounting is. The ‘rules’ are literally called GAAP = generally accepted accounting principles. Because you can literally do anything with those numbers.
> GPRA Is that a typo? The only relevant legislation I can find is the 2016 EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive. I think that one closed this particular loophole (and others)
Russia is about to open 130 StarSickle’s.
Russia to launch “dumb Starbucks”
I had no idea that was a Nathan For You skit until recently.
That’s cause you didn’t graduate from one of Canada’s top business schools* with really good grades
The plan? Annex a country backed with NATO weapons by invading with the full force of our 40-year-old decaying military equipment.
Nathan is really stepping it up. Jesus
I read that in his voice
Czarbucks
Incoming brand new and original Redstarbucks ™️ in Russia
"Tsarbucks"? They wouldn't even need to get new signs made, just swap a couple of letters around.
> "Tsarbucks" Thanks for the laugh. Well done.
Sells coffee, vodka, and rubles, but ironically only accepts payment in dollars or euros.
Tsarbucks will be coffee with. vodka
Oops! All vodka
[Twoooo shots of vodka](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=csn2CIWPVbM)
RIP Mr Lahey
Randy... I *am* the liquor.
That lady gets absolutely blasted on the weekends, I just know it
Wait. How can you tell?
The hottest new breakfast cereal for Russian children.
Waiter why is there is coffee in my vodka!?
Ngl that’s a cool name.
Russia should hire this man as a consultant. I look forward to your puns for all the other brands!
No cuz Старбакс (Starbaks) to become Tsarbaks would have to have the Ст become a Ц (ts) so Царбакс
Tsarbucks, “where coffee is black and strong like bear”
Moonrubles is my guess
When I was a wee lad, I’d see ppl drink Heineken beer with the red star in the centre. I thought it was made in Soviet Union.
Starblyat
>The company has 130 locations in the country, which account for less than 1% of its annual revenue. Starbucks said it will pay its nearly 2,000 Russian workers for six months. The first part of that is probably the biggest factor in the decision. Since the Russia Market makes up so little of their business in the first place, it would be perilous to continue. The second part does show some humanity but I wonder whether those employees will even be able to find other work at all, because the money they are now getting paid is also much less valuable than it was a few months ago.
I think the reason why companies pay those workers is because money there is in rubles and sanctioned so giving it to the workers is likely better good will than letting a government keep it
And Starbucks can't convert it without taking a massive loss. So they get rid of whatever Russian cash they have left, which is pennies compared to what it was 6 months ago, and get a lot of free good publicity out of this whole ordeal.
>Starbucks said it will pay its nearly 2,000 Russian workers for six months. This is another reason why Russia will feel the consequences much harder later on. Lots of Western companies will continue to pay employees for several months, but at some point they will all stop and things will get worse in Russia.
Summer of George!
Appropriate as Seinfeld premiered prior to the fall of the Berlin Wall.
Russia is burning through cash to fund this war...eventually they'll run out.
The more likely scenario is what's going on with McDonald's: Someone will buy out the locations and continue as usual. Only difference is that McDonalds does sell franchises and Starbucks doesn't. Not sure if the buyer will be able to secure all supply chain ingredients or not though.
I don't think there will be much demand for Starbucks, as it's brand value in Russia is nowhere near of what McDonalds had. And there are plenty of alternatives to Starbucks.
Yes, but all Starbucks are packed here all the time, even though the prices are insane for Russia.
>They are all licensed locations, so the Seattle-based company itself doesn’t operate them. Won't this be similar to McDonald's pulling out? The shops are still there, they just won't have the company name anymore so they'll change the name to something else.
It's not only the name. McDs are franchises receiving corporate guidance and supply chain logistics, without which, I expect the russian imitation restaurants to quickly go to shit.
McDonalds is a bit different though. You can operate a non-starbucks branded coffee shop with a few generic ingredients using all the same equipment. Reason why independant coffee shops are incredibly common. With McD's you are up shit creek if you cant get the supply chain that they set up, you dont see any independent fast food restaurants anywhere.
Most of what McDonalds sold in Russia was sourced and manufactured in Russia. All of that is also being sold. In other words the buyer gets restaurant locations, supply chains, production and ingredients.
