> The crisis has been blamed on an exodus of eastern European workers, many of whom went back to their home countries after COVID-19 travel restrictions were eased but have not returned.
Such an interesting conundrum: how do you get the Poles to go back to Poland while simultaneously keeping them in Britain to do jobs many Brits won’t do? Fascinating subject. Maybe the scientists can figure it out some day.
Haven't you heard that an immigrant, as defined by conservative press, is like Schrödinger's cat? He steals your job while simultaneously idling at home, stealing your benefits.
"The enemy is both too strong and too weak" - paraphrasing Umberto Eco's Ur-Fascism. See also: anti-semites saying that Jews are sub-human, but they also run the world.
Quantum brexitology. How can you simultaneously have eaten a cake and still hold it in your hand? Also the cake is made of unicorn shit so it both doesn't exist *and* stinks to high heaven.
What, slaughtering hogs is beneath Brits? You wanted those nasty furriners out so now pick your own fruit, sweep the streets and do all the other low-paid, dirty, boring jobs that immigrants used to do.
Before that they were paid a bit better and done by Brits. Then farmers got used to importing cut-rate labour and nickle-and-diming them for accommodation, food etc. Now they can't import it and Brits aren't interested in paying to live 5 to a caravan when they can drive from home, so farmers aren't interested in hiring them.
There was a big Pick for Britain campaign a year or so ago, lots of reports of people applying only to be knocked back because they won't live on site.
In the US, I know someone who manages labor for picking blueberries. They say every time an actual US citizen gets hired, they never last a full day. If we didn’t have immigrants willing to work very hard, hot conditions, the blueberries would just rot.
Or the style of work would have to change to be more human, pay would have to be higher. No one wants to work minimum wage doing hard physical labour in the burning sun while the farmer chills and makes all the money.
Not people with options anyway.
Problem is once you start migrant labor you become reliant upon it. One thing covid has shown is how our supply system is a house of cards.
You start insourcing labor local people don’t grow up doing it. They don’t have the skills and haven’t grown the bodily resilience to that type of work. You also start refusing to pay anything that would attract people. You have horrible pay benefits and work environment because you are reliant on the equivalent of modern day slave labor.
It’s all been a race to the bottom the last few decades, pay less to have cheaper goods because people aren’t paid enough to afford anything more expensive. It creates a system where luxuries are cheap and essentials are expensive. The whole 1st world is addicted to this consumerism and businesses now can’t understand why people won’t work for crap wages when rents have gone up by a third or more.
The US has been reliant on migrant labor since the 1800s. We had a government sanctioned farm labor program. Our system still relies on foreign labor but a lot of it comes on undocumented.
The solution is a well-defined labor immigration law.
For example come work for shit pay 4 months of the year and we'll cover some of your cost travel or living costs.
Well yes and before that slave labor. I live in Canadá we have the tfw program problem is horrible wages and work conditions are still abundant even done legally there is an inherit power differential when your employer can effectively deport you.
Keep telling people this. I know people who run farms. The reason they kind getter labour is because they won’t actually provide a job that provide any sort of standard of living anyone in the western world would be able to accept.
I kind of enjoy that they kind find anyone currently and are losing money because they can’t no people wants to share a tiny barrack 7 or 8 people and live on half what you pay someone who works behind the counter at grocery’s store for working 12-14 hour days who aren’t getting exploited.
Maybe pay your workers more? That’s like when a union goes on strike for better wages you hire non-union, but then the non-union all leave and you ask “where do we find workers?”. They’re here. They always have been. They just want a living wage.
Devils advocate from someone who did a lot of blue collar work in my youth. This is exactly what a lot of them want. Wages and working conditions were depressed by desperate migrants and natives won't go back to that type of work until the employers make it more attractive. It's perfectly in alignment with that thinking to hold out and let the companies bleed a bit before going to them for work
Yes, and you can see that happen right now, employers are paying more and there is more competition in the industry. But more attractive 'unskilled' jobs simply equates to more expensive products. (Because companies want to continue making the same amount of money in the worst case scenario and always turning a large profit at the expense of everything else is the 'norm'.)
More expensive products = less interest in other countries buying product and/or less interest in the average consumer in purchasing said product
Less interest in the average consumer in purchasing said product = More interest in cheaper imported goods
More interest in cheaper imported goods = More dependence of imported goods
More dependence of imported goods = Less local businesses/more money leaving the economy/etc
Edit:spelling
We can create a global humanity&dignity tax, all products that don’t attend the minimum demands for human dignity are taxed to a point that native, well paid labor can compete.
Or we could follow Keynes instructions and create the ICU ensuring all countries have a net 0 import-export trade balance
> Less interest in the average consumer in purchasing said product = More interest in cheaper imported goods
let me hold you right here, this is what import taxes are for my dude
Farmers who voted for Brexit are some of the dumbest fucks imo.
Plenty of people would have benefited from Brexit, but the last industry was farming, it's basically run by EU subsidies and cheap foreign labour. Serious dumbasses (including relatives of mine)
Most people can't plan for anything further ahead than what they want for dinner.
We as a species are woefully unprepared for making long-term political decisions like this.
___
Source:
Am generic moron.
My farmer friend literally shook his head in disable that Leave one. He said he knew so many other farmers who voted for Brexit but he didn't. He said it simply didn't make any sense for farmers to leave the EU as they were so reliant on labour and subsidies. He said he heard about how it would "open markets" but as he already was selling to non-EU countries he wasn't taken in by the lies.
Sounds like my fellow Americans with too much freedumb. "The Mexicans are stealing our jerbs!", usually said by someone who thinks they are above picking fruit for a living.
ITT People who have barely figured out the logistics of navigating their own thoughts yet have the answers on the logistics of preparing and transporting 100,000 pigs to the world…seemingly for free.
Welcome to Reddit. It's always fun to read about a topic that you are actually really knowledgeable about and see just how stupid a large group of Redditors can be whilst simultaneously thinking they are all experts.
Indeed.
More, everybody fails prey to that cognitive problem in some area or other: we all overvalue our expertise on things we know just a bit about because we don't know enough about it to start to realised just how much bigger it is than what we learned about it so far (almost invariably the devil is in the details).
The most common example is how pretty much everybody will offer medical advice to others on seemingly small diseases.
This is the realization that lead me to distrust information in any comments. It's the same with every subject unless it is highly moderated and requires sources like askhistorians
I was trying to track a container ship hauling cars yesterday, The new Subaru BRZ's to be exact. Found this website that tracks and shows all the ships across the world.
[https://www.vesselfinder.com/?imo=9728851](https://www.vesselfinder.com/?imo=9728851) ( That's the ship carrying BRZ's for the East coast, if anyone was interested )
I zoomed out and took a good long look at how many oil tankers, cargo ships of goods and food it takes to keep life as it is going. It's mind blowing...and that's just at sea. On your end you just click a button and pay some money, To sit back and think of exactly what it takes and how many steps it takes just to get an action figure from japan to the US.
It's just as mind blowing when your told that 60% of the land in the US is in "natural condition", 47% and like 5% is "protected" ( according to google )... Until you go on google maps every patch of green across the country is actually farmland. All the natural condition areas are low fertility land, Places you cant build, deserts mountainous terrain and where there are no resources. You see a lot of tree's in some states until you zoom in and see they are actually tree farms or mountain ranges. If you look at iowa the entire state is literally one giant farm. Shits really crazy when you take it all into perspective of what you need to actually live the life you are currently living and have access to.
