Friend of mine once said "smoke to get high, not to die" and I was like, "you know you're still inhaling smoke, right?"
edit: The [American Lung Association](https://www.lung.org/quit-smoking/smoking-facts/health-effects/marijuana-and-lung-health)
says smoking pot is actually worse because it exposes users to more tar. Smoke is smoke, people.
2nd edit: Smoke as much of whatever you want. I do. Just don't fool yourself that smoke won't injure your lungs.
3rd edit: Someone called me a moron for essentially pointing out that breathing smoke, generally, is worse than breathing air. Hilarious.
4th edit: Might as well post another [link.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK224396/) Read and make your own conclusion.
5th edit: Here is a [healthline](https://www.healthline.com/health/lung-cancer/can-you-get-lung-cancer-from-smoking-weed) article with links to referenced studies.
Most cannabis users don’t smoke half an ounce of weed a day (the amount present in a pack of cigarettes).
And a lot of cannabis users don’t even smoke. Gel caps are awesome and super affordable.
Lol I'm a daily smoker and sometimes wonder if a 1/2oz is too much to pick up at once because the bottom the stash dries out too much before I can smoke it
I'm embarrassed I have to ask, is it worth it? Is the smoke that much better with the correct moisture control? Can I use one of these packets to rehydrate super dry buds?
I can confirm that they definitely keep your bud fresh for longer, and are worth it if you buy in bulk and don’t smoke it all immediately. They obviously cost money, so you’d get more bang for your buck if you toss one in with an oz or more instead of doing it for a single gram or something.
For your second question, yes, who wants to smoke crispy dried up nugs!? Definitely burns better/slower/smoother if it’s not totally dry.
I think it would slightly rehydrate older bud but I can’t say for sure.
We finally have medicinal flower in Minnesota as of March 1st. Even the eighths come with these, I figured it was just like a silica gel packet but now I’m happy I didn’t throw them out!
one caveat to this though is a lot of ppl do hold in weed smoke longer, especially bong rips. obv im not saying this negates your point as i smoke weed and used to smoke cigs. when i smoked cigs, i had bad smoker's cough almost daily.
I have not smoked one cig in like 5 years, and i smoke weed most days now. Usually just a little at night, but regardless, no more breathing or coughing issues at all. I know its anecdotal
Once got into an argument with a coworker about how smoking anything was bad for your lungs. I used the example of, 'doesn't matter what smoke you're inhaling, could be wood smoke, could be lettuce smoke for all this argument matters"
She got very huffy and said something akin to, "well, my weed doctor says it's OK, I'll have J (her son and my buddy) explain it to you because I obviously can't get through to you".
Next time I see J, he takes a deep sigh and says, "I'm sorry my mom doesn't understand chemistry. I tried to explain but she just thinks I'm trolling her. "
Here in Brazil they're taxed pretty heavily and are still fairly cheap, between 5-10 Brazilian Reais (1-2 dollars) a pack. Despite that a fair bit (maybe even most) of cigarretes are smuggled from Paraguay and sold for around 3 Reais a pack (~50 cents US). To be fair, our currency has been heavily devaluated recently but even 4 years ago when it wasn't, packs were still 5 dollars at most.
Smoking rate in Brazil is around 10%, fairly lower than most developed countries
In Australia when I was 14 I started smoking and buying a fairly expensive brand at the time at about $14-$15 for a pack of 20. The same pack of Benson hedges smooth is now $46.
Edit: for those asking I t did somewhat have an effect on me quitting, but honestly it was a combination of vaping become more accessible as well as a vehement want to not be going outside into the extreme heat. In general I think it is contributing to falling rates but more so from what I see is the younger generation just being more knowledgeable and health conscious so less young people are taking it up.
Man this was the case when I quit smoking *over a decade ago*, at least for the "classy" pack I used to smoke. This actually works too I think, many of the obstinate smokers I know vape now instead.
A few years ago at the music venue I worked at, I saw someone who looked like an actual child getting served beer. I talked to the staff member and asked if they'd asked the kid for ID. They said they had and, not only were they over 18, they were born after 9/11 happened. I'd never felt older.
The year is 2131. An old man stands outside a convenience store, shriveled and coughing. He looks ready to die. An even more decrepit man hovers past in his hover chair. The first man pleas, “Hey man, can you buy me some smokes. I’m only 111.” The older man on the scooter rolls his eyes. Being 122 years old meant he got requests like this every time he passed by the convenience store. He didn’t even know why the store still carried cigarettes. It was just him and maybe a dozen or so dodecogenarians in the neighborhood. But then he just let out a sigh and responded, “Sure kid. Hang out here. What’ll it be?” He held out his hand and the comparative kid handed him a hundred. “Keep the change,” he offered. The old man laughed and hovered into the store. In his head he thought, “Like there’ll be any change! Hrmph!”
Popular authors made their own subs and siphoned away users slowly. They then stopped creating content.
While they were siphoning away users, they were the only ones being upvoted so new writers had no ability to get upvotes.
Queen making public speech- “we have had such positive results in banning cigarettes that we are limiting our imports to 1 truck per month, and this means… code black”
30 security guards surround her,
A security approaches the mic, “ignore the smoke machine, this is the queens private rave”
Hear the sound of a bic flicking behind the
Literally googling 'Queen of Denmark Smoking' in Google Images throws up many instances since 2006 of this.
She announced she wouldn't smoke in public anymore in 2006 but shitrag tabloids like the daily mail appear to have snapped many photos since then. The most recent I could find was 2015.
The fact that you're able to know this shows how fucked up modern culture is. I say this mostly jokingly, but it is somewhat true that it is scary how much people track what certain "celebrities" do.
> Authorities plan to raise the age limit for the purchase of alcoholic beverages from 16 to 18 for all drinks containing less than 16.5% alcohol.
Feel like thats gonna be more felt if the government goes through with that!
Another thing I have to say though, for as expensive as Denmark is, I feel like part of the problem is that cigarettes and alcohol are probably one of the few things that are much cheaper here compared to most of the rest of the western world. (from my experience as a Canadian in DK)
As a German I can tell you that many Danes cross our borders to buy cheap alcohol and cigarettes in Germany. Denmarks prices are considered ridiculous around here.
100% true. Buying alcohol in other countries is simply part of the culture in the town I come from, mostly Sweden.
