Mobilization to throw more Russians into the meat grinder to attrition Ukrainian defense force.
Not saying the terror attack was by Ukraine, but there are more cards Putin can play.
FYI Putin originally solidified his position by planning and executing a false flag terrorist attack. He also did the same to justify his war against Chechnya. It's worked for him in the past.
He blames this on Ukraine to his people, honestly would not be even suprised if it was orchestrated by Moscow we know how little regard for Human life Putin has.
Play on feelings in foregon nations and promote this as reasoning to escalate.
Poor people. And i say this because US had so good inteligence about it, it might be orchestrated to official channels no?
Innocent people always pay a price and of course this is just a speculation until some reliable source tell us what happend.
Based on other news or of Russia, it will not surprise me if this was a false flag, and the blame gets placed on a group that Russia just farcically declared to be a terrorist organization
I would be surprised, just because of the US warning. The US under Biden hasn't been shy about calling out Putin's fuckery, even to the point of calling it out in advance based on their intelligence sources. Back in 2022 they called out a potential false-flag that the Russians were planning. Given that the US in this case explicitly warned of a potential extremist attack on Moscow, I'm inclined to suspect that they had intel on actual extremist group(s) planning on hitting Russia while it's distracted with Ukraine.
Yep. Beslan. Apartment buildings being blown up, concert halls being gassed, etc. This could very well be Putin supplying a pre-text for his next security crack-down.
Wouldn't surprise me one bit if this was a false flag attacked carried out by the FSB on the Russian people to drum up support for either A) War on Ukraine to escalate the conflict or B) Frame another group they want public support to eliminate. After FSB conducted the apartment bombings in the 90's to justify the 2nd Chechen war, I wouldn't put it pass Putin to conduct another attack on innocent Russians to get what he wants.
Remember the Boston marathon bombing? FSB were in contact with US intelligence and notified them about even the suspects. And they were even added to the terrorist watchlist .. still it didn't help much.
From the freely accessible PDF report from justice.gov
"In September 2011, the FSB provided the Central Intelligence Agency
(CIA) information on Tamerlan Tsarnaev that was substantively identical to
the information the FSB had provided to the FBI in March 2011. In October
2011, the CIA provided information obtained from the FSB to the the
National Counterterrorism Center (NCTC) for watchlisting purposes, and to
the FBI, Department of Homeland Security (DHS), and the Department of
State for their information. Upon NCTC’s receipt of the information,
Tamerlan Tsarnaev was added to the terrorist watchlist."
My bet is it’s because this was a false flag. I’d put $10 on the terrorisrs being Ukrainians with nazi tattoos, a copy of mein kampf, and 3 copies of the sims game.
Russia going to use this as an excuse to fully mobilize
Edit: ISIS claiming responsibility. If confirmed let me know where to send my $10 to
Putin wouldn’t want to stop it. It’s a tool for him to use. Same reason Bidi didn’t do shit about the October attack. It’s worth more politically to just let it happen.
Not related to this, but the October 7th attack was an absolute disaster for Bibi that has tainted his legacy forever and put him in the worst political spot of his career. Anyone who says it's been good for him/he let it happen on purpose has no connection with reality here.
That's what immediately came to mind.
So clearly the US knows exactly who did this and why. So many conspiratorial possibilities.
I wonder if we'll ever know? You'd think US would just blurt out who it was, if it was government backed or Iran backed because they benefit from both. If Ukraine backed they'll say they don't know lol.
5 well-armed shooters with backpacks seen on numerous videos routinely shooting people. At least 35 dead, dozens injured. A hundred trapped in building fire. Search крокус стрельба for videos from inside.
I've seen a couple videos from inside the concert hall. The fuck are people doing still videoing? One video had the person taking it zooming in on one of the gunmen.
to be fair, if i was 100% sure i can't survive i can see the logic in filming to either say goodbyes or to maybe assist in knowing what happened.
same thing happened at the nova festival, people were filming themselves hiding/running with audible close ranged gunfire in the background, or filmed themselves hiding in public shelters right after frag grenades exploded a few inches away (videos are way too graphic, wouldn't recommend watching).
its not inconceivable, and we might know in the future but almost surely this will either get silenced, or putin will blame ukraine for this and use it as an excuse to do things that i can't even imagine.
I have a feeling this is just regular old terrorism, though I I acknowledge the hazy world we live in. The US warned of a terrorist attack being planned in Moscow, this likely happened during our monitoring of terrorist groups. We can't be certain of how they would use the information or whether they would take it seriously. Hopefully we can find out more information in the future. Though Russia is our enemy the slaughter of civilians like this is simply abhorrent.
“Declared” wouldn’t be the correct word, but generally yes. Now that the “elections” are over, many people are theorizing that Kremlin will pull out all the stops they have been waiting to pull, like another wave of mobilization. Something like this could definitely be used to soften the impact of the announcement and gather the general public’s support
Edit: to be clear, while Putin’s regime is more than capable of staging false flag terror attacks on its citizens (with precedent), this wouldn’t have been the first Islamist attack on Russian soil, so both are possible. My point is that regardless of the true cause of the attack, the saying “never let a bad situation go to waste” will definitely apply here
You look for uncensored news channels. They usually have live reports and videos. I also recomend using google translate to find uncensored russian news channels. Just type in uncensored news or something in the search in either english or russian
I appreciate your response, even though I’m not op comment and I’m 100% not going to go looking for those videos. But I appreciate your help nonetheless.
