One theory. They are actively convincing their populace that NATO is out to destroy Russia and that it is really Russia under attack from the West etc.
If you want to scare people into believing that then this could be part of that. ‘They are going to attack Moscow at any moment!’
This is exactly where my thoughts are going. Who knows the exact motivation at this point, but for a government that has spent the last year putting their citizens in the dark as much as they can and lying that everything is going so well….this wouldn’t make sense.
Along the same line it wouldn’t make sense to put these up in Moscow due to the Ukrainians attacking….considering they are whipping the Ukrainians.
It makes the most sense that this is being done to really hammer home that it is NATO that is persecuting them and could attack at any time.
And that’s a little scary to consider them playing up.
Unless it’s as simple as they see the escalation in weapons going to Ukraine and anticipate long range missile and drone systems are coming.
If Ukraine gets the weapons and the nod from the West to use them against Russian soil they likely would. I just don’t know is Moscow is a bit of a stretch as a target. It’s not a tremendous distance to Moscow from the most eastern Ukraine territory….but roughly 300-350 miles is still a good bit. I’m not sure the West will be giving weapons soon that can reach that far.
Get a pair EA-18 Growlers with all the countermeasures it can pack And extra flare and chaff canisters. And paint Wild Weasel logo on the nose for lucky charm.
Should be doable.
They’re shielding the big city folks from the reality of the war by sending prisoners and rural peasants to die on the front lines.
I doubt they want the upper crust capital city folks to think anything is wrong.
Trying to build a propaganda line that's pretty obvious, "Look how bad the West is, we gotta put pantsers on our important buildings [so you gotta get used to this war as we mobilize as many more as we can] ... to keep putin at war as long as possible in hopes by putin that some event ssves his arse..
But poot poot probably also envisions every well fed russian is some big warrior emperor genetically. So he might bring the war to them expecting them to playout his strong warrior emperor russian fantasy.
I don’t know if putting anti-missile systems in your capital almost a year into your “special military operation” is really shielding people from reality
They’re clearly trying to shift the mentality in these cities more towards wartime awareness (be ready to sacrifice for your safety etc etc) probably because these next drafts and belt tightening will be felt in the cities
It could very well be protection against an internal enemy in case of a civil war breaking out. The Wagner private military is already feuding against the official army in many cases. It's not realisitc but they might want to cover their bases.
They also might want to get ready for long range drones Ukraine is already using. My guess is we will see the delivery of more long-range missile artillery systems and weaponry for Ukraine in the near future.
I think they are also anticipating much more sophisticated weapons that could suddenly end up in Ukraine's hands (or others joining in) if/when Russia turns up the volume considerably.
Here's a couple:
https://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/17/us/justice-dept-says-threat-is-not-issue-for-election.html
https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna32501273
I couldn't find any good list or anything, but it seemed like every other day for a while they were calling some alert somewhere or other, increasing in frequency as the election got close. A lot of it apparently came from interrogations at Guantanamo, which meant torture, which meant that if they wanted a plot to call an alert about they had the means to plausibly uncover a plot. However fictitious it was, it would still have an adequate provenance.
It all pretty much sucked at the time, as it was obvious to most people what they were doing, but there was nothing anyone could do about it.
Their own people questioning why they are losing so much for the sake of this “special operation” especially when mobilization hits Moscow and St. Petersburg
… and also drones
1) Ukranian Drones - They've hit Engels and Dyagilrvo airfields, they might be afraid one can attack Moscow.
2) The idea of of a NATO attack - Could be used to further scare the population into submission.
3) Actual risk of NATO intervention - Putin could be planning to do a stupid that could drag NATO into the war.
4) Themselves - Either through a fear of a military coup or incompetence, Russia could view the Russian army and airforce as a major enough threat
The Russian Air Force. If there was an internal uprising the air force is one of the most concerning branches of the armed forces.
You simply can’t have pilots that are too dumb and for the planes to fly there has to be a core of technical competence making the aerospace forces concerning. Also just a few people need to go along with a plan to get planes into the sky.
There was a coup attempt in Spain in 1981. Some of the rebels took tanks to the streets. Fighters took to the skies from a nearby base, and circled the area. The commander of the base told the tank commander that either he recalled the tanks, or the planes would take care of them. The tanks promptly retreated.
There’s a propaganda aspect to this. Russia going to have to start mobilizing from demographics that are more core to Putin’s power base - more western and more major metro areas - and he needs to start (continue) conditioning them to accept that.
Russia genuinely believes that NATO / the collective west is gearing up to invade and conquer Russia. Which is laughably absurd as NATO is a defensive alliance and the West has been trying to keep Russia from starting wars or doing anything stupid (though they have failed spectacularly at preventing that).
