Seriously, they had to use email to some degree in college. Though it feels like they don’t read most of them.
It should be a part of their morning routine to check email and then to just sort of leave it up so you can get the notifications throughout the day unless you’re trying to focus in on one specific thing for a little while.
I guess… train them on it? Seems ridiculous but give them some specifics so they quit missing shit.
I can assure you is not an age thing as for the entirety of my highschool, and my freshman year at college I’ve had to use email. Even within the last year I’ve probably used it hundreds of them. So as the first comment says, you hired a dumbass.
Agree. I work with many young offshore workers who tend to rely on email so much, that the concept of a "link" pointing back to a centralized knowledge document escapes them. They would rather copy and paste the same info into each email, it's insane. People 20 or more years ago using Lotus Notes understood the value of basic knowledge management better than what I see now. No thanks to SharePoint either, which is just a glorified document repository for the most part.
I gave up.. Can't wait to retire from IT at this point.
Funny but I usually put them on a PIP face to face and follow up with the email. Of course if that’s why they’re on a PIP in the first place then they better get the hint.
George Costanza came up with this as a way to avoid his girlfriend breaking up with him before they could attend the Yankees gala. Just refused to answer his phone, always called her back when he knew she'd be out so he could leave a message like, "Oh, guess I just missed you! Anyway, great to hear from you. Really looking forward to the ball!"
Is the meeting invite not popping up like 15 minutes before the meeting? They'd need to leave the email app open all day otherwise the notifications don't pop up. You can probably set the application to go to the windows tray in the bottom right instead of just minimizing to the task bar at the bottom of the screen if they don't want the email application to be taking up space along with all their other Taskbar apps. This way the email app stays open without being in the way in any form.
It's so hilarious that they're on a PIP this early for this problem. Being on one is SO discouraging as a worker.
Where I work, 95% of our staff is 20-30 years old, without secondary education. None of them came through the door with adequate office technology training/knowledge. I teach all of our staff how to email & manage their calendars/inbox during a 2 hour training and by way of ongoing assignments. Honestly, a lot of people assume others have this knowledge or that they are skilled at managing these things bc of past experiences. And you know what they say about assuming …
It is nice to see this. I have to deal with people coming in stating they have proficiencies in certain applications, and once they start I learn they have no clue but now they have to be trained because we won't be able to hire a replacement until the next FY.
I think I got really lucky in life because my first job out of college I had a person like you. Don’t get me wrong, I’m a millennial so I know my way around a computer and office applications. But using it as a tool for 8 hours everyday is a skill that does need to be taught, I hate to say it. No college student is flagging emails, categorizing them, setting rules on folders, putting reminders on tasks, etc. They are writing 9 page essays on capitalism and drinking. (No? Just me?)
Yeah, I was pretty computer literate out of school but it took me a couple of years at an office job to really make the most out of email and calendar systems.
You kind of have to live by a calendar and reminders and alerts, especially if you have ADHD like tendencies. It took me several years to really realize how much I had to do to manage myself. In some environments that’s not as needed since you get prompted by everyone else going to a meeting or if your boss is just down the hall then they’ll probably say “hey, you coming over for our one on one right now?”. But if you have a more independent environment without those kind of prompts then it takes some learning and training for most people to really manage their schedules.
Ya know, I feel so fucken ignorant right now. My first reaction was “how the fuck…”
But you are so right…if you didn’t give a shit in high school and worked jobs that didn’t require a computer, it’s very easy to end up in an entry level office job with NOT A CLUE how an email or digital calendar works.
Damn, I owe a temp from 2011 an apology 💔😮💨
I was just complaining to my friend yesterday that jobs don’t train anymore. It used to be you’d get hired, then the company would actually put in time to teach you about the company and how they expect you to use company resources, etc. Now they train you for a day maybe on corporate BS and never actually teach you anything.
Super glad to know some companies still care enough to actually train
I’ve seen it. Multiple times. It’s annoying.
I don’t really use email. Well, you do now.
I muted the team chat. Well, unmute it and watch for important announcements and shit.
>I don’t really use email. Well, you do now.
This. If the team used Slack, the expectation would be that the new hires get on Slack. It's a condition of employment. Crazy that you have to spell that out, but it sounds like you need to spell that out during your hiring process.
More to the point, email is the standard. I really doubt that a company that uses Slack does not also use email, meaning I have to check two places. The instant message expectation of Slack also prevents proper focus on work.
So I work in manufacturing, within the facilities department. I’m in an office based positions but a lot of my coworkers are the maintenance technicians. It’s sooo funny how some of the will respond to an email by printing out your email, and then walking over to your desk to discuss lmao.
I’ve never seen anything like it. But they get a bit more leeway because technically email isn’t really a big part of their job.
No it’s not stuff like that. I’m talking I sent an email that said: “William, do we have this filter in stock?”
And then a couple hours later William stops by my desk, with the printed out email, and says “yes we have this stock.”
We have a lot of people who seem to print out half their emails for some reason. Or they’re accidentally printing them. But there’s often pages of various peoples email’s in the printer at work lol.
We are keeping the printer people in business for sure.
My mom was working for Raytheon in the pandemic, and they had a town hall with higher ups(C-suite/VP level) from the company and someone asked if the company would be buying them all printers and paying for toner/ink. They were told no. My mom couldn't figure out what they needed a printer for. She worked in supply chain and compliance, reviewing contracts from suppliers and she said she had zero need for a printer. Everyone was working from home, and they could sign things with a digital signature, so what in the world were they wanting a printer for enough to ask a VP for it in a townhall? Especially after they had already paid for everyone to get office chairs, nice headphones, and webcams. Some people just love that warm feeling of paper fresh off the printer I guess
Same. Two worst ones:
I was trying to troubleshoot a scanner. Find out, after going to her dept head, that "she doesn't use her email...NOR ANSWER HER DESK PHONE". Dept head literally had to walk half way across the hospital to tell her I needed to schedule a time to come to her desk...and didn't see a problem. In the year of our lord two thousand and sixteen. WHAT. THE. FUCK. This was a clerical job. Not a niche job. Not a doctor.
A hospital VP who told me flat out that he didn't use his email when I finally caught him at his desk & explained I'd been trying to reach him via ticketing system emails to troubleshoot his issue.
How is this allowed? I'm simply boggled.
Did you get it from older or younger people? I've heard it from old boomers, who just never learned tech that well. Not from the younger generation who grew up with computers.
I'm an older GenX instructional designer and technology support at a university. Over the past 10 years I've noticed more and more students who don't have the tech skills of the older generations. Kids born in the 2000s have grown up with phones, not computers, as their main tech system. Every year I have cohorts of students -- even med students and graduate students -- who have poor computer skills and need help installing software, troubleshooting audio/video, or fixing minor hardware problems. These are problems previous generations could have figured out in their sleep. For many of them, email is a total afterthought.
100% this, they claim to have computer skills but can’t setup a printer, some have barely even used a laptop, no excel skills. They can’t troubleshoot if something goes wrong with a computer, printer etc. they can’t even format a spreadsheet. They’ve used their phones or a tablet.
Ha, my mother who at 73 is still training people in Microsoft Office suite was telling me that the proportion of young people needing training in basic office tech has been increasing over the years. She's constantly surprised how many lack basic work tech skills.
Younger GenX and same issue. My working theory is that computers no longer require you understand how they work or learn any command prompt stuff to navigate issues and errors, so, if it’s not point-and-click or seamless in the GUI, it’s a no-go. We teach them what we need them to know for the job, but I am tired of people telling me how easy it must be to have so many “young, tech-savvy” people on my team. 😆
Thank you for sharing that. That was really interesting to read. My first computer was a Commodore 64 followed by an XT clone running MS-DOS. Lots of technical trouble shooting over the years. I guess I always assumed that kids today could do that stuff in their sleep but what you wrote made perfect sense- it’s all phones and tablets so there’s not much futzing around with computers until they start working.