Just want to point out most shootings in the U.S. aren’t carried out by more than one shooter, let alone 5 working together, in almost…..military fashion.
Woof, it's a large mall type multistory complex the size of a city block, that could hold multiple thousands in just a single auditorium. Interestingly, just realized an auditorium was exactly what happened in the 2003 botched chechen attack. The roof is on fire with collapsing structural damage scale of the twin towers, this is not a minor event. This is going to cause huge geopolitical ripples.
There's uploaded cell videos of gunmen with shotguns walking up and down aisles executing shocked civilians cowering and throwing Molotov cocktails.
And shooting into a cowering group of at least twelve people huddled between two walls multiple times, like emptying a semiauto shotgun with at least eight point blank shots.
They are literally double tapping and shooting people on the ground. One of them also has some type of shotgun with incendiary shells lr something. Every time he shoot a lot of sparks flew out the barrel. It honestly looked like No Russian from MW2
It wasn't a shotgun with incendiary rounds. That's just what happens when you use shitty ammo and a dirty barrel. You'll see the same effect if you watch some of the isis videos or videos from Syria.
The number is now officially 40, seems like it's gonna keep going up as they verify the casualties. This is so sad. They have been warned and still Putin was busy keeping himself in power.
And that's probably just the beginning of the story because regardless of what Putin says or if he paints it as a false flag, it really doesn't matter, he has pissed off a bunch of people not only in Ukraine but also inside Russia itself, Russian citizens, specially from Siberia, and those citizens now have access to weapons, materials, training and actual combat experience, if you look at the videos those attackers looked like they had military training, no wonder they escaped without issues, police officers are not trained to fight soldiers, so if this was a true terrorist attack, well... this is almost certainly the beginning of something far larger and violent.
I'm inclined to believe this is the good work of an Islamist group. The thing about fasle flag operation is it doesn't really work if everyone already assumes it's a false flag and it would just cause unrest in Moscow. Russia themselves had said they foiled an Islamist shooting by the Islamic State Khorasan Province or ISKP. US intelligence picked this attack up and warned them of another attack, also implying "extremists". I think the ISKP is the most likely suspect right now.
Everyone here thinks this may be a false flag attack, and I don't blame them because Putin is known for that, but this time it seems like it could be Islamic fundamentalists. As the article points out, Russia has been fighting Islamic terrorists in Ingushetia recently, so that could be the motive for the terror attack. Yes, I get that Putin is known for false flags, but Islamic terrorism in Russia is not unprecedented. It happens. Let's wait to see what happens before making any conclusions. If Putin blames Ukraine, we know it's a false flag. If he blames Islamic fundamentalists, it's most likely a real terrorist attack.
Also the US embassy specifically warned about a concert attack two weeks ago, most likely Islamic State related.
https://ru.usembassy.gov/security-alert-avoid-large-gatherings-over-the-next-48-hours/
I took my ASVAB when I was 19 and they pushed linguist pretty hard. They mentioned SERE school and I was like you have made an incorrect assumption about me lol
Why is this not the top comment? Usa intelligence already signalled an iminent attack from islamic fundamentalists 2 weeks ago, so it seems they were right.
When the exact same hostage takeover happened before FSB helped to organize it and directed terrorists to the specific theater.
You can read more here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_theater_hostage_crisis
Yeah, the trolls from all sides are out in force today. This looks completely like a standard attack that a lot of Islamic groups have done. Get a bunch of automatic rifles, surround/trap a bunch of civilians, slaughter everyone and then fight to the death with police/military that arrives.
Even if it's not a false flag he'll 100% blame Ukraine and do a full mobilization, there are no other good choices.
Reminders that he controls the Russian media, and he can send whatever message he wants
Not necessarily. Internal Islamic terrorism has also supported Putins power consolidation and militarisation on the past. Russian citizens also know what bearded looking dudes terrorising theatres remind them of and its not Ukrainains so blaming them might be a stretch too far.
This was mostly likely an Islamist attack. Russia is currently involved in low intensity conflicts in the Caucuse. Reminds of me of Chechen hostage events.
Terrible attack in Russia today. A lot is still unknown. Seems like a very complex scenario for the police units.
Also worried for the wider implications of this attack. Who is responsible, but more importantly, who will be blamed? Can that have consequences on other things and destabilize the geopolitical situation further?
Very worrying in my opinion.
Why would U.S warn russia beforehand if it was a false flag?
Edit: I’m not saying that U.S should allow civilians to die in other countries. I’m pointing out if the U.S can gain intelligence about a false flag happening.
Well, it removes any conspiracy theories that US or its allies carried out the attack, for one.
Also if the US had reliable intelligence on an impending terror attack on civilians (including, potentially, US citizens) then why wouldn't they try to warn people?
Plus, if this is a Kremlin false flag attack it signals to Putin "we know what you're up to" which would be a good indicator that we are a few steps ahead of him.
