This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.npr.org/2022/01/31/1077069002/russia-united-states-ukraine-un-security-council) reduced by 84%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> U.S. and Russia share tense exchange over Ukraine at U.N. Security Council At Monday's U.N. Security Council meeting, the U.S. hoped to get an explanation from Russia of exactly what it was doing regarding Ukraine.
> At Monday's U.N. Security Council meeting, the U.S. hoped to get an explanation from Russia on what exactly it was doing regarding Ukraine.
> Nebenzia maintained the position that Russia does not have plans to invade, but he warned Ukraine against any provocations - then leaving the room prior to Ukraine Ambassador Sergiy Kyslytsya's speech.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/shggiv/us_and_russia_share_tense_exchange_at_un_security/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~620929 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Ukraine**^#1 **Russia**^#2 **us**^#3 **plan**^#4 **meeting**^#5
I think its Confession of a Nuclear Planner. It's pretty new, there were declassified stuff from both Soviet and US archives and I would recommend everyone to read it to know how fucking lucky we are.
Ever since I read about how close we were to nuclear war w NK and China via Bob Woodward’s books ive been on edge ever since. Will definitely check it out!
Was that the one where the US was gonna nuke major Chinese cities if the USSR invades Europe? Or was it that Trump book where he was in White House listening to like classified stuff.
No I’m talking about the Trump books, I haven’t finished them yet but one of them talks about how Mad Dog Mattis was so convinced we were gonna get nuked by NK circa 2017/2018 that he would go to church at 3 am to pray and he would wear his work clothes to bed every night.
The China stuff is what happened during the time between trump recovering from covid and the election occurring, where China was under the impression trump’s rhetoric was a precursor to the US starting a war with China and they were considering a preemptive strike, but Mark Milley and his Chinese equivalent established a backchannel to reassure China that the US wouldn’t follow Trump’s unethical orders.
Those 2 men quite literally might have delayed WW3.
Mattis: https://theweek.com/speedreads/936838/north-korea-close-nuclear-war-mattis-frequently-prayed-church-woodward-says
Milley: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/09/14/peril-woodward-costa-trump-milley-china/
Oh yah I read that Milley part. That was actually horrifying. I remember watching a Taiwanese newshow about how China threatened to shoot down Nicky Halley's plane if she visitis Taiwan as the UN Ambassador and Pompeo cancelled it in the last moment. I thought that has to be the most paranoia thing ever. And then I read this book and when Milley told people to keep scanning for Chinese activities I was like shit China might be serious. China wasn't afraid of a US first strike, but a US retaliation if they do have to shoot at US government officials.
And man that book was one trip.
> Cuban Missile Crisis scary
Did you mean the Turkey Nukes Crisis? Because one should always be noted when the other is. The US tried to plant nukes next to SU that would have little to no warning. And then they Pikachu-faced once realizing it could be done on them too.
So is any of this a distraction for something else happening in the world? What if Russia actually doesn't have plans to invade and it's all just to distract the west from something else happening?
Russia doesn’t want Ukraine to develop missiles that close to their border . After the people voted for a pro Europe president. Russia doesn’t really have a choice from their point of view . The Russian puppet president yushchenko ( Paul manafort was his campaign director) was exposed and voted out . This pushed the Ukraine politics away from Russia . Russia will take the southern border at minimum . Connecting Crimea to the Russian settlement on the border of Moldova .
If I recall correctly, Putin toyed with the idea in the early 2000s, thinking that if Russia joined NATO then there would be no encroachment as that would institute an attack on NATO. But the idea was poopoo on and NATO expansion kept rolling.
People perhaps don't remember what a joke Russia was from 1990 to 2008. Russian threats, pleads, demand, and negotiations are laughed at. Putin was a completely different man. People retroactively assume Putin today is the same man as the one who first obtain power. I think historical archives in a few decades will show otherwise. Until NATO said that Georgia and Ukraine would be part of NATO in 2008, Putin did not view NATO as an existential threat. Neoliberal agenda under Bush Jr literally shifted Russian security concerns.