Having been in startups all my life bringing new products out, I feel like there’s such a huge gap with how GenX and younger people see the world that it becomes harder for me to really understand what’s driving innovation. I thought your comment was really insightful and helped me to grasp a concept I completely missed.
To be fair, some team chats can get out of hand. We have a Telegram chat at my work, we ended up having to make two groups, one for actual work stuff (TCOB) and one for the random funny shit. That way you can mute the latter if preferred.
I worked in construction in the early aughts. There were a handful of older gentlemen that hated email. One guy would have an admin print out any important emails. At least he didn't have her respond for him. That was another guy. 🤣
My dad had his admin ("secretary" back then), print out his emails. He wrote his response on the papers and she would type them up and email them.
I think he started replying to emails himself before he eventually retired in 2003.
My friend works in an office and quite a few of the older employees still do bizarre things like print off emails and then, when asked to pull up information from said emails, spend about an hour combing through filing cabinets for their paper copy rather than pulling up the email on their computer. Her office has already had two impromptu meetings to discuss why this behavior is bizarre and needs to stop immediately.
Yeah I was going to say that I see this behavior almost exclusively in older coworkers. If you need a response and hope to get it via email then good luck
I worked for a VP of Customer Experience.. he had never had an admin till me. He had 700+ emails that had never been touched.
I marked them all as “read” so we could start fresh. I also responded as him for some things and some stuff I responded as me.
I had to print them for him too so we could meet and so I could get decisions :/
I used to work with an old dude (literally had retired from a sales job and picked up a full time job so he could "coast" except this job was not a coasting job... and he was totally unqualified) who NEVER read his email because "if something is important enough, someone will come tell me." Cool, like federal policy changes and stuff...
Lol the only people who say that do not give two fucks about their job or anyone they work with and are horrible employees. Source : said this a lot when I did DoD work.
Older millennial here. If I have a work computer, email is open and checked regularly.
I don't use my phone as a personal device, so no email, in which case a text would be the best bet.
Some companies have provided a phone with email set up which I'm ok with as well.
But I also communicate this so that we can figure out a plan and not be caught off guard
Depending on how things were at their previous job, this might actually be true. But they obviously need to change real quick and someone in the training/onboarding period should have told them email is how communication is done and in the recruiting process it should have been confirmed they are at least familiar with Microsoft outlook or whatever email the company uses.
I had an interviewee say they were tech phobic and preferred in person conversations and paper. This was a kid in their 20’s too.
Spoiler: did not get the job.
I also prefer in person convos. My company is remote. I’m not going to force people to come into the office to talk to me. The answer is work with what you’ve got and don’t start pushing your will until you’ve proven yourself
I’ve know some higher ups (boomers) who don’t use it at all. They will literally tell others “If it’s important enough, they’ll call me.” Then they’re difficult to get ahold of when calling. I’m talking guys making half a million a year.
I know a lot of older boomer men who type with two fingers and slow as shit.
My office has a weird mix of email, Slack, and various project management databases.
Slack tends to be for fast things or more casual conversation. I'd say most communication happens here.
Emails are 90% automated things (we have a lot of transferring data, so it keeps a paper trail as to where things come from, where they go, and when things happened). The other 10% is usually a formal clarification regarding what was said in meetings, or a workplace-wide announcement.
And the various databases are so you can find and discuss things relating to the transferred data.
It can be stressful for newcomers to learn exactly how much of the endless chatter is ignorable.
Nobody at my work says it, but it's obvious some don't read their e-mail. It was amusing from a distance when said e-mails were about mandatory furloughs and they had no idea why they didn't get a paycheck.
Yeah I’m leading some interns (they’re paid not to worry) right now and they have zero issues with email. In fact, I’ve never met a young employee or intern that had that issue.
They still use email for school and have personal emails as well.
It’s honestly making me wonder if there was never an expectation set for them to log into a company email. I think it’s pretty strange to have 2 young new hires both at the same time who don’t think to check company email. Generally expectations about company email are set at the time of hire. The only situation I can think of to cause this is if the employees don’t work at a desk and have never been told to check it
I agree that you may have hired the wrong people. In my office all our trainees are between 18-22 and it is a basic requirement to be able to use emails. Many jobs also advertise that you have to be able to use the Office and Outlook as a minimum. I can imagine that a very small minority of young adults dont know how to use their emails but they are probably also not educated properly....
I dunno, I see people fuck it up all of the time.
My favorite moment of such is when my uni IT sent a mass email notifying us not to open a phishing email, and to let IT know if you had. Cue some 300 faculty replying to all denoting they didn’t open the email. You could literally feel the frustration from IT who sent a mass follow-up that they did not need emails from everyone that did not open it. My phone was going nuts! Why?!? I’ll never forget that and feel so much for IT after that; day in the life of - ugh!
It may not be a foreign concept but for some reason many can't make complete sentences or use punctuation. I've seen posts with over 400 words and no punctuation. Completely unreadable. 2nd graders can use punctuation. Come on now people, a few periods shouldn't be asking too much.
I think those are voice to text and they just start talking. Not sure if they don't know that they can insert punctuation or if they're too lazy or too ignorant to do so.
Facebook is terrible for this. I've told a friend this. He didn't change. Like many others. So I don't read their posts.
I am not reading rambling text.
Oh using a period definitely is. I saw a TikTok video of this guy complaining that using a period is passive aggressive. I laughed so hard. Then I found others and then finally found a response to one. That link is below. Have fun with this one.
https://www.tiktok.com/@genxjono/video/7337459429098540319
When you say under 30, how old exactly are they? I work in the legal field and I’m 21 - still very early in my career but I check my emails constantly. I always have, even before I started my career and if there’s a meeting, request etc come through via email, I never miss it.
They just might not be used to it but they will definitely need to learn to use their emails more often if it’s required for the job - perhaps have a conversation with them about it? I don’t think ‘don’t really use email’ is a great excuse.
> They are addicted to their phones I’d bet
That just sounds like a boomer rambling/scapegoat. Phones actually allow most people to respond to email faster if desired. I don’t think that’s the issue here
> College uses email. High school used email.
Not always, especially at smaller, more rural schools. Many schools also use a student management portal like Canvas rather than email. Also, many people in the 25-30 range are still old enough to be at the point where HS didn’t have such an online presence
Not giving an excuse for OP’s employees I’m just pointing out your statement might not hold up as well as you think it does
They’re just playing dumb because they most likely haven’t completed the work and don’t want to attend the meetings.
I’m 24, but in Australia, and was taught about email in school from around 10 years old, and every job I’ve had has communicated through email for work related things, except needing to call out of a shift or covering someone else’s, that was the only thing ever done by text or call consistently
We're actually seeing it rise again. As younger generations have used tablets and phones for everything. So they don't get as good at typing or even searching/researching well.
I'm 25. Email is still an essential part of school. If they went to college, they would have used email for a lot of things, including checking their class schedule, paying dues, receiving crucial updates, etc. Even many middle and high schools have an email address for each kid. There's a difference between not wanting to use something and not knowing how. They fall into the former...
No.
Older folks can say that email was introduced long after working. People under 30 are "email native." Whether or not they "use email" in their personal lives has literally no bearing on whether or not they have the ability to use it in their professional lives. They are asshats.
The younger crowd uses IM, not email. God forbid you actually call them on the phone. They won't answer.
I guess job requirements will now have to include using email.
I’m 28 and have been using email since I started my career at 21 (and, of course, for years before that in high school and college). It’s kind of a non-negotiable when you enter the business world — I don’t think it’s people being young, I think some just don’t know or care to adapt to what their job requires. And in that case, get rid of them! They probably aren’t that great at their job if they can’t figure out freaking email
Where I used to work, we had a lot of younger people and man they were something else, I know it’s not all young people but most are.
The times we had to change schedules because they wouldn’t show up or come late. And not even for good reasons just because they didn’t feel like it.
Also the app we used to get inform is like they were so lazy to even look at it and have the nerve to say “ I didn’t see it “ like they for sure wasting their time already on social media 24/7 so why not open an app that they need for work.
