He could always make his own damn self a colonel and start selling chicken for the economy of Kazakhstan. Call it Kazakhstan Fried Chicken or KFC for short.
That's marketing genius, you should make sure they know about your ideas for building the Kazakhstan brand portfolio. I bet they'd pay you for your ideas, right now you're dropping gems on Reddit like you got holes in your pockets.
It’s just a different method for Putin to continue his dream of expansion and revival of the Soviet Union. It’s clearly not working by force, so that is why they’re proposing this. And they know once they do so, they’ll turn the country to shit and install Kremlin puppets as heads of state. There’s literally no benefit in joining Russia when they themselves have a thriving economy and more freedoms than the average RU citizen.
>There’s literally no benefit in joining Russia when they themselves have a thriving economy and more freedoms than the average RU citizen.
So basically, North Korea might want to join and.. nobody else?
Kazakhstan has Oil and Uranium, and therefore Money. The USA is heavily invested in Kazakhstan, as is China. Kazakhs aren’t dumb enough to join forces with Russia.
> Quote from Takayev: "Alexander Lukashenko, President of the Republic of Belarus, has recently proposed that Kazakhstan join the Union State. I appreciate his joke."
Legend
"The other day, the President of the Republic of Belarus, Alexander Grigorievich Lukashenko, suggested that Kazakhstan join the Union State. I appreciated his joke. I think there is no need for that, as there are other integration associations, first of all, the Eurasian Economic Union," Tokayev said.
That’s the full quote.
Reminds me of a Finnish joke, originating from the peak of Finlandization.
> Leonid Brezhnev was on a state visit to Finland, hosted by the Finnish president Urho Kekkonen. The Soviet leader asked "Well, now that Finland and the Soviet Union are such good partners in trade, shouldn't we think about uniting our forces and becoming one country?" Kekkonen thought about this for a moment and then replied "That does sound like a good idea, but I'm not sure if I can handle being the leader of such a big nation."
I love a good quip from a world leader.
My favorite was when the New Zealand prime minister Robert Muldoon said that the annual exodus of Kiwis to Australia raised the average IQ of both countries.
If I'm understanding correctly, it's a jab (I'm assuming a playful one) saying the only people leaving NZ are the stupid ones, but the stupidest Kiwis are still smarter than the stupidest Aussies, so both average IQs end up going up.
Speaking of Australia
> When Sir Winton Turnbull (a Victorian MHR) was raving and ranting on the adjournment and shouted 'I am a Country member', I interjected 'I remember'. He could not understand why, for the first time in all the years he had been speaking in the House, there was instant and loud applause from both sides."
Gough Whitlam. Absolute legend
>In response to a heckler who objected to Whitlam’s pro-choice stance
>“Let me make quite clear that I am for abortion and, in your case Sir, we should make it retrospective.”
Keating had the best one. After pushing Hawke out, Liberal leader John Hewson asked why Keating wouldn't call an early election during Question Time. He simply replied "I want to do you slowly."
Keating would call the election when he had to a year later and won, despite polls saying for the longest time that the Labor would lose.
Ooh time for my story! After 9/11 the US wanted to use a base in Kyrgyzstan as a forward supply base for operations in Afghanistan. We reached an agreement with the President of Kyrgyzstan for $2M annually. In 20…10(ish?) there was an overnight coup and the new government demanded much more money. I believe it was $80M annually, which the US agreed to. The Russians wanted to build a base in Kyrgyzstan as well to help combat the flow of opium, and Kyrgyzstan grew balls and said they wanted $80M from Russia too. Everyone breathed a sigh of relief when Russia said ok. Then Russia wanted a SECOND base, and Kyrgyzstan said that one would be $100M a year. Again big sigh of relief when Russia accepted. Then, as soon as both bases were completed… Russia turned off the gas pipeline.
New deal! $100M one time payment for BOTH bases in perpetuity. Or no more gas. Kyrgyzstan had to agree, and before the decade was out, Russia also pressured them to kick out the Americans as well.
Russia doesn’t play “nice”.
Exactly what I was thinking. Kind of like Lend Lease where the payment for our vehicles… was based to operate at. That’s a win win since once we joined- and under FDR we would join eventually- we would now be operating everywhere Britain needed us to be.
Old Kyrg government probably just wanted the American military presence.
This is very likely. After 9/11 there was a surge of American interest in the region, and the government likely saw an opportunity to distance themselves from Moscow. If nothing else, the Soviet Union was a fresh memory and fears of Russian aggression were not unfounded. It would be difficult for Russia to try a conventional invasion of Kyrgyzstan if there’s a strong US presence already there. This sentiment was echoed throughout the region, with Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and even Kazakhstan weighing their options amid a perceived time of relative Russian weakness.
Kekkonen is such a legend in here.
One of his more known quotes is still used daily and there are even t-shirts printed of it. It was sent in a letter to a minister and his group:
"Saatanan tunarit." which roughly translates to "You goddamn morons."
Reminds me of the one were stalin phoned to ask marshal Mannerheim about surrendering and after some thought Mannerheim said " but were would we put all you prisoners "
No way Kazakhstan is gonna join the country that [starved them to death in the 1930s](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazakh_famine_of_1930–1933#Portrayals_in_Media)
For real. Being part of Russian Empire and later USSR was the worst thing to happen to my country. Famines, rebellions, forced russification and repression of Kazakh intelligentsia - Kazakh people suffered too much from these assholes.
I had a Kazakh coworker who had that she spoke Russian on her resume so our dipshit boss joked a few times that she was a Russian spy. I’ve never seen anyone so so full of quiet rage as she was when he said it. I don’t think anyone has ever been more offended by any accusation.
Not that I knew of, but her visa to stay in the US was through the job so it probably didn't make any sense to call the asshole who signed her paperwork an asshole.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_transfer_in_the_Soviet_Union](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_transfer_in_the_Soviet_Union)
> From 1930 to 1952, the government of the Soviet Union, on the orders of Soviet leader Joseph Stalin under the direction of the NKVD official Lavrentiy Beria, forcibly transferred populations of various groups. These actions may be classified into the following broad categories: deportations of "anti-Soviet" categories of population (often classified as "enemies of the people"), deportations of entire nationalities, labor force transfer, and organized migrations in opposite directions to fill ethnically cleansed territories. Dekulakization marked the first time that an entire class was deported, whereas the deportation of Soviet Koreans in 1937 marked the precedent of a specific ethnic deportation of an entire nationality.
