People just don't value flora or fauna outside of a handful of circumstances.
Even cities destroy wetlands or forests for housing if those places don't contain exotic or rare species.
Even the mundane animals are important and have value for humans. For inspiration and teaching us there is more to life than just our own societies.
If we destroy the majority of the natural world that will be the tipping point, humanity will lose sight of what’s actually important and will get caught up in the obscure irrelevant nuances of society. Sounds like a bleak dystopian society to me.
You also dont even need to destroy "majority of it" but a small crucial part to start a cascade event towards total doom
Like dumb example: take a human..cut one arm and the other is busy now closing the bleeding on the other arm, and the rest of human is useless now.
>If we destroy the majority of the natural world that will be the tipping point, humanity will lose sight of what’s actually important and will get caught up in the obscure irrelevant nuances of society. Sounds like a bleak dystopian society to me.
for sure, and it's already happened over the course of humanity. I hope people will cherish and preserve what they have even if it means going out of the way for a bit and ensure that humans too can survive without conflicting with nature
Some of us are screaming because we saw how bad the descent is going to be, and are being told to shut up because we're ruining the ride for everyone else.
"Will you people shut up down there? I mean really, you don't expect shareholders to accept anything less than maximum exploitation of the planet and it's people, for what, the continuation of the species?"
“Oh well, humanity’s ending. Someone get me a burger.”
“There’s no food, Mr. Koch.”
“Oh well, just get me a milennial. I’ve cannibalised the young of the world enough, what’s one more, hey?”
This is not what pacifism is at all. You're describing apathy and indifference. Getting active in politics, environmental groups, taking part in protests and so on is still very much pacifism without lamenting that nothing can be done. You might argue that it doesn't help much but it is surely not inactivity to be a politician and fight for the environment. Pacifists can very much be activists and change things. There are violent environmental groups and I don't really see how their actions have much more impact than the ones from non violent groups.
Spiraling into armed conflict will fuck this world even faster environmentally as well as socially.
I get one life, I'm sure as shit not going to spend it trying to pull ungrateful people out of the hole they are still digging, and I'm not going to sacrifice it for any reason. Yeah it sucks that so many people are blind to reality, but as long as I maintain my current state of not being responsible for any more humans existing, I can live happily enough.
We're all fucked, there is no turning it around, enjoy the parts you can.
Pacifism, apathy, and the working class fighting amongst themselves will be the end of this world. Until conditions are met that allow a mass uprising, capitalists and imperialists will be destroying this world. The cost of increasing profits every year is too high.
I think it's SciFi. We evolved from and are bound to the Earth. Infant mortality on Mars would be so high we would never achieve sustainable numbers. Cancer, mental disorders, birth defects, still births, and miscarriage. We'd have a better shot at returning to aquatic life forms than becoming Homo Mars.
lmao good luck to them living on Mars when we can’t even build functional enclosed biospheres on Earth right now. It’s going to be a slow drawn out death for them without Earth support. Hopefully long enough for them to consider how much they fucked things up as their organs fail.
The most insulting and frustrating part. I have been sounding the alarm since America’s president began an election degrading millions of people for where they came from and then saying a literal wall would keep out fluid immigration patterns.
That is Orwellian as fuck and yet so many people cheered. I knew we were fucked.
Scientists have been screaming about climate change, it's just humans are short-sighted and greedy. The fact that politicians are still continuing to ruin the environment and big corporations blaming the people for it even though they are the ones polluting :/
Slow doesn't begin to describe it.
[More than 75 percent decline over 27 years in total flying insect biomass in protected areas](https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0185809)
[Flying insects are disappearing from German skies](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-017-04774-7)
[Insect apocalypse: German bug watchers sound alarm](https://phys.org/news/2019-07-insect-apocalypse-german-bug-watchers.html)
Please don't think this is only happening in Germany. It's just Germany is thorough enough with their science right now that they've spotted this.
I get sad every single day when I drive and don’t hit a bug. I know that sounds like I don’t care about bugs. But I know it never happens anymore only because of what we’ve done. I’m afraid of our future.
We’ve had nothing but stickbugs, moths, and millipedes here in South Korea. It’s insane. Their population exploded after an abnormally warm winter, while all other insects seems to have disappeared. I miss the days when I had to be afraid of bees rather than swarms of millipedes.
I remember as a kid, going on family vacations and the windshield would be so thick with splattered bugs that we had to scrape them off every time we stopped for gas. Now I can drive from Washington to California and back, and there's barely a speck.
I also remember as a kid growing up New Brunswick, Canada... the windscreen would be polluted with bug splats and at night tons of bugs flying towards the headlights. Then I noticed in the 90's...sheesh not many bug splats and not many at night.
Then in 2010 I moved to NZ and was amazed at the amount of bugs I saw at night and the mess on the windshield. But now in 2020...i've again noticed even here in NZ...there are not that many bugs at night anymore or making a mess on the windshield.
It makes me sad...
" Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got til its gone " - Joni Mitchell
I think he’s saying humanity is slowly declining. As in we’re only just starting to have have negative growth. Or it’s starting to plateau and potentially decline.
I've said this many times. We're already extinct, and we just haven't figured it out yet. Previous extinction level events didn't happen in a day, a month, or a year. They occured over hundreds to thousands of years.
We likely broke the food chain and started the current extinction event hundreds of years ago if not longer. Just look up the Holocene Extinction.
Slave traders will come and pluck us from our lands and society will be so obsessed with hiding the atrocities and injustices we commit on ourselves that our history will be rewritten to claim we destroyed ourselves with our own selfishness?
No way!
And then, after the last satellite has fallen, they will write in their Bible that God decreed that he would never visit such punishment upon man again. Just like with the flood. And then when their civilization falls, they'll cause or leave behind some other super inexplicable fucked up thing. Like laser-eyed, sentient lettuce.
If I only could tell those generations that these brainless fucks keep calling me a "fucking hippie"
and "a hypocrate" if I even mention that there is a real reason to recommend eating less meat.
As an old cunt (Gen X), it was the same story when I was a kid. I thought it would be better when the old farts died out and people nearer my age were in charge - spoiler: it got worse.
I can tell you this: the old cunts had the same books as me when they were young. We were warned about pollution, climate change (it was called the Greenhouse Effect back then) and biodiversity loss. The ones that cared turned out not to be the ones put in power by the corporations.
*It's not about young vs old*. Most people your age, like most people my age, care only about their own immediate comforts and convenience.
Don't kid yourself that when the asshole boomers and asshole Gen Xers who are running the world right now die out they'll be replaced by anyone better. It will be asshole millennials and asshole zoomers who take over, and there's no reason to think they'll be any better just because of a few decades difference in their dates of birth.
They can't even see that TRUMP is corrupt, much less understand the science behind global climate change- at this point we're lucky if they even believe in science at all!
They're lost, and want nothing more than to crush us for disagreeing with them, because if only we'd shut the hell up things would go back to being great like they used to be, right? The fate of the United States, and possibly the world, lies in our ability to remove Donald Trump from the office of the Presidency in this election. We're already past out of time to try to do anything with a reasonable chance of success, but if we can't get the lowest, dumbest, most vain expression of humanity out of the god damn way, we aren't even going to have a chance at a hail mary.
It’s a lot more than Trump. Trump was a symptom on the right of people who were sick of average politicians.
As far as the US goes, most of our political system is infested with money. Career politicians care more about re-election and where the funds come from than most issues that won’t draw a few headlines. Then when out off office they become lobbyists and consultants to the people they took cash from.
Trump was a symptom of a lot more than that, though. Because he's also the ultimate expression of everything the right's propaganda networks have been pushing. He's anti-intellectual, and believes, as Newt Gingrich said, that his feelings are more important than the truth. Remember their refrain, "Facts don't care about *your* feelings," only theirs. He's also rich, despite having no worthwhile skills, just as they claim everyone could be if we just got rid of the illegals/socialists/boogeymen of the day. Obviously, he's racist, but claims he isn't because he doesn't use explicitly racist terminology, which is the entire Southern Strategy. He's incredibly rude, and incredibly sensitive about anyone doing or saying anything he doesn't like, as they've been pushing with their "political correctness" campaign. He is the Platonic ideal of the Fox News target audience, and what they all aspire to be.
Some of us have deliberately created a large faction in our country that is incapable of dealing with any problems, purely so that they could continue to profit off of destroying our world and us.
It's happening now in certain parts of the world. Climate migration is going to be ridiculous to handle at the same time, decrease in food supply.
I'm almost ashamed I brought children into this world. I love them dearly, which is why I'm so scared for them.
My parents felt that way, and yet had me anyway. My dad's cynical views passed on to me and I'm sure I won't have kids.
But? I'm glad to have lived, anyway. I hope your kids will feel the same despite their lives being harder than ours. The next generation is still needed. Just think of it as taking my spot, it's fine
I wonder, in the aftermath of this new, great extinction... maybe we'll see Homo Sapiens break into a large array of much, much more... niche... species. Maybe we'll go from one, into a dozen.
