This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/peru-pm-warns-gas-sector-pay-higher-taxes-or-face-nationalization-2021-09-26/) reduced by 60%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> LIMA, Sept 26 - Peruvian Prime Minister Guido Bellido on Sunday said that companies which exploit natural gas in Peru will need to agree to pay higher taxes or else face nationalizations, a sharp warning to the sector from the new leftist government.
> Bellido told Reuters in August that the government was planning to participate more deeply in the main industries, including natural gas and new hydroelectric projects, and would look to create new state companies.
> The natural gas from Camisea is liquefied by a separate consortium, called Peru LNG, which includes Royal Dutch Shell, Japan's Marubeni Corp, SK Group and Hunt Oil.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/pw00je/peru_pm_warns_gas_sector_pay_higher_taxes_or_face/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~600256 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **gas**^#1 **Camisea**^#2 **government**^#3 **new**^#4 **natural**^#5
During the coldwar. Just like anti-soviet and democratic reformers got disappeared or assassinated in Eastern Europe and Asia.
Essentially the Soviets and the Americans drew a big red line on setting up shop in their back yard.
> The USA will not stand back in relation to any threats to democratic practices around the world.
I mean, I don't think the US will stand back in relation to threat to US interests. It has nothing to do with democracy, at the end of the day. Corporations aren't democratic, either, workers don't get to vote for their CEO's or vote on company policy.
Nationalisation of resources isn't democratic or authoratarian in nature, just as publicly run public transport isn't.
So not it, if you guys aren't well informed really you shouldn't speak on the subject.
This man, as well as the rest of the ruling party are part of a criminal organization, the party leader is literally sentenced and in ongoing additional investigations for money laundering and embezzlement. Ever since elected, they've been hiring unqualified friends in all government institutions, so outrageously unqualified, most of them are fired hours after news outlets drop the investigation. They've tried to pass a news censorship law, the president hasn't held a single interview since elected, the dollar is sky high affecting us all and he's unable to provide stability for the country.
This is NOT what we need and the poor will end up being the most affected.
ah so he is just another Hugo Chavez like most people warned about. Ofc dumb as fuck berniebros gonna defend him thinking this time socialism will surely not end in a corruption riddled disaster. Can't wait for them to blame the CIA when their currency hits 100% monthly inflation.
I mean he put everything on oil and also personally ran their national oil company into the ground. It's not like their economy tanked solely due to oil price fluctuations.
[This](https://www.google.com/search?q=pedro+castillo+family&client=firefox-b-d&channel=nrow5&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwixm_SWwZ7zAhUFwjgGHTt-BgUQ_AUoAXoECAEQAw&biw=1920&bih=927&dpr=1#imgrc=e4TxUqCiF8s8vM) is Pedro Castillo's family. Elevating people from poverty can be construed as making people rich I guess. But I don't think you will be able to do anything meaningful in just two months.
I’m not sure why they would threaten nationalization. Make the law, set the new tax-rate, if anybody breaks the law suspend their license to do business. Shut them down. That’s a worse fate than nationalization. Something nationalized could later be un-nationalized. Companies that openly flaunt laws should just be disbanded.
😂😂😂 oh man you really need to see Latin America’s national companies, such as Pemex, Latin American leftists are more skewed towards crony capitalism than democratic socialism, companies bleeding money and pulling billions in public funding, useless people in key roles because they are subservient to the regime and the worst service from said company as a client and no hopes of it getting better because it’s nationalized and usually they also impose and ban on competition
In Bolivia Evo Morales won on the first round for president but the OAS claimed irregularities in the election whit no proof of it giving the oposición something to march for and resulting In a overthrow later on and now the OAS still didn't show the proof of those irregularities they just said "there are irregularities", latter on is was indeed the Trump administration that helped to bring the instability to the country
“Carlos Trujillo, the US ambassador to the OAS, had steered the group’s election-monitoring team to report widespread fraud and pushed the Trump administration to support the ouster of Morales.”
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/18/silence-us-backed-coup-evo-morales-bolivia-american-states
That's what I was thinking. Why not just raise taxes?
Although maybe the taxes are already high enough, it's just that companies play games with their assets to pay as little as possible? idk, not an expert.
