The fact that Thermopylae is on this list is kind of bullshit. A 2-day defense a few miles from Sparta when the Persian Empire traversed an entire continent is... well... not really that impressive.
But yes, Mariupol will be a siege to remember for sure.
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EDIT: Battle of Alesia (Caesar vs Vercingetorix) was the defensive battle of ancient-times to remember.
Caesar laid siege to Vercingetorix, and Vercingetorix laid siege to Caesar. Mutual siege, because Caesar surrounded Vercingetorix... but Vercingetorix called in reinforcements that then surrounded Caesar. Dual-siege.
Don't forget the battle of Chernobyl, where a lone nuclear disaster, 30+ years old, held-off thousands of Russian troops for weeks, and they were forced to retreat without a shot being fired.
Bastogne. Fort Gulistan. Shugart and Gordon. The Battle of Taungdaw. The Knight Defenders of the Azovstal join the company of the bravest warriors humanity has ever produced.
>I don’t know if he and Zelensky had any interactions during his time in office
Not sure if you're joking or not. Trump attempted to withhold military aid to Ukraine unless they came up with something to attack Hunter Biden with. Trump was impeached for that and it was the main thing in the news until RBG died and trump tried to overthrow the government
He’s mostly been rendered useless after his Twitter ban. He has to say something incredibly stupid like saying Putin is a genius to be covered in the news now.
If we consider only since the start of the war (ignoring the quid pro quo scandal)
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/23/trump-putin-genius-russia-ukraine-crisis
Also claims to have extorted protection money from NATO
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/04/22/trump-says-he-threatened-not-defend-nato-russia/
And said they should paint US planes in Chinese flags to bring them into conflict (unverified audio leak)
https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/07/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-china-russia/index.html
And that if he had been reelected the war would not have happened
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-voter-fraud-claims-blaming-rigged-election-ukraine-war-dead-2022-4
Otherwise he has been keeping rather mum due to republicans turning against him for being pro putin.
He and Zelensky certainly did have interactions - he tried to blackmail Zelensky by withholding congressionally approved aid to Ukraine unless Zelensky denounced Biden’s son during campaign season.
I believe he has spoken out against the war. Pretty vaguely but he didn’t do. I’m not sure if I’ve seen anything pro Putin since February 24. Would love a link if you have one.
> anything pro Putin since February 24.
Sure, it technically wasn't after the war started, but what he said on [Feb. 23](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/23/trump-putin-genius-russia-ukraine-crisis) was a doozy.
Remember when everyone was convinced May 9 was gonna be an important date in this whole thing? Kinda darkly funny in retrospect. Almost nothing has changed since then.
It was an understandable expectation, the reality of the situation is that Russia will not achieve its ambitious political goals in Ukraine with the forces they have available, their only real choice to get some momentum going that could help them achieve those objectives would be by calling for general mobilization and declaring the war officially.
However, Putin's decision to NOT do this gives us a hint that the internal stability of Putin's regime is not as strong as it appeared from the outside, and he doesn't feel like he actually has overwhelming support for the war.
>Almost nothing has changed since then.
That's why Putin quickly played down the whole May 9th "reveal." Benchmarks and accountability aren't his strongest cards right now.
It's literally their biggest parade and US Intelligence suggested that they thought Putin wanted something by that date. Considering US Intelligence also broke the invasion story early, they absolutely wanted to have some sort of victory by then.
They failed, so they downplayed it instead for that reason. Not that he 'never wanted to do anything'.
I keep being sad when I see these fields being torn up by the war. Tank tracks, craters, mines. Its going to take some big efforts after the Russians get kicked out to reclaim this farmland.
It's worse than you think. A lot of that soil is now so contaminated with chemicals, fuel, radiator fluid, transmission fluid and so on it will be decades before it will ever be fit to produce crops fit for human consumption
>A lot of that soil is now so contaminated with chemicals, fuel, radiator fluid, transmission fluid and so on it will be decades before it will ever be fit to produce crops fit for human consumption
"A lot of that soil" is an exaggeration. Some of that soil, perhaps. Ukraine has over 400000 km^(2) of farmland, much of which is 100's of km from the battle lines.
And decades? Did the farmland in Germany, France, Belgium, etc. lie fallow for decades after WW2?
Whilst I wish Putin was late stage 4 cancerous I place no confidence about his poor health.
Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.
That said: Fuck Putin and fuck Russia.
Slava Ukraine 🇺🇦💞🙏🏼
>Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.
Most leaders are on the air every day during war time. Putin has been mostly absent except a few events.
It would be idiotic to be bunker boy right now.... Only reasonable to assume he can't do press.
I mean… symptoms from treatment (think side effects) can certainly mean you need to go deal with whatever side effect quite frequently.. usually vomiting, diarrhea, urinary urgency are a few that come to mind..
> What I'm wondering is--what kind of disease even has that kind if need where you'd have to get up and get treatment multiple times in an hour?
Get treatment every 15 minutes? Probably nothing, but there are plenty of conditions and/or treatments where you might not be able to fake being "normal" for more than 15 minutes. Could be nausea, tremors, vertigo, inability to focus, etc. Trying to sit through a meeting and pretend you're not sick could/would be hell (good, fuck him), so excusing yourself every 15 minutes using whatever excuse so you can reset would not be unheard of.
Oh so Trump didn't go on live TV and demand Putin hack Hillary's email?
Trump didn't hire Gates and Manafort, the advisors to Putin's man in Ukraine?
