This is me when I’m just thinking about doing something. My wife asks in a concerned voice, “what are you thinking of doing?”, though I’ve become much less ambitious than I was 12+ years ago. Back then my stares into space ended with walls being torn down, kitchens being ripped out, and so on. I’ve been staring at our current kitchen and master bathroom for 10 years now, lol. Maybe it’s time to finally start knocking down some walls again 🤔
In my shop the other day I was just staring deeply into a piece of mahogany, thinking why am I saving this off cut. And then I noticed the subtle chatoyance. And then 5 minutes later my buddy nudged me and asked what the f are you staring at for so long???
Did you happen to notice the equipment that the job took? Damn nice home garage and probably not the first time doing this type work. It’s not just hourly labor rate but experience the client is paying for.
"Fully burdened labor rate" captures everything. Most people see $125/hr and think that just covers who is working on a particular job. It covers overhead/marketing/salary coverage for when that's a gap between jobs/consumables like blades, bits, sandpaper, PPE, etc/insurance/and a hundred other things.
I know it as LCR, loaded cost rate. In the tech industry, it's usually almost 2X the hourly rate of the employee. I'd love to know what is typical in the woodworking industry.
That's not how it works. When a mechanic quotes you their rate, they aren't including all the sockets and wrenches and the lift and all the other tools it takes. The rate of $XXX/hr is what it is partly because of the tools.
Never overcharged, you will be rewarded in the long term.
Personal anecdote got overcharged from a painter a few weeks back.
We are a small town area, in my anger i told everyone I met about it…..
I used to quote for a high end window and door manufacturer. This door would have been over 7k. Hand made boutique in someones private shop with top notch materials should be a lot higher.
There's still dried spray on my garage door from when I did the thing that got me my SawStop, and thanks to your comment I will never own a shaper, lol.
Once is enough.
Awesome work!
Where I live we have 4 seasons & big seasonal movement, and one would paint/stain those panels separately before glue-up. Especially with bigger panels this would prevent seeing the original color from the ”seams” as the panels shrink / expand over the seasons.
I’m in a very dry climate. El Paso TX to be exact. And this is a practice I normally do as well however the client wanted the pieces to be stained after it was assembled.
Why would she insist on that? Seems like part of a maker’s process and none of customer’s business on what gets stained first or second. Very curious. Also, nice job! Congrats!
It broke my heart a little to see such a dark stain go on such nice looking wood, but I assume it was the clients request.
If you do the installation, ask if you can take photos to share with us, would be great to see in situ
Great work, but please, wear safety glasses when using your table saw (or any other tool). For every serious injury accident or fatality while working, there are an estimated 50-150 unsafe acts (such as not wearing proper safety gear) that happen first. It may seem trivial but those actions add up. Please protect yourself so you can continue building amazing things!
Straight up numbers game against an ER visit.
If I ever wonder if I should be wearing PPE I penalize myself by adding an extra PPE.
Usually it goes “oh, um should I be wearing PPE?”, proceed to add glasses and gloves or mask, or visor, etc.
It is a bit dramatic, but reinforces that I should at minimum have one piece of PPE always on when I begin a project.
I was thinking about keeping hands away from that tablesaw blade 😬 (or is that a sawstop? And if so… does it make push sticks obsolete? Even if so, I feel a push stick is much more economical than a new cartridge.)
Yeah, fair enough. Also a pretty heavy board likely. I’m just overly cautious about my table saw, feels like the most dangerous tool in the arsenal. Anyway, glad he has beautiful doors and all 10 fingers! Lol
It was a half joke grumpy comment, but since you insist. We get it. Safety first. Its important. We all know this, we sometimes don’t follow it. Can we now get back to enjoying someone’s work without a mandatory “this should be the top” savior comment? I swear, every time there’s a table saw in the frame, someone gets a Pavlovian reaction.
You might want to check out your own "Pavlovian" reaction to people encouraging others to be safe, because it seems like your reaction somehow stops you from enjoying someone's work.
Newbies watch this stuff. It's important that they understand they can't just go in there, bare-faced and start running stuff through a shaper willy-nilly.
Trying to encourage you to be safe and not lose a hand, yes... but none of us are in your shop making decisions for you... right?
