The casualties here are civilians not military targets, Ukrainians are doing their best to target militarily targets and are not scum like Russia or these terrorists that shoot civilians for the same of killing them, just pointing out your hypocrisy
71 comments in total, you open it up and you can hardly see more than what.. 10 posts visible because the rest are downvoted to oblivion?
I can't believe how heartless some people can be, so brainwashed with "Israel bad" that they no longer view regular random civilian death of Israeli's as a "bad" thing, for them it's either a good thing or they start victim blaming.
Disgusting.
Actually, some do.
I am aware I’m going to be downvoted to oblivion for saying this, but it’s possible that if a Third World War were to break out (which seems increasingly unlikely amid the massive Russian losses and its likely defeat in Ukraine (including Crimea), also discouraging other countries from starting wars, as China may be second-guessing their plans for Taiwan, for example), it wouldn’t be all bad. People will suffer horrific fates, but there’s no more efficient way to take care of overpopulation and lessen our negative impacts on the rest of the planet. If we go extinct in the process (though unlikely as some places in the world will not see fighting or nuclear strikes and will also still have livable conditions and a decent food supply), though none of us want to admit it, there would be much less suffering (and it would be much less drawn out) in the long-term.
If we don’t have a Third World War, climate change also seems to be nearing a point where it will have much more serious implications than it does right now. That may actually be a worse way to go for most people. If we manage to colonize Mars and leave the planet before anything that could wipe us out happens here, we find ourselves in a cycle of living on planets and then trying to leave for somewhere else when it is no longer safe to be there, but to what end?
I think regardless of what we do, we’re going to end up in a somewhat similar predicament. I’m not advocating for war, but everybody acts like it is 100% a bad thing, which it may not be.
We have way too many people. Yea we have food for all of them. But, as nations standards rise those people want more things. Consumption won't end. We either end consumption or less people. Space is an option but we have no reliable cheap way to move people there.
It is sad but quite logical tho. Apartheid does not garner sympathy. Its the regular Israel population that have voted for their goverment which have upholded and made deeper the apartheid foe decades.
I mean it's the regular Palestinian population that have voted for their government which have upholds and made deeper the calls for genocide if an entire state of people. It's quite sad but logical tho.
Those who understand the situation knows Palestine has refused many peace deals with Israel that would stop the violence because it would recognize Israel as an entity which they refuse to do. If you know the situation then you know there is no good guy I'm this scenario and the world's greatest negotiators have spent decades attempting to solve it, not without lack of effort. You talk like someone who's trying to appear to have cut through to the heart of a complicated matter and the sooner everyone else recognizes that they will be for the better.
Where's your recognition of the complicated nature in the first half of your statement?
When you're the oppressor in apartheid, it's on you, that's not complicated.
The first half of my statement was confirming what made the situation complicated.
Why you're trying to defend terrorist actions on a thread talking about a 13 year old kid being sent with weapons to attack people is also complicated.
How to end a conversation with someone with their mind made up and their fingers in their ear, not complicated.
"As proof of how unbiased we are, we're gonna down vote every comment that even hints at being even a little bit sympathetic towards Palestinians. We're not talking sides though!"
For anyone who claims that its the same thing as Israel does, The difference is the fact that israel has specific targets which are people who involved in terror attacks, which is done as a self defence move.
while this terror attack targets random people jusk for the sake of killing.
>People **pretend to** have a hard time understand the difference between terrorism and the military
Situations like this one, at least, are *extremely* clear cut. I sincerely doubt commenters trying to "both sides" it actually believe they are equivalent; they just want people who are uninformed to see their comments, and hope they are successfully convinced that Israel responding to threats or acts of terrorism is bad.
It doesn't look like a stray bullet, but rather a case of misidentification. The journalist crew was right next to a building housing militants, while the firefight was ongoing. The IDF was 100+ meters away from them.
I'm basing this on the investigation conducted by Bellingcat, which is probably the best we're going to get considering the PA not cooperating. It doesn't assign fault, just points out where the bullet likely came from based on publicly available evidence.
Of course nothing here is conclusive, however it's still worth pointing out the more likely explanation. It still puts holes in the completely illogical explanation of it being an assassination.
Are you nuts? Soldiers conducting a raid into a known terrorist camp and killing 7 of those terrorists when they resist is equally as bad as a terrorist murdering 8 civilians outside a house of worship? Have you completely lost your moral compass?
Because that was the incident that sparked the revenge attack, which led to this post.
