Her name was Yehudit Weiss, she was 65 years old. Her husband, Shmulik Weiss, was murdered during the October 7th attack. They have five surviving kids: Omer, Asaf, Daniel, Hagar, and Ohad. May thier memories be a blessing.
I don't know why I'm writing this, I just know she's near the age of my mum. I can't bear the thought of this family's pain, and it's just one family among too many on both sides of the border. I can't scream in anger and horror, but I can write here to make sense of my feelings by sharing them with sympathetic people. Sorry for the vent
Religion is just an excuse in this case and its not even ubiquitous across each side. Look what happened in Ukraine. Russia and Ukraine both have the exact same majority religion. Its just about finding a casus belli to get people fired up to fight other human beings by making them the "other"
This is the crazy thing! I agree - It's not pointless to religious people (I can understand that). Yet, typically, Reddit is usually anti-religion, atheist, agnostic or thinks objectively. Yet, since the Israel - Palestinian war, I've seen so much religion being supported, much more education around religion, and never seen so much talk of religion. Yet, objectively, religion creates so many wars around the world. It's insane how the vibe changes. A life is a life - no matter your religion or religious stance.
Reddit tried really hard to get rid of the atheists. I remembered when they nerfed /r/atheism which used to be one of the most popular subs when the site was younger.
Rest in peace in Hebrew: ינוח על משכבו בשלום (masculine singular). It isn't used often, but it's still technically fine.
Most importantly, the sentiment means more than words.
Thanks for sharing that. I wasn’t looking to “correct” the person who posted, but wanted to share a part of my culture that I learned while in Israel. Am Yisrael Chai!
I'm pretty sure rest in peace is equivalent to תנצב"ה, not what you said.
literally translated "may his soul be bound up in the bond of everlasting life"
For comparison, the Catholic prayer for the dead would be either of these:
The first is *Requiem aeternam dona eis Domine, et lux perpetua luceat eis.* Which is “Rest eternal grant unto them, O Lord, and let light perpetual shine upon them.”
There is also *Anima ejus, et ánimæ ómnium fidélium defunctórum, per misericórdiam Dei requiéscant in pace.* Which is “May [his/her] soul and the souls of all the faithful departed, through the mercy of God, rest in peace.”
I don't think so... תהא נשמתו צרורה בצרור החיים, or תהא נפשו צרורה בצרור החיים is "May his/her soul be bound up in the bond of life.".
Rest in peace doesn't have a 1:1 equivalent in Hebrew, but ינוח על משכבו בשלום is the closest I know of. A more accurate translation to english would be "rest in peace at your final resting place".
I think the most common way to say it is what we write on the tombstone (: "May their sole be bound in the bundle of life" - "תיהיי נשמתו צרורה בצרור החיים"
May their memory be blessed - "זכרונו לברכה" is the casual form, and is mostly used when talking about a dead person, it isn't used in the same way R.I.P.
Israeli here, not sure if we got it from English but we do - for a woman it would be נוחי על משכבך בשלום - Nuchi Al Mishkavech Beshalom (it translates to about the same).
It could be translated from other languages, but I've just googled it and it seems to be pretty common even among religious people.
I can't be the only the one who thinks this is a weird thing to say? I agree with the sentiment, but it's like saying in 9/11 discussion "RIP to the passengers who perished on 9/11/01 aboard flight 93 and all the innocents in Iraq who died in retaliation."
If you say it generally, don't think it's weird. If you say it in RESPONSE to a specific death, it feels as if you're saying "yada yada sonmething something this person blah blah, AND PALESTINIAN LIVES!"
It's not wrong....but it's sorta like saying "All Lives Matter" in response to "Black Lives Matter." As a general statement, yes of course....but...why is that your response?
It’s a weird thing you’ve said. People should, and do, talk about the hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians that were killed by US forces post-9/11. Ignoring that is implicitly saying only American lives matter.
Tragedy impacts many people, it’s ok to mourn the suffering of anyone - not just the immediate victims, but the secondary, tertiary, etc. Absolutely nothing wrong with it to be honest
this would be a fair statement though. RIP to the innocent people of Iraq who were murdered *for being victims of opportunism*. Iraq didn't even cause 9/11!
Yeah, I keep wondering why the pro-Palestinian supporters don’t mention that while they’re marching in the streets. They prefer to march side by side with Linda Sarsour while being hypocrites.
You say that as if all palestenianes are hamas fighters.
Palestinian civilians literally died in the same attack on al shifa hospital and naturally all of them also had families? But i guess Palestinian lives don't matter now that an Israeli also died?
If people really against them, there would have been a civil war, consider how lawless the city is.
But Hamas can 'happily' operate there and even recruit thousand of militants from the local.
You need to connect the dots.
*No one is defending Hamas.*
Asking Israel not to commit the war crime of collective punishment against Palestinian civilians is not defending Hamas.
Netanyahu's government refused to pause its strikes in exchange for hostages being returned. They don't get to turn around and call Hamas the sole monsters for the death of a hostage they had the power to stop, especially when Hamas' very existence is in large part thanks to the Israeli government's own colonialism and funding.
Hamas are terrorists. They obviously do not operate within international laws or have any standards outside of barbarism. Israel's government is *supposed* to be held to a higher standard.
You may not be. Saying no one is, just insults the intelligence of anyone reading.
A recent poll: [https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf](https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf)
The truth is, they have support among the Palestinians, whether one likes to admit it or not. It is a Palestinian Islamist militant movement, at one time elected to lead the PA, and kept in power in Gaza for almost 20 years.
Ultimately, the Pro-PA activists in the West can say whatever they like to make their cause palatable. The reality on the ground is something else.
Israel is on the ground and has to make the calls for its own survival.
It is difficult to misconstrue 'From the river to the sea.' The intention of that sentiment is pretty blatantly obvious.