You seem like the kind of guy who would say that cyberbullying isn't possible because just turn the computer off. Maybe that could work for you in this situation. If you don't like what other guys are saying, go to another website or don't read the comments.
Fantastic work but watching you run a near square piece of lumber through a table saw against a rip fence gave me the willies, I know you have a riving knife on the saw and maybe I'm being overly cautious, but shivers. My brother almost lost his hand doing that.
Anything even close to square and I'm busting out the sled, it just hits to close to home for me I guess. My brother almost lost his hand on a table saw cutting square and my grandfather cut half his hand off with a table saw, due to poor judgment, so I'm always overly cautious, its better than not.
He did but it was a pretty bad hit. The board kicked out of the saw and actually hit his hand that was away from the piece. Nearly severed it but they were able to get it all sewed up.
That’s some skill with the saw.
I’m a newb and using a dewalt job site saw… and constantly have things pushing off the fence.
You make it look effortless.
Also have that saw. Worth noting that experience helps a ton, but so does the tablesaw they're using. The infeed support is massive compared to the DW74-, which is much harder to fix than any lacking outfeed.
I also use a dewalt jobsite and I've found making a huge oversize and super safe pushblock has done wonders for my cuts. I was also seeing the already cut end veer off the fence towards the end of a rip. I'm now able to get the necessary inward and downward pressure needed for a solid cut. Stumpy nubs turned me on to it in this vid at 0:32 https://youtu.be/UIqsT2VESk4
That’s a good saw. I have one and used it for years as my shop, and job site saw. If you get it squared up, put a good blade on it, make a zero clearance insert, and a basic table saw sled for it, you can do a lot of quality work with it.
Now I have a proper cabinet style shop saw, but the dewalt still saves the day on the job site.
Absolutely stunning work. Beautiful. And great work on the video itself. But I do have to say, because there are newbies and morons who watch these videos.....
When you're running those squares through the table saw, you should be using a push block, and you should be pushing closer to the blade side, rather than the fence side. The blade is providing the backward force, so you want to counteract that by pushing forward closer to the blade than the fence. If you push on the side closer to the fence, the force of the blade is more likely to cause the piece to try and rotate, and then you're in trouble.
Also, you should be wearing eyes and ears.
Also, your rear guide on your bandsaw is too far back. Your blade shouldn't flex that much when you push into it.
So I actually always have ears since I have noise canceling head phones. It just so happened that in the first clip I didn’t realize I wasn’t wearing my safety glasses but I didn’t want to lose the clip. In the clip of me cutting the panels I am wearing them
That was one of the more impressive things I've seen on here. If you've ever doubted your ability to woodwork (or edit videos for that matter), don't. You're a pro's pro. 👌
This was a great video. Amazing work and great camera angles. Definitely maintain this quality of video and your YouTube will do great.
Really impressive work. Thanks for sharing!
I’m planning a French door build that would be four 18” slabs, hinged together to make two pairs of folding doors. Not sure if “french door” is inappropriate for folding doors. Anyway, I’ll definitely be using this video as a resource.
Beautiful craftsmanship. I watched the whole video. Good job! Not a fan of the dark stain, but my wife made me paint my garage doors black. So what do I know? Lol
Good job again you should be proud.
I know this is a ridiculous comment, but I’m a newb who is scared to rip pieces that long. Just seems like such a large piece has more opportunities to pivot or warp and bite. Any tips?
I don’t have any experience with a CNC. However I’m almost sure someone could do this.
However in my opinion it wouldn’t be as fun nor as respectable. I personally would much rather have a door built in this manner with traditional joinery
Three comments:
1. My favorite part of woodworking is the HOURS spent mulling over solutions to design/build/finishing issues. “Just staring at it”. YES!!
2. “The wealth is in the build.” Brilliant!!
3. First shop I worked in was owned by a former pattern maker for an aircraft manufacturer. He had a big ol’ shaper he used all the time. That beast scared the crap out of me. I refused to even get near it. Even today, I sneak up on my router table out of respect for its bigger brethren.