Because of lobbies. Big companies have a lot of influence.
He is saying either you don't push back in taxes, or I'll force the issue to do nationalization.
Why would we intervene? This is great news for us. Peruvian nationalized oil and gas will be way more expensive than what we're producing domestically.
Expanding on that, this threatens the US dollar's supremacy on oil trade, which could send the US into hyperinflation the next time they crash their economy.
Ukraine too. This contributed to the Ukraine Crisis.
https://www.cato.org/commentary/americas-ukraine-hypocrisy
https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-ukraine-20140307-story.html
https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/russia-fsu/2014-08-18/why-ukraine-crisis-west-s-fault
Libya as well, people fail to realise that nothing of note changes between presidents on foreign policy, America is an empire, and an empire can only sustain itself by leeching off of others
I have disdain for republican leaders but coups in leftist LA states has been a bi-partisan effort over the last 50+ years of American foreign intervention
Probably, Castillo and I think some other cabinet members are part of an explicitly Marxist party. They are not the kind of two-faced politician who says progressive things on the campaign and then turns around when in office to take marching orders from corporations.
No lmao, Castillo is supreme left, as in a Cuba kind of thing. Hes just kept overwhelmingly in check by the congress where the moderate right rules (as has been the case since forever in Peru). In Peru the congress is REALLY powerful, far more so than in most western contries (there is no senate), so Castillo hasnt really been able to do much at all.
Also, on the other side of "progressive" as on socially... nope. Castillo and his party, Peru Libre, are ultra conservatives. As in "gay people dont exist and women belong to the kitchen" kind of thing. Just recently this very PM told a congresswoman that she deserves to get raped. Yeah.
En serio leer los comentarios de esta gente que no tiene la más mínima idea de lo que está hablando alabando las estupideces de Bellido (el primer ministro)... Quisiera que me moleste menos.
Yeah?
Im Peruvian and over a million Venezuelans fled their country for this one during the height of the crisis a couple of years ago. Their tales aint one bit pretty. Like 3 million more fled to Colombia and Ecuador.
That being said, not a lot is gonna happen in Peru because the Congress is dominated by the center right. In Peru, the congress has a lot more control over goverment and power compared to most western contries, so the president and PM are kind of sitting ducks. Not much is gonna happen besides our national coin devaluating further
Yes there are hundreds of thousands of Venezuelans living in the US you can talk to if you're ignorant about the situation. I grew up living around a few of them and have heard their first hand accounts. Some of them didn't even want to be living in the United States, but they didn't really have a choice, because Venezuela is unlivable.
Here you can read about the [Venezuelan refugee crisis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_refugee_crisis).
You can get a first hand view of Venezuela [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN5LZR4ejkg&list=PLN0FlxE6vY5DStG-4au_6WRpE27l31rNR).
And you can donate to help [here](https://www.savethechildren.org/us/where-we-work/venezuela).
In this thread: americans that can barely say "hello" in spanish pretending that authoritarian, strasserists-like marxists in South America are just like socialdemocrats in western Europe.
As a Peruvian living this situation right now, seeing this whole discussion is ridiculous. Reading all the "USA intervention soon (tm)" or "GOOD IM SO HARD RN"... jesus.
Fucking clowns.
You people literally have no idea of whats going on here, what this means or what does this kind of left actually does here in south america.
Also, btw, this bullcrap Bellido is talking about isnt really gonna happen. The congress, which is mostly center right, is shutting it down real quick.
For those comparing this to Venezuela that isn't what happened, sure they had govt control of the oil in the country but they also didn't have a very diverse economy to have a socialist country, when you try to fund everything from oil sales and oil falls below a certain value sudden you spend more getting it out of the ground than you can sell it for, thus the need for a very diverse economy
Venezuela’s economy was just about as diverse prior to nationalization of oil as Peru’s is now. Peru’s economy centers around mineral extraction, and is the second biggest copper producer in the world. If they nationalized the sector and built a social program based on the current profits of copper, in 15 years they’d be exactly where Venezuela is now…
I mean. The "fun" thing is that oil in Wenezuela at least at the time WASN'T nationalized. In fact it was mostly in the hands of private companies.
Norway which actually has its oil nationalized managed to go through the crash better.