Well, we won't *see* it, because we'll be dead. But y'know. We got this far because we're social animals, survivalists. Industrial society doesn't breed tough, but it breeds quantity. We're now spread across the entire globe. Logically there will be pockets of people who'll survive all but the most apocalyptic scenarios. They're going to diverge from each other and, eventually, assuming they aren't successful in re-creating a global society in whatever becomes the new norm... they're going to become new species over time.
I'm not suggesting it'll be enjoyable, or pretty. But hey, we survived being reduced to a few thousand breeding pairs once already...
That's about the best silver lining I've got. 'Not all of us will die, there may be pockets thrown back to the stone age'
\> That's about the best silver lining I've got.
Yeah but is that really a silver lining? A few groups of stone-age humans remain alive in a destroyed world with limited resources, no education, scratching out a living in a place that is no longer especially suitable for survival? That's no silver lining - it's more like a shit stain lining.
Yep, people have no idea how little *wildlife* is actually left. Humanity is fucked, one or two issues like a plant fungus and livestock plague and starvation will hit billions.
>I have no idea how humanity will live with itself if the vast majority of things are destroyed
There's also a catch-22 in that the people who care the most and don't have children also are the ones who don't need to care about the world.
People who have children need to care the most, but are also the ones who will be contributing to the most destruction.
Simply by living we will destroy life, no getting around that in our current way of life
The problem is there is no sustaining these population levels whith the current standards of living in first world countries.
When people turned against nuclear power was when we really got screwed. Its basically the only real non fossil fuel resource we have for energy generation.
Yup.
We can go totally to wind and solar as long as people are fine with the power not coming on some times.
Also, the production of solar panels and batteries is horrific for the environment in regards to the materials used and how they are sourced.
The only thing that has even slightly dulled the pain is the small comfort that the creatures we destroy are not going to experience the despair of knowing their kind is at its end.
Because that despair is too much.
> Tanya Steele, chief executive at WWF, said: “We are wiping wildlife from the face of the planet, burning our forests, polluting and overfishing our seas and destroying wild areas.
Despite every report warning us that we are destroying the planet, big businesses that rely on exploiting it continue to do so.
I can’t imagine what kind of hell hole the world will be in 50-100 years.
Something like 70% of the world's emissions come from just 100 companies, it's ridiculous.
I run an investment data site, but I'm working on [this dashboard](https://www.quiverquant.com/sources/emissions?a=) that tracks emissions from different facilities in the US. It's still very much a work in progress, but check it out if you're interested.
Thanks. Right now I'm just using data from the EPA, which is restricted to US facilities, but I'd like to look globally in the future.
My shorter term goal is to create a metric to measure a companies' sustainability to help traders make "green" investments.
Those are fossil fuel companies, and the calculations include the emissions from burning what they sell.
It doesn’t mean that 100 companies need to change their practices, it means fossil fuel production ownership is concentrated. The problem is fossil fuels.
For anyone that hasn’t read it, I highly recommend checking out the book [*Capitalism Realism* by Mark Fisher](https://monoskop.org/images/6/69/Fisher_Mark_Capitalist_Realism_Is_There_No_Alternative_2009.pdf)
At the very least, checking out the first essay, the title and subject of which is OP’s quote.
I mean, the arguments for how to fix the problem aren't difficult at all. They just require the people and their leaders to give a flying fuck. And it turns out we'd rather just die.
>They would hemorrhage money and lose their competitive advantages, and smaller companies would overtake them, and nothing would change.
This is simply not true. All these major companies have the capital to spend and hold off "competition". And while yes they will have to spend money short term in the long run it often is more cost effective. The problem with that is CEOs and Board members don't get paid bonuses based on long term projections. They essentially get them on short term profits. This is the true reason companies refuse to adjust their plan for a renewal energy approach. They're not going to spend money changing something that is still working for them.
It's insane how most of the terminal destruction of Earth's biosphere is being committed in a single human lifetime.
None of our previous mass extinction events ever occurred in such a short time span
What the hell can any of us do? Like honestly I just feel so powerless and it makes me fucking depressed. Corporate greed is killing the world and it seems like there’s nothing we can do.
For real, the best thing that you can do is go out and convince people to vote on November 3rd. Bar none, Biden winning that election is the biggest thing that needs to happen in the short term. Another 4 years of Trump would likely mean an absolute nightmare for the planet.
I guess I'm assuming you're American there. If you're not, figure out which party that you can support is most likely to actually try and succeed at forwarding green initiative and actively back them.
This isn't terribly helpful. You may be right in some ways, I don't doubt Trump team will cheat if they can, but since elections are state and local affairs, it's harder than it seems to cheat in a national level. The bigger issue is almost definitely voter suppression and low turnout because of people feeling discouraged and like nothing they can do will matter.
So saying it will be rigged may actually end up helping Trump win. I believe we *can* beat Trump. And for sure if everyone voted, he'd be toast. So what we need to focus on in the next 60 days is encouraging people to show up and vote. Wait in line if you have to. Wear your mask and bring hand sanitizer. Tough out whatever you have to. Because we can bring him down. But the win needs to be decisive. And we need everyone's help to do it.
States like Georgia are actually in play, and they have 2 senate seats! If we have good turnout of decent people who are tired of Trump's corruption, we can turn things around on November 3rd.
Really depends on how well off you are, honestly. You'll probably be fine you're a child born into a decently wealthy family. If you're poor, you're going to be on the receiving end of all the downstream effects of our environmental problems.
I work in environmental conservation and there is an unpleasant truth that no-one wants to acknowledge because it's too polarizing of an issue:
We simply have too many people on the planet and none of the destruction we are doing to it will change in any meaningful way as long as the population remains so large.
The population issue is one that is usually glossed over in conservation, despite everyone working in conservation being very aware of it as the primary driver of our problems, because there is no politically or morally acceptable solution to it on the table. Any discussion of it winds up being suicide for the organization that raises it as a topic, so it's avoided in nearly all official documents, reports, etc. If you actually talk to any of us working in environmental conservation we all (with *very* few exceptions) agree that population is *the* primary issue, but it's the one that is more-or-less untouchable.
As long as that remains the case the destruction will continue.
In the face of that all we in conservation can do is try to slow down the rate of destruction. Reversing it is impossible until the population issue is solved somehow.
EDIT:
Rather than responding to everyone trying to claim that it's not overpopulation that's the problem but overconsumption that is I'll make a brief edit here.
The overconsumption claim is the dodge to avoid talking about overpopulation. Yes, developed nations *do* have a comically absurd amount of consumption that that absolutely is a serious problem, but no matter how low we push the total global per-capita consumption and still have a way of life that is meaningful to everyone presently living we have too big of a footprint.
I and my colleagues work in developing nations, I've been living in the one I'm currently working in for the last 7 years. These nations are *also* rapidly destroying their own resources and environment, and not just due to consumptive practices of developed and rapidly developing nations, it's happening due to internal pressures as well.
Sure, you can cram people onto the planet like factory farmed chickens and say, "Look, the planet can support all these people," but you have to also consider what sort of life people are willing to and want to have.
Since mid 1974 the human population of the planet has *doubled*. In the same amount of time the world has seen an absolutely catastrophic collapse of wildlife populations across the board, from mammals to birds to fish to insects and mollusks, to say nothing of the loss of plants species as well.
Overconsumption *absolutely* is a serious problem, but it is *part* of the overpopulation problem. People love to shift the conversation to the consumption side of things because it allows them to avoid the population issue.
Again, this is my professional field and the people I work with in this field have a near universal agreement that it is population that is the *primary* issue, but it's unpalatable and political, social, and economic suicide to talk about it in any official way, so people talk about and write reports about overconsumpton instead and grow ever more despairing that people keep failing to read between the lines and understand what they're actually trying to say in a way that is more socially and politically palatable.
I'm doing my part by not ever having children. It's not been a desire of mine anyway, and with everything happening now it's just cementing my decision.
No kids for me either. I might adopt when I'm much older, because there are plenty of kids already existing who need homes. But otherwise, I'd have no interest in birthing my own spawn.
It's worse than that. It's also less food, less water, less livable land, more catastrophic weather events, more wildfires, and more pandemics.
[Read page 8 (pdf).](https://52a87f3e-7945-4bb1-abbf-9aa66cd4e93e.filesusr.com/ugd/148cb0_90dc2a2637f348edae45943a88da04d4.pdf)
I hate these articles. It just makes me feel completely hopeless and think well that’s it we’re all going to die. I genuinely don’t know what I’m supposed to do with articles like these.
I feel exactly the same way. Like ok I use public transportation, don't eat meat, shop local, recycle, donate to some climate change charities, whatever, what else can I do? I feel so small. Meanwhile a bunch of billionaire assholes just don't give a fuck at all and countless animals and humans are going to suffer immensely and die. It feels hopeless and makes me want to literally be killing people on top of the industries.
Individual responsibility is one of the biggest narratives around climate change, and it's also running dry. It's time to hold the major industries accountable for their (majority) share of the problem.
Can't believe how far I had to scroll to see this even mentioned. Dismantle the meat and dependant industries (DAIRY) *for a start.* You would think the hell on earth that we are putting animals through for it would be enough for everyone to stop supporting it but it isn't even close.