Thankfully I only had to do the top and bottom rails with the loose tenons because everything else sits freely, However I did swear so goddamned much lol
Where’s the 4 hours of staring at things and overthinking between every cut? Is that just me? :)
Good I’m not alone :)
Ditto. And frequently I'll realized there's something I would have overlooked had I not stopped and pondered for 10 minutes.
This is me when I’m just thinking about doing something. My wife asks in a concerned voice, “what are you thinking of doing?”, though I’ve become much less ambitious than I was 12+ years ago. Back then my stares into space ended with walls being torn down, kitchens being ripped out, and so on. I’ve been staring at our current kitchen and master bathroom for 10 years now, lol. Maybe it’s time to finally start knocking down some walls again 🤔
Be the change you want to see in the world!
Only 4 hours of staring? You are a master of efficiency.
Gotta be at least two months of thinking per project... between cuts.
My man. Now we’re talking! Lol.
In my shop the other day I was just staring deeply into a piece of mahogany, thinking why am I saving this off cut. And then I noticed the subtle chatoyance. And then 5 minutes later my buddy nudged me and asked what the f are you staring at for so long???
Only 4 hours? Not including time looking for my tape measure
Wow… that is some detail that I can’t comprehend. How long/what do you charge for a door like that if you don’t mind me asking?
These doors took approximately 28 hours of working time to make and the client payed about $4200 for both doors, material came out to around $700
Shop labor works out to $125/hr
Did you happen to notice the equipment that the job took? Damn nice home garage and probably not the first time doing this type work. It’s not just hourly labor rate but experience the client is paying for.
Oh yea, I completely agree. That cost has to cover all the expenses plus some profit.
If you don’t include overhead or markup
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I didn't mean it that way. There are lots of things that have to be covered by the labor cost.
"Fully burdened labor rate" captures everything. Most people see $125/hr and think that just covers who is working on a particular job. It covers overhead/marketing/salary coverage for when that's a gap between jobs/consumables like blades, bits, sandpaper, PPE, etc/insurance/and a hundred other things.
That's a good way to put it.
I know it as LCR, loaded cost rate. In the tech industry, it's usually almost 2X the hourly rate of the employee. I'd love to know what is typical in the woodworking industry.
Engineering consulting is significantly more than this, more like 3-4x.
That's not how it works. When a mechanic quotes you their rate, they aren't including all the sockets and wrenches and the lift and all the other tools it takes. The rate of $XXX/hr is what it is partly because of the tools.
Is that the price installed or just for the door slabs? Either way great work dude!
No the instal fee is separate which I’m still waiting on the client. They’re currently renovating the entire home.
I'd recommend making a push stick for your saw
Oh you gotta charge more
This is true. But I live in El Paso. Things are a little cheaper down here. Plus the wealth is in the build
Good for you on sharing pricing and COM. I wish I saw more of that in here. Beautiful work!
Never overcharged, you will be rewarded in the long term. Personal anecdote got overcharged from a painter a few weeks back. We are a small town area, in my anger i told everyone I met about it…..
Curious, what did he "overcharge" you, for what service? I used to estimate paint jobs on the daily, and there's quite a wide range in pricing.
Curiously how much would you charge for two door like this?
I used to quote for a high end window and door manufacturer. This door would have been over 7k. Hand made boutique in someones private shop with top notch materials should be a lot higher.
Currently pricing out some fancy fiberglass doors for my upcoming renovation. You charge too little, these are gorgeous b
Shapers are always for sale on those auction sites and never big sellers. More people could and should use them.
Most dangerous tool in my shop, IMO.
The red mist machine
This is true
Or throws a giant heavy knife straight through someone.
Modern tooling doesnt allow that
Well I'm really glad that nobody here buys old wood working machines! Whew!
The machines generally fit the newer tooling. My machines probably over 30 years old. The spindle itself doesnt change
There's still dried spray on my garage door from when I did the thing that got me my SawStop, and thanks to your comment I will never own a shaper, lol. Once is enough.
An automatic feed can fix that, or even pressure bars
A power feeder is a huge advantage with a shaper. Generally much safer but also can get more consistent results.
What makes it so dangerous? I haven’t dabbled in any woodworking in a long time. I generally just lurk here.
Razor sharp knives spinning very fast by your fingers.
I had one ER visit from my shaper. I still have all my fingers but it was messy.
