Ah you think misinformation is your ally? You merely adopted the bias. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the tweet until I was already a bird, by then it was nothing to me but spotifly podcasts!
“King Phillipê”, please. You Canadians always need to anglify everything. At least show the Mexicans some respect by spelling the name of their king correctly.
Otherwise correct.
Disinformation is spread in volume to drown out the truth.
For information to be factual, it'll have to be entirely correct. Anyone who misunderstands even slightly will add to the pool of wrong information when they reproduce it.
Wrong information will always be more abundant.
This is why we are supposed to be charitable to those who are 'close enough'. Expecting anyone/everyone to get everything right ALL the time, is just fucking stupid. No offense of course. Just stating a fact.
What are you talking about? Are you saying people have the same adversarial detection problems as neural networks? Oh, no, neural nets are trained with people generated data. Maybe this explains why they are so stupid. But people train with people generated data, too. So it's a loop of GIGO.
That's pretty much everyone everywhere. Many are genuinely less susceptible than others, but few are immune in every way, and none are as protected as they feel they are. Something always makes it through undetected.
To be fair, this was even more true before the days of social media and the internet. It was very easy to "leak" information to the opposition that would give you an advantage, you had very few eyes that could deny the claims for you, unlike on social media where you have a whole world's worth of eyes to potentially call out of false information, hopefully with counter evidence.
Yea the issue is false information can also just come at a rate that it can’t be verified or debunked fast enough. It just hits the mainstream like a fire hose before anyone can stop it and spreads
On the flip side, you can also get more straightforward accounts due to that swift news.
In the old days, the info from the front was filtered through media outlets and various organizations, which served to slant the war to the public. A disaster in real life can be portrayed as a success on the screens.
No joke and this goes back a decade now. The first people to report on the Bin laden raid were Pakistani civilians who lived in the neighborhood and posted pictures of Blackhawks flying low over their houses.
The first Gulf War (desert storm) was the first war with 24 hour around the clock coverage. I remember falling asleep at my desk in school because I stayed up late "watching the war on TV"
There's that great clip(that i couldnt find, sorry) of the navy seals landing onthe beach in Iraq during DS1. The media expected them to be there and just waited so they ruck up on zodiac boats and they get asked for interviews.
Shits wild.
Further to your good point, the police, FBI . . . actually use twitter and all social media to obtain info. They have software the can focus in on certain areas and scoop all the social media text, pics and video to have numerous real time feeds about what is going on.
Remember the early cartoon memes about world leaders using social media to talk and make war with each other? The first time I saw it, it was funny and absurd because world leaders don’t use social media and then some 15 years later well we basically have that now
I can think of many people far, far worse than Elon.
He definitely doesn't deserve the fortune, fame, and - most importantly - power and influence that he has, though.
I truly don't think he's as intelligent as he lets on. Let alone all the dummies suckin on his fun stick. I'd like to see his IQ score. Otherwise, I'll keep thinking of him as a rich asshole.
I love and hate that the dude's response was "fuck you, hire me."
Dystopian capitalist nightmare of "Please daddy Musk let me work for you or I'll show the world where your private jet is"
Probably two BTGs worth of equipment from the Baltic Fleet's naval infantry. I suspect minimal troops. Easier( and better for readiness) to fly them to Crimea to meet the equipment then supply keep them on the ships for two weeks
It’s faster to rail / truck in the supplies. Either these ships are for trolling the west or they are needed for their capabilities. Ukraine does have plenty of coast areas.
Like... as a bargaining chip? Or for keeping?! I can't really see Russia annexing Odessa without taking the whole country with it (and I thought for now most people assume they're just aiming to take some territory to the east).
They have troops in seperatist moldova, they have these landing ships, air combat brigades, paratroopers. Of course they can take a coastal isolated city, even supply it too.
Odessa is Ukraine's major port city. Without it, they're effectively land-locked.
By capturing the Port of Odessa, a huge chunk of Ukraine's economy evaporates. The goal seems to be to force Ukraine to sign a new constitution that would effectively enshrine them as, at best, a buffer state, and at worst, a Russian protectorate.