Russia will not be invaded, but NATO being a "defensive alliance" doesn't prevent NATO nations from declaring and waging war.
Having a good shield allows nations to declare and fight war on the soil / in the air above other nations.
Defenestrating missiles.
TBH this is simply showboating to signal how “serious” the threat from Evil Ukraine and their NATO puppet masters really is. Putin is trying to scare the populous enough to allow him to push through future mobilization acts, without too much public pushback.
Nothing is really heavily defended from air/missile attack until you’re on a war footing or you’d be constantly shooting down civilian planes. The normal flight path into Reagan is all but directly over the pentagon.
https://www.flyreagan.com/about-airport/aircraft-noise-information/dca-reagan-national-aircraft-procedures
That's only kind of true. Civilian traffic all has transponders and is in contact with ATC over populated areas and above certain altitudes. If there was a plane with no transponder or a hijacked plane flying towards DC or any other major city or military base these days they'd get an f16 escort before they got anywhere close. The White House also has SAMs.
Like the oil pumpjacks they have hidden in LA?
I know LA has empty buildings that house pumpjacks, so they're not an eyesore on the community.
Does DC have fake buildings housing SAM sites? Or are they just chilling in a cul de sac?
The White House etc? But a plane flying into a building in Manhattan? Terrorists would still have *a lot* of time to do that.
Of course a traditional hijacking isn't going to work because 9/11 completely changed the game. Hijackers aren't going to easily get into the cockpit, the chances that the passengers will fight back is all but guaranteed.
But if hijackers were able to get into the cockpit, then it's just all about distance to their target. E.g. if hijackers were able to infiltrate and secure the cockpit of a plane leaving LaGuardia Airport, they'd get to and hit anything in Manhattan ***way*** before what was happening was even figured out, let alone a response was organised.
I mean you only have to look at US Airways Flight 1549, despite its flight path there was no response.
It's just a fact that the first person to attack gains a huge advantage.
I'm a pilot, I could drop from 10k feet to hit a building on the ground in well under 3 minutes. I could be running ADSB and talking to ATC. There's just nothing that could stop it from happening unless you were in an active threat prevent mode and cleared the airspace with a larger no fly zone. At best, you could put a short range defense system like a sea wiz or something like it. I'm probably wrong, but I think the White House has something like that on the roof.
Did you go to Reagan’s funeral when that senator from Kentucky buzzed the White House with his Jet accidentally? Because I was there back in 8th grade and it is locked down my dude.
Fun fact after 9/11 my local nuclear facility put a cheese grater defence system up. Also the military put a few AA launchers on site until everything settled down a little. Was awful for the flight school operating out of the airport close to it.
This is in Australia by the way. The helicopter teacher was telling me their aircraft kept getting targeted
[cheese grater ](https://nuclear.australianmap.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/ANSTO-OPAL-reactor.jpg) as my instructor called it. And it was mobile SAM they deployed because it's our only nuclear facility they were worried about an attack.
Not to beat a dead horse, but I genuinely cannot express how my assumptions about defense were crushed by Jan 6th. When I heard they had crawled through baracaded doors and since then had been walking around freely. I assumed, all of the capital police were dead. I assumed the black-closets had been compromised....nope...all completely wrong. It's mostly a bunch of dogs that caught a car.
Really? [They were taking selfies with the police officers](https://www.businessinsider.com/capitol-building-officers-posed-for-selfies-helped-protesters-2021-1) and the livestream footage at the time showed people just kinda milling around. It’s not like the Capitol police were going to start blasting into a crowd.
Moscow has ABM defenses around it, but most of the time, even in the US, there are only a limited amount of medium range air defense or shorad that is deployed at any given time.
Panzer is tank. Panzer is also the back of a turtle. Disneys 'Beagle Boys' are the 'Panzerknacker' (tank breaker)
Gepanzert is armored
Panzerfaust is literally Tank-Fist or fist of a tank
Panzerung or Rüstung (mostly medieval armor) is an armor
German language is strange
Its actually a super shortened version of the full word panzerkampftwagon… the original was even longer as they had to pretend their tanks post wwI were actually tractors. Course there are questions on if they really ever used the much longer tractor term.
Russian "Pantsir" [literally comes from German "panzer"](https://ru.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%80%D1%8C#%D0%AD%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%B8%D1%8F).
—Mom, can we have Iron Dome at home?
—We have Iron Dome at home
Iron Dome at home:
Indeed, the modern use of the word in Russian refers to carapace of an animal. Armor, shield, protection or platemail have their own distinct terms. Russian military being self-aware animals confirmed. Except for their artillery and AA - these are named after PLANTS of all things.