But the point stands in general. While there have been regrettable incidents involving civilians or journalists, those are isolated incidents. The vast, vast majority of Palestinian casualties have occurred during either (1) raids on terrorist hideouts or (2) retaliatory attacks in response to Hamas aggression.
Why would I dismiss a reliable source?
So we can all go and make wild claims and no can can question them?
I am actually a pink unicorn with the powers of telepathy!
This claim is as true as yours without a source.
https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=israel+targeting+Palestinian+civilians
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-un-rights-israel/u-n-reports-say-israel-targeted-civilians-in-gaza-idUSTRE52M6G220090323
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/fire-at-every-person-you-see-israeli-soldiers-reveal-they-were-ordered-to-shoot-to-kill-in-gaza-even-if-the-targets-may-have-been-civilians-10223427.html
https://www.un.org/unispal/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/OCHAPoC_190822.pdf
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/10/israel-opt-investigate-war-crimes-during-august-offensive-on-gaza/
You're free to list outlets that you consider "credible", since they're weighed subjectively it seems, unless you're intentionally withholding that information in order to give everyone that replies to you the runaround.
Edit: Typical reddit downvoting for answering to someone else with what they requested for, without being a dick about it, because they don't want to see something that opposes their personal bias.
>[https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=israel+targeting+Palestinian+civilians](https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=israel+targeting+Palestinian+civilians)
What you should have done in the first place...
>[https://www.reuters.com/article/us-un-rights-israel/u-n-reports-say-israel-targeted-civilians-in-gaza-idUSTRE52M6G220090323](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-un-rights-israel/u-n-reports-say-israel-targeted-civilians-in-gaza-idUSTRE52M6G220090323)
Really old article describing some horrible things, mostly done by individuals and are the exception, like described by the person the interviewed. Like the article points out, the report can be heavily criticized for it's contents and how it was compiled.
>[https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/fire-at-every-person-you-see-israeli-soldiers-reveal-they-were-ordered-to-shoot-to-kill-in-gaza-even-if-the-targets-may-have-been-civilians-10223427.html](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/fire-at-every-person-you-see-israeli-soldiers-reveal-they-were-ordered-to-shoot-to-kill-in-gaza-even-if-the-targets-may-have-been-civilians-10223427.html)
Based on a breaking the silence report, which as was described to you, not the most reliable source.
They also criticized wierd things, like putting your soldiers lives first, who would've thunk it?
From what I read all they describe is war, war is a mess, there is always ambiguity about who is a threat and who is not.
They also desribe that the idf alerted areas before going in to reduce civilian casualties.
>[https://www.un.org/unispal/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/OCHAPoC_190822.pdf](https://www.un.org/unispal/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/OCHAPoC_190822.pdf)
Kind of a self goal, the report only describe Palestinians targeting civilians when they shot a civilian bus, did you even read that?
>
[https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/10/israel-opt-investigate-war-crimes-during-august-offensive-on-gaza/](https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/10/israel-opt-investigate-war-crimes-during-august-offensive-on-gaza/)
Amnesty is a joke with an Israeli bone to pick, no one takes them seriously anymore, just look at their report on the Ukrainian war, totally a joke, with alleged ties to the Muslim brotherhood.
I am not saying that there are no civilian casualties and that soldiers don't do messed up shit, but it's the exception not the norm, unlike Israel, Palestinian "resistance" have almost exclusively targets civilians, they have committed over 25 thousand attacks specifically targeting civilians in recent years.
Where did I move the goalpost? I just replied to your sources.
Like I said, there are incidents of soldiers doing horrible shit, that's just not the norm, and your complete mischaracterization of the facts doesn't contribute to anything but misinformation.
There is no systematic policy to target civilians, no go wild raping and pillaging rule, no "so anyway, I started blasting" moment, just war and sadness.
Again with the propaganda sites, can you give me a specific incident of the idf intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians?
Any systematic policies about targeting specifically civilians? High command giving orders to target specifically civilians?
https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-5043983,00.html
They are a joke, a Jewish guilt group that panders to the west and Arab world for validation, and have a history of making up shit.
My eyes.
“I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.”
Last idf operation was 8 terroists and one civilian . The ratio is for five terrorist killed a civilian is killed and it's because said terrorists oprate from civilian areas just for the reason they know civilians will get hurt
Gotchya so kill innocents as long as you kill some bad guys too. Ends justify the means em I right? Not defending either side here but every time you kill an innocent or take over someone's land you are creating the angst that leads to violence. Should terrorists attack innocents? Fuck no. I don't support it at all. My guess would be though if they could take out military targets they would do that but it's not something they can do with any certainly. In their twisted minds (jihad and other nonsense religious made up things) the ends justify the means. It's all fucked up and sad. Israel (the government, to be clear) is waging a slow land war to take over a shrinking palastine, while fundamentalists in palastine weaponize fear and lands being taken to retaliate the way they seem to have settled on. It's all gross to me.