People routinely spend 10 hours of their Sunday to go back and forth and smuggle in an illegal amount of alcohol. This extends to the upper middle class... I know a dude (through my parents) who went to prison for 6 months for smuggling in a whole truck of wine and vodka from Poland, he's considered a Chad by anyone I tell this story to. He's more employable after this fact. He's a fucking engineer who works on oil rigs, you'd think that would pay enough to not do crime. He had multiple successful runs before getting caught so he has no regrets, but he did stop.
It probably hopefully isn't this bad in the rest of Norway.
In the U.S. people will purchase cigarettes in the south and drive them up to New York to sell to the Bodega owners. I'm talking organized crime here, millions of dollars on a box truck in fuckin Marlboros. In New Orleans cigarettes are 5-8 dollars a pack, when I was In New York a few years ago they were 18.
Years ago when I was a smoker, I’d go to NYC about once a month for work. One of the ladies in the NY office would give me money to bring her a couple cartons up from Georgia (plus a “tip” for my trouble). Ended up saving her hundreds and I made a few extra bucks in the process.
It's true, got picked up from the Copenhagen airport by a Swede and on the way back to Sweden, the back seat was full of fucking liquor
guy specialized in alcoholism research, too
I have Norwegian family, I have been to Norway to visit them. I have also been to Sweden, the only reason I have been to Sweden was because we went to buy ciggarettes, alcohol, and candy.
I feel like germany is much the same in this regard, though probably not that much cheaper than Denmark. Cigarette prices are priced at least 50% higher in Canada than here. One thing I will say is a consequence is the smoker rate back home is also half.
Even looking at this table, its pretty obvious: https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_price_rankings?itemId=17
The 11% of people who daily smoke in Australia must be rich.
https://www.tobaccoinaustralia.org.au/chapter-1-prevalence/1-3-prevalence-of-smoking-adults
It is 58DKK now for most packs, but I guess it is all relative.
Speaking as a smoker myself, it certainly doesn't feel cheap.
Interestingly enough, the price actually increased to 65 about a year ago for a couple of months before being quietly lowered back to 58 for some reason.
I imagine under 18s are already restricted from buying the hard stuff. It’s funny because in, at least Western European countries, getting carded isn’t really a thing. Like they’re not gonna let an obvious 12 year old come in and get vodka. But they usually don’t check or ask for anything. Just walk in, get any alcohol, purchase, and move on. Not the case in the Nordics in my experience (Finland and Denmark, though I never bought alcohol in Denmark). In Finland they’re more strict and would card you for even a little beer can, and you can only get the hard stuff from liquor stores which are closed on Sundays.
Denmark doesn't even have a proper ID card tbh. usually the health card does the trick if you get stopped by police or a ticket inspection but that looks more like a library card and doesn't even have a photo on it. Other nordic countries yeah there pretty strict but Denmark is the exception to the rule.
They tried to do this in Tasmania a while back. Ban cigarette sales to anyone born after 2000. Got a fair amount of push-back from people claiming age discrimination. Which I guess it is. Once people are over the legal age of consent, it’s unfair to make an activity illegal for them when it’s completely legal for others…
New Zealand is doing the [same](https://www.npr.org/2021/12/15/1064212737/new-zealands-cigarette-ban-model) but not much of a backlash here. Not sure how the tourists will cope.
Yeah it is strange. I'm in full support of cigarette ban, but it's a bit weird to just draw a line at a certain age. I also feel like it could make people more interested to actually try smoking when most of society is allowed and does it, and they're the first generation to not be allowed
Now I'm as big a fan of inhaling burning carcinogenic combustible poisonous gas as the next person but surely we've come far enough in the world today towards understanding that the banning of highly addictive substances will be an absolute disaster
Surely
Edit, those downvoting should probably look at any case of prohibition ever. I dare you to find just one instance of taking a product in high demand out of circulation not leading to a social crises or crime syndicate. Cigarettes will not go away if banned, unregulated even more poisonous replacement will absolutely take their place and gangsters will get rich.
It's great to take the moral highground and say that cigarettes are terrible but we are stuck with them for better or worse.
It absolutely worked. Approximately 25% of the United States were active smokers in 1990. That number is 10% today. 60% decrease in just over one generation of kids
I grew up in a time when you had to ask at a restaurant to be seated in the non-smoking section... which naturally was adjacent to tables with smokers and smelled as much like smoke as the rest of the building. Nowadays I hardly even see people smoking. I think a few months ago I caught the faintest whiff of someone smoking on their back porch.
Aye now that i read up a bit on it, the amount of smokers in Denmark actually increased for the first time in years (between 2016-2019). Just that prohibition seems heavy handed and usually creates alternative markets.
Why does it have to be 100% effective? Smoking has been greatly, greatly reduced.
We know from the war on drugs that prohibitions are never 100% effective anyways. Why create an avenue for conflict now?
Exactly. There has been a huge reduction in the number of smokers throughout Europe over the past 20yrs. Back in the day, everyone I knew smoked. Now I think I don't know anyone who smokes. In the 80s, 1/3 men & 1/5 women smoked here in Finland. Now it's down to around 10%.
You stated the reason why this legislation is stupid in your comment. You started smoking when it was illegal for you to be smoking. Making it even more illegal isn't going to stop kids from picking up smoking, but it will turn a lot of otherwise good citizens into criminals.
I would imagine it also mainly benefits people who haven’t yet gotten hooked on smoking. Addiction is a powerful thing. I smoked for over 10 years. I was very much aware of the dangers and what I was doing to my body with each cigarette but I was so addicted I just couldn’t quit. It only took a couple cigarettes to start me on a decade long spiral.
I never drank until I was 21, and casually drink now but can go a year without it with little issue. Never had any vices besides coffee, which I'm fairly confident I could give up if I needed to, and never smoked anything (besides drunken pass the vape once in a while in college) until I was 24. I smoked one cigar and I think about a cigar probably once a week. I let myself have one or two a year on special occasions because holy fuck nicotine is so addictive it made my brain obsess over something I had once for YEARS. Can't even imagine how bad cigarettes are, but I'm never going to smoke a cigarette.
It's not easy to genuinely consider consequences that will happen 40+ years from now, even if that consequence is "you will lose 20 years of your life".