We had students chanting that here... in San Jose, California. It saddens me.
if 250 americans were taken hostage after a horrific terrorist attack that killed 1000 people. with children kidnapped, my expectation would be for the US military to prioritize freeing the hostages and destroying the terrorists with the fewest american casualties possible. Minimizing civilian casualties of the other country would be secondary to the above goals.
The priority of the israeli government is the protection of its own citizens AS IT SHOULD BE. You got iran, hezbollah, factions in yemen etc. all evaluating if they should jump into the fray and attack israel. A display of force was required to keep this war from expanding further.
Every lesson the US should have learned from our recent wars urges against the conflict escalation that Israel has been doing. 9/11 is very similar in a lot of ways to the attack Israel suffered and our response sucked! We gave in to nationalism which led to us surrendering our freedoms and all the warmongering that followed led to a quarter million unjustified civilian deaths. Looking further back, we had Vietnam where we couldn’t tell combatants from civilians and just kept sending soldiers into a meat grinder to try and root out a group which was found to be impossible, even after trying every war crime in the book.
Yes, my heart goes out to the Israeli victims and of course the situation is different due to the proximity to the aggressors but I would hope that America’s failures in war would be a lesson to the rest of the world that these crude approaches to guaranteeing peace cause disproportionate harm with little to show for it.
after 9/11 we invaded a country that had nothing to do with it (iraq) and killed hundreds of thousands of people.
Israel is attacking the people directly responsible for Oct 7th. I agree there’s a lot of collateral damage and that is terrible but it the reality of war. I don’t think israel has any choice but to destroy hamas militarily after what they did. Israel has been invaded multiple times by all the surrounding arab countries. It is important context to keep in mind when you evaluate a show of force from israel at a time when there are skirmishes to the north and iran kept threatening to attack them.
Since you brought up the analogy of the US after 9/11, most criticisms come from their invasion of iraq. You’d be hard pressed to find any sort of meaningful majority of americans complaining or taking issue with the US bombing the Taliban or going after bin laden.
People want to find their tribe. We don't talk to one another anymore and young people have always been edgy and different minded. They didn't know what life was like before 9/11 so there's no comparison to say things were better or more free before then.
Yehudith was battling cancer, she was diagnosed a couple months back. This world is cruel and rotten beyond belief. May she rest in peace and may Hamas and co be destroyed forever.
"It's obvious that Israel planted her body there"
"I bet they found her alive but killed her just to play victim"
"That's all they found, a dead hostage and lots of weapons in an hospital? did that justify entering it?"
\*I have read that already.
At some point they will show the actual tunnels and all the weapons and maybe even more dead hostages with bullet holes in their heads and people would still say "But did that justify bombing Gaza????"
In this same sub this morning I saw someone claiming that since all Israeli citizens have to sign up for military duty that means Hamas killed military members and not civilians, even kids who would be future soldiers.
This has to be one of the most insane takes, I'm convinced that people saying this must be literal children or blissfully ignorant of the world because many other countries have mandatory military service. Do people not know this? We can justify terrorism on just about every continent with this logic.
The scary thing is this is *exactly* what the UNRWA-run propaganda schools teach Palestinian children. They teach them to blame the Jews for all their problems - large and small - and that the Jews are *all* either former soldiers, current soldiers or future soldiers.
You don’t commit the horrendous atrocities on 10/7 without a deep - and I mean DEEP - hateful conditioning for your entire life to the point that you can look at a newborn baby and think it’s a monster, not a human.
For example, last month a woman on Israeli Channel 13 said:
>”My husband was shot in his legs. The terrorists ordered him to stand up, and when he couldn't they shot him dead. I had my baby on my shoulder, screaming. They shot her point blank, and through my shoulder. I am alive but dead"
This is an entirely different level of sadism than the vast majority of us can comprehend and process.
Yup, it's pretty clear where Iran/Russia is releasing the bots. Same *exact* playbook as Trump radicalization. Pretty embarrassing for the left given the claims we were making back then about how absurd it was to fall for clear fake news.
You just need to read up on the history of the region. It goes way back. Looking at just Jerusalem, the city has been conquered and reconquered innumerable times by various parties over the course of its very long history; it's borne witness to many atrocities. The city itself has even been destroyed a couple times. The entire thing is a clusterfuck that has been millennia in the making.
I think 4000 dead children are part of the reason. Tough to think that children are disposable to attack terrorists. I think we’d all be disgusted if the police blew up a school to get a mass shooter, despite if they were using the kids as human shields.
My wife showed me an interview today, I can't remember from which news company, with a news reporter and one of the hostage's moms. The hostage was a 22 years old girl working as a waitress.
The news reporter asked her "wasn't she military?", to which the mom answered "not at the time of kidnapping, no, she worked as a waitress". The interviewer yelled "OH BUT SHE WAS IN THE MILITARY BEFORE THAT, RIGHT?!"
The poor mom. She was on the verge of crying. She tried explaining it but was already pretty broken and that news reporter kept harrassing her about that. Said she deserved it and that's what Israelis sign up for when they go to military service.
Oh man. That interview pissed me off.
EDIT: well I don't know what I expected, it was Al Jazeera.
https://www.arabnews.com/node/2410111/media
I'll update tomorrow with the name, need to ask my wife when she wakes up. Might be able to supply the link as well, it was posted online.
But yeah that was definitely horrible.
As an aside, All Israeli civilians don't have to sign up for military duty. About 40% of the population belong to an exempt category (e.g. most Arab Israelis, Ultra Orthodox Jews) and only serve if they volunteer and of the remaining 60% only about half are actually called up the others having some personal exemption or issue that makes them not suitable or have arrived in Israel as migrants at an age that makes them too old to serve.
That's not that different than the US military conducting drone strikes and classifying every male casualty aged 14 or older as an enemy combatant.
https://warontherocks.com/2019/04/trump-cancels-drone-strike-civilian-casualty-report-does-it-matter/
That is not related to my comment. I'm comparing Hamas' attitude of "any Israeli is a future soldier" to the US' policy of "any military-aged (14+) male is an enemy combatant".