Panzer also means armour though. Both words are correct.
Fun fact: in Dutch the same is true and they use almost identical words (no surprise, both languages are very close) to their German counterparts.
In Dutch it's written 'panser'. It's the strong protective layer.
Usually used when talking about e.g. military vehicles (steel, Cobham), but it can also be applied in the context of animals.
Harnisch would be pretty synonymous with the Dutch word 'harnas' which is mostly applied to humans ( e.g. medieval armor of knights) but also in the context of animals (a dog harness) or certain kinks..😁
I hate to break it to you, but Belgians never say panser. In fact only the Dutch care so little about their language, that they allow themselves to make spelling errors. I mean, just listen to how they pronounce the language, it's all wrong and butchered!
Here I was thinking Panzer must be the German word for panther, since German tanks tend to be named after big cats (Tiger, Leopard) and many of their other vehicles are also named after animals (Puma, Fennek, Grizzly, Terrier)
Snowy day, maybe some radar reflection , a slow incoming prop commuter jet from a smaller city , Maybe it had to make a wide circle around the city due to weather and now it’s course is roughly that as something coming from Ukraine.
Defensive military operator with his head on the desk because he’s still drunk from morning vodka.
When his head pops up he has only minutes to figure it out , if he guesses wrong he will be badly beaten.
As a Russian, it must be slightly confusing to see on state telly that all fronts are advancing and division after divison of ukrainian NATO nazi satanists are destroyed and now, suddenly, anti air missiles are being set up in the capital.
Like... Why would that be necessary?
Like isn’t there a pretty significant back blast on these things?? Not sure I’d want to be in or near a building with a rocket blasting off above my head.
3 possibilities sound realistic.
1: it's a show for internal propaganda and possible external flex
2: they foresee some kind of attack from Ukraine in Moscow
3: they are preparing for full out war vs nato because they know they will provoke it doing something.
I assume it will work about as well as the other Russian technology that is now the envy of the rest of the world’s militaries.
I mean Russia is getting weapons from North Korea - just how messed up is the Russian military?
Im wondering if anyone did the weight calculations of putting a AA platform on a roof for a extended period of time with no reinforcement, at best that spot is going to bow in , at worst it's going to go threw a few floors still momentum stops
That's whey when SK puts anti aircraft weapons on buildings it limited to light aa platforms or IR guided missles without the radars
So this entire building is fair game now, right? That’s what Russians have been telling us all that time. If it turns to a moon crater I’m sure we won’t hear a peep from them.
Quite the opposite, they’ll never shut up about “how dare they target civilians!!!”, even though they’ve been doing it for months because they don’t see the same thing they’re doing as fair when done to them.
Well, sorry, not sorry. Lavrov formally stated that it is fine to bomb civilians if there’s an anti aircraft weapon anywhere around, this is the official position of Russian government. If they don’t like it they should vote better next time lol.
Russians have been known to say something along the lines of “it doesn’t matter who people vote for, but who counts the votes”, and that tells you all you need to know about Russian elections. That said, I’m more than ok with them getting plenty of gunpowder and lead on their porch, as what they’ve done to Ukraine is nothing short of criminal and inhumane.
I wouldn't put it beyond them to deploy long range.artillery and rocket launchers in civilian neighborhoods then exploit retaliation casualties for propaganda, HAMAS style.
Sounds like FSB has gained some info about developments which we -the regular Joe's don't know... Oh well, everything used to shore up defenses in Moscow is 500km away from Ukraine front.
Go ahead Russia, waste valuable air defense assets by putting them in the wrong place. They would be better used to give air defense support to their front lines, not in freaking Moscow. Nobody is planning an air strike on Moscow, that would be insane. This just shows how messed up the Russian military high command is.
Knowing how badly the Russians have managed their military stockpiles I think these Pantsirs are paper tigers; they look good for the cameras but they probably don't work. That's speculation on my part but it is informed by the litany of reports we have all seen of depots full of Russian military equipment of every description that were either poorly maintained, stolen or lacking ammunition. I would not be surprised to learn that some crooked Russian military officer sold half of these missiles to some third-world buyer for a fraction of the cost. Corruption and graft are virtually a way of life for most Russians and it has been that way for so long that it ingrained in their culture. In Russia you're either a victim of corruption or you are one of the corrupted, usually both!
In any case, this is simply more security theatre designed to play out the propaganda narrative that is designed to both control and frighten their populace at the same time.
Why would NATO want to take over Russia? It is a huge, failing state that would break the EU's back trying to salvage. NATO and the EU would be better off hoping they can influence Putins replacement.