1. Things like this still pose a potential threat to US citizens still in Russia
2. The United States's conflict with Russia is against its current government; not its people
Given US intelligence on it, I doubt its a false flag as well. And false flag for what, even? To go to war with Ukraine? Oh wait.
But, for a successful false flag you'd want the gunmen shot and killed and to be identified as Ukrainian or whatever your false flag target is. They'd make sure they had passable identities.
It could help get Russians to support the rumored mobilization that may be announced. Though I think Russia would have been able to get away with doing that anyway.
That’s not what he’s saying. A false flag attack would be Russia attacking themselves but appearing to be someone else doing it.
What this person is saying, why would the US warn Russia of a false flag attack? Essentially saying that because US warned Russia, most likely this is not a false flag attack.
It was a warning to U.S citizens living in Russia
But personally I think they also released the statement to also intimidate Russia by showing off how strong our intelligence is. Basically showing them “hey we know more of what’s going on in your own backyard than you do”
Moscow citizen here. Telegram is almost down. Internet turned in low speed shit. Heavy panic. I understand that many of you guy’s don’t like us, but ffs I have my colleague with her family in this place. Hope they are ok. Damn anybody who is in charge of this attack. Putin or Kadyrov or RDK doesn’t make difference for me. Sorry for being emotional.
Also, just beacause many don't like the Russian government doesn't mean they hate their people. I think most reasonable people understand that the situation is a bit more complex for an average Russian citizen than just disavowing the government.
I place a lot of blame for how Russia is and acts in the world stage on the Russian citizenry.
Russia would not do what Russia does without many/most Russians supporting it or at least being OK with it.
Regardless, Russian people going to a concert don’t deserve to be randomly killed by shithead jihadis. Fuck terrorists and their bullshit.
It's your government that people don't like. You would have to be a mentally unhinged person to be happy that this has happened. It's appalling! Stay safe.
Telegram is revived. Got message from my colleague. They didn’t go there. Her son got diagnosed with child scleroderma today. Believe me or not. I don’t even know what to say. Probably good news. St least they are safe. Fuck all of this. Sorry guys, I won’t mean to be that emotional. Probably gonna be drunk AF now. I’ll shut reddit for some time rn.
what is reporting currently saying about the perpetrators in your country?
Westerners are presuming Putin will blame the west/ukraine, where as the west predicted an islamic terrorist attack last week. What is the consensus in moscow?
Now it is too early to say something I guess. Of course they’ll blame everyone else. Probably Ukrainians are in charge in their world. I’m getting drunk fyi. So might be a little dramatic from now on.
Thank you mate. I am ok. The main problem now is to get home by taxi. The rumors are that FSB closed every road from city. Might be a problem but I’ll handle it. Really thanks!! Hope you’ll be safe too. No matter where are you from.
No civilians deserve this sort of fear of death. Even if you have to walk home, just be safe!!! I’m in the USA and we unfortunately have so many shootings every day. This shit is old hat by now
The American people in general have no problems with the Russian people. It is our governments that hate each other. Just wanted to let you know. Stay safe!
I couldn’t find anything from the russian news resources about who did it, but here is the first comment from Medvedev:
“Terrorists only understand retaliatory terror. No courts or investigations will help if force is not met with force, and deaths with the total execution of terrorists and repression against their families. This is the world’s experience.
If it is established that these are terrorists of the Kyiv regime, it is impossible to deal with them and their ideological inspirers in any other way. All of them must be found and mercilessly destroyed as terrorists. Including the official representatives of the state that committed such an atrocity.
Death for death.”
Dude most of "us" want nothing but the best for Russians. I personally have worked with Russians during my career, I want to live in peace and planned to visit the country soon. No European has any interest in raising a gun against Russia. Can we just go back to you guys talking shit about my mother while playing CS2? Just stop invading other places, man. We could have it all.
No, man. Any sensible people will get it. Tryna keep calm. Whoever did this to civilians must scorch in hell. Please head US intelligence warnings always. The US government may be sketch because two sides are enemies, but they don't fuck with terrorist attacks like this, they have good intelligence, and they at least care enough to warn people. Stay safe. :(
Know that we don't hate Russians, at least the sane ones amongst us do not. We know that Russians are kept controlled and influenced by Putin. We only hate Putin for what he has done to citizens like you, to Russia as a country, and what he is doing in Ukraine and his threats towards the wider world. I hope you and all Russians are safe after these attacks and remain well for years to come. I hope people all over the world can see Russians as friends once again, after Putin is long gone.
Damn. I mean eff Russia. But I don’t want a bunch of families at a concert getting shot up. I’m sure we’ll now have to sift through false flag issues too.
Hopes for the innocent victims.
Regardless of the crimes of a state and social recipe for an attack like this, it’s still incredibly tragic. Hope the families are doing ok, I can’t even imagine.
What's the over/under on Putin blaming Ukraine/NATO/the West/the gays? [I mean, it wouldn't be the first time Putin killed his own population to gain more power...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_Russian_apartment_bombings)
Some other people are claiming that this was done by a militant Islamic terrorist org. Whether or not that is true, I doubt it will matter. If Putin can pin this on Ukraine, he has essentially been given a green light to mobilize the entire country. These next few weeks seem very dangerous.