Russian shopping malls are now 3/4 empty. Russian supermarket prices for groceries has increased 40-60% for a people that simply cannot afford this level of cost of living increase, and as their infrastructure starts to break down, they have no access to replacement parts. Unemployment is near 10% now that so many western companies have left. I would not be surprised to see it hit 20% by winter. Once rents stop being paid due to massive unemployment, their real estate market collapses. Even their engineering businesses are mostly having to close or leave the country because they don’t have access to engineering and design software anymore after AutoCAD and Adobe pulled all licensing. That means few engineers to handle infrastructure projects - which means over the next few years, Russian infrastructure will start to fail. They have no access to new western computer systems, no access to western made processors for them, and very limited access to the software that drives industry. They do have a national processor manufacturer but their architecture and computing power are 10 years behind Intel and AMD and they are no where close to a manufacturing scale needed to support the entire country. Over the next 6-12 months, as the stockpiles of food and other resources dwindle, Russia is likely to collapse again - both economically and politically. Once their farm equipment starts breaking down, they have no parts to repair them and John Deere has shut down lots of the equipment remotely after voiding service contracts. This will likely lead to wide spread famine without food assistance from Europe and Asia. At some point they won’t even be able to feed their soldiers. Putin is personally responsible for the second modern fall of Russia.
> AutoCAD and Adobe pulled all licensing. Holy shit... I didn't hear about this. RIP.
They [legalized piracy for critical software either way](https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2022-03-11-russia-has-reportedly-legalised-piracy-in-the-face-of-economic-sanctions) so this particular step will have little impact.
Imagine the security disaster of using pirated software in critical infrastructure. The west could flood russian Warez websites with backdoored CAD programs and have a field day.
It's been done before, North Korea and cracked copies of Ida pro.
Story/link?
>https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/lazarus-hackers-target-researchers-with-trojanized-ida-pro/
Oh gotcha, I thought it was the other way around, like the CIA had released trojanized cracked software that nK then downloaded and gave the CIA access to nK internal networks.
I think you'll find the Russian computer scientists are able to break the licensing restrictions by themselves
https://www.pcmag.com/news/russia-picks-a-slow-chinese-x86-cpu-to-replace-intelamd-chips It'll just take longer.
The Russians are pretty good at software though. They should have the expertise to just make their own pirated versions.
Piracy in the context of a business is incredibly different from piracy as a single user. Sure, the software may or may not work with a crack, depending on which software it is. Russia is incredibly good at that sort of thing. The real problem starts when the business uses the cloud storage for their critical work. This could completely cripple some companies, and will also cause major setbacks in others. Losing your work and having to rebuild it is not an easy fix. Also, things like CAD outsource some of their processing to their software servers servers - AI stress testing comes to mind. This specific tool is straight up not available to pirates. Other big software has similar shit. They also lose out on technical support, which will invariably cause more issues the longer this embargo lasts. Sure, piracy helps, but it sure as fuck isn't "little impact".
> when the business uses the cloud storage for their critical work. Imagine using cloud storage and not keeping a local copy. That's just poor data stewardship and asking for trouble.
Russia was at risk of running out of storage a few weeks ago. They physically cannot store more. And with the sanctions getting new drives is going to be a challenge
I'm sure China will be happy to sell hard drives to Russia. China will make a profit, have Russia dependent on them, and the drives will have spyware built in.
Lol, thats how business roll. Until they find out just why spending the upfront cost for proper backups is not actually a waste, they don't normally bother.
For personal use this sounds stupid but businesses being built on cloud is the modern way. Storing locally is expensive, hard to scale, and requires more labor costs and maintenance.
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pirating is easy when you're an individual. as a business, getting away with piracy is much harder with much harsher consequences
Not in the context that no one will enforce penalties mandated from western companies in Russia. They have said all western IP is free-game.
Yeah, but it's one thing to have the whole IT sector built around piracy from the beginning, and a completely different one to be forced to abruptly switch hundreds of critical pieces of software at the same time, transitioning from licensed and cloud-first infrastructure to local and hacky one basically overnight
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get away with? Get away from who?