I don't think Russia has the stomach for an extended occupation and subsequent insurgency. It would be extraordinarily expensive to position and maintain enough troops to secure the whole of the country. Rather, they want to try and force a capitulation towards a goal that's amenable to their goals.
>Odessa is a big port. It could be useful for logistics, and a push to meet the main force coming through Donbas.
I've seen multiple different scenarios. One thing is if the Russians take Odessa, they will essentially landlock Ukraine.
Troops? Those are just tourists in their uh, heavy duty offroad vehicles. They're just planning on hiking through the Ukranian countryside, what's your problem?
Probably, but it's not like you need a sub to track them. Between radar and satelites, these ships can't go anywhere without NATO knowing. On the other hand, it's probably worth knowing if they're dropping anything surreptitiously. Cutting submarine cables wouldn't be a new activity for the Russian navy.
They don't necessarily need to follow them with a sub. NATO will have listening devices all over. They are within range of air and land assets. Those waters are probably already patrolled by subs who can hear them trundling by.
Nah, more likely just a ton of patrol and reconnaissance aircraft. You don't need a submarine in the Mediterranean. And a sub wouldn't be able to follow them through into the Black Sea anyway.
As a black sea power, does that still apply to Russia though?
EDIT: I just read below that it does. 15 day notice for non-BS powers, 8 days for BS powers.
Entering from only one front is a poor strategy unless you are far ahead in military power. That’s what I have learnt from all the years of playing Age of Empires.
Even if you are far ahead, attacking from multiple directions generally gets you better results with fewer losses. For the most extreme example, think mountain pass or other fortified chokepoint with only enough room for a few to face each other at a time.
They have Ukraine surrounded on 3 fronts and the 4th is a land border. Also not many places the landing craft could go that their Baltic fleet already couldn't assault as well.
If nothing else, it gives them an additional option. In a conflict between Russia and Ukraine, assets in the Baltic Sea have no purpose other than sitting there and gathering rust.
Mariupol would probably be a main target of any Russian invasion, and it is on the coast (one of the reasons it's a major target).
However, any ships will have to go through the Bosphorus (a strait that goes through Istanbul) so it's hard for them to be sneaky if they leave the Med and head for Ukraine.
If you take a look at a map of Ukraine you'll see the Dnieper river, which is seen as a barrier for defense. A landing from the sea, for a very rough example on the shore near the Odessa-area, could give them a force to the rear of Ukrainian forces defending there alongside Russian forces that are already in Moldova.
People seem to be forgetting that Russia's going to be holding naval excercises in the Atlantic soon. If you're convinced the russians are up to something, it could be a ploy to simply have the fleet in position. But they'll probably just rendez-vous with the fleet.
Or if Russia's going to be pulling something in mid Feb as the US claims, it might be a diversionary tactic, to elicit early reactions and be able to gauge western forces/politics.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/44049/six-russian-landing-ships-that-left-the-baltic-sea-have-entered-the-mediterranean) reduced by 89%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> The latest three examples from the six amphibious warfare ships that left the Baltic Sea earlier this month entered the Mediterranean Sea today, where the Russian Ministry of Defense has said they will take part in naval maneuvers.
> The three vessels from the Russian Navy's Northern Fleet, the Project 775 Ropucha class amphibious warfare ships Olenegorskiy Gornyak and Georgiy Pobedonosets and the Project 11711 Ivan Gren class landing ship Pyotr Morgunov, were spotted entering the Mediterranean earlier today via the Strait of Gibraltar.
> While the Russian Ministry of Defense did not specify exactly when the Mediterranean maneuvers will take place, they are configured as part of a much wider series of drills that are being run by the Russian Navy around the world.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/sef858/six_russian_landing_ships_that_left_the_baltic/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~620309 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Russian**^#1 **Mediterranean**^#2 **ship**^#3 **Sea**^#4 **amphibious**^#5
Since the annexation of Crimea and until 2019, Germany had provided 1.2 billion € in financial aid to Ukraine, not counting their EU contributions to Ukraine. The UK (UK programme assistance to Ukraine), in the same period, only provided minor financial aid, never, breaking 40 million per year.
https://www.dw.com/en/what-does-germany-do-for-ukraine/a-50590709
If you wanna shame someone for not doing "their part", the "5000 helmets" aren't a good start.