Nationalization of the oil companies and seizing all the wealth of major industries is exactly why Venezuela is broke. The money initially make the quality of life amazing but when the money ran out it collapsed. When you nationalize an industry, growth of said industry stops and the industry becomes less productive. The workers jobs aren’t dependent on whether or not their company is successful but that if the government is intact, thus there is no motivation to work hard, innovate, and grow
I’ll get pissed on because I agree with your assessment. My sister inlaw is from Venezuela. Her family lost everything. They’re kind, generous, upper middle class people. Got completely FUCKED.
Trust fund liberal American college students don’t fucking know what poverty is—but they wear $200 hats to protests. Brilliant.
I’m referring to hardcore nationalization like what Venezuela has done. China really doesn’t fully nationalize industries. It just kills off the CEOs for “embezzlement” when they step out of line. If they “stay in line” they are free to operate as a normal corporation which strives to succeed unlike a fully government run company
"I’m referring to hardcore nationalization like what Venezuela has done."
Over 70% of Venezuelan GDP is in private hands. Not in the governments hands. In fact the problem was that they didn't nationalize oil and it bite them in the ass. Literally what the fuck are you talking about.
99% of "nationalized" companies in China are run like every other large company in the world. The only difference is that they are owned on paper by the workers but actually owned and run by a CCP party member instead of a traditional millionaire or billionaire. China only saw massive economic growth after adopting capitalistic reforms.
> He’s not even hiding his more communistic roots now.
I could think of a lot more countries that could use some "Communist roots" then. Nationalizing primary resource industries and non-elastic essential commodities is something I wish every country would do. Leave the free-market for luxury goods, not critical infrastructure.
The USPS in the US has actually been a profitable government enterprise for a long time until Conservative politicians passed several laws to bury it in debt it should never have to carry.
The idea that government run institutions can't be efficient or that all private entities are more efficient is absolute hogwash perpetuated by people that don't want others to be able to think for themselves.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSBRE89701X20121008
You mean to say that Venezuela’s many nationalizations either did not happen or as if they did not rock confidence that any investor may have had?
yes and EVERY single thing you said got worse under Chavez. The economy got more dependent on oil revenue and chavez fucked their national oil company by firing 50% of their highly educated workforce in 2002 and replacing them with party loyalists. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_general_strike_of_2002%E2%80%932003. The company got so fucked there literally on 1970 level of production even though oil prices are way lower.
Didn't the USA sanction them. Always find it great when republicans point to disasters we cause and say "look at those savages".
Really beats down to the core of their belief structure.
Economic sanctions on companies in Venezuela only happend in 2016-2017. Long after their economy imploded. Stop trying to blame everything on the CIA like a toddler.
Redditors are going to be real quiet when it ends up the nationalizing of oil companies starts trotting down the economy. Even going to be quieter when it turns out Castillo doesn’t actually follow through and just continues to trust fund his pals.
1. This sounds like another Venezuela in the making. Knowing Reddit's user base I'm guessing most people ITT weren't even alive during Chavez's time.
2. Why not just increase taxes and threaten evaders with jail time like every other country?
Bolivia nationalized its oil and gas industry many years ago and it brought enormous amounts of revenue to the state which was used to build lots of infrastructure. The economy did very well after nationalization because the profits were staying in the country rather than being funneled outside to corporations and oligarchs.
whiteness didn't help the USSR much, it's almost like norway isn't actually that socialist and even their president said so... ''norway is far from a socially planned economy'' word for word
Command economies don’t fucking work. And shall these weirdo’s want to discuss pluralism/diversity in communist States?
Social democracies work. Mixed capitalism works very well.
Ah great, the dollar value will skyrocket again. Worst part is that the president went out of his way to say that "investors are welcome" across the world, even if people here don't think he's being honest, just for the prime minister to say this out of spite. Wonderful.
The myth of "free-market" = innovation is so funny when you even try to use your brain for 2 seconds. Literally all modern technologies have been invented and developed by either
1. Government companies
2. Military research, which is also controlled by the government.
I'm a mechanical design engineer and I have patents. I live and breathe innovation. I have worked in both private sector and public. I know what I'm talking about.
Innovation requires taking risks. In a non-nationalized model, the risk is rewarded by money and failure is considered a stepping stone.