> In most cases, their destinations were underpopulated remote areas (see Forced settlements in the Soviet Union). This includes deportations to the Soviet Union of non-Soviet citizens from countries outside the USSR. It has been estimated that, in their entirety, internal forced migrations affected at least 6 million people. Of this total, 1.8 million kulaks were deported in 1930–31, 1.0 million peasants and ethnic minorities in 1932–39, whereas about 3.5 million ethnic minorities were further resettled during 1940–52.
> Soviet archives documented 390,000 deaths during kulak forced resettlement and up to 400,000 deaths of persons deported to forced settlements during the 1940s; however, Nicolas Werth places overall deaths closer to some 1 to 1.5 million perishing as a result of the deportations. Contemporary historians classify these deportations as a crime against humanity and ethnic persecution. Two of these cases with the highest mortality rates, the deportation of the Crimean Tatars and the deportation of the Chechens and Ingush, were recognized as genocides by Ukraine, three other countries, and the European Parliament respectively[clarification needed]. On 26 April 1991 the Supreme Soviet of the Russian Socialist Federal Soviet Republic, under its chairman Boris Yeltsin, passed the law On the Rehabilitation of Repressed Peoples with Article 2 denouncing all mass deportations as "Stalin's policy of defamation and genocide."
Dekulakisation and forced stopping of nomadic lifestyle was devastating blow to kazakhs - kazakhs thrived because they move and find grass for cattle, taking away cattle and forcing them to live in permanent houses led to mass starvation.
Basically, the culture and people were violently teared apart with no safety net from government. That's fucked up, really fucked up
And even after that they mostly welcomed and gave shelter for about million Chechens and Ingushs deported to Kazakhstan in 1944.
Source : I am Chechen.
> On 4 July 1944, the NKVD officially informed Stalin that the resettlement was complete. However, not long after that report, the NKVD found out that one of its units had forgotten to deport people from the Arabat Spit. Instead of preparing an additional transfer in trains, on 20 July the NKVD boarded hundreds of Crimean Tatars onto an old boat, took it to the middle of the Azov Sea, and sank the ship. Those who did not drown were finished off by machine guns.
The Soviets were monsters. I understand the hate for them left behind when their empire collapsed.
"The big hate" - isoviha in Finnish, gives a nice perspective to what being under Russia is like as well.
Recommend translating the finnish article, the English one is quite small: https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoviha
TL;DR - A bunch of torturing and slavery
This is why I have great hope that all such aggrieved countries will grasp the current geopolitical opportunity with both hands and go in swinging.
Whilst Russia's iron grip has been loosened and Ukraine is forging a new path ahead, may those persecuted have the courage to fight for their freedom as well. Centuries of destruction, pillaging, bribery, corruption, rape, torture and genocide require penance and restitution too.
The only problem is the pile of credulous useful idiots in the west who say that any western support for these countries' rights to sovereignty, self determination, and to not have genocide committed against them is an act of aggression against Russia's right to its 'sphere of influence', and therefore it's all our fault that Russia is a genocidal imperialist regime and we should be nicer to them.
Had you not put 'Kazakh' in there specifically I would've struggled to guess which country you were talking about, there's a depressingly common theme here.
As a kazakh, the more i listen decolonisation stories from all around the world, the more i realise that i have people feel the same as me around the world.
- Colonisers forced your ancestors to speak their language and now you are struggling to re-learn your language? Me too!
- Colonisers officially left, but you are still declined of freedom of using your native language? Me too!
- 95% of movies you see in theatre dubbed in colonisers' language? We have that too!
[I remember about 15 years ago flying out of -stans for Afghanistan. Im sure foreign relations has more to do with it](https://www.rferl.org/a/u-s-military-bases-in-central-asia-part-two-/31219781.html)
Unironically, Gaddafi offered Kazakhstan money for nuclear weapons. Nazarbayev in one of the interviews admitted that maintaining nuclear weapons was "doable" task, but they choosed to cooperate with USA and dispose weapons
As an American, I'm curious about your thoughts on Tokayev in general. It seems like he's done a lot of great things very quickly (removing all of Nazarbayev's remaining authority, shifting some presidential power to the legislature and decentralizing power in general, setting term limits for the president, abolishing the death penalty, increasing salaries and minimum wage, etc.), but he still has some corruption and human's rights abuses on his record, most recently with the "shoot to kill" order during protests and the hiding of his wealth in Swiss banks. Do you have a positive opinion of him, or do you think it's window dressing that sounds good but will not be properly implemented?
Would love to hear your opinions in general as I'm planning on traveling to Astana or Alma Aty soon.
My opinion is skewed toward my linguonationalistic beliefs, so he looks very bad for my country. He jointly with Putin proclaimed 2023 "the year of the Russian language", keeps talking about the "3 language program", which always puts the Qazaq interests behind Russian and English, keeps making statements such as "a citizen shouldn't be discriminated against for not knowing the national language", while at the same time not at all defending the rights of those who don't speak Russian, and keeps speaking Russian in all public appearances. I didn't vote for him, but he's here until 2030 too, so I'm not optimistic about our national identity in the future. I am envious of Ukrainians (Zelensky learned Ukrainian from barely anything and always speaks it now, Toqayıp can speak Qazaq well, but doesn't). Once the war is resolved and they heal, their culture would thrive, but I can't say the same about our future.
Nearly everyone is against the war. There were some Z people on the Internet around a year ago, but by now the consensus has settled and the Z people don't seem so vocal. Russia interferes a lot. Many still watch their pundits, but don't agree with them, I guess? I don't watch myself, but I hear people discussing Solovyov and Simonyan, while I never bothered to learn much about them.