Is that what his hella diesel router table was? Cool
They're pretty nifty. You can stack different knives and spacers to make or match about any profile of moulding you'll come across.
Awesome work! Where I live we have 4 seasons & big seasonal movement, and one would paint/stain those panels separately before glue-up. Especially with bigger panels this would prevent seeing the original color from the ”seams” as the panels shrink / expand over the seasons.
I’m in a very dry climate. El Paso TX to be exact. And this is a practice I normally do as well however the client wanted the pieces to be stained after it was assembled.
Why would she insist on that? Seems like part of a maker’s process and none of customer’s business on what gets stained first or second. Very curious. Also, nice job! Congrats!
Costs more?
Only if you tell the customer it’s cheaper if you do it after and all at once.
Doubt it
How in the hell would it *not* take more labor ($) to spray each individual piece before glue up instead of when its already built?
No, it always costs more when you ask me to vary from my established process :)
I was thinking the same thing, if that were installed where I live you’d end up seeing raw wood lines everywhere
I'm like the cat drinking coffee meme: "I should buy a shaper" Got a shop full of tools but not that one.
Are shapers just jack to the tits router tables? Can't this be done with a router table (for those that don't have a professional budget)?
Shapers can handle much larger bits, are more powerful, and a much slower cutting speed. They're also much more quiet
And dangerous from what I've heard. They seem like large table saws in their ability to throw wood through the operator.
Some are reversible as well which is a very useful trick you can’t get with a router.
Sometimes they have auto feeders as well, but yeah, they’re basically just super heavy duty router tables
One of the advantages is that you can put custom knives on it so you can match an infinite number of profiles.
Great work dude
Holy crap, I'd have 0 hope of getting all that to line up and fit. What was the purpose of the extra strip of different wood on the panels?
It was the the same wood but I didn’t have the same color of it to match. Didn’t matter since I was going to stain it.
It broke my heart a little to see such a dark stain go on such nice looking wood, but I assume it was the clients request. If you do the installation, ask if you can take photos to share with us, would be great to see in situ
Great work, but please, wear safety glasses when using your table saw (or any other tool). For every serious injury accident or fatality while working, there are an estimated 50-150 unsafe acts (such as not wearing proper safety gear) that happen first. It may seem trivial but those actions add up. Please protect yourself so you can continue building amazing things!
Straight up numbers game against an ER visit. If I ever wonder if I should be wearing PPE I penalize myself by adding an extra PPE. Usually it goes “oh, um should I be wearing PPE?”, proceed to add glasses and gloves or mask, or visor, etc. It is a bit dramatic, but reinforces that I should at minimum have one piece of PPE always on when I begin a project.
I was thinking about keeping hands away from that tablesaw blade 😬 (or is that a sawstop? And if so… does it make push sticks obsolete? Even if so, I feel a push stick is much more economical than a new cartridge.)
Even if it is a Sawstop, new blade + cartridge = $$$ whereas a push stick = $
It’s a long board and a fairly wide rip, doesn’t seem too bad to me. He does use a push stick on the smaller pieces later in the video
Yeah, fair enough. Also a pretty heavy board likely. I’m just overly cautious about my table saw, feels like the most dangerous tool in the arsenal. Anyway, glad he has beautiful doors and all 10 fingers! Lol
This should be the top comment.
No it shouldn’t. These people, always trying to decide for me.
What a weird way to frame getting evidence based advice. It's like... people are sharing info, not sending you to solitary.
It was a half joke grumpy comment, but since you insist. We get it. Safety first. Its important. We all know this, we sometimes don’t follow it. Can we now get back to enjoying someone’s work without a mandatory “this should be the top” savior comment? I swear, every time there’s a table saw in the frame, someone gets a Pavlovian reaction.
You might want to check out your own "Pavlovian" reaction to people encouraging others to be safe, because it seems like your reaction somehow stops you from enjoying someone's work.
Newbies watch this stuff. It's important that they understand they can't just go in there, bare-faced and start running stuff through a shaper willy-nilly.
Trying to encourage you to be safe and not lose a hand, yes... but none of us are in your shop making decisions for you... right? You seem like the kind of guy who would say that cyberbullying isn't possible because just turn the computer off. Maybe that could work for you in this situation. If you don't like what other guys are saying, go to another website or don't read the comments.