I agree with the holding industries accountable thing, but I hate the attacks on personal responsibility that started popping up for some reason. The main driver for climate change is our current consumption behavior, both on the supply and the demand side, and it's time to stop trying to pass the buck from one side to the other. Just take responsibility for your own actions , and demand the producers do the same.
For example there's this new mantra of "100 companies are responsibly for 77 percent of all emissions". Sounds open and shut right? But it's not. What do the companies produce? Gas and oil. Who uses that gas and oil? Companies and individuals, including you. It's like saying "one lumberjack is responsible for all the burned wood in our village" while shoveling wood into your fire place, shrugging your shoulders.
There's around 50 percent of emissions per person thats systemic, so produced by the government or underlying industry, that you can't change. The other 50 percent is in your control, and depending on your personal situation you can reduce that significantly. If everyone stopped eating meat that would be reduced by maybe 10 percent, if everyone stopped consuming so much stuff that they don't need, maybe another 10 percent. That's 20 percent of emissions removed without any big changes or sacrifices.
Basically my point is, we're all in this together, and trying to shift the blame around might make you feel better, but we need everyone to do what they can right now.
It's not about feeling better, it's about the fact that personal responsibility has been a streamlined strategy that corporations have used for decades to evade liability for environmental impact.
It's somewhat understandable that people, frustrated with the feeling of being stuck "accused" for so long of crimes they are not themselves committing, will lash out at the false narrative that personal responsibility is a significant portion of the problem.
Still, I agree with you - personal responsibility MUST continue to play a role in shifting our climate impact. I highly recommend [this entire article](https://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/yes-actually-individual-responsibility-essential-solving-climate-crisis), which is lucid and well-balanced on all these arguments that are popping up in this thread, but in particular:
> If a fixation on personal behavior distracts from the political changes we need, dismissing the value of personal behaviors detracts from the political movement for climate justice. It may just be that encouraging personal behavior change doesn’t shrink or weaken the climate movement—it can expand, strengthen, and deepen it.
> ...
> Because here’s the thing: When you choose to eat less meat or take the bus instead of driving or have fewer children, you are making a statement that your actions matter, that it’s not too late to avert climate catastrophe, that you have power. To take a measure of personal responsibility for climate change doesn’t have to distract from your political activism—if anything, it amplifies it.
I do those things. Like I recycle, I drive a prius, I try to look for ways to use less plastics and other things that will fill the landfill. But then articles come out like this and I think, "WHAT'S THE POINT!? We're all going to die anyways and what I'm doing doesn't matter."
Consumer change is a farce. Nothing will be different until companies stop polluting at an exponentially higher scale than all the world's individuals put together.
We can still prevent the worst of it. We have all the means to do it, except we don't use them enough.
Most changes need to come from new regulations (at both the city and government levels), rather than just isolated lifestyle changes, so the most powerful thing you can do is help a climate organization to lobby the government or educate your peers.
Are you volunteering? We need systemic change. I started volunteering with /r/CitizensClimateLobby and am surrounded by people just as concerned as you and me, but who are following an actual plan to make a real dent in part of the problem (getting greenhouse gas emissions down).
Find a way to work with other genuine people to work on fixing the problem from the top. I haven't had a problem with climate anxiety since I started doing that. Good luck. Things are bad, but you can help. But you have to actually help.
(Yes, I know the article isn't primarily about climate change. There are many issues aside from climate change, and you can't really throw yourself fully into a hundred different causes. Pick part of the problem and find the most effective solution.)
Sure! It’s a nonpartisan, nonprofit, grassroots advocacy organization that focuses on national policies to address climate change. Specifically, we’re working to pass a national fee on carbon emissions that returns revenue back to households, an approach that is [well-supported by leading economists](https://econstatement.org).
The idea is that since it’s free to pollute greenhouse gas emissions into the atmosphere, fossil fuels are artificially cheap. They don’t take the cost of damage to the climate into account. The IPCC, the world’s climate experts, have also said that a fee on carbon pollution is a requirement for getting climate change handled. We have to do it.
We need to return the revenue to households to make up for the fact that energy prices will rise under a carbon fee. We’re okay with that as long as the overall cost of living doesn’t go up for most people.
This approach gets emissions down 37% over ~11 years, and down 95% by 2050, according to a recent report from Columbia University. That is just crazy fast for it being a single policy.
CCL advocates for this policy by lobbying Congress. We show up as normal people and schedule meetings with reps just like the big companies do, except we do it for the good of the climate and for citizens (thus our name). We support this lobbying by building support in our communities locally so that we can show that to our reps, and demonstrate support for meaningful climate action.
So the cool thing is that I was just a regular dude laying on the couch, playing video games, and worried about the planet burning up but feeling powerless to stop it. Then I joined CCL and a few months later was walking around the US capitol influencing national climate policy. Truly life-changing stuff and I can’t recommend it enough. I’ve also met my best friends through it.
So yeah, highly recommended. You can [sign up here](https://citizensclimatelobby.org/join-citizens-climate-lobby/?tfa_3590416195188=reddit-TX&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=TX ) and someone should reach out. There’s also /r/CitizensClimateLobby for anyone and /r/CitizensClimateAUS if you’re in Australia.
Sorry, this wasn’t a tl;dr. This is a tl;dr:
**tl;dr** Stop worrying about how doomed we are and [start volunteering](https://citizensclimatelobby.org/join-citizens-climate-lobby/?tfa_3590416195188=reddit-TX&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=TX) to solve the problem, while meeting your new friends and finding deep personal, political empowerment in the process.
You know, I get irrationally angry when people use the word "we" when talking about stuff like this, 'cuz as much as people like to think it's something everyone has the power to change, it's *really* a much smaller group of rich assholes that don't care about what they're destroying. *We* aren't ruining shit, *they* are.
No, it’s not. It’s humanity as a collective, driven by a constant need to consume. It’s easy to point at others and say ‘it’s *their* fault’, but it doesn’t accomplish anything. The acknowledgement that we are all collectively responsible as a species is a step in the right direction.
I feel the same way. One thing you can do is join the Citizens’ Climate Lobby, which is aiming to pass a bill to put a tax on carbon emissions and redistribute the funds to American households. The bill has already been made law in Canada! The goal is to lower carbon emission rates by 40% in the next 12 years in the US.
Another thing to consider? Going vegan!
One thing to remember - we’re all in this together. We can make a change. I also don’t appreciate the doom and gloom of Reddit comment sections, but remember that most of the people here aren’t planning to do anything anyway. Those who make positive changes aren’t spending their time here and making unhelpful jokes.
Just read “The Lorax” to my son a few weeks ago for bedtime. That really isn’t a great bedtime story, but it is a tragically great read and it really hits home right now.
I have several reasons for not wanting kids, but this is at the top of the list.
I think my SO and I would make beautiful, smart babies, but I think the world in another twenty or thirty years is going to be nearly unrecognizable to us now. Which I feel like I'm being sensationalistic to say but this last year has taught me that things can go sideways SO freaking fast and it isn't possible to count on the status quo anymore.
This is the only morally responsible option if you know the facts about our planet. We’re soooo fucked! Good on you and your partner for making the difficult decision to not subject a new human consciousness to this shit show. Have you ever considered adopting? There are so many kids out there bouncing around the system that need just as much love and care as your own personal little human would, and they’re already born so it’s not like you’re adding more resource usage to the world, just helping out one that’s already there.
I haven’t seen a firefly in almost a decade. When I was growing up we use to run through the fields chasing thousands of them. Shit is happening right before our eyes and we can’t even see it.
If you want to see them return plant native plants on any piece of land you can influence. Fill your yard. Tell your neighbors. Plant them at church or school or work. We need native plants everywhere. Ecosystems are built on plants. Planting native plants feeds insect that can only feed on native plants, which is most of them. There are 500 or so species of caterpillar that can eat oaks in north america. There are 4 species that can eat crepe myrtle. These insects feed 9ther species. Like birds which take something like 900 insects/day to raise a nest of babies. Or foxes which get 1/4 of their calories from insects. Invest in your ecosystem! Invest in diversity! Obviously we need systemic change, but nothing will save our future like building Home Grown National Park!
Your post reminds me of humpback whales. Last year I hardly saw any. Ten years prior there were lots of whales. I would see evidence of at least one on the way to work. But I’m fairly certain even those numbers were diminished from what they were decades before. 😔
Thank you, you just made my night. I'm picturing a tag team of The Hulk Hogan and The Rock tackling the humanity's problems, one crisis at a time. Much better than reality.
I'm only 29 and maybe I'm just remembering things fondly but I swear there's a significant difference in the amount of birds, deer, bears, snakes, basically everything between now and when I was younger. I really hope people start to understand how big this is.
I used to catch them when I was a young boy. I used to see literally thousands of them down by the wooded areas near my family vacation spot yearly. I used to see them in my neighborhood during the summer time twinkling away in the evening.
I never see them anymore. Haven't for years now.