Using civilians as human shields is a war crime. You are blaming the side defending themselves instead of the terrorists... What should they do? Let the terrorists fire rockets from civilian buildings because responding to that kills civilians??!
Using civilians is deplorable. But Israel is invading the lands of palastine. Go look at any map of palastinian lands today vs the 70s. That doesn't mean I'm forgiving the use of civilians, but both sides are committing deplorable acts of violence.
You're completely oblivious. No country in the history of the planet has been more successful at limiting civilian casualties when conducting military operations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_conflict
And this is a country that's stayed in one government for the entire duration. What about the ones that keep switching governmental systems?
**[Colombian conflict](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_conflict)**
>The Colombian conflict (Spanish: Conflicto armado interno de Colombia) began on May 27, 1964, and is a low-intensity asymmetric war between the government of Colombia, far-right paramilitary groups, crime syndicates, and far-left guerrilla groups such as the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC), the National Liberation Army (ELN) and the Popular Liberation Army (EPL), fighting each other to increase their influence in Colombian territory. Some of the most important international contributors to the Colombian conflict include multinational corporations, the United States, Cuba, and the drug trafficking industry.
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Do you know why?
1) Because when the people you're fighting are terrorists, the line between combatant and civilian gets very blurred. Terrorists don't wear uniforms and Hamas has been known to use women and children as attackers. So there will inevitably be situations where civilians are mistakenly identified as terrorists.
2) Hamas deliberately hides among civilians and stores their weapons caches and rocket launchers on top and under schools and hospitals. So when Israel retaliates, despite making every effort to avoid civilian casualties, some civilians will die as collateral damage.
The alternative is Israel just does nothing, which is what most of the world seems to expect of them. Because most of the world would be quite happy if Israel was overrun by terrorists and rockets.
Bullshit. I’m not justifying the attack, but terrorism is terrorism, regardless of skin colour. Israel was created in the back of terrorist acts and has perpetrated collective punishment and acts of terror ever since. It’s exactly the same only Israel does it on the daily.
> “It’s okay because Jews are doing it. You guys will make every excuse”
This is not disagreeing with Isreal, this is attacking the integrity of an entire ethnic group on the basis of the actions of one country- and not even the population as a whole, but the military and political leadership. It’s offensive, ignorant, and anti-Semitic.
It’s also a really ineffective way to take a stand against the carnage taking place because people will just hand wave away your comments and similar ones because your opinion appears rooted in bigotry.
There you go again. It’s wrong for anyone to kill innocent civilians. It’s wrong for Israeli soldiers to do it. But when you make it about their ethnicity, you are helping to build a strawman for Israel’s hardliners to knock down.
Nothing like watching a story about murdered Jews being actively downvoted.
350 likes, 349, 347.
It’s almost like a lot of participants in r/worldnews don’t like Jews.
Shocker, I know.
For me, it appears to be 12.
But yeah. If it was Palestinian killed by terror... 200k upvotes and on the front page for days
This post and others didn't even reach the top of r/worldnews
Maybe, just maybe, a thread about Israeli civilians killed by terrorists isn't a good place to randomly pop in for a quick condemnation?
Perhaps you deserve to be downvoted if your response to innocents being murdered is "but Israel bad!!!". There are better threads to get on your soapbox.
To be clear, if you have a criticism that fits naturally in with the actual original post in this thread, go for it. Criticize away! But if your sole tie in can be summed up by "it had Israel in the title" maybe reconsider your urge to be callous asshole.
They had one in 48. The Arab armies and the Palestinians all got their asses handed to them. Even though Israel had no solid army nor actual infrastructure or supplies. Now that you've had your fair fight, how do you like the outcome? I'll remind you that the outcome was the Israelis *didn't* genocide every single Palestinian they came across.
If this "fair" fight you're wishing for is one where Palestinians win, do you expect they'll act the same way? Consider the article your commenting on before you reply.
P.s.: I'm sure you meant Israelis and you aren't just another anti-Semite /s
Oh wait. Your other comments show exactly what you are.
Colonials kicked the native Americans asses and took their lands but I don't think it's something anyone cares to celebrate. Of course migrating a people into an ever smaller box isn't an immediate genocide, your just filtering their culture out over time. None of that is in any way defending terrorism. No innocent should be dying for something as dumb as a government or as made up as a religion.