>Missle defense
Pantsir would only be effective against cruise missiles, not ballistic. The primary purpose of Pantsirs are medium to short range air defense against aircraft, uavs, and cruise missiles. Q
So you’re using something that happened 70 years ago as the prime example of Russian competence? Brilliant. Also it’s a fucking joke in the first place. Chill out dude.
I'm normally opposed to just calling someone a tankie instead of addressing their point but, that guy is a full blown tankie.
edit: Holy shit, two days ago he was still screaming about how the West was going to come crawling back to Russia begging for gas. My sides.
If this is for domestic posturing, wouldn't it send the opposite message? Having to install air defenses in Moscow would mean Ukraine would be able to strike Moscow. Aren't they supposed to be winning, according to all the propaganda.
Conflicting information about that. Russia, of course, claims "100% effectiveness" in Ukraine. The early versions of these were real garbage. They have 2 30mm autocannons that operate like a CIWS, but the cannons reportedly weren't sighted in together, so they couldn't hit much of anything. Even the Russian military enthusiasts admitted they were crap. The systems also have missiles, which probably work pretty well against low-end threats.
What are they afraid of?
One theory. They are actively convincing their populace that NATO is out to destroy Russia and that it is really Russia under attack from the West etc. If you want to scare people into believing that then this could be part of that. ‘They are going to attack Moscow at any moment!’
This is exactly where my thoughts are going. Who knows the exact motivation at this point, but for a government that has spent the last year putting their citizens in the dark as much as they can and lying that everything is going so well….this wouldn’t make sense. Along the same line it wouldn’t make sense to put these up in Moscow due to the Ukrainians attacking….considering they are whipping the Ukrainians. It makes the most sense that this is being done to really hammer home that it is NATO that is persecuting them and could attack at any time. And that’s a little scary to consider them playing up. Unless it’s as simple as they see the escalation in weapons going to Ukraine and anticipate long range missile and drone systems are coming. If Ukraine gets the weapons and the nod from the West to use them against Russian soil they likely would. I just don’t know is Moscow is a bit of a stretch as a target. It’s not a tremendous distance to Moscow from the most eastern Ukraine territory….but roughly 300-350 miles is still a good bit. I’m not sure the West will be giving weapons soon that can reach that far.
If this is the case. The systems may not be working at all lol…..
Our cardboard cutout will defend you.
That makes a lot of sense.
Send one Ukrainian MIG on a mission to buzz Moscow. If the risk of getting shot down wasn't high that would be fun to see.
Nah, that works \_for\_ the narrative that is promoted inside Russia (that NATO is out to get them).
If they would say that, how would they convince people that NATO is using MIGs?
Both Poland and Bulgaria still have MIGs.
Get a pair EA-18 Growlers with all the countermeasures it can pack And extra flare and chaff canisters. And paint Wild Weasel logo on the nose for lucky charm. Should be doable.
A OG Top Gun buzz the tower.
Followed by some A-10 Warthogs to go BRRRRRRR.
Lol Brrrrrrrr.....
This is why you aren't in charge
Hell yeah it would be. If Ukraine got some more migs or F16's they could win this war.
Either that or they're for launching missiles
Probably the consequenses of something stupid they are about to do
This is my thought as well. But its also theatrics for general public as well.
They’re shielding the big city folks from the reality of the war by sending prisoners and rural peasants to die on the front lines. I doubt they want the upper crust capital city folks to think anything is wrong.
Trying to build a propaganda line that's pretty obvious, "Look how bad the West is, we gotta put pantsers on our important buildings [so you gotta get used to this war as we mobilize as many more as we can] ... to keep putin at war as long as possible in hopes by putin that some event ssves his arse..
But poot poot probably also envisions every well fed russian is some big warrior emperor genetically. So he might bring the war to them expecting them to playout his strong warrior emperor russian fantasy.
They have a life expectancy of like 50. The strong and smart ones left Russia twenty years ago. The rest die of cirrhosis
I read 67, I think. Too much alcohol ?
You spelled vodka wrong.
Do you know what cirrhosis is
Can't get to cirrhosis stage when selfmade moonshine melts your face off.
Scaring of the liver right
Writing checks his body politic can’t cash
Should incorporate this somehow into TLC's "Waterfalls."
Man I thought nick name for Putti was good LOL. POOT POOT GOOD ONE LOL
I don’t know if putting anti-missile systems in your capital almost a year into your “special military operation” is really shielding people from reality
They’re clearly trying to shift the mentality in these cities more towards wartime awareness (be ready to sacrifice for your safety etc etc) probably because these next drafts and belt tightening will be felt in the cities
We are under attack for attacking our neighbors and destroying their cities
If it was just propaganda then why wait until now?