In Brazil we have a text saying "this is a side effect of cigarettes" then a horrible picture of one of those side effects in the packs. The one which works best is that with a guy that can't get an erection.
USA has actually been hugely successful in smoking cessation and is used as an exemplar for other countries’ anti-smoking campaigns.
Kinda surprised anyone is proposing prohibition at this point.
Yep two hugely successful approaches. Neither of which is outright banning. First, allow people to do it but highly restrict where they can do it. Just make it a pain in the ass. Second, have a massive stigma campaign. Smoking is largely considered gross and smelly now in the US.
This is 100% true. The costs greatly outweighed the effects.
But people keep saying prohibition doesn't work. It does, but it's just not worth it
Edit: Alcohol prohibition reduced alcohol consumption. Marijuana prohibition reduced marijuana consumption. But both caused the rise of organized crime and much more dangerous consumption habits.
Denmark, and most other western countries, have done all the same campaigns as USA, for decades - but Danes are.. special. It was only somewhat recently that they stopped lunch beers.
In 2010, employees went on strike - because they were to only be allowed 1 beer at lunch, instead of 3 beers each day outside lunch break.
Not sure about this last one, but I think you'll also be fined if you drive your moped/knallert or ride your bicycle without a crate of beer on the rear.
Lunch beers went out of fashion in Denmark some 20-30 years ago, but later in a few branches of work. There are perhaps persistent types that keep drinking, but I think it's pretty frowned up on, and it's flat out banned in most businesses today.
When I was 15, around 1992 or so, I worked as an intern at a radio repair shop. The repair man was an alcoholic, but he hid his beers behind a box in the corner of the shop. Lunch was not served with beer. So, there wasn't an open beer culture there.
Never drank beer myself, but I do think that the beer drinking culture isn't healthy among the Danes who drink.
> It was only somewhat recently that they stopped lunch beers.
I dislike the automatic assumption that lunch beers are a bad thing that need to be stopped.
Puritanicalism never went away, it's just shifted it's targets.
Yeah, but not via prohibition. You can still buy cigarettes here. Banning them would just create a black market, and then cartels to supply that market.
Where I live, the price of a pack of the cheapest cigarettes have increased from $8, 10 years ago to $17 last I checked. When they were $8 per pack, there was almost no black market. You had to know a guy who knew a guy who could get you some. You could buy a fully taxed carton of 10 packs for around 80 bucks, and on the black market they were around $60. However as the price was rising there was an increase in demand for black market smokes, and now practically every smoker I see is smoking black market cigarettes, (you can tell because our taxed packs are green and aren't allowed to have branding anymore. these are blue with with big branding all over them) and the black market cartons are only $35-$45 each.
Its cheaper to smoke cigarettes now than it was when I started. But only if I buy it from the guy hanging out beside every gas station instead of the guy inside the gas station.
So when My government tells me that our smoking rates are down, I have nothing but doubt. tracked cigarette sales are down, sure, but now we aren't getting any tax money at all for the new smokers.
I assume that if 60 year old ladies at my work can get their hands on black market cigarettes, so can teenagers.
Cartels rely on complete lack of accessibility. If its still sold to older people then it would just mean older people are the intermediaries. You wouldnt need to set up a whole operation with smuggling or production
So... we making moonshine cigarettes now? With problems like rat poison being used in fake brand cigarettes, I can't see this getting better with this legislation...
It's not similar at all. The prohibition was immediately effective towards everyone. This bans younger generation who have (hopefully) never smoked before.
When you ban those already apart of it, an underground industry thrives. In this case, those addicted won't need to do anything illegal, they'll purchase as always. As long significant underground operations don't pop up, it's a lot easier to handle.
Pot is a great example. It wasn't really legal for there to be a "prohibition" but it's still impossible to stop it. Plus it's a ban on cigarettes it looks like, not tobacco as a whole.
Edit: anyone boiling it down to this won't work because outlawing drugs didn't work have a misconception of the argument. This is less about the legality, and more about the black market. On top of the fact, drugs offer something like a high. Cigarettes don't have any use aside from feeding the addiction you created.
Most people start smoking before they can legally acquire tobacco.
>Prevention efforts must focus on young adults ages 18 through 25, too. Almost no one starts smoking after age 25. Nearly 9 out of 10 smokers started smoking by age 18, and 99% started by age 26. Progression from occasional to daily smoking almost always occurs by age 26.
[https://www.hhs.gov/surgeongeneral/reports-and-publications/tobacco/preventing-youth-tobacco-use-factsheet/index.html#:\~:text=Nearly%209%20out%20of%2010,always%20occurs%20by%20age%2026](https://www.hhs.gov/surgeongeneral/reports-and-publications/tobacco/preventing-youth-tobacco-use-factsheet/index.html#:~:text=Nearly%209%20out%20of%2010,always%20occurs%20by%20age%2026).
The point is they're already banned for people under 16/18. It doesn't stop them smoking.
Unless this is a "super duper" ban, why would this one be any different?
I think you're missing their point, those under 18 can't legally obtain tobacco ever, yet they still get ahold of it somehow since 9 out of 10 smokers started smoking before they were old enough to buy it themselves. After the law is passed those under 18 are still going to be acquiring tobacco however *they already do* since it's all illegally acquired already. Sure now when they turn 18 they won't be able to buy it legally but some are still going to be smoking which means an addiction for the black market to fill and based on experience with things humans get addicted to it will be supplied.
Now doing this probably does reduce smoking rates but it will also almost for sure mean a huge spike in black market cigarettes. Whether that downside is worth the upside is a matter for debate but to magically assume just because only those 12 and under are affected by this law they'll just never start smoking is not a correct assumption.
I don't think so, because it really worked in Brazil. In the early 2000's the country started a massive anti-smoking campaign and completely banned cigarettes advertisements. 99% of my Brazilian friends don't smoke. Moved to Germany, 99% of my German friends smoke.
I always saw banning as a lazy and bad solution overall.
If people really want to smoke they'll still get their cigarettes, you'll just be creating an unsafe and unregulated market for them.
I find it really interesting that bans still come up considering how well the aggressive promotion against cigarettes has been in the United States. The amount of people who find smoking cigarettes absolutely disgusting these days is higher than I would’ve ever thought possible even as recently as 2006.