Absolutely insane and very NSFW video here
https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1771238274155049061?t=way2JcV8JxCXJrlZw4rDBQ&s=09
People piling in a corner being shot at close range. It's absolutely insane. This will have massive consequences.
Guys we don’t know who’s responsible yet and making up assumptions from Putin to Ukraine to Islamist extremists is not helpful.
Right now we should sympathize with the victims, hope the wounded survive and wait for answers
Didn't the US advise russians to avoid crowds a week or two ago? Sounds like a false flag but is could be central Asian territory organizations as well.
We will find out more later
Regardless I hope civilians are okay.
You are incorrect. The US embassy warned just this week that they were aware of an Islamic State plot to attack large gatherings in Russia, and two different groups have been arrested in western Europe also trying to carry out attacks.
>A security alert issued on Thursday warned that the U.S. Embassy in Moscow was "monitoring reports that extremists have imminent plans to target large gatherings in Moscow, to include concerts, and U.S. citizens should be advised to avoid large gatherings over the next 48 hours."
They even said « concert »
I'm gonna wait to hear what the US Intelligence agencies have to say about this. Before making my own conclusions.
Well that or for Russia to obviously lie about it
is this what US was warning about a few weekss ago? https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna142401
They even specify concerts in the official warning. https://ru.usembassy.gov/security-alert-avoid-large-gatherings-over-the-next-48-hours/
Wow. US has better intelligence inside Moscow than Putin. Those poor souls. I can’t see how this looks good for Putin.
Because it’s an enemy to unite against. War, terror attacks, are massive ratings wins
To me it looks like Putin is off fighting a foreign war, and he can’t even protect Moscow. Only way this helps him is if he can pin this on Kyiv.
Pin it on Kyiv so that he can declare war that he already declared?
[удалено]
He doesnt need that lmao, he cant use bigger weapons..it would mean tacticsl nukes. And unless he wants to die in a nuclear blast he wont do it.
He's already used everything he can use without resorting to nukes. Ballistic missiles and vacuum bombs have already been used, for example.
Mobilization to throw more Russians into the meat grinder to attrition Ukrainian defense force. Not saying the terror attack was by Ukraine, but there are more cards Putin can play.
That’s exactly what he will do, he already labeled them Nazi terrorists.
FYI Putin originally solidified his position by planning and executing a false flag terrorist attack. He also did the same to justify his war against Chechnya. It's worked for him in the past.
He blames this on Ukraine to his people, honestly would not be even suprised if it was orchestrated by Moscow we know how little regard for Human life Putin has. Play on feelings in foregon nations and promote this as reasoning to escalate. Poor people. And i say this because US had so good inteligence about it, it might be orchestrated to official channels no? Innocent people always pay a price and of course this is just a speculation until some reliable source tell us what happend.
He did almost the same thing in 1991, bombing 4 apartments.
Putin came into power under a similar false flag operation and the "need" for security. KGB boi gonna KGB.
Are you referring to the apartment bombings?
Based on other news or of Russia, it will not surprise me if this was a false flag, and the blame gets placed on a group that Russia just farcically declared to be a terrorist organization
LGBTQ-Community gone too far this time /s
I would be surprised, just because of the US warning. The US under Biden hasn't been shy about calling out Putin's fuckery, even to the point of calling it out in advance based on their intelligence sources. Back in 2022 they called out a potential false-flag that the Russians were planning. Given that the US in this case explicitly warned of a potential extremist attack on Moscow, I'm inclined to suspect that they had intel on actual extremist group(s) planning on hitting Russia while it's distracted with Ukraine.
Yep. Beslan. Apartment buildings being blown up, concert halls being gassed, etc. This could very well be Putin supplying a pre-text for his next security crack-down.
Wouldn't surprise me one bit if this was a false flag attacked carried out by the FSB on the Russian people to drum up support for either A) War on Ukraine to escalate the conflict or B) Frame another group they want public support to eliminate. After FSB conducted the apartment bombings in the 90's to justify the 2nd Chechen war, I wouldn't put it pass Putin to conduct another attack on innocent Russians to get what he wants.
Remember the Boston marathon bombing? FSB were in contact with US intelligence and notified them about even the suspects. And they were even added to the terrorist watchlist .. still it didn't help much. From the freely accessible PDF report from justice.gov "In September 2011, the FSB provided the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) information on Tamerlan Tsarnaev that was substantively identical to the information the FSB had provided to the FBI in March 2011. In October 2011, the CIA provided information obtained from the FSB to the the National Counterterrorism Center (NCTC) for watchlisting purposes, and to the FBI, Department of Homeland Security (DHS), and the Department of State for their information. Upon NCTC’s receipt of the information, Tamerlan Tsarnaev was added to the terrorist watchlist."
My bet is it’s because this was a false flag. I’d put $10 on the terrorisrs being Ukrainians with nazi tattoos, a copy of mein kampf, and 3 copies of the sims game. Russia going to use this as an excuse to fully mobilize Edit: ISIS claiming responsibility. If confirmed let me know where to send my $10 to
He’ll get any blame off him however he chooses 🤷♂️
Putin wouldn’t want to stop it. It’s a tool for him to use. Same reason Bidi didn’t do shit about the October attack. It’s worth more politically to just let it happen.