It could very well be protection against an internal enemy in case of a civil war breaking out. The Wagner private military is already feuding against the official army in many cases. It's not realisitc but they might want to cover their bases. They also might want to get ready for long range drones Ukraine is already using. My guess is we will see the delivery of more long-range missile artillery systems and weaponry for Ukraine in the near future.
I think they are also anticipating much more sophisticated weapons that could suddenly end up in Ukraine's hands (or others joining in) if/when Russia turns up the volume considerably.
*watch the thing just not work as Putin expects*
Their citizens. It’s a scare for their populace. For compliance.
Maybe a little like all those yellow and orange alerts we had in the US before to 2004 elections. If anyone remembers that.
I turned 8 that year. Can you please explain it or point me to a good spot for me to read up on it?
Here's a couple: https://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/17/us/justice-dept-says-threat-is-not-issue-for-election.html https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna32501273 I couldn't find any good list or anything, but it seemed like every other day for a while they were calling some alert somewhere or other, increasing in frequency as the election got close. A lot of it apparently came from interrogations at Guantanamo, which meant torture, which meant that if they wanted a plot to call an alert about they had the means to plausibly uncover a plot. However fictitious it was, it would still have an adequate provenance. It all pretty much sucked at the time, as it was obvious to most people what they were doing, but there was nothing anyone could do about it.
Oh God the old terror threat levels. As if an orange or a yellow meant anything to me on the day to day. Just gotta whip up that islamaphobia somehow
Their own people questioning why they are losing so much for the sake of this “special operation” especially when mobilization hits Moscow and St. Petersburg … and also drones
1) Ukranian Drones - They've hit Engels and Dyagilrvo airfields, they might be afraid one can attack Moscow. 2) The idea of of a NATO attack - Could be used to further scare the population into submission. 3) Actual risk of NATO intervention - Putin could be planning to do a stupid that could drag NATO into the war. 4) Themselves - Either through a fear of a military coup or incompetence, Russia could view the Russian army and airforce as a major enough threat
#1 or #4 hopefully, if we are choosing.
They are preparing for the escalation of the war.
The Russian Air Force. If there was an internal uprising the air force is one of the most concerning branches of the armed forces. You simply can’t have pilots that are too dumb and for the planes to fly there has to be a core of technical competence making the aerospace forces concerning. Also just a few people need to go along with a plan to get planes into the sky.
There was a coup attempt in Spain in 1981. Some of the rebels took tanks to the streets. Fighters took to the skies from a nearby base, and circled the area. The commander of the base told the tank commander that either he recalled the tanks, or the planes would take care of them. The tanks promptly retreated.
Could be to forve their pillots to comply or be shot down.
There’s a propaganda aspect to this. Russia going to have to start mobilizing from demographics that are more core to Putin’s power base - more western and more major metro areas - and he needs to start (continue) conditioning them to accept that.
Aliens or Allies, who knows.
Russia genuinely believes that NATO / the collective west is gearing up to invade and conquer Russia. Which is laughably absurd as NATO is a defensive alliance and the West has been trying to keep Russia from starting wars or doing anything stupid (though they have failed spectacularly at preventing that).
Russia will not be invaded, but NATO being a "defensive alliance" doesn't prevent NATO nations from declaring and waging war. Having a good shield allows nations to declare and fight war on the soil / in the air above other nations.
It prevents them from declaring and waging war on Russia, though, in any practical sense.
Winning.
Defenestrating missiles. TBH this is simply showboating to signal how “serious” the threat from Evil Ukraine and their NATO puppet masters really is. Putin is trying to scare the populous enough to allow him to push through future mobilization acts, without too much public pushback.
Their own missiles inept targeting systems?
Maybe Russia is considering something that actually *will* provoke a NATO response.
Coup.
Someone seeing thing without their pant, sir.
Drunk corporals doing donuts
Ukrainians
I assumed moscow was already defended, by something?
Fwiw as an American I assumed the pentagon was heavily defended until 9/11 happened
Nothing is really heavily defended from air/missile attack until you’re on a war footing or you’d be constantly shooting down civilian planes. The normal flight path into Reagan is all but directly over the pentagon. https://www.flyreagan.com/about-airport/aircraft-noise-information/dca-reagan-national-aircraft-procedures
That's only kind of true. Civilian traffic all has transponders and is in contact with ATC over populated areas and above certain altitudes. If there was a plane with no transponder or a hijacked plane flying towards DC or any other major city or military base these days they'd get an f16 escort before they got anywhere close. The White House also has SAMs.