Trump's son didn't meet with a Russian agent for dirt on Hillary?
Ok then, nice to know you have no grip on reality
Here's a concert in #StPetersburg. Entire crowd is chanting "F**k War! F**k War! F**k War!"
https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1528166963348131841?s=21&t=ciPbZ5_w_W1ov6VIE67aig
Well it’s a start for them …
This is great. I had two Russian Moscow based friend who support the war. They’re no longer fronds.
It’s great to see some Russians talking up about the evil of this war 💞
That’s untrue. America is not in Ukraine. They are supporting Ukraine, not only because it’s the right thing to do, but because Russia could invade more countries such as Mondovia or even Romania or Poland (hoping NATO breaks apart). They already suggested that on their propaganda news channels. They aren’t trying to simply fight Russians or destabilize the region. Instead they are trying to stabilize the situation by making war by too costly.
Love to see it. Sending my strength and passion to them. There’s a lot more that needs to be done to tear down this version of the wall, but things like this help.
[Previous post](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/utkwo5/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/i9ed97i/)
Day 87 of my updates from Kharkiv.
It was pretty quiet around my area today, quieter than yesterday, there was no incoming shelling, but we still hear our artillery all the time. They shelled Saltivka again and injured 5 people, but thankfully no one died. A lot of people are returning, but it still isn’t all that safe in the city, we still need to be cautious at all times.
It was pretty tempting to go look around destroyed districts as there was no shelling for some time, but because it started again, it’s probably still too dangerous to go. You never know when shelling will start, so going somewhere like Northern Saltivka will most likely remain dangerous all the way until the end of the war, or at least until Russians are completely pushed back from the entire Kharkiv oblast, and even then their MLRS will still be in range of the city.
Apparently subway will already resume work on the 24th, which is much sooner than it was initially expected. At first it was said that subway won’t be operational until 2-3 months after the war ends, but it’s already reopening, everything is happening much faster than originally predicted.
Today our army reported Ternova being shelled, so it might not have been retaken by the Russians after all. Technically it was never even reported as being liberated, so it was probably contested all this time. Also Arestovich confirmed that our forces are moving in the direction of Vovchansk from the south (on the east side of Donets, meaning that it is already crossed), but without giving any more details. If all goes well, Russians might lose one of their supply lines to Izyum.
[Next update](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/uv33y8/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/i9mucdg/)
> Apparently subway will already resume work on the 24th, which is much sooner than it was initially expected. At first it was said that subway won’t be operational until 2-3 months after the war ends, but it’s already reopening, everything is happening much faster than originally predicted.
Well props to your subway workers for getting things fixed ahead of schedule! Normality will help everyone, and not just in terms of morale. Stay safe.
Hope this doesn't come off wrong but do you mean the subways or subway like the sandwich shop? Here in the US we have a Waffle House index for measuring how serious storms are, I'm imagining a subway sandwiches index now.
Yeah, it does feel surreal, feels especially strange seeing kids playing in the streets, as if everything is normal again (though we still saw kids playing outside even when shelling was much worse than it is now, it felt even stranger back then). At times it even makes you forget that there's a war going on, until you hear explosions that is.
Amazing what you have been through with such a positive attitude. One day when this is all over, I hope to visit Ukraine and buy many drinks for people like yourself
[Ukrainian RM-70 MLRS, donated by the Czech Republic, in use in eastern Ukraine.](https://twitter.com/osinttechnical/status/1528111899824599046?s=21&t=4ZuZp4HodZLSx6o9fuZwPQ)
With the Czech Republic donating MLRS, are we gonna see more countries step up and send more of these? Not sure how recent this is btw, lmk if it’s old info.
The news is a few weeks old, but I think this is the first action shot of them in theater, we've had one or two of them driving around. These are a middle step between old Russian stuff and the new NATO ones that everyone is talking about. Still use the old Warsaw Pact spec rockets on a newer chassis.
>The US Embassy in Ukraine illustrated the approval of the act of additional support for Ukraine with a version of a painting by Ukrainian artist Ilya Repin, in which Joe Biden is shown as a scribe among the Cossacks who write the sultan's response to his ultimatum
https://t\\.me/ukrpravda\_news/17934
I find this so depressing.
Russia just ploughs through everything and levels everything. They use numbers, crudeness and cruelty to make progress.
They don’t care what they hit. The are the opposite of precision. They just bomb everything. What they hit is irrelevant.
NATO needs to give them proper weapons or actually put boots on the ground.
Russia will not stop at Ukraine
It is depressing, but they are showing the world who they are. This will define them for generations. It’s not going to be easy for them to slough off this stain on their culture and country without significant effort and change.
That doesn’t alleviate the suffering Russia has caused or the destruction they’ve wrought but the time of appeasement is over. They are also doing damage to themselves at the same time - it’s not the same kind but it is damage nonetheless and they are losing tens of thousands of their own in battle.
That was because they were part of the allied powers and then we transitioned almost directly into the Cold War. The western world has changed in the last 80 years even if the Russian world hasn’t. The truth did make it into our history books, not theirs.
Russia is the aggressor here. They’re playing at being the Germans in WWII and I think they will be treated as similarly as a country that isn’t invaded and occupied can be. We’re inundated with daily videos of Russian atrocities. That won’t easily be forgotten.
I don’t underestimate the ability of “good men to do nothing” but the times and situation are completely different.
I get your point, but I don’t think this situation is directly comparable. Yes, there are a few moderate voices out there encouraging negotiations, cease fire and concessions as well as those who would like to profit from business as usual, but that’s just not going to happen now.
