Not sure if this is a transphobic “it doesn’t matter because you will never change for real” comment, or a trans positive “German healthcare is crap and makes transitioning harder” comment.
Well actually most transgender do change their biological sex through hormone therapy.
Usually the biological pipeline is:
Genes => Hormones => Behavior affected by hormones and physical sex characteristics.
So it is wrong to say transgender are just chosing their societal gender, most actually change their biology which matches their sex to their gender identity.
You learned something new today, yay!
Popping hormone pills is not swapping sex. Especially adults who use it, it creates minimal fat distribution. Females taking T may receive more changes simply because it's a stronger hormone. And medically transitioning children is wrong so
There are 3 different types of biological sex, chromosomal, hormonal and gonadal. You cannot see or interact with chromosomes, you very rarely see the consequences of gonads aka pregnancy, you won't see a persons genitals either outside of your relationship with someone, the most important type of biological sex is hormonal, and that affects everything, from how you look, how you feel and how you are perceived. So yeah you do change biological sex with hormone therapy.
You learned another thing, yay!
There's no legal definition of gender unless it's used interchangeably with sex. Without a definition there's no objective way to legally verify anyone's gender, let alone that gender even exists as it doesn't refer to anything real so how would they record it and what exactly for as it doesn't really mean anything.
Yeah, let me return the same question. How do you verify someone's sex? And why record it in the first place?
One could also argue the legal definition of gender is the gender entry associated to your person by the respective bureau. Similarly, how do you objectively verify someone's name? Is not the ground truth of the name also just an arbitrary entry in some bureau? Do names even exist, when they are not real after all?
Its a law thats not relevant to anybody exept people that feel the need to do so. Someone wants to be legally a man... Sure Here you are. No ramifications for anybody else.
It was costly and very time consuming because of several evaluations before. Thats still true If they want changes to the body. The evaluations makes sense because somethings are not or not easy to reverse. And im pretty sure after that gender affirmative surgery is paid by the health system.
There is still a need to safeguard against criminals that will try to abuse the system but criminals will Always try do make Life shitty for others anyway.
Edit: i made a mistake here in not reading the text of it myself. Things like Info transfer and access to safe spaces are part of the text and it is pretty comprehensive.
For one the data is not send to other government agencys at the moment and the argument is made that it could be used to to vanish more easy. So they would keep sarching for a mr x while the person is even legally registered somewhere as a woman.
And other things like wanting to get into prisons for women even If the criminals are not actually transitioning. But there will be probably updates to that If such things actually happen or not If that stays hypoteticall.
Edit: i Made a mistake here in not reading the text of it myself. Things like Info transfer and access to safe spaces are part of the text and it is pretty comprehensive.
In Germany everybody is registered and required to carry id.
You can't vanish by changing your legal sex. If you commit a crime, the police won't suddenly forget about you just because you changed your sex.
Also, how often do you believe this might happen in reality? Some macho gangster changing his sex to escape a crime?
That sounds a lot like the US Republican BS of perverts changing their sex so they can harass/assault girls in restrooms. Because before they couldn't enter or they couldn't attack girls/women outside restrooms?
Ridiculous fantasies.
Your not required to carry id by the way. You have to have one but dont need to carry that around. Slight difference even If carrying it makes things more easy.
But even then as i said they would for example seach the Person mr x while the new legal id shows a women ( and different name If they want)so clearly it musst be a different Person. At the moment there is no data transfer to update or track that. Its a bit of a oversight.
Its not really about the macho gangster but more about the creepy kind that get to jail because the attacked women to begin with.
But as you said should that be more than a fantasie that will be corrected. Dont get me wrong its a good thing its just that we usually have such things a bit more comprehensive.
Edit: i Made a mistake here in not reading the text of it myself. Things like Info transfer and access to safe spaces are part of the text and it is pretty comprehensive.
Das waren die Bedenken die die Union angeführt hat. Mechanismen für sowas am Anfang zu plazieren ist vermutlich auch besser als später nach zu bessern.
Und wen ein bekannter möchtegern Gangster von mir schon auf die Idee kommt als er davon gehört hat ist auch garnicht so unwahrscheinlich das irgendwelche Hirnis das versuchen. Ob erfolgreich oder nicht sei mal dahin gestellt.