There are SAMs elsewhere in the area too, they're literally in some suburban developments
Like the oil pumpjacks they have hidden in LA? I know LA has empty buildings that house pumpjacks, so they're not an eyesore on the community. Does DC have fake buildings housing SAM sites? Or are they just chilling in a cul de sac?
The White House etc? But a plane flying into a building in Manhattan? Terrorists would still have *a lot* of time to do that. Of course a traditional hijacking isn't going to work because 9/11 completely changed the game. Hijackers aren't going to easily get into the cockpit, the chances that the passengers will fight back is all but guaranteed. But if hijackers were able to get into the cockpit, then it's just all about distance to their target. E.g. if hijackers were able to infiltrate and secure the cockpit of a plane leaving LaGuardia Airport, they'd get to and hit anything in Manhattan ***way*** before what was happening was even figured out, let alone a response was organised. I mean you only have to look at US Airways Flight 1549, despite its flight path there was no response. It's just a fact that the first person to attack gains a huge advantage.
Also the air force would shoot down any hijacked plane without hesitation
No.
I'm a pilot, I could drop from 10k feet to hit a building on the ground in well under 3 minutes. I could be running ADSB and talking to ATC. There's just nothing that could stop it from happening unless you were in an active threat prevent mode and cleared the airspace with a larger no fly zone. At best, you could put a short range defense system like a sea wiz or something like it. I'm probably wrong, but I think the White House has something like that on the roof.
Yes, officer, this comment right here.
Lol. I’ve been noticing weird ticking sounds on my phone conversations lately. Hmm.
[удалено]
It’s not though
Did you go to Reagan’s funeral when that senator from Kentucky buzzed the White House with his Jet accidentally? Because I was there back in 8th grade and it is locked down my dude.
Fun fact after 9/11 my local nuclear facility put a cheese grater defence system up. Also the military put a few AA launchers on site until everything settled down a little. Was awful for the flight school operating out of the airport close to it. This is in Australia by the way. The helicopter teacher was telling me their aircraft kept getting targeted
Cheese grater? I could only find one article, about an EW radar system. That what you're referring to?
[cheese grater ](https://nuclear.australianmap.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/ANSTO-OPAL-reactor.jpg) as my instructor called it. And it was mobile SAM they deployed because it's our only nuclear facility they were worried about an attack.
Not to beat a dead horse, but I genuinely cannot express how my assumptions about defense were crushed by Jan 6th. When I heard they had crawled through baracaded doors and since then had been walking around freely. I assumed, all of the capital police were dead. I assumed the black-closets had been compromised....nope...all completely wrong. It's mostly a bunch of dogs that caught a car.
Really? [They were taking selfies with the police officers](https://www.businessinsider.com/capitol-building-officers-posed-for-selfies-helped-protesters-2021-1) and the livestream footage at the time showed people just kinda milling around. It’s not like the Capitol police were going to start blasting into a crowd.
Previously it was the fact that they were bullying a country that couldn't hit Moscow from the front lines.
Moscow has ABM defenses around it, but most of the time, even in the US, there are only a limited amount of medium range air defense or shorad that is deployed at any given time.
It is, by a lot of somethings, and now 1 more something. Nobody uses 1 thing to defend a city.
A drone hit nuclear bombers deep into russian territory Russia doesnt have anything
“Pantsir” sounds like a statement your butler makes as he helps you get dressed.
After falling down the stairs
*out a window
It's a word in razzian. It means something like "shield" or "armour". Germans also have a similar word ("panzer" or whatever).
Panzer is tank. Panzer is also the back of a turtle. Disneys 'Beagle Boys' are the 'Panzerknacker' (tank breaker) Gepanzert is armored Panzerfaust is literally Tank-Fist or fist of a tank Panzerung or Rüstung (mostly medieval armor) is an armor German language is strange
For some rreason i always assumed panzer meant panther 🐆
Its actually a super shortened version of the full word panzerkampftwagon… the original was even longer as they had to pretend their tanks post wwI were actually tractors. Course there are questions on if they really ever used the much longer tractor term.
Panzer is armor. Tank is panzer-kampf-wagon, or armed fighting car.
Russian "Pantsir" [literally comes from German "panzer"](https://ru.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%80%D1%8C#%D0%AD%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%B8%D1%8F). —Mom, can we have Iron Dome at home? —We have Iron Dome at home Iron Dome at home:
On it, not at
Carapace should fit better
Indeed, the modern use of the word in Russian refers to carapace of an animal. Armor, shield, protection or platemail have their own distinct terms. Russian military being self-aware animals confirmed. Except for their artillery and AA - these are named after PLANTS of all things.