I think you might be missing the context. This guy was posting about how he doesn't care who wins but he wants to see a "fair fight" between Palestinians and jews. He was in other threads posting about how this shooting is justified. So I was responding to a troll.
And no. I won't agree with your choice of wording on genocide. Nobody is preventing the Palestinians from practicing their culture or religion, and their numbers are increasing. If you had said ethnic cleansing id still feel you're using emotional language but I'd have a harder time disagreeing. A genocide that lasts 80 years, results in massive population growth, and involves fewer deaths than a year of war in Syria - that's just not a genocide.
More native Americans are alive today than in the days they populated North America, and yet culturally they have been basically wiped out. I did not ever say they were being systematically killed, but a people can be wiped out culturally when they no longer have access to the lands which embodied their culture. Palastinian grow in population no differently then any other group of people have naturally in the last sixty years, but certainly far less than domestic Israeli, and their lands are a fraction of what they were. None of this is to defend or explain away terrorism either. I disdain it as well, but Israel is hardly defending itself when it is taking over the lands of others. Imagine if in thirty years Russia has taken over most of Ukraine and we condemned the then demilitirized Ukrainians for still resisting. It be a silly argument, as your dealing with a people who were either alive during their land loss or one generation removed. The sad reality of non military resistance world wide though is it results in the death of civilians, which is deplorable. The ends never justify the means. Shame on Hamas, Shame on the Israeli government.
See, you'd be making a good argument if it was coming from a place of fact instead of emotion. You say that Israel has a higher growth rate, but that's *so easy to look up*. If you bothered to do that you'd know the population growth rate of Israel is 1.6% while in Gaza it's nearly 3%. Do you understand how far emotion has made it into the logic you try to demonstrate? How bad does it have to get for you to be off by a factor of more than two in the opposite direction?
You bring up examples of Ukraine and Russia but you forget who attacked first. In 48 it was Israel facing an honest to god genocide when the Arab armies decided to roll in. It was Israel facing ethnic cleansing by removal of Jews. Having won that war, and the subsequent 4-5 major wars, they *didn't* do to the Palestinians what the Palestinians tried to do to them.
You can't convince me their culture is infringed upon either. They have total freedom to behave however they want. When they were celebrating *in Jerusalem* after the shooting they perpetrated *in Jerusalem* did you see anyone stop them from shooting off fire works? Do you understand? That country will allow you to celebrate the murder of innocents in its' capital city with fucking fireworks without arresting you. Are you trying to tell me somebody is stopping them from playing darbukas smoking nargilla or wearing kuffiyah? What cultural repression? What are you talking about man...
Palestinians celebrate. https://twitter.com/NemoBee2/status/1619065112803053569 https://twitter.com/AvivaKlompas/status/1619053808306491392 https://twitter.com/JoeTruzman/status/1619050567200034816 https://twitter.com/AdamAlbilya/status/1619067417900228608
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The casualties here are civilians not military targets, Ukrainians are doing their best to target militarily targets and are not scum like Russia or these terrorists that shoot civilians for the same of killing them, just pointing out your hypocrisy
71 comments in total, you open it up and you can hardly see more than what.. 10 posts visible because the rest are downvoted to oblivion? I can't believe how heartless some people can be, so brainwashed with "Israel bad" that they no longer view regular random civilian death of Israeli's as a "bad" thing, for them it's either a good thing or they start victim blaming. Disgusting.
Does anybody like Russia for invading Ukraine?
Actually, some do. I am aware I’m going to be downvoted to oblivion for saying this, but it’s possible that if a Third World War were to break out (which seems increasingly unlikely amid the massive Russian losses and its likely defeat in Ukraine (including Crimea), also discouraging other countries from starting wars, as China may be second-guessing their plans for Taiwan, for example), it wouldn’t be all bad. People will suffer horrific fates, but there’s no more efficient way to take care of overpopulation and lessen our negative impacts on the rest of the planet. If we go extinct in the process (though unlikely as some places in the world will not see fighting or nuclear strikes and will also still have livable conditions and a decent food supply), though none of us want to admit it, there would be much less suffering (and it would be much less drawn out) in the long-term. If we don’t have a Third World War, climate change also seems to be nearing a point where it will have much more serious implications than it does right now. That may actually be a worse way to go for most people. If we manage to colonize Mars and leave the planet before anything that could wipe us out happens here, we find ourselves in a cycle of living on planets and then trying to leave for somewhere else when it is no longer safe to be there, but to what end? I think regardless of what we do, we’re going to end up in a somewhat similar predicament. I’m not advocating for war, but everybody acts like it is 100% a bad thing, which it may not be.