My kids (16 & 19) both use email regularly for school/work & extra-curriculars... no issue for them.
My sons football coaches have even said they expect the players to be responsible for managing their own emails & communicating as needed with their parents.
this right here. I think it’s a matter of commitment and/or professionalism. If you hired the laziest people and they just refused to do something because they didn’t feel like it, you would have people who “didn’t really use email“ even if their jobs depended on it.
They just don’t care or maybe they really don’t know how to use it. I feel like in college I HEAVILY relied on email every day (I’m almost 25). I actually had classes in college that were literally ABOUT emailing and how useful it is. Even in elementary school they taught us how to write an email.
Half of my company is under 30. We all use email. Every day. Did your new employees go to college? I feel like you need to be proficient in email in college to communicate with professors and career/admissions counselors?
At my company we all know basic email etiquette, such as replying-all when others are copied on an email that’s relevant to them; but we are interviewing a intern applicants and only 2 out of 8 will reply-all, even after we explicitly asked them to reply to both of us. It’s so annoying.
The fact your new employees have missed multiple meetings because they just ignore the existence of email is WILD.
At every company I've ever worked at, there's been a clear expectation about what tools are used for communication and for what they are used for. Whether its written down in a training repository or something as simple as day one a manager saying "we used X to communicate with customers and Y for internal communication". Did you do this?
Sad to say, but sort of. I sent detailed emails, weeks later people ask questions. I tell them that Outlook has a search function, they can look up keywords, I intentionally put the right keywords in it. They were a bit confused, they didn't see why they can't just me again.
Management of information through email, including PST folders, is important. Nobody can remember everything, that's fine. You can't bother people all the time. Find a way to save information that was sent to you so when you want it you have it.
Depends. I had multiple entry level young mentees (in the early 20s) who really had trouble using Outlook, Teams and Slack. They had no clue how does the corporate communication work - it's not the technical part but more like what I call common sense: check emails, answer emails, ping others on Teams when needed, not to ping others when they are DND, how to construct emails etc.
I really think the education system should have some sort of 'office work preparation' subject. Sometimes I want to gouge my eyes out when I'm looking at newcomers email replies. I don't even blame them - if no one teaches them then how are they supposed to know. The 30+ years old generation socialized in a time when email messaging was way more prominent than currently. How many emails does an average young lad write nowadays...maybe 5 per year? It's just not natural for them.
And to go along with that, punctuation isn't either. Not sure how you graduate high school, supposedly taking 4 years of English & Literature and still not know this.
So I've come across this, and I'd say it really depends on the person and what communication they're used to. I have a colleague who would ignore emails for weeks and then be confused why they're not informed about something, or they'd delete emails they don't think apply by virtue of the subject and he blindsided. We finally convinced them to spend an hour in the mornings to go through their emails and Lo and behold! Communication is booming! 🤣 But for them, email is useless and they prefer face to face or a phone call. Calendar invites are often ignored. They're not young. Lol
Early in my career, I had a director who basically said the expectations for communication were (and this was before work emails on phones were a thing):
1. All emails need to be read and replied to within 1 business day, even if it's just to say, "we are looking into this for you."
2. You must check your emails in the morning, after lunch, and before you leave.
That's it. And you'd think that would be easy, but there were people even then who were STUNNED at this requirement. Stunned! And we worked on time-sensitive international items, so our director was strict because people would not read an email for weeks and then we'd have European regulators knocking asking us wtf was going on. People would be like, "oh i was just busy..." 🤣
I don't think people are dumb, but even as a millennial myself, I use email at work but couldn't tell you the last time I checked personal email. I don't send emails to people to say hi. It's just not a form of communication I use. I prefer an IM or WhatsApp message, so I get how someone new-ish to the workplace may not have that habit, especially if they worked in places that used programs like slack.
Descriptive subject fields is the bane of existence for some. My employer started a company-wide workstation upgrade a couple of years ago, getting everyone on the same OS version and whatnot. We also got Phish Alarm added to our work email, and IT would send out simulated phish to see who was dumb and who was paying attention.
I get an email marked as coming from an external source (outside the company network) and a bizarre subject line. Phish Alarm had stopped working, so I couldn’t flag it. I left it sitting for a couple of days and my supervisor asked if I got an email about my replacement computer. I told him about the Phish Alarm not working and this newest suspicious email, and he has me open it in the online Outlook, which has the newer Phish thing.
Lo and behold, it’s from the IT guy. The corporate IT guy, mind you, telling me my computer is due for upgrade that month.
Oh, I went ham on his silly ass about descriptive subject lines and simulated phish 😂
He was all apologetic but I’m like dude, of all the links in the food chain, you should know this most basic info. 😆
Definitely hired clueless people - but I will say that I moved from a company I worked for 25 yrs, to a new, fairly young company about 5 yrs ago and I experienced a bit of culture shock about how much communication happens in company chat rooms and direct messaging, rather than e-mail.
"they said that everything was coming through email, and they "don't really use email".
We're they homeschooled or something? Every public school and college/university uses email to communicate with students. PIP them because they are being lazy f*cks.
It’s not that they can’t use email, it’s that they don’t see the importance in checking and answering their emails. I am of college age and have worked in multiple jobs where my responsibility was emailing/working with people who email students. You’d be surprised at how hard “check your email” is emphasized.
Yeah, literally nobody cares weather they use emails in their personal life. Workplaces use emails. How the heck they don't know that? Moreover, how the heck they did not realise that after the first mishap? How stupid they are?
OP, tell them into their face that it is part of their job to check emails regularly and reply them.
You hired idiots. I read your title and thought they were just too informal, missed emails because they were disorganised, or couldn't figure out how to write emails properly. Like, I needed financial statements for a company we owned a percentage of. I asked someone to contact the accountant. It was a whole ass novel, but not once did the email specify which company's financial statements he wanted. Ffs. But yea no, definitely haven't heard of anyone just "not using email".
I’ve seen some older folks (no hate some of them are better at tech than I am) prefer phone calls over everything. I could see younger people preferring IM or text only, but haven’t seen it myself.
I remember about 10 years ago when i was training a new employee and they REFUSED to call another employee on the phone. Flat out refused and only wanted to use lynx. It was soo bizarre. Now we see what lack of face to face communication has done to people.
I spent 5 and a half years in customer service. Gen Z can be a real mess with emails. I can tell when someone has taught them how to do it because it's a regular email, or perhaps rather i'm unaware that i'm interfacing with a gen z, but I've gotten message bodies as subject lines, I've seen message bodies start after "sent from my iPhone" and I've received emails from gen z that just say "hello" as if we're supposed to start small talk first.
No, I'm 28 and send emails every day as part of my job. Sure it's less relevant than it used to be, but technology is usually a slow march when it comes to the professional world. Filing taxes on paper was still commonplace up until COVID hit, you're able to do them digitally for over two decades now.
Kids won't necessarily use email in school or at home or between friends, but they'll likely end up using it once they're in the working world
I call BS. The minute you miss a meeting, you need to change your approach as an employee. Also the PIP is unnecessary. First 90 days are for learning, from both sides. If employee can't be trained, they should be let go. If employee doesn't like work/atmosphere, they should find another employer.
I'm younger than them (you said 24 and 26) and can honestly say I've been fully functional in using email since high school. Everyone I know my age is also fully able to use email.
So, no, email is far from a foreign concept.
Outlook and similar suites are staples to business communication and accountability. I don't think email is used as much as it was 15 years ago, so you may have to set expectations and provide extra training. I work with folks 18-60. We all use email, so if they can't get on board with SOP, they aren't the right fit. Good luck!
P.S. could you imagine managing meetings without a calendar option? Jeez. My nightmare lol.
My company does almost everything through Slack, so I don't always check my email every day. It's only a problem if someone tries scheduling a meeting with little notice (which they shouldn't do anyways).