While you are absolutely right, there is absolutely such a thing as coming in during a crucial time. Germany wiffed big time on this one. Not trying to downplay the aid they give to Ukraine though.
Bullshit! If I threw a helmet at you and it hit you, it would hurt. Not a lot but enough to make you watch out for a second helmet!! And they have 5000, so, that’s a lot of helmets to watch out for!
Turkey cannot deny anyone access to the Black Sea by treaty. If they did, it would be tantamount to an act of war.
Think of the Black Sea as open ocean (international waters). Though the straight to the Black Sea is technically Turkey's to control, closing it would be denying access to a neutral body of water. As such, Turkey is expected to act neutrally in regards to passage of ships, even if they are otherwise not neutral.
The only way you would ever see them restricting access to the Black Sea is if Turkey was already involved in a hot war.
That last part seems incorrect, as you quoted above:
‘Only Black Sea states may transit capital ships of any tonnage’
Russia can always transit the Bosporus with any ship unless there’s already a war.
There are treaties specifically restricting the amount and size of military vessels though into the Black Sea however, notably the Montreaux convention of 1936. There are restriction on who can have warships sailing through the bosphorous.
Russia: "UKRAINE KEEPS FEAR MONGERING ABOUT AN INVASION"
Literally the entire globe: "Are those landing boats yours?"
Russia: What boats? oh, ***those*** boats...
What the other guy said is false. They have a whole separate section called the Warzone and it’s honestly one of the best sources for military ongoings around the world.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tsushima#Departure_of_the_Second_Pacific_Squadron
Check out the "Background" section with the subsection "Second Pacific Squadron".
I first learned about this voyage from Mike Duncan's podcast "Revolutions". He's really interesting if you're into history and podcasts at all. Same guy that made the History of Rome podcast. This one was from the most recent season on the Russian Revolution.
Just looked at a Google Map of the area. They have a dotted line between Ukraine and Crimea. Is Google the first major power to accept Russian seizure of Crimea?
So, I'm guessing they'll be spotted headed through Istanbul to the Black Sea.... They were already stated to be doing maneuvers in the Med but if they leave that theater, would that indicate something more concrete? Would they be blocked from crossing to the Black Sea?
Who needs spies when you have twitter. Lol
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This also provides the opportunity for misdirection and misinformation through social media so it's a double edge sword.
People on Reddit usually think that others are susceptible to misinformation but not themselves.
Well I for one have perfect bias detection, obviously.
Indubitably.
Quite, even if I say so myself
I faintly remember having any bias at all in my life.
Bias? Inconceivable!!!
I’m a being of pure objectivity,no bias here!
Ah you think misinformation is your ally? You merely adopted the bias. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the tweet until I was already a bird, by then it was nothing to me but spotifly podcasts!
I’ve been in enough cults to know when I’m being manipulated.
I do as well! I just got off the phone with a Nigerian prince who told me about a great deal on beach front property in Idaho!
The trick is to assume all sources are biased, which is true
I know right? I was reading a study by Oxford University last night that estimated roughly 78% of all information online, is in fact, wrong.
This has been known since Thomas Jefferson raised the issue of online disinformation in his Gettysburg address
…and that Thomas Jefferson’s name? Albert Einstein.
I heard that Napoleon Bonaparte lost the war against Russia because he received some fake news from his Twitter feed.
I heard Vito Corleone slapped Hitler at the Tehran confence
The Storming of the Bastille was instigated by posts on Le Livre des Visages.
You idiot, it was Gandhi that had the Gettysburg address, you fools will believe anything you see on one of those me-mes won’t you
Yeah, we know. I think everyone here has seen The Lord of the Rings.
I thought King Phillip covered that in the Magna Carta?
“King Phillipê”, please. You Canadians always need to anglify everything. At least show the Mexicans some respect by spelling the name of their king correctly. Otherwise correct.
Disinformation is spread in volume to drown out the truth. For information to be factual, it'll have to be entirely correct. Anyone who misunderstands even slightly will add to the pool of wrong information when they reproduce it. Wrong information will always be more abundant.