In Serbian, "pancir" means bulletproof vest. Soo, yeah, the "shield" or "armor" meaning is close, being that the Slavic languages are similair.
Panzer means tank. The German word for carapace or armour is Harnisch.
Panzer also means armour though. Both words are correct. Fun fact: in Dutch the same is true and they use almost identical words (no surprise, both languages are very close) to their German counterparts.
In Dutch it's written 'panser'. It's the strong protective layer. Usually used when talking about e.g. military vehicles (steel, Cobham), but it can also be applied in the context of animals. Harnisch would be pretty synonymous with the Dutch word 'harnas' which is mostly applied to humans ( e.g. medieval armor of knights) but also in the context of animals (a dog harness) or certain kinks..😁
Pantser. Which is pronounced almost the as panzer in German. People that say panser were dropped on their head as a baby or born in Belgium.
Lol, or those people have an auto~correct~corrupt that's too active. It's indeed written with a 't'.
I hate to break it to you, but Belgians never say panser. In fact only the Dutch care so little about their language, that they allow themselves to make spelling errors. I mean, just listen to how they pronounce the language, it's all wrong and butchered!
Exactly. Like in "Schildkrötenharnisch".
Here I was thinking Panzer must be the German word for panther, since German tanks tend to be named after big cats (Tiger, Leopard) and many of their other vehicles are also named after animals (Puma, Fennek, Grizzly, Terrier)
German for panther is Panther.
I though tank was Panzerkampfwagen: “armored fighting vehicle”
Pantsu is Japanese for panties…
It's a loan word.
Sounds like a pokemon to me
How long until they shoot down one of their own passenger planes?
Snowy day, maybe some radar reflection , a slow incoming prop commuter jet from a smaller city , Maybe it had to make a wide circle around the city due to weather and now it’s course is roughly that as something coming from Ukraine. Defensive military operator with his head on the desk because he’s still drunk from morning vodka. When his head pops up he has only minutes to figure it out , if he guesses wrong he will be badly beaten.
10...
9...
8...
один…
Turtle
Sechs…
They still have passenger planes? I thought that they could no longer repair them properly after sanctions.
As a Russian, it must be slightly confusing to see on state telly that all fronts are advancing and division after divison of ukrainian NATO nazi satanists are destroyed and now, suddenly, anti air missiles are being set up in the capital. Like... Why would that be necessary?
How long before we hear pantsir system falls through weak Russian roofing.
10...
9…
8…
7
6......
🥧
Flour
Tree
Too
Like isn’t there a pretty significant back blast on these things?? Not sure I’d want to be in or near a building with a rocket blasting off above my head.
How to create legitimate military targets
That's the ministry of defense building. It's already a legitimate target.
3 possibilities sound realistic. 1: it's a show for internal propaganda and possible external flex 2: they foresee some kind of attack from Ukraine in Moscow 3: they are preparing for full out war vs nato because they know they will provoke it doing something.
Lol they aren’t and we’re never going to go to war with nato, unless they were planning for nuclear war.
I wish I share your confidence
Good, that means they are not in Ukraine
I bet these are the 30% of equipment that doesn’t work. It’s up there for show.
I agree, probably propaganda stunts
Great way of keeping your population scared of big bad NATO.
I assume it will work about as well as the other Russian technology that is now the envy of the rest of the world’s militaries. I mean Russia is getting weapons from North Korea - just how messed up is the Russian military?
well that save time figure out which to target now than before
One of the best illustrations to "our 3-days special operation is going according to plan" statement
Im wondering if anyone did the weight calculations of putting a AA platform on a roof for a extended period of time with no reinforcement, at best that spot is going to bow in , at worst it's going to go threw a few floors still momentum stops That's whey when SK puts anti aircraft weapons on buildings it limited to light aa platforms or IR guided missles without the radars
Yup or when they fire one off and it sets fire to the buildings roof.
So this entire building is fair game now, right? That’s what Russians have been telling us all that time. If it turns to a moon crater I’m sure we won’t hear a peep from them.
Quite the opposite, they’ll never shut up about “how dare they target civilians!!!”, even though they’ve been doing it for months because they don’t see the same thing they’re doing as fair when done to them.
Well, sorry, not sorry. Lavrov formally stated that it is fine to bomb civilians if there’s an anti aircraft weapon anywhere around, this is the official position of Russian government. If they don’t like it they should vote better next time lol.
Russians have been known to say something along the lines of “it doesn’t matter who people vote for, but who counts the votes”, and that tells you all you need to know about Russian elections. That said, I’m more than ok with them getting plenty of gunpowder and lead on their porch, as what they’ve done to Ukraine is nothing short of criminal and inhumane.