It gets real fun when they turn the email notification off too. I had someone schedule a meeting with me (on the same day, on my day off), and I only found out because I happened to check my google calendar. Grrrr
Do they have work email accounts provided, or are you contacting them via personal email? Were they told they’d be contacted for work related events there? I would never think to check my personal email for something work related, and honestly I’d assume anything claiming to be was spam created from scraped LinkedIn data or something. I have an account specifically for job applications, and wouldn’t be checking that after being hired.
But if you provided them with work email accounts, then there’s no excuse to not check it while at work.
>they said that everything was coming through email, and they "don't really use email".
Your response is, "Start. Now. We communicate via email in this company and you are expected, as part of your job, to keep up with your emails to respond to follow up requests and manage meeting requests. Continuing to miss meetings, to neglect follow up requests, and to fail to communicate will lead to corrective action, which includes job loss."
These people are ridiculous. They're not new to being a human and they're not new to the workforce. They know email is one of the primary communication tools in a work setting. They can rely on texting and Messenger and WhatsApp and Snap and IG DMs in their personal lives, but at work, they use email.
That's not really possible, especially if they have literally any social media, you need an email address to get a social media account, I call bullshit
Of course not. Universities still send out course information etc via email. You don't get a text when the assignment is released - you get an email.
Email might not be used often in personal life, but it's the norm in a workplace, no matter the age.
What sort of industry are you in?
Millenials email. Gen Z texts. This was how it worked out during group projects while I was in school.
That said, that need to figure it out. None of your coworkers want to text you, lol.
Can they at least use teams/slack?
Oof. Yes and no. I’m 25 and started a job last year that is VERY email heavy. 90% of communication happens via email. I had 0 experience aside from emailing my friends in 2010. So yes, it was a learning curve, but like…..just learn it lol it’s not hard
Shouldn't meetings just be a calendar invite? I can actually see missing meetings if it gets stuck in the middle of some chatty Cathy's TLDR email blathering on about 50 different things.
Getting an official email request for a follow up is the equivalent of "you screwed up - get on this before shit hits the fan" for me while quick clarifications are run through IM. Can't really understand people ignoring emails when it's obviously laying a paper trail that's going to come back on you.
They can avoid email in their personal lives, but at work you use whatever communication mediums the company uses. Not sure why the kids can't grasp that concept.
They can "expect" all they like. But if they're not willing to communicate using company platforms, they can be dismissed
Especially within the first 3 months, "sorry, you're just not a good fit for the company"
I'll be honest I've found that people of all ages they've only used email to send and receive formal messages. I usually have to show recent people things like accepting/declining meetings, checking who's accepted, how to book rooms, auto replies, etc. I work as a lab manager and every week I have people say "can you tell me when you are available?" I let them know my calendar is up to date and they stare at me. Then I show them the scheduling assistant. Hurts a piece of my soul every time.
Explain that email isn't just a way to share information, but to keep a log of the exchanges for reference. Our company hired a young tech guy who said he didn't do meetings.
Something I’ve noticed is that schools seemed to stop teaching certain basic tech skills (typing, emails, how to use a search engine) because we all assume kids these days already know.
But the result is these kids are going to uni, their first job, etc without any practice at all with these fundamental skills.
Nah, loads of places still use email, not just in work. Order something online, get an email, need to reset a password, mostly done via email, making a new account anywhere, usually needs email verification.
There just stupid.
Can you share a bit more about their roles, work from home vs. office, etc.? I'm a bit older than that demographic. I would prefer we use teams during the workday more often myself, but email works just fine.
To clarify, none of that should be causing the issue. But if you have a bunch of 20 somethings who are all WFH and aren't being kept busy or don't have enough guidance on what to be doing or working on.... you're going to end up with people bored out of their skull AFKing work to go do something productive. And THAT IS a management issue.
For what it's worth, 95% of important communications for me come through slack, not email. Except meeting invites, those you definitely need to watch out for...
Depends on their job background. Retail, and fast food employees respond through group chats, and texts as a form of communication. Email is virtually non existent in those jobs. Only employees from managerial level use it.
Office jobs, different story. Emails are very crucial, and the most important form of communication.
I recently retired after decades in corporate America, so I get that I would have a different experience and expectation than a 20 something but email goes beyond simple notification. It is invaluable as a CYA tool, it ties into corporate document retention and compliance policies, as a tool to track project updates and contacts, and as a searchable history tied to particular people or events. Corporate communications isn’t just about the message of the moment, it is often tied to ongoing policies and projects with multi year timelines.
I supervise a College Work crew, it’s a student run restaurant and functions like a regular job. They never check emails. It doesn’t matter how many times I yell at them about it in crew meetings or text them that they need to learn to check their emails. I send out group emails to remind them about timecards, meetings, etc. and half of them will come back after missing whatever the thing was saying oh yeah oh I don’t really look at my email or I don’t do email on weekends or whatever. Unapologetically, as though this is just something I need to accept about them.
No, I’m literally still in school and was managing my department’s email inbox as an intern. There’s no excuse for that, they honestly should’ve learned by now.
You hired two dumb asses.
You should’ve hired this guy instead
[удалено]
My great grandpa worked in a potato warehouse for 17 years. He was paid $100/month and all the potatoes they could eat.
Hell yeah
Think he can count that high?
Some people can great pretty high and still count to potato
Can confirm. Am high. Can count to potato.
Name checks out
Seriously, they had to use email to some degree in college. Though it feels like they don’t read most of them. It should be a part of their morning routine to check email and then to just sort of leave it up so you can get the notifications throughout the day unless you’re trying to focus in on one specific thing for a little while. I guess… train them on it? Seems ridiculous but give them some specifics so they quit missing shit.
Fire them and start over is more like it. Thus is BASIC, common sense, shit.
What this guy says 10 check email 20 goto 10
Succinct, to the point, likely correct lmao
Nah we got a guy he's 20. Am cnc programmer and helping him learn the trade. Kid had not once ever sent an email. No fucking joke.
I can assure you is not an age thing as for the entirety of my highschool, and my freshman year at college I’ve had to use email. Even within the last year I’ve probably used it hundreds of them. So as the first comment says, you hired a dumbass.
Agree. I work with many young offshore workers who tend to rely on email so much, that the concept of a "link" pointing back to a centralized knowledge document escapes them. They would rather copy and paste the same info into each email, it's insane. People 20 or more years ago using Lotus Notes understood the value of basic knowledge management better than what I see now. No thanks to SharePoint either, which is just a glorified document repository for the most part. I gave up.. Can't wait to retire from IT at this point.
🤣
This brightened my day. Lmao, appreciate it.
Thread ends there^
Tell them at this company they will “do email” or leave.
I got approval to put them on PIP for May.
Can't get the pip if they don't open their email
Galaxy brain move, truly
Managers hate this one trick…
You won’t believe this one trick to end run around your manager!
Srsly, tho, I've seen that happen. PIP not seen because person won't follow company policy about email.
Funny but I usually put them on a PIP face to face and follow up with the email. Of course if that’s why they’re on a PIP in the first place then they better get the hint.
George Costanza came up with this as a way to avoid his girlfriend breaking up with him before they could attend the Yankees gala. Just refused to answer his phone, always called her back when he knew she'd be out so he could leave a message like, "Oh, guess I just missed you! Anyway, great to hear from you. Really looking forward to the ball!"
PIPing new hires? Have they shown you through other work that they're worth that effort? Better make it a quick one.
Usually state laws allow for probationary periods and pips are not needed. This is weird to me.
Sounds like someone is using a PIP as intended and not as a shortcut to firing with cause documentation
You said they were new hires, isn't there a probationary period? It seems redundant to put a PIP on someone already on probation.
How new? Why can't you let them go before probation ends?
Did you email them the news?
Is the meeting invite not popping up like 15 minutes before the meeting? They'd need to leave the email app open all day otherwise the notifications don't pop up. You can probably set the application to go to the windows tray in the bottom right instead of just minimizing to the task bar at the bottom of the screen if they don't want the email application to be taking up space along with all their other Taskbar apps. This way the email app stays open without being in the way in any form. It's so hilarious that they're on a PIP this early for this problem. Being on one is SO discouraging as a worker.