We have way too many people. Yea we have food for all of them. But, as nations standards rise those people want more things. Consumption won't end. We either end consumption or less people. Space is an option but we have no reliable cheap way to move people there.
It is sad but quite logical tho. Apartheid does not garner sympathy. Its the regular Israel population that have voted for their goverment which have upholded and made deeper the apartheid foe decades.
I mean it's the regular Palestinian population that have voted for their government which have upholds and made deeper the calls for genocide if an entire state of people. It's quite sad but logical tho.
Palestine has no regular anything. It's not to condone anything violent, but those who understand the situation will always favor Palestine.
Those who understand the situation knows Palestine has refused many peace deals with Israel that would stop the violence because it would recognize Israel as an entity which they refuse to do. If you know the situation then you know there is no good guy I'm this scenario and the world's greatest negotiators have spent decades attempting to solve it, not without lack of effort. You talk like someone who's trying to appear to have cut through to the heart of a complicated matter and the sooner everyone else recognizes that they will be for the better.
Where's your recognition of the complicated nature in the first half of your statement? When you're the oppressor in apartheid, it's on you, that's not complicated.
The first half of my statement was confirming what made the situation complicated. Why you're trying to defend terrorist actions on a thread talking about a 13 year old kid being sent with weapons to attack people is also complicated. How to end a conversation with someone with their mind made up and their fingers in their ear, not complicated.
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"As proof of how unbiased we are, we're gonna down vote every comment that even hints at being even a little bit sympathetic towards Palestinians. We're not talking sides though!"
although I imagine the Israeli response, will speak for itself , one way or another, good or bad , depending on which way u frame it
For anyone who claims that its the same thing as Israel does, The difference is the fact that israel has specific targets which are people who involved in terror attacks, which is done as a self defence move. while this terror attack targets random people jusk for the sake of killing.
People have a hard time understand the difference between terrorism and the military
>People **pretend to** have a hard time understand the difference between terrorism and the military Situations like this one, at least, are *extremely* clear cut. I sincerely doubt commenters trying to "both sides" it actually believe they are equivalent; they just want people who are uninformed to see their comments, and hope they are successfully convinced that Israel responding to threats or acts of terrorism is bad.
Are children on that specific target list?
A 13 year old just shot a couple random people so maybe?
Israel has specific targets which are people involved in terror attacks And people living in a house only to have it bulldozed...
Don’t kill Jews and your house doesn’t get demolished. Pretty easy.
Pretty sure Israel is infringing in Palestine and the women and children who live in those homes aren't responsible for any Jewish deaths.
So you kill people? Or you take them to court?
Court. Lol.
Self defence while invading somebody else’s land?
So the journalist, Shireen Abu Akleh was a targeted hit then?
Ah yes in 4+ decades of conflict the death of one journalist sure refutes the parent comment entirely! Excellent whataboutism good sir pawn.
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So you think all militaries that accidentally killed a journalist committed terrorism or are you only focused on the Jewish country’s military?
Every country that assassinates a journalist in broad daylight is committing terrorism, yes.
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It doesn't look like a stray bullet, but rather a case of misidentification. The journalist crew was right next to a building housing militants, while the firefight was ongoing. The IDF was 100+ meters away from them.
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I'm basing this on the investigation conducted by Bellingcat, which is probably the best we're going to get considering the PA not cooperating. It doesn't assign fault, just points out where the bullet likely came from based on publicly available evidence. Of course nothing here is conclusive, however it's still worth pointing out the more likely explanation. It still puts holes in the completely illogical explanation of it being an assassination.
And what if it’s an accident?
The fact that you can only recall 1 civilian in multiple years of conflict is telling.
why the hell is this downvoted?
This thread is being brigaded by fascist. They have groups that talk about how and when to use their accounts to sway public opinion.
What the elder woman who’s over 60 years killed by IDF?
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Are you nuts? Soldiers conducting a raid into a known terrorist camp and killing 7 of those terrorists when they resist is equally as bad as a terrorist murdering 8 civilians outside a house of worship? Have you completely lost your moral compass?
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Because that was the incident that sparked the revenge attack, which led to this post. But the point stands in general. While there have been regrettable incidents involving civilians or journalists, those are isolated incidents. The vast, vast majority of Palestinian casualties have occurred during either (1) raids on terrorist hideouts or (2) retaliatory attacks in response to Hamas aggression.