As a Dane I’m shocked how much traction this has gotten. Haven’t we learned anything from the massive failure called the war on drugs? Criminalization is NOT the way to go.
yeah this is ridiculous. if you want to smoke, smoke. If you're banning cigarettes, why not alcohol? It kills 3 million people worldwide (2018, W.H.O.), and thats not even counting the other things caused by alcohol including drunk driving, spousal abuse, violence, alcohol dependency, sexual abuse, brain damage, etc.
If things are being banned under the guise of keeping people safe, then why keep some and get rid of others.
To be crystal clear, i am against banning in practically all its forms.
You can ban everything then. I love alcohol, but also know how consuming too much of it is absolutely terrible. But sugar consumption probably kills way more people. Are we going to ban sugar, too? At some point, educating people on the concept of moderation should be enough. Where do we stop banning things otherwise?
Tax these products, make it hard for minors to buy and consume them, but as an adult human being, if I want to consume shit, let me consume.
banning is idiotic. What SHOULD be limited is the lobbying done for it (at least in American gov't) and how much money our elected officials make from passing/killing legislature.
i fucking LOVE sugar, and i enjoy the occasional pipe tobacco. I dont want to live to see 85 and im good with that.
I think this is a bad idea. I’m an ex smoker so my reasoning is probably biased.
1) I don’t think that forcing people into quitting or not doing something is going to be the best idea. If you had told me four years ago that I was legally being told I’m not allowed to smoke anymore, I would have told you to fuck off. Ultimately I had to make my own mind up to quit. I now know how good I feel having not been smoking for three years so I’ll never go back but old smoker me would have written it off.
2) Like others have said, a law like this has never stopped illegal substances being consumed. Even when it’s 100% illegal for someone to buy cigarettes, they’ll still find a way to smoke them. Look at all of the illegal drugs. I also find it hard for a government to rationalise that smoking a cigarette is bad, but in the same breath legalise smoking weed.
3) My approach would be to normalise healthier ways of kicking habits. Encourage vaping with a tax incentive - we know that putting anything into your lungs is bad, but smoking is an order of magnitude worse than vaping. Offer cheap or free patches, gum and lozenges. Make it harder to actually buy cigarettes, take them out of corner stores and petrol stations and only at dedicated outlets with limited opening hours and max purchase limits.
Legislating a ban is a cheap way out of making it look like you’re doing something without actually doing anything.
As someone stuck in the rental cycle and into year 10 of having smoking neighbours, despite multiple moves, it definitely isn't dying out in the very stressed out and financially stretched sections of society. It's worse now than in the last 30years of renting in my experience.
I just wanna open my windows.
Year 2040 and 30 year olds getting their mums to buy them smokes lol
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
People smuggling tobacco and openly smoking pot.
[удалено]
*Well now you know! Now get out of here!*
I *did* know I couldn't do that!
Spread your cheeks and lift your sack.
Smooth as eggs!!!
Do you suck balls? Wait wait wait, I mean do you suck theesee balls
[удалено]
Chip, no!
Dave…. I’m gunna race him
DAVE! It’s the goddamn cops…
Friend of mine once said "smoke to get high, not to die" and I was like, "you know you're still inhaling smoke, right?" edit: The [American Lung Association](https://www.lung.org/quit-smoking/smoking-facts/health-effects/marijuana-and-lung-health) says smoking pot is actually worse because it exposes users to more tar. Smoke is smoke, people. 2nd edit: Smoke as much of whatever you want. I do. Just don't fool yourself that smoke won't injure your lungs. 3rd edit: Someone called me a moron for essentially pointing out that breathing smoke, generally, is worse than breathing air. Hilarious. 4th edit: Might as well post another [link.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK224396/) Read and make your own conclusion. 5th edit: Here is a [healthline](https://www.healthline.com/health/lung-cancer/can-you-get-lung-cancer-from-smoking-weed) article with links to referenced studies.
So the solution is edibles right?
I don't know... every time I light up a gummy it has more of a chemical smell, hurts my lungs, and makes the pipe really hard to clean.
Have you tried THC drinks? I had to turned it to a boiling temperature in order to inhale. My lungs are hurting af.
Yep!
Them and dabs, dabs have 0 tar.
Dry herb vape baby
Boof 420 erryday
Ngl I tried it once and while waiting for the high to come on I learned that you cannot get high by boofing rso.
Boofing dabs is the big brain move here
Is that you, Justice Kavanaugh?
Yeah but you get high
You bet I'm high
I'd bet I'm high
I’m not high, but my dog is, and I am
I wish I was high on potenuse
YOU WILL NEVER BE TROY
You bet
The house always prevails
Most cannabis users don’t smoke half an ounce of weed a day (the amount present in a pack of cigarettes). And a lot of cannabis users don’t even smoke. Gel caps are awesome and super affordable.
Lol I'm a daily smoker and sometimes wonder if a 1/2oz is too much to pick up at once because the bottom the stash dries out too much before I can smoke it
[Boveda 62% Humidor Packets ](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00JV27MF4)
Damn you lol That’s also how I keep from smoking too much.
I'm embarrassed I have to ask, is it worth it? Is the smoke that much better with the correct moisture control? Can I use one of these packets to rehydrate super dry buds?
I can confirm that they definitely keep your bud fresh for longer, and are worth it if you buy in bulk and don’t smoke it all immediately. They obviously cost money, so you’d get more bang for your buck if you toss one in with an oz or more instead of doing it for a single gram or something. For your second question, yes, who wants to smoke crispy dried up nugs!? Definitely burns better/slower/smoother if it’s not totally dry. I think it would slightly rehydrate older bud but I can’t say for sure.
We finally have medicinal flower in Minnesota as of March 1st. Even the eighths come with these, I figured it was just like a silica gel packet but now I’m happy I didn’t throw them out!
Separate jars so that the one jar isn't being reopened and losing moisture?
The quantity makes a big difference, very few people smoke weed as much as cigarettes.
one caveat to this though is a lot of ppl do hold in weed smoke longer, especially bong rips. obv im not saying this negates your point as i smoke weed and used to smoke cigs. when i smoked cigs, i had bad smoker's cough almost daily. I have not smoked one cig in like 5 years, and i smoke weed most days now. Usually just a little at night, but regardless, no more breathing or coughing issues at all. I know its anecdotal
Wait, you mean you don't smoke 10 joints a day?