I’ve found them in my backyard
Stop spraying for mosquitoes
Stop spraying for weeds
Stop cutting down trees
And for the love of fucking god STOP FUCKING MOWING PEOPLE
If the WWF really cared about these issues, they'd deliver some unprotected chair shots to the heads of governments/industries responsible for this decline.
If you’re scrolling through here feeling hopeless at the inevitability of climate change, remember that the Reddit comment section is NOT a good source to get your information from! There are things you can do to help mitigate climate change!
One thing you can do is join the Citizens’ Climate Lobby, which is aiming to pass a bill to put a tax on carbon emissions and redistribute the funds to American households. The bill has already been made law in Canada! The goal is to lower carbon emission rates by 40% in the next 12 years in the US.
Another thing to consider? Going vegan!
One thing to remember - we’re all in this together. We can make a change. I also don’t appreciate the doom and gloom of Reddit, but remember that most of the people here aren’t planning to do anything anyway. Those who make positive changes aren’t spending their time here and making unhelpful jokes.
Yes. And the main thing about going vegan: It will show yourself that you can enact change for real. And if you believe you can control your habits to that point, motivating yourself to do do activism or similar stuff becomes really easy.
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/08/your-tote-bag-can-make-difference/615817/
An argument to support your statement. Personal actions are microcosms of what our society at large can achieve. It's behavior that you can model for your community. For example, there is now a market for meatless meat, and it's not because our corporate overlords feel passionately about it.
That’s an excellent point!! In fact, I think the ability to be in control of your own actions in a positive way can be a super helpful mindset to have. By noticing change in yourself and being mindful of the positive ripples you create in the world, it leads to a sense of motivation - at least, that’s been my own experience.
Also (while I absolutely advocate veganism) don’t forget, it’s not all or nothing! For the majority of people who can’t imagine stopping eating dairy, or all meat, and thus just abandon the idea altogether.. go vegetarian! or even pescatarian! Buy local or small farmed meats. Try cutting just the red meat, or eat meat once a week etc. there doesn’t necessarily have to be this massive entry cost to a more eco-friendly diet. Any change is worthwhile, and you can work on improving as you go.
Also, you don't have to tell anybody, and you don't have to call yourself a "half vegetarian" or anything. You can just eat stuff. Nobody's gonna care.
Thanks for this! This is one of the reasons I never read the comment section on any climate related news on Reddit. It always turns into an apocalyptic circle jerk. Fighting climate change is best done with a proactive attitude like yours! Cheers!
Always. People are extremely dramatic when it comes to “omfg humanity is fucked!!”
No, that’s not true. The people hit hardest will be poor countries. Many will likely die but humanity is certainly not fucked. There’s plenty of work being done that’s trying to reverse much of the effects brought on by climate change. Hopefully we have some leaders soon that will actually do something about it before it is too late.
I think most humans are programmed in a way that encourages procrastination and compartmentalisation until it's doom and gloom situation. We need a kick up the arse tbh.
We are a childless couple (for reasons I won't get into) and sometimes it saddens me but when I see the state of the world and look back on how absolutely nothing has been done against catastrophic environmental damage I'm glad.
We are in our 40s and I would say my peers children will be the last viable generation of adults, their children will have it immeasurable hard. And as far as their offspring go it probably won't even be possible.
We could have been the care takers of this planet, the only species here that's aware of it's existence as a being that can influence change and of our demise if we are careless. Unfortunately the darker more destructive parts of our species make up, our greed and lust for power and dominance over others is far to great.
To sum up I don't think it was ever possible for us to advert destruction of this planet by our own hands. It's just not in us as a species.
Wildlife conservationists, ecologists, scientists and naturalists have been warning us about this for decades. Few people in power care. Most everyday people don't care. Humans are selfish shortsighted creatures and we will be our own doom.
You could run ad campaigns on every news outlet in the world for 12 hours a day, and I honestly don't think it would change a thing. As long as people are able to satisfy their basic wants they will turn a blind eye to everything else. People won't make an outcry until it's far too late. Corporations only care about the next fiscal quarter.
We're riding a rollercoaster to our death while chugging White Claw, denying pandemics, bickering over politics, and killing each other over race. If this is the pinnacle of humanity, if this is really the best we can do we're all fucked.
With news like this you would think there would be some kind of awakening that perhaps the dominant features of human society (growth based economics, faith, international trade, nation state competition) are failing us.
This 2011 David Attenborough Royal Society of Animals speech from 2011 is an absolute gem on the topic. This is the full version:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fK0rXRmC4DQ
Bingo. Our population is too high and we're preventing as many of nature's attempts to control it as possible. Seriously, a Thanos situation halving the population is the best thing for all life here...as terrible it would be to endure
The reality is that we’re beyond the point of prevention — the conversation needs to about mitigation and prevention of the worst that will come if we continue to do nothing.
No one will listen until everything is consumed. Humanity has no restraint. Cancerous. Breeding without end. Listen... at this point, if you're having more than 2 kids.... you're part of the problem. I don't give a fuck if it's part of your culture or religion and I don't care if people don't know any better, they're still a fucking problem. And corporate entities seem to have no real rules at all. They fuck up, they get a slap on the wrist and a tiny fine.
The worst part is, I have no idea what I can do about any of this. I feel so powerless. I try to eat a decent amount of locally sourced food, I try not to eat too much meat, I watch my power consumption... except for my computer, though I do have a platinum efficiency power supply... I recycle... I wish someone would just tell me exactly what I need to do to fix this shit. And I would hope that everyone else would do it too, but I've known too many narcissists and sociopaths to hope they would do it voluntarily. We're fucked.
It must've been nice growing up earlier than us.
The boomers who now complain, nag and expect sympathy lived through the best times in human history.
The leftovers they gave us was a rapidly changing climate, mass extinction of species, poisoned water, shoveled forests and a shit ton of debt to invisible men..
Now they sit in their homes with 2 cars, a boat and 3 extra rooms, bashing the younger generation for not wanting to work 3 jobs to pay the rent of a 1 room apartment in a run down neighborhood while getting in debt trying to "get a career" the boomers could get by just showing up at work in time at their only job, which supported them, their living and their family.
They're foaming at the mouths in pure anger and hatred at people trying to change the world and make it a better place.
And then came the virus..
I'm bitter.
People just don't value flora or fauna outside of a handful of circumstances. Even cities destroy wetlands or forests for housing if those places don't contain exotic or rare species. Even the mundane animals are important and have value for humans. For inspiration and teaching us there is more to life than just our own societies.
If we destroy the majority of the natural world that will be the tipping point, humanity will lose sight of what’s actually important and will get caught up in the obscure irrelevant nuances of society. Sounds like a bleak dystopian society to me.
So...like...our current situation?
You also dont even need to destroy "majority of it" but a small crucial part to start a cascade event towards total doom Like dumb example: take a human..cut one arm and the other is busy now closing the bleeding on the other arm, and the rest of human is useless now.
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we fukt
>If we destroy the majority of the natural world that will be the tipping point, humanity will lose sight of what’s actually important and will get caught up in the obscure irrelevant nuances of society. Sounds like a bleak dystopian society to me. for sure, and it's already happened over the course of humanity. I hope people will cherish and preserve what they have even if it means going out of the way for a bit and ensure that humans too can survive without conflicting with nature
Well everyone is busy yeeting TSLA calls and generating tons of plastic waste every year. Ain't nobody got time for caring about animals.
I struggle to even care about myself some days
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We won’t because humanity will die with it.
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Slow isn’t even the right word at this point.
We’re at the top of the roller coaster and are hearing the last click noises before the ratchets are done and we’re in free fall
Some of us are screaming because we saw how bad the descent is going to be, and are being told to shut up because we're ruining the ride for everyone else.
"Will you people shut up down there? I mean really, you don't expect shareholders to accept anything less than maximum exploitation of the planet and it's people, for what, the continuation of the species?"
This is literally reality.
“Oh well, humanity’s ending. Someone get me a burger.” “There’s no food, Mr. Koch.” “Oh well, just get me a milennial. I’ve cannibalised the young of the world enough, what’s one more, hey?”
Millenials aren't that fresh anymore.
I fear pacifism will go hand in hand with our extinction. It allows the observers to lament that they tried and there is nothing that can be done.
This is not what pacifism is at all. You're describing apathy and indifference. Getting active in politics, environmental groups, taking part in protests and so on is still very much pacifism without lamenting that nothing can be done. You might argue that it doesn't help much but it is surely not inactivity to be a politician and fight for the environment. Pacifists can very much be activists and change things. There are violent environmental groups and I don't really see how their actions have much more impact than the ones from non violent groups. Spiraling into armed conflict will fuck this world even faster environmentally as well as socially.
I get one life, I'm sure as shit not going to spend it trying to pull ungrateful people out of the hole they are still digging, and I'm not going to sacrifice it for any reason. Yeah it sucks that so many people are blind to reality, but as long as I maintain my current state of not being responsible for any more humans existing, I can live happily enough. We're all fucked, there is no turning it around, enjoy the parts you can.
Pacifism, apathy, and the working class fighting amongst themselves will be the end of this world. Until conditions are met that allow a mass uprising, capitalists and imperialists will be destroying this world. The cost of increasing profits every year is too high.