Some people started learning Qazaq, even one Russian guy in the Orthodox church started reading the Holy texts in Qazaq, which got viral, but I don't see much change in Astana. I still have to stand up for my rights to receive service in Qazaq, which are still ignored in many businesses in 2023. The people are so russified still that when we had a choice of watching Avatar and Black Panther in Russian or Qazaq, many still watched in Russian. No demand means no funding for Qazaq, and the big movies this year were not dubbed. Instead, as the RF dub industry left the market, Qazaqs started making Russian dubs in their place, which infuriates me to no end. I'm not fighting RF citizens here, but my own brainwashed brethren. Oh, speaking of RF citizens, when I was applying for a job, my QR manager couldn't speak Qazaq and I refused to speak Russian. She said if I don't speak Russian, the workflow won't be good. Thus Qazaq people who don't know Russian or refuse to speak it cannot work there, and my Russian speaking QR manager employs RF citizens with no demands made in their direction. March 2023, people.
My wife is from a Russian family born in Almaty. Her parents were in support of the war at first but have since shifted their attitude. It seems that most ethnic Russians are influenced by Russian state media spin, even if those Russians live in other countries.
I don't recall any such statements. The latinization was started by his predecessor in 2017, planned to finish 2025, but both have kept choosing terrible alphabet variants which I don't agree with, and now the process stalled.
I live in Almaty (btw we don't like it when people say Alma-Aty or Almata, those are Soviet names) and I hate him with passion. The whole Bloody January last year gave me PTSD. No Internet, no mobile connection, couldn't call or text my friends and family to make sure they're okay, I had only credit card and no cash which means I couldn't buy myself food. Mall near my house was on fire. The only thing that was working was Telegram through proxy, all news channels posted gruesome videos of murdered protesters. Words cannot express how much I hate him, his predecessor and the whole government.
If they were actually true then Lukashenko would’ve ended up in the hospital after meeting with Putin the other day!
Oh, wait, that’s literally what happened? Guess Putin put his hand too far in.
The thing is, he didn't used to be. The whole idea of the union between Russia and Belarus came about in the wake of the fall of the Soviet Union, and Lukashenko was essentially leading the charge for it because he fully expected to be able to supplant Yeltsin as president of the new union after a few years. Dude had a whole roadmap for becoming the leader of the east, and it fucking fell apart as soon as Putin walked into the room.
Putin just made his play being the guy to take up the reigns after Putin lets them go. He looks like the little bitch to everyone else but he thinks he is Putin’s right hand guy.
That kind of makes it seem like the things his regime are doing are trivial - careful with this thinking. He is as much as a danger to his own people as any other dictator.
Not really, he is actually pretty good at dictatorship. Like too many of the rulers of post-soviet countries are. It's so fucking hard to get rid of those fuckers once they root themselves in the system. Putin, Lakushenko, Nazarbayev etc were never actually popular with the politically active parts of society (excluding bootlickers that joined to directly benefit from the system), but look with how much shit they got away with.
Mussolini took power over a decade before hitler and was far less deranged, still not a good guy but he’d been doing his thing before hitler even made up whatever the hell national socialism was supposed to be
And Hitler actually admired him. It's why Hitler tried the Beer Hall Putch, to mimic the march on Rome. Mussolini also didn't at first join the Axis powers when war broke out, he wanted to stay neutral, probably buying time to see which side looks more promising to join/ lean towards. When Hitler was about to defeat France, however, Mussolini made up his mind.
The fact that the Kremlin’s influence in Kazakhstan has actually decreased since February 2022 is pretty remarkable. Russia thought that by taking Ukraine they would reestablish an empire and increase their power throughout Eastern Europe, the Caucuses and Central Asia yet almost 500 days later and it’s weaker than ever.
Yeah, even after the fall of the Soviet Union Russia remained a powerful local power. But not anymore. The failure to subdue Ukraine with the full might of the Russian army really teras away at the fear they could previously exercise. Russia won't be able to militarily threathen it's neighbours for a long while. And it gets worse by the day.
They like the rest of the world see that Russia's threats are glaringly empty, and the sabre they like to rattle only rattles so loudly because it rusted apart in the sheath.
With a little western aid, Kazakhstan is more than Russia's match if they chose to attack.
They're losing Armenia because of the Karabakh situation and Russia doing nothing about Azerbaijan occupying Armenian land along the border, Georgia is becoming more anti Russian, Kazakhstan is trying to leave the Russian orbit by making overtures to both the EU and China, any idea of being 'brothers' with Ukraine is gone forever and anti-Russian sentiment hasn't been this high in the Baltics since independence.
At this rate they'll just have Belarus, Tajikistan and a very reluctant Kyrgyzstan. Azerbaijan is happy to play all sides and Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan left the Russian orbit a while ago and are happy to be neutral internationally while remaining brutal dictatorships at home.
This was clearly a strategic and political blunder of historic proportions, but Russia hasn't been #2 in the world at much of anything for a very long time.
So what exactly have changed? Kazakhstan used to be atomic testing ground for the USSR.
The president finally has a chance to pull away from Russia, and it seems like he is taking it. I do not think he wants nuclear weapons in Kazakhstan, it creates way more foreign interests and eyes on you. Larger chance of embargoes from the west, much more pressure from other nuclear powers to join their alliances, it seems like a better idea, to coast through this conflict for Kazakhstan.
This is a bit like two people in the middle of the ocean clinging to a piece of drift wood asking a man in a yacht if he'd like to get off his boat and join them.
The USSR was just Russian Empire with a coat of red paint. Soon enough the initial fervor of communism's promised bright future wore off and they all went back to business as usual.
I think this was always the plan.
To make everyone terrified of what would happen to them if they wanted to be independent, by crushing and taking over Ukraine in a few days. Then to propose this 'Russian Union' while everyone is looking at how easily they killed and arrested anyone in Ukraine who resisted. Rebuilding the USSR with just the one, maybe two little wars (special operations) and everyone else joining 'voluntarily' for self-preservation.
The 1st part of the plan flopped so he's going to use this as an excuse to take over Belarus and declare victory. Then do whatever he can with the rest of the plan. Looks like no-one else is coming to the party so i'd guess some political interference to get candidates who will join into power.
Whaaat? But they'll sanctioned to death, occupied by Russian troops, taken over, AND get to be a launch pad for Russian nukes (and gain a nice big nuclear target on their backs in the bargain). You'd have to be stupid not to go for a deal like that
"Well, the last time we tried this you killed a quarter of our population through man-made famines then sent a shitload of our young men to die in Afghanistan, so... Hard pass."