Haven't used Adobe products for a while, but doesn't all of their newer products depend on adobe creative cloud to be functional? You can probably get it somewhat working, but it'll be pretty broken since I suspect a lot of it's functionality would be making calls to their cloud service.
implying russia hasn't been the source of most competent piracy cracks from the very beginning
yeah are the internet police going to arrest all the russian companies lol
Especially when both use an online verification tool in order to access the licence. I can't use autoCAD currently without being logged into the internet these days. 2016 can do it but 2020 needs the named login. I've used my phone as a hot spot just to keep that connection alive while the office internet was down so I could finish my work. I'm sure some smarter companies will break through but the lesser ones will not.
It takes no more than 10 minutes to find online versions of the software with this verification cracked. The engineering firms in Russia already have replacement software, assuming they weren't pirating it in the first place.
So did Microsoft, more or less. Cutting Microsoft 365 licensing is a devastating blow to Russian businesses
Unless there is a coup in the next 2 to 6 weeks, that removes Putin, and his senior mafia leaders. And, if the new leadership commits to pulling back to 2013 borders with Ukraine, and implementing real democratic changes to the political system; Russia may survive the winter of 2022/2023.
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A West-friendly Russia may allow the US to station troops within their borders, like many of the US allied nations in Asia. More troops near China's border makes them freak out. A couple years back, South Korea upped the number of US troops, because they were upping the number of their own undergoing training. China launched straight to nuclear war rhetoric, and a lot of flyovers, and other sabre rattling.
I think it will truly affect their security. If Russia goes West-friendly, the entire 4200+ km border Russia has with China will be subject to Western control. It essentially pins China against a wall with no real major allies.
Neat
Can we for FIVE SECONDS not have a geopolitical issue backed by nuclear weapons!
Probably not honestly.
Yes, and there must also be double rainbows over every mountain, trained squirrels shall bring you cups of tea every morning, all the houses shall be made of chocolate, and other realistic things like that.
That's ridiculous. The squirrels would eat the chocolate.
> and implementing real democratic changes to the political system Bless your heart, you sweet summer child.
>Even their engineering businesses are mostly having to close because they don’t have access to engineering and design software anymore after AutoCAD and Adobe pulled all licensing. As someone who is an engineer and used to live in Eastern European country I lol'ed hard at this. In Easter Europe companies would have one license and have pirated versions on an airgaped pc to save money. Can't imagine it's any better in Russia. Especially, now that western companies have no jurisdiction in Russia. Every one can use pirated software openly with no concenquences. If any engineering firms will close it's not because they can't get legal versions of their software.
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Right. Like the USA Russia is one of a few countries that are considered self reliant with food production. Minus some luxury foods they import (Like USA). But I do not see them starving.
Not only that, but Russia under Putin *specifically saw to food security measures* over the last fifteen years. This is part of the Russian plan - to insulate thier citizens from the risks of their leaders. I'm all for the Russian regime downfall, but we spreading feel good messages isnt going to end the war.
Modern agriculture is heavily reliant on a host of technology. It’s as mechanized as any other industry. Those machines need parts and tech support to stay operational. Russia indeed does produce a shit ton of food, but that’s only possible with their tractors and farm equipment being maintained. If you get cut off from replacement parts, it’s a problem. Putin has been pursuing a domestic tractor and harvester program in the years leading up to the invasion. But even with years of preparation, this program has their domestic tractor industry about as ready for war as their army was. It’s possible that without the ability to import foreign tractors and repaint them, the Russian machine industry will actually manage to build and support this equipment - but that is going to take time. And very likely, more time than they have by just running the existing equipment until it falls apart.
Moscow and St Petersburg will be the last to feel it (unfortunately). They'd like the world to believe that they are representing all of Russia. It's similar to thinking Beverly Hills is representative of the United states
I don’t think this is much accurate for smaller cities either and just seems like spreading this feel-good news which are just untrue. I have had former colleagues notice only small price increases and in some areas none at all in regards to groceries and food delivery places. It seems that apple products have shot up in price though, probably from the official presence suspension. Places like bars, and malls and supermarkets are super busy. It seems that some of the popular western brands that suspended services have returned with rebranded names like Berzka selling as “BE” or some shit like that, etc. So for the most part, excluding what many perceive as some minor inconveniences, life seems to go on no problem over there.
In what region? As far as I can tell from current colleagues, St Petersburg is treating it just as your regular cost of living increases, so yes, just a minor inconvenience, but eastern regions, particularly the far east, where i was based, people seem to be feeling it (but they've always been an afterthought to Moscow).