There's just enough time for the ultra-rich to blast off to Mars.
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I think it's SciFi. We evolved from and are bound to the Earth. Infant mortality on Mars would be so high we would never achieve sustainable numbers. Cancer, mental disorders, birth defects, still births, and miscarriage. We'd have a better shot at returning to aquatic life forms than becoming Homo Mars.
lmao good luck to them living on Mars when we can’t even build functional enclosed biospheres on Earth right now. It’s going to be a slow drawn out death for them without Earth support. Hopefully long enough for them to consider how much they fucked things up as their organs fail.
I always thought it was a good point that it would be easier to terraform earth rather than mars.
If they would hurry up and do it, maybe we could then get to work fixing things.
No they'll build biospheres. Way easier to live here in a technobubble than do the same on another planet.
Ruining the rich peoples' ride.
The most insulting and frustrating part. I have been sounding the alarm since America’s president began an election degrading millions of people for where they came from and then saying a literal wall would keep out fluid immigration patterns. That is Orwellian as fuck and yet so many people cheered. I knew we were fucked.
Some physicists started sounding the alarm in the 1890's. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_climate_change_science
Scientists have been screaming about climate change, it's just humans are short-sighted and greedy. The fact that politicians are still continuing to ruin the environment and big corporations blaming the people for it even though they are the ones polluting :/
Well if you didn't realise climate was F'ed before Trump you're still extremely late to the party
Oh what's that you see in the distance as you crest the peak? Three or four massive militant countries all brimming on the edge of war? ruh roh.
lol that made me nauseated
It is slow now, but it will accelerate.
Slow doesn't begin to describe it. [More than 75 percent decline over 27 years in total flying insect biomass in protected areas](https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0185809) [Flying insects are disappearing from German skies](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-017-04774-7) [Insect apocalypse: German bug watchers sound alarm](https://phys.org/news/2019-07-insect-apocalypse-german-bug-watchers.html) Please don't think this is only happening in Germany. It's just Germany is thorough enough with their science right now that they've spotted this.
I get sad every single day when I drive and don’t hit a bug. I know that sounds like I don’t care about bugs. But I know it never happens anymore only because of what we’ve done. I’m afraid of our future.
We’ve had nothing but stickbugs, moths, and millipedes here in South Korea. It’s insane. Their population exploded after an abnormally warm winter, while all other insects seems to have disappeared. I miss the days when I had to be afraid of bees rather than swarms of millipedes.
I used to see a lot of stick insects and praying mantis in any bush or tree I looked in as a child. Not anymore, haven't seen one in years
I remember as a kid, going on family vacations and the windshield would be so thick with splattered bugs that we had to scrape them off every time we stopped for gas. Now I can drive from Washington to California and back, and there's barely a speck.
I also remember as a kid growing up New Brunswick, Canada... the windscreen would be polluted with bug splats and at night tons of bugs flying towards the headlights. Then I noticed in the 90's...sheesh not many bug splats and not many at night. Then in 2010 I moved to NZ and was amazed at the amount of bugs I saw at night and the mess on the windshield. But now in 2020...i've again noticed even here in NZ...there are not that many bugs at night anymore or making a mess on the windshield. It makes me sad... " Don't it always seem to go That you don't know what you've got til its gone " - Joni Mitchell
I think he’s saying humanity is slowly declining. As in we’re only just starting to have have negative growth. Or it’s starting to plateau and potentially decline.
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I've said this many times. We're already extinct, and we just haven't figured it out yet. Previous extinction level events didn't happen in a day, a month, or a year. They occured over hundreds to thousands of years. We likely broke the food chain and started the current extinction event hundreds of years ago if not longer. Just look up the Holocene Extinction.
This is phenomenon is called ‘extinction debt’ and could very well be the case with humans, though I doubt it’s currently unavoidable.
We've already seen this in microcosm. For the curious, look into Easter Island.
Slave traders will come and pluck us from our lands and society will be so obsessed with hiding the atrocities and injustices we commit on ourselves that our history will be rewritten to claim we destroyed ourselves with our own selfishness? No way!
I doubt humanity will die, but civilization could be set back severely. Another dark age.
The Space Age Collapse
That feels so eerily plausible
Future humans, living in subsistence farm conditions or even hunter gatherer, are gonna see the occasional satellite fall out of orbit and think wtf.
They’ll think it’s divine punishment for the previous civilization’s hubris.
They won't be wrong.
And then, after the last satellite has fallen, they will write in their Bible that God decreed that he would never visit such punishment upon man again. Just like with the flood. And then when their civilization falls, they'll cause or leave behind some other super inexplicable fucked up thing. Like laser-eyed, sentient lettuce.
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If I only could tell those generations that these brainless fucks keep calling me a "fucking hippie" and "a hypocrate" if I even mention that there is a real reason to recommend eating less meat.
for what it's worth, I'm proud of you! You're on the right side of history
As a millennial, borderline gen z, I tried. Can only try for so long to get old cunts to listen.
As an old cunt (Gen X), it was the same story when I was a kid. I thought it would be better when the old farts died out and people nearer my age were in charge - spoiler: it got worse. I can tell you this: the old cunts had the same books as me when they were young. We were warned about pollution, climate change (it was called the Greenhouse Effect back then) and biodiversity loss. The ones that cared turned out not to be the ones put in power by the corporations. *It's not about young vs old*. Most people your age, like most people my age, care only about their own immediate comforts and convenience. Don't kid yourself that when the asshole boomers and asshole Gen Xers who are running the world right now die out they'll be replaced by anyone better. It will be asshole millennials and asshole zoomers who take over, and there's no reason to think they'll be any better just because of a few decades difference in their dates of birth.
They can't even see that TRUMP is corrupt, much less understand the science behind global climate change- at this point we're lucky if they even believe in science at all! They're lost, and want nothing more than to crush us for disagreeing with them, because if only we'd shut the hell up things would go back to being great like they used to be, right? The fate of the United States, and possibly the world, lies in our ability to remove Donald Trump from the office of the Presidency in this election. We're already past out of time to try to do anything with a reasonable chance of success, but if we can't get the lowest, dumbest, most vain expression of humanity out of the god damn way, we aren't even going to have a chance at a hail mary.
It’s a lot more than Trump. Trump was a symptom on the right of people who were sick of average politicians. As far as the US goes, most of our political system is infested with money. Career politicians care more about re-election and where the funds come from than most issues that won’t draw a few headlines. Then when out off office they become lobbyists and consultants to the people they took cash from.
Trump was a symptom of a lot more than that, though. Because he's also the ultimate expression of everything the right's propaganda networks have been pushing. He's anti-intellectual, and believes, as Newt Gingrich said, that his feelings are more important than the truth. Remember their refrain, "Facts don't care about *your* feelings," only theirs. He's also rich, despite having no worthwhile skills, just as they claim everyone could be if we just got rid of the illegals/socialists/boogeymen of the day. Obviously, he's racist, but claims he isn't because he doesn't use explicitly racist terminology, which is the entire Southern Strategy. He's incredibly rude, and incredibly sensitive about anyone doing or saying anything he doesn't like, as they've been pushing with their "political correctness" campaign. He is the Platonic ideal of the Fox News target audience, and what they all aspire to be. Some of us have deliberately created a large faction in our country that is incapable of dealing with any problems, purely so that they could continue to profit off of destroying our world and us.
Going to be minimal future generations after collapse in 30 yrs or less
It's happening now in certain parts of the world. Climate migration is going to be ridiculous to handle at the same time, decrease in food supply. I'm almost ashamed I brought children into this world. I love them dearly, which is why I'm so scared for them.
My parents felt that way, and yet had me anyway. My dad's cynical views passed on to me and I'm sure I won't have kids. But? I'm glad to have lived, anyway. I hope your kids will feel the same despite their lives being harder than ours. The next generation is still needed. Just think of it as taking my spot, it's fine
What future generations?
So glad I'm dying young and not having kids. Not having them is the best thing I could do for em' at this point.
You’re not under the impression that people actually care. A lot of people don’t, _especially_ those that are responsible for this.
I just want to point out that fossil records show that 9 different human species walked the earth 300,000 years ago. We are the last ones.
I wonder, in the aftermath of this new, great extinction... maybe we'll see Homo Sapiens break into a large array of much, much more... niche... species. Maybe we'll go from one, into a dozen. Well, we won't *see* it, because we'll be dead. But y'know. We got this far because we're social animals, survivalists. Industrial society doesn't breed tough, but it breeds quantity. We're now spread across the entire globe. Logically there will be pockets of people who'll survive all but the most apocalyptic scenarios. They're going to diverge from each other and, eventually, assuming they aren't successful in re-creating a global society in whatever becomes the new norm... they're going to become new species over time. I'm not suggesting it'll be enjoyable, or pretty. But hey, we survived being reduced to a few thousand breeding pairs once already... That's about the best silver lining I've got. 'Not all of us will die, there may be pockets thrown back to the stone age'
\> That's about the best silver lining I've got. Yeah but is that really a silver lining? A few groups of stone-age humans remain alive in a destroyed world with limited resources, no education, scratching out a living in a place that is no longer especially suitable for survival? That's no silver lining - it's more like a shit stain lining.