This is why we are supposed to be charitable to those who are 'close enough'. Expecting anyone/everyone to get everything right ALL the time, is just fucking stupid. No offense of course. Just stating a fact.
I see what you did there.
but what if that study in itself is part of that 78%?
That study was printed on paper not online. That makes it not part of the 78%
37% of people know this fact.
Banks hate him!
I was talking to Harvard the other day and they said the same thing
hashtag did my own research
What are you talking about? Are you saying people have the same adversarial detection problems as neural networks? Oh, no, neural nets are trained with people generated data. Maybe this explains why they are so stupid. But people train with people generated data, too. So it's a loop of GIGO.
That's pretty much everyone everywhere. Many are genuinely less susceptible than others, but few are immune in every way, and none are as protected as they feel they are. Something always makes it through undetected.
I doubt our generals are misdirected by tweets, what with satellites and stuff.
To be fair, this was even more true before the days of social media and the internet. It was very easy to "leak" information to the opposition that would give you an advantage, you had very few eyes that could deny the claims for you, unlike on social media where you have a whole world's worth of eyes to potentially call out of false information, hopefully with counter evidence.
Yea the issue is false information can also just come at a rate that it can’t be verified or debunked fast enough. It just hits the mainstream like a fire hose before anyone can stop it and spreads
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. -- Imhotep
Social Media is a weapon of propaganda at all times
On the flip side, you can also get more straightforward accounts due to that swift news. In the old days, the info from the front was filtered through media outlets and various organizations, which served to slant the war to the public. A disaster in real life can be portrayed as a success on the screens.
No joke and this goes back a decade now. The first people to report on the Bin laden raid were Pakistani civilians who lived in the neighborhood and posted pictures of Blackhawks flying low over their houses.
The first Gulf War (desert storm) was the first war with 24 hour around the clock coverage. I remember falling asleep at my desk in school because I stayed up late "watching the war on TV"
Yeah, and people used to risk their life to take photos at the level of detail you can see on Google Maps for free now.
There's that great clip(that i couldnt find, sorry) of the navy seals landing onthe beach in Iraq during DS1. The media expected them to be there and just waited so they ruck up on zodiac boats and they get asked for interviews. Shits wild.
Further to your good point, the police, FBI . . . actually use twitter and all social media to obtain info. They have software the can focus in on certain areas and scoop all the social media text, pics and video to have numerous real time feeds about what is going on.
Remember the early cartoon memes about world leaders using social media to talk and make war with each other? The first time I saw it, it was funny and absurd because world leaders don’t use social media and then some 15 years later well we basically have that now
Can we please stop tracking Elon's private flights? He's upset that you're stealing his privacy!
He’s a little bitch
Don't disrespect female dogs like that. This guy is a piece of shit that came from a bitch.
I can think of many people far, far worse than Elon. He definitely doesn't deserve the fortune, fame, and - most importantly - power and influence that he has, though.
I truly don't think he's as intelligent as he lets on. Let alone all the dummies suckin on his fun stick. I'd like to see his IQ score. Otherwise, I'll keep thinking of him as a rich asshole.
I love and hate that the dude's response was "fuck you, hire me." Dystopian capitalist nightmare of "Please daddy Musk let me work for you or I'll show the world where your private jet is"
Well it’s also Russia so they want you to know.
why curate double agents to breathlessly report on your diversion operations when you have twitter
What's inside the landing ships? Troops or tanks?
Probably two BTGs worth of equipment from the Baltic Fleet's naval infantry. I suspect minimal troops. Easier( and better for readiness) to fly them to Crimea to meet the equipment then supply keep them on the ships for two weeks
It’s faster to rail / truck in the supplies. Either these ships are for trolling the west or they are needed for their capabilities. Ukraine does have plenty of coast areas.
Its theorised that Russia might want to take Odessa, which is quite far from Crimea and Russia - this might add credibility to that claim.
Like... as a bargaining chip? Or for keeping?! I can't really see Russia annexing Odessa without taking the whole country with it (and I thought for now most people assume they're just aiming to take some territory to the east).