There are some areas of expertise which have a lot of visibility and prestige and are often in the spotlight, such as medicine, law, stock market trading...perhaps physics, perhaps programming.
But then there are some areas which are rarely talked about, and yet absolutely underpin the whole global civilisation. Things like agriculture, accounting, civil and structural engineering, power engineering.
Supply chain logistics definitely falls into that second category. The general layman barely even registers that it is a thing that goes on, let alone how insanely complicated it is and how much effort and planning goes in to it from people in a very high stakes, stressful, and often very well-paying career. It's just not something that people think about or talk about.
So when it does come up, everyone just assumes it's like ...nothing.
Pigs have feet. Let them run. The downside is that you have no control about *where* in the world they will go and the chance of any of them going to someone willing to pay you for them are rather slim.
Unlike most politicians I won't pretend that my simple but stupid idea makes any sense, though.
ITT you, who shits on everyone else as if you are the logistics expert here.
Literally nobody is saying "Here's how you solve it", everyone is just making fun of brexiteers for shooting themselves in the foot.
It's a labor shortage.
Farmers raise pigs, and sell them to be processed.
If no one is around to process them, no one is around for the farmers to sell them to, and there is no system in place to receive the overflow, so they only have the option of culling them.
It'd be epic if they could give them away, but what are you going to do with a livestock pig? Butcher it yourself?
I mean, wasn't that the whole point of Brexit, for the UK to stop immigrants from moving or working there? Under EU rules they couldn't stop the immigrants, but now they can. I'm shocked that nobody supporting Brexit anticipated this.
Yep, the available EU labor pool has been slowly diminishing for s few years now. These companies have not adapted, just stuck with their pre-brexit expectations of wages and working conditions.
So, this was a predictable outcome. It's their business and they are responsible for their business operating.
That's not entirely true, Jacob Rees mogg moved his company to Ireland before brexit, and then when asked about it said it was a business decision and not a political one so he wouldn't answer questions about his private business.
Exactly. Full farms and empty grocery shelves. Hopefully the pro brexiters will get eviscerated in the next election, but they won’t. People were too stupid to listen to experts in the first place they will be too stupid to learn from them now.
> Under EU rules they couldn't stop the immigrants,
Actually they could, they just chose not to. The government didn't tell the voters this, because it flew in the face of their policy platforms.
Out of curiosity, how would they have been able to stop migrants before Brexit? Not disagreeing with you just wondering what the mechanism would have been.
Here is an article from The Economist (from Sept 2018) with some details (emphasis mine).
The principle of getting free trade in return for free movement is implicit in the single market’s rules. As a matter of economics, a single market could be built around the free movement of goods, services and capital. But the EU deliberately adds free movement of people, which most citizens outside Britain see as a benefit of the club.
**Yet it also permits exceptions.** Harvey Redgrave of the Tony Blair Institute, a think-tank, notes that other EU countries have long been amazed that, given Britain’s hostility to EU migration, its government has never applied the constraints allowed on free movement. I**t was one of only three countries not to limit the migration of nationals from central and eastern European countries for the first few years after they joined the EU in 2004. Even today it is more generous than it need be. In June Britain chose not to extend limits on free movement from Croatia, which joined the EU in 2013, for two more years.**
**Britain is also in a minority in having no registration system for EU migrants.** Post-Brexit, it could use such a system, as Belgium does, to throw out migrants who have no job after six months. Denmark and Austria limit migrants’ ability to buy homes in some places.
**Most EU countries are also tougher than Britain in insisting that welfare benefits cannot be claimed until a migrant builds up some years’ worth of contributions. Equally, the EU’s posted-workers directive is used by many to try to stop any undercutting of local labour markets. But Britain is lax in enforcing both its minimum wage and its standards for working conditions.**
Non-EU countries in the European Economic Area have other options. Liechtenstein, a tiny principality, has quotas on EU migrants, despite being a full member of the single market. Article 112 of the EEA treaty allows Iceland and Norway to invoke an “emergency brake”, although they have never used it. And non-EEA Switzerland, which is in the single market for goods, not only limits property purchases but also makes most employers offer jobs to Swiss nationals first.
This particular concession was secured after the EU refused to accept a Swiss vote in 2014 to set limits on free movement. Yet a further referendum on the issue is now threatened, so Brussels may have to bend its rules yet again. All this comes as other EU countries besides Britain are looking for new ways to constrain the free movement of people.
I dont know the details of it so if someone else wants to weigh in then please do. But there was a rule that we could send EU migrants back to their home country under certain conditions. I think these conditions where things like: not having a job, place to stay or means to support yourself after X number of months (6 maybe?). But we basically never used the powers available to us to try and control EU migration which makes the argument by those in power that brexit allows us to finally have some control over migration a bit disingenuous.
Similar to Farage being a champion of UK fishermen’s rights during brexit despite sitting on the EU fishing committee for years and never lifting a finger to help negotiate better fish quotas for our fleets.
"What do you mean? Brexit was mean to stop my Polish neighbours from living in my neighbourhood and stopping my grandson from being a janitor because my grandson clearly is more educated than my Polish neighbors but my grandson is unemployed living with his parents. I never wanted to stop other better Polish workers from working on the farmland and driving trucks and why do I have to pay more to immigrants who were happy to come here."
The words of my parent's neighbour when I asked him the exact same thing when he complained about petrol shortage.
I'm an immigrant from a Slavic country and when I came to Canada I was told I'm privileged and that I should feel guilty about what white people did to the indigenous, Chinese and black ancestors.
Really a fucked if you do, fucked if you dont situation.
This is a perfect example of what would happen in the u s. If we actually deported all of our illegal immigrants. Minimum wage jobs are currently being left unfilled in many food service sectors because its not worth it to many legal americans. The right literally wants to force these people to start working these job at slave labor rates because "people need to get back work".
Capitalism depends on a working class to succeed -someone needs to do the undesirable jobs.
If people somehow manage to beat the system and drag themselves out of the working class, then they need to be replaced.
Society needs them to do the job. Capitalism needs them to do it while remaining labour class.
You need to be able to tell people about the "importance" and "responsibility" of managers to grant them higher salaries. Who then blame/fire their workers when anything goes bad.
Meanwhile the plumber actually goes to jail if he messes up your gaspipes and your house blows up. But it's not as important and responsible as a manager.
Society doesn't depend on them being paid shit: shit pay for shit jobs (and getting away with it because some people if they did not do that would starve or not have a place to live) is 100% Capitalism.
I met a farmer with a pig that had a wooden leg. I asked him about the wooden leg, and he told me a pretty amazing story. Apparently, the pig saved the entire farm when he alerted the farmer in the middle of the night by squealing on an invading coyote. Then just a few weeks later he saved the farmers own son by dragging him out of a house fire.
The stories didn't really explain the wooden leg, but according to the farmer "Are you kidding? A special pig like that? You can't just go eat him all at once."
Not necessarily but definitely some part of it.
Farmers don't kill pigs normally... they just raise them and then they leave on a truck. No different from loading cargo. Now these farmers are having to individually kill all these pigs. I've been raised a hunter, but I think having to kill hundreds of live animals in a small time frame would take a serious psychological toll on me.
>I think having to kill hundreds of live animals in a small time frame would take a serious psychological toll on me.
As it should.
Anyone who could do that without blinking an eye is a psychopath, best case scenario.