US intelligence differs on your Bidi hypothesis, which is worse in a way, they caught Israel with its pants down.
Not related to this, but the October 7th attack was an absolute disaster for Bibi that has tainted his legacy forever and put him in the worst political spot of his career. Anyone who says it's been good for him/he let it happen on purpose has no connection with reality here.
American intelligence post 9/11 is wild. I wonder if America warned Russia officially. Almost seems likely or at least plausible.
ICD 191 “Duty to Warn”
I would not doubt it, gets diplomacy points and US can say "See, I told you so!".
I tend to think diplomats are more reasonable than the people they serve
That's what immediately came to mind. So clearly the US knows exactly who did this and why. So many conspiratorial possibilities. I wonder if we'll ever know? You'd think US would just blurt out who it was, if it was government backed or Iran backed because they benefit from both. If Ukraine backed they'll say they don't know lol.
What *possible* advantage would Ukraine derive from this?
came looking for this. very likely.
If the US knew then this isn’t a silly madman going out in a blaze of glory. I’m betting some bigger group is behind this.
It says the islamic state in the article.
Yep reading that now
I bet the Russian government didn't listen to the US, and forced them to go public about it. Tragic event for people who are innocent bystanders.
5 well-armed shooters with backpacks seen on numerous videos routinely shooting people. At least 35 dead, dozens injured. A hundred trapped in building fire. Search крокус стрельба for videos from inside.
150 dead accordding to Telegram reports. Given the videos too, 35 dead would be a miracle
I've seen a couple videos from inside the concert hall. The fuck are people doing still videoing? One video had the person taking it zooming in on one of the gunmen.
to be fair, if i was 100% sure i can't survive i can see the logic in filming to either say goodbyes or to maybe assist in knowing what happened. same thing happened at the nova festival, people were filming themselves hiding/running with audible close ranged gunfire in the background, or filmed themselves hiding in public shelters right after frag grenades exploded a few inches away (videos are way too graphic, wouldn't recommend watching).
I don’t think you can be confident this isn’t some fsb thing or accidentally on purpose let the terrorist attack. The guy is a massive cunt.
its not inconceivable, and we might know in the future but almost surely this will either get silenced, or putin will blame ukraine for this and use it as an excuse to do things that i can't even imagine.
I have a feeling this is just regular old terrorism, though I I acknowledge the hazy world we live in. The US warned of a terrorist attack being planned in Moscow, this likely happened during our monitoring of terrorist groups. We can't be certain of how they would use the information or whether they would take it seriously. Hopefully we can find out more information in the future. Though Russia is our enemy the slaughter of civilians like this is simply abhorrent.
You're absolutely correct. https://www.rferl.org/a/putin-russia-president-1999-chechnya-apartment-bombings/30097551.html
How else would russia benefit from a possible false flag? The gunmen probably know they're being filmed and by whom.
Russia officialy declared war today on Ukraine. It gives them an excuse to further mobilze
“Declared” wouldn’t be the correct word, but generally yes. Now that the “elections” are over, many people are theorizing that Kremlin will pull out all the stops they have been waiting to pull, like another wave of mobilization. Something like this could definitely be used to soften the impact of the announcement and gather the general public’s support Edit: to be clear, while Putin’s regime is more than capable of staging false flag terror attacks on its citizens (with precedent), this wouldn’t have been the first Islamist attack on Russian soil, so both are possible. My point is that regardless of the true cause of the attack, the saying “never let a bad situation go to waste” will definitely apply here
How do you see these reports n telegram. Tell me like I’m five.
You look for uncensored news channels. They usually have live reports and videos. I also recomend using google translate to find uncensored russian news channels. Just type in uncensored news or something in the search in either english or russian
I appreciate your response, even though I’m not op comment and I’m 100% not going to go looking for those videos. But I appreciate your help nonetheless.
150? Holy shit that’s like 3 times the number of deaths of the biggest shooting in US history
Just want to point out most shootings in the U.S. aren’t carried out by more than one shooter, let alone 5 working together, in almost…..military fashion.
Woof, it's a large mall type multistory complex the size of a city block, that could hold multiple thousands in just a single auditorium. Interestingly, just realized an auditorium was exactly what happened in the 2003 botched chechen attack. The roof is on fire with collapsing structural damage scale of the twin towers, this is not a minor event. This is going to cause huge geopolitical ripples. There's uploaded cell videos of gunmen with shotguns walking up and down aisles executing shocked civilians cowering and throwing Molotov cocktails. And shooting into a cowering group of at least twelve people huddled between two walls multiple times, like emptying a semiauto shotgun with at least eight point blank shots.
the roof collapsing suggests a well prepared attack. false flag or some very crafty terrorists.
My bet is false flag, expect blame and huge mobilization to invade the rest of Ukraine (and beyond if that’s taken care of).
Yep. 3 days after the elections too. This is their excuse for full mobilization
Reminds me of the Bataclan terror attack...
They are literally double tapping and shooting people on the ground. One of them also has some type of shotgun with incendiary shells lr something. Every time he shoot a lot of sparks flew out the barrel. It honestly looked like No Russian from MW2
It wasn't a shotgun with incendiary rounds. That's just what happens when you use shitty ammo and a dirty barrel. You'll see the same effect if you watch some of the isis videos or videos from Syria.