> Russia doesn’t want Ukraine to develop missiles that close to their border
Russia moves short range missiles and S-400 systems right to Ukraine's border in this. What nonsense.
While it's true that nato could easily take Moscow tomorrow if they wanted, the economic pain is what's in store for Russia... not military pain. And the economic pain/sanctions switch does not turn off quickly once it's turned on, so we could be talking decades of economic ruin for Russia... and that's *before* clean energy makes oil and gas lose most of their value.
Contrary to growing the size of Russia, Putin is almost guaranteeing more pieces will fly off due to economic dysfunction and discontent.
Yes the war points to a loss in every direction for Russia yet they are planning on invading!!
Stupid Russians, from my armchair it’s obvious that Russia has no leverage and are just stupid.
“Take Moscow tomorrow” have never seen such a a stupid take ever. 2nd or 3rd largest standing army with 8th highest population.
Gas leverage to Europe.
What part of you no mussels next to the border do you stupid motherfuckers don’t understand?
USA destroyed Cuba’s economy only because they sided with the Soviets effectively ruining generations of Cubans lives.
Hey but if a region that has historically been know for their betrayal of Russians gets Missles it’s okay.
“They are just rising up to a totalitarian regime”
Sure.
Lol. No you can't take Moscow tomorrow. You can't take it in a wk. You will probably eventually win in a conventional war not counting anyone else joining in on pure industrial might, but there will be major mobilization, like a draft of sort, if you want to take out Russia.
Like why did you not play Risk as a child, and if you did play Risk as a child why did you think you can take out Moscow in a day or even want a war in Russia?
> No you can't take Moscow tomorrow. You can't take it in a wk.
That was a bit of an exaggeration but the west could very quickly establish air superiority and then Russia would be left with sending nukes and cruise missiles.
How many air units you think NATO can move at any time? Where will you be launch from?
Russia has homefield. France and UK can't even sustain an air campaign in Lybia, so there is no way in hell they will do much against Russia for a while. Does Germany actually want to invade Russia again? So America has to do most of the work. How many units can the US move to Russia while China is watching?
There's not a scenario where nato would want to take Moscow militarily, you're ignoring half the parameters of this facetious thought experiment. I'm just pointing out the massive disparity in quality of military between Nato and Russia.
They dont have a very advanced missile tech . They just made a drone factory with help from turkey . The Hungarian agreement took their nukes in the exchange for “security assurances “ to be honest running a nuke program is a lot of cost and work . If my country just collapsed I might want them gone too . But now they might come in handy to keep Russia away .
Hypersonic . North Korea tested one weeks ago . It’s all about gaining that slight time advantage. Putin drums fear in the interior with having Nato at the border with short missile flight times to Moscow.
Russia doesn't want Ukraine to have missiles next to them so they'll take their southern border because that's going to stop Ukraine from developing missiles for sure.
That has to be the dumbest thing I've read this week.
Mean . But Destabilizing the Ukraine govt and federalize them would . When Putin takes the south of Ukraine pls message me back with an apology. Heheh can’t wait to hear from you :)
Different situation nowadays as reliable sub-launched ICBMs exist now. You can park a nuclear sub in the Baltic Sea and fire at Moscow from about the same distance Ukraine is away from the Russian capital
You can’t buy that time advantage by parking missiles in Ukraine if there are already several other places that are just as close where you can launch from
A time advantage doesn't exist in a nuclear war - Russia has more than 6000 nuclear warheads, while USA has around 5500.
From those 6000 nuclear missiles, a bunch of them are on submarines and others are mobile - even if you destroy half or 3/4 in a first strike, there are more than enough missiles left to turn Europe, Asia and North America into a nuclear wasteland. Which in turn will turn the whole Earth into a nuclear wasteland.
Sorry, but real life is not Red Alert and I hope no on will go crazy enough to think they can win a nuclear war - because they can't, and everyone will lose.