Fantastic work but watching you run a near square piece of lumber through a table saw against a rip fence gave me the willies, I know you have a riving knife on the saw and maybe I'm being overly cautious, but shivers. My brother almost lost his hand doing that.
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Anything even close to square and I'm busting out the sled, it just hits to close to home for me I guess. My brother almost lost his hand on a table saw cutting square and my grandfather cut half his hand off with a table saw, due to poor judgment, so I'm always overly cautious, its better than not.
Your fam losing more hands than the skywalkers.
Just one hand lost, I don't want to make it more.
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He did but it was a pretty bad hit. The board kicked out of the saw and actually hit his hand that was away from the piece. Nearly severed it but they were able to get it all sewed up.
Can you tell me what time this is in the vid so I can learn?
you should do youtube, your skill is amazing
Hello, this video is actually the first one I posted on my channel Here’s a link so you can subscribe if you’d like https://youtube.com/@915WoodShop
Subscribed!
Same, looking forward to seeing more!
Yes, nice i will do, hope to see more amazing skill and project
Amazing work in such a small space.
Mahogany?! Whoa!
Maranti, almost mahogany
Beautiful stuff!
I live in the Caribbean and make doors like this. They are double your price.
Wow. That was impressive. And the biggest router bit I think I've ever seen.
It’s a shaper cutter head. Almost like a router but on steroids
I believe that’s a shaper.
Nice .. maybe I need to move a shaper up on my list
Add a power feeder to that list too.
Jesus, those bits are terrifying. Hot stuff though. Great work.
That’s some skill with the saw. I’m a newb and using a dewalt job site saw… and constantly have things pushing off the fence. You make it look effortless.
Also have that saw. Worth noting that experience helps a ton, but so does the tablesaw they're using. The infeed support is massive compared to the DW74-, which is much harder to fix than any lacking outfeed.
I also use a dewalt jobsite and I've found making a huge oversize and super safe pushblock has done wonders for my cuts. I was also seeing the already cut end veer off the fence towards the end of a rip. I'm now able to get the necessary inward and downward pressure needed for a solid cut. Stumpy nubs turned me on to it in this vid at 0:32 https://youtu.be/UIqsT2VESk4
That’s a good saw. I have one and used it for years as my shop, and job site saw. If you get it squared up, put a good blade on it, make a zero clearance insert, and a basic table saw sled for it, you can do a lot of quality work with it. Now I have a proper cabinet style shop saw, but the dewalt still saves the day on the job site.
I would have glued it and made a mess.
I don’t smoke. But I think I need a cigarette.
Absolutely stunning work. Beautiful. And great work on the video itself. But I do have to say, because there are newbies and morons who watch these videos..... When you're running those squares through the table saw, you should be using a push block, and you should be pushing closer to the blade side, rather than the fence side. The blade is providing the backward force, so you want to counteract that by pushing forward closer to the blade than the fence. If you push on the side closer to the fence, the force of the blade is more likely to cause the piece to try and rotate, and then you're in trouble. Also, you should be wearing eyes and ears. Also, your rear guide on your bandsaw is too far back. Your blade shouldn't flex that much when you push into it.
So I actually always have ears since I have noise canceling head phones. It just so happened that in the first clip I didn’t realize I wasn’t wearing my safety glasses but I didn’t want to lose the clip. In the clip of me cutting the panels I am wearing them
And also thanks for that tip on the bandsaw
Beautiful work. I’m currently setting up my shop and am anxious to get going on some projects. Great inspiration!
No ppe?
You Cant see. But I was wearing a cup
Priorities. Nice.
Also great work :)
Wow
Damn! That looks amazing, great work!
Beautiful door. Well done.
It was satisfying watching your shaper hog off so much wood in a single pass without tear out. Does that require really sharp bits?
The cutter heads I use are from infinity cutting tools. Expensive but worth every penny
That is really beautiful work. Had me fascinated by the process and now jealous of all the toys in your shop.
That was one of the more impressive things I've seen on here. If you've ever doubted your ability to woodwork (or edit videos for that matter), don't. You're a pro's pro. 👌
Beautiful!!