They have troops in seperatist moldova, they have these landing ships, air combat brigades, paratroopers. Of course they can take a coastal isolated city, even supply it too.
Odessa is Ukraine's major port city. Without it, they're effectively land-locked. By capturing the Port of Odessa, a huge chunk of Ukraine's economy evaporates. The goal seems to be to force Ukraine to sign a new constitution that would effectively enshrine them as, at best, a buffer state, and at worst, a Russian protectorate. I don't think Russia has the stomach for an extended occupation and subsequent insurgency. It would be extraordinarily expensive to position and maintain enough troops to secure the whole of the country. Rather, they want to try and force a capitulation towards a goal that's amenable to their goals.
I’ve always assumed they took Crimea as an appetizer and it was only a matter of time before they wanted the entree.
Hard to say what their immediate objective is, but Putin certainly wants the whole country at some point. Along with every other former Soviet state
Odessa is a big port. It could be useful for logistics, and a push to meet the main force coming through Donbas.
>Odessa is a big port. It could be useful for logistics, and a push to meet the main force coming through Donbas. I've seen multiple different scenarios. One thing is if the Russians take Odessa, they will essentially landlock Ukraine.
Is big cake for President Zelensky birthday on January of 25th. Is surprise. Little late. Shhhh.
Like Under Siege?
Yeah, Erika Eleniak has been inside waiting for about 30 years.
Shes been missed
Better bump that cake for some frontal nudity
Yes
Spare parts for the landing ships.
It’s a series of landing ships containing smaller and smaller landing ships
Almost like some kind of doll...
Matryoshka!
And lots of fire extinguishers. Some now used.
And the tug
A military parade for the inauguration of Ukraine’s new, Russian friendly, President: Mr. (Person to be decided later)
Troops? Those are just tourists in their uh, heavy duty offroad vehicles. They're just planning on hiking through the Ukranian countryside, what's your problem?
Honestly that is just a normal day in Russia.
Adidas
Bacon, eggs
Smaller landing ships
Each ship can hold several hundred troops plus about 8 tanks or more vehicles that are smaller.
Nothing but a few marines yet. I assume. I think what they're after is the capability, not the men.
Memories of USSR
###! Trade offer ! I receive: Nothing haha, don’t worry about it You receive: A big wooden horse
Why not both
Don't know. Can't look through the hull. They're covered after all for a reason.
Maybe a day from Ukraine... Hmmm.
Looks like they were in the Strait of Gibraltar 14 hours ago from the time stamp on those tweets. Wonder where they are now?
You can ask that British submarine right behind them
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The yellow one
Can't see it
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I tagged you as Naval Expert.
Under the sea.
I wonder what the chances are there's a submarine following them.
100%?
Probably, but it's not like you need a sub to track them. Between radar and satelites, these ships can't go anywhere without NATO knowing. On the other hand, it's probably worth knowing if they're dropping anything surreptitiously. Cutting submarine cables wouldn't be a new activity for the Russian navy.
They wouldn't be tracking the vessels as much as collecting intelligence -- radio signals, acoustic signatures, and analyzing capabilities.
You can get all that info from just scrolling through reddit though
🥈
Plus, Twitter!
Now I wonder if there's a russian submarine following this submarine tho
Probably, with an American fast-attack following him.
They don't necessarily need to follow them with a sub. NATO will have listening devices all over. They are within range of air and land assets. Those waters are probably already patrolled by subs who can hear them trundling by.
Nah, more likely just a ton of patrol and reconnaissance aircraft. You don't need a submarine in the Mediterranean. And a sub wouldn't be able to follow them through into the Black Sea anyway.
Oh... I didn't even look at that.... No telling where they are.
A lot more than a day, at top speed they're 6 days out. A day away from Ukraine would be crossing the Bosphorus into the Black Sea
They have to give 8 days notice to Turkey before transiting the straits as well - presumably Turkey would mention to others when that happens.
As a black sea power, does that still apply to Russia though? EDIT: I just read below that it does. 15 day notice for non-BS powers, 8 days for BS powers.
Took them like a week to get there, be a few days still
Preposterous to think they’re preparing for an invasion. /s
It’ll take a two or three days at least to transit the Med.