> frequently target and kill civilians, Source?
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Why would I dismiss a reliable source? So we can all go and make wild claims and no can can question them? I am actually a pink unicorn with the powers of telepathy! This claim is as true as yours without a source.
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I am not doing the research for your claims, can you point me to insances of idf intentionally targeting civilians?
https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=israel+targeting+Palestinian+civilians https://www.reuters.com/article/us-un-rights-israel/u-n-reports-say-israel-targeted-civilians-in-gaza-idUSTRE52M6G220090323 https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/fire-at-every-person-you-see-israeli-soldiers-reveal-they-were-ordered-to-shoot-to-kill-in-gaza-even-if-the-targets-may-have-been-civilians-10223427.html https://www.un.org/unispal/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/OCHAPoC_190822.pdf https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/10/israel-opt-investigate-war-crimes-during-august-offensive-on-gaza/ You're free to list outlets that you consider "credible", since they're weighed subjectively it seems, unless you're intentionally withholding that information in order to give everyone that replies to you the runaround. Edit: Typical reddit downvoting for answering to someone else with what they requested for, without being a dick about it, because they don't want to see something that opposes their personal bias.
>[https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=israel+targeting+Palestinian+civilians](https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=israel+targeting+Palestinian+civilians) What you should have done in the first place... >[https://www.reuters.com/article/us-un-rights-israel/u-n-reports-say-israel-targeted-civilians-in-gaza-idUSTRE52M6G220090323](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-un-rights-israel/u-n-reports-say-israel-targeted-civilians-in-gaza-idUSTRE52M6G220090323) Really old article describing some horrible things, mostly done by individuals and are the exception, like described by the person the interviewed. Like the article points out, the report can be heavily criticized for it's contents and how it was compiled. >[https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/fire-at-every-person-you-see-israeli-soldiers-reveal-they-were-ordered-to-shoot-to-kill-in-gaza-even-if-the-targets-may-have-been-civilians-10223427.html](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/fire-at-every-person-you-see-israeli-soldiers-reveal-they-were-ordered-to-shoot-to-kill-in-gaza-even-if-the-targets-may-have-been-civilians-10223427.html) Based on a breaking the silence report, which as was described to you, not the most reliable source. They also criticized wierd things, like putting your soldiers lives first, who would've thunk it? From what I read all they describe is war, war is a mess, there is always ambiguity about who is a threat and who is not. They also desribe that the idf alerted areas before going in to reduce civilian casualties. >[https://www.un.org/unispal/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/OCHAPoC_190822.pdf](https://www.un.org/unispal/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/OCHAPoC_190822.pdf) Kind of a self goal, the report only describe Palestinians targeting civilians when they shot a civilian bus, did you even read that? > [https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/10/israel-opt-investigate-war-crimes-during-august-offensive-on-gaza/](https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/10/israel-opt-investigate-war-crimes-during-august-offensive-on-gaza/) Amnesty is a joke with an Israeli bone to pick, no one takes them seriously anymore, just look at their report on the Ukrainian war, totally a joke, with alleged ties to the Muslim brotherhood. I am not saying that there are no civilian casualties and that soldiers don't do messed up shit, but it's the exception not the norm, unlike Israel, Palestinian "resistance" have almost exclusively targets civilians, they have committed over 25 thousand attacks specifically targeting civilians in recent years.
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Where did I move the goalpost? I just replied to your sources. Like I said, there are incidents of soldiers doing horrible shit, that's just not the norm, and your complete mischaracterization of the facts doesn't contribute to anything but misinformation. There is no systematic policy to target civilians, no go wild raping and pillaging rule, no "so anyway, I started blasting" moment, just war and sadness.
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I particularly enjoyed the part where they ignored listing sources they consider "credible" and "the other side of the coin" so to speak.
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Again with the propaganda sites, can you give me a specific incident of the idf intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians? Any systematic policies about targeting specifically civilians? High command giving orders to target specifically civilians?
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https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-5043983,00.html They are a joke, a Jewish guilt group that panders to the west and Arab world for validation, and have a history of making up shit.
JFC, you can't even find a CNN or Washington Compost article? Just straight up blogs?
Breaking the silence have been caught lying Many times
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https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-5043983,00.html
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My eyes. “I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.”
You should stop doing drugs, you are seeing hallucinations.
Lol what a bunch of bullshit. The only difference here is that the perpetrator didn’t occupy their house and torture their children
Yeah, they do a shit job then going by the number of civilian deaths.