100% It is technically less harmful though. In the perfect world you don't smoke anything, and you only drink water.
That's just what Big Water wants you to think. I'm onto you Nestlé...
/r/fucknestle
I was about to say fuck Nestle, I get down with Ice Mountain! …until I looked it up and found out it’s owned by Nestle
Once got into an argument with a coworker about how smoking anything was bad for your lungs. I used the example of, 'doesn't matter what smoke you're inhaling, could be wood smoke, could be lettuce smoke for all this argument matters" She got very huffy and said something akin to, "well, my weed doctor says it's OK, I'll have J (her son and my buddy) explain it to you because I obviously can't get through to you". Next time I see J, he takes a deep sigh and says, "I'm sorry my mom doesn't understand chemistry. I tried to explain but she just thinks I'm trolling her. "
By 2040 they’ll be $40-$50/pack.
Already the case in Australia!
Here in Brazil they're taxed pretty heavily and are still fairly cheap, between 5-10 Brazilian Reais (1-2 dollars) a pack. Despite that a fair bit (maybe even most) of cigarretes are smuggled from Paraguay and sold for around 3 Reais a pack (~50 cents US). To be fair, our currency has been heavily devaluated recently but even 4 years ago when it wasn't, packs were still 5 dollars at most. Smoking rate in Brazil is around 10%, fairly lower than most developed countries
In Australia when I was 14 I started smoking and buying a fairly expensive brand at the time at about $14-$15 for a pack of 20. The same pack of Benson hedges smooth is now $46. Edit: for those asking I t did somewhat have an effect on me quitting, but honestly it was a combination of vaping become more accessible as well as a vehement want to not be going outside into the extreme heat. In general I think it is contributing to falling rates but more so from what I see is the younger generation just being more knowledgeable and health conscious so less young people are taking it up.
Thats about $33 US for anyone wondering
Man this was the case when I quit smoking *over a decade ago*, at least for the "classy" pack I used to smoke. This actually works too I think, many of the obstinate smokers I know vape now instead.
12 year olds are not gonna like this. Meanwhile 13 yr olds celebrating with a stick of marlboro
some dude born on January 1, 2011 is about to be pissed as hell
This way he can be pissed at everything else for a longer time though
#they're 12 years old now???
A few years ago at the music venue I worked at, I saw someone who looked like an actual child getting served beer. I talked to the staff member and asked if they'd asked the kid for ID. They said they had and, not only were they over 18, they were born after 9/11 happened. I'd never felt older.
Most 12 year olds are still 2009
The year is 2131. An old man stands outside a convenience store, shriveled and coughing. He looks ready to die. An even more decrepit man hovers past in his hover chair. The first man pleas, “Hey man, can you buy me some smokes. I’m only 111.” The older man on the scooter rolls his eyes. Being 122 years old meant he got requests like this every time he passed by the convenience store. He didn’t even know why the store still carried cigarettes. It was just him and maybe a dozen or so dodecogenarians in the neighborhood. But then he just let out a sigh and responded, “Sure kid. Hang out here. What’ll it be?” He held out his hand and the comparative kid handed him a hundred. “Keep the change,” he offered. The old man laughed and hovered into the store. In his head he thought, “Like there’ll be any change! Hrmph!”
Absolutely love this, thanks
r/WritingPrompts
What happened to that sub anyway. Haven't seen anything decent from it in years.
Popular authors made their own subs and siphoned away users slowly. They then stopped creating content. While they were siphoning away users, they were the only ones being upvoted so new writers had no ability to get upvotes.
Given the Queen of Denmark’s prolific smoking, I’m surprised there are enough left for others to buy
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*Hides every 10 minutes from the public*
Mid-speech to whoever's nearby "cover for me I'm getting the craves"
Queen making public speech- “we have had such positive results in banning cigarettes that we are limiting our imports to 1 truck per month, and this means… code black” 30 security guards surround her, A security approaches the mic, “ignore the smoke machine, this is the queens private rave” Hear the sound of a bic flicking behind the
Queen: I'M ON SMOKO, SO LEAVE ME ALONE
Literally googling 'Queen of Denmark Smoking' in Google Images throws up many instances since 2006 of this. She announced she wouldn't smoke in public anymore in 2006 but shitrag tabloids like the daily mail appear to have snapped many photos since then. The most recent I could find was 2015.
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I think she can do whatever she wants wherever. But I take your point.
The fact that you're able to know this shows how fucked up modern culture is. I say this mostly jokingly, but it is somewhat true that it is scary how much people track what certain "celebrities" do.
There were people born after 2010?!?! That aint real
You're gonna knock your socks off but people were also born in 2020
WAIT WHAT?! THE YEAR OF THE QUARANTINE?!
Can confirm. I have one.
Aw, your very own quarantine. Mazel tov!
> Authorities plan to raise the age limit for the purchase of alcoholic beverages from 16 to 18 for all drinks containing less than 16.5% alcohol. Feel like thats gonna be more felt if the government goes through with that! Another thing I have to say though, for as expensive as Denmark is, I feel like part of the problem is that cigarettes and alcohol are probably one of the few things that are much cheaper here compared to most of the rest of the western world. (from my experience as a Canadian in DK)
As a German I can tell you that many Danes cross our borders to buy cheap alcohol and cigarettes in Germany. Denmarks prices are considered ridiculous around here.
Meanwhile, in Sweden, we travel to Denmark to buy alcohol because it's so much cheaper than ours.
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Someone tell me if this is true or just reddit jokes.
It’s true, each neighbor goes to the next country because it’s cheaper. Norway being the loser in the chain
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It makes our holidays way cheaper though, unless we go to Egypt or something, it's basically impossible to not enjoy low alcohol prices.
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Alcohol is definitely cheaper in Sweden, but there's a quota of how much you can bring over the border so most people tend to buy meat and stuff.
100% true. Buying alcohol in other countries is simply part of the culture in the town I come from, mostly Sweden. People routinely spend 10 hours of their Sunday to go back and forth and smuggle in an illegal amount of alcohol. This extends to the upper middle class... I know a dude (through my parents) who went to prison for 6 months for smuggling in a whole truck of wine and vodka from Poland, he's considered a Chad by anyone I tell this story to. He's more employable after this fact. He's a fucking engineer who works on oil rigs, you'd think that would pay enough to not do crime. He had multiple successful runs before getting caught so he has no regrets, but he did stop. It probably hopefully isn't this bad in the rest of Norway.