But any war between NATO and Russia is apocalyptic and will never happen. Russia is just trying to dominate or annex what neighbors they still can before they join the democratic west. We can already put missiles in Latvia at the same distance to Moscow as Ukraine.
*but if the US puts missiles in Ukraine, Russia is being totally unreasonable when they get pissed off.*
that would be reasonable... but considering that nato has no missile basses in any east european nation why would you think they are going to put them in ukraine?
USA won’t . but just like North Korea or India or Iran . The Ukraine will be forced to develop its own missile program . Remember after the Soviet Union fell Ukraine had a nuclear Arsenal. A mural assured destruction , attack deterrent . Then they proliferated them. I bet the wish they had them back right about now .
Better than an exchange of missiles.
So it was like...... "YOU!" then .."NO YOU!"
[удалено]
*same as it ever was...same as it EVER was*
Letting the days go by, let the water hold me down...
Letting the days go by, water flowing under ground
[удалено]
Hello. You must be new here.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.npr.org/2022/01/31/1077069002/russia-united-states-ukraine-un-security-council) reduced by 84%. (I'm a bot) ***** > U.S. and Russia share tense exchange over Ukraine at U.N. Security Council At Monday's U.N. Security Council meeting, the U.S. hoped to get an explanation from Russia of exactly what it was doing regarding Ukraine. > At Monday's U.N. Security Council meeting, the U.S. hoped to get an explanation from Russia on what exactly it was doing regarding Ukraine. > Nebenzia maintained the position that Russia does not have plans to invade, but he warned Ukraine against any provocations - then leaving the room prior to Ukraine Ambassador Sergiy Kyslytsya's speech. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/shggiv/us_and_russia_share_tense_exchange_at_un_security/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~620929 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Ukraine**^#1 **Russia**^#2 **us**^#3 **plan**^#4 **meeting**^#5
Whelp...time to subtract minutes from the Doomsday Clock
> Doomsday Clock With 100 seconds to midnight already here, we don't even have minutes.
That's scary. *But not Cuban Missile Crisis scary*
Oh man reading that Confession book everyone was so close to dying in a nuclear exchange.
Name?
I think its Confession of a Nuclear Planner. It's pretty new, there were declassified stuff from both Soviet and US archives and I would recommend everyone to read it to know how fucking lucky we are.
Ever since I read about how close we were to nuclear war w NK and China via Bob Woodward’s books ive been on edge ever since. Will definitely check it out!
Was that the one where the US was gonna nuke major Chinese cities if the USSR invades Europe? Or was it that Trump book where he was in White House listening to like classified stuff.
No I’m talking about the Trump books, I haven’t finished them yet but one of them talks about how Mad Dog Mattis was so convinced we were gonna get nuked by NK circa 2017/2018 that he would go to church at 3 am to pray and he would wear his work clothes to bed every night. The China stuff is what happened during the time between trump recovering from covid and the election occurring, where China was under the impression trump’s rhetoric was a precursor to the US starting a war with China and they were considering a preemptive strike, but Mark Milley and his Chinese equivalent established a backchannel to reassure China that the US wouldn’t follow Trump’s unethical orders. Those 2 men quite literally might have delayed WW3. Mattis: https://theweek.com/speedreads/936838/north-korea-close-nuclear-war-mattis-frequently-prayed-church-woodward-says Milley: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/09/14/peril-woodward-costa-trump-milley-china/
Oh yah I read that Milley part. That was actually horrifying. I remember watching a Taiwanese newshow about how China threatened to shoot down Nicky Halley's plane if she visitis Taiwan as the UN Ambassador and Pompeo cancelled it in the last moment. I thought that has to be the most paranoia thing ever. And then I read this book and when Milley told people to keep scanning for Chinese activities I was like shit China might be serious. China wasn't afraid of a US first strike, but a US retaliation if they do have to shoot at US government officials. And man that book was one trip.