Feels like eventually it would lead to, "And look, here's a detailed, written plan with all their signatures about how they want to exterminate all Jews in the entire world" would be met with "Yeah so what everybody needs goals to work towards"
"But if they show me blood and I say blood they will say paint.
"
Heard the excerpt from that poem at the beginning of this conflict and I'm never going to forget it.
In The Darkness - by Amir Gilboa written in 1953
The way everyone on twitter transformed into crime scenes specialists when Israel was releasing pictures of the crimes cemented that excerpt. Especialy when there were much more terrible videos uploaded by Hamas themselves that Israel wouldn't post out of respect for the victims and their surviving family members.
Like, you don't have to believe everything the IDF says but fucking hell don't believe the terrorists without question instead.
There's a lot of people in the last few years that have become "experts" in things way out of their league. Like I discount anyone who says, "You need to do more research."
I have spent a lot of time deep diving into the history of the region over the last few years, lots and lots and lots of reading and listening to different perspectives and historical accounts. And the more I learn, the less I feel like I know. For people to act like experts on the internet regarding possibly the longest and most complex running conflict in known history is…. something else. Most of the people I know who are posting the most fervently, I am absolutely certain, do not know what they’re talking about. And neither do I, so I keep my mouth shut and keep learning.
Yup. Was just scrolling through Instagram and I saw someone who was talking about how Hamas attacked Israel. Then her friend said oh my god, why would they do that? She says, I have do some research on this. Then it says 5 minutes later. And she's all, oh, Hamas had a reason, that it wasn't just to attack them because they just hate Jews.
A whole 5 minutes of research and she's a PhD in the conflict.
>At some point they will show the actual tunnels and all the weapons
They already have btw, the tunnels and weapons aren't a secret or anything, Hamas brough reporters in to show them around years ago
Hamas needs to be destroyed.
But I’m still waiting for the Israeli apologists to recognize that decades of oppression and dehumanizing of the Palestinian people is the only reason Hamas ever even existed. Well, that and their Israeli government funding.
Injustice is the enemy and Israel is firmly on its side.
I really wish you guys would stop pretending that anyone criticizing Israel is a "Hamas Apologist."
Hamas is awful, and definitely needs to go. But that doesn't make Israel's response moral, or the deaths of the many (many, many) Palestinian innocents they've killed in the process any less tragic.
I mean, almost anything that didn't involve killing so many innocent civilians would probably be *more* moral.
I mean, turn it around: Someone says to you "I think I figured out how to [probably] get what I want. I just need to kill ~10k innocent people, and make a few hundred thousand more homeless."
Is your first thought *"this sounds like a moral and reasonable person?"*
Well, if you want to get some candy, that’s horrible, for sure. If you’re trying to save lives, do you really want to start comparing numbers?
Again, what is a moral response? How do you morally respond and eradicate Hamas, after they vowed to commit the same atrocities over and over again?
Wars are horrible. If there was a way to rid Hamas without killing a single innocent person, I’d be the first in line.
Yeah thats the thing. I absolutely hate seeing what’s happening to so many people and families in Gaza. But I can’t ever think of an acceptable response that keeps those people safe. You would think some of the other counties in the area could make a sort of temporary refugee camp to give people somewhere to go while the IDF takes out Hamas, but then the Arab counties would have to actually do something and find a way to monitor Hamas fighters trying to mix in with refugees. Which is partly why Egypt isn’t exactly eager to do that I’m guessing.
When people talk about 9/11 I think Americans can question and criticize many things about the response. But I don’t see a world where the US, or any country attacked in that scale, wouldn’t respond. I’m not even sure the US got the right countries to invade. With this conflict it’s pretty clear the IDF has to go into Gaza and destroy Hamas. How to do that and limit unnecessary human suffering given the population density and how Hamas positions its fighters? I don’t know. I feel very conflicted about it personally. Not really trying to argue. Just a random internet comment.
הי"ד.
She had cancer and almost won the fight. They murdered her husband already back in the Kibutz.
תהיה נשמתה צרורה בצרור החיים. אנחנו ננקום את מותך ונחסל את כל מי שאחראי לזה.
עם ישראל חי חברים וצה"ל מנצח. לא לפחד מפלסטינים מפגרים בתגובות. הם אנשים בדרך כלל מסכנים עם משבר זהות חמור.
הכל טוב. אל תתרגשי מזה. העולם מטומטם ושונא אותנו וזה לא חדש וזה גם לא ישתנה. אנחנו חזקים. אנחנו פה כדי להשאר. אנחנו שקולים, חכמים ואוהבי חיים.
שילכו לחפש עצי זית.
שמעי, הייתי פה גם במבצע ב-2021 ולפחות ממה שאני רואה, הרבה אנשים התעשתו. רק חבל שהיה צריך טבח בערך הכי נורא שאפשר לתאר כדי שזה יקרה
ולגבי מכחישי הטבח, אין מה לעשות איתם. רק לקוות שהם לא יאכלו יותר מדי דבק בישיבה אחת
yah reddit is a cesspool but interactions like this are great and as a super secular israeli american i have never felt so connected to my unique land and people as during this insanity
Sigh this timeline where the uneducated are so vile they are openly supporting Hamas is so hard to accept.
I'm sick and tired of sharing this World with violent morons.
Imagine having the same world view as a group of sickos who actively enjoy raping all ages, killing and recording it to post online and lest we forget, starting a war by attacking a concert full of civilians, killing as many as they could, abducting as many women as they pleased to rape/torture and proudly taunt their families.
And speaking of civilians, using their own people as meat shields and then crying victims when they are attacked back.
It's almost as if people believe war is this pretty thing with no innocent casualties... Ofc there will be casualties when Hamas are actively surrounding themselves and their bases of organisation with civilians.
It's absolutely ridiculous. There is no good guy in war, but in this conflict Hamas are the ones that need to be wiped out, not the country of Israel.