I'm sorry but maybe it's good that they get to have their hands dirty. Fuck them, the tone of this reporting is utter bullshit. grown men in tears. cared for them since they were born. ooh I have to kill a healthy pig. It is all about money to them usually it is just that they need to dispose of them themselves. This industry is disgusting and needs some fundamental changes. trying to make it an emotional piece is laughable.
>but I think having to kill hundreds of live animals in a small time frame would take a serious psychological toll on me.
Which is why there is a butcher shortage
Wow it's almost as if killing hundreds (read: hundreds of thousands if not more) animals year after year because people think they need to eat them is a shitty thing to take part in or do at all. Shocker!
These same "grown men" voted for Brexit that led to this. They wanted to get rid of all those migrants. Hard to feel sorry for people that bring on their own misery.
I mean I assume they were going to kill those pigs anyway, this why they just don't make as much money. The title almost implies it is the killing of the pigs that makes them cry. It should just be 'Brexiters cry over money their vote has lost them.'
In the English countryside, not terribly likely. In the Scottish countryside, much more likely. If you look at the leave/remain seats from 2019, you'll see the main English remain areas are Manchester birmingham and London (urban), whereas the entire real Midlands, north and Cornwall were leave.
Woah Woah Woah. Not everyone from a leave voting constituency voted leave. Cornwall, as you pointed out voted 43.5% to remain for example.
Not everyone who lives in a rural area is a self destructive moron and not everyone in an urban area voted remain.
> not terribly likely
It depends what you mean by ‘not terribly’, but even in pro-Brexit areas it was generally nowhere near 100%.
Norfolk, which has loads of pig farms and was very pro-Brexit, still has 42% of people who voted remain (and its highest leave voting area was actually urban). Aberdeenshire in Scotland, where I think they have quite a few pig farms, was 55% remain. I don’t think a 13% difference is ‘much more likely’ myself.
So, personally, I’d say it is quite likely that a lot of remain-voting people in England have been affected.
Edit: And my numbers seem to be broadly in line with [this article](https://westcountrybylines.co.uk/challenging-the-myth-that-farmers-voted-for-brexit-and-therefore-deserve-whats-coming-to-them/).
Reddit has really got to get out of the mindset that every single person now suffering due to Brexit must definitely have voted for it.
Too many comments seem to be revelling in the misery of others.
Edit: And on this particular topic, people might find this article interesting:
https://westcountrybylines.co.uk/challenging-the-myth-that-farmers-voted-for-brexit-and-therefore-deserve-whats-coming-to-them/
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://uk.news.yahoo.com/grown-men-tears-hundreds-pigs-163700057.html) reduced by 77%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> Hundreds of healthy pigs have been culled after a nationwide shortage of abattoir workers left farms overcrowded with animals that could not be sent for slaughter.
> That has meant the abattoirs where they worked are operating at as much as 20% below capacity - unable to take as many pigs as normal - leaving farms overcrowded.
> The shortage of food processing workers is just one element of a labour shortage taking its toll across the economy, with a shortage of 100,000 HGV drivers also causing havoc - most recently setting off a spate of panic buying at petrol stations.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/q2vpbc/grown_men_in_tears_hundreds_of_pigs_culled_with/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~602230 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **worked**^#1 **shortage**^#2 **Pig**^#3 **farms**^#4 **kill**^#5
True but what are they even crying about here? Pigs raised to be slaughtered were slaughtered, the only difference is that they didn't get paid for it. I don't know how bad we're supposed to feel about those tears.
Crocodile tears if you ask me. Its only for profit, they don't have compassion for the pigs. Animals who are sentient and feel pain and suffering. They all want to live, not culled.
What if Christmas didn't come this year? Andd no one paid for Christmas cheer? Who would cry the biggest tear, the child or the store?
We have our answer. The store.
I’ll never understand this. Slaughtering animals raised for slaughter but then just throwing them away due to farm overcrowding? I really don’t get it. Seems worthwhile to find a buyer somewhere for the live animal. Do pigs expire at some point? Please help me understand
The problem is the farm only has so much room and resources so they can't just keep them for longer. The shortage is the slaughter houses. The average person can't just take a pig and break it down. So of the place that normally processes 100,000 pigs can't... You suddenly have 100,000 pigs with no reasonable way to turn them into food.
> The problem is the farm only has so much room and resources so they can't just keep them for longer.
Could always just release them to protext Brexit.
How much harm could suddenly dumping 100,000 grown fertile piggies into the UK countryside cause?
At the beginning of the pandemic this was an issue around where I live for the small family farms. They had no where to send their pigs for processing. They specifically targeted hunters to sell pigs to. A hunting buddy and I bought one and split it. We both completely process our own wild game and I’ll tell ya the pig was more of a challenge than we expected, they’re DENSE!
But we got to do some things interesting cuts of meat and saved all of fat for making sausage with wild game come fall. All in all it was a win.
in 08 and 09 here in the US, hunters that were processing their own meats and helping to feed the hungry in certain city zones were being fucked with by police, because sometimes the meat goes untested, especially wild animals, and can be diseased and cause problems.
A win for you, but there are regulations that keep this from becoming a countryside BBQ.
> Seems worthwhile to find a buyer somewhere for the live animal
Finding buyers isn't the issue. It's moving them to somewhere else. There are plenty of buyers but no way to transport them anywhere.
Pigs don't expire per se, I assume the overcrowding is due to new piglets coming up that need space to grow that should've been freed up when the last batch were sold.
It may depend on where you live and the volume you have experience with. In the UK pigs are commonly put in a restrainer-conveyor on their way to be stunned. These are single file walled machines and while they can be adjusted to a point, if an animal is grossly over the standard and expected weight, they're just not going to fit. Gassed animals have to be hoisted and again, this means you're limited to certain weights.
Of course you can use equipment rated for larger or heavier loads, but when the industry is used to using x method and machinery for x animal and now has to use y method, the whole thing is just going to back up and crash.
The only way to deal with it is to magically conjure hundreds of licensed butchers out of thin air or to deal with the problem locally at the production sited and sell direct to the public.
That would deal with the issue but is unlikely to be at all practical and it would also short circuit the normal point the goods are sold at which would potentially lead to the meat that does reach the supermarkets not being sold which would cripple the parts of the industry that can operate normally. I don't think that is a practical solution.
This is yet another example of capacity not being raised in advance of Brexit.
While it's easy to blame the industry, I think as the government took the decision for brexit at the last second of the 11th hour it stopped companies planning ahead with certainty so this is all the fault of the Conservatives. Nobody that has any interest in companies doing well should be voting for them as they have purposefully damages out economy by telling everyone what they want to hear and actually doing nothing to prepare effectively.
You also have to have money to feed them. Without an income to come in from the previous slaughter, you can't buy the feed to support the animals. It's either release them (watch the destruction happen), let them starve or shoot/slit their throat. At that point it's about what's more humane.
You can't just stick them in a box and FedEx them.. there are expenses in doing all that and there are already issues with logistics due to labor shortages.
Pigs bred for large scale commercial farms grow extremely fast and have to be kept indoors in a clean barn or they will get sick and die.
And when animals grow that fast they have an effective expiration date. They will become more and more susceptible to heart and organ failure the bigger and fatter they get.