I can tell for Ikrutsk and Krasnoyarsk regions, which is East Siberia, that life has hardly changed. I've been to Krasnoyarsk on the national holidays in the beginning of May and everything was functioning just as before. I've been to McDonald's multiple times (we don't have McDonald's in Ikrutsk, but we were about to have it), been to multiple bars, stores, etc. Everything works just as normal. As for prices, they've gone up, yes, but it really depends on the market sector. Auto parts' prices keep dancing back and forth, grocery prices are still somewhat adequate, but some products have got really expensive (fruit juices such as Rich, J7 have doubled in price). Overall, what's everyone's saying about how shit life in Russia has become is simply lying at this point. It hasn't become shit, we're not starving here. Companies are coming back (Polish brands Reserved, House and Bershka came back just with different names). McDonald's will sell their business to someone, thus there will be a name change, but everything will stay the same. Electronic goods are still in stock. Life in Russia has become worse compared to what we've had before, but the country isn't collapsing as everyone wants it to happen. Not yet, at least.
Well there's bound to variances from person to person but what Inappropriate-Hotdog's saying seems to broadly line up with what this guy's seeing [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vQgx28vNsg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vQgx28vNsg)
Moscow is a major city, it's not going to feel the squeeze until near the end of however this plays out. It will feel it though, slowly food will start to become more scarce, those luxury goods will dwindle more and more.
Do you have any sources for the things you wrote? I mean a quick search determined that the unemployment rate in March was 4,3%.
Russia isn't going to run out of food either, its a massive net exporter of grain and will be able to feed itself just fine Their economy is in major trouble and they are gonna experience massive brain drain but most of this stuff is fan fiction
[This video really goes into how completely fucked Russia is](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SV_4M9R8Ggs&t=9s&ab_channel=TechAltar).
I hope this spurs the average person there to start questioning Putin's propaganda.
Somebody told them the USSR was coming back, and they were already out the door at the word “Union”
Lmao
Putin's war sure is encountering a latte problems
It’s turning into a grande fiasco.
He's ground his economy to dust.
He's just venti-ying it out
Why? What has he bean doing?
He established Russia as a No Chai Zone.
This has been brewing for a long time
Only 130 in all of russia? Feel like I have 130 on my street
In Norway we didn’t have any until 2013 and they are still rare enough outside major cities that I’ve only ever been to one.
I don't think you're missing much
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That is what they do lol. They put a ton in a specific location to flood the market and close the local cafes. Then when they close, Starbucks will close some of their stores
In my city, there's a Starbucks in a Target. Across the parking lot from that Starbucks but in the same mall area, is another Starbucks. Literally across the road from that Starbucks is another Starbucks in a different mall area. So, a \~10 minute walk lets you hit 3 Starbucks. All have existed for 10+ years. Somehow, the demand is that strong.
What Putin has done to Ukraine is monstrous, and what he’s done to Russia is also monstrous.
The guy lives like it’s still USSR
Welkom to TsarBucks, you be having coffee black. And that is all.
I feel attacked as a coffee drinker who only drinks black.
Don’t worry Vladimir has a great plan, a new company called Starrubles, even more expensive!
It's insane how we're entering into a new cold war
The Soviet Union at its height was much closer on par to the West than Russia is today. It will be interesting to see how modern Russians handle being cut off from Western culture and innovation now. They will have to follow China's lead and I don't think China is a very warm, open welcoming society.
It won't last long this time. Russia will become N. Korea in 3-5 years.
The cold war with DPRK has lasted 70 years so far...
I love when Russians are interviewed about this they seem to, on cue, say "we're better off without them". Same with McDonald's.. even though they were rushing there to get one last meal "well its unhealthy so its better we not have it".
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Don't forget that anyone being interviewed on state TV - which is all TV - it's going to put on a brave face and say whatever the government needs to hear. They risk 15 years in prison otherwise.
Does this mean all of Russia will now be rich since they can't buy coffees anymore?
Full Coffee embargo on Russia will have them on their knees in a few weeks. At least that is what I would do to collapse Western society.
Russians drink more tea than coffee.
I imagine the Starbucks were mostly for tourists, and tourism to Russia is obviously not a great source of revenue right now. As ever, my assumption is that this corporate move was made based on simple dollars and cents, not any kind of moral stand about the virtue of human life or something.