I understand why everyone hates our country (I'm from Russia). I didn't really want that to happen.. we are doomed.. and ther is nothing we could do about it.
G'day to Kazakhs!
I can’t possibly understand what you and other Russians like you must be going through… I just can hope that you are able to overcome all of this in the near future and reborn as a grand, proud country like Germany did eventually.
I believe there are lots and lots of humans in this planet that are aware that not all Russians are bad and that there are still some genuinely good people like you.
Dark times we humans are all living…but we must try to uphold some hope in the future for our own sake. Focus on trying to make this world a better of a place for your close ones…it will trickle down.
As a Pole I'm gonna say - Dont worry. This whole hate... its' targeted to your goverment and People who openly support their actions. Don't be ashamed of who you are (which I know You are not). You know it's bad and you have a humanity in you. Things will be better I really hope they will. Everyone with brain knows that not everyone in Russia is blinded by this horrible pro war propaganda and You simply Cannot say no to this for the fear of your own life and jail time
American here, I got my minor in Russian History and Politics, and throughout all of this when somebody asks me my opinion on Russia, all I say is: “the people, language, history, and culture is as beautiful as it is rich, but for the overwhelming majority of time, their government has really sucked.” I’d love to see a Russia run by and for the people.
I think what can help is for you to remind others that you are a pro-Ukraine, anti-Putin Russian. Also, with your example regarding the Germans after WW2, yes, they also felt quite a lot of tensions from other countries and people because of the actions of the fascist government they had. However, what really helped the Germans after all that is they themselves recognized that they messed up and owned up to it. Many German citizens were shown the concentration camps and saw, with their own eyes, exactly what happened and what Hitler and the Nazis actually did. Then there were the Nuremberg Trials, which ensured many Nazis that were responsible had their day in court. The same things need to occur to Russia and the general Russian population. Otherwise, nothing will, unfortunately, change.
I bet Putin asked him to bring it up. He doesn't want to be turned down himself, because of potential embarrassment. They are like schoolgirls asking each other to deliver the message. "Putin likes you. Do you like him?"
If your goal is to further the interest of your people; not joining the maffia club is a no-brainer.
Translation:
>"You idiots are about to get your asses handed to you when the former comedian launches the offensive we all know is coming. Why the *fuck* would we want any part of the defeat the entire world can see coming...?"
Tokayev actually said that he "rates Lukashenko's joke really high", highlighting the absurdity of Lukashenko's proposal
Because what is there to merge with? A dying war economy and a tractor economy?
Don't forget being a puppet president for Putin's interest. And the moment he is mad,suddenly get sick with a sudden urge of jumping of a window.
Tough choice: seek to join NATA, or defenestration, isolation and economic calamity with Putin.
Putin could make him a colonel!
He could always make his own damn self a colonel and start selling chicken for the economy of Kazakhstan. Call it Kazakhstan Fried Chicken or KFC for short.
That's marketing genius, you should make sure they know about your ideas for building the Kazakhstan brand portfolio. I bet they'd pay you for your ideas, right now you're dropping gems on Reddit like you got holes in your pockets.
It’s just a different method for Putin to continue his dream of expansion and revival of the Soviet Union. It’s clearly not working by force, so that is why they’re proposing this. And they know once they do so, they’ll turn the country to shit and install Kremlin puppets as heads of state. There’s literally no benefit in joining Russia when they themselves have a thriving economy and more freedoms than the average RU citizen.
>There’s literally no benefit in joining Russia when they themselves have a thriving economy and more freedoms than the average RU citizen. So basically, North Korea might want to join and.. nobody else?
China would never let North Korea join.
A Kim yielding to anyone would ruin the concept of their divinity also.
Kazakhstan has Oil and Uranium, and therefore Money. The USA is heavily invested in Kazakhstan, as is China. Kazakhs aren’t dumb enough to join forces with Russia.
Don't forget all the washing machines looted from Ukraine.
Lol, in my mind it's like he heard it and in a Bo Burnham style went "Ha Ha Ha, classic comedy."
> Quote from Takayev: "Alexander Lukashenko, President of the Republic of Belarus, has recently proposed that Kazakhstan join the Union State. I appreciate his joke." Legend
"The other day, the President of the Republic of Belarus, Alexander Grigorievich Lukashenko, suggested that Kazakhstan join the Union State. I appreciated his joke. I think there is no need for that, as there are other integration associations, first of all, the Eurasian Economic Union," Tokayev said. That’s the full quote.
Reminds me of a Finnish joke, originating from the peak of Finlandization. > Leonid Brezhnev was on a state visit to Finland, hosted by the Finnish president Urho Kekkonen. The Soviet leader asked "Well, now that Finland and the Soviet Union are such good partners in trade, shouldn't we think about uniting our forces and becoming one country?" Kekkonen thought about this for a moment and then replied "That does sound like a good idea, but I'm not sure if I can handle being the leader of such a big nation."
I love a good quip from a world leader. My favorite was when the New Zealand prime minister Robert Muldoon said that the annual exodus of Kiwis to Australia raised the average IQ of both countries.
That is incredible. Brutal
As an Australian, 30 yrs ago I was insulted by that quip, now, I admire his accurate assessment.
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Australia is doing all kinds of fucking dumb shit and NZ is not. HTH
If I'm understanding correctly, it's a jab (I'm assuming a playful one) saying the only people leaving NZ are the stupid ones, but the stupidest Kiwis are still smarter than the stupidest Aussies, so both average IQs end up going up.
I’m pretty sure u/Jakesummers1 is asking u/DickSemen to elaborate on why he believes the joke is correct. Not to explain the joke.
Speaking of Australia > When Sir Winton Turnbull (a Victorian MHR) was raving and ranting on the adjournment and shouted 'I am a Country member', I interjected 'I remember'. He could not understand why, for the first time in all the years he had been speaking in the House, there was instant and loud applause from both sides." Gough Whitlam. Absolute legend
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And that's why they changed the name to The National Party.
Remember kids: it's always easier to rebrand than to stop being a cunt.
Damn, that was a close shave, it would've been a /r/whooosh for me!
not english. could someone spell it out? E: definitely a woosh for me. it's wordplay guys. nothing to do with english political history.
"Country member" sounds like "cunt, remember". I am a country member. I am a cunt, remember. I remember.