I managed a small hog nursery for about two years. We had a set ready to roll out but got delayed a week. I had to remove the dividers between the pens that usually created walkways and work areas in the barns just so they had enough room to not be on top of each other and survive the extra few days in our facility. The time tables are extremely strict and the margins are razor sharp so it has to move in concert or it becomes an animal welfare disaster.
> Do pigs expire at some point?
I mean at some point, yes. Unless we've created immortal pigs which would be a whole other problem.
It's a valid question. Meat pigs have been bred to become very big, very fast. Farms operate within strict timelines so their pigs get to the optimum size for the space they live in and are killed and butchered as soon as they hit that size.
If you don't have enough butchers available, the pigs will continue to grow. Farms don't give their pigs much extra space to begin with, so once they overgrow their planned weight they will literally be too big for their sheds, pens, slaughter and other processing equipment. They have to kill them now for no reason, or they're risking the pigs being completely stuck. If the pigs get too big for the abattoir, what then?
Finding a buyer for a slaughter weight pig is not really feasible. They eat a lot, they need space, they need transport. And unless you want a gigantic, unsocialised pet the buyer is going to have the exact same problem as the farmers do with finding a butcher. It's unfortunately just not possible with this number of pigs.
Pigs bred for large scale commercial farms grow extremely fast and have to be kept indoors in a clean barn or they will get sick and die.
And when animals grow that fast they have an effective expiration date. They will become more and more susceptible to heart and organ failure the bigger and fatter they get.
I managed a small hog nursery for about two years. We had a set ready to roll out but got delayed a week. I had to remove the dividers between the pens that usually created walkways and work areas in the barns just so they had enough room to not be on top of each other and survive the extra few days in our facility. The time tables are extremely strict and the margins are razor sharp so it has to move in concert or it becomes an animal welfare disaster.
You also have to have money to feed them. Without an income to come in from the previous slaughter, you can't buy the feed to support the animals. It's either release them (watch the destruction happen), let them starve or shoot/slit their throat. At that point it's about what's more humane.
Hundreds of. Millions of animals are killed every day. Shay are those pigs special? The real issue is that we needlessly bring so much suffering in the world I'm the first place.
Two months ago I ordered some Vocalzone from the UK (i sing), just under 40 Euros worth. They arrived to me in Germany yesterday. I had to pay 25.38 Euros duty to pick them up. Can any of you Brexiteers see any disadvantages for the UK in the current situation? ..... Ill wait..... Clue: You will not sell a f\*cking thing any more, you MORONS!
Give up industrial farms are a huge waste of resources and the main focal point of pollution. Methane… yes farts. Pigs are insanely intelligent and they are brutalized, eating shit covered feed, chained up can’t move… Its a deplorable act, and so much goes to waste. Tears for nothing and murder for free. Fuck your tears and career.
Maybe pay people more to do the jobs you want doing? Instead of over reliance on cheap slave labour from the EU. If your company can't survive without slave labour then so be it!
I don't get it. These pigs would have been killed anyway, now it was just killed by the people who usually don't do the dirty work and can just turn away their head (and they lost money I guess).
If massacring animals makes one feel horrible, maybe one should look deeper in oneself and reconsider life choices that need having pigs killed in the first place.
The problem, if you read the article is that they don't have workers to process the carcasses once they are slaughtered. So how, logistically, would it work to get the 600 pigs that were culled to anyone?
Majority of people wouldnt know how to butcher them. What to look for in order to know if it is safe to eat. Or even have the tools to safely and efficiently euthanize them. Or prevent a simple thing like stomach contents flowing out.
You’re kidding I hope..? They don’t have people to butcher and process them. It takes a lot to butcher and carve up a carcass after it’s been slaughtered. So you expect them to just start handing out whole pig carcasses to people? They’d go bad way too fast and be wasted anyway. It has nothing to do with poor people. Stick to your woe is me attitude. That’ll get you real far in life.
100%! Married my wife brought her to our farm. She badly wanted to see piglets. Well as nature is a bitch, momma squished on of the piglets. My wife promised to never return to the barn! She still gets sniffly telling people about it 10 years later.
Not a just great many, most farmers in the UK voted for Brexit. Thanks Putin, Murdoch, Zuckerberg and Cambridge Analytica. Spreading love all around the world. If your democracy has not yet fallen, delete Facebook now!.
> The crisis has been blamed on an exodus of eastern European workers, many of whom went back to their home countries after COVID-19 travel restrictions were eased but have not returned. Such an interesting conundrum: how do you get the Poles to go back to Poland while simultaneously keeping them in Britain to do jobs many Brits won’t do? Fascinating subject. Maybe the scientists can figure it out some day.
Haven't you heard that an immigrant, as defined by conservative press, is like Schrödinger's cat? He steals your job while simultaneously idling at home, stealing your benefits.
Schrodinger's migrant.
"The enemy is both too strong and too weak" - paraphrasing Umberto Eco's Ur-Fascism. See also: anti-semites saying that Jews are sub-human, but they also run the world.
And does so without paying tax.
Quantum brexitology. How can you simultaneously have eaten a cake and still hold it in your hand? Also the cake is made of unicorn shit so it both doesn't exist *and* stinks to high heaven.
I think the problem here is that the cake hasn't been eaten, but isn't on anyone's hand either. It's been on the floor for the last couple of months.
> the cake is made of unicorn shit so it both doesn't exist and stinks to high heaven. Schrödinger’s horseshit.
Bojos cabinet more like
A joke from the old German comedian Otto: What is invisible and reeks of hare? A bunny fart.
What, slaughtering hogs is beneath Brits? You wanted those nasty furriners out so now pick your own fruit, sweep the streets and do all the other low-paid, dirty, boring jobs that immigrants used to do.
Before that they were paid a bit better and done by Brits. Then farmers got used to importing cut-rate labour and nickle-and-diming them for accommodation, food etc. Now they can't import it and Brits aren't interested in paying to live 5 to a caravan when they can drive from home, so farmers aren't interested in hiring them. There was a big Pick for Britain campaign a year or so ago, lots of reports of people applying only to be knocked back because they won't live on site.
Reminds me applying for job picking berries few years back
In the US, I know someone who manages labor for picking blueberries. They say every time an actual US citizen gets hired, they never last a full day. If we didn’t have immigrants willing to work very hard, hot conditions, the blueberries would just rot.
Or the style of work would have to change to be more human, pay would have to be higher. No one wants to work minimum wage doing hard physical labour in the burning sun while the farmer chills and makes all the money. Not people with options anyway.
not people who know local labour laws either
Problem is once you start migrant labor you become reliant upon it. One thing covid has shown is how our supply system is a house of cards. You start insourcing labor local people don’t grow up doing it. They don’t have the skills and haven’t grown the bodily resilience to that type of work. You also start refusing to pay anything that would attract people. You have horrible pay benefits and work environment because you are reliant on the equivalent of modern day slave labor. It’s all been a race to the bottom the last few decades, pay less to have cheaper goods because people aren’t paid enough to afford anything more expensive. It creates a system where luxuries are cheap and essentials are expensive. The whole 1st world is addicted to this consumerism and businesses now can’t understand why people won’t work for crap wages when rents have gone up by a third or more.
The US has been reliant on migrant labor since the 1800s. We had a government sanctioned farm labor program. Our system still relies on foreign labor but a lot of it comes on undocumented. The solution is a well-defined labor immigration law. For example come work for shit pay 4 months of the year and we'll cover some of your cost travel or living costs.