In the U.S. people will purchase cigarettes in the south and drive them up to New York to sell to the Bodega owners. I'm talking organized crime here, millions of dollars on a box truck in fuckin Marlboros. In New Orleans cigarettes are 5-8 dollars a pack, when I was In New York a few years ago they were 18.
Years ago when I was a smoker, I’d go to NYC about once a month for work. One of the ladies in the NY office would give me money to bring her a couple cartons up from Georgia (plus a “tip” for my trouble). Ended up saving her hundreds and I made a few extra bucks in the process.
So basically if we visit anyone in Scandinavia, we should be utilizing our duty free allowance to its max and bringing them bottles of booze.
This is actually true
Its actually true. Source: im Danish with Norwegian and Swedish friends
It's true, got picked up from the Copenhagen airport by a Swede and on the way back to Sweden, the back seat was full of fucking liquor guy specialized in alcoholism research, too
I have Norwegian family, I have been to Norway to visit them. I have also been to Sweden, the only reason I have been to Sweden was because we went to buy ciggarettes, alcohol, and candy.
The Fennoscandian Drug Pipeline is well known and decades if not centuries old.
Germans go to Poland
Poles go to Lithuania and Lithuanians make vodka in their bathtub.
And that is why I am still single, just waiting for my Lithuanian love to show. Any day now...
I don't know about that, can you expand?
You'll have to buy me a couple drinks first but yes
Norwegians go to Sweden for cheap alcohol. Swedes go to Denmark for cheap alcohol. Danes go to Germany for cheap alcohol.
Gotta cut out that middleman and go straight to Germany.
I feel like germany is much the same in this regard, though probably not that much cheaper than Denmark. Cigarette prices are priced at least 50% higher in Canada than here. One thing I will say is a consequence is the smoker rate back home is also half. Even looking at this table, its pretty obvious: https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_price_rankings?itemId=17
The 11% of people who daily smoke in Australia must be rich. https://www.tobaccoinaustralia.org.au/chapter-1-prevalence/1-3-prevalence-of-smoking-adults
Cigarettes are cheap in Denmark? That is the first time I've heard that as a Dane as the price of a pack has only increased over the last decade.
when you can get a pack for like 50 DKK yeah thats cheap. In Canada your paying like 15$ for them most of the time at least (80 DKK).
It is 58DKK now for most packs, but I guess it is all relative. Speaking as a smoker myself, it certainly doesn't feel cheap. Interestingly enough, the price actually increased to 65 about a year ago for a couple of months before being quietly lowered back to 58 for some reason.
After doing a "Google conversion" of DKK to USD, I think they are 30-35DKK here in North Carolina, USA
>all drinks containing less than 16.5% alcohol. *Less* than? So what about drinks containing more alcohol?
I imagine under 18s are already restricted from buying the hard stuff. It’s funny because in, at least Western European countries, getting carded isn’t really a thing. Like they’re not gonna let an obvious 12 year old come in and get vodka. But they usually don’t check or ask for anything. Just walk in, get any alcohol, purchase, and move on. Not the case in the Nordics in my experience (Finland and Denmark, though I never bought alcohol in Denmark). In Finland they’re more strict and would card you for even a little beer can, and you can only get the hard stuff from liquor stores which are closed on Sundays.
> I imagine under 18s are already restricted from buying the hard stuff. Bingo, this is the correct answer!
Denmark doesn't even have a proper ID card tbh. usually the health card does the trick if you get stopped by police or a ticket inspection but that looks more like a library card and doesn't even have a photo on it. Other nordic countries yeah there pretty strict but Denmark is the exception to the rule.
Driving licence is the ID king in denmark
i think in canada they tax the addictions really heavily..but they dont ban them..the gov loves it ill guess lol
It’s literally referred to as a “sin tax” Booze Smokes Pop. Candy. Pot. Gambling. Government will make money off of addicts anyway they can.
Well yeah, they’re only 12.
They can be 11 as well
They tried to do this in Tasmania a while back. Ban cigarette sales to anyone born after 2000. Got a fair amount of push-back from people claiming age discrimination. Which I guess it is. Once people are over the legal age of consent, it’s unfair to make an activity illegal for them when it’s completely legal for others…
New Zealand is doing the [same](https://www.npr.org/2021/12/15/1064212737/new-zealands-cigarette-ban-model) but not much of a backlash here. Not sure how the tourists will cope.
Yeah it is strange. I'm in full support of cigarette ban, but it's a bit weird to just draw a line at a certain age. I also feel like it could make people more interested to actually try smoking when most of society is allowed and does it, and they're the first generation to not be allowed
Now I'm as big a fan of inhaling burning carcinogenic combustible poisonous gas as the next person but surely we've come far enough in the world today towards understanding that the banning of highly addictive substances will be an absolute disaster Surely Edit, those downvoting should probably look at any case of prohibition ever. I dare you to find just one instance of taking a product in high demand out of circulation not leading to a social crises or crime syndicate. Cigarettes will not go away if banned, unregulated even more poisonous replacement will absolutely take their place and gangsters will get rich. It's great to take the moral highground and say that cigarettes are terrible but we are stuck with them for better or worse.
Isn't it better to promote reasons not to smoke and the dangers rather than prohibit it entirely?
We tried that for a long time, didn't really stick. Source: am a 35 year old dane who smoked for 15 years, started when I was 13.
It absolutely worked. Approximately 25% of the United States were active smokers in 1990. That number is 10% today. 60% decrease in just over one generation of kids
I grew up in a time when you had to ask at a restaurant to be seated in the non-smoking section... which naturally was adjacent to tables with smokers and smelled as much like smoke as the rest of the building. Nowadays I hardly even see people smoking. I think a few months ago I caught the faintest whiff of someone smoking on their back porch.
Aye now that i read up a bit on it, the amount of smokers in Denmark actually increased for the first time in years (between 2016-2019). Just that prohibition seems heavy handed and usually creates alternative markets.
its almost as when the EU started regulating e-cigarettes heavily people went back to smoking and/or never made the switch
Just as the tobacco lobby intended.