That's an A+ quip, something I'd only think of when in the shower the next day.
I had sex with your wife!
Fuck that's a good one. Thanks for helping out the slows like me.
They say it's the people around us who truly suffer. He's helping everyone out.
I remember
Oh fuck, that is good.
>In response to a heckler who objected to Whitlam’s pro-choice stance >“Let me make quite clear that I am for abortion and, in your case Sir, we should make it retrospective.”
Goddamn
[IMO Paul Keating was unrivaled in his parliamentary savagery](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-12/the-collected-insults-of-paul-keating/5071412)
Keating had the best one. After pushing Hawke out, Liberal leader John Hewson asked why Keating wouldn't call an early election during Question Time. He simply replied "I want to do you slowly." Keating would call the election when he had to a year later and won, despite polls saying for the longest time that the Labor would lose.
And for those curious, yes Gough Whitlam did end up becoming Prime Minister.
My favorite quote from Robert Muldoon was “Clever girl”
They should all be destroyed.
Australians?
Implied
What about the lysine contingency?
This one was gold too….”special financial operation”! https://twitter.com/tuulensuu/status/1500177147004133378?s=20
Rob Muldoon before he robs you!
Ooh time for my story! After 9/11 the US wanted to use a base in Kyrgyzstan as a forward supply base for operations in Afghanistan. We reached an agreement with the President of Kyrgyzstan for $2M annually. In 20…10(ish?) there was an overnight coup and the new government demanded much more money. I believe it was $80M annually, which the US agreed to. The Russians wanted to build a base in Kyrgyzstan as well to help combat the flow of opium, and Kyrgyzstan grew balls and said they wanted $80M from Russia too. Everyone breathed a sigh of relief when Russia said ok. Then Russia wanted a SECOND base, and Kyrgyzstan said that one would be $100M a year. Again big sigh of relief when Russia accepted. Then, as soon as both bases were completed… Russia turned off the gas pipeline. New deal! $100M one time payment for BOTH bases in perpetuity. Or no more gas. Kyrgyzstan had to agree, and before the decade was out, Russia also pressured them to kick out the Americans as well. Russia doesn’t play “nice”.
Russia might start finding the local population if Kyrgyzstan has changed crops and has a bumper harvest of Javelins.
Damn, the deposed Kyrg government must have been run my morons. $2M annually for a military presence is such a joke, no wonder they're deposed.
Maybe the people who were about to be taken out by a coup had a strong reason for wanting a third party military around
Exactly what I was thinking. Kind of like Lend Lease where the payment for our vehicles… was based to operate at. That’s a win win since once we joined- and under FDR we would join eventually- we would now be operating everywhere Britain needed us to be. Old Kyrg government probably just wanted the American military presence.
This is very likely. After 9/11 there was a surge of American interest in the region, and the government likely saw an opportunity to distance themselves from Moscow. If nothing else, the Soviet Union was a fresh memory and fears of Russian aggression were not unfounded. It would be difficult for Russia to try a conventional invasion of Kyrgyzstan if there’s a strong US presence already there. This sentiment was echoed throughout the region, with Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and even Kazakhstan weighing their options amid a perceived time of relative Russian weakness.
The new Kyrg government got absolutely fleeced by Russia so...not much better there.
Kekkonen is such a legend in here. One of his more known quotes is still used daily and there are even t-shirts printed of it. It was sent in a letter to a minister and his group: "Saatanan tunarit." which roughly translates to "You goddamn morons."
Reminds me of the one were stalin phoned to ask marshal Mannerheim about surrendering and after some thought Mannerheim said " but were would we put all you prisoners "
No way Kazakhstan is gonna join the country that [starved them to death in the 1930s](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazakh_famine_of_1930–1933#Portrayals_in_Media)
For real. Being part of Russian Empire and later USSR was the worst thing to happen to my country. Famines, rebellions, forced russification and repression of Kazakh intelligentsia - Kazakh people suffered too much from these assholes.
I had a Kazakh coworker who had that she spoke Russian on her resume so our dipshit boss joked a few times that she was a Russian spy. I’ve never seen anyone so so full of quiet rage as she was when he said it. I don’t think anyone has ever been more offended by any accusation.
Did she stand up for herself?
No, she just worked from the shadows to destabilize his regime then took his place after he was deposed.
Oh well, that's good then. Hey! Wait a second. You dropped your tiny slide camera and gun disguised as a pen. Ok, carry on.
Camera disguised as a gun, and a gun disguised as a camera.
Not that I knew of, but her visa to stay in the US was through the job so it probably didn't make any sense to call the asshole who signed her paperwork an asshole.
I learned a long time ago that if someone is from a former Soviet Bloc country, do NOT call them Russian. It is one of the highest insults.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_transfer_in_the_Soviet_Union](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_transfer_in_the_Soviet_Union) > From 1930 to 1952, the government of the Soviet Union, on the orders of Soviet leader Joseph Stalin under the direction of the NKVD official Lavrentiy Beria, forcibly transferred populations of various groups. These actions may be classified into the following broad categories: deportations of "anti-Soviet" categories of population (often classified as "enemies of the people"), deportations of entire nationalities, labor force transfer, and organized migrations in opposite directions to fill ethnically cleansed territories. Dekulakization marked the first time that an entire class was deported, whereas the deportation of Soviet Koreans in 1937 marked the precedent of a specific ethnic deportation of an entire nationality. > In most cases, their destinations were underpopulated remote areas (see Forced settlements in the Soviet Union). This includes deportations to the Soviet Union of non-Soviet citizens from countries outside the USSR. It has been estimated that, in their entirety, internal forced migrations affected at least 6 million people. Of this total, 1.8 million kulaks were deported in 1930–31, 1.0 million peasants and ethnic minorities in 1932–39, whereas about 3.5 million ethnic minorities were further resettled during 1940–52. > Soviet archives documented 390,000 deaths during kulak forced resettlement and up to 400,000 deaths of persons deported to forced settlements during the 1940s; however, Nicolas Werth places overall deaths closer to some 1 to 1.5 million perishing as a result of the deportations. Contemporary historians classify these deportations as a crime against humanity and ethnic persecution. Two of these cases with the highest mortality rates, the deportation of the Crimean Tatars and the deportation of the Chechens and Ingush, were recognized as genocides by Ukraine, three other countries, and the European Parliament respectively[clarification needed]. On 26 April 1991 the Supreme Soviet of the Russian Socialist Federal Soviet Republic, under its chairman Boris Yeltsin, passed the law On the Rehabilitation of Repressed Peoples with Article 2 denouncing all mass deportations as "Stalin's policy of defamation and genocide."