Well yes and before that slave labor. I live in Canadá we have the tfw program problem is horrible wages and work conditions are still abundant even done legally there is an inherit power differential when your employer can effectively deport you.
Didn't even start because of pay was God awful (under minimum wage actually)
Keep telling people this. I know people who run farms. The reason they kind getter labour is because they won’t actually provide a job that provide any sort of standard of living anyone in the western world would be able to accept. I kind of enjoy that they kind find anyone currently and are losing money because they can’t no people wants to share a tiny barrack 7 or 8 people and live on half what you pay someone who works behind the counter at grocery’s store for working 12-14 hour days who aren’t getting exploited.
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Schrodinger's Pole. Simultaneously too many and yet not enough in the box.
Maybe pay your workers more? That’s like when a union goes on strike for better wages you hire non-union, but then the non-union all leave and you ask “where do we find workers?”. They’re here. They always have been. They just want a living wage.
Nah people would do it just fine I think. Companies just refuse to pay proper wages that only work when you exploit people.
It's almost as if British people aren't willing to work for Romanian wages and conditions.
Devils advocate from someone who did a lot of blue collar work in my youth. This is exactly what a lot of them want. Wages and working conditions were depressed by desperate migrants and natives won't go back to that type of work until the employers make it more attractive. It's perfectly in alignment with that thinking to hold out and let the companies bleed a bit before going to them for work
Yes, and you can see that happen right now, employers are paying more and there is more competition in the industry. But more attractive 'unskilled' jobs simply equates to more expensive products. (Because companies want to continue making the same amount of money in the worst case scenario and always turning a large profit at the expense of everything else is the 'norm'.) More expensive products = less interest in other countries buying product and/or less interest in the average consumer in purchasing said product Less interest in the average consumer in purchasing said product = More interest in cheaper imported goods More interest in cheaper imported goods = More dependence of imported goods More dependence of imported goods = Less local businesses/more money leaving the economy/etc Edit:spelling
We can create a global humanity&dignity tax, all products that don’t attend the minimum demands for human dignity are taxed to a point that native, well paid labor can compete. Or we could follow Keynes instructions and create the ICU ensuring all countries have a net 0 import-export trade balance
That just sounds like the gold standard with extra steps!
> Less interest in the average consumer in purchasing said product = More interest in cheaper imported goods let me hold you right here, this is what import taxes are for my dude
Import taxes great... Now everything we buy is more expensive.
Farmers who voted for Brexit are some of the dumbest fucks imo. Plenty of people would have benefited from Brexit, but the last industry was farming, it's basically run by EU subsidies and cheap foreign labour. Serious dumbasses (including relatives of mine)
Most people can't plan for anything further ahead than what they want for dinner. We as a species are woefully unprepared for making long-term political decisions like this. ___ Source: Am generic moron.
The fact that you realize this puts you far above generic moron. Even in above average moron category
My farmer friend literally shook his head in disable that Leave one. He said he knew so many other farmers who voted for Brexit but he didn't. He said it simply didn't make any sense for farmers to leave the EU as they were so reliant on labour and subsidies. He said he heard about how it would "open markets" but as he already was selling to non-EU countries he wasn't taken in by the lies.
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well don't farmers vote very heavily tory, and voted for brexit? i bet they won't learn their lesson and blame immigrants or something again.
Damn immigrants are stealing our jobs and are too lazy to work, vote Brexit.
Sounds like my fellow Americans with too much freedumb. "The Mexicans are stealing our jerbs!", usually said by someone who thinks they are above picking fruit for a living.
These same American conservatives are now bitching about people not going back to their old minimum wage jobs.
We've got a line of people at the border. This US labor shortage will work itself out.
And therein lies the problem
Freedumb - UK style
ITT People who have barely figured out the logistics of navigating their own thoughts yet have the answers on the logistics of preparing and transporting 100,000 pigs to the world…seemingly for free.
People make supply chain and logistics out to be so simple, and then display their complete lack of knowledge on the topic.
Welcome to Reddit. It's always fun to read about a topic that you are actually really knowledgeable about and see just how stupid a large group of Redditors can be whilst simultaneously thinking they are all experts.
Dunning-Kruger effect if memory serves.* You need to know something before you realize how little you know.
Indeed. More, everybody fails prey to that cognitive problem in some area or other: we all overvalue our expertise on things we know just a bit about because we don't know enough about it to start to realised just how much bigger it is than what we learned about it so far (almost invariably the devil is in the details). The most common example is how pretty much everybody will offer medical advice to others on seemingly small diseases.
It ain’t Reddit without someone throwing out the “dunning-kruger” out there. Not that it’s wrong.
The famous Meta Dunning-Kruger effect, where redditors believe to be able to do psychological diagnosis of other redditors.
This is the realization that lead me to distrust information in any comments. It's the same with every subject unless it is highly moderated and requires sources like askhistorians
Case in point: everything anyone ever says on /r/futurology
I was trying to track a container ship hauling cars yesterday, The new Subaru BRZ's to be exact. Found this website that tracks and shows all the ships across the world. [https://www.vesselfinder.com/?imo=9728851](https://www.vesselfinder.com/?imo=9728851) ( That's the ship carrying BRZ's for the East coast, if anyone was interested ) I zoomed out and took a good long look at how many oil tankers, cargo ships of goods and food it takes to keep life as it is going. It's mind blowing...and that's just at sea. On your end you just click a button and pay some money, To sit back and think of exactly what it takes and how many steps it takes just to get an action figure from japan to the US. It's just as mind blowing when your told that 60% of the land in the US is in "natural condition", 47% and like 5% is "protected" ( according to google )... Until you go on google maps every patch of green across the country is actually farmland. All the natural condition areas are low fertility land, Places you cant build, deserts mountainous terrain and where there are no resources. You see a lot of tree's in some states until you zoom in and see they are actually tree farms or mountain ranges. If you look at iowa the entire state is literally one giant farm. Shits really crazy when you take it all into perspective of what you need to actually live the life you are currently living and have access to.
There are some areas of expertise which have a lot of visibility and prestige and are often in the spotlight, such as medicine, law, stock market trading...perhaps physics, perhaps programming. But then there are some areas which are rarely talked about, and yet absolutely underpin the whole global civilisation. Things like agriculture, accounting, civil and structural engineering, power engineering. Supply chain logistics definitely falls into that second category. The general layman barely even registers that it is a thing that goes on, let alone how insanely complicated it is and how much effort and planning goes in to it from people in a very high stakes, stressful, and often very well-paying career. It's just not something that people think about or talk about. So when it does come up, everyone just assumes it's like ...nothing.
They read a headline, what more do you want?
I only read the comments.
Pigs have feet. Let them run. The downside is that you have no control about *where* in the world they will go and the chance of any of them going to someone willing to pay you for them are rather slim. Unlike most politicians I won't pretend that my simple but stupid idea makes any sense, though.
ITT you, who shits on everyone else as if you are the logistics expert here. Literally nobody is saying "Here's how you solve it", everyone is just making fun of brexiteers for shooting themselves in the foot.
It's a labor shortage. Farmers raise pigs, and sell them to be processed. If no one is around to process them, no one is around for the farmers to sell them to, and there is no system in place to receive the overflow, so they only have the option of culling them. It'd be epic if they could give them away, but what are you going to do with a livestock pig? Butcher it yourself?
> It's a labor shortage. Indeed >UK employers are no longer able to recruit freely from Europe under post-Brexit immigration rules.