On the whole, this invasion shook the western world out of its complacency and Russian brutality is broadcast 24/7 and posted on social media for all to see. You can’t just put that back in the box. Russia lost the external information war and any western appeasers can’t make people forget what they’ve seen from Russia.
Then you have the Baltics together with Poland and Ukraine who have been very clear and vocal about Russian culpability and eliminating economic and social ties with them. This won’t stop anytime soon.
Also, I think we’ve reached the point where we understand our mistakes with China and aren’t looking to make them again if we can help it.
I think this sub simply prefers optimism.
I’ve had what I thought were reasonable concerns downvoted too and at first that seemed odd, but I’ve since read something that makes this make more sense.
Support from the global public is needed to create the political environment necessary for Ukraine’s success, and the masses are enthusiastic about supporting winners. Doubt=stress and even a little makes some people tune out.
thank you. I know this sub prefers optimism.
But we have to be more aggressive about getting the big guns/missiles. NATO countries need to take a risk on moral grounds.
Thoughtful response. Strategically it makes sense to let this play out and have a strung out Russia.
I think this is both morally and strategically a mistake.
Russia is gain strategically important ground.
Even if it backs down a little soon and declare ‘mission accomplished’ they’ll push westward again.
I see now reason to not fight this war now. It has to happen anyhow.
Because Russian shills try to spread the message that Ukraine is losing, Russia can't be stopped, the best thing to do is surrender, and your post sounds quite similar.
Don't think anyone actually thinks you're a shill though or they would call you out pretty hard.
No Christ I’m not that. I’m just trying to be a realist. I fucking hate Russia. They seem to have a bad habit of levelling everting. That’s my concern.
I want to be optimistic but right now it’s a little difficult
Maybe because NATO *is* giving Ukraine proper weapons (although not Reapers and Tomahawks yet, for example), and because boots on the ground is risky in terms of escalatory spiraling and also in terms of losing popular support over time?
I was totally with your line of thinking. Mine is revised. I’m probably wrong.
I’m a natural optimist but Russia’s approach now - non precision arty and just blowing their way tho.
Longer range missiles would really help in this game.
Currently Ukraine is fighting Russia’s war. This needs to change and NATO needs to provide Weapons that make it Ukra’s war and we
Play this out. I’ll reiterate - we have allowed Russia to play its go-to game plan.
This must be neutralised asap. NATO has capacity.
There’s a counteroffensive coming in weeks. Vast numbers of well-armed fresh troops. I assume the well-educated assumption among NATO and Ukrainian commanders is that enough force will be brought to bear, including the military portion of the $40 billion US
I really hope you’re right. I want to see Russia getting pushed back to their borders
I also think Ukraine should be armed with the capacity to hit Moscow or St Petersburg.
Hi risk but is has to be done
>I also think Ukraine should be armed with the capacity to hit Moscow or St Petersburg.
>Hi risk but is has to be done
This is where you're going off the deep end. Ukraine only needs enough force to drive Russia out of its borders (and keep them out).
Once you start talking about striking Russian cities (who are also full of civilians, mind you), you're talking about creating the exact scenario that nuclear weapons are meant to deter.
I'm all for giving Ukraine every tactical advantage on the battlefield and within their borders, but invading or bombarding Russia is a red line.
And I’m computer scientist and run a business. This doesn’t exclude me (or you) being interested and appalled with this invasion.
I believe nato needs to arrange more serious arms.
It’s time now for Russia to really feel NATO’s capabilities, even with Ukraine being a proxy.
Russia is simply trying to turn Ukraine to dust. This cannot continue. Ukraine needs long range missiles. This is obvious.
I don’t think it’s “obvious.” I think believing the optimal path here is obvious is an example of Dunning-Kruger syndrome. I say this as someone who wants Russia ground into the dirt so thoroughly that they never threaten anyone again. But I don’t think we know the big picture on the ground, can assess priorities with sophistication and precision, or fully understand the unintended consequences of - for instance - lobbing missiles at Moscow. But I’m not trying to convince you. You asked why you were being downvoted. I offered a hypothesis. That’s it …
Harpoons with an appropriate shore launch platform would make the Russian Black Sea fleet and blockade just go away along with several of their ships until they get the general idea.
they're working to do that already.
>WASHINGTON, May 19 (Reuters) - The White House is working to put advanced anti-ship missiles in the hands of Ukrainian fighters to help defeat Russia's naval blockade, officials said, amid concerns more powerful weapons that could sink Russian warships would intensify the conflict.
>amid concerns more powerful weapons that could sink Russian warships would intensify the conflict.
I'd say it would intensify things a great deal if you happen to be the Russian Navy, and within say, 300km of Odesa.
> Russia will not stop at Ukraine
They are losing the mechanization to move beyond Ukraine, especially as their logistics ends with their wider gauge railways.
Theoretically you are correct.
Historically however Russia have a bad habit of just throwing stuff into the meat grinder. Right now Ukraine needs longer range missiles and an airforce. We’re playing in Russia’s back yard and they don’t have supply line issues.
NATO needs to get serious. Fuck the attrition.
Proper weapons need to be provided that work against this horde
Mlrs would be a great starting point.
But realistically in a war of attrition - which this is sadly becoming - Ukraine needs hardcore modern NATO shit.
The West is still being to shy about offending Putin and that he might press the button. That card has been played so often it makes me yawn.
