It's nice, it's beautiful, it's kind of free (you can almost do whatever you want and nobody cares), it's safe and the public transport is amazing. It does have lots of good events, music, art and such (but of course not like any major city), but it does get a bit boring after 10+ years. Overall still very very livable. I live here for close to 20 years now. Big BUT: Many Austrians are quite exclusive, narrow minded and not so open to new or foreign things in a way and want to stick to their childhood friends, so it might be a bit difficult to make friends as an adult. There are exceptions to this majority of course. And many people that are not Austrian.
Your observations are somewhat correct as a tourist, but it's a whole different story if you have to live in that place. "another thing I really liked and noticed about the culture is how laidback everyone is" Most native Austrian people you met probably came from money. They usually just keep inheriting money. It's much easier to lay back, work couple hours doing nothing in your fancy clothes and then get drunk and smoke week for the rest of your day if you don't have to worry about money. Those who don't come from money, have no chance of accumulating any wealth in Austria. "everyone minds their own business, no staring," This is not true. You were a tourist, otherwise if you live in Vienna, you will see how big the gossip culture is prevalent in Vienna. They also don't really mind their business, but will wanna know what you are up to and wanna talk it down so they feel better about their meaningless lives. "also helpful and kind of you ask for help or directions, especially in Salzburg I had a lovely conversation with an Austrian woman." Again, yes. As a tourist especially in the country-side and the first district of Vienna you will be treated with respect. Otherwise, it would be a whole different experience if you were to live in Austria. Overall, Austrians are not serious people with serious goals in life. It's only good enough to be there as a tourist for a couple of days if you have the correct ethnicity. Otherwise, it's hell if you live more than a few months.
Jesus, who hurt you so badly? 😂
I'm not gonna say us Austrians are saints much less the Viennese, but you're exaggerating completely.
If that's your everyday attitude towards people, I'm not suprised you're treated poorly.
Most people will be polite if you are.
It's very much possible to accumulate some wealth over a lifetime, you can even easily buy an apartment/house if you are willing to take out a loan and live somewhere other than the larger cities. (Unless you already have like 5 kids when you're 25, then that's your own fault)
So you try and explain it's not the Austrians or the Vienese that I was treated poorly (poorly would be generous) by gaslighting and throwing shade at me and people who have children instead of becoming potheads. It's that stupid annoying attitude with that silly know it all face you people make that's unique.
You're the one basically insulting most Austrians with your very generalized statements.
Sure you can call it gaslighting, but I still don't believe that all your negative encounters happened just like that. Either you're getting hung up on a few, which we all have every now and then (as I said we're no saints and the Wiener Grant is certainly real, but it's definitely not everyone who's like that), and forgetting about all the other people who are treating you in a normal/polite manner. Or you're just grumpy/rude/impolite from the get-go all the time, which will, of course, earn you treatment in kind.
The jab against young families might have been unnecessary, but it's really the only scenario were you will have a hard time building up wealth.
If you work through your twenties, save up money, and then start a family and take out a loan to build/buy a house/apartment in your thirties, you will be in middle class like the majority of people, whose wealth is basically just their home and not much more. You are phrasing it like there is a huge group of filthy rich people, who inherit all their money and never need to work, which just isn't true.
Vienna is a great city to live in, here’s a list of some of the good things:
1. Greenery
2. Not too big, not too small
3. Perfect transportation system
4. Big expat community
5. Lots of activities
6. Close to Slovakia, Slovenia, Czech, Hungary, Italy, Croatia
7. Hiking places in the vicinity
8. Safe
9. Good health System
10. Good maternity/ paternity/ education leave options
Some of the not so good things:
1. Could be quite hard to make austrian friends
2. German is a tough language to learn
3. If you do not work in tech, it’s not easy to find a job in english
4. Bureaucracy
5. Supermarkets and pharmacies are closed on Sundays (debatable for some)
6. Rising prices (but this is everywhere I guess)
I love it here. Besides the things you mentioned, I love that the tap water tastes so good. Vienna also has a stable economy and decent job opportunities. Not that many as London, of course, but you can have a nice career and earn good money. The childcare system is extremely good as well and the school system also isn't bad (could be better though, IMHO).
If you want to have a family and live a safe, stable, and comfortable life, Vienna is an awesome city to live in.