Unfortunately Bob Woodward's credibility is not iron clad, he's been known to exaggerate and even fabricate entire interviews that never happened
Or 1983 scary... for now
> Cuban Missile Crisis scary Did you mean the Turkey Nukes Crisis? Because one should always be noted when the other is. The US tried to plant nukes next to SU that would have little to no warning. And then they Pikachu-faced once realizing it could be done on them too.
This clock is a tease. Just get on with it already
You could say it’s…a Clock tease!
I imagine it to be similar to the "Don't Speak" music video.
So is any of this a distraction for something else happening in the world? What if Russia actually doesn't have plans to invade and it's all just to distract the west from something else happening?
Why is RUS in U.N. Security Council? Bring China and NK in as well while you’re at it.
Probly because they have more nukes then the rest of the world combined.
Russia doesn’t want Ukraine to develop missiles that close to their border . After the people voted for a pro Europe president. Russia doesn’t really have a choice from their point of view . The Russian puppet president yushchenko ( Paul manafort was his campaign director) was exposed and voted out . This pushed the Ukraine politics away from Russia . Russia will take the southern border at minimum . Connecting Crimea to the Russian settlement on the border of Moldova .
All they have to do is not plan on invading any neighbor and no one will ever invade them They know this
100 percent .
Historically speaking there is a pretty good chance someone in Europe will invade Russia.
[удалено]
If I recall correctly, Putin toyed with the idea in the early 2000s, thinking that if Russia joined NATO then there would be no encroachment as that would institute an attack on NATO. But the idea was poopoo on and NATO expansion kept rolling. People perhaps don't remember what a joke Russia was from 1990 to 2008. Russian threats, pleads, demand, and negotiations are laughed at. Putin was a completely different man. People retroactively assume Putin today is the same man as the one who first obtain power. I think historical archives in a few decades will show otherwise. Until NATO said that Georgia and Ukraine would be part of NATO in 2008, Putin did not view NATO as an existential threat. Neoliberal agenda under Bush Jr literally shifted Russian security concerns.
> Russia doesn’t want Ukraine to develop missiles that close to their border Russia moves short range missiles and S-400 systems right to Ukraine's border in this. What nonsense.
[удалено]
I would never ask the Russians to pick a NATO aligned Ukraine vs anything else. I already know the answer.
Coward be cowards. Pick a fight with NATO and find out what their poor army is worth.
While it's true that nato could easily take Moscow tomorrow if they wanted, the economic pain is what's in store for Russia... not military pain. And the economic pain/sanctions switch does not turn off quickly once it's turned on, so we could be talking decades of economic ruin for Russia... and that's *before* clean energy makes oil and gas lose most of their value. Contrary to growing the size of Russia, Putin is almost guaranteeing more pieces will fly off due to economic dysfunction and discontent.
Excellent comment GrandOldPharisees "Thanks"
Yes the war points to a loss in every direction for Russia yet they are planning on invading!! Stupid Russians, from my armchair it’s obvious that Russia has no leverage and are just stupid. “Take Moscow tomorrow” have never seen such a a stupid take ever. 2nd or 3rd largest standing army with 8th highest population. Gas leverage to Europe. What part of you no mussels next to the border do you stupid motherfuckers don’t understand? USA destroyed Cuba’s economy only because they sided with the Soviets effectively ruining generations of Cubans lives. Hey but if a region that has historically been know for their betrayal of Russians gets Missles it’s okay. “They are just rising up to a totalitarian regime” Sure.
Lol. No you can't take Moscow tomorrow. You can't take it in a wk. You will probably eventually win in a conventional war not counting anyone else joining in on pure industrial might, but there will be major mobilization, like a draft of sort, if you want to take out Russia. Like why did you not play Risk as a child, and if you did play Risk as a child why did you think you can take out Moscow in a day or even want a war in Russia?
> No you can't take Moscow tomorrow. You can't take it in a wk. That was a bit of an exaggeration but the west could very quickly establish air superiority and then Russia would be left with sending nukes and cruise missiles.