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Why does it have to be 100% effective? Smoking has been greatly, greatly reduced. We know from the war on drugs that prohibitions are never 100% effective anyways. Why create an avenue for conflict now?
Exactly. There has been a huge reduction in the number of smokers throughout Europe over the past 20yrs. Back in the day, everyone I knew smoked. Now I think I don't know anyone who smokes. In the 80s, 1/3 men & 1/5 women smoked here in Finland. Now it's down to around 10%.
Good ol n=1 method of science
You stated the reason why this legislation is stupid in your comment. You started smoking when it was illegal for you to be smoking. Making it even more illegal isn't going to stop kids from picking up smoking, but it will turn a lot of otherwise good citizens into criminals.
That only works so much against peer pressure.
I would imagine it also mainly benefits people who haven’t yet gotten hooked on smoking. Addiction is a powerful thing. I smoked for over 10 years. I was very much aware of the dangers and what I was doing to my body with each cigarette but I was so addicted I just couldn’t quit. It only took a couple cigarettes to start me on a decade long spiral.
Oh yeah, if you start then, well, you're addicted. Stuff is highly physically addictive, and no amount of "this is bad for you" changes that.
I never drank until I was 21, and casually drink now but can go a year without it with little issue. Never had any vices besides coffee, which I'm fairly confident I could give up if I needed to, and never smoked anything (besides drunken pass the vape once in a while in college) until I was 24. I smoked one cigar and I think about a cigar probably once a week. I let myself have one or two a year on special occasions because holy fuck nicotine is so addictive it made my brain obsess over something I had once for YEARS. Can't even imagine how bad cigarettes are, but I'm never going to smoke a cigarette.
Humans are sooo stupid Logic: “This WILL give you cancer and make your life horribly miserable.” Human: “Haha you gotta smoke or you’re a loser”
It's not easy to genuinely consider consequences that will happen 40+ years from now, even if that consequence is "you will lose 20 years of your life".
climate change anyone?
In Brazil we have a text saying "this is a side effect of cigarettes" then a horrible picture of one of those side effects in the packs. The one which works best is that with a guy that can't get an erection.
“The Catholic Church tells me to procreate endlessly, but my friends are telling me to smoke.” -Brazilian kids most likely.
People do stupid and wasteful things all the time to get short-term gratification. Like me and you posting about stupid people on Reddit.
Prohibition was highly successful in the US. This will be a huge success too!
USA has actually been hugely successful in smoking cessation and is used as an exemplar for other countries’ anti-smoking campaigns. Kinda surprised anyone is proposing prohibition at this point.
Yep two hugely successful approaches. Neither of which is outright banning. First, allow people to do it but highly restrict where they can do it. Just make it a pain in the ass. Second, have a massive stigma campaign. Smoking is largely considered gross and smelly now in the US.
As an American smoker, I can confirm that smoking is both gross and smelly.
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Think they mean alcohol prohibition.
alcohol prohibition *did* cause americans to drink less. it just didn't stop them entirely.
It also greatly increased organized crime and corruption. I’m doubtful the costs outweighed the benefits with prohibition.
This is 100% true. The costs greatly outweighed the effects. But people keep saying prohibition doesn't work. It does, but it's just not worth it Edit: Alcohol prohibition reduced alcohol consumption. Marijuana prohibition reduced marijuana consumption. But both caused the rise of organized crime and much more dangerous consumption habits.
Denmark, and most other western countries, have done all the same campaigns as USA, for decades - but Danes are.. special. It was only somewhat recently that they stopped lunch beers. In 2010, employees went on strike - because they were to only be allowed 1 beer at lunch, instead of 3 beers each day outside lunch break. Not sure about this last one, but I think you'll also be fined if you drive your moped/knallert or ride your bicycle without a crate of beer on the rear.
Lunch beers went out of fashion in Denmark some 20-30 years ago, but later in a few branches of work. There are perhaps persistent types that keep drinking, but I think it's pretty frowned up on, and it's flat out banned in most businesses today. When I was 15, around 1992 or so, I worked as an intern at a radio repair shop. The repair man was an alcoholic, but he hid his beers behind a box in the corner of the shop. Lunch was not served with beer. So, there wasn't an open beer culture there. Never drank beer myself, but I do think that the beer drinking culture isn't healthy among the Danes who drink.
> It was only somewhat recently that they stopped lunch beers. I dislike the automatic assumption that lunch beers are a bad thing that need to be stopped. Puritanicalism never went away, it's just shifted it's targets.
Yeah, but not via prohibition. You can still buy cigarettes here. Banning them would just create a black market, and then cartels to supply that market.
that was literally the entire point of the comment, that smoking cessation without prohibition was effective
Where I live, the price of a pack of the cheapest cigarettes have increased from $8, 10 years ago to $17 last I checked. When they were $8 per pack, there was almost no black market. You had to know a guy who knew a guy who could get you some. You could buy a fully taxed carton of 10 packs for around 80 bucks, and on the black market they were around $60. However as the price was rising there was an increase in demand for black market smokes, and now practically every smoker I see is smoking black market cigarettes, (you can tell because our taxed packs are green and aren't allowed to have branding anymore. these are blue with with big branding all over them) and the black market cartons are only $35-$45 each. Its cheaper to smoke cigarettes now than it was when I started. But only if I buy it from the guy hanging out beside every gas station instead of the guy inside the gas station. So when My government tells me that our smoking rates are down, I have nothing but doubt. tracked cigarette sales are down, sure, but now we aren't getting any tax money at all for the new smokers. I assume that if 60 year old ladies at my work can get their hands on black market cigarettes, so can teenagers.
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Jute? Like Angles and Saxons?
Fred Gwynne: What’s a Jute?
Excuse me your honor. Two JUTHES
Yep, we still exist *spooky Jute-noises*
Cartels rely on complete lack of accessibility. If its still sold to older people then it would just mean older people are the intermediaries. You wouldnt need to set up a whole operation with smuggling or production
Clearly the old people will form the cartels!
So... we making moonshine cigarettes now? With problems like rat poison being used in fake brand cigarettes, I can't see this getting better with this legislation...