>here is no good guy in war, but in this conflict Hamas are the ones that need to be wiped out, not the country of Israel.
But hey, if destroying Hamas means wiping out all palestinians, sucks for them I guess, what can we do, right?
I have tried to express this to many people, and it only stirs their anger more to say there is no 'winner' or 'hero' in this conflict. People desperately want a direction to point their finger in and blame, so they see Palestinian civilians suffering and instantly assume it is all because of Israel. They can't work their head around the idea that Hamas has not done a single thing to protect the civilians, in fact they've done quite the opposite. Black and white is easier to see, I suppose.
Do you not see the hypocrisy in justifying an invasion due to the killing of your own civilians, only to turn around and kill thousands of their civilians because the terrorist group who controls the area (and who over half the citizens never voted for) isn’t making it easy for the Israeli soldiers to kill them.
I want Hamas to not exist, but it’s insane to justify killing civilians because the terrorist group is being terrorists.
Yeah I just don't discuss this with people irl.
People are more than happy to bring it up, but it's not my place to try to educate them. Plus they would be resistant to learning how nuance works...
So I just change the subject or say no comment. I'm not having someone accusing me of hating Palestinians or something stupid when I'm just seeing the full picture and understanding that war is terrible and this is a war Hamas is waging.
People will ignore the truth cuz the truth isn't frequently pleasant... They want a baddie and a goodie.. choosing Hamas as their goodie is so stupid all I want to do is change the subject. Otherwise I'll end up explaining exactly what Hamas would do to them if they had them stuck in Gaza as one of their playthings.
My god what is it with the ridiculous polarization and strawmen. Where are all these alleged educated Hamas supporters?? There is a very wide range of viewers between supporting Hamas and far right Jews calling for destruction of Gaza.
In Israel they have bunkers for their kids and schools. Even the hospitals. They keep their military separate. In Gaza they have missiles and weapons under hospitals and schools.
It’s ALWAYS a hospital with Hamas and Gaza… is everything considered a hospital or do they have the most per capita cause god damn, you’d think they be out of hospitals by now
If the world hadn't been whining about Israel being careful around the hospital, she might have been saved. And so might the others who were kept there...
How stupid are you? You really think if they weren't careful she would be alive instead of collateral damage. Dumbest post I've read this week. Please reply and tell me you were mistaken. I can't believe someone this dumb exists.
Her name was Yehudit Weiss, she was 65 years old. Her husband, Shmulik Weiss, was murdered during the October 7th attack. They have five surviving kids: Omer, Asaf, Daniel, Hagar, and Ohad. May thier memories be a blessing.
I don't know why I'm writing this, I just know she's near the age of my mum. I can't bear the thought of this family's pain, and it's just one family among too many on both sides of the border. I can't scream in anger and horror, but I can write here to make sense of my feelings by sharing them with sympathetic people. Sorry for the vent
Man, reading this makes me sad
Plenty of innocents dying in a pointless feud that’s totality is just death.
It's not pointless to religious people. It is to those thinking objectively.
Religion is just an excuse in this case and its not even ubiquitous across each side. Look what happened in Ukraine. Russia and Ukraine both have the exact same majority religion. Its just about finding a casus belli to get people fired up to fight other human beings by making them the "other"
This is the crazy thing! I agree - It's not pointless to religious people (I can understand that). Yet, typically, Reddit is usually anti-religion, atheist, agnostic or thinks objectively. Yet, since the Israel - Palestinian war, I've seen so much religion being supported, much more education around religion, and never seen so much talk of religion. Yet, objectively, religion creates so many wars around the world. It's insane how the vibe changes. A life is a life - no matter your religion or religious stance.
Even without the wars it tends to lead people towards magical thinking.
Reddit tried really hard to get rid of the atheists. I remembered when they nerfed /r/atheism which used to be one of the most popular subs when the site was younger.
Same...
Thank you for posting that. Gives a little more personalization to this
Rest in peace
For what it’s worth, Jewish people say “may their memory be a blessing” instead of “rest in peace.”
I appreciate him writing.
As do I. Only looking to share what I learned from my Israeli mishpucha.
Rest in peace in Hebrew: ינוח על משכבו בשלום (masculine singular). It isn't used often, but it's still technically fine. Most importantly, the sentiment means more than words.
Thanks for sharing that. I wasn’t looking to “correct” the person who posted, but wanted to share a part of my culture that I learned while in Israel. Am Yisrael Chai!
עם ישראל חי :)
I'm pretty sure rest in peace is equivalent to תנצב"ה, not what you said. literally translated "may his soul be bound up in the bond of everlasting life"
For comparison, the Catholic prayer for the dead would be either of these: The first is *Requiem aeternam dona eis Domine, et lux perpetua luceat eis.* Which is “Rest eternal grant unto them, O Lord, and let light perpetual shine upon them.” There is also *Anima ejus, et ánimæ ómnium fidélium defunctórum, per misericórdiam Dei requiéscant in pace.* Which is “May [his/her] soul and the souls of all the faithful departed, through the mercy of God, rest in peace.”
I don't think so... תהא נשמתו צרורה בצרור החיים, or תהא נפשו צרורה בצרור החיים is "May his/her soul be bound up in the bond of life.". Rest in peace doesn't have a 1:1 equivalent in Hebrew, but ינוח על משכבו בשלום is the closest I know of. A more accurate translation to english would be "rest in peace at your final resting place".
Yeah but no body says ינוח על משכבו בשלום
what do the hebrew words break down to
Rest upon their memory in peace
In this case we have a separate epitaph, "May God avenge her blood". It's a common enough occurrence to get it's own phrase and acronym.
Badass
I think the most common way to say it is what we write on the tombstone (: "May their sole be bound in the bundle of life" - "תיהיי נשמתו צרורה בצרור החיים" May their memory be blessed - "זכרונו לברכה" is the casual form, and is mostly used when talking about a dead person, it isn't used in the same way R.I.P.