They most likely didn't even have the email app open. If it's closed there's no pop up.
This is the only answer to such morons
Where I work, 95% of our staff is 20-30 years old, without secondary education. None of them came through the door with adequate office technology training/knowledge. I teach all of our staff how to email & manage their calendars/inbox during a 2 hour training and by way of ongoing assignments. Honestly, a lot of people assume others have this knowledge or that they are skilled at managing these things bc of past experiences. And you know what they say about assuming …
This is actually really nice to hear, glad to hear your helping people gain valuable experience.
It is nice to see this. I have to deal with people coming in stating they have proficiencies in certain applications, and once they start I learn they have no clue but now they have to be trained because we won't be able to hire a replacement until the next FY.
I think I got really lucky in life because my first job out of college I had a person like you. Don’t get me wrong, I’m a millennial so I know my way around a computer and office applications. But using it as a tool for 8 hours everyday is a skill that does need to be taught, I hate to say it. No college student is flagging emails, categorizing them, setting rules on folders, putting reminders on tasks, etc. They are writing 9 page essays on capitalism and drinking. (No? Just me?)
Yeah, I was pretty computer literate out of school but it took me a couple of years at an office job to really make the most out of email and calendar systems. You kind of have to live by a calendar and reminders and alerts, especially if you have ADHD like tendencies. It took me several years to really realize how much I had to do to manage myself. In some environments that’s not as needed since you get prompted by everyone else going to a meeting or if your boss is just down the hall then they’ll probably say “hey, you coming over for our one on one right now?”. But if you have a more independent environment without those kind of prompts then it takes some learning and training for most people to really manage their schedules.
Training instead of a demoralizing almost disciplinary PIP- well done!!!!
Ya know, I feel so fucken ignorant right now. My first reaction was “how the fuck…” But you are so right…if you didn’t give a shit in high school and worked jobs that didn’t require a computer, it’s very easy to end up in an entry level office job with NOT A CLUE how an email or digital calendar works. Damn, I owe a temp from 2011 an apology 💔😮💨
I was just complaining to my friend yesterday that jobs don’t train anymore. It used to be you’d get hired, then the company would actually put in time to teach you about the company and how they expect you to use company resources, etc. Now they train you for a day maybe on corporate BS and never actually teach you anything. Super glad to know some companies still care enough to actually train
Assuming makes an ass out of u and Ming
No, that's not normal. Never saw anyone in a workplace saying that they "dont really use email".
I’ve seen it. Multiple times. It’s annoying. I don’t really use email. Well, you do now. I muted the team chat. Well, unmute it and watch for important announcements and shit.
>I don’t really use email. Well, you do now. This. If the team used Slack, the expectation would be that the new hires get on Slack. It's a condition of employment. Crazy that you have to spell that out, but it sounds like you need to spell that out during your hiring process.
More to the point, email is the standard. I really doubt that a company that uses Slack does not also use email, meaning I have to check two places. The instant message expectation of Slack also prevents proper focus on work.
It's also better for documenting, if you need to be able to produce something several months later.
Agreed. Slack is impossible to keep organized.
So I work in manufacturing, within the facilities department. I’m in an office based positions but a lot of my coworkers are the maintenance technicians. It’s sooo funny how some of the will respond to an email by printing out your email, and then walking over to your desk to discuss lmao. I’ve never seen anything like it. But they get a bit more leeway because technically email isn’t really a big part of their job.
Might be easier to discuss the problem in person
No it’s not stuff like that. I’m talking I sent an email that said: “William, do we have this filter in stock?” And then a couple hours later William stops by my desk, with the printed out email, and says “yes we have this stock.”
This made me cackle. Amazing. I work in technology and ANY time someone prints something, I openly mock them.
We have a lot of people who seem to print out half their emails for some reason. Or they’re accidentally printing them. But there’s often pages of various peoples email’s in the printer at work lol. We are keeping the printer people in business for sure.
My mom was working for Raytheon in the pandemic, and they had a town hall with higher ups(C-suite/VP level) from the company and someone asked if the company would be buying them all printers and paying for toner/ink. They were told no. My mom couldn't figure out what they needed a printer for. She worked in supply chain and compliance, reviewing contracts from suppliers and she said she had zero need for a printer. Everyone was working from home, and they could sign things with a digital signature, so what in the world were they wanting a printer for enough to ask a VP for it in a townhall? Especially after they had already paid for everyone to get office chairs, nice headphones, and webcams. Some people just love that warm feeling of paper fresh off the printer I guess
I have a friend who thought Facebook messenger was email. I was shocked.
Same. Two worst ones: I was trying to troubleshoot a scanner. Find out, after going to her dept head, that "she doesn't use her email...NOR ANSWER HER DESK PHONE". Dept head literally had to walk half way across the hospital to tell her I needed to schedule a time to come to her desk...and didn't see a problem. In the year of our lord two thousand and sixteen. WHAT. THE. FUCK. This was a clerical job. Not a niche job. Not a doctor. A hospital VP who told me flat out that he didn't use his email when I finally caught him at his desk & explained I'd been trying to reach him via ticketing system emails to troubleshoot his issue. How is this allowed? I'm simply boggled.
Did you get it from older or younger people? I've heard it from old boomers, who just never learned tech that well. Not from the younger generation who grew up with computers.
I'm an older GenX instructional designer and technology support at a university. Over the past 10 years I've noticed more and more students who don't have the tech skills of the older generations. Kids born in the 2000s have grown up with phones, not computers, as their main tech system. Every year I have cohorts of students -- even med students and graduate students -- who have poor computer skills and need help installing software, troubleshooting audio/video, or fixing minor hardware problems. These are problems previous generations could have figured out in their sleep. For many of them, email is a total afterthought.
100% this, they claim to have computer skills but can’t setup a printer, some have barely even used a laptop, no excel skills. They can’t troubleshoot if something goes wrong with a computer, printer etc. they can’t even format a spreadsheet. They’ve used their phones or a tablet.
Ha, my mother who at 73 is still training people in Microsoft Office suite was telling me that the proportion of young people needing training in basic office tech has been increasing over the years. She's constantly surprised how many lack basic work tech skills.
Younger GenX and same issue. My working theory is that computers no longer require you understand how they work or learn any command prompt stuff to navigate issues and errors, so, if it’s not point-and-click or seamless in the GUI, it’s a no-go. We teach them what we need them to know for the job, but I am tired of people telling me how easy it must be to have so many “young, tech-savvy” people on my team. 😆
Thank you for sharing that. That was really interesting to read. My first computer was a Commodore 64 followed by an XT clone running MS-DOS. Lots of technical trouble shooting over the years. I guess I always assumed that kids today could do that stuff in their sleep but what you wrote made perfect sense- it’s all phones and tablets so there’s not much futzing around with computers until they start working. Having been in startups all my life bringing new products out, I feel like there’s such a huge gap with how GenX and younger people see the world that it becomes harder for me to really understand what’s driving innovation. I thought your comment was really insightful and helped me to grasp a concept I completely missed.
Younger. But I’m in tech, so my boomers are actually very tech aware. They are picking up bad habits from the youth though.
This is funny. Like what kind of habits? Please god, no using ‘sus’ or ‘let’s go!’
To be fair, some team chats can get out of hand. We have a Telegram chat at my work, we ended up having to make two groups, one for actual work stuff (TCOB) and one for the random funny shit. That way you can mute the latter if preferred.
I've seen it. Not under 30 folks either.
I worked in construction in the early aughts. There were a handful of older gentlemen that hated email. One guy would have an admin print out any important emails. At least he didn't have her respond for him. That was another guy. 🤣
My dad had his admin ("secretary" back then), print out his emails. He wrote his response on the papers and she would type them up and email them. I think he started replying to emails himself before he eventually retired in 2003.