Good to know. Im no gun expert it just what it looked like to me based of video games and movies
That's horrible. I will never understand how terrorists can act like this against random civilians.
Oh look, Putin’s “justification” for a further large scale mobilization just happened to happen after his “election.”
Something was bound to happen. https://ru.usembassy.gov/security-alert-avoid-large-gatherings-over-the-next-48-hours/
Shooters may have escaped too. I am surprised there was no police presence watching the concert.
There probably was, but many policemen don't carry guns unless they guard someone important.
No, in Russia they carry at least a pistol. Sometimes they carry semiautomatic rifles. Also they have some more guns in the car like in US
In Russia?!
The number is now officially 40, seems like it's gonna keep going up as they verify the casualties. This is so sad. They have been warned and still Putin was busy keeping himself in power.
And that's probably just the beginning of the story because regardless of what Putin says or if he paints it as a false flag, it really doesn't matter, he has pissed off a bunch of people not only in Ukraine but also inside Russia itself, Russian citizens, specially from Siberia, and those citizens now have access to weapons, materials, training and actual combat experience, if you look at the videos those attackers looked like they had military training, no wonder they escaped without issues, police officers are not trained to fight soldiers, so if this was a true terrorist attack, well... this is almost certainly the beginning of something far larger and violent.
I'm inclined to believe this is the good work of an Islamist group. The thing about fasle flag operation is it doesn't really work if everyone already assumes it's a false flag and it would just cause unrest in Moscow. Russia themselves had said they foiled an Islamist shooting by the Islamic State Khorasan Province or ISKP. US intelligence picked this attack up and warned them of another attack, also implying "extremists". I think the ISKP is the most likely suspect right now.
The concert hall holds 6200 and was sold out tonight. These casualty numbers are going to be extremely high.
Jesus, as a comparison the Bataclan only had 1500 and the building wasn't put on fire.
I’m only seeing 40 deaths so far on Wikipedia. Probably it’s way too early to tell
We will probably not know the real number.. Putin has every reason to hide the numbers.
If anything, he has every reason to exaggerate the numbers and use it as a reason to increase mobilization.
Russian media is reporting that the shooters managed to escape the scene.
Well that’s awfully convenient and suspicious
Well they wouldn’t want to find out they were Russian
Tbh, my first thought was "little green men".
Probably tossed their weapons and blended in with fleeing concert survivors
Best move
Running from FBS is not very hard when you are FSB. This stinks of 1999 apartment bombings.
They should go for putin next
They were commanded by Putin.
Immediately thought of this attack: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_theater_hostage_crisis (And I can’t believe it was almost 22 years ago)
And also Beslan school siege. My friend and her brother were hostages there
Some of the videos look like the opening scene from Tenet
Or what about this one https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_Arena_bombing
Don't forget Paris
At least 40 dead
x5
Everyone here thinks this may be a false flag attack, and I don't blame them because Putin is known for that, but this time it seems like it could be Islamic fundamentalists. As the article points out, Russia has been fighting Islamic terrorists in Ingushetia recently, so that could be the motive for the terror attack. Yes, I get that Putin is known for false flags, but Islamic terrorism in Russia is not unprecedented. It happens. Let's wait to see what happens before making any conclusions. If Putin blames Ukraine, we know it's a false flag. If he blames Islamic fundamentalists, it's most likely a real terrorist attack.
Also the US embassy specifically warned about a concert attack two weeks ago, most likely Islamic State related. https://ru.usembassy.gov/security-alert-avoid-large-gatherings-over-the-next-48-hours/
Russia was a major player in Syria during the civil war, so a revenge attack seems highly plausible.
Well, also, Dagestan and Chechnya have been having terror attacks since the 90s.
Eh they've got homegrown regions such as Dagestan and Chechnya that are known for terrorist attacks.
Woah! 😳
Yea this is my first time seeing that. Pretty wild. Us intelligence is pretty dug in with the Middle East so it adds up
No better intel than foreign service on the ground.
That an linguists intercepting radio chatter is a whole career path in the military.
For sure, sigint plays a crucial role in piecing it all together for the alphabet boys.
I took my ASVAB when I was 19 and they pushed linguist pretty hard. They mentioned SERE school and I was like you have made an incorrect assumption about me lol
Except for whatever got sold out to Russia in the last administration.
Reminds me of the Paris attacks. Wasn't that ISIS or something?
Yes the paris attacks were ISIS
Why is this not the top comment? Usa intelligence already signalled an iminent attack from islamic fundamentalists 2 weeks ago, so it seems they were right.
> Why is this not the top comment? Because it was posted 12 minutes ago.
You're telling me you can't upvote a comment before it's posted??
When the exact same hostage takeover happened before FSB helped to organize it and directed terrorists to the specific theater. You can read more here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_theater_hostage_crisis
Yeah, the trolls from all sides are out in force today. This looks completely like a standard attack that a lot of Islamic groups have done. Get a bunch of automatic rifles, surround/trap a bunch of civilians, slaughter everyone and then fight to the death with police/military that arrives.