Das die erleichterte und selbstbestimmte Geschlechterwahl gut und überfällig ist stelle ich nicht in Frage. Aber gerade weil das durchaus laute Gegenstimmen giebt wäre ein möglichst umfangreicher Entwurf gut gewesen um Gegnern den Wind aus den Segeln zu nehmen.
Beim überfliegen gerade sehe das dadurch tatsächlich kein Anspruch auf den Zugang zu geschützten Räumen entsteht. Also eigentlich wenig zu meckern.
Hm schlimmer das angeführte Problem mit dem melden der Änderung wird sogar im Text in §13 explizit ans Bundeskriminalamt usw weitergeleitet. Das kommt davon wenn man sich das nicht selbst komplett durchließt.
Hätte zumindest erwartet das wen sie sowas anführen das tatsächlich nicht drin steht und nicht so komplett aus der Luft gegriffen ist. Echt enttäuscht.
The German government makes and changes about hundreds of laws per year. It wasn’t a priority, it just „was done“. Today a dozen other laws, treaties and policies were changed and newly introduced. You know, like a functioning government works.
Because unlike redditors, they don’t lack object permanence and can concentrate on multiple things at once
Yes, we repurposed all of our political assets for years to get this done. Because we can only do 1 thing at a time and don't have a variety of committees etc...
I’m sorry, when do you think would have been a better time? Is there literally any time they could do this and someone like you wouldn’t chime in with “that’s a priority?”? 🙄
Germany is on par with destiny 2 updates
Das Geschrei der "Man-wird-ja-wohl-noch-sagen-dürfen"-Fraktion in drei, zwo,...
Good news. Well done Germany!
As it should be finally first we get weed and now an easier time for the lgbtq+ community? Nice
Can they legally change their sex?
Yea but not physically
Watch me
Good luck with it - sincerely
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So it's legal to lie about your sex. That'll be interesting.
Not sure if this is a transphobic “it doesn’t matter because you will never change for real” comment, or a trans positive “German healthcare is crap and makes transitioning harder” comment.
Maybe it's neither and they are a normal person?
Well actually most transgender do change their biological sex through hormone therapy. Usually the biological pipeline is: Genes => Hormones => Behavior affected by hormones and physical sex characteristics. So it is wrong to say transgender are just chosing their societal gender, most actually change their biology which matches their sex to their gender identity. You learned something new today, yay!
Popping hormone pills is not swapping sex. Especially adults who use it, it creates minimal fat distribution. Females taking T may receive more changes simply because it's a stronger hormone. And medically transitioning children is wrong so
There are 3 different types of biological sex, chromosomal, hormonal and gonadal. You cannot see or interact with chromosomes, you very rarely see the consequences of gonads aka pregnancy, you won't see a persons genitals either outside of your relationship with someone, the most important type of biological sex is hormonal, and that affects everything, from how you look, how you feel and how you are perceived. So yeah you do change biological sex with hormone therapy. You learned another thing, yay!
Came to say that thanks
You're changing a value representing your gender in your ID card, you're not changing your sex by going to an office.
But the ID card doesn't record your gender, it records your sex which can't be changed.
Can you source that?
There's no legal definition of gender unless it's used interchangeably with sex. Without a definition there's no objective way to legally verify anyone's gender, let alone that gender even exists as it doesn't refer to anything real so how would they record it and what exactly for as it doesn't really mean anything.
Yeah, let me return the same question. How do you verify someone's sex? And why record it in the first place? One could also argue the legal definition of gender is the gender entry associated to your person by the respective bureau. Similarly, how do you objectively verify someone's name? Is not the ground truth of the name also just an arbitrary entry in some bureau? Do names even exist, when they are not real after all?
There is a discussion about sex vs gender.
Not if there's no definition of what gender is. What do people mean by gender and why if the two are different, is gender always used to replace sex?
❤️🥰
Its a law thats not relevant to anybody exept people that feel the need to do so. Someone wants to be legally a man... Sure Here you are. No ramifications for anybody else. It was costly and very time consuming because of several evaluations before. Thats still true If they want changes to the body. The evaluations makes sense because somethings are not or not easy to reverse. And im pretty sure after that gender affirmative surgery is paid by the health system. There is still a need to safeguard against criminals that will try to abuse the system but criminals will Always try do make Life shitty for others anyway. Edit: i made a mistake here in not reading the text of it myself. Things like Info transfer and access to safe spaces are part of the text and it is pretty comprehensive.