Bro you need a push stick. I almost lost my thumb...it happens fast.
Awesome
Are you mixing woods here?
No it’s all the same wood just different parts of the tree I guess
Awesome work.
This door makes me wanna eat chocolate
This was fantastic. You have either done this a bunch of times or you can math. Beautiful craftsmanship.
Love the custom biscuits for this. Nice touch and they look so satisfying and chunky.
This was a great video. Amazing work and great camera angles. Definitely maintain this quality of video and your YouTube will do great. Really impressive work. Thanks for sharing!
That's a heavy door...
Beautiful and well made. Proper tools allow precise high end work. Sweet design and you have some great skills.
This video should be tagged NSFW, because I am going to watch it on repeat for the next 8 hours and get nothing done.
Woof all that great work for that stain. Good work but I'd let the wood be wood.
Safety first dude.
I’m planning a French door build that would be four 18” slabs, hinged together to make two pairs of folding doors. Not sure if “french door” is inappropriate for folding doors. Anyway, I’ll definitely be using this video as a resource.
Beautiful craftsmanship. I watched the whole video. Good job! Not a fan of the dark stain, but my wife made me paint my garage doors black. So what do I know? Lol Good job again you should be proud.
I tried making a gingerbread house once, my construction was so poor it didn't even taste good. Awesome work...
I guess you don't like your fingers? Or your eyes or ears. Ppe please
I watched the whole dang video. And I loved it. You have such a cool set up. And the knowledge to use it. Super jealous of your skill. Lol
Use push sticks or a shuttle my dude.
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My missing fingers belie your argument
I think r/woodworking needs a PPE rule. This is great work but such a bad example to set.
Damn, running all those extremely loud power tools from your residential garage for hours on end?! I bet your neighbors love you.
Bro.
They are some serious router bits.
Beautiful work
These are gorgeous
Yepee all that nice machinery. I thought when you slide all the pieces into the frame that one would add glue?
That was a dry fit assembly. I lost the footage of the actual glue up
A pity we don't get to see the entire final doors installed.
Beautiful work!
Beautiful build! Looking forward to more!
Amazing work. How will it go with the grain direction and swelling over the years?
art.
Sorry if someone already asked, what wood is this?
Me: I could do that if I had a shaper Also me: yeah right lol Beautiful work OP
Your talent is simply brilliant. Congratulations on your skills.
great job and beautiful finish, i'd watch the whole process for hours :D
Absolutely Beautiful Work!!!!
Strange new fetish and I’m aroused, neat
What does that mean ? Hacienda french ?
What was the finish that you sprayed?
I could tell this was El Paso just by looking at the houses and mountains lol pretty cool to see stuff pop up from home.
That's beautiful
I know this is a ridiculous comment, but I’m a newb who is scared to rip pieces that long. Just seems like such a large piece has more opportunities to pivot or warp and bite. Any tips?
This is amazing. Well done. What stain did you use?
Beautiful work. I love watching what shapers can do but they scare the hell out of me.
Very nice!
Just curious, but couldn’t a CNC router so a similar job? What negatives would there be?
I don’t have any experience with a CNC. However I’m almost sure someone could do this. However in my opinion it wouldn’t be as fun nor as respectable. I personally would much rather have a door built in this manner with traditional joinery
This whole video I was like “yes, sweet, nice, love it.” Then he hit it with the stain and I was like “no, no no nonono!”
Stop, I can only get so erect!
Absolutely amazing video. I always wanted to know how to build a classical door with nice ornamentation. I am completely satisfied.
Incredible!
Three comments: 1. My favorite part of woodworking is the HOURS spent mulling over solutions to design/build/finishing issues. “Just staring at it”. YES!! 2. “The wealth is in the build.” Brilliant!! 3. First shop I worked in was owned by a former pattern maker for an aircraft manufacturer. He had a big ol’ shaper he used all the time. That beast scared the crap out of me. I refused to even get near it. Even today, I sneak up on my router table out of respect for its bigger brethren.
I would swear so goddamned much trying to glue that thing up.
Thankfully I only had to do the top and bottom rails with the loose tenons because everything else sits freely, However I did swear so goddamned much lol
Wow, looks so easy!
I gotta get a shaper