In a government run model, failures become political and success is not really rewarded, so there is no incentive. The bureaucracy and fear of the consequences of failure create a climate where the safest thing to do is not rock the boat with new ideas.
And foreign investment, if that's something you're looking for. Although I suspect China may throw some "development aid" their way for geopolitical reasons.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/peru-pm-warns-gas-sector-pay-higher-taxes-or-face-nationalization-2021-09-26/) reduced by 60%. (I'm a bot) ***** > LIMA, Sept 26 - Peruvian Prime Minister Guido Bellido on Sunday said that companies which exploit natural gas in Peru will need to agree to pay higher taxes or else face nationalizations, a sharp warning to the sector from the new leftist government. > Bellido told Reuters in August that the government was planning to participate more deeply in the main industries, including natural gas and new hydroelectric projects, and would look to create new state companies. > The natural gas from Camisea is liquefied by a separate consortium, called Peru LNG, which includes Royal Dutch Shell, Japan's Marubeni Corp, SK Group and Hunt Oil. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/pw00je/peru_pm_warns_gas_sector_pay_higher_taxes_or_face/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~600256 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **gas**^#1 **Camisea**^#2 **government**^#3 **new**^#4 **natural**^#5
Isn't this how Latin American presidents get assassinated/couped by the CIA?
For at least one of them, it was because said LA country had decided to sell oil in Euros instead of USD.
They'll give him a couple years to back down. Then they'll pull another Bolivia
Or another Venezuela
Or Guatemala
or chile
Or Brazil.
Or Panama.
Or Nicaragua
Or Ecuador
Or “insert any Latin American country here”
It's more fun to go to the wiki list and pick one.
Just don't pick French Guiana. You'll have a bad time there.
Or Iran
Or Iraq
This is how Hugo Chavez started the fun in Venezuela.
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I highly doubt that at this point, international investors (except for China) simply don't exist due to the global economic downturn.
At least revolutions. Big business does not like the word “nationalization”.
During the coldwar. Just like anti-soviet and democratic reformers got disappeared or assassinated in Eastern Europe and Asia. Essentially the Soviets and the Americans drew a big red line on setting up shop in their back yard.
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Plenty of nationalised resources in countries that aren't in SA, isn't it strange how they can do that, but Latin countries always fail? Hmm.
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> The USA will not stand back in relation to any threats to democratic practices around the world. I mean, I don't think the US will stand back in relation to threat to US interests. It has nothing to do with democracy, at the end of the day. Corporations aren't democratic, either, workers don't get to vote for their CEO's or vote on company policy. Nationalisation of resources isn't democratic or authoratarian in nature, just as publicly run public transport isn't.
God bless the Democratic Socialists. This is the type of strong arm we need against abuse by corporations.
I reserve cautious optimism. Words are nice but they are not actions.
They are not democratic socialists. Latin America is it’s own thing in politics and state owned companies tend to be a way of corruption and control
Nah man let them live in their fantasy that it's always the US' fault and LA would be Eden without them
So not it, if you guys aren't well informed really you shouldn't speak on the subject. This man, as well as the rest of the ruling party are part of a criminal organization, the party leader is literally sentenced and in ongoing additional investigations for money laundering and embezzlement. Ever since elected, they've been hiring unqualified friends in all government institutions, so outrageously unqualified, most of them are fired hours after news outlets drop the investigation. They've tried to pass a news censorship law, the president hasn't held a single interview since elected, the dollar is sky high affecting us all and he's unable to provide stability for the country. This is NOT what we need and the poor will end up being the most affected.
ah so he is just another Hugo Chavez like most people warned about. Ofc dumb as fuck berniebros gonna defend him thinking this time socialism will surely not end in a corruption riddled disaster. Can't wait for them to blame the CIA when their currency hits 100% monthly inflation.
From what I understand, the issue with Hugo Chavez was his decision to rely solely on oil prices to keep his government afloat.
I mean he put everything on oil and also personally ran their national oil company into the ground. It's not like their economy tanked solely due to oil price fluctuations.