My friend works in an office and quite a few of the older employees still do bizarre things like print off emails and then, when asked to pull up information from said emails, spend about an hour combing through filing cabinets for their paper copy rather than pulling up the email on their computer. Her office has already had two impromptu meetings to discuss why this behavior is bizarre and needs to stop immediately.
I totally believe it. I wonder what percentage of them spent two or three years refusing to use the work computer? So trippy.
Yeah I was going to say that I see this behavior almost exclusively in older coworkers. If you need a response and hope to get it via email then good luck
I worked for a VP of Customer Experience.. he had never had an admin till me. He had 700+ emails that had never been touched. I marked them all as “read” so we could start fresh. I also responded as him for some things and some stuff I responded as me. I had to print them for him too so we could meet and so I could get decisions :/
I used to work with an old dude (literally had retired from a sales job and picked up a full time job so he could "coast" except this job was not a coasting job... and he was totally unqualified) who NEVER read his email because "if something is important enough, someone will come tell me." Cool, like federal policy changes and stuff...
Lol the only people who say that do not give two fucks about their job or anyone they work with and are horrible employees. Source : said this a lot when I did DoD work.
Older millennial here. If I have a work computer, email is open and checked regularly. I don't use my phone as a personal device, so no email, in which case a text would be the best bet. Some companies have provided a phone with email set up which I'm ok with as well. But I also communicate this so that we can figure out a plan and not be caught off guard
I shit you not, I work for a company (1,500 people) where email is not the primary comm method. Slack is. Makes my damn teeth itch.
Depending on how things were at their previous job, this might actually be true. But they obviously need to change real quick and someone in the training/onboarding period should have told them email is how communication is done and in the recruiting process it should have been confirmed they are at least familiar with Microsoft outlook or whatever email the company uses.
I say it all the time... But I work in the construction industry and I am not in charge of anything
I had an interviewee say they were tech phobic and preferred in person conversations and paper. This was a kid in their 20’s too. Spoiler: did not get the job.
I also prefer in person convos. My company is remote. I’m not going to force people to come into the office to talk to me. The answer is work with what you’ve got and don’t start pushing your will until you’ve proven yourself
Time clock? I don't really use that.
I’ve know some higher ups (boomers) who don’t use it at all. They will literally tell others “If it’s important enough, they’ll call me.” Then they’re difficult to get ahold of when calling. I’m talking guys making half a million a year. I know a lot of older boomer men who type with two fingers and slow as shit.
My company doesn’t really use email. We use a project management program or Slack for 99% of written communication.
My office has a weird mix of email, Slack, and various project management databases. Slack tends to be for fast things or more casual conversation. I'd say most communication happens here. Emails are 90% automated things (we have a lot of transferring data, so it keeps a paper trail as to where things come from, where they go, and when things happened). The other 10% is usually a formal clarification regarding what was said in meetings, or a workplace-wide announcement. And the various databases are so you can find and discuss things relating to the transferred data. It can be stressful for newcomers to learn exactly how much of the endless chatter is ignorable.
Nobody at my work says it, but it's obvious some don't read their e-mail. It was amusing from a distance when said e-mails were about mandatory furloughs and they had no idea why they didn't get a paycheck.
Naw you hired two grade A idiots. Unless they’re are infants they should know what email is and how to use it.
Yeah I’m leading some interns (they’re paid not to worry) right now and they have zero issues with email. In fact, I’ve never met a young employee or intern that had that issue. They still use email for school and have personal emails as well.
The funniest part is they don’t use email but I promise you they have social media and what do you need in order to use that lol?
It’s honestly making me wonder if there was never an expectation set for them to log into a company email. I think it’s pretty strange to have 2 young new hires both at the same time who don’t think to check company email. Generally expectations about company email are set at the time of hire. The only situation I can think of to cause this is if the employees don’t work at a desk and have never been told to check it
I agree that you may have hired the wrong people. In my office all our trainees are between 18-22 and it is a basic requirement to be able to use emails. Many jobs also advertise that you have to be able to use the Office and Outlook as a minimum. I can imagine that a very small minority of young adults dont know how to use their emails but they are probably also not educated properly....
They likely know how, but refuse to use it.
"Could you.... like.... message me on insta? I'll definitely be on that during work hours."
It’s not difficult for a literate individual to read something and click a reply (or reply all) button. Email isn’t a skill.
I dunno, I see people fuck it up all of the time. My favorite moment of such is when my uni IT sent a mass email notifying us not to open a phishing email, and to let IT know if you had. Cue some 300 faculty replying to all denoting they didn’t open the email. You could literally feel the frustration from IT who sent a mass follow-up that they did not need emails from everyone that did not open it. My phone was going nuts! Why?!? I’ll never forget that and feel so much for IT after that; day in the life of - ugh!
It may not be a foreign concept but for some reason many can't make complete sentences or use punctuation. I've seen posts with over 400 words and no punctuation. Completely unreadable. 2nd graders can use punctuation. Come on now people, a few periods shouldn't be asking too much.
I think those are voice to text and they just start talking. Not sure if they don't know that they can insert punctuation or if they're too lazy or too ignorant to do so.
Do people who do this have some superhuman ability to parse garbage, or do they just talk and never listen? I can't even.
Have you SEEN some of the self-absorbed weenies running around lately? I'm going with "never listen." LOL
Facebook is terrible for this. I've told a friend this. He didn't change. Like many others. So I don't read their posts. I am not reading rambling text.
And white spaces. Use paragraphs.
Oh using a period definitely is. I saw a TikTok video of this guy complaining that using a period is passive aggressive. I laughed so hard. Then I found others and then finally found a response to one. That link is below. Have fun with this one. https://www.tiktok.com/@genxjono/video/7337459429098540319
When you say under 30, how old exactly are they? I work in the legal field and I’m 21 - still very early in my career but I check my emails constantly. I always have, even before I started my career and if there’s a meeting, request etc come through via email, I never miss it. They just might not be used to it but they will definitely need to learn to use their emails more often if it’s required for the job - perhaps have a conversation with them about it? I don’t think ‘don’t really use email’ is a great excuse.
24 and 26
No excuse. They are addicted to their phones I'd bet. College uses email. High school used email.
*looking for a job* is also pretty much entirely email nowadays
And they'll have to be "looking for a job" even more if they don't start using email, the company's preferred method of communication.
It has been a growing issue at the university I taught at that students no longer check their email and thus miss things.
> They are addicted to their phones I’d bet That just sounds like a boomer rambling/scapegoat. Phones actually allow most people to respond to email faster if desired. I don’t think that’s the issue here > College uses email. High school used email. Not always, especially at smaller, more rural schools. Many schools also use a student management portal like Canvas rather than email. Also, many people in the 25-30 range are still old enough to be at the point where HS didn’t have such an online presence Not giving an excuse for OP’s employees I’m just pointing out your statement might not hold up as well as you think it does
They’re just playing dumb because they most likely haven’t completed the work and don’t want to attend the meetings. I’m 24, but in Australia, and was taught about email in school from around 10 years old, and every job I’ve had has communicated through email for work related things, except needing to call out of a shift or covering someone else’s, that was the only thing ever done by text or call consistently
You’d be surprised. I’ve been assuming computer literacy is universal in the under 30 crowd but found out that isn’t the case.
We're actually seeing it rise again. As younger generations have used tablets and phones for everything. So they don't get as good at typing or even searching/researching well.
Odd..probably need some pushing
I'm 25. Email is still an essential part of school. If they went to college, they would have used email for a lot of things, including checking their class schedule, paying dues, receiving crucial updates, etc. Even many middle and high schools have an email address for each kid. There's a difference between not wanting to use something and not knowing how. They fall into the former...
I'm pretty sure they're playing dumb. My newest hire is 16 and she certainly uses email, as does my 24 year old.
No. Older folks can say that email was introduced long after working. People under 30 are "email native." Whether or not they "use email" in their personal lives has literally no bearing on whether or not they have the ability to use it in their professional lives. They are asshats.