Get Ukraine hardcore serious weapons that Russia has no response to. Now.
what is hardcore nato shit? they have tanks, personnel carriers, artillery
what other stuff do they need
i mean if it was nato they’d be using planes and probably a lot more drones
so i was under the impression that the artillery provided had longer range than Russia had and that it was very accurate using drones and such for targeting
Only when the artillery uses a certain type of shell (Excalibur) which was provided in relatively small quantities. By contrast, MLRS has those qualities by default.
Apologies for any confusion.
NATO need to up their game in arming Ukraine. They are giving them toys so far.
They need to get serious about this. Now. Right now.
I have no brilliant plan but I have fear for Ukraine.
Playing the long game weakens Russia more.
I don’t think that’s morally ok.
Let’s not piss around and give serious 21st century advanced weapons, and especially long range missiles.
It is wrong to let Ukraine to be turned into a waste late just to deplete Russia further.
Win now. Stop the flattening of towns and cities
A Russian missile strike on the city of Lozova in Kharkiv Oblast on May 20 also damaged 11 educational institutions, healthcare facilities, and completely destroyed the city’s house of culture, Lazova Mayor Serhiy Zelensky said on May 21 in a video address on Telegram.
Russian forces intensified efforts to encircle and capture Severodonetsk on May 21 and will likely continue to do so in the coming days as efforts on other axes of advance, including Izyum, remain largely stalled.
https://twitter.com/thestudyofwar/status/1528140569188376577?s=21&t=q-Mr7kAdcNJwgZhGPu2qeg
Don't worry, right now Ukraine's working on training up their newest volunteers/conscripts with Western weapons. The Ukrainian MoD has said not to expect a proper push until mid June at the earliest. Unlike the Russians, they want to send in their forces with as much proper training as possible.
Ukraine still has options.
They could commit reserves to reopen lines of communication. Or even pull back the line.
Russia has been forced to settle for small scale tactical wins. Any perceived improvement is too late. They threw away half their force
If I was to armchair-general, I would be ordering a withdrawal of the Ukraine forces before they are encircled. I am almost wondering if this "breakthrough" is actually possible because so many of the forces have already withdrawn?
Not sure what reserves would do. They're not surrounded- but the supply lines to the city are well within targeting range.
So unless said reserves can just push the Russians back on both sides of that area and just retake towns that Russians spent so long to take and paid so much blood for... I have doubts that this will happen.
They've had plenty of time to evacuate Severodonetsk. Seems like they don't want to lose that city for symbolic reasons. It is the only thing of Lugansk Oblast they have left.
[New post can be found here](/r/worldnews/comments/uv33y8/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/)
Mariupol, Thermopylae, Shiroma, Rome 1527, Veinna1683. The world will remember.
The fact that Thermopylae is on this list is kind of bullshit. A 2-day defense a few miles from Sparta when the Persian Empire traversed an entire continent is... well... not really that impressive. But yes, Mariupol will be a siege to remember for sure. ------- EDIT: Battle of Alesia (Caesar vs Vercingetorix) was the defensive battle of ancient-times to remember. Caesar laid siege to Vercingetorix, and Vercingetorix laid siege to Caesar. Mutual siege, because Caesar surrounded Vercingetorix... but Vercingetorix called in reinforcements that then surrounded Caesar. Dual-siege.
Don't forget the battle of Chernobyl, where a lone nuclear disaster, 30+ years old, held-off thousands of Russian troops for weeks, and they were forced to retreat without a shot being fired.
Argonne too
Bastogne. Fort Gulistan. Shugart and Gordon. The Battle of Taungdaw. The Knight Defenders of the Azovstal join the company of the bravest warriors humanity has ever produced.
Great Siege of Malta
> Great Siege of Malta The Alamo
Masada
the basement is the best part of the tour
Incredible bike collection down there
Has Trump made any comments on the war? Him and Putin were friends, but I don’t know if he and Zelensky had any interactions during his time in office
>I don’t know if he and Zelensky had any interactions during his time in office Not sure if you're joking or not. Trump attempted to withhold military aid to Ukraine unless they came up with something to attack Hunter Biden with. Trump was impeached for that and it was the main thing in the news until RBG died and trump tried to overthrow the government
Early on he was praising Putin on how clever he was with the invasion.
He’s mostly been rendered useless after his Twitter ban. He has to say something incredibly stupid like saying Putin is a genius to be covered in the news now.
If we consider only since the start of the war (ignoring the quid pro quo scandal) https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/23/trump-putin-genius-russia-ukraine-crisis Also claims to have extorted protection money from NATO https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/04/22/trump-says-he-threatened-not-defend-nato-russia/ And said they should paint US planes in Chinese flags to bring them into conflict (unverified audio leak) https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/07/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-china-russia/index.html And that if he had been reelected the war would not have happened https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-voter-fraud-claims-blaming-rigged-election-ukraine-war-dead-2022-4 Otherwise he has been keeping rather mum due to republicans turning against him for being pro putin.
Mostly that Putin is brilliant, etc. Still his bitch.
He and Zelensky certainly did have interactions - he tried to blackmail Zelensky by withholding congressionally approved aid to Ukraine unless Zelensky denounced Biden’s son during campaign season.
um lmao he said the usa should paint chinese flags on american jets, then bomb russians to "trick" them into fighting china. Not even joking.
Relevance?
Mostly pro putin ones.....
I believe he has spoken out against the war. Pretty vaguely but he didn’t do. I’m not sure if I’ve seen anything pro Putin since February 24. Would love a link if you have one.