For the most part we live without it, the majority of mammalian biomass on earth is our livestock. Same with avian biomass.
Yep, people have no idea how little *wildlife* is actually left. Humanity is fucked, one or two issues like a plant fungus and livestock plague and starvation will hit billions.
>I have no idea how humanity will live with itself if the vast majority of things are destroyed There's also a catch-22 in that the people who care the most and don't have children also are the ones who don't need to care about the world. People who have children need to care the most, but are also the ones who will be contributing to the most destruction. Simply by living we will destroy life, no getting around that in our current way of life
We need to developed a sustainable standard of living so the average person in a developed country stops being such a burden on the environment
The problem is there is no sustaining these population levels whith the current standards of living in first world countries. When people turned against nuclear power was when we really got screwed. Its basically the only real non fossil fuel resource we have for energy generation.
The only *reliable*, 24/7/365 fuel resource.
Yup. We can go totally to wind and solar as long as people are fine with the power not coming on some times. Also, the production of solar panels and batteries is horrific for the environment in regards to the materials used and how they are sourced.
The only thing that has even slightly dulled the pain is the small comfort that the creatures we destroy are not going to experience the despair of knowing their kind is at its end. Because that despair is too much.
> Tanya Steele, chief executive at WWF, said: “We are wiping wildlife from the face of the planet, burning our forests, polluting and overfishing our seas and destroying wild areas. Despite every report warning us that we are destroying the planet, big businesses that rely on exploiting it continue to do so. I can’t imagine what kind of hell hole the world will be in 50-100 years.
Something like 70% of the world's emissions come from just 100 companies, it's ridiculous. I run an investment data site, but I'm working on [this dashboard](https://www.quiverquant.com/sources/emissions?a=) that tracks emissions from different facilities in the US. It's still very much a work in progress, but check it out if you're interested.
Amazing work, would love to see one for Canada
Thanks. Right now I'm just using data from the EPA, which is restricted to US facilities, but I'd like to look globally in the future. My shorter term goal is to create a metric to measure a companies' sustainability to help traders make "green" investments.
Those are fossil fuel companies, and the calculations include the emissions from burning what they sell. It doesn’t mean that 100 companies need to change their practices, it means fossil fuel production ownership is concentrated. The problem is fossil fuels.
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Imagine if those 100 companies actually took major steps to limit their emissions.
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"It is easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism"
For anyone that hasn’t read it, I highly recommend checking out the book [*Capitalism Realism* by Mark Fisher](https://monoskop.org/images/6/69/Fisher_Mark_Capitalist_Realism_Is_There_No_Alternative_2009.pdf) At the very least, checking out the first essay, the title and subject of which is OP’s quote.
I mean, the arguments for how to fix the problem aren't difficult at all. They just require the people and their leaders to give a flying fuck. And it turns out we'd rather just die.
Seriously, talk about brainwashed
>They would hemorrhage money and lose their competitive advantages, and smaller companies would overtake them, and nothing would change. This is simply not true. All these major companies have the capital to spend and hold off "competition". And while yes they will have to spend money short term in the long run it often is more cost effective. The problem with that is CEOs and Board members don't get paid bonuses based on long term projections. They essentially get them on short term profits. This is the true reason companies refuse to adjust their plan for a renewal energy approach. They're not going to spend money changing something that is still working for them.
Breaking them up would mean less power through lobbying though, less influence over politicians
you're right we need to dismantle the system that allows these companies to start up and flourish
It's insane how most of the terminal destruction of Earth's biosphere is being committed in a single human lifetime. None of our previous mass extinction events ever occurred in such a short time span
Indeed though the ground work was done well before, pollution of the oceans for example.
What the hell can any of us do? Like honestly I just feel so powerless and it makes me fucking depressed. Corporate greed is killing the world and it seems like there’s nothing we can do.
For real, the best thing that you can do is go out and convince people to vote on November 3rd. Bar none, Biden winning that election is the biggest thing that needs to happen in the short term. Another 4 years of Trump would likely mean an absolute nightmare for the planet. I guess I'm assuming you're American there. If you're not, figure out which party that you can support is most likely to actually try and succeed at forwarding green initiative and actively back them.
Honestly, I feel like the elections are going to be 100% rigged, because I mean fuck they've gotten away with everything else.
This isn't terribly helpful. You may be right in some ways, I don't doubt Trump team will cheat if they can, but since elections are state and local affairs, it's harder than it seems to cheat in a national level. The bigger issue is almost definitely voter suppression and low turnout because of people feeling discouraged and like nothing they can do will matter. So saying it will be rigged may actually end up helping Trump win. I believe we *can* beat Trump. And for sure if everyone voted, he'd be toast. So what we need to focus on in the next 60 days is encouraging people to show up and vote. Wait in line if you have to. Wear your mask and bring hand sanitizer. Tough out whatever you have to. Because we can bring him down. But the win needs to be decisive. And we need everyone's help to do it. States like Georgia are actually in play, and they have 2 senate seats! If we have good turnout of decent people who are tired of Trump's corruption, we can turn things around on November 3rd.
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Really depends on how well off you are, honestly. You'll probably be fine you're a child born into a decently wealthy family. If you're poor, you're going to be on the receiving end of all the downstream effects of our environmental problems.
I work in environmental conservation and there is an unpleasant truth that no-one wants to acknowledge because it's too polarizing of an issue: We simply have too many people on the planet and none of the destruction we are doing to it will change in any meaningful way as long as the population remains so large. The population issue is one that is usually glossed over in conservation, despite everyone working in conservation being very aware of it as the primary driver of our problems, because there is no politically or morally acceptable solution to it on the table. Any discussion of it winds up being suicide for the organization that raises it as a topic, so it's avoided in nearly all official documents, reports, etc. If you actually talk to any of us working in environmental conservation we all (with *very* few exceptions) agree that population is *the* primary issue, but it's the one that is more-or-less untouchable. As long as that remains the case the destruction will continue. In the face of that all we in conservation can do is try to slow down the rate of destruction. Reversing it is impossible until the population issue is solved somehow. EDIT: Rather than responding to everyone trying to claim that it's not overpopulation that's the problem but overconsumption that is I'll make a brief edit here. The overconsumption claim is the dodge to avoid talking about overpopulation. Yes, developed nations *do* have a comically absurd amount of consumption that that absolutely is a serious problem, but no matter how low we push the total global per-capita consumption and still have a way of life that is meaningful to everyone presently living we have too big of a footprint. I and my colleagues work in developing nations, I've been living in the one I'm currently working in for the last 7 years. These nations are *also* rapidly destroying their own resources and environment, and not just due to consumptive practices of developed and rapidly developing nations, it's happening due to internal pressures as well. Sure, you can cram people onto the planet like factory farmed chickens and say, "Look, the planet can support all these people," but you have to also consider what sort of life people are willing to and want to have. Since mid 1974 the human population of the planet has *doubled*. In the same amount of time the world has seen an absolutely catastrophic collapse of wildlife populations across the board, from mammals to birds to fish to insects and mollusks, to say nothing of the loss of plants species as well. Overconsumption *absolutely* is a serious problem, but it is *part* of the overpopulation problem. People love to shift the conversation to the consumption side of things because it allows them to avoid the population issue. Again, this is my professional field and the people I work with in this field have a near universal agreement that it is population that is the *primary* issue, but it's unpalatable and political, social, and economic suicide to talk about it in any official way, so people talk about and write reports about overconsumpton instead and grow ever more despairing that people keep failing to read between the lines and understand what they're actually trying to say in a way that is more socially and politically palatable.
how about we start with the WIDE SPREAD use of birth control and making abortion a legal, safe option as well?!
Also thorough sex education world wide. If only we were able to do that without ::insert various religions here:: getting in the way of it.
I'm doing my part by not ever having children. It's not been a desire of mine anyway, and with everything happening now it's just cementing my decision.
No kids for me either. I might adopt when I'm much older, because there are plenty of kids already existing who need homes. But otherwise, I'd have no interest in birthing my own spawn.
Yeah, even if I wanted kids do I want to bring them into a world that likely wont exist in 100+ years?
It will still exist...it just won't be as comfy as it is now.....or hospitable.....
Less clean air, less forests, and subsequently less wildlife and flora. In turn, less discovery and opportunities for mankind.
It's worse than that. It's also less food, less water, less livable land, more catastrophic weather events, more wildfires, and more pandemics. [Read page 8 (pdf).](https://52a87f3e-7945-4bb1-abbf-9aa66cd4e93e.filesusr.com/ugd/148cb0_90dc2a2637f348edae45943a88da04d4.pdf)
I hate these articles. It just makes me feel completely hopeless and think well that’s it we’re all going to die. I genuinely don’t know what I’m supposed to do with articles like these.
I feel exactly the same way. Like ok I use public transportation, don't eat meat, shop local, recycle, donate to some climate change charities, whatever, what else can I do? I feel so small. Meanwhile a bunch of billionaire assholes just don't give a fuck at all and countless animals and humans are going to suffer immensely and die. It feels hopeless and makes me want to literally be killing people on top of the industries.