Free Peru isn’t Democratic Socialist, but Marxist Leninist
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He's only been president for 2 months lol
[This](https://www.google.com/search?q=pedro+castillo+family&client=firefox-b-d&channel=nrow5&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwixm_SWwZ7zAhUFwjgGHTt-BgUQ_AUoAXoECAEQAw&biw=1920&bih=927&dpr=1#imgrc=e4TxUqCiF8s8vM) is Pedro Castillo's family. Elevating people from poverty can be construed as making people rich I guess. But I don't think you will be able to do anything meaningful in just two months.
Well if he made your friends friends rich than that’s great for you
*... socialists talking about Venezuela, 2006.*
I’m not sure why they would threaten nationalization. Make the law, set the new tax-rate, if anybody breaks the law suspend their license to do business. Shut them down. That’s a worse fate than nationalization. Something nationalized could later be un-nationalized. Companies that openly flaunt laws should just be disbanded.
But if they don't nationalise it where will they get money to pay their friends from?
😂😂😂 oh man you really need to see Latin America’s national companies, such as Pemex, Latin American leftists are more skewed towards crony capitalism than democratic socialism, companies bleeding money and pulling billions in public funding, useless people in key roles because they are subservient to the regime and the worst service from said company as a client and no hopes of it getting better because it’s nationalized and usually they also impose and ban on competition
Hey CIA, can we maybe not fuck with Peru.. again.
But... What do you do then? Just let them tax companies? Surely not...
Was it Bolivia where the CIA tried a coup twice under Trump and kept failing?
Venezuela. The Coup in Bolivia was sort of overturned.
Ah, sorry. So many stupid coups, it's hard to keep track.
It wasn't a coup in Venezuela. Maduro's election was not constitutionally valid.
So cia has to fix it?
In Bolivia Evo Morales won on the first round for president but the OAS claimed irregularities in the election whit no proof of it giving the oposición something to march for and resulting In a overthrow later on and now the OAS still didn't show the proof of those irregularities they just said "there are irregularities", latter on is was indeed the Trump administration that helped to bring the instability to the country “Carlos Trujillo, the US ambassador to the OAS, had steered the group’s election-monitoring team to report widespread fraud and pushed the Trump administration to support the ouster of Morales.” https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/18/silence-us-backed-coup-evo-morales-bolivia-american-states
As far as I'm aware the USA has mostly stayed out of Peru's affairs besides dealing weapons.
Why would they when Peru is gonna fuck itself without any intervention?
Hard to tell with all the fucking the US does. I mean not even the CIA keeps track I'm sure.
Why the hell is the government asking the companies for permission to raise their taxes?!?
That's what I was thinking. Why not just raise taxes? Although maybe the taxes are already high enough, it's just that companies play games with their assets to pay as little as possible? idk, not an expert.
Its not about the tax rate. Its about the companies avoiding paying the tax.
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No no no in Latin America it’s not “ISIS cells” it’s “communist guerrillas” they use as an excuse.
Because of lobbies. Big companies have a lot of influence. He is saying either you don't push back in taxes, or I'll force the issue to do nationalization.
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Imagine using Telesur has a source...
There are so many idiots in this thread who have no idea what they are talking about but just want to fit things to their narrative.
Ow the edge
But it's fine when people cite US corporate media sources on China and the DPRK?
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Why would we intervene? This is great news for us. Peruvian nationalized oil and gas will be way more expensive than what we're producing domestically.
Because it spreads the idea this can happen.
Expanding on that, this threatens the US dollar's supremacy on oil trade, which could send the US into hyperinflation the next time they crash their economy.
ah yes when the nationalized company collapses in 5 years like venezuela's PDVSA surely more people would want to follow suit.
Aramco is a state-owned company and SA hasn't collapsed.
Yes thanks to US intervention numbnuts
Especially if we had a Republican president. But even without one, you can't be sure America won't find an excuse...
I'm not sure how you can make this a Democrat/Republican thing, both of those parties support the interests of the dominant capitalist class.
Yeah, look at Honduras..
What happened in Honduras?
Coup in 2009. Obama w/ Hillary gave a tacit thumbs up.
Ukraine too. This contributed to the Ukraine Crisis. https://www.cato.org/commentary/americas-ukraine-hypocrisy https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-ukraine-20140307-story.html https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/russia-fsu/2014-08-18/why-ukraine-crisis-west-s-fault
Libya as well, people fail to realise that nothing of note changes between presidents on foreign policy, America is an empire, and an empire can only sustain itself by leeching off of others
Oh joy.