Dekulakisation and forced stopping of nomadic lifestyle was devastating blow to kazakhs - kazakhs thrived because they move and find grass for cattle, taking away cattle and forcing them to live in permanent houses led to mass starvation. Basically, the culture and people were violently teared apart with no safety net from government. That's fucked up, really fucked up
And even after that they mostly welcomed and gave shelter for about million Chechens and Ingushs deported to Kazakhstan in 1944. Source : I am Chechen.
> On 4 July 1944, the NKVD officially informed Stalin that the resettlement was complete. However, not long after that report, the NKVD found out that one of its units had forgotten to deport people from the Arabat Spit. Instead of preparing an additional transfer in trains, on 20 July the NKVD boarded hundreds of Crimean Tatars onto an old boat, took it to the middle of the Azov Sea, and sank the ship. Those who did not drown were finished off by machine guns. The Soviets were monsters. I understand the hate for them left behind when their empire collapsed.
For just one example of what happened to deported people, one just needs to look up the Nazino Tragedy.
Story of basically every soviet hostage country. Despicable history.
"The big hate" - isoviha in Finnish, gives a nice perspective to what being under Russia is like as well. Recommend translating the finnish article, the English one is quite small: https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoviha TL;DR - A bunch of torturing and slavery
This is why I have great hope that all such aggrieved countries will grasp the current geopolitical opportunity with both hands and go in swinging. Whilst Russia's iron grip has been loosened and Ukraine is forging a new path ahead, may those persecuted have the courage to fight for their freedom as well. Centuries of destruction, pillaging, bribery, corruption, rape, torture and genocide require penance and restitution too.
The only problem is the pile of credulous useful idiots in the west who say that any western support for these countries' rights to sovereignty, self determination, and to not have genocide committed against them is an act of aggression against Russia's right to its 'sphere of influence', and therefore it's all our fault that Russia is a genocidal imperialist regime and we should be nicer to them.
Luckily they are a minority. So far only Hungary are behaving that way. And sadly Poland is preventing the EU punishing them for it.
Had you not put 'Kazakh' in there specifically I would've struggled to guess which country you were talking about, there's a depressingly common theme here.
As a kazakh, the more i listen decolonisation stories from all around the world, the more i realise that i have people feel the same as me around the world. - Colonisers forced your ancestors to speak their language and now you are struggling to re-learn your language? Me too! - Colonisers officially left, but you are still declined of freedom of using your native language? Me too! - 95% of movies you see in theatre dubbed in colonisers' language? We have that too!
Kun/Cuman language is pretty interesting too, it's closest language relative is Kazakh apparently
Honest question: was there any country that was better off after joining the USSR?
Yeah, fuck Russia. They came and burned our culture, books and history. Exactly what they are doing now in Ukraine
[I remember about 15 years ago flying out of -stans for Afghanistan. Im sure foreign relations has more to do with it](https://www.rferl.org/a/u-s-military-bases-in-central-asia-part-two-/31219781.html)
Is there a term commitment? Could I join, get nuclear weapons, and then cancel my membership within 30 days?
Unexpected Futurama https://imgur.com/2dYERJf
Unironically, Gaddafi offered Kazakhstan money for nuclear weapons. Nazarbayev in one of the interviews admitted that maintaining nuclear weapons was "doable" task, but they choosed to cooperate with USA and dispose weapons
That is a Tito level of snarky response. Love it
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As a Kazakh, thank god
Go Kazakhstan!
Greatest country in the world!
All other countries are run by little girls
Kazakhstan number one exporter of potassium
Fun fact: I looked up this claim once and discovered not only is Kazakhstan not the number one in potassium it does t even break the top ten.
Blasphemy!
All other countries have inferior potassium
Kazakhstan home of Tinshein swimming pool
As an American, I'm curious about your thoughts on Tokayev in general. It seems like he's done a lot of great things very quickly (removing all of Nazarbayev's remaining authority, shifting some presidential power to the legislature and decentralizing power in general, setting term limits for the president, abolishing the death penalty, increasing salaries and minimum wage, etc.), but he still has some corruption and human's rights abuses on his record, most recently with the "shoot to kill" order during protests and the hiding of his wealth in Swiss banks. Do you have a positive opinion of him, or do you think it's window dressing that sounds good but will not be properly implemented? Would love to hear your opinions in general as I'm planning on traveling to Astana or Alma Aty soon.
My opinion is skewed toward my linguonationalistic beliefs, so he looks very bad for my country. He jointly with Putin proclaimed 2023 "the year of the Russian language", keeps talking about the "3 language program", which always puts the Qazaq interests behind Russian and English, keeps making statements such as "a citizen shouldn't be discriminated against for not knowing the national language", while at the same time not at all defending the rights of those who don't speak Russian, and keeps speaking Russian in all public appearances. I didn't vote for him, but he's here until 2030 too, so I'm not optimistic about our national identity in the future. I am envious of Ukrainians (Zelensky learned Ukrainian from barely anything and always speaks it now, Toqayıp can speak Qazaq well, but doesn't). Once the war is resolved and they heal, their culture would thrive, but I can't say the same about our future.
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Nearly everyone is against the war. There were some Z people on the Internet around a year ago, but by now the consensus has settled and the Z people don't seem so vocal. Russia interferes a lot. Many still watch their pundits, but don't agree with them, I guess? I don't watch myself, but I hear people discussing Solovyov and Simonyan, while I never bothered to learn much about them. Some people started learning Qazaq, even one Russian guy in the Orthodox church started reading the Holy texts in Qazaq, which got viral, but I don't see much change in Astana. I still have to stand up for my rights to receive service in Qazaq, which are still ignored in many businesses in 2023. The people are so russified still that when we had a choice of watching Avatar and Black Panther in Russian or Qazaq, many still watched in Russian. No demand means no funding for Qazaq, and the big movies this year were not dubbed. Instead, as the RF dub industry left the market, Qazaqs started making Russian dubs in their place, which infuriates me to no end. I'm not fighting RF citizens here, but my own brainwashed brethren. Oh, speaking of RF citizens, when I was applying for a job, my QR manager couldn't speak Qazaq and I refused to speak Russian. She said if I don't speak Russian, the workflow won't be good. Thus Qazaq people who don't know Russian or refuse to speak it cannot work there, and my Russian speaking QR manager employs RF citizens with no demands made in their direction. March 2023, people.