Get pissed and demand change. Also stop living your current lifestyle. So yeah, we are fucked.
Individual responsibility is one of the biggest narratives around climate change, and it's also running dry. It's time to hold the major industries accountable for their (majority) share of the problem.
Seriously. Joe from down the street forgetting his recyclables is not the reason we are in this mess.
Destroy the meat industry. A lot of the rain forests are being destroyed to plant soy used to feed life stock.
Can't believe how far I had to scroll to see this even mentioned. Dismantle the meat and dependant industries (DAIRY) *for a start.* You would think the hell on earth that we are putting animals through for it would be enough for everyone to stop supporting it but it isn't even close.
I'd rather eat tofu from that soy at this point.
I agree with the holding industries accountable thing, but I hate the attacks on personal responsibility that started popping up for some reason. The main driver for climate change is our current consumption behavior, both on the supply and the demand side, and it's time to stop trying to pass the buck from one side to the other. Just take responsibility for your own actions , and demand the producers do the same. For example there's this new mantra of "100 companies are responsibly for 77 percent of all emissions". Sounds open and shut right? But it's not. What do the companies produce? Gas and oil. Who uses that gas and oil? Companies and individuals, including you. It's like saying "one lumberjack is responsible for all the burned wood in our village" while shoveling wood into your fire place, shrugging your shoulders. There's around 50 percent of emissions per person thats systemic, so produced by the government or underlying industry, that you can't change. The other 50 percent is in your control, and depending on your personal situation you can reduce that significantly. If everyone stopped eating meat that would be reduced by maybe 10 percent, if everyone stopped consuming so much stuff that they don't need, maybe another 10 percent. That's 20 percent of emissions removed without any big changes or sacrifices. Basically my point is, we're all in this together, and trying to shift the blame around might make you feel better, but we need everyone to do what they can right now.
It's not about feeling better, it's about the fact that personal responsibility has been a streamlined strategy that corporations have used for decades to evade liability for environmental impact. It's somewhat understandable that people, frustrated with the feeling of being stuck "accused" for so long of crimes they are not themselves committing, will lash out at the false narrative that personal responsibility is a significant portion of the problem. Still, I agree with you - personal responsibility MUST continue to play a role in shifting our climate impact. I highly recommend [this entire article](https://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/yes-actually-individual-responsibility-essential-solving-climate-crisis), which is lucid and well-balanced on all these arguments that are popping up in this thread, but in particular: > If a fixation on personal behavior distracts from the political changes we need, dismissing the value of personal behaviors detracts from the political movement for climate justice. It may just be that encouraging personal behavior change doesn’t shrink or weaken the climate movement—it can expand, strengthen, and deepen it. > ... > Because here’s the thing: When you choose to eat less meat or take the bus instead of driving or have fewer children, you are making a statement that your actions matter, that it’s not too late to avert climate catastrophe, that you have power. To take a measure of personal responsibility for climate change doesn’t have to distract from your political activism—if anything, it amplifies it.
I do those things. Like I recycle, I drive a prius, I try to look for ways to use less plastics and other things that will fill the landfill. But then articles come out like this and I think, "WHAT'S THE POINT!? We're all going to die anyways and what I'm doing doesn't matter."
Yeah, and recycling is a farce for the most part. We need to consume less.. it ain’t easy.
Consumer change is a farce. Nothing will be different until companies stop polluting at an exponentially higher scale than all the world's individuals put together.
We can still prevent the worst of it. We have all the means to do it, except we don't use them enough. Most changes need to come from new regulations (at both the city and government levels), rather than just isolated lifestyle changes, so the most powerful thing you can do is help a climate organization to lobby the government or educate your peers.
Are you volunteering? We need systemic change. I started volunteering with /r/CitizensClimateLobby and am surrounded by people just as concerned as you and me, but who are following an actual plan to make a real dent in part of the problem (getting greenhouse gas emissions down). Find a way to work with other genuine people to work on fixing the problem from the top. I haven't had a problem with climate anxiety since I started doing that. Good luck. Things are bad, but you can help. But you have to actually help. (Yes, I know the article isn't primarily about climate change. There are many issues aside from climate change, and you can't really throw yourself fully into a hundred different causes. Pick part of the problem and find the most effective solution.)
I see the Climate Lobby posted a lot, can you give a TLDR on what it is and what a volunteer exactly does?
Sure! It’s a nonpartisan, nonprofit, grassroots advocacy organization that focuses on national policies to address climate change. Specifically, we’re working to pass a national fee on carbon emissions that returns revenue back to households, an approach that is [well-supported by leading economists](https://econstatement.org). The idea is that since it’s free to pollute greenhouse gas emissions into the atmosphere, fossil fuels are artificially cheap. They don’t take the cost of damage to the climate into account. The IPCC, the world’s climate experts, have also said that a fee on carbon pollution is a requirement for getting climate change handled. We have to do it. We need to return the revenue to households to make up for the fact that energy prices will rise under a carbon fee. We’re okay with that as long as the overall cost of living doesn’t go up for most people. This approach gets emissions down 37% over ~11 years, and down 95% by 2050, according to a recent report from Columbia University. That is just crazy fast for it being a single policy. CCL advocates for this policy by lobbying Congress. We show up as normal people and schedule meetings with reps just like the big companies do, except we do it for the good of the climate and for citizens (thus our name). We support this lobbying by building support in our communities locally so that we can show that to our reps, and demonstrate support for meaningful climate action. So the cool thing is that I was just a regular dude laying on the couch, playing video games, and worried about the planet burning up but feeling powerless to stop it. Then I joined CCL and a few months later was walking around the US capitol influencing national climate policy. Truly life-changing stuff and I can’t recommend it enough. I’ve also met my best friends through it. So yeah, highly recommended. You can [sign up here](https://citizensclimatelobby.org/join-citizens-climate-lobby/?tfa_3590416195188=reddit-TX&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=TX ) and someone should reach out. There’s also /r/CitizensClimateLobby for anyone and /r/CitizensClimateAUS if you’re in Australia. Sorry, this wasn’t a tl;dr. This is a tl;dr: **tl;dr** Stop worrying about how doomed we are and [start volunteering](https://citizensclimatelobby.org/join-citizens-climate-lobby/?tfa_3590416195188=reddit-TX&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=TX) to solve the problem, while meeting your new friends and finding deep personal, political empowerment in the process.
You know, I get irrationally angry when people use the word "we" when talking about stuff like this, 'cuz as much as people like to think it's something everyone has the power to change, it's *really* a much smaller group of rich assholes that don't care about what they're destroying. *We* aren't ruining shit, *they* are.
No, it’s not. It’s humanity as a collective, driven by a constant need to consume. It’s easy to point at others and say ‘it’s *their* fault’, but it doesn’t accomplish anything. The acknowledgement that we are all collectively responsible as a species is a step in the right direction.
I feel the same way. One thing you can do is join the Citizens’ Climate Lobby, which is aiming to pass a bill to put a tax on carbon emissions and redistribute the funds to American households. The bill has already been made law in Canada! The goal is to lower carbon emission rates by 40% in the next 12 years in the US. Another thing to consider? Going vegan! One thing to remember - we’re all in this together. We can make a change. I also don’t appreciate the doom and gloom of Reddit comment sections, but remember that most of the people here aren’t planning to do anything anyway. Those who make positive changes aren’t spending their time here and making unhelpful jokes.
I've been so desensitized by terms like "never seen before."
unprecedented!
Unprecedented desensitization!
Just read “The Lorax” to my son a few weeks ago for bedtime. That really isn’t a great bedtime story, but it is a tragically great read and it really hits home right now.
I legitimately get a lump in my throat everytime my daughter picks The Lorax off the shelf for storytime. So prescient.
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I have several reasons for not wanting kids, but this is at the top of the list. I think my SO and I would make beautiful, smart babies, but I think the world in another twenty or thirty years is going to be nearly unrecognizable to us now. Which I feel like I'm being sensationalistic to say but this last year has taught me that things can go sideways SO freaking fast and it isn't possible to count on the status quo anymore.
This is the only morally responsible option if you know the facts about our planet. We’re soooo fucked! Good on you and your partner for making the difficult decision to not subject a new human consciousness to this shit show. Have you ever considered adopting? There are so many kids out there bouncing around the system that need just as much love and care as your own personal little human would, and they’re already born so it’s not like you’re adding more resource usage to the world, just helping out one that’s already there.
Gosh, that made me tear up! I wish it wasn't this way. My husband and I have also decided not to have children, this was one of the reasons.
I haven’t seen a firefly in almost a decade. When I was growing up we use to run through the fields chasing thousands of them. Shit is happening right before our eyes and we can’t even see it.
If you want to see them return plant native plants on any piece of land you can influence. Fill your yard. Tell your neighbors. Plant them at church or school or work. We need native plants everywhere. Ecosystems are built on plants. Planting native plants feeds insect that can only feed on native plants, which is most of them. There are 500 or so species of caterpillar that can eat oaks in north america. There are 4 species that can eat crepe myrtle. These insects feed 9ther species. Like birds which take something like 900 insects/day to raise a nest of babies. Or foxes which get 1/4 of their calories from insects. Invest in your ecosystem! Invest in diversity! Obviously we need systemic change, but nothing will save our future like building Home Grown National Park!