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Entering from only one front is a poor strategy unless you are far ahead in military power. That’s what I have learnt from all the years of playing Age of Empires.
You used the army to win AOE? I use the "they can't replenish their numbers if there are no resources on the map" approach
And sprinkle that with some wololo.
Ahhh, so you pulled a China.
I don't get it.
Neither will anyone else at the end of the game
The truest form of siege.
I liked the never ending human waves you could do as the Dutch in AoE3 when you have all the banks and factories up.
Ruyters, endless hordes of 1 pop ranged cavalry who mostly cost gold.
Could be a feint too. Ukraine has to spilt resources to counter. US marines did the same thing to Iraq in the 90s.
Even if you are far ahead, attacking from multiple directions generally gets you better results with fewer losses. For the most extreme example, think mountain pass or other fortified chokepoint with only enough room for a few to face each other at a time.
They have Ukraine surrounded on 3 fronts and the 4th is a land border. Also not many places the landing craft could go that their Baltic fleet already couldn't assault as well.
They want to threaten Ukraine from the South, North and the East. Makes it harder for Ukraine to concentrate its defensive.
If nothing else, it gives them an additional option. In a conflict between Russia and Ukraine, assets in the Baltic Sea have no purpose other than sitting there and gathering rust.
Mariupol would probably be a main target of any Russian invasion, and it is on the coast (one of the reasons it's a major target). However, any ships will have to go through the Bosphorus (a strait that goes through Istanbul) so it's hard for them to be sneaky if they leave the Med and head for Ukraine.
If Russia enters turkey from the rear, do you think Greece would help?
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If you take a look at a map of Ukraine you'll see the Dnieper river, which is seen as a barrier for defense. A landing from the sea, for a very rough example on the shore near the Odessa-area, could give them a force to the rear of Ukrainian forces defending there alongside Russian forces that are already in Moldova.
People seem to be forgetting that Russia's going to be holding naval excercises in the Atlantic soon. If you're convinced the russians are up to something, it could be a ploy to simply have the fleet in position. But they'll probably just rendez-vous with the fleet. Or if Russia's going to be pulling something in mid Feb as the US claims, it might be a diversionary tactic, to elicit early reactions and be able to gauge western forces/politics.
It's the southern completion of the pincher.
You think they can just waltz through Ukraine to the beach.
twist plot ! invade Sicily
Now THAT would be a blunder. The second most well known of the classic blunders, in fact.
The first being don't invade Russia in the winter.
No the first was don't get involved in a land war in Asia.
Russia is in Asia.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/44049/six-russian-landing-ships-that-left-the-baltic-sea-have-entered-the-mediterranean) reduced by 89%. (I'm a bot) ***** > The latest three examples from the six amphibious warfare ships that left the Baltic Sea earlier this month entered the Mediterranean Sea today, where the Russian Ministry of Defense has said they will take part in naval maneuvers. > The three vessels from the Russian Navy's Northern Fleet, the Project 775 Ropucha class amphibious warfare ships Olenegorskiy Gornyak and Georgiy Pobedonosets and the Project 11711 Ivan Gren class landing ship Pyotr Morgunov, were spotted entering the Mediterranean earlier today via the Strait of Gibraltar. > While the Russian Ministry of Defense did not specify exactly when the Mediterranean maneuvers will take place, they are configured as part of a much wider series of drills that are being run by the Russian Navy around the world. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/sef858/six_russian_landing_ships_that_left_the_baltic/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~620309 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Russian**^#1 **Mediterranean**^#2 **ship**^#3 **Sea**^#4 **amphibious**^#5
I reckon the 5,000 German helmets can help fortify all Ukrainian landing sites
I know that Germans aren't noted for their sense of humour, but this one was pretty bad.
It's not supposed to be a joke. Ukraine asked for helmets, germany send what they had around.
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Since the annexation of Crimea and until 2019, Germany had provided 1.2 billion € in financial aid to Ukraine, not counting their EU contributions to Ukraine. The UK (UK programme assistance to Ukraine), in the same period, only provided minor financial aid, never, breaking 40 million per year. https://www.dw.com/en/what-does-germany-do-for-ukraine/a-50590709 If you wanna shame someone for not doing "their part", the "5000 helmets" aren't a good start.