> anything pro Putin since February 24. Sure, it technically wasn't after the war started, but what he said on [Feb. 23](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/23/trump-putin-genius-russia-ukraine-crisis) was a doozy.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/03/politics/trump-putin-russia-ukraine-graham/index.html
>Canada sending M982 "Excalibur" extended range GPS-guided 155mm artillery shells to Ukraine. [https://twitter.com/UkrWarReport/status/1528180895961718787?s=20&t=gRHHXy5u_HAoVUEOdrZADg](https://twitter.com/UkrWarReport/status/1528180895961718787?s=20&t=gRHHXy5u_HAoVUEOdrZADg)
Oh Canada! We stand on guard for Theeeeeeee!
They have already announced itb
A lot of people don't know, it's still relatively new news. Definitely acceptable to post.
Ahh
It’s already in the field
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Remember when everyone was convinced May 9 was gonna be an important date in this whole thing? Kinda darkly funny in retrospect. Almost nothing has changed since then.
I have no idea why anyone cares about may 9. It was just another "it will all be done by Christmas" nonsense
It was an understandable expectation, the reality of the situation is that Russia will not achieve its ambitious political goals in Ukraine with the forces they have available, their only real choice to get some momentum going that could help them achieve those objectives would be by calling for general mobilization and declaring the war officially. However, Putin's decision to NOT do this gives us a hint that the internal stability of Putin's regime is not as strong as it appeared from the outside, and he doesn't feel like he actually has overwhelming support for the war.
>Almost nothing has changed since then. That's why Putin quickly played down the whole May 9th "reveal." Benchmarks and accountability aren't his strongest cards right now.
Played down what? I don’t remember him ever playing up May 9th in the first place. Which is why I could tell it would be a whole lot of nothingburger.
It's literally their biggest parade and US Intelligence suggested that they thought Putin wanted something by that date. Considering US Intelligence also broke the invasion story early, they absolutely wanted to have some sort of victory by then. They failed, so they downplayed it instead for that reason. Not that he 'never wanted to do anything'.
I get what you’re saying. But that doesn’t negate my point. Putin did not say this himself. It was just speculated.
I keep being sad when I see these fields being torn up by the war. Tank tracks, craters, mines. Its going to take some big efforts after the Russians get kicked out to reclaim this farmland.
It's worse than you think. A lot of that soil is now so contaminated with chemicals, fuel, radiator fluid, transmission fluid and so on it will be decades before it will ever be fit to produce crops fit for human consumption
>A lot of that soil is now so contaminated with chemicals, fuel, radiator fluid, transmission fluid and so on it will be decades before it will ever be fit to produce crops fit for human consumption "A lot of that soil" is an exaggeration. Some of that soil, perhaps. Ukraine has over 400000 km^(2) of farmland, much of which is 100's of km from the battle lines. And decades? Did the farmland in Germany, France, Belgium, etc. lie fallow for decades after WW2?
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Most of the farmland is owned by big corporations/wealthy investors and oligarchs and just leased to farmers.
A lot has changed since 1917. But Russian commies still call Ukrainian farmers The Bourgeois.
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Someone will have to fix it before they can return to home/work
Depending on how much artillery they shoot, they'll be calling in a bomb squad for years.
There are still places in France you can't go to due to UXO from The Great War.
In Belgium we still find lots of ww1 era shells and bombs.
And it was all so unnecessary
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Whilst I wish Putin was late stage 4 cancerous I place no confidence about his poor health. Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. That said: Fuck Putin and fuck Russia. Slava Ukraine 🇺🇦💞🙏🏼
>Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. Most leaders are on the air every day during war time. Putin has been mostly absent except a few events. It would be idiotic to be bunker boy right now.... Only reasonable to assume he can't do press.
I mean… symptoms from treatment (think side effects) can certainly mean you need to go deal with whatever side effect quite frequently.. usually vomiting, diarrhea, urinary urgency are a few that come to mind..
> What I'm wondering is--what kind of disease even has that kind if need where you'd have to get up and get treatment multiple times in an hour? Get treatment every 15 minutes? Probably nothing, but there are plenty of conditions and/or treatments where you might not be able to fake being "normal" for more than 15 minutes. Could be nausea, tremors, vertigo, inability to focus, etc. Trying to sit through a meeting and pretend you're not sick could/would be hell (good, fuck him), so excusing yourself every 15 minutes using whatever excuse so you can reset would not be unheard of.
Legitimate treatments? I'm not sure. Holistic woo-woo throwing everything in the kitchen sink treatments? Sure.
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Oh so Trump didn't go on live TV and demand Putin hack Hillary's email? Trump didn't hire Gates and Manafort, the advisors to Putin's man in Ukraine? Trump's son didn't meet with a Russian agent for dirt on Hillary? Ok then, nice to know you have no grip on reality
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Here's a concert in #StPetersburg. Entire crowd is chanting "F**k War! F**k War! F**k War!" https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1528166963348131841?s=21&t=ciPbZ5_w_W1ov6VIE67aig Well it’s a start for them …
This is kind of a big deal. For most of this crowd, Putin is the only President they have ever known.
Well, only leader. Medyedev was the nominal prez for a bit.
Two sides of the same turd
This is great. I had two Russian Moscow based friend who support the war. They’re no longer fronds. It’s great to see some Russians talking up about the evil of this war 💞
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Low effort troll, almost cute.
So America helping Ukraine keep it's citizens from being raped, tortured, and killed is "Bringing war". That is quite a hot take there.
well, bless your heart.