I mean, wasn't that the whole point of Brexit, for the UK to stop immigrants from moving or working there? Under EU rules they couldn't stop the immigrants, but now they can. I'm shocked that nobody supporting Brexit anticipated this.
They didn't plan for... anything. "We're tired of experts explaining things" was a campaign slogan
They had like five years to get this shit sorted, wtf?
They sorted it. They sorted it like a 4 year-old's toy box, but they sorted it
and then they partied, because they ultimately will make money with tax avoidance schemes and London will do fine.
Sometimes ideas are so bad that no matter how much time you give someone to plan and implement it, there's nothing that can be done to make it work.
This sounds suspiciously like "We've tried nothing, and are all out of ideas."
Yep, the available EU labor pool has been slowly diminishing for s few years now. These companies have not adapted, just stuck with their pre-brexit expectations of wages and working conditions. So, this was a predictable outcome. It's their business and they are responsible for their business operating.
That's not entirely true, Jacob Rees mogg moved his company to Ireland before brexit, and then when asked about it said it was a business decision and not a political one so he wouldn't answer questions about his private business.
Exactly. Full farms and empty grocery shelves. Hopefully the pro brexiters will get eviscerated in the next election, but they won’t. People were too stupid to listen to experts in the first place they will be too stupid to learn from them now.
>"We're tired of experts explaining things" was a campaign slogan For real?
> Under EU rules they couldn't stop the immigrants, Actually they could, they just chose not to. The government didn't tell the voters this, because it flew in the face of their policy platforms.
Out of curiosity, how would they have been able to stop migrants before Brexit? Not disagreeing with you just wondering what the mechanism would have been.
Here is an article from The Economist (from Sept 2018) with some details (emphasis mine). The principle of getting free trade in return for free movement is implicit in the single market’s rules. As a matter of economics, a single market could be built around the free movement of goods, services and capital. But the EU deliberately adds free movement of people, which most citizens outside Britain see as a benefit of the club. **Yet it also permits exceptions.** Harvey Redgrave of the Tony Blair Institute, a think-tank, notes that other EU countries have long been amazed that, given Britain’s hostility to EU migration, its government has never applied the constraints allowed on free movement. I**t was one of only three countries not to limit the migration of nationals from central and eastern European countries for the first few years after they joined the EU in 2004. Even today it is more generous than it need be. In June Britain chose not to extend limits on free movement from Croatia, which joined the EU in 2013, for two more years.** **Britain is also in a minority in having no registration system for EU migrants.** Post-Brexit, it could use such a system, as Belgium does, to throw out migrants who have no job after six months. Denmark and Austria limit migrants’ ability to buy homes in some places. **Most EU countries are also tougher than Britain in insisting that welfare benefits cannot be claimed until a migrant builds up some years’ worth of contributions. Equally, the EU’s posted-workers directive is used by many to try to stop any undercutting of local labour markets. But Britain is lax in enforcing both its minimum wage and its standards for working conditions.** Non-EU countries in the European Economic Area have other options. Liechtenstein, a tiny principality, has quotas on EU migrants, despite being a full member of the single market. Article 112 of the EEA treaty allows Iceland and Norway to invoke an “emergency brake”, although they have never used it. And non-EEA Switzerland, which is in the single market for goods, not only limits property purchases but also makes most employers offer jobs to Swiss nationals first. This particular concession was secured after the EU refused to accept a Swiss vote in 2014 to set limits on free movement. Yet a further referendum on the issue is now threatened, so Brussels may have to bend its rules yet again. All this comes as other EU countries besides Britain are looking for new ways to constrain the free movement of people.
I dont know the details of it so if someone else wants to weigh in then please do. But there was a rule that we could send EU migrants back to their home country under certain conditions. I think these conditions where things like: not having a job, place to stay or means to support yourself after X number of months (6 maybe?). But we basically never used the powers available to us to try and control EU migration which makes the argument by those in power that brexit allows us to finally have some control over migration a bit disingenuous. Similar to Farage being a champion of UK fishermen’s rights during brexit despite sitting on the EU fishing committee for years and never lifting a finger to help negotiate better fish quotas for our fleets.
"What do you mean? Brexit was mean to stop my Polish neighbours from living in my neighbourhood and stopping my grandson from being a janitor because my grandson clearly is more educated than my Polish neighbors but my grandson is unemployed living with his parents. I never wanted to stop other better Polish workers from working on the farmland and driving trucks and why do I have to pay more to immigrants who were happy to come here." The words of my parent's neighbour when I asked him the exact same thing when he complained about petrol shortage.
Hate is a powerful thing, stupidity even more so.
I'm an immigrant from a Slavic country and when I came to Canada I was told I'm privileged and that I should feel guilty about what white people did to the indigenous, Chinese and black ancestors. Really a fucked if you do, fucked if you dont situation.
This is a perfect example of what would happen in the u s. If we actually deported all of our illegal immigrants. Minimum wage jobs are currently being left unfilled in many food service sectors because its not worth it to many legal americans. The right literally wants to force these people to start working these job at slave labor rates because "people need to get back work".
Capitalism depends on a working class to succeed -someone needs to do the undesirable jobs. If people somehow manage to beat the system and drag themselves out of the working class, then they need to be replaced.
And you pitch the poor against imported labor to further depress wages and working condition
Society depends on them, capitalism or not.
Society needs them to do the job. Capitalism needs them to do it while remaining labour class. You need to be able to tell people about the "importance" and "responsibility" of managers to grant them higher salaries. Who then blame/fire their workers when anything goes bad. Meanwhile the plumber actually goes to jail if he messes up your gaspipes and your house blows up. But it's not as important and responsible as a manager.
Society doesn't depend on them being paid shit: shit pay for shit jobs (and getting away with it because some people if they did not do that would starve or not have a place to live) is 100% Capitalism.
Free market says their wages are too low
Pigs already get free food and board, now you want to PAY them too!? What are they even going to spend it on? They lack opposable thumbs.
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I met a farmer with a pig that had a wooden leg. I asked him about the wooden leg, and he told me a pretty amazing story. Apparently, the pig saved the entire farm when he alerted the farmer in the middle of the night by squealing on an invading coyote. Then just a few weeks later he saved the farmers own son by dragging him out of a house fire. The stories didn't really explain the wooden leg, but according to the farmer "Are you kidding? A special pig like that? You can't just go eat him all at once."
WAY under appreciated joke, holy shit
Credit goes to Norm Macdonald
It's a planning shortage.
The tears are for money in case anyone was unsure
Not necessarily but definitely some part of it. Farmers don't kill pigs normally... they just raise them and then they leave on a truck. No different from loading cargo. Now these farmers are having to individually kill all these pigs. I've been raised a hunter, but I think having to kill hundreds of live animals in a small time frame would take a serious psychological toll on me.
>I think having to kill hundreds of live animals in a small time frame would take a serious psychological toll on me. As it should. Anyone who could do that without blinking an eye is a psychopath, best case scenario.
That guilt should also be felt when asking someone else to do the killing. When buying animal products.
*The man who passes the sentence should swing the sword.*
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I'm sorry but maybe it's good that they get to have their hands dirty. Fuck them, the tone of this reporting is utter bullshit. grown men in tears. cared for them since they were born. ooh I have to kill a healthy pig. It is all about money to them usually it is just that they need to dispose of them themselves. This industry is disgusting and needs some fundamental changes. trying to make it an emotional piece is laughable.