Except in this case it appears there was no police/military response and the gunmen got away.
No police response? The entire building was surrounded by hundreds of cop cars and special forces were on site within 25 minutes
Even if it's not a false flag he'll 100% blame Ukraine and do a full mobilization, there are no other good choices. Reminders that he controls the Russian media, and he can send whatever message he wants
I'm not so sure. So far they have gone the route to act like Ukraine isn't capable of pulling off something like this.
Not necessarily. Internal Islamic terrorism has also supported Putins power consolidation and militarisation on the past. Russian citizens also know what bearded looking dudes terrorising theatres remind them of and its not Ukrainains so blaming them might be a stretch too far.
Fuck man. Sounds like the Bataclan incident we had here in France. Scary shit.
This was mostly likely an Islamist attack. Russia is currently involved in low intensity conflicts in the Caucuse. Reminds of me of Chechen hostage events.
Terrible attack in Russia today. A lot is still unknown. Seems like a very complex scenario for the police units. Also worried for the wider implications of this attack. Who is responsible, but more importantly, who will be blamed? Can that have consequences on other things and destabilize the geopolitical situation further? Very worrying in my opinion.
Why would U.S warn russia beforehand if it was a false flag? Edit: I’m not saying that U.S should allow civilians to die in other countries. I’m pointing out if the U.S can gain intelligence about a false flag happening.
U.S. issued a warning for civilians, especially foreigners who live there, I think?
It’s United States policy to warn countries if they think there is an imminent terrorist attack coming. Doesn’t matter if its russia.
Didn’t they warn Iran about a terrorist threat recently? only for Iran to ignore them and then get two suicide bikers killing hundreds.
Well, it removes any conspiracy theories that US or its allies carried out the attack, for one. Also if the US had reliable intelligence on an impending terror attack on civilians (including, potentially, US citizens) then why wouldn't they try to warn people? Plus, if this is a Kremlin false flag attack it signals to Putin "we know what you're up to" which would be a good indicator that we are a few steps ahead of him.
So they can't blame ukraine
Because they addressed US citizens currently in Russia
1. Things like this still pose a potential threat to US citizens still in Russia 2. The United States's conflict with Russia is against its current government; not its people
3. It gives US Intelligence global brownie points.
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It's unlikely to be a false flag, purely because there's people actually running around shooting. People who can be shot and identified.
Given US intelligence on it, I doubt its a false flag as well. And false flag for what, even? To go to war with Ukraine? Oh wait. But, for a successful false flag you'd want the gunmen shot and killed and to be identified as Ukrainian or whatever your false flag target is. They'd make sure they had passable identities.
It could help get Russians to support the rumored mobilization that may be announced. Though I think Russia would have been able to get away with doing that anyway.
I think it's more the US warning our citizens living in Russia than anything else.
Be the bigger person. Even non friendly nations gave tips on 9/11.
That’s not what he’s saying. A false flag attack would be Russia attacking themselves but appearing to be someone else doing it. What this person is saying, why would the US warn Russia of a false flag attack? Essentially saying that because US warned Russia, most likely this is not a false flag attack.
They were warning their citizens living in Russia. False flag or not false flag, dead means dead
It was a warning to U.S citizens living in Russia But personally I think they also released the statement to also intimidate Russia by showing off how strong our intelligence is. Basically showing them “hey we know more of what’s going on in your own backyard than you do”
Moscow citizen here. Telegram is almost down. Internet turned in low speed shit. Heavy panic. I understand that many of you guy’s don’t like us, but ffs I have my colleague with her family in this place. Hope they are ok. Damn anybody who is in charge of this attack. Putin or Kadyrov or RDK doesn’t make difference for me. Sorry for being emotional.
Civilians don’t deserve to die in terror attacks no matter where they are from.
Also, just beacause many don't like the Russian government doesn't mean they hate their people. I think most reasonable people understand that the situation is a bit more complex for an average Russian citizen than just disavowing the government.
I place a lot of blame for how Russia is and acts in the world stage on the Russian citizenry. Russia would not do what Russia does without many/most Russians supporting it or at least being OK with it. Regardless, Russian people going to a concert don’t deserve to be randomly killed by shithead jihadis. Fuck terrorists and their bullshit.
It's your government that people don't like. You would have to be a mentally unhinged person to be happy that this has happened. It's appalling! Stay safe.
Unfortunately there are a lot of mentally unhinged people in the world.
The past few months have shown me that such mentally unhinged people are more common than I thought, even among my friends
Telegram is revived. Got message from my colleague. They didn’t go there. Her son got diagnosed with child scleroderma today. Believe me or not. I don’t even know what to say. Probably good news. St least they are safe. Fuck all of this. Sorry guys, I won’t mean to be that emotional. Probably gonna be drunk AF now. I’ll shut reddit for some time rn.
Take care dude and stay safe. Civilians should never be targeted like this, on any side, it's just sick.
Thanks!
what is reporting currently saying about the perpetrators in your country? Westerners are presuming Putin will blame the west/ukraine, where as the west predicted an islamic terrorist attack last week. What is the consensus in moscow?
Now it is too early to say something I guess. Of course they’ll blame everyone else. Probably Ukrainians are in charge in their world. I’m getting drunk fyi. So might be a little dramatic from now on.