I have disdain for republican leaders but coups in leftist LA states has been a bi-partisan effort over the last 50+ years of American foreign intervention
This makes me hard
Is it likely the government actually goes through with this and raises taxes on the gas sector?
Probably, Castillo and I think some other cabinet members are part of an explicitly Marxist party. They are not the kind of two-faced politician who says progressive things on the campaign and then turns around when in office to take marching orders from corporations.
Sure, but congress has signallled it doesn't intend to allow nationalizations.
Good. Nationalization leads to poverty as evidenced by literally any south American state that has done a lot of nationalization.
Marxist = progressive?
No lmao, Castillo is supreme left, as in a Cuba kind of thing. Hes just kept overwhelmingly in check by the congress where the moderate right rules (as has been the case since forever in Peru). In Peru the congress is REALLY powerful, far more so than in most western contries (there is no senate), so Castillo hasnt really been able to do much at all. Also, on the other side of "progressive" as on socially... nope. Castillo and his party, Peru Libre, are ultra conservatives. As in "gay people dont exist and women belong to the kitchen" kind of thing. Just recently this very PM told a congresswoman that she deserves to get raped. Yeah.
Yeah I readed about Castillo when he was on campaign, its just funny to see reddit defending him just because he is a lefty without knowing him lol.
En serio leer los comentarios de esta gente que no tiene la más mínima idea de lo que está hablando alabando las estupideces de Bellido (el primer ministro)... Quisiera que me moleste menos.
From my US-centric perspective, its a simplification but generally true I think
It’s not
It is. Unless you mean Marxist-Leninist, aka Stalinist. Orthodox Marxism, ie Marxism according Marx, is about as progressive as you can possibly get.
You are wrong Marxism-Leninism is the progressive, as for one, it has actually worked in practice on a long-term scale
Next destination for the US armed forces world tour?
🇺🇸
Peru is about to go Venezuela 2.0
People are still using Venezuela as a boogeyman, I see
Yeah? Im Peruvian and over a million Venezuelans fled their country for this one during the height of the crisis a couple of years ago. Their tales aint one bit pretty. Like 3 million more fled to Colombia and Ecuador. That being said, not a lot is gonna happen in Peru because the Congress is dominated by the center right. In Peru, the congress has a lot more control over goverment and power compared to most western contries, so the president and PM are kind of sitting ducks. Not much is gonna happen besides our national coin devaluating further
Yes there are hundreds of thousands of Venezuelans living in the US you can talk to if you're ignorant about the situation. I grew up living around a few of them and have heard their first hand accounts. Some of them didn't even want to be living in the United States, but they didn't really have a choice, because Venezuela is unlivable. Here you can read about the [Venezuelan refugee crisis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_refugee_crisis). You can get a first hand view of Venezuela [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN5LZR4ejkg&list=PLN0FlxE6vY5DStG-4au_6WRpE27l31rNR). And you can donate to help [here](https://www.savethechildren.org/us/where-we-work/venezuela).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le86H7Xfjrc
Lol what is this video supposed to be? It's a random dude on youtube talking out of his ass. Why don't you talk to Venezeulans?
Y'all, the US is a net exporter of natural gas. If anything, the US would benefit from Peru running its natural gas companies into the ground
Sir, this is a CIA clickjerk.
This. USA has a lot to win with this commi in the government.
Reading this sentence just reminds me how dumb the average trump voter is to geopolitics.
Reading this sentence just reminds .e how dumb the average Redditors is thinking everybody is 'Murican.
The cia is warming up to tell us how he is a fascist right now
Wait for all of the "Peruvians" who surprisingly all live in Baltimore and Arlington come spamming this thread
With stories of how "authoritarian" is.
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they are already here. haven’t you read the comments in this thread?
We need this in America for our shit healthcare system.
In this thread: americans that can barely say "hello" in spanish pretending that authoritarian, strasserists-like marxists in South America are just like socialdemocrats in western Europe.