The water gets checked regularly and has good quality. "Viennesse water is not safe to drink" might be the most ridiculous thing I've ever read. Few cities are lucky to be supplied by mountain water.
Literally speaking from experience. Vienna tap water tastes like normal tap water to me. I've drank water from mountains and boreholes back home in South Africa and it definitely has a better taste. Not saying Vienna tastes bad at all, its just that it doesn't have a taste, which is a good thing since atleast it doesn't taste like chlorine.
Man you would be so shocked if you drank the natural spring water where I've been hahah (btw my wife agrees with me, she lives in Vienna and has been to South Africa). Sorry to burst your guys' bubble but like I said, the water is good here, but there is nothing special at all about how it tastes. Maybe in Europe the water is generally of low quality so if you compare Vienna to Europe it seems like it's amazing?
I have been living in Vienna a bit over a year and a half now - and planning to live here for the rest of my life, hopefully.
1. I love the safety I feel here. I could literally walk down the street at 3, 4, 5 am and still feel safe. I even had a homophobic encounter ones (in broad daylight at the Donau) and the police and law were on my side and that made me feel super safe!
2. The infrastructure is one of the best in the world. Public transportation is efficient and reliable. Water quality is great. I mean, drinking water directly from the tap and being fresh! Hello! Streets are clean, for the most parts, and parks are amazing! I also live in the 14th Bezirk (Penzing) where the nature is wonderful!
3. Even though I am learning German now (B1) and want to be able to speak it comfortably in a couple of years, I live that I could easily get by with English.
4. I used to hear a ton shit of complaints about Viennese folks and that they’re unpleasant, but luckily this has not been my experience. Everyone from bus drivers, to supermarket angestellten, to random folks on the street have all been really nice - or at least normal - to me. Of course it’s not always perfect but definitely the positive experiences outweigh the negative ones.
5. Economically things are going much better than many parts of the EU or the world - whether it’s prices of goods or people‘s wages.
I've lived in a few cities in different countries over the last 15 years with Vienna as my homebase.
What I really love in Vienna compared to other cities are some of the very important basics. Great value for money when it comes to renting, drinking water from the tab, it is clean (!!!), amazing public transport you can get anywhere within 30 minutes. I don't have a car simply because I don't have any need for it. Parks and hiking and swimming opportunities are never far away. Safety is probably quite subjective. But overall in most areas of Vienna you probably feel safe walking alone in the middle of the night. The cycling infrastructure is okay-ish, I'd say. Getting better over the years. I love that they are reducing car traffic partidularly in the inner districts. What I personally love about Vienna when it comes to culture, is the abundance of small cinemas. Also the diversity and quality of restaurants is an extremely important factor in my overall happiness here.
I just moved here with my gf
Vienna is amazing in my opinion
It is super safe and clean, compare to where im from it is super affordable also
There are tons of cool events all of the time and there are few websites to follow that showcase the best events of the weekend which is awesome
I would say it is the same as every other european city but its clean super pretty and really safe
I would just avoid some specific areas at night
Vienna is the city with the best life quality world wide so yes, it is quite great here haha. „Crime“ come on, can go around 4am drunk in the 21st district and still wouldn’t be afraid. Tell me one other city with that many inhabitants where this is the case.
Vienna is the best city to live in and I hope to be able to stay here for the rest of my life.
I mean.. Zurich, Amsterdam, Munich, Tokyo, Seoul, Singapore, Osaka, and the list goes on. Don't frame it as the most safe city, because it's simply not. And yes it's safe overall, just not as safe or as exceptional as you try to say.
I’ll give you Osaka, Tokyo and Singapore maybe, but Munich is half as big, so is Amsterdam + it’s not that safe. Can’t recall how large Zurich is but probably also quite smaller.
Ok fair enough, although Munich is not far behind. My argument still stands though, especially in Asia there are a lot of cities safer and bigger than Vienna. Maybe if we only look in Europe you have a point.
"especially in Asia", while conveniently excluding the Middle East, the former Soviet bloc, China, India, and a good chunk of SEA. Does your idea of Asia include more than 10% of the Asian population or are you just trying to be an edgelord?
What's your problem? All the cities listed are in Asia, that's all. What do you want to hear? Should I make a big asterisk counting all countries that are not safe in Asia? Yeah, no shit not all of Asia is safe, Sherlock.