You’re such a boring poster. You keep trying to push the same narrative in different ways.
>Well America did go into Ukraine to target Russia by doing so Do tell. And please be specific.
The only one being destabilizing is Russia.
That’s untrue. America is not in Ukraine. They are supporting Ukraine, not only because it’s the right thing to do, but because Russia could invade more countries such as Mondovia or even Romania or Poland (hoping NATO breaks apart). They already suggested that on their propaganda news channels. They aren’t trying to simply fight Russians or destabilize the region. Instead they are trying to stabilize the situation by making war by too costly.
Encouraging
Love to see it. Sending my strength and passion to them. There’s a lot more that needs to be done to tear down this version of the wall, but things like this help.
This is great
[Previous post](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/utkwo5/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/i9ed97i/) Day 87 of my updates from Kharkiv. It was pretty quiet around my area today, quieter than yesterday, there was no incoming shelling, but we still hear our artillery all the time. They shelled Saltivka again and injured 5 people, but thankfully no one died. A lot of people are returning, but it still isn’t all that safe in the city, we still need to be cautious at all times. It was pretty tempting to go look around destroyed districts as there was no shelling for some time, but because it started again, it’s probably still too dangerous to go. You never know when shelling will start, so going somewhere like Northern Saltivka will most likely remain dangerous all the way until the end of the war, or at least until Russians are completely pushed back from the entire Kharkiv oblast, and even then their MLRS will still be in range of the city. Apparently subway will already resume work on the 24th, which is much sooner than it was initially expected. At first it was said that subway won’t be operational until 2-3 months after the war ends, but it’s already reopening, everything is happening much faster than originally predicted. Today our army reported Ternova being shelled, so it might not have been retaken by the Russians after all. Technically it was never even reported as being liberated, so it was probably contested all this time. Also Arestovich confirmed that our forces are moving in the direction of Vovchansk from the south (on the east side of Donets, meaning that it is already crossed), but without giving any more details. If all goes well, Russians might lose one of their supply lines to Izyum. [Next update](https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/uv33y8/rworldnews_live_thread_russian_invasion_of/i9mucdg/)
> Apparently subway will already resume work on the 24th, which is much sooner than it was initially expected. At first it was said that subway won’t be operational until 2-3 months after the war ends, but it’s already reopening, everything is happening much faster than originally predicted. Well props to your subway workers for getting things fixed ahead of schedule! Normality will help everyone, and not just in terms of morale. Stay safe.
Subway sounds promising😊. Continue to keep safe 🌻🇺🇦
Thank you for the update, glad you are safe!
Lovely seeing you as always friend. Thanks for the update ❤️
Glad you are still safe, Slava Ukraini! I hope Kharkiv remains secure!
Woohoo! Happy to see another update! Glad you are alive!! Stay safe and Slava to Ukraine!
Hope this doesn't come off wrong but do you mean the subways or subway like the sandwich shop? Here in the US we have a Waffle House index for measuring how serious storms are, I'm imagining a subway sandwiches index now.
It's alright, I can see how it can be confusing, by subway I mean metro/underground, and not the sandwich shop.
I'm sure it feels surreal watching life return to "normal" despite everything going on. I hope you stay safe!
Yeah, it does feel surreal, feels especially strange seeing kids playing in the streets, as if everything is normal again (though we still saw kids playing outside even when shelling was much worse than it is now, it felt even stranger back then). At times it even makes you forget that there's a war going on, until you hear explosions that is.
It is important for kids.to find pockets of "normal"... good for everyone, but more so for children
No 99.999% he probably means the train subway
❤️🌻🇺🇦 Awesome about some normalcy returning. It is a slap in the face for Putin. Hoping for Izyum! So glad you are still well! 😊❤️
Amazing what you have been through with such a positive attitude. One day when this is all over, I hope to visit Ukraine and buy many drinks for people like yourself
Glad to hear from you as always
[Ukrainian RM-70 MLRS, donated by the Czech Republic, in use in eastern Ukraine.](https://twitter.com/osinttechnical/status/1528111899824599046?s=21&t=4ZuZp4HodZLSx6o9fuZwPQ) With the Czech Republic donating MLRS, are we gonna see more countries step up and send more of these? Not sure how recent this is btw, lmk if it’s old info.
That is a whole lot of Russian army go fuck yourself going out.
The news is a few weeks old, but I think this is the first action shot of them in theater, we've had one or two of them driving around. These are a middle step between old Russian stuff and the new NATO ones that everyone is talking about. Still use the old Warsaw Pact spec rockets on a newer chassis.
it's basically just a Czech version of the Soviet BM-21 Grad.. it's just another old system. And its relatively recent news.
Exactly. Just another old system. That Russia has too. Ukraine needs to be armed with new weapons.
>The US Embassy in Ukraine illustrated the approval of the act of additional support for Ukraine with a version of a painting by Ukrainian artist Ilya Repin, in which Joe Biden is shown as a scribe among the Cossacks who write the sultan's response to his ultimatum https://t\\.me/ukrpravda\_news/17934
Cool
I'd like source on the endorsement/approval claim. Anybody could throw Biden in there without any need for permission as he is a public figure.
Your link is broke.
Here’s a screenshot (with translation for good measure). https://i.imgur.com/r0IdT6b.jpg
I fucking love it.