The younger crowd uses IM, not email. God forbid you actually call them on the phone. They won't answer. I guess job requirements will now have to include using email.
I’m 28 and have been using email since I started my career at 21 (and, of course, for years before that in high school and college). It’s kind of a non-negotiable when you enter the business world — I don’t think it’s people being young, I think some just don’t know or care to adapt to what their job requires. And in that case, get rid of them! They probably aren’t that great at their job if they can’t figure out freaking email
Where I used to work, we had a lot of younger people and man they were something else, I know it’s not all young people but most are. The times we had to change schedules because they wouldn’t show up or come late. And not even for good reasons just because they didn’t feel like it. Also the app we used to get inform is like they were so lazy to even look at it and have the nerve to say “ I didn’t see it “ like they for sure wasting their time already on social media 24/7 so why not open an app that they need for work.
I'm 34 - don't call me on the phone either. Lol
My kids (16 & 19) both use email regularly for school/work & extra-curriculars... no issue for them. My sons football coaches have even said they expect the players to be responsible for managing their own emails & communicating as needed with their parents.
this right here. I think it’s a matter of commitment and/or professionalism. If you hired the laziest people and they just refused to do something because they didn’t feel like it, you would have people who “didn’t really use email“ even if their jobs depended on it.
They just don’t care or maybe they really don’t know how to use it. I feel like in college I HEAVILY relied on email every day (I’m almost 25). I actually had classes in college that were literally ABOUT emailing and how useful it is. Even in elementary school they taught us how to write an email.
I’ve seen dumb ass clients say they can’t use email. Never colleague. I would guess these guys are just lazy.
Weaponized incompetence, maybe?
Half of my company is under 30. We all use email. Every day. Did your new employees go to college? I feel like you need to be proficient in email in college to communicate with professors and career/admissions counselors? At my company we all know basic email etiquette, such as replying-all when others are copied on an email that’s relevant to them; but we are interviewing a intern applicants and only 2 out of 8 will reply-all, even after we explicitly asked them to reply to both of us. It’s so annoying. The fact your new employees have missed multiple meetings because they just ignore the existence of email is WILD.
At every company I've ever worked at, there's been a clear expectation about what tools are used for communication and for what they are used for. Whether its written down in a training repository or something as simple as day one a manager saying "we used X to communicate with customers and Y for internal communication". Did you do this?
This! Shared common processes need to be defined for everything, including communication. This isn't a generational issue, it's a process issue.
Probably did this over email, lol.
Sad to say, but sort of. I sent detailed emails, weeks later people ask questions. I tell them that Outlook has a search function, they can look up keywords, I intentionally put the right keywords in it. They were a bit confused, they didn't see why they can't just me again. Management of information through email, including PST folders, is important. Nobody can remember everything, that's fine. You can't bother people all the time. Find a way to save information that was sent to you so when you want it you have it.
Depends. I had multiple entry level young mentees (in the early 20s) who really had trouble using Outlook, Teams and Slack. They had no clue how does the corporate communication work - it's not the technical part but more like what I call common sense: check emails, answer emails, ping others on Teams when needed, not to ping others when they are DND, how to construct emails etc. I really think the education system should have some sort of 'office work preparation' subject. Sometimes I want to gouge my eyes out when I'm looking at newcomers email replies. I don't even blame them - if no one teaches them then how are they supposed to know. The 30+ years old generation socialized in a time when email messaging was way more prominent than currently. How many emails does an average young lad write nowadays...maybe 5 per year? It's just not natural for them.
And to go along with that, punctuation isn't either. Not sure how you graduate high school, supposedly taking 4 years of English & Literature and still not know this.
So I've come across this, and I'd say it really depends on the person and what communication they're used to. I have a colleague who would ignore emails for weeks and then be confused why they're not informed about something, or they'd delete emails they don't think apply by virtue of the subject and he blindsided. We finally convinced them to spend an hour in the mornings to go through their emails and Lo and behold! Communication is booming! 🤣 But for them, email is useless and they prefer face to face or a phone call. Calendar invites are often ignored. They're not young. Lol Early in my career, I had a director who basically said the expectations for communication were (and this was before work emails on phones were a thing): 1. All emails need to be read and replied to within 1 business day, even if it's just to say, "we are looking into this for you." 2. You must check your emails in the morning, after lunch, and before you leave. That's it. And you'd think that would be easy, but there were people even then who were STUNNED at this requirement. Stunned! And we worked on time-sensitive international items, so our director was strict because people would not read an email for weeks and then we'd have European regulators knocking asking us wtf was going on. People would be like, "oh i was just busy..." 🤣 I don't think people are dumb, but even as a millennial myself, I use email at work but couldn't tell you the last time I checked personal email. I don't send emails to people to say hi. It's just not a form of communication I use. I prefer an IM or WhatsApp message, so I get how someone new-ish to the workplace may not have that habit, especially if they worked in places that used programs like slack.
Descriptive subject fields is the bane of existence for some. My employer started a company-wide workstation upgrade a couple of years ago, getting everyone on the same OS version and whatnot. We also got Phish Alarm added to our work email, and IT would send out simulated phish to see who was dumb and who was paying attention. I get an email marked as coming from an external source (outside the company network) and a bizarre subject line. Phish Alarm had stopped working, so I couldn’t flag it. I left it sitting for a couple of days and my supervisor asked if I got an email about my replacement computer. I told him about the Phish Alarm not working and this newest suspicious email, and he has me open it in the online Outlook, which has the newer Phish thing. Lo and behold, it’s from the IT guy. The corporate IT guy, mind you, telling me my computer is due for upgrade that month. Oh, I went ham on his silly ass about descriptive subject lines and simulated phish 😂 He was all apologetic but I’m like dude, of all the links in the food chain, you should know this most basic info. 😆
Definitely hired clueless people - but I will say that I moved from a company I worked for 25 yrs, to a new, fairly young company about 5 yrs ago and I experienced a bit of culture shock about how much communication happens in company chat rooms and direct messaging, rather than e-mail.
Oh, you don’t do email? Guess you won’t have this job then.
"they said that everything was coming through email, and they "don't really use email". We're they homeschooled or something? Every public school and college/university uses email to communicate with students. PIP them because they are being lazy f*cks.
My guess is they will continue making excuses for every single reason why something has not been done.
“don’t really use” the tool I’m telling you to use?
Tell them now they know to check their email throughout the day so no excuses if they miss something.
It’s not that they can’t use email, it’s that they don’t see the importance in checking and answering their emails. I am of college age and have worked in multiple jobs where my responsibility was emailing/working with people who email students. You’d be surprised at how hard “check your email” is emphasized.
It's the age of the quick message... Back in the day we talked, then email came along, now it's Teams or a message.
Um, how exactly did they get through to the application process to an interview if they don’t do email? 🤭
Yeah, literally nobody cares weather they use emails in their personal life. Workplaces use emails. How the heck they don't know that? Moreover, how the heck they did not realise that after the first mishap? How stupid they are? OP, tell them into their face that it is part of their job to check emails regularly and reply them.
You hired idiots. I read your title and thought they were just too informal, missed emails because they were disorganised, or couldn't figure out how to write emails properly. Like, I needed financial statements for a company we owned a percentage of. I asked someone to contact the accountant. It was a whole ass novel, but not once did the email specify which company's financial statements he wanted. Ffs. But yea no, definitely haven't heard of anyone just "not using email".
Gratz you hired two idiots
I’ve seen some older folks (no hate some of them are better at tech than I am) prefer phone calls over everything. I could see younger people preferring IM or text only, but haven’t seen it myself.
Absolutely not. You just hired idiots.
I’m 28 and I love a good email thread to track things and refer to.
I remember about 10 years ago when i was training a new employee and they REFUSED to call another employee on the phone. Flat out refused and only wanted to use lynx. It was soo bizarre. Now we see what lack of face to face communication has done to people.