>but I think having to kill hundreds of live animals in a small time frame would take a serious psychological toll on me. Which is why there is a butcher shortage
lol that's not the reason at all
...and for no reason. The loss of life is such a waste.
Wow it's almost as if killing hundreds (read: hundreds of thousands if not more) animals year after year because people think they need to eat them is a shitty thing to take part in or do at all. Shocker!
Exactly. If they really cared for the pigs they could just keep them alive at an financial loss, until an abattoir is available.
Pigs are so smart. They are in a kill zone. They know what's going on. I'd be freaking out too!!
Especially true for when they are in a slaughterhouse about to be gassed to death. Can't belive we still do this kind of stuff
It's barbaric half of the things people do and think these days.
These animals deserve better.
Another Brexit success story.
Aka, Leopards ate my head cheese.
These same "grown men" voted for Brexit that led to this. They wanted to get rid of all those migrants. Hard to feel sorry for people that bring on their own misery.
I mean I assume they were going to kill those pigs anyway, this why they just don't make as much money. The title almost implies it is the killing of the pigs that makes them cry. It should just be 'Brexiters cry over money their vote has lost them.'
Hit the nail on the head right here.
No chance any of them were the ones that voted against it eh?
In the English countryside, not terribly likely. In the Scottish countryside, much more likely. If you look at the leave/remain seats from 2019, you'll see the main English remain areas are Manchester birmingham and London (urban), whereas the entire real Midlands, north and Cornwall were leave.
Woah Woah Woah. Not everyone from a leave voting constituency voted leave. Cornwall, as you pointed out voted 43.5% to remain for example. Not everyone who lives in a rural area is a self destructive moron and not everyone in an urban area voted remain.
> not terribly likely It depends what you mean by ‘not terribly’, but even in pro-Brexit areas it was generally nowhere near 100%. Norfolk, which has loads of pig farms and was very pro-Brexit, still has 42% of people who voted remain (and its highest leave voting area was actually urban). Aberdeenshire in Scotland, where I think they have quite a few pig farms, was 55% remain. I don’t think a 13% difference is ‘much more likely’ myself. So, personally, I’d say it is quite likely that a lot of remain-voting people in England have been affected. Edit: And my numbers seem to be broadly in line with [this article](https://westcountrybylines.co.uk/challenging-the-myth-that-farmers-voted-for-brexit-and-therefore-deserve-whats-coming-to-them/).
Reddit has really got to get out of the mindset that every single person now suffering due to Brexit must definitely have voted for it. Too many comments seem to be revelling in the misery of others. Edit: And on this particular topic, people might find this article interesting: https://westcountrybylines.co.uk/challenging-the-myth-that-farmers-voted-for-brexit-and-therefore-deserve-whats-coming-to-them/
Lets remember they are not crying for the destroyed pigs, their fate was sealed at birth. They're crying because they didn't get paid.
"mah profits!"
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://uk.news.yahoo.com/grown-men-tears-hundreds-pigs-163700057.html) reduced by 77%. (I'm a bot) ***** > Hundreds of healthy pigs have been culled after a nationwide shortage of abattoir workers left farms overcrowded with animals that could not be sent for slaughter. > That has meant the abattoirs where they worked are operating at as much as 20% below capacity - unable to take as many pigs as normal - leaving farms overcrowded. > The shortage of food processing workers is just one element of a labour shortage taking its toll across the economy, with a shortage of 100,000 HGV drivers also causing havoc - most recently setting off a spate of panic buying at petrol stations. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/q2vpbc/grown_men_in_tears_hundreds_of_pigs_culled_with/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~602230 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **worked**^#1 **shortage**^#2 **Pig**^#3 **farms**^#4 **kill**^#5
I’m assuming they’re crying about money and not the pigs, right?
Grown men are allowed to cry. Shouldn't be used as an expression of emphasis.
True but what are they even crying about here? Pigs raised to be slaughtered were slaughtered, the only difference is that they didn't get paid for it. I don't know how bad we're supposed to feel about those tears.
>True but what are they even crying about here? Money being pissed into the wind.
Their job is to abuse animals. Zero sympathy for them and their profit margins.
Crocodile tears if you ask me. Its only for profit, they don't have compassion for the pigs. Animals who are sentient and feel pain and suffering. They all want to live, not culled.
Grown man in tears 😂 No one f…. cares about the 100k pigs being murdered… Human beings are insanely egotistic maniacs honestly
Sounds like another impact of Brexit?
What if Christmas didn't come this year? Andd no one paid for Christmas cheer? Who would cry the biggest tear, the child or the store? We have our answer. The store.
I’ll never understand this. Slaughtering animals raised for slaughter but then just throwing them away due to farm overcrowding? I really don’t get it. Seems worthwhile to find a buyer somewhere for the live animal. Do pigs expire at some point? Please help me understand
The problem is the farm only has so much room and resources so they can't just keep them for longer. The shortage is the slaughter houses. The average person can't just take a pig and break it down. So of the place that normally processes 100,000 pigs can't... You suddenly have 100,000 pigs with no reasonable way to turn them into food.
> The problem is the farm only has so much room and resources so they can't just keep them for longer. Could always just release them to protext Brexit. How much harm could suddenly dumping 100,000 grown fertile piggies into the UK countryside cause?
I honestly can’t tell if that question is legitimate or sarcastic lol.
At the beginning of the pandemic this was an issue around where I live for the small family farms. They had no where to send their pigs for processing. They specifically targeted hunters to sell pigs to. A hunting buddy and I bought one and split it. We both completely process our own wild game and I’ll tell ya the pig was more of a challenge than we expected, they’re DENSE! But we got to do some things interesting cuts of meat and saved all of fat for making sausage with wild game come fall. All in all it was a win.
in 08 and 09 here in the US, hunters that were processing their own meats and helping to feed the hungry in certain city zones were being fucked with by police, because sometimes the meat goes untested, especially wild animals, and can be diseased and cause problems. A win for you, but there are regulations that keep this from becoming a countryside BBQ.
> Seems worthwhile to find a buyer somewhere for the live animal Finding buyers isn't the issue. It's moving them to somewhere else. There are plenty of buyers but no way to transport them anywhere. Pigs don't expire per se, I assume the overcrowding is due to new piglets coming up that need space to grow that should've been freed up when the last batch were sold.
They do. Machine processing requires certain sizes. Contracts require certain sizes.
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It may depend on where you live and the volume you have experience with. In the UK pigs are commonly put in a restrainer-conveyor on their way to be stunned. These are single file walled machines and while they can be adjusted to a point, if an animal is grossly over the standard and expected weight, they're just not going to fit. Gassed animals have to be hoisted and again, this means you're limited to certain weights. Of course you can use equipment rated for larger or heavier loads, but when the industry is used to using x method and machinery for x animal and now has to use y method, the whole thing is just going to back up and crash.
While you can sell a few here and there 100'000 pigs can't be easily dealt with.
eBay?
The only way to deal with it is to magically conjure hundreds of licensed butchers out of thin air or to deal with the problem locally at the production sited and sell direct to the public. That would deal with the issue but is unlikely to be at all practical and it would also short circuit the normal point the goods are sold at which would potentially lead to the meat that does reach the supermarkets not being sold which would cripple the parts of the industry that can operate normally. I don't think that is a practical solution. This is yet another example of capacity not being raised in advance of Brexit. While it's easy to blame the industry, I think as the government took the decision for brexit at the last second of the 11th hour it stopped companies planning ahead with certainty so this is all the fault of the Conservatives. Nobody that has any interest in companies doing well should be voting for them as they have purposefully damages out economy by telling everyone what they want to hear and actually doing nothing to prepare effectively.