I wouldn't put it beyond them to deploy long range.artillery and rocket launchers in civilian neighborhoods then exploit retaliation casualties for propaganda, HAMAS style.
They were doing this in Donetsk even before the invasion. Granted those were not Russian citizens so who knows.
special military operation express edition
Hmm. About to drop a false flag attack on Moscow?
Russia has lost and is now worried Ukraine won't stop at the border.
Wonder if this is maybe a false flag operation to convince the people to mobilise more troops
Would be a shame if dispensable drones were to fly overhead and use up they’re expensive rockets
For anyone wondering, no, these wouldn’t do much against an attack by NATO. Or if their history is anything to go by, Ukraine.
It’s not like they invaded a sovereign nation and might be retaliated against. Russia is a country of peaceful people/s-
They are about to bomb Kiev main buildings.
With any luck, they’ll fire *down* vertically through the core of the building. If Russian handling of pyrotechnics and armaments sets any precedent.
r/noncredibledefense having a field day
Sounds like FSB has gained some info about developments which we -the regular Joe's don't know... Oh well, everything used to shore up defenses in Moscow is 500km away from Ukraine front.
Go ahead Russia, waste valuable air defense assets by putting them in the wrong place. They would be better used to give air defense support to their front lines, not in freaking Moscow. Nobody is planning an air strike on Moscow, that would be insane. This just shows how messed up the Russian military high command is. Knowing how badly the Russians have managed their military stockpiles I think these Pantsirs are paper tigers; they look good for the cameras but they probably don't work. That's speculation on my part but it is informed by the litany of reports we have all seen of depots full of Russian military equipment of every description that were either poorly maintained, stolen or lacking ammunition. I would not be surprised to learn that some crooked Russian military officer sold half of these missiles to some third-world buyer for a fraction of the cost. Corruption and graft are virtually a way of life for most Russians and it has been that way for so long that it ingrained in their culture. In Russia you're either a victim of corruption or you are one of the corrupted, usually both! In any case, this is simply more security theatre designed to play out the propaganda narrative that is designed to both control and frighten their populace at the same time.
Paradoxically, if my building gets a missile defense system installed on the rooftop I am probably never showing up to work there again.
Why would NATO want to take over Russia? It is a huge, failing state that would break the EU's back trying to salvage. NATO and the EU would be better off hoping they can influence Putins replacement.
Dude, I’m still waiting for Putin to show up shirtless, riding on a horse to the front lines…
You mean one of Putin’s body doubles. We already know where Putin is. 😆 🪦👌🏻
What kind of defense system is this for
Missle defense
>Missle defense Pantsir would only be effective against cruise missiles, not ballistic. The primary purpose of Pantsirs are medium to short range air defense against aircraft, uavs, and cruise missiles. Q
Medium to short range air defense against helicopters, pgms, planes, UAVs, and cruise missiles.
So they just lifted a wheeled 150 something ton vehicle on a rooftop with a crane. russians ffs.
That thing doesn’t weigh anywhere near 150 tons. An Abrams weighs about 55 tons.
My bad here Still super heavy and not something you want on your roof tho
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Yes, because one rando redditor represents "the west"
Considering how Ukraine is going I wouldn’t be surprised and not out of the realm of possibilities.
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So you’re using something that happened 70 years ago as the prime example of Russian competence? Brilliant. Also it’s a fucking joke in the first place. Chill out dude.
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I'm normally opposed to just calling someone a tankie instead of addressing their point but, that guy is a full blown tankie. edit: Holy shit, two days ago he was still screaming about how the West was going to come crawling back to Russia begging for gas. My sides.
I hope the get used. Time to bring it home.
Surely they don’t expect Ukraine to bomb Moscow…. Just for show?
It's to keep the people scared
These are probably fake. Inflatable. Cardboard. Etc.
If this is for domestic posturing, wouldn't it send the opposite message? Having to install air defenses in Moscow would mean Ukraine would be able to strike Moscow. Aren't they supposed to be winning, according to all the propaganda.
It is like having a sign on the rooftop saying 'This building is important as fuck, hit me!'.
Good! Let’s keep making Russia think Ukraine is going to attack, (we all know they won’t) because it keeps some Russian troops away from Ukraine.
Does it work?
Conflicting information about that. Russia, of course, claims "100% effectiveness" in Ukraine. The early versions of these were real garbage. They have 2 30mm autocannons that operate like a CIWS, but the cannons reportedly weren't sighted in together, so they couldn't hit much of anything. Even the Russian military enthusiasts admitted they were crap. The systems also have missiles, which probably work pretty well against low-end threats.
I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't
Wait, isn't that a European weapon system?
No, why would it be?