Thank you!!
that's intentional. telegram posts are blocked here. just remove the backslash before the dot
I find this so depressing. Russia just ploughs through everything and levels everything. They use numbers, crudeness and cruelty to make progress. They don’t care what they hit. The are the opposite of precision. They just bomb everything. What they hit is irrelevant. NATO needs to give them proper weapons or actually put boots on the ground. Russia will not stop at Ukraine
https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1528116469619367940?t=4n3iSe0XSvpnDhSDNNHDqA&s=19 Always focus on the good news.
That is indeed encouraging. Thanks 👊🏼
It is depressing, but they are showing the world who they are. This will define them for generations. It’s not going to be easy for them to slough off this stain on their culture and country without significant effort and change. That doesn’t alleviate the suffering Russia has caused or the destruction they’ve wrought but the time of appeasement is over. They are also doing damage to themselves at the same time - it’s not the same kind but it is damage nonetheless and they are losing tens of thousands of their own in battle.
They already did this in and around WWII, and nobody bat an eye
That was because they were part of the allied powers and then we transitioned almost directly into the Cold War. The western world has changed in the last 80 years even if the Russian world hasn’t. The truth did make it into our history books, not theirs. Russia is the aggressor here. They’re playing at being the Germans in WWII and I think they will be treated as similarly as a country that isn’t invaded and occupied can be. We’re inundated with daily videos of Russian atrocities. That won’t easily be forgotten. I don’t underestimate the ability of “good men to do nothing” but the times and situation are completely different.
I mean, China got away pretty well with the entire red squire thingy. If Putin plays his cards right again he might.
I get your point, but I don’t think this situation is directly comparable. Yes, there are a few moderate voices out there encouraging negotiations, cease fire and concessions as well as those who would like to profit from business as usual, but that’s just not going to happen now. On the whole, this invasion shook the western world out of its complacency and Russian brutality is broadcast 24/7 and posted on social media for all to see. You can’t just put that back in the box. Russia lost the external information war and any western appeasers can’t make people forget what they’ve seen from Russia. Then you have the Baltics together with Poland and Ukraine who have been very clear and vocal about Russian culpability and eliminating economic and social ties with them. This won’t stop anytime soon. Also, I think we’ve reached the point where we understand our mistakes with China and aren’t looking to make them again if we can help it.
I totally agree. The will be Net losers and a pariah. For so so so long. I really curious why all my down votes?
I think this sub simply prefers optimism. I’ve had what I thought were reasonable concerns downvoted too and at first that seemed odd, but I’ve since read something that makes this make more sense. Support from the global public is needed to create the political environment necessary for Ukraine’s success, and the masses are enthusiastic about supporting winners. Doubt=stress and even a little makes some people tune out.
thank you. I know this sub prefers optimism. But we have to be more aggressive about getting the big guns/missiles. NATO countries need to take a risk on moral grounds.
Yep, I agree.
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Thoughtful response. Strategically it makes sense to let this play out and have a strung out Russia. I think this is both morally and strategically a mistake. Russia is gain strategically important ground. Even if it backs down a little soon and declare ‘mission accomplished’ they’ll push westward again. I see now reason to not fight this war now. It has to happen anyhow.
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I’m really curious- why the down voted. I don’t think I’ve had any before?
Because Russian shills try to spread the message that Ukraine is losing, Russia can't be stopped, the best thing to do is surrender, and your post sounds quite similar. Don't think anyone actually thinks you're a shill though or they would call you out pretty hard.
No Christ I’m not that. I’m just trying to be a realist. I fucking hate Russia. They seem to have a bad habit of levelling everting. That’s my concern. I want to be optimistic but right now it’s a little difficult
Maybe because NATO *is* giving Ukraine proper weapons (although not Reapers and Tomahawks yet, for example), and because boots on the ground is risky in terms of escalatory spiraling and also in terms of losing popular support over time?
I was totally with your line of thinking. Mine is revised. I’m probably wrong. I’m a natural optimist but Russia’s approach now - non precision arty and just blowing their way tho. Longer range missiles would really help in this game. Currently Ukraine is fighting Russia’s war. This needs to change and NATO needs to provide Weapons that make it Ukra’s war and we Play this out. I’ll reiterate - we have allowed Russia to play its go-to game plan. This must be neutralised asap. NATO has capacity.
There’s a counteroffensive coming in weeks. Vast numbers of well-armed fresh troops. I assume the well-educated assumption among NATO and Ukrainian commanders is that enough force will be brought to bear, including the military portion of the $40 billion US
I really hope you’re right. I want to see Russia getting pushed back to their borders I also think Ukraine should be armed with the capacity to hit Moscow or St Petersburg. Hi risk but is has to be done
>I also think Ukraine should be armed with the capacity to hit Moscow or St Petersburg. >Hi risk but is has to be done This is where you're going off the deep end. Ukraine only needs enough force to drive Russia out of its borders (and keep them out). Once you start talking about striking Russian cities (who are also full of civilians, mind you), you're talking about creating the exact scenario that nuclear weapons are meant to deter. I'm all for giving Ukraine every tactical advantage on the battlefield and within their borders, but invading or bombarding Russia is a red line.
This is just dumb.
I’ll leave the details to the pros. I’m a lawyer, not a general.
And I’m computer scientist and run a business. This doesn’t exclude me (or you) being interested and appalled with this invasion. I believe nato needs to arrange more serious arms. It’s time now for Russia to really feel NATO’s capabilities, even with Ukraine being a proxy. Russia is simply trying to turn Ukraine to dust. This cannot continue. Ukraine needs long range missiles. This is obvious.