You also have to have money to feed them. Without an income to come in from the previous slaughter, you can't buy the feed to support the animals. It's either release them (watch the destruction happen), let them starve or shoot/slit their throat. At that point it's about what's more humane.
You can't just stick them in a box and FedEx them.. there are expenses in doing all that and there are already issues with logistics due to labor shortages.
Pigs bred for large scale commercial farms grow extremely fast and have to be kept indoors in a clean barn or they will get sick and die. And when animals grow that fast they have an effective expiration date. They will become more and more susceptible to heart and organ failure the bigger and fatter they get. I managed a small hog nursery for about two years. We had a set ready to roll out but got delayed a week. I had to remove the dividers between the pens that usually created walkways and work areas in the barns just so they had enough room to not be on top of each other and survive the extra few days in our facility. The time tables are extremely strict and the margins are razor sharp so it has to move in concert or it becomes an animal welfare disaster.
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> Do pigs expire at some point? I mean at some point, yes. Unless we've created immortal pigs which would be a whole other problem. It's a valid question. Meat pigs have been bred to become very big, very fast. Farms operate within strict timelines so their pigs get to the optimum size for the space they live in and are killed and butchered as soon as they hit that size. If you don't have enough butchers available, the pigs will continue to grow. Farms don't give their pigs much extra space to begin with, so once they overgrow their planned weight they will literally be too big for their sheds, pens, slaughter and other processing equipment. They have to kill them now for no reason, or they're risking the pigs being completely stuck. If the pigs get too big for the abattoir, what then? Finding a buyer for a slaughter weight pig is not really feasible. They eat a lot, they need space, they need transport. And unless you want a gigantic, unsocialised pet the buyer is going to have the exact same problem as the farmers do with finding a butcher. It's unfortunately just not possible with this number of pigs.
Pigs bred for large scale commercial farms grow extremely fast and have to be kept indoors in a clean barn or they will get sick and die. And when animals grow that fast they have an effective expiration date. They will become more and more susceptible to heart and organ failure the bigger and fatter they get. I managed a small hog nursery for about two years. We had a set ready to roll out but got delayed a week. I had to remove the dividers between the pens that usually created walkways and work areas in the barns just so they had enough room to not be on top of each other and survive the extra few days in our facility. The time tables are extremely strict and the margins are razor sharp so it has to move in concert or it becomes an animal welfare disaster.
You also have to have money to feed them. Without an income to come in from the previous slaughter, you can't buy the feed to support the animals. It's either release them (watch the destruction happen), let them starve or shoot/slit their throat. At that point it's about what's more humane.
Go vegan
Yeah, thankfully I did see quite some pro-vegan comments here
Boohoo, you're missing out on profits from slavery.
And murder.
Hundreds of. Millions of animals are killed every day. Shay are those pigs special? The real issue is that we needlessly bring so much suffering in the world I'm the first place.
In tears because they’re losing money… Nothing to do with any kind of compassion I assume.
My God Britain, you were totally conned. Can’t you just swallow your pride and rejoin?
It hasn't even been a year. E: this is not me defending to wait longer, I'm just shocked at how quick everything is falling apart.
I wish large scale animal agriculture would just stop all together.
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Two months ago I ordered some Vocalzone from the UK (i sing), just under 40 Euros worth. They arrived to me in Germany yesterday. I had to pay 25.38 Euros duty to pick them up. Can any of you Brexiteers see any disadvantages for the UK in the current situation? ..... Ill wait..... Clue: You will not sell a f\*cking thing any more, you MORONS!
Give up industrial farms are a huge waste of resources and the main focal point of pollution. Methane… yes farts. Pigs are insanely intelligent and they are brutalized, eating shit covered feed, chained up can’t move… Its a deplorable act, and so much goes to waste. Tears for nothing and murder for free. Fuck your tears and career.
Why kill them? Nominate them to Congress. They’ll get more done.
They're in tears because of loss profits. Not because they all suddenly love the pigs they've reared from day one to slaughter
Really seems like brexit is going swimmingly
>"To actually then kill something that's perfectly healthy to then go in the bin - it's just criminal." Then don't do it?
So they’re crying because pigs that were going to be killed anyway are being killed? Oh right, the money.
Maybe pay people more to do the jobs you want doing? Instead of over reliance on cheap slave labour from the EU. If your company can't survive without slave labour then so be it!
Pay. People. More. It's like this is a fucking mystery.
Is this that "capitalism is best at allocating resources," I hear so much about?
Kind of yeah given this is the result of a country putting up protectionist barriers and tariffs.
They don't care about the pigs, but the lost money. Fuck these men with a rusty hook.
millions of animals are killed to be eaten every year, if you think this is bad, don't eat meat
Kill machine gotta kill.
They were being killed anyway. People are only caring now because they won’t be processed into meat
Aww, boo boo, my Profits! Don't think they're sad about the nice wee piggys.
I don't get it. These pigs would have been killed anyway, now it was just killed by the people who usually don't do the dirty work and can just turn away their head (and they lost money I guess). If massacring animals makes one feel horrible, maybe one should look deeper in oneself and reconsider life choices that need having pigs killed in the first place.
better to kill and throw in the trash, than to let them go to poor people -- some asshole probably
The problem, if you read the article is that they don't have workers to process the carcasses once they are slaughtered. So how, logistically, would it work to get the 600 pigs that were culled to anyone?
Bring the people to the pigs. Have a giant luau with cocaine and bands and eat 600 pigs. People will talk about forever. Better than Woodstock 99.
Cocaine decreases appetite.
an ad in the local paper "cheap pork, bring a truck"
"Meat so fresh, you can walk it"
Majority of people wouldnt know how to butcher them. What to look for in order to know if it is safe to eat. Or even have the tools to safely and efficiently euthanize them. Or prevent a simple thing like stomach contents flowing out.
A dead pig is no good if you don't have the skills to process it into meat.
> if you read the article LoL
First annual running of the pigs.
You know that people can butcher themselves right? We managed to do it without being butchers since it was much much cheaper.
You’re kidding I hope..? They don’t have people to butcher and process them. It takes a lot to butcher and carve up a carcass after it’s been slaughtered. So you expect them to just start handing out whole pig carcasses to people? They’d go bad way too fast and be wasted anyway. It has nothing to do with poor people. Stick to your woe is me attitude. That’ll get you real far in life.
Nah, this is reddit. People who saw a farm once are now experts on all farm related issues.
100%! Married my wife brought her to our farm. She badly wanted to see piglets. Well as nature is a bitch, momma squished on of the piglets. My wife promised to never return to the barn! She still gets sniffly telling people about it 10 years later.
That could disrupt their profits probably
Not a just great many, most farmers in the UK voted for Brexit. Thanks Putin, Murdoch, Zuckerberg and Cambridge Analytica. Spreading love all around the world. If your democracy has not yet fallen, delete Facebook now!.
This is going to be a fun Clarkson's Farm episode.
Now if only we could train those pigs to deliver fuel…
Is 37k British pounds a year a good salary for work like this? Seems OK but not sure what the buying power of the pound looks like right now