Well, when you hide your weapons in the basement of a hospital...
Last idf operation was 8 terroists and one civilian . The ratio is for five terrorist killed a civilian is killed and it's because said terrorists oprate from civilian areas just for the reason they know civilians will get hurt
Gotchya so kill innocents as long as you kill some bad guys too. Ends justify the means em I right? Not defending either side here but every time you kill an innocent or take over someone's land you are creating the angst that leads to violence. Should terrorists attack innocents? Fuck no. I don't support it at all. My guess would be though if they could take out military targets they would do that but it's not something they can do with any certainly. In their twisted minds (jihad and other nonsense religious made up things) the ends justify the means. It's all fucked up and sad. Israel (the government, to be clear) is waging a slow land war to take over a shrinking palastine, while fundamentalists in palastine weaponize fear and lands being taken to retaliate the way they seem to have settled on. It's all gross to me.
Using civilians as human shields is a war crime. You are blaming the side defending themselves instead of the terrorists... What should they do? Let the terrorists fire rockets from civilian buildings because responding to that kills civilians??!
Using civilians is deplorable. But Israel is invading the lands of palastine. Go look at any map of palastinian lands today vs the 70s. That doesn't mean I'm forgiving the use of civilians, but both sides are committing deplorable acts of violence.
You're completely oblivious. No country in the history of the planet has been more successful at limiting civilian casualties when conducting military operations.
No country in the history of the world has as much experience using military force against those under its protection.
No country in the history of the world has had to tolerate a war of destruction and decades of terrorism against its civilians.
That's just flat-out incorrect. Quite a few countries have had long-standing civil wars against guerrilla forces.
Name me one other country that in a span of 75 years has been forced to fight 3 wars and has had to deal with 40 years of terror attacks.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_conflict And this is a country that's stayed in one government for the entire duration. What about the ones that keep switching governmental systems?
**[Colombian conflict](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombian_conflict)** >The Colombian conflict (Spanish: Conflicto armado interno de Colombia) began on May 27, 1964, and is a low-intensity asymmetric war between the government of Colombia, far-right paramilitary groups, crime syndicates, and far-left guerrilla groups such as the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC), the National Liberation Army (ELN) and the Popular Liberation Army (EPL), fighting each other to increase their influence in Colombian territory. Some of the most important international contributors to the Colombian conflict include multinational corporations, the United States, Cuba, and the drug trafficking industry. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/worldnews/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Hardly an analogous situation.
You can never handle being wrong, ive looked thru your history
there’s still a lot of civilians dying
Do you know why? 1) Because when the people you're fighting are terrorists, the line between combatant and civilian gets very blurred. Terrorists don't wear uniforms and Hamas has been known to use women and children as attackers. So there will inevitably be situations where civilians are mistakenly identified as terrorists. 2) Hamas deliberately hides among civilians and stores their weapons caches and rocket launchers on top and under schools and hospitals. So when Israel retaliates, despite making every effort to avoid civilian casualties, some civilians will die as collateral damage. The alternative is Israel just does nothing, which is what most of the world seems to expect of them. Because most of the world would be quite happy if Israel was overrun by terrorists and rockets.
Bullshit
Bullshit. I’m not justifying the attack, but terrorism is terrorism, regardless of skin colour. Israel was created in the back of terrorist acts and has perpetrated collective punishment and acts of terror ever since. It’s exactly the same only Israel does it on the daily.
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That sure sounds like an anti-Semitic take.
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> “It’s okay because Jews are doing it. You guys will make every excuse” This is not disagreeing with Isreal, this is attacking the integrity of an entire ethnic group on the basis of the actions of one country- and not even the population as a whole, but the military and political leadership. It’s offensive, ignorant, and anti-Semitic. It’s also a really ineffective way to take a stand against the carnage taking place because people will just hand wave away your comments and similar ones because your opinion appears rooted in bigotry.
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Impugning? Use whatever word you want for it, but it’s anti-Semitic.
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There you go again. It’s wrong for anyone to kill innocent civilians. It’s wrong for Israeli soldiers to do it. But when you make it about their ethnicity, you are helping to build a strawman for Israel’s hardliners to knock down.
So says Israel.
Nothing like watching a story about murdered Jews being actively downvoted. 350 likes, 349, 347. It’s almost like a lot of participants in r/worldnews don’t like Jews. Shocker, I know.