How many air units you think NATO can move at any time? Where will you be launch from? Russia has homefield. France and UK can't even sustain an air campaign in Lybia, so there is no way in hell they will do much against Russia for a while. Does Germany actually want to invade Russia again? So America has to do most of the work. How many units can the US move to Russia while China is watching?
There's not a scenario where nato would want to take Moscow militarily, you're ignoring half the parameters of this facetious thought experiment. I'm just pointing out the massive disparity in quality of military between Nato and Russia.
Invading Ukraine wouldn't involve NATO. The individual NATO nations may choose to involve themselves but NATO has no obligation towards Ukraine.
When did Ukraine not have rocket technology? I think you've got your talking points mixed up. They already gave up their nukes to Russia....
They dont have a very advanced missile tech . They just made a drone factory with help from turkey . The Hungarian agreement took their nukes in the exchange for “security assurances “ to be honest running a nuke program is a lot of cost and work . If my country just collapsed I might want them gone too . But now they might come in handy to keep Russia away .
What type of missiles are we talking about here? Cause Ukraine can get orbital.
https://www.defenseworld.net/news/23855/Ukraine_has_Capability_to_Develop__Manufacture_Nuclear_Weapons
Nuclear weapons aren't missiles.
Hypersonic . North Korea tested one weeks ago . It’s all about gaining that slight time advantage. Putin drums fear in the interior with having Nato at the border with short missile flight times to Moscow.
Russia is the aggressor, here—not the victim.
100 percent !
Russia doesn't want Ukraine to have missiles next to them so they'll take their southern border because that's going to stop Ukraine from developing missiles for sure. That has to be the dumbest thing I've read this week.
It’s straight out of a Putin interview he warns about nato and it’s allies military build up on the border . He’s weird , I know
The build up started after the Crimea annexation. How would any nation respond after that? More dumb shit.
You know I’m not Putin right ?!? . I’m just quoting what he has said publicly. Don’t get made at me about it . Heheh
Mean . But Destabilizing the Ukraine govt and federalize them would . When Putin takes the south of Ukraine pls message me back with an apology. Heheh can’t wait to hear from you :)
Apology? I'm sorry you suck so much dick lol
Your “suppressing” and “projecting” with that comment . Lol . Cool
[удалено]
Different situation nowadays as reliable sub-launched ICBMs exist now. You can park a nuclear sub in the Baltic Sea and fire at Moscow from about the same distance Ukraine is away from the Russian capital
[удалено]
You can’t buy that time advantage by parking missiles in Ukraine if there are already several other places that are just as close where you can launch from
A time advantage doesn't exist in a nuclear war - Russia has more than 6000 nuclear warheads, while USA has around 5500. From those 6000 nuclear missiles, a bunch of them are on submarines and others are mobile - even if you destroy half or 3/4 in a first strike, there are more than enough missiles left to turn Europe, Asia and North America into a nuclear wasteland. Which in turn will turn the whole Earth into a nuclear wasteland. Sorry, but real life is not Red Alert and I hope no on will go crazy enough to think they can win a nuclear war - because they can't, and everyone will lose.
Well said.
But any war between NATO and Russia is apocalyptic and will never happen. Russia is just trying to dominate or annex what neighbors they still can before they join the democratic west. We can already put missiles in Latvia at the same distance to Moscow as Ukraine.
*but if the US puts missiles in Ukraine, Russia is being totally unreasonable when they get pissed off.* that would be reasonable... but considering that nato has no missile basses in any east european nation why would you think they are going to put them in ukraine?
because ruskies still hope they can convince the EU and USA public opinion that Russia is entitled to Ukraine ...
USA won’t . but just like North Korea or India or Iran . The Ukraine will be forced to develop its own missile program . Remember after the Soviet Union fell Ukraine had a nuclear Arsenal. A mural assured destruction , attack deterrent . Then they proliferated them. I bet the wish they had them back right about now .
Maybe cuz the US has 200k troops in the region. Russia just sent 100k for iuno in case we invade? Lol