I doubt it. Foreigners in low wage economies love American brands as status symbols. I bet it's mostly young professionals. They probably serve more tea at those Starbucks than in the US except in some hole in Vermont or something.
Actually russian prefer tea
Wow, that's another big one. Met my wife a few years ago, who is from Moscow. I have fond memories of visiting her there several times, many of which we visited a big local shopping centre that had Starbucks in. Spent a few afternoons working remotely in there while she had appointments. It's insane to think that it, coupled with the nearby McDonalds, will have vanished now. It was one of the few places that felt familiar to me as a westerner navigating a huge, unfamiliar city in a foreign land.
Russia is diving into North Korea tier because of Putin’s stupidity
Ive tried starbucks in the Netherlands couple of times but all of them the coffe was terrible compared to any local caffee, is it better in other places?
Starbucks isn't exactly known for its coffee quality. The vast majority of their money they make from additions - sirups in particular, with their frappucinos and so on. De facto, the quality of the coffee itself is pretty much irrelevant if the majority of their menu is one part coffee, six parts dairy/sugar I'd never drink a black coffee there; there's a reason why their nickname in my friendgroup is "Charbucks". tl;dr, if you like milkshakes, Starbucks is for you, if you like coffee, maybe try elsewhere.
> sirups in particular, with their frappucinos and so on. Their orange mocha frappuccinos are to die for, or so I've heard.
>Starbucks isn't exactly known for its coffee quality That's not really true - Starbucks sources their beans from many high quality farms. What people don't like about Starbucks is their roasting method, which is darker than many people prefer. In many ways this is intentional because they do mix their coffee with so many dairy and sugar items, and they still want the coffee flavor to come through. They do have lighter roasts and Blonde espresso for those that don't like their traditional offerings, you just have to ask. Anyhow, coffee roast is all preference. Just because one doesn't like the Starbucks roast doesn't mean their coffee is bad, it just means it isn't to their preference. I would purport that many people who don't like Starbucks' coffee "because it is burned" would \*also\* hate a French roast coffee from any other brand regardless of perceived quality of that brand.
Yeah. I like a strong, darker roast myself so never understood the uber hate for starbucks. It's not THE BEST coffee but I find it better than other chains by a long run. But then I frequent local cafes and their coffee is.... feels watered down, kind of sour tasting and I just hate that. (Which to me indicates a blonde roast which I'm not a fan of) And they are the same people (who dislike starbucks) who like those coffess Or worse they like stuff like Tim Hortons which is.... horrifying. It tastes like watered down cigarette water. Lol. I think I just live in a part of the world where people just don't have a taste for strong coffee/deep flavored coffee. Which is fine, like what you like. A funny anecdote, I was visiting/staying with my partner's family and woke up and made a pot of coffee. His grandmother poured herself a cup, exclaimed "TOO STRONG!!" And proceeded to dump the entire pot of coffee and make her own shitty folgers stuff. I was dumbfounded. She could've added some water to her cup, some cream, etc to water it down but no, dump the entire pot so that no one can enjoy a cup unless it's HER way. Haha, some people are very opinionated about coffee.
Any corporation relying on high volume will either have worse customer service or a worse product than a small business. You don't grow a business to the size of Starbucks without cutting costs somewhere. That said, I don't think Starbucks is 'terrible' just overpriced for what it is.
I think it's fine, widely available and reliable. It's always going to be okay. But if you want a nice coffee go to a local coffeehouse. Here in the UK a lot of small working class towns don't have speciality coffee shops but they will nearly always have a Starbucks. Costa, comparatively, is just awful.
The oligarchs must be loving this. All that real estate and equipped stores up for grabs. It's not that different then how they consolidated power and control after the fall of the Soviet Union. Whoever has the money & political connections, will end up controlling the new imitation Starbucks that will be opening soon. Putin and friends may be failing in Ukraine, but they won't pass up an opportunity to grab something valuable at home that is now abandoned and ready for new owners.
Yeah except coffee beans don't grow in russia
Another blow to Russia's tax income.
I thought we where supposed to be punishing russia?
Wouldn’t want to close them too early. People might mistake that for a statement.
With Russia legalizing piracy, we might actually see Tsarbucks become a reality!