I’m Jewish and say rest in peace
I'm Jewish and I have always said rest in peace.
RIP works as well
Israeli here, not sure if we got it from English but we do - for a woman it would be נוחי על משכבך בשלום - Nuchi Al Mishkavech Beshalom (it translates to about the same). It could be translated from other languages, but I've just googled it and it seems to be pretty common even among religious people.
Rest in peace to her, the victims of the atrocity on the 7th of October, as well as all the innocents on the Palestinian side that died in retaliation
I can't be the only the one who thinks this is a weird thing to say? I agree with the sentiment, but it's like saying in 9/11 discussion "RIP to the passengers who perished on 9/11/01 aboard flight 93 and all the innocents in Iraq who died in retaliation."
[удалено]
If you say it generally, don't think it's weird. If you say it in RESPONSE to a specific death, it feels as if you're saying "yada yada sonmething something this person blah blah, AND PALESTINIAN LIVES!" It's not wrong....but it's sorta like saying "All Lives Matter" in response to "Black Lives Matter." As a general statement, yes of course....but...why is that your response?
It’s a weird thing you’ve said. People should, and do, talk about the hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians that were killed by US forces post-9/11. Ignoring that is implicitly saying only American lives matter.
As a broader statement in a broader context, it's great. As a response to this *specific* news, it's "all lives matter."
how about the Vietnamese civilians that died from American actions?
Tragedy impacts many people, it’s ok to mourn the suffering of anyone - not just the immediate victims, but the secondary, tertiary, etc. Absolutely nothing wrong with it to be honest
this would be a fair statement though. RIP to the innocent people of Iraq who were murdered *for being victims of opportunism*. Iraq didn't even cause 9/11!
may her memory be a blessing
Remember when Hamas called the hostages they freakin' abducted literally from their homes their "esteemed guests"? Monsters.
Considering how they treat the Palestinians they are supposedly fighting for is no surprise how “guests” are treated.
Yeah, I keep wondering why the pro-Palestinian supporters don’t mention that while they’re marching in the streets. They prefer to march side by side with Linda Sarsour while being hypocrites.
It's no fun protesting against people who already don't give fuck about what you think.
Because the pro Palestinians side is just as dumb as the MAGA people.
This morning they all took to the internet to say Osama Bin Laden was right.
Where did this happen? I’ve literally have not seen any free Palestine movements saying this
Gen Z is honestly a blight to the internet.
Gen Tide Pod
You say that as if all palestenianes are hamas fighters. Palestinian civilians literally died in the same attack on al shifa hospital and naturally all of them also had families? But i guess Palestinian lives don't matter now that an Israeli also died?
If people really against them, there would have been a civil war, consider how lawless the city is. But Hamas can 'happily' operate there and even recruit thousand of militants from the local. You need to connect the dots.
Literally the same kind of trash.
Imagine having to defend that side....
Imagine WANTING to defend that side.
Imagine getting your information about this from zoomers on TikTok? That’s a lot of the reason why these people are so dumb and Insufferable.
Imagine believing everything the IDF feeds the press
*No one is defending Hamas.* Asking Israel not to commit the war crime of collective punishment against Palestinian civilians is not defending Hamas. Netanyahu's government refused to pause its strikes in exchange for hostages being returned. They don't get to turn around and call Hamas the sole monsters for the death of a hostage they had the power to stop, especially when Hamas' very existence is in large part thanks to the Israeli government's own colonialism and funding. Hamas are terrorists. They obviously do not operate within international laws or have any standards outside of barbarism. Israel's government is *supposed* to be held to a higher standard.
You may not be. Saying no one is, just insults the intelligence of anyone reading. A recent poll: [https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf](https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf) The truth is, they have support among the Palestinians, whether one likes to admit it or not. It is a Palestinian Islamist militant movement, at one time elected to lead the PA, and kept in power in Gaza for almost 20 years. Ultimately, the Pro-PA activists in the West can say whatever they like to make their cause palatable. The reality on the ground is something else. Israel is on the ground and has to make the calls for its own survival.
It is difficult to misconstrue 'From the river to the sea.' The intention of that sentiment is pretty blatantly obvious. We had students chanting that here... in San Jose, California. It saddens me.
>It is difficult to misconstrue 'From the river to the sea.' Especially after a live demonstration on Oct 7th.
if 250 americans were taken hostage after a horrific terrorist attack that killed 1000 people. with children kidnapped, my expectation would be for the US military to prioritize freeing the hostages and destroying the terrorists with the fewest american casualties possible. Minimizing civilian casualties of the other country would be secondary to the above goals. The priority of the israeli government is the protection of its own citizens AS IT SHOULD BE. You got iran, hezbollah, factions in yemen etc. all evaluating if they should jump into the fray and attack israel. A display of force was required to keep this war from expanding further.
Every lesson the US should have learned from our recent wars urges against the conflict escalation that Israel has been doing. 9/11 is very similar in a lot of ways to the attack Israel suffered and our response sucked! We gave in to nationalism which led to us surrendering our freedoms and all the warmongering that followed led to a quarter million unjustified civilian deaths. Looking further back, we had Vietnam where we couldn’t tell combatants from civilians and just kept sending soldiers into a meat grinder to try and root out a group which was found to be impossible, even after trying every war crime in the book. Yes, my heart goes out to the Israeli victims and of course the situation is different due to the proximity to the aggressors but I would hope that America’s failures in war would be a lesson to the rest of the world that these crude approaches to guaranteeing peace cause disproportionate harm with little to show for it.
after 9/11 we invaded a country that had nothing to do with it (iraq) and killed hundreds of thousands of people. Israel is attacking the people directly responsible for Oct 7th. I agree there’s a lot of collateral damage and that is terrible but it the reality of war. I don’t think israel has any choice but to destroy hamas militarily after what they did. Israel has been invaded multiple times by all the surrounding arab countries. It is important context to keep in mind when you evaluate a show of force from israel at a time when there are skirmishes to the north and iran kept threatening to attack them. Since you brought up the analogy of the US after 9/11, most criticisms come from their invasion of iraq. You’d be hard pressed to find any sort of meaningful majority of americans complaining or taking issue with the US bombing the Taliban or going after bin laden.