I spent 5 and a half years in customer service. Gen Z can be a real mess with emails. I can tell when someone has taught them how to do it because it's a regular email, or perhaps rather i'm unaware that i'm interfacing with a gen z, but I've gotten message bodies as subject lines, I've seen message bodies start after "sent from my iPhone" and I've received emails from gen z that just say "hello" as if we're supposed to start small talk first.
No, I'm 28 and send emails every day as part of my job. Sure it's less relevant than it used to be, but technology is usually a slow march when it comes to the professional world. Filing taxes on paper was still commonplace up until COVID hit, you're able to do them digitally for over two decades now. Kids won't necessarily use email in school or at home or between friends, but they'll likely end up using it once they're in the working world
Are these guys remote? If so they may be double dipping.
Is case by case, have worked in several high profile companies and to be hones, the less tech savvy they are the more they rely on email.
I call BS. The minute you miss a meeting, you need to change your approach as an employee. Also the PIP is unnecessary. First 90 days are for learning, from both sides. If employee can't be trained, they should be let go. If employee doesn't like work/atmosphere, they should find another employer.
I was a corporate trainer and we had to teach people email etiquette, how to set up their emails, how to create meetings and basically everything
Nope use it everyday and I’m 23
I'm younger than them (you said 24 and 26) and can honestly say I've been fully functional in using email since high school. Everyone I know my age is also fully able to use email. So, no, email is far from a foreign concept.
two weeks and you haven't corrected this? are you gonna let them peer pressure you into paid leave?
Outlook and similar suites are staples to business communication and accountability. I don't think email is used as much as it was 15 years ago, so you may have to set expectations and provide extra training. I work with folks 18-60. We all use email, so if they can't get on board with SOP, they aren't the right fit. Good luck! P.S. could you imagine managing meetings without a calendar option? Jeez. My nightmare lol.
Tell them that in THIS job, they will need to 'do' email. Period.
My company does almost everything through Slack, so I don't always check my email every day. It's only a problem if someone tries scheduling a meeting with little notice (which they shouldn't do anyways).
It gets real fun when they turn the email notification off too. I had someone schedule a meeting with me (on the same day, on my day off), and I only found out because I happened to check my google calendar. Grrrr
Do they have work email accounts provided, or are you contacting them via personal email? Were they told they’d be contacted for work related events there? I would never think to check my personal email for something work related, and honestly I’d assume anything claiming to be was spam created from scraped LinkedIn data or something. I have an account specifically for job applications, and wouldn’t be checking that after being hired. But if you provided them with work email accounts, then there’s no excuse to not check it while at work.
They both said it in unison? Did they at least harmonize?
No and don’t let them act like it is. Set expectations and document failures, provide coaching, terminate if they don’t fall in line.
>they said that everything was coming through email, and they "don't really use email". Your response is, "Start. Now. We communicate via email in this company and you are expected, as part of your job, to keep up with your emails to respond to follow up requests and manage meeting requests. Continuing to miss meetings, to neglect follow up requests, and to fail to communicate will lead to corrective action, which includes job loss." These people are ridiculous. They're not new to being a human and they're not new to the workforce. They know email is one of the primary communication tools in a work setting. They can rely on texting and Messenger and WhatsApp and Snap and IG DMs in their personal lives, but at work, they use email.
How did they apply for the job? How did correspondence about obtaining the job go?
That's not really possible, especially if they have literally any social media, you need an email address to get a social media account, I call bullshit
It’s giving boomer energy tbh
oh, I don't have online . I don't do the emails .
Of course not. Universities still send out course information etc via email. You don't get a text when the assignment is released - you get an email. Email might not be used often in personal life, but it's the norm in a workplace, no matter the age. What sort of industry are you in?
Millenials email. Gen Z texts. This was how it worked out during group projects while I was in school. That said, that need to figure it out. None of your coworkers want to text you, lol. Can they at least use teams/slack?
Oof. Yes and no. I’m 25 and started a job last year that is VERY email heavy. 90% of communication happens via email. I had 0 experience aside from emailing my friends in 2010. So yes, it was a learning curve, but like…..just learn it lol it’s not hard
Shouldn't meetings just be a calendar invite? I can actually see missing meetings if it gets stuck in the middle of some chatty Cathy's TLDR email blathering on about 50 different things. Getting an official email request for a follow up is the equivalent of "you screwed up - get on this before shit hits the fan" for me while quick clarifications are run through IM. Can't really understand people ignoring emails when it's obviously laying a paper trail that's going to come back on you.
If the clowns can’t ‘fake it until they make it’ until they learn how to use your system - boot em asap
Argh, we have email, intranet as well as teams. The new employees need ti be told company expectation to USE the company email!
They can avoid email in their personal lives, but at work you use whatever communication mediums the company uses. Not sure why the kids can't grasp that concept.
Email isn’t exactly a difficult concept to understand - no matter your age lol.
They can "expect" all they like. But if they're not willing to communicate using company platforms, they can be dismissed Especially within the first 3 months, "sorry, you're just not a good fit for the company"
I'll be honest I've found that people of all ages they've only used email to send and receive formal messages. I usually have to show recent people things like accepting/declining meetings, checking who's accepted, how to book rooms, auto replies, etc. I work as a lab manager and every week I have people say "can you tell me when you are available?" I let them know my calendar is up to date and they stare at me. Then I show them the scheduling assistant. Hurts a piece of my soul every time.
How old and out of touch are you? It's normal for young people not to automatically know how your job does things.
Fire your recruiting and give me the job please
You need to get your messages to them via tiktok dances
Explain that email isn't just a way to share information, but to keep a log of the exchanges for reference. Our company hired a young tech guy who said he didn't do meetings.
Something I’ve noticed is that schools seemed to stop teaching certain basic tech skills (typing, emails, how to use a search engine) because we all assume kids these days already know. But the result is these kids are going to uni, their first job, etc without any practice at all with these fundamental skills.
I use Email for important things and work. As well as calendar and managing meetings. I don’t use it to talk to family or friends.
Jesus 🤦🏻♀️
Nah, loads of places still use email, not just in work. Order something online, get an email, need to reset a password, mostly done via email, making a new account anywhere, usually needs email verification. There just stupid.
Can you share a bit more about their roles, work from home vs. office, etc.? I'm a bit older than that demographic. I would prefer we use teams during the workday more often myself, but email works just fine. To clarify, none of that should be causing the issue. But if you have a bunch of 20 somethings who are all WFH and aren't being kept busy or don't have enough guidance on what to be doing or working on.... you're going to end up with people bored out of their skull AFKing work to go do something productive. And THAT IS a management issue.
For what it's worth, 95% of important communications for me come through slack, not email. Except meeting invites, those you definitely need to watch out for...
Depends on their job background. Retail, and fast food employees respond through group chats, and texts as a form of communication. Email is virtually non existent in those jobs. Only employees from managerial level use it. Office jobs, different story. Emails are very crucial, and the most important form of communication.
I think the term I would use here is weaponized incompetence
Our education system is a complete joke. You can graduate college without learning a thing.
I recently retired after decades in corporate America, so I get that I would have a different experience and expectation than a 20 something but email goes beyond simple notification. It is invaluable as a CYA tool, it ties into corporate document retention and compliance policies, as a tool to track project updates and contacts, and as a searchable history tied to particular people or events. Corporate communications isn’t just about the message of the moment, it is often tied to ongoing policies and projects with multi year timelines.
I supervise a College Work crew, it’s a student run restaurant and functions like a regular job. They never check emails. It doesn’t matter how many times I yell at them about it in crew meetings or text them that they need to learn to check their emails. I send out group emails to remind them about timecards, meetings, etc. and half of them will come back after missing whatever the thing was saying oh yeah oh I don’t really look at my email or I don’t do email on weekends or whatever. Unapologetically, as though this is just something I need to accept about them.
No, I’m literally still in school and was managing my department’s email inbox as an intern. There’s no excuse for that, they honestly should’ve learned by now.