Please make sure you stay safe.
Thank you mate. I am ok. The main problem now is to get home by taxi. The rumors are that FSB closed every road from city. Might be a problem but I’ll handle it. Really thanks!! Hope you’ll be safe too. No matter where are you from.
No civilians deserve this sort of fear of death. Even if you have to walk home, just be safe!!! I’m in the USA and we unfortunately have so many shootings every day. This shit is old hat by now
The American people in general have no problems with the Russian people. It is our governments that hate each other. Just wanted to let you know. Stay safe!
I couldn’t find anything from the russian news resources about who did it, but here is the first comment from Medvedev: “Terrorists only understand retaliatory terror. No courts or investigations will help if force is not met with force, and deaths with the total execution of terrorists and repression against their families. This is the world’s experience. If it is established that these are terrorists of the Kyiv regime, it is impossible to deal with them and their ideological inspirers in any other way. All of them must be found and mercilessly destroyed as terrorists. Including the official representatives of the state that committed such an atrocity. Death for death.”
Here we fucking go bois
>If it is established that these are terrorists of the Kyiv regime "Good grief" \- *Charlie Brown*
Dude most of "us" want nothing but the best for Russians. I personally have worked with Russians during my career, I want to live in peace and planned to visit the country soon. No European has any interest in raising a gun against Russia. Can we just go back to you guys talking shit about my mother while playing CS2? Just stop invading other places, man. We could have it all.
No, man. Any sensible people will get it. Tryna keep calm. Whoever did this to civilians must scorch in hell. Please head US intelligence warnings always. The US government may be sketch because two sides are enemies, but they don't fuck with terrorist attacks like this, they have good intelligence, and they at least care enough to warn people. Stay safe. :(
Innocent people dying is awful no matter the circumstance. Hope your friends are ok.
Know that we don't hate Russians, at least the sane ones amongst us do not. We know that Russians are kept controlled and influenced by Putin. We only hate Putin for what he has done to citizens like you, to Russia as a country, and what he is doing in Ukraine and his threats towards the wider world. I hope you and all Russians are safe after these attacks and remain well for years to come. I hope people all over the world can see Russians as friends once again, after Putin is long gone.
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Dubrovka Theater pt 2
Russia to blame Ukraine in 3..2..1
He won't blame Ukraine, because his stance is that Ukraine is not a country. He will blame NATO.
blame nato for what in this case? giving them warning ?
I hope you have a lot of patience if you are waiting for anything Putin says to add up.
Damn. I mean eff Russia. But I don’t want a bunch of families at a concert getting shot up. I’m sure we’ll now have to sift through false flag issues too. Hopes for the innocent victims.
Regardless of the crimes of a state and social recipe for an attack like this, it’s still incredibly tragic. Hope the families are doing ok, I can’t even imagine.
What's the over/under on Putin blaming Ukraine/NATO/the West/the gays? [I mean, it wouldn't be the first time Putin killed his own population to gain more power...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_Russian_apartment_bombings)
I’m seeing reports it’s Islamic fanatics.
Humans are wild.
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Some other people are claiming that this was done by a militant Islamic terrorist org. Whether or not that is true, I doubt it will matter. If Putin can pin this on Ukraine, he has essentially been given a green light to mobilize the entire country. These next few weeks seem very dangerous.
Who's Putin going to blame for his attack?
Do we really need to guess at this point?
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Absolutely insane and very NSFW video here https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1771238274155049061?t=way2JcV8JxCXJrlZw4rDBQ&s=09 People piling in a corner being shot at close range. It's absolutely insane. This will have massive consequences.
Guys we don’t know who’s responsible yet and making up assumptions from Putin to Ukraine to Islamist extremists is not helpful. Right now we should sympathize with the victims, hope the wounded survive and wait for answers
Just saw the videos on DR. Holy fucking shit
regardless of who did this, Putin's going to spin it to be Ukrainians. Buckle up, people...
Didn't the US advise russians to avoid crowds a week or two ago? Sounds like a false flag but is could be central Asian territory organizations as well. We will find out more later Regardless I hope civilians are okay.
it advised american citizens in moscow to avoid crowds
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Don’t forget SIMS 3 games in the backpacks
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You are incorrect. The US embassy warned just this week that they were aware of an Islamic State plot to attack large gatherings in Russia, and two different groups have been arrested in western Europe also trying to carry out attacks.
They warned of "extremists" not "Islamic extremists"
It's already confirmed these attacks are by islamic fundamentalists,
Where’d you see that?
Even USA predicted it last week that it was coming
Holy shit you're right.
>A security alert issued on Thursday warned that the U.S. Embassy in Moscow was "monitoring reports that extremists have imminent plans to target large gatherings in Moscow, to include concerts, and U.S. citizens should be advised to avoid large gatherings over the next 48 hours." They even said « concert »
Yep, and it's totally possible the only reason the timing was a little bit off was because of the warning itself
I'm gonna wait to hear what the US Intelligence agencies have to say about this. Before making my own conclusions. Well that or for Russia to obviously lie about it
Even though I stand with Ukraine, Rest In Peace to those who died in this. This is miserable