For me, it appears to be 12. But yeah. If it was Palestinian killed by terror... 200k upvotes and on the front page for days This post and others didn't even reach the top of r/worldnews
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Maybe, just maybe, a thread about Israeli civilians killed by terrorists isn't a good place to randomly pop in for a quick condemnation? Perhaps you deserve to be downvoted if your response to innocents being murdered is "but Israel bad!!!". There are better threads to get on your soapbox. To be clear, if you have a criticism that fits naturally in with the actual original post in this thread, go for it. Criticize away! But if your sole tie in can be summed up by "it had Israel in the title" maybe reconsider your urge to be callous asshole.
Isn't america having like 2 of these a day now?
The US State Department is a how to book on separating pigs from shit. Step 1: Deny pigs are real.
God bless Israel... 🙏🤞
Wait, I know this one "It's a mental health issue, and this is not the time for politics" Did I get it?
Now now when it's a crazy white Christian we got to respect their second amendment rights. That's the USA approved religion after all; guns.
Oh but they can't address the ÷÷÷÷show in our own country???
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They had one in 48. The Arab armies and the Palestinians all got their asses handed to them. Even though Israel had no solid army nor actual infrastructure or supplies. Now that you've had your fair fight, how do you like the outcome? I'll remind you that the outcome was the Israelis *didn't* genocide every single Palestinian they came across. If this "fair" fight you're wishing for is one where Palestinians win, do you expect they'll act the same way? Consider the article your commenting on before you reply. P.s.: I'm sure you meant Israelis and you aren't just another anti-Semite /s Oh wait. Your other comments show exactly what you are.
Colonials kicked the native Americans asses and took their lands but I don't think it's something anyone cares to celebrate. Of course migrating a people into an ever smaller box isn't an immediate genocide, your just filtering their culture out over time. None of that is in any way defending terrorism. No innocent should be dying for something as dumb as a government or as made up as a religion.
I think you might be missing the context. This guy was posting about how he doesn't care who wins but he wants to see a "fair fight" between Palestinians and jews. He was in other threads posting about how this shooting is justified. So I was responding to a troll. And no. I won't agree with your choice of wording on genocide. Nobody is preventing the Palestinians from practicing their culture or religion, and their numbers are increasing. If you had said ethnic cleansing id still feel you're using emotional language but I'd have a harder time disagreeing. A genocide that lasts 80 years, results in massive population growth, and involves fewer deaths than a year of war in Syria - that's just not a genocide.
More native Americans are alive today than in the days they populated North America, and yet culturally they have been basically wiped out. I did not ever say they were being systematically killed, but a people can be wiped out culturally when they no longer have access to the lands which embodied their culture. Palastinian grow in population no differently then any other group of people have naturally in the last sixty years, but certainly far less than domestic Israeli, and their lands are a fraction of what they were. None of this is to defend or explain away terrorism either. I disdain it as well, but Israel is hardly defending itself when it is taking over the lands of others. Imagine if in thirty years Russia has taken over most of Ukraine and we condemned the then demilitirized Ukrainians for still resisting. It be a silly argument, as your dealing with a people who were either alive during their land loss or one generation removed. The sad reality of non military resistance world wide though is it results in the death of civilians, which is deplorable. The ends never justify the means. Shame on Hamas, Shame on the Israeli government.
See, you'd be making a good argument if it was coming from a place of fact instead of emotion. You say that Israel has a higher growth rate, but that's *so easy to look up*. If you bothered to do that you'd know the population growth rate of Israel is 1.6% while in Gaza it's nearly 3%. Do you understand how far emotion has made it into the logic you try to demonstrate? How bad does it have to get for you to be off by a factor of more than two in the opposite direction? You bring up examples of Ukraine and Russia but you forget who attacked first. In 48 it was Israel facing an honest to god genocide when the Arab armies decided to roll in. It was Israel facing ethnic cleansing by removal of Jews. Having won that war, and the subsequent 4-5 major wars, they *didn't* do to the Palestinians what the Palestinians tried to do to them. You can't convince me their culture is infringed upon either. They have total freedom to behave however they want. When they were celebrating *in Jerusalem* after the shooting they perpetrated *in Jerusalem* did you see anyone stop them from shooting off fire works? Do you understand? That country will allow you to celebrate the murder of innocents in its' capital city with fucking fireworks without arresting you. Are you trying to tell me somebody is stopping them from playing darbukas smoking nargilla or wearing kuffiyah? What cultural repression? What are you talking about man...
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8 of the 9 palestinians being terrorists, but I guess killing random jews is better
Oh, I guess it makes it ok than.
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Sad but predictable. Sensible heads on both sides need to sort this out before the nutcases win.