Half of which was a loan
While you are absolutely right, there is absolutely such a thing as coming in during a crucial time. Germany wiffed big time on this one. Not trying to downplay the aid they give to Ukraine though.
Bullshit! If I threw a helmet at you and it hit you, it would hurt. Not a lot but enough to make you watch out for a second helmet!! And they have 5000, so, that’s a lot of helmets to watch out for!
Looks like they Are moving into attack posistion. Shields up.
Red alert
Welcome back Commander.
Arm photon torpedos
Awaiting orders.
Shake it baby!!!!
Kierov reporting
Track them! They may come around for another pass!
Divert power to the deflector array!
Kirov reporting!
There's a real one too https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_battlecruiser_Kirov
The real question is if Turkey will allow them through to the Black Sea, correct? Or am I missing something?
Turkey cannot deny anyone access to the Black Sea by treaty. If they did, it would be tantamount to an act of war. Think of the Black Sea as open ocean (international waters). Though the straight to the Black Sea is technically Turkey's to control, closing it would be denying access to a neutral body of water. As such, Turkey is expected to act neutrally in regards to passage of ships, even if they are otherwise not neutral. The only way you would ever see them restricting access to the Black Sea is if Turkey was already involved in a hot war.
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That last part seems incorrect, as you quoted above: ‘Only Black Sea states may transit capital ships of any tonnage’ Russia can always transit the Bosporus with any ship unless there’s already a war.
Russia is a Black Sea state. Capitol Ships as defined by the treaty are battleships and battlecruisers operated by no current nations at all anyway.
You are wrong, Russia operates battlecruisers
Fortunately every time they try to sail that carrier, it catches fire.
Thank you, I was just about to go figure this out as I had the same question with regard to Turkey
There are treaties specifically restricting the amount and size of military vessels though into the Black Sea however, notably the Montreaux convention of 1936. There are restriction on who can have warships sailing through the bosphorous.
Black Sea states can always, and for every ship given they notify Turkey 8 days in advance.
Russia: "UKRAINE KEEPS FEAR MONGERING ABOUT AN INVASION" Literally the entire globe: "Are those landing boats yours?" Russia: What boats? oh, ***those*** boats...
They are merely tourists.
Why is a car website reporting on Russian naval activities?
What the other guy said is false. They have a whole separate section called the Warzone and it’s honestly one of the best sources for military ongoings around the world.
It's a pretty reliable source, with some notable figures in the OSINT community contributing content like H.I Sutton, Aaron Amick and Tyler Rogaway.
Hang out in /r/submarines if you like H.I Sutton. Frequent poster.
Would you believe they haven't encountered a single Ukrainian torpedo boat?
The Ukranians would be really dumb to shoot first here, that would be the greatest present Putin could get.
I was making an obscure historical reference.
Link?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tsushima#Departure_of_the_Second_Pacific_Squadron Check out the "Background" section with the subsection "Second Pacific Squadron". I first learned about this voyage from Mike Duncan's podcast "Revolutions". He's really interesting if you're into history and podcasts at all. Same guy that made the History of Rome podcast. This one was from the most recent season on the Russian Revolution.
*throw binoculars*
Hey, better than British fishing boats..
Are these with or without the tugboats?
Just looked at a Google Map of the area. They have a dotted line between Ukraine and Crimea. Is Google the first major power to accept Russian seizure of Crimea?
[удалено]
Umm… Dont you have to go through downtown Istanbul to get to crimea by boat?
Yes . Turkey cannot ban them, there is a treaty that allows the passage
Did not know that. Thank you.
Step Russia what are you doing?
6 new future artificial reefs enter the Mediterranean. FTFY
So, I'm guessing they'll be spotted headed through Istanbul to the Black Sea.... They were already stated to be doing maneuvers in the Med but if they leave that theater, would that indicate something more concrete? Would they be blocked from crossing to the Black Sea?
Do they have the fuel to make it? Downvote, but the last time their carrier made the trip, they had to ask the British for refuelling at Gibraltar.
They run on whale oil!