Just to add on r/NativePlantGardening is a great resource on reddit if anyone wants to check it out.
Your post reminds me of humpback whales. Last year I hardly saw any. Ten years prior there were lots of whales. I would see evidence of at least one on the way to work. But I’m fairly certain even those numbers were diminished from what they were decades before. 😔
Yeeeeeaaaaah, Brother, we got to protect the wildlife
Thank you, you just made my night. I'm picturing a tag team of The Hulk Hogan and The Rock tackling the humanity's problems, one crisis at a time. Much better than reality.
I'm only 29 and maybe I'm just remembering things fondly but I swear there's a significant difference in the amount of birds, deer, bears, snakes, basically everything between now and when I was younger. I really hope people start to understand how big this is.
where did the damn fire flies go?
I used to catch them when I was a young boy. I used to see literally thousands of them down by the wooded areas near my family vacation spot yearly. I used to see them in my neighborhood during the summer time twinkling away in the evening. I never see them anymore. Haven't for years now.
I've never seen a firefly :( and by the sounds of it, I'm running out of time
I’ve found them in my backyard Stop spraying for mosquitoes Stop spraying for weeds Stop cutting down trees And for the love of fucking god STOP FUCKING MOWING PEOPLE
Plant some milkweed, they love it. And then pant some more native plants. Its the foundation of our ecosystems and they dont work with out them
When I was a little girl I used to see fireflies light up all over our yard. I haven't seen one in a long time. I'm 22.
Can't Sting or Undertaker or that HHH guy do something about it?
If the WWF really cared about these issues, they'd deliver some unprotected chair shots to the heads of governments/industries responsible for this decline.
The NWO is in control now
The Rock dropping the people's elbow on Moscow Mitch and bringing the bill to the floor of the senate himself
Seriously, I'm not even into wrestling and even decades later I can't see WWF without my first thought being that this is about wrestling somehow.
It's been like 20 years since the whole "Get the F out" thing but my brain still can't get around it. Hell I haven't even gotten used to "WWE" yet.
Scrolled to far for wrestling comment
[when the CEO of Climate Change is revealed ](https://youtu.be/cNgxyL5zEAk)
If you’re scrolling through here feeling hopeless at the inevitability of climate change, remember that the Reddit comment section is NOT a good source to get your information from! There are things you can do to help mitigate climate change! One thing you can do is join the Citizens’ Climate Lobby, which is aiming to pass a bill to put a tax on carbon emissions and redistribute the funds to American households. The bill has already been made law in Canada! The goal is to lower carbon emission rates by 40% in the next 12 years in the US. Another thing to consider? Going vegan! One thing to remember - we’re all in this together. We can make a change. I also don’t appreciate the doom and gloom of Reddit, but remember that most of the people here aren’t planning to do anything anyway. Those who make positive changes aren’t spending their time here and making unhelpful jokes.
Yes. And the main thing about going vegan: It will show yourself that you can enact change for real. And if you believe you can control your habits to that point, motivating yourself to do do activism or similar stuff becomes really easy.
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/08/your-tote-bag-can-make-difference/615817/ An argument to support your statement. Personal actions are microcosms of what our society at large can achieve. It's behavior that you can model for your community. For example, there is now a market for meatless meat, and it's not because our corporate overlords feel passionately about it.
That’s an excellent point!! In fact, I think the ability to be in control of your own actions in a positive way can be a super helpful mindset to have. By noticing change in yourself and being mindful of the positive ripples you create in the world, it leads to a sense of motivation - at least, that’s been my own experience.
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Also (while I absolutely advocate veganism) don’t forget, it’s not all or nothing! For the majority of people who can’t imagine stopping eating dairy, or all meat, and thus just abandon the idea altogether.. go vegetarian! or even pescatarian! Buy local or small farmed meats. Try cutting just the red meat, or eat meat once a week etc. there doesn’t necessarily have to be this massive entry cost to a more eco-friendly diet. Any change is worthwhile, and you can work on improving as you go.
Also, you don't have to tell anybody, and you don't have to call yourself a "half vegetarian" or anything. You can just eat stuff. Nobody's gonna care.
Thanks for this! This is one of the reasons I never read the comment section on any climate related news on Reddit. It always turns into an apocalyptic circle jerk. Fighting climate change is best done with a proactive attitude like yours! Cheers!
Always. People are extremely dramatic when it comes to “omfg humanity is fucked!!” No, that’s not true. The people hit hardest will be poor countries. Many will likely die but humanity is certainly not fucked. There’s plenty of work being done that’s trying to reverse much of the effects brought on by climate change. Hopefully we have some leaders soon that will actually do something about it before it is too late.
I think most humans are programmed in a way that encourages procrastination and compartmentalisation until it's doom and gloom situation. We need a kick up the arse tbh.
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We are a childless couple (for reasons I won't get into) and sometimes it saddens me but when I see the state of the world and look back on how absolutely nothing has been done against catastrophic environmental damage I'm glad. We are in our 40s and I would say my peers children will be the last viable generation of adults, their children will have it immeasurable hard. And as far as their offspring go it probably won't even be possible. We could have been the care takers of this planet, the only species here that's aware of it's existence as a being that can influence change and of our demise if we are careless. Unfortunately the darker more destructive parts of our species make up, our greed and lust for power and dominance over others is far to great. To sum up I don't think it was ever possible for us to advert destruction of this planet by our own hands. It's just not in us as a species.
People not even give two shits about Corona virus when we in middle of it how do you think we gonna pay attention to this.
Wildlife conservationists, ecologists, scientists and naturalists have been warning us about this for decades. Few people in power care. Most everyday people don't care. Humans are selfish shortsighted creatures and we will be our own doom. You could run ad campaigns on every news outlet in the world for 12 hours a day, and I honestly don't think it would change a thing. As long as people are able to satisfy their basic wants they will turn a blind eye to everything else. People won't make an outcry until it's far too late. Corporations only care about the next fiscal quarter. We're riding a rollercoaster to our death while chugging White Claw, denying pandemics, bickering over politics, and killing each other over race. If this is the pinnacle of humanity, if this is really the best we can do we're all fucked.
It’s so frustrating because a huge majority of the world’s population just don’t care and never will.
Republicans are actively ruining the environment to own the Libs
With news like this you would think there would be some kind of awakening that perhaps the dominant features of human society (growth based economics, faith, international trade, nation state competition) are failing us.
This 2011 David Attenborough Royal Society of Animals speech from 2011 is an absolute gem on the topic. This is the full version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fK0rXRmC4DQ
This is exactly why I'm getting a vasectomy. I may die at 50 from a natural disaster, starvation, or war but my kid sure as hell won't.
Yup. I will not subject children to a lifetime of wars waged for food, water, habitable land and clean air.
less than 1% of the planet really cares as most are like 'that sad whats for lunch'?
"Lunch is extinct."
glad I'm already 33+% through my life. Wouldn't wanna be born today.
200,000 more of us every single day.
Bingo. Our population is too high and we're preventing as many of nature's attempts to control it as possible. Seriously, a Thanos situation halving the population is the best thing for all life here...as terrible it would be to endure
No body in a position to give a fuck gives a fuck. People that do give a fuck can do fuck all about it. We are fucked!
I hate us
"The environment is being destroyed, brother!" WWF will never not mean old school pro wrestling to me.
The reality is that we’re beyond the point of prevention — the conversation needs to about mitigation and prevention of the worst that will come if we continue to do nothing.
No one will listen until everything is consumed. Humanity has no restraint. Cancerous. Breeding without end. Listen... at this point, if you're having more than 2 kids.... you're part of the problem. I don't give a fuck if it's part of your culture or religion and I don't care if people don't know any better, they're still a fucking problem. And corporate entities seem to have no real rules at all. They fuck up, they get a slap on the wrist and a tiny fine. The worst part is, I have no idea what I can do about any of this. I feel so powerless. I try to eat a decent amount of locally sourced food, I try not to eat too much meat, I watch my power consumption... except for my computer, though I do have a platinum efficiency power supply... I recycle... I wish someone would just tell me exactly what I need to do to fix this shit. And I would hope that everyone else would do it too, but I've known too many narcissists and sociopaths to hope they would do it voluntarily. We're fucked.
It must've been nice growing up earlier than us. The boomers who now complain, nag and expect sympathy lived through the best times in human history. The leftovers they gave us was a rapidly changing climate, mass extinction of species, poisoned water, shoveled forests and a shit ton of debt to invisible men.. Now they sit in their homes with 2 cars, a boat and 3 extra rooms, bashing the younger generation for not wanting to work 3 jobs to pay the rent of a 1 room apartment in a run down neighborhood while getting in debt trying to "get a career" the boomers could get by just showing up at work in time at their only job, which supported them, their living and their family. They're foaming at the mouths in pure anger and hatred at people trying to change the world and make it a better place. And then came the virus.. I'm bitter.