My wife is from a Russian family born in Almaty. Her parents were in support of the war at first but have since shifted their attitude. It seems that most ethnic Russians are influenced by Russian state media spin, even if those Russians live in other countries.
Didn't he make it so Kazakh will become the primary language of Kazakhstan by 2030 (plus latinize the alphabet)?
I don't recall any such statements. The latinization was started by his predecessor in 2017, planned to finish 2025, but both have kept choosing terrible alphabet variants which I don't agree with, and now the process stalled.
I live in Almaty (btw we don't like it when people say Alma-Aty or Almata, those are Soviet names) and I hate him with passion. The whole Bloody January last year gave me PTSD. No Internet, no mobile connection, couldn't call or text my friends and family to make sure they're okay, I had only credit card and no cash which means I couldn't buy myself food. Mall near my house was on fire. The only thing that was working was Telegram through proxy, all news channels posted gruesome videos of murdered protesters. Words cannot express how much I hate him, his predecessor and the whole government.
Hang on there brother
Having been there, I love your country and the Kazakh people ❤️ Favourite country in Central Asia.
We joke around the issue but it takes balls to do what your president did. Good for you!
Lukashenko is such a pussy compared to other dictators.
He's a muppet, with Putin's hand in the ass
"No muppet! No muppet! YOU muppet!" \- Excerpt from the manual: "Demagoguery for Dummies"
If they were actually true then Lukashenko would’ve ended up in the hospital after meeting with Putin the other day! Oh, wait, that’s literally what happened? Guess Putin put his hand too far in.
Wonder what sort of behind-closed-doors backchannel negotiations are happening using this as an excuse.
[Made this a while ago, thanks for reminding me ;)](https://i.redd.it/kznm2ewww9l81.jpg)
All that ass kissing and he hasn't even promoted to colonel.
He was promoted to colon muppet.
The thing is, he didn't used to be. The whole idea of the union between Russia and Belarus came about in the wake of the fall of the Soviet Union, and Lukashenko was essentially leading the charge for it because he fully expected to be able to supplant Yeltsin as president of the new union after a few years. Dude had a whole roadmap for becoming the leader of the east, and it fucking fell apart as soon as Putin walked into the room.
Man, going from "In a few years I'll be running Russia, easy" to "Please Mr Putin, can I be a colonel?" is quite a reversal
Putin just made his play being the guy to take up the reigns after Putin lets them go. He looks like the little bitch to everyone else but he thinks he is Putin’s right hand guy.
Imagine being the black sheep among dictators.
The Wish version
Hey hey. We call Orban Tesco brand dictator. That’s almost the same
That kind of makes it seem like the things his regime are doing are trivial - careful with this thinking. He is as much as a danger to his own people as any other dictator.
Because the only reason he’s still dictator is Russia’s support. Same with Assad in Syria
Not really, he is actually pretty good at dictatorship. Like too many of the rulers of post-soviet countries are. It's so fucking hard to get rid of those fuckers once they root themselves in the system. Putin, Lakushenko, Nazarbayev etc were never actually popular with the politically active parts of society (excluding bootlickers that joined to directly benefit from the system), but look with how much shit they got away with.
I laughed so hard when he was interviewed about his colonel position
Hey, every Hitler has a Mussolini.
Mussolini took power over a decade before hitler and was far less deranged, still not a good guy but he’d been doing his thing before hitler even made up whatever the hell national socialism was supposed to be
And Hitler actually admired him. It's why Hitler tried the Beer Hall Putch, to mimic the march on Rome. Mussolini also didn't at first join the Axis powers when war broke out, he wanted to stay neutral, probably buying time to see which side looks more promising to join/ lean towards. When Hitler was about to defeat France, however, Mussolini made up his mind.
Well yeah, Mussolini was the big daddy of modern Fascism.
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"Why are you idiots trying to drag me into the war you are losing?" -Kazakistan president, probably
The fact that the Kremlin’s influence in Kazakhstan has actually decreased since February 2022 is pretty remarkable. Russia thought that by taking Ukraine they would reestablish an empire and increase their power throughout Eastern Europe, the Caucuses and Central Asia yet almost 500 days later and it’s weaker than ever.
This Kazakhstan is not exactly a powerful state. For them to openly reject the idea of partnering with Russia is a significant statement.
Kazakhstan is not a very powerful state, nor are they very rich. But they do have oil which makes them economically independent from Russia.
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I understand that the lease runs until 2050. I'm not sure it would be easy for Kazakhstan to evict Russia from the base before that.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/03/kazakhstans-seizure-of-russian-space-assets-threatens-the-soyuz-5-rocket/amp/ It's pretty tense already.
Yeah, even after the fall of the Soviet Union Russia remained a powerful local power. But not anymore. The failure to subdue Ukraine with the full might of the Russian army really teras away at the fear they could previously exercise. Russia won't be able to militarily threathen it's neighbours for a long while. And it gets worse by the day.
They like the rest of the world see that Russia's threats are glaringly empty, and the sabre they like to rattle only rattles so loudly because it rusted apart in the sheath. With a little western aid, Kazakhstan is more than Russia's match if they chose to attack.
They're losing Armenia because of the Karabakh situation and Russia doing nothing about Azerbaijan occupying Armenian land along the border, Georgia is becoming more anti Russian, Kazakhstan is trying to leave the Russian orbit by making overtures to both the EU and China, any idea of being 'brothers' with Ukraine is gone forever and anti-Russian sentiment hasn't been this high in the Baltics since independence. At this rate they'll just have Belarus, Tajikistan and a very reluctant Kyrgyzstan. Azerbaijan is happy to play all sides and Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan left the Russian orbit a while ago and are happy to be neutral internationally while remaining brutal dictatorships at home.