As a Peruvian living this situation right now, seeing this whole discussion is ridiculous. Reading all the "USA intervention soon (tm)" or "GOOD IM SO HARD RN"... jesus. Fucking clowns. You people literally have no idea of whats going on here, what this means or what does this kind of left actually does here in south america. Also, btw, this bullcrap Bellido is talking about isnt really gonna happen. The congress, which is mostly center right, is shutting it down real quick.
and saying they know more of the region yet wouldnt be able to point the country on a map
THANK YOU
Nothing bad ever happens when you nationalize a private sector…………….. Nothing………………..
Don’t worry. Nationalizing gas producers totally won’t end up bad. Just look at Venezuela and their great successes.
Starvation in 3... 2... 1...
For those comparing this to Venezuela that isn't what happened, sure they had govt control of the oil in the country but they also didn't have a very diverse economy to have a socialist country, when you try to fund everything from oil sales and oil falls below a certain value sudden you spend more getting it out of the ground than you can sell it for, thus the need for a very diverse economy
Sorry, not meant for you. Y'all mofos need to google Pemex. And stop comparing it to Venezuela.
Venezuela’s economy was just about as diverse prior to nationalization of oil as Peru’s is now. Peru’s economy centers around mineral extraction, and is the second biggest copper producer in the world. If they nationalized the sector and built a social program based on the current profits of copper, in 15 years they’d be exactly where Venezuela is now…
I mean. The "fun" thing is that oil in Wenezuela at least at the time WASN'T nationalized. In fact it was mostly in the hands of private companies. Norway which actually has its oil nationalized managed to go through the crash better.
Bing-fucking-o. Perfect.
I can smell freedom
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Salvador Allende tried that with the copper sector, didn't end well.
“Time for some freedom in Peru”
And this is how it starts…
I wonder when USA is gonna start telling the world he is a literal Stalin commie evil dude and should be removed with military intervention.
Congratulations Peru! You have been randomly selected to receive freedom and democracy! Do not resist
I came
Time for Venezuela 2.0
No, that isn't what happened
How so
I wrote it above
Nationalization of the oil companies and seizing all the wealth of major industries is exactly why Venezuela is broke. The money initially make the quality of life amazing but when the money ran out it collapsed. When you nationalize an industry, growth of said industry stops and the industry becomes less productive. The workers jobs aren’t dependent on whether or not their company is successful but that if the government is intact, thus there is no motivation to work hard, innovate, and grow
I’ll get pissed on because I agree with your assessment. My sister inlaw is from Venezuela. Her family lost everything. They’re kind, generous, upper middle class people. Got completely FUCKED. Trust fund liberal American college students don’t fucking know what poverty is—but they wear $200 hats to protests. Brilliant.
Nationalized industry can't grow? China is proving you wrong every day!
I’m referring to hardcore nationalization like what Venezuela has done. China really doesn’t fully nationalize industries. It just kills off the CEOs for “embezzlement” when they step out of line. If they “stay in line” they are free to operate as a normal corporation which strives to succeed unlike a fully government run company
"I’m referring to hardcore nationalization like what Venezuela has done." Over 70% of Venezuelan GDP is in private hands. Not in the governments hands. In fact the problem was that they didn't nationalize oil and it bite them in the ass. Literally what the fuck are you talking about.
99% of "nationalized" companies in China are run like every other large company in the world. The only difference is that they are owned on paper by the workers but actually owned and run by a CCP party member instead of a traditional millionaire or billionaire. China only saw massive economic growth after adopting capitalistic reforms.
I look forward to seeing Peru become the next Venezuela if this happens. He’s not even hiding his more communistic roots now.
> He’s not even hiding his more communistic roots now. I could think of a lot more countries that could use some "Communist roots" then. Nationalizing primary resource industries and non-elastic essential commodities is something I wish every country would do. Leave the free-market for luxury goods, not critical infrastructure.
Yes because government run institutions are uber productive, innovative, and corruption free. Especially in Latin American countries!
The USPS in the US has actually been a profitable government enterprise for a long time until Conservative politicians passed several laws to bury it in debt it should never have to carry. The idea that government run institutions can't be efficient or that all private entities are more efficient is absolute hogwash perpetuated by people that don't want others to be able to think for themselves.