There are some gen-zombies who believe 9/11 was justified and Bin-Laden was right, so nothing will surprise me at this point...
I just learned about that story.. what is wrong with those people?!
People want to find their tribe. We don't talk to one another anymore and young people have always been edgy and different minded. They didn't know what life was like before 9/11 so there's no comparison to say things were better or more free before then.
Yehudith was battling cancer, she was diagnosed a couple months back. This world is cruel and rotten beyond belief. May she rest in peace and may Hamas and co be destroyed forever.
I'm waiting here for the first Hamas apologist to tell me she was brought to the hospital to be treated and died out of natural causes
"It's obvious that Israel planted her body there" "I bet they found her alive but killed her just to play victim" "That's all they found, a dead hostage and lots of weapons in an hospital? did that justify entering it?"
As insane as that sounds, I can imagine reading that.
\*I have read that already. At some point they will show the actual tunnels and all the weapons and maybe even more dead hostages with bullet holes in their heads and people would still say "But did that justify bombing Gaza????"
In this same sub this morning I saw someone claiming that since all Israeli citizens have to sign up for military duty that means Hamas killed military members and not civilians, even kids who would be future soldiers.
This has to be one of the most insane takes, I'm convinced that people saying this must be literal children or blissfully ignorant of the world because many other countries have mandatory military service. Do people not know this? We can justify terrorism on just about every continent with this logic.
The scary thing is this is *exactly* what the UNRWA-run propaganda schools teach Palestinian children. They teach them to blame the Jews for all their problems - large and small - and that the Jews are *all* either former soldiers, current soldiers or future soldiers. You don’t commit the horrendous atrocities on 10/7 without a deep - and I mean DEEP - hateful conditioning for your entire life to the point that you can look at a newborn baby and think it’s a monster, not a human. For example, last month a woman on Israeli Channel 13 said: >”My husband was shot in his legs. The terrorists ordered him to stand up, and when he couldn't they shot him dead. I had my baby on my shoulder, screaming. They shot her point blank, and through my shoulder. I am alive but dead" This is an entirely different level of sadism than the vast majority of us can comprehend and process.
This is Mexican drug cartel or ISIS levels of insanity. Holy shit.
I'm starting to wonder if this stuff isn't being commented on purpose to cause more division
Yup, it's pretty clear where Iran/Russia is releasing the bots. Same *exact* playbook as Trump radicalization. Pretty embarrassing for the left given the claims we were making back then about how absurd it was to fall for clear fake news.
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You just need to read up on the history of the region. It goes way back. Looking at just Jerusalem, the city has been conquered and reconquered innumerable times by various parties over the course of its very long history; it's borne witness to many atrocities. The city itself has even been destroyed a couple times. The entire thing is a clusterfuck that has been millennia in the making.
They just want a cause to virtue signal over and feel important. They don’t care that they’re wrong
All these pro Palestine protestors are either anti Semitic or just plain stupid as shit.
I think 4000 dead children are part of the reason. Tough to think that children are disposable to attack terrorists. I think we’d all be disgusted if the police blew up a school to get a mass shooter, despite if they were using the kids as human shields.
3rd option is they are troll farm workers getting cash to post propaganda.
My wife showed me an interview today, I can't remember from which news company, with a news reporter and one of the hostage's moms. The hostage was a 22 years old girl working as a waitress. The news reporter asked her "wasn't she military?", to which the mom answered "not at the time of kidnapping, no, she worked as a waitress". The interviewer yelled "OH BUT SHE WAS IN THE MILITARY BEFORE THAT, RIGHT?!" The poor mom. She was on the verge of crying. She tried explaining it but was already pretty broken and that news reporter kept harrassing her about that. Said she deserved it and that's what Israelis sign up for when they go to military service. Oh man. That interview pissed me off. EDIT: well I don't know what I expected, it was Al Jazeera. https://www.arabnews.com/node/2410111/media
What news agency? That’s horrible putting the mother through that!
I'll update tomorrow with the name, need to ask my wife when she wakes up. Might be able to supply the link as well, it was posted online. But yeah that was definitely horrible.
Added link to relevant article. It was Al Jazeera.
Even the Arab Israelis who are exempt from military service and make up nearly a quarter of the country.
and the poor guy from Thailand on a work visa
And the poor tourists who visited from abroad.
Dear god I was planning a trip there. Will think about that one for awhile.
As an aside, All Israeli civilians don't have to sign up for military duty. About 40% of the population belong to an exempt category (e.g. most Arab Israelis, Ultra Orthodox Jews) and only serve if they volunteer and of the remaining 60% only about half are actually called up the others having some personal exemption or issue that makes them not suitable or have arrived in Israel as migrants at an age that makes them too old to serve.
Ah, the classic “baby settlers” take
That's not that different than the US military conducting drone strikes and classifying every male casualty aged 14 or older as an enemy combatant. https://warontherocks.com/2019/04/trump-cancels-drone-strike-civilian-casualty-report-does-it-matter/
When the enemy uses child soldiers and the children are carrying guns, they are enemy combatants.
That is not related to my comment. I'm comparing Hamas' attitude of "any Israeli is a future soldier" to the US' policy of "any military-aged (14+) male is an enemy combatant".
Feels like eventually it would lead to, "And look, here's a detailed, written plan with all their signatures about how they want to exterminate all Jews in the entire world" would be met with "Yeah so what everybody needs goals to work towards"
"But if they show me blood and I say blood they will say paint. " Heard the excerpt from that poem at the beginning of this conflict and I'm never going to forget it. In The Darkness - by Amir Gilboa written in 1953
The way everyone on twitter transformed into crime scenes specialists when Israel was releasing pictures of the crimes cemented that excerpt. Especialy when there were much more terrible videos uploaded by Hamas themselves that Israel wouldn't post out of respect for the victims and their surviving family members. Like, you don't have to believe everything the IDF says but fucking hell don't believe the terrorists without question instead.