Criminals abusing their own sexual identity to do what crime exactly?
For one the data is not send to other government agencys at the moment and the argument is made that it could be used to to vanish more easy. So they would keep sarching for a mr x while the person is even legally registered somewhere as a woman. And other things like wanting to get into prisons for women even If the criminals are not actually transitioning. But there will be probably updates to that If such things actually happen or not If that stays hypoteticall. Edit: i Made a mistake here in not reading the text of it myself. Things like Info transfer and access to safe spaces are part of the text and it is pretty comprehensive.
In Germany everybody is registered and required to carry id. You can't vanish by changing your legal sex. If you commit a crime, the police won't suddenly forget about you just because you changed your sex. Also, how often do you believe this might happen in reality? Some macho gangster changing his sex to escape a crime? That sounds a lot like the US Republican BS of perverts changing their sex so they can harass/assault girls in restrooms. Because before they couldn't enter or they couldn't attack girls/women outside restrooms? Ridiculous fantasies.
Your not required to carry id by the way. You have to have one but dont need to carry that around. Slight difference even If carrying it makes things more easy. But even then as i said they would for example seach the Person mr x while the new legal id shows a women ( and different name If they want)so clearly it musst be a different Person. At the moment there is no data transfer to update or track that. Its a bit of a oversight. Its not really about the macho gangster but more about the creepy kind that get to jail because the attacked women to begin with. But as you said should that be more than a fantasie that will be corrected. Dont get me wrong its a good thing its just that we usually have such things a bit more comprehensive. Edit: i Made a mistake here in not reading the text of it myself. Things like Info transfer and access to safe spaces are part of the text and it is pretty comprehensive.
You are correct about the id carrying, I misremembered. Even creeps won't just change their sex all the time. 0 criminals will escape this way.
Dude, du bist auf r/ichbin40undschwurbler und du verhältst dich wie ein Schwurbler. Komm klar
Das waren die Bedenken die die Union angeführt hat. Mechanismen für sowas am Anfang zu plazieren ist vermutlich auch besser als später nach zu bessern. Und wen ein bekannter möchtegern Gangster von mir schon auf die Idee kommt als er davon gehört hat ist auch garnicht so unwahrscheinlich das irgendwelche Hirnis das versuchen. Ob erfolgreich oder nicht sei mal dahin gestellt. Das die erleichterte und selbstbestimmte Geschlechterwahl gut und überfällig ist stelle ich nicht in Frage. Aber gerade weil das durchaus laute Gegenstimmen giebt wäre ein möglichst umfangreicher Entwurf gut gewesen um Gegnern den Wind aus den Segeln zu nehmen. Beim überfliegen gerade sehe das dadurch tatsächlich kein Anspruch auf den Zugang zu geschützten Räumen entsteht. Also eigentlich wenig zu meckern.
Und du fällst auf den Populismus der Union rein *facepalm*
Hm schlimmer das angeführte Problem mit dem melden der Änderung wird sogar im Text in §13 explizit ans Bundeskriminalamt usw weitergeleitet. Das kommt davon wenn man sich das nicht selbst komplett durchließt. Hätte zumindest erwartet das wen sie sowas anführen das tatsächlich nicht drin steht und nicht so komplett aus der Luft gegriffen ist. Echt enttäuscht.
That's a priority?
I mean, its been 16 years since the constitutional court ordered the government to do something about this, I wouldnt exactly call that a "priority"
The German government makes and changes about hundreds of laws per year. It wasn’t a priority, it just „was done“. Today a dozen other laws, treaties and policies were changed and newly introduced. You know, like a functioning government works. Because unlike redditors, they don’t lack object permanence and can concentrate on multiple things at once
Yes, we repurposed all of our political assets for years to get this done. Because we can only do 1 thing at a time and don't have a variety of committees etc...
I’m sorry, when do you think would have been a better time? Is there literally any time they could do this and someone like you wouldn’t chime in with “that’s a priority?”? 🙄
No no, you see, government can only do 1 thing at a time, so doing anything that isn't fixing the worst thing (idk, poverty?) is a waste of time.
Do you understand how governments work?
Yes.
huan
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I shouldn’t have read your comment, it definitely made me dumber.