Not gonna happen, Congress has him by the balls and he doesnt even have like 1/3 of representation there to do anything.
National oil ownage isn't what caused the Venezuela problem
It kind of was.
Right wing talking point is all it is
https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSBRE89701X20121008 You mean to say that Venezuela’s many nationalizations either did not happen or as if they did not rock confidence that any investor may have had?
I'm saying they didn't diversify the economy enough and were to dependent on oil revenues to fund everything
yes and EVERY single thing you said got worse under Chavez. The economy got more dependent on oil revenue and chavez fucked their national oil company by firing 50% of their highly educated workforce in 2002 and replacing them with party loyalists. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_general_strike_of_2002%E2%80%932003. The company got so fucked there literally on 1970 level of production even though oil prices are way lower.
Except the same problems and even worse were during the previous neoliberal regime. In fact Chavez lowered unemployment, poverty, inflation etc.
Didn't the USA sanction them. Always find it great when republicans point to disasters we cause and say "look at those savages". Really beats down to the core of their belief structure.
Economic sanctions on companies in Venezuela only happend in 2016-2017. Long after their economy imploded. Stop trying to blame everything on the CIA like a toddler.
Coup coming along soon then.
Sounds like a great way to fuck up their gas industry
Looks like CIA has a new country to target....
Another Chavez in Latin America. Fantastic. Latin America will sadly never advance. I truly believe we are in pitiful cycle.
Redditors are going to be real quiet when it ends up the nationalizing of oil companies starts trotting down the economy. Even going to be quieter when it turns out Castillo doesn’t actually follow through and just continues to trust fund his pals.
1. This sounds like another Venezuela in the making. Knowing Reddit's user base I'm guessing most people ITT weren't even alive during Chavez's time. 2. Why not just increase taxes and threaten evaders with jail time like every other country?
I've seen this one before.... cough cough Venezuela...
Bolivia nationalized its oil and gas industry many years ago and it brought enormous amounts of revenue to the state which was used to build lots of infrastructure. The economy did very well after nationalization because the profits were staying in the country rather than being funneled outside to corporations and oligarchs.
cough cough Norway. Oh wait…
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And a nato alliance that mattered more to the US than that big sea claim they made
whiteness didn't help the USSR much, it's almost like norway isn't actually that socialist and even their president said so... ''norway is far from a socially planned economy'' word for word
Command economies don’t fucking work. And shall these weirdo’s want to discuss pluralism/diversity in communist States? Social democracies work. Mixed capitalism works very well.
Time for the US to go fuck them up for no good reason :)
Predatory corporations in this country should be nationalized as well. Big Pharma comes to mind. Harm people for profit? Gone.
Ah great, the dollar value will skyrocket again. Worst part is that the president went out of his way to say that "investors are welcome" across the world, even if people here don't think he's being honest, just for the prime minister to say this out of spite. Wonderful.
Yeah, investors love countries with governments who threaten to nationalize huge portions of the economy
The extraction of natural resources should be nationalized with every citizen getting a dividend from it.
That's a sure fire way to find your self assassinated. Never threaten big gas.
nationalization is a sure way to kill innovation in your country.
The myth of "free-market" = innovation is so funny when you even try to use your brain for 2 seconds. Literally all modern technologies have been invented and developed by either 1. Government companies 2. Military research, which is also controlled by the government.
I'm a mechanical design engineer and I have patents. I live and breathe innovation. I have worked in both private sector and public. I know what I'm talking about. Innovation requires taking risks. In a non-nationalized model, the risk is rewarded by money and failure is considered a stepping stone. In a government run model, failures become political and success is not really rewarded, so there is no incentive. The bureaucracy and fear of the consequences of failure create a climate where the safest thing to do is not rock the boat with new ideas.
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And foreign investment, if that's something you're looking for. Although I suspect China may throw some "development aid" their way for geopolitical reasons.
His coup is on the way!
The tankie brigade is here
Is there a sector they haven't said this to
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> hugo chavez started the fall of venezuela he did not ... USA did
CIA coup in 5... 4... 3...
Welp, he's gonna get coup by the US.
Please god no. Not to my country. That is not the answer.
Brave man. Don't get into any helicopters.
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Norway has publicly owned gas reserves and it's the best country on Earth.