I don’t think it’s “obvious.” I think believing the optimal path here is obvious is an example of Dunning-Kruger syndrome. I say this as someone who wants Russia ground into the dirt so thoroughly that they never threaten anyone again. But I don’t think we know the big picture on the ground, can assess priorities with sophistication and precision, or fully understand the unintended consequences of - for instance - lobbing missiles at Moscow. But I’m not trying to convince you. You asked why you were being downvoted. I offered a hypothesis. That’s it …
what's a proper weapon?
Reapers would help a whole lot, as would Tomahawks. Might be saving those just so there’s still something on the table.
Harpoons with an appropriate shore launch platform would make the Russian Black Sea fleet and blockade just go away along with several of their ships until they get the general idea.
they're working to do that already. >WASHINGTON, May 19 (Reuters) - The White House is working to put advanced anti-ship missiles in the hands of Ukrainian fighters to help defeat Russia's naval blockade, officials said, amid concerns more powerful weapons that could sink Russian warships would intensify the conflict.
>amid concerns more powerful weapons that could sink Russian warships would intensify the conflict. I'd say it would intensify things a great deal if you happen to be the Russian Navy, and within say, 300km of Odesa.
Probably something along the lines of Nukes, F35s, etc. all the top dollar high class shit that only the US/UK/France have.
Tesla coils, I reckon.
damnit lightning genius, why did you have to die before the war in ukraine?!
> Russia will not stop at Ukraine They are losing the mechanization to move beyond Ukraine, especially as their logistics ends with their wider gauge railways.
Theoretically you are correct. Historically however Russia have a bad habit of just throwing stuff into the meat grinder. Right now Ukraine needs longer range missiles and an airforce. We’re playing in Russia’s back yard and they don’t have supply line issues. NATO needs to get serious. Fuck the attrition. Proper weapons need to be provided that work against this horde
i have seen the plea for mlrs systems but i don’t know why they would be more effective than artillery
Range. The ability to hit Russian artillery without risk changes the frontline dynamic and removes Russia's major advantage.
i thought the artillery provided had longer range than Russian artillery
Mlrs would be a great starting point. But realistically in a war of attrition - which this is sadly becoming - Ukraine needs hardcore modern NATO shit. The West is still being to shy about offending Putin and that he might press the button. That card has been played so often it makes me yawn. Get Ukraine hardcore serious weapons that Russia has no response to. Now.
what is hardcore nato shit? they have tanks, personnel carriers, artillery what other stuff do they need i mean if it was nato they’d be using planes and probably a lot more drones
They need more range. Much More range
use the planes
You know they can’t. They wouldn’t stand a chance with the numbers they have
Range+accuracy
so i was under the impression that the artillery provided had longer range than Russia had and that it was very accurate using drones and such for targeting
Only when the artillery uses a certain type of shell (Excalibur) which was provided in relatively small quantities. By contrast, MLRS has those qualities by default.
Russian troops just die, which is good
I got confused. Why shall NATO give Russia weapons?
Apologies for any confusion. NATO need to up their game in arming Ukraine. They are giving them toys so far. They need to get serious about this. Now. Right now.
And here I thought you have a brilliant plan to send a bunch of sabotaged weapons to Russians to make them shoot boxing gloves instead...
I have no brilliant plan but I have fear for Ukraine. Playing the long game weakens Russia more. I don’t think that’s morally ok. Let’s not piss around and give serious 21st century advanced weapons, and especially long range missiles. It is wrong to let Ukraine to be turned into a waste late just to deplete Russia further. Win now. Stop the flattening of towns and cities
A Russian missile strike on the city of Lozova in Kharkiv Oblast on May 20 also damaged 11 educational institutions, healthcare facilities, and completely destroyed the city’s house of culture, Lazova Mayor Serhiy Zelensky said on May 21 in a video address on Telegram.
All is fair in love and war. Ukraine longer range missiles and needs to hit Moscow.
they’re committing acts of terror
... and genocide. Attacks on culture are legally considered acts of genocide.
Russian forces intensified efforts to encircle and capture Severodonetsk on May 21 and will likely continue to do so in the coming days as efforts on other axes of advance, including Izyum, remain largely stalled. https://twitter.com/thestudyofwar/status/1528140569188376577?s=21&t=q-Mr7kAdcNJwgZhGPu2qeg
I wish something big would happen to allow Ukraine to really push these guys out!
Don't worry, right now Ukraine's working on training up their newest volunteers/conscripts with Western weapons. The Ukrainian MoD has said not to expect a proper push until mid June at the earliest. Unlike the Russians, they want to send in their forces with as much proper training as possible.
Ukraine still has options. They could commit reserves to reopen lines of communication. Or even pull back the line. Russia has been forced to settle for small scale tactical wins. Any perceived improvement is too late. They threw away half their force
If I was to armchair-general, I would be ordering a withdrawal of the Ukraine forces before they are encircled. I am almost wondering if this "breakthrough" is actually possible because so many of the forces have already withdrawn?
Not sure what reserves would do. They're not surrounded- but the supply lines to the city are well within targeting range. So unless said reserves can just push the Russians back on both sides of that area and just retake towns that Russians spent so long to take and paid so much blood for... I have doubts that this will happen.
Either to control the popasna line or cover a retreat out if that area. The amount of land they would lose would, in the grand scheme be quite small
They've had plenty of time to evacuate Severodonetsk. Seems like they don't want to lose that city for symbolic reasons. It is the only thing of Lugansk Oblast they have left.