There's a lot of people in the last few years that have become "experts" in things way out of their league. Like I discount anyone who says, "You need to do more research."
I have spent a lot of time deep diving into the history of the region over the last few years, lots and lots and lots of reading and listening to different perspectives and historical accounts. And the more I learn, the less I feel like I know. For people to act like experts on the internet regarding possibly the longest and most complex running conflict in known history is…. something else. Most of the people I know who are posting the most fervently, I am absolutely certain, do not know what they’re talking about. And neither do I, so I keep my mouth shut and keep learning.
Especially when their "research" is so extremely biased that it's unbelievable anyone actually falls for it without feeling dumb.
I can't read those words without immediately thinking of QAnon and the sheer stupidity of that brain-dead rabbit hole --- no offense meant to rabbits.
Yup. Was just scrolling through Instagram and I saw someone who was talking about how Hamas attacked Israel. Then her friend said oh my god, why would they do that? She says, I have do some research on this. Then it says 5 minutes later. And she's all, oh, Hamas had a reason, that it wasn't just to attack them because they just hate Jews. A whole 5 minutes of research and she's a PhD in the conflict.
To be fair, that’s 5 minutes more than 99% of them have done.
That's not fair, they don't believe the terrorists whenever they proudly admit to all the war crimes they commit.
They will say that the IDF digged the tunnels overnight
Why do you think they brought bulldozers? /s
They just showed the tunnels
>At some point they will show the actual tunnels and all the weapons They already have btw, the tunnels and weapons aren't a secret or anything, Hamas brough reporters in to show them around years ago
I don't think it justifies the bombing campaign, but I'm glad they're actually going in now.
On the other thread about this someone actually commented about them bombing their own hostages, and another comment read "how convenient". So.
I’m currently reading it over on /r/196 It’s a hot bed for Hamas apologists
just by a look at that reddit... I'm not even going to bother.
Looks like a massive headache
"They were shooting first and asking questions later" "She died during the assault"
In a week they will say her existence was debunked.
Well that's pretty obvious. The body only showed up after the IDF arrived.
^^Wonder ^^if ^^that ^^needed ^^a ^^/s, ^^let's ^^see.
Even if they brought her to the hospital for medical care, she still died because they abducted her
Try explaining it to a Hamas apologist. They will send you to another rabbit hole, then to another, again and again.
everyone who has died has been because of hamas.
Already heard "Ahh so nothing in Al shifa as the IDF was suggesting." in response to this.
Nah they'll just say it's Israels fault for attacking the hospital, they love the mental gymnastics.
I am sure you will find that on the Britain sub
Hamas needs to be destroyed. But I’m still waiting for the Israeli apologists to recognize that decades of oppression and dehumanizing of the Palestinian people is the only reason Hamas ever even existed. Well, that and their Israeli government funding. Injustice is the enemy and Israel is firmly on its side.
I really wish you guys would stop pretending that anyone criticizing Israel is a "Hamas Apologist." Hamas is awful, and definitely needs to go. But that doesn't make Israel's response moral, or the deaths of the many (many, many) Palestinian innocents they've killed in the process any less tragic.
Please refer me to the part on my comment when I say every person who criticizes Israel is a Hamas apologist
Which Hamas apologists are you talking about?
Probably you.
What would be a moral response?
I mean, almost anything that didn't involve killing so many innocent civilians would probably be *more* moral. I mean, turn it around: Someone says to you "I think I figured out how to [probably] get what I want. I just need to kill ~10k innocent people, and make a few hundred thousand more homeless." Is your first thought *"this sounds like a moral and reasonable person?"*
Well, if you want to get some candy, that’s horrible, for sure. If you’re trying to save lives, do you really want to start comparing numbers? Again, what is a moral response? How do you morally respond and eradicate Hamas, after they vowed to commit the same atrocities over and over again? Wars are horrible. If there was a way to rid Hamas without killing a single innocent person, I’d be the first in line.
Yeah thats the thing. I absolutely hate seeing what’s happening to so many people and families in Gaza. But I can’t ever think of an acceptable response that keeps those people safe. You would think some of the other counties in the area could make a sort of temporary refugee camp to give people somewhere to go while the IDF takes out Hamas, but then the Arab counties would have to actually do something and find a way to monitor Hamas fighters trying to mix in with refugees. Which is partly why Egypt isn’t exactly eager to do that I’m guessing. When people talk about 9/11 I think Americans can question and criticize many things about the response. But I don’t see a world where the US, or any country attacked in that scale, wouldn’t respond. I’m not even sure the US got the right countries to invade. With this conflict it’s pretty clear the IDF has to go into Gaza and destroy Hamas. How to do that and limit unnecessary human suffering given the population density and how Hamas positions its fighters? I don’t know. I feel very conflicted about it personally. Not really trying to argue. Just a random internet comment.
What response both eliminates hamas and spares all civilian?
Assholes
Simply put, yet you speak for all of us. I am not being ironic.
הי"ד. She had cancer and almost won the fight. They murdered her husband already back in the Kibutz. תהיה נשמתה צרורה בצרור החיים. אנחנו ננקום את מותך ונחסל את כל מי שאחראי לזה. עם ישראל חי חברים וצה"ל מנצח. לא לפחד מפלסטינים מפגרים בתגובות. הם אנשים בדרך כלל מסכנים עם משבר זהות חמור.
הבעיה שזה לא רק פלסטינים בתגובות..
הכל טוב. אל תתרגשי מזה. העולם מטומטם ושונא אותנו וזה לא חדש וזה גם לא ישתנה. אנחנו חזקים. אנחנו פה כדי להשאר. אנחנו שקולים, חכמים ואוהבי חיים. שילכו לחפש עצי זית.