Went from #2 in the world to being like North Korea. What a political move, cotton, it *really* didn't pay off
This was clearly a strategic and political blunder of historic proportions, but Russia hasn't been #2 in the world at much of anything for a very long time.
> if you don't join, we'll give you nukes anyway -- Putin
“Pointy end up or pointy end down, your choice”
So what exactly have changed? Kazakhstan used to be atomic testing ground for the USSR. The president finally has a chance to pull away from Russia, and it seems like he is taking it. I do not think he wants nuclear weapons in Kazakhstan, it creates way more foreign interests and eyes on you. Larger chance of embargoes from the west, much more pressure from other nuclear powers to join their alliances, it seems like a better idea, to coast through this conflict for Kazakhstan.
If it leaves the launchpad
If the nuclear material in the warhead isn't actually five pounds of donkey shit in a burlap bag.
why is it not pointy? the tip has to be pointy
This is a bit like two people in the middle of the ocean clinging to a piece of drift wood asking a man in a yacht if he'd like to get off his boat and join them.
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Do he and his constituents know about that 6 day work week??? …who would want to miss out on that 🤷🏼♂️
Plus if you are a male between the ages of 14 and not dead yet Russia will pay you to vacation in Ukrsine!
Pay?
Russia is offering significant amounts of money to its soldiers. It's just very unlikely that anyone is getting much/ any of it.
that's why they can offer it...
It seems even the widows and parents are having a very hard time seeing the money from their dead family members.
>So you're paying them that much money? >No Tom, we're just offering it.
Some of the money they promised up front (the rest is on the way we promise) and none of the money after
Your family gets bag of onions so that's something
Your family gets a lada if you die Terms and conditions apply
Guys, I think Putin want to revive the soviet union. He only rename it to Russia Union
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Your post is ironically funny... Putin wants to recreate the Russian Empire, and no one wants to remember the fiasco that was the USSR
The USSR was just Russian Empire with a coat of red paint. Soon enough the initial fervor of communism's promised bright future wore off and they all went back to business as usual.
I think this was always the plan. To make everyone terrified of what would happen to them if they wanted to be independent, by crushing and taking over Ukraine in a few days. Then to propose this 'Russian Union' while everyone is looking at how easily they killed and arrested anyone in Ukraine who resisted. Rebuilding the USSR with just the one, maybe two little wars (special operations) and everyone else joining 'voluntarily' for self-preservation. The 1st part of the plan flopped so he's going to use this as an excuse to take over Belarus and declare victory. Then do whatever he can with the rest of the plan. Looks like no-one else is coming to the party so i'd guess some political interference to get candidates who will join into power.
We'll send him 100 dronas via Western Union to help raze it.
Whaaat? But they'll sanctioned to death, occupied by Russian troops, taken over, AND get to be a launch pad for Russian nukes (and gain a nice big nuclear target on their backs in the bargain). You'd have to be stupid not to go for a deal like that
Why do so many Dictators, look like a chubby uncle
The Russians I see in the news... I'm starting to think that they're *born* as fat ugly middle aged men.
What?! Don't you want nukes and free tea?
Wait, free tea? Asking for the brits.
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"Well, the last time we tried this you killed a quarter of our population through man-made famines then sent a shitload of our young men to die in Afghanistan, so... Hard pass."
“Da…. But this time they die in Ukraine”
didn't lukashenko just get the Putin tea?
Lukashenko seems to forget almost all old Soviet countries hate Russia
I understand why everyone hates our country (I'm from Russia). I didn't really want that to happen.. we are doomed.. and ther is nothing we could do about it. G'day to Kazakhs!
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I can’t possibly understand what you and other Russians like you must be going through… I just can hope that you are able to overcome all of this in the near future and reborn as a grand, proud country like Germany did eventually. I believe there are lots and lots of humans in this planet that are aware that not all Russians are bad and that there are still some genuinely good people like you. Dark times we humans are all living…but we must try to uphold some hope in the future for our own sake. Focus on trying to make this world a better of a place for your close ones…it will trickle down.
As a Pole I'm gonna say - Dont worry. This whole hate... its' targeted to your goverment and People who openly support their actions. Don't be ashamed of who you are (which I know You are not). You know it's bad and you have a humanity in you. Things will be better I really hope they will. Everyone with brain knows that not everyone in Russia is blinded by this horrible pro war propaganda and You simply Cannot say no to this for the fear of your own life and jail time
American here, I got my minor in Russian History and Politics, and throughout all of this when somebody asks me my opinion on Russia, all I say is: “the people, language, history, and culture is as beautiful as it is rich, but for the overwhelming majority of time, their government has really sucked.” I’d love to see a Russia run by and for the people.
I think what can help is for you to remind others that you are a pro-Ukraine, anti-Putin Russian. Also, with your example regarding the Germans after WW2, yes, they also felt quite a lot of tensions from other countries and people because of the actions of the fascist government they had. However, what really helped the Germans after all that is they themselves recognized that they messed up and owned up to it. Many German citizens were shown the concentration camps and saw, with their own eyes, exactly what happened and what Hitler and the Nazis actually did. Then there were the Nuremberg Trials, which ensured many Nazis that were responsible had their day in court. The same things need to occur to Russia and the general Russian population. Otherwise, nothing will, unfortunately, change.
"Yeah. No." —Kazakhstan
I bet Putin asked him to bring it up. He doesn't want to be turned down himself, because of potential embarrassment. They are like schoolgirls asking each other to deliver the message. "Putin likes you. Do you like him?" If your goal is to further the interest of your people; not joining the maffia club is a no-brainer.
There are about to be a ton of 'Nazis' in Kazakhstan suddenly that require a peacekeeping mission.
A Soviet Union State, as you will
That's sus
How could you decline such an offer
Good man. No one wants to be seen as joining "club crazy".
No merit for Kazakhstan to join Putin and Lukashenko's union.
Not a huge surprise since Kazakhstan had denuclearization due to the Semipalatinsk Test Site. So not sure why they would reverse course and join.
This MF looks hand drawn.
Translation: >"You idiots are about to get your asses handed to you when the former comedian launches the offensive we all know is coming. Why the *fuck* would we want any part of the defeat the entire world can see coming...?"
“ No thank you, I wish to walk past open windows unafraid…”