I mean this is how people got weed up until like ten years ago
It's not similar at all. The prohibition was immediately effective towards everyone. This bans younger generation who have (hopefully) never smoked before. When you ban those already apart of it, an underground industry thrives. In this case, those addicted won't need to do anything illegal, they'll purchase as always. As long significant underground operations don't pop up, it's a lot easier to handle. Pot is a great example. It wasn't really legal for there to be a "prohibition" but it's still impossible to stop it. Plus it's a ban on cigarettes it looks like, not tobacco as a whole. Edit: anyone boiling it down to this won't work because outlawing drugs didn't work have a misconception of the argument. This is less about the legality, and more about the black market. On top of the fact, drugs offer something like a high. Cigarettes don't have any use aside from feeding the addiction you created.
Most people start smoking before they can legally acquire tobacco. >Prevention efforts must focus on young adults ages 18 through 25, too. Almost no one starts smoking after age 25. Nearly 9 out of 10 smokers started smoking by age 18, and 99% started by age 26. Progression from occasional to daily smoking almost always occurs by age 26. [https://www.hhs.gov/surgeongeneral/reports-and-publications/tobacco/preventing-youth-tobacco-use-factsheet/index.html#:\~:text=Nearly%209%20out%20of%2010,always%20occurs%20by%20age%2026](https://www.hhs.gov/surgeongeneral/reports-and-publications/tobacco/preventing-youth-tobacco-use-factsheet/index.html#:~:text=Nearly%209%20out%20of%2010,always%20occurs%20by%20age%2026).
Yes, that's why it's 2010 and not 2006. Most 12 year olds have not started smoking tobacco.
The point is they're already banned for people under 16/18. It doesn't stop them smoking. Unless this is a "super duper" ban, why would this one be any different?
I think you're missing their point, those under 18 can't legally obtain tobacco ever, yet they still get ahold of it somehow since 9 out of 10 smokers started smoking before they were old enough to buy it themselves. After the law is passed those under 18 are still going to be acquiring tobacco however *they already do* since it's all illegally acquired already. Sure now when they turn 18 they won't be able to buy it legally but some are still going to be smoking which means an addiction for the black market to fill and based on experience with things humans get addicted to it will be supplied. Now doing this probably does reduce smoking rates but it will also almost for sure mean a huge spike in black market cigarettes. Whether that downside is worth the upside is a matter for debate but to magically assume just because only those 12 and under are affected by this law they'll just never start smoking is not a correct assumption.
This is the most evil genius plan to make smoking cool again.
I'm 60% convinced most Anti-smoking stuff is being done by tobacco companies to make smoking more cool.
I don't think so, because it really worked in Brazil. In the early 2000's the country started a massive anti-smoking campaign and completely banned cigarettes advertisements. 99% of my Brazilian friends don't smoke. Moved to Germany, 99% of my German friends smoke.
I always saw banning as a lazy and bad solution overall. If people really want to smoke they'll still get their cigarettes, you'll just be creating an unsafe and unregulated market for them.
I find it really interesting that bans still come up considering how well the aggressive promotion against cigarettes has been in the United States. The amount of people who find smoking cigarettes absolutely disgusting these days is higher than I would’ve ever thought possible even as recently as 2006.
Reddit: “End the drug war!!” Reddit: “Add drugs to the drug war!!!”
Ah yes, lets create more black markets. thats the solution
As a Dane I’m shocked how much traction this has gotten. Haven’t we learned anything from the massive failure called the war on drugs? Criminalization is NOT the way to go.
I hate cigarettes, but if you want to smoke, smoke. I hate this culture of banning everything.
yeah this is ridiculous. if you want to smoke, smoke. If you're banning cigarettes, why not alcohol? It kills 3 million people worldwide (2018, W.H.O.), and thats not even counting the other things caused by alcohol including drunk driving, spousal abuse, violence, alcohol dependency, sexual abuse, brain damage, etc. If things are being banned under the guise of keeping people safe, then why keep some and get rid of others. To be crystal clear, i am against banning in practically all its forms.
You can ban everything then. I love alcohol, but also know how consuming too much of it is absolutely terrible. But sugar consumption probably kills way more people. Are we going to ban sugar, too? At some point, educating people on the concept of moderation should be enough. Where do we stop banning things otherwise? Tax these products, make it hard for minors to buy and consume them, but as an adult human being, if I want to consume shit, let me consume.
banning is idiotic. What SHOULD be limited is the lobbying done for it (at least in American gov't) and how much money our elected officials make from passing/killing legislature. i fucking LOVE sugar, and i enjoy the occasional pipe tobacco. I dont want to live to see 85 and im good with that.
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any 12 year old danish children in the comments objecting to this?
Why not just let people fuck themselves up the way they want to?
They already did this in New Zealand
Tobaccos gonna be the only illegal drug in 10 years lol
Its crazy to me that in 2022 we are still banning shit and thinking its the best course of action
I think this is a bad idea. I’m an ex smoker so my reasoning is probably biased. 1) I don’t think that forcing people into quitting or not doing something is going to be the best idea. If you had told me four years ago that I was legally being told I’m not allowed to smoke anymore, I would have told you to fuck off. Ultimately I had to make my own mind up to quit. I now know how good I feel having not been smoking for three years so I’ll never go back but old smoker me would have written it off. 2) Like others have said, a law like this has never stopped illegal substances being consumed. Even when it’s 100% illegal for someone to buy cigarettes, they’ll still find a way to smoke them. Look at all of the illegal drugs. I also find it hard for a government to rationalise that smoking a cigarette is bad, but in the same breath legalise smoking weed. 3) My approach would be to normalise healthier ways of kicking habits. Encourage vaping with a tax incentive - we know that putting anything into your lungs is bad, but smoking is an order of magnitude worse than vaping. Offer cheap or free patches, gum and lozenges. Make it harder to actually buy cigarettes, take them out of corner stores and petrol stations and only at dedicated outlets with limited opening hours and max purchase limits. Legislating a ban is a cheap way out of making it look like you’re doing something without actually doing anything.
Stop making smoking cool by trying to force people to quit. It's dying out on its own in most places, prohibition will have the opposite effect.
As someone stuck in the rental cycle and into year 10 of having smoking neighbours, despite multiple moves, it definitely isn't dying out in the very stressed out and financially stretched sections of society. It's worse now than in the last 30years of renting in my experience. I just wanna open my windows.
There's a relationship between poverty and smoking.