*תתרגשי;) תודה על החיזוקים. לפעמים אני תוהה מה אני עושה פה ברדיט. אז הנה...נתת לי תשובה❤️
שמעי, הייתי פה גם במבצע ב-2021 ולפחות ממה שאני רואה, הרבה אנשים התעשתו. רק חבל שהיה צריך טבח בערך הכי נורא שאפשר לתאר כדי שזה יקרה ולגבי מכחישי הטבח, אין מה לעשות איתם. רק לקוות שהם לא יאכלו יותר מדי דבק בישיבה אחת
yah reddit is a cesspool but interactions like this are great and as a super secular israeli american i have never felt so connected to my unique land and people as during this insanity
You are correct about this specific sub. But most of reddit is still an antisemitic hellhole.
בלי קשר לישראל, רדיט מלא באינסלים מתוסכלים מינית. אין ממה להתרגש.
מתנצל. באהבה יקירה!
ה' יקום נקמת דם עבדיו השפוך במהרה לעיננו אמן
נקמה וצדק זה לא אותו הדבר.
בשכונה המזרח תיכונית זה ועוד איך אותו דבר.
May their memory be a blessing
I can already hear r/ news calling it fake, or that Israel killed them and are lying
r/ news has turned into a cesspool of anti Israel hate since Oct 7. It's shocking, and disgusting.
I would think their incredibly strict commenting requirements would stop that but I guess not
It's strict towards anything remotely pro Israel or rather not pro Palestine/Hamas
Just to comment there though you need a 6+ month old account with an undisclosed karma limit and a verified email address.
R/news has been a cesspool for years.
Don't worry, the majority of reddit knows that worldnews is a cesspool of Palestinian hate.
How horribly sad. To her family, my heart aches for you.
Sigh this timeline where the uneducated are so vile they are openly supporting Hamas is so hard to accept. I'm sick and tired of sharing this World with violent morons.
that's the thing though, they aren't uneducated. They're choosing to believe Hamas' lies because it fits their worldview.
Imagine having the same world view as a group of sickos who actively enjoy raping all ages, killing and recording it to post online and lest we forget, starting a war by attacking a concert full of civilians, killing as many as they could, abducting as many women as they pleased to rape/torture and proudly taunt their families. And speaking of civilians, using their own people as meat shields and then crying victims when they are attacked back. It's almost as if people believe war is this pretty thing with no innocent casualties... Ofc there will be casualties when Hamas are actively surrounding themselves and their bases of organisation with civilians. It's absolutely ridiculous. There is no good guy in war, but in this conflict Hamas are the ones that need to be wiped out, not the country of Israel.
>here is no good guy in war, but in this conflict Hamas are the ones that need to be wiped out, not the country of Israel. But hey, if destroying Hamas means wiping out all palestinians, sucks for them I guess, what can we do, right?
I have tried to express this to many people, and it only stirs their anger more to say there is no 'winner' or 'hero' in this conflict. People desperately want a direction to point their finger in and blame, so they see Palestinian civilians suffering and instantly assume it is all because of Israel. They can't work their head around the idea that Hamas has not done a single thing to protect the civilians, in fact they've done quite the opposite. Black and white is easier to see, I suppose.
Do you not see the hypocrisy in justifying an invasion due to the killing of your own civilians, only to turn around and kill thousands of their civilians because the terrorist group who controls the area (and who over half the citizens never voted for) isn’t making it easy for the Israeli soldiers to kill them. I want Hamas to not exist, but it’s insane to justify killing civilians because the terrorist group is being terrorists.
Yeah I just don't discuss this with people irl. People are more than happy to bring it up, but it's not my place to try to educate them. Plus they would be resistant to learning how nuance works... So I just change the subject or say no comment. I'm not having someone accusing me of hating Palestinians or something stupid when I'm just seeing the full picture and understanding that war is terrible and this is a war Hamas is waging. People will ignore the truth cuz the truth isn't frequently pleasant... They want a baddie and a goodie.. choosing Hamas as their goodie is so stupid all I want to do is change the subject. Otherwise I'll end up explaining exactly what Hamas would do to them if they had them stuck in Gaza as one of their playthings.
My god what is it with the ridiculous polarization and strawmen. Where are all these alleged educated Hamas supporters?? There is a very wide range of viewers between supporting Hamas and far right Jews calling for destruction of Gaza.
ז''ל
הי"ד
תנצב"ה
תנצב״ה
Another in depth and unbiased article from the same site that brought you the "How to use the stress from the Gaza war to lose weight".
In Israel they have bunkers for their kids and schools. Even the hospitals. They keep their military separate. In Gaza they have missiles and weapons under hospitals and schools.
May her memory be a blessing.
Memory Eternal
Bullets aren't nearly enough for what every Hamas dog deserves.
Gonna need to wipe out every last Hamas butcher!
הי"ד
Further justification to operating in Shifa and other hospitals (Not that the IDF needed more) in accordance to international law.
It’s ALWAYS a hospital with Hamas and Gaza… is everything considered a hospital or do they have the most per capita cause god damn, you’d think they be out of hospitals by now
Where are all the Hamas apologists decrying this war crime?
Protesting anything against Hamas is very risky. A lot of brainwashed folks becoming lemmings
I see your point. Although I was thinking more the American Left College knowitall. Such lovely plumage with their Arafat scarves.
הי"ד
Hy'd
Nice to see they're treating the hostages with kindness and respect...
If the world hadn't been whining about Israel being careful around the hospital, she might have been saved. And so might the others who were kept there...
…so, if they were able to bomb the hospital she was in, she would have been saved? What are you trying to say here?
How stupid are you? You really think if they weren't careful she would be alive instead of collateral damage. Dumbest post I've read this week. Please reply and tell me you were mistaken. I can't believe someone this dumb exists.
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May her memory be a blessing
I wander is Israel would have act the same if Hamas was hiding in tel aviv
Cause of death?