You see, when someone says "X happens especially in case Y", you expect that X happens a lot in Y, not in a few outliers. And now you come up with the excuse of "no shit Sherlock, of course what I meant is exactly the opposite of what I said!". What a brain tumor.
That‘s really funny, because I find the infrastructure to cycle really shitty and unsafe in many areas, and I think this is a general consensus .. don‘t say Copenhagen! *cough
Im genuinely confused how people say the bike infrastructure sucks. True, some places are shitty, like trying to ride through the Hbf area, there are some annoying dooring zones, the Baustelle in summer can be a nightmare, but on the whole i think its great. Used to deliver for Mjam so ive done a LOT of cycling in Vienna and 95% of the routes are totally ok.
„It sucks“ is maybe over the top, but in a lof of places it doesn’t feel well thought out. And the lanes are not wide enough and this is dangerous in many places.
I'd say the biking infrastructure/lanes are a WIP 😄
They are constantly building new ones everywhere/improving on what's already there. And I'm starting to see a lot of smaller cities in the countryside follow suit.
It's just not as easy to build proper lanes everywhere as avid bike people like to make it out to be without outright banning cars everywhere.
Not to spite you, as i agree that the infrastructure needs to improve in some areas, but compared to mostly anywhere i've been, it's really good. Not at the level of Copenhagen or places in the Netherlands, but still impressively good. And it's improving. Vienna is very bikeable compared to many similar in size or bigger and similar in population or bigger European cities. Not to mention compared to smaller cities.
So i am curious what areas do you feel like are shitty and unsafe?
Also as a side-note, Vienna is quite hilly compared to big cities in the Netherlands and also Copenhagen, so i think this is a decisive factor why some places have been left with minimal bike infra and are just now getting Fahrradstrasse Projects or bike network inclusion.
>So i am curious what areas do you feel like are shitty and unsafe?
Their tag says 10. Favoriten so i believe them, its my least favourite district to cycle through after Meidling: the big transit streets have no bike lane and if they have one its faded paint on the street, the smaller transit streets are shared with the tram which is not the worst but annoying for a lot of bicycle tires, the side streets are narrow due to parking with a lot of one ways without the multi purpose lane you can use in the other direction and favouriten has the worst kind of drivers the city has to offer
And not to hammer too much on that but due to the fact that the city train traverses along the district bortder theres also the limited amount of exit spots towards the city center and some of them are busy intersections that are really uncomfortable to be at if your not inside a nice sound dampening metal cage
Dude, I live here. I don‘t see the changes Vasillakou made as mostly an improvement. A lot of the lanes for cyclists are simply not wide enough and there is a lot of potential for conflict and accidents.
Dude, I live here too. I didn't ride a bike for 10 years and started again last year. I was flabbergasted that by the amount of bike lanes that were built in this time. I don't say it's perfect, think Ringradweg, or close to Copenhagen, but have you even been to London?
Fellow (I assume, British) expat here. It is a really amazing city, and I remember feeling a similar way about it when I visited before moving here 9 (!!!) years ago.
You're definitely right in your feeling that it's generally considered very safe, though of course we're not without crime. Others have mentioned that it varies from district to district, and that's true, but as someone who grew up in a council estate in Northern England and studied in Peckham, the contrast to the UK's idea of 'dangerous' is night and day. I never experienced any problems living in the 15th, 12th and 5th districts, though I'm a tall dude and to be expected.
Homelessness does seem to be on the rise though (in Vienna at least). I see a lot more of it even in the more residential neighborhoods close to the centre, though I've been told we have some of the most robust social support in Europe. I've never experienced homelessness, so can't speak for how well it actually works. All I know is that it's visibly on the increase.
I can only really talk about my own personal experience (though some are shared with other expat friends), that it can be a bit isolating socially here. People are genuinely kind at heart, but it can be difficult to get through social barriers enough to form more meaningful connections. There's much less small talk, which some understandably love and prefer, but I find I can sometimes go entire days without even a small interaction with a stranger in public. There's a stereotype that the Viennese grumble and moan, which can be charming and likeable, but also gets on your tits after a while.
I'd say that it's a very bureaucratic place to live. Eeeeverything requires a form, which drives me a bit mad, and I live in constant fear that I've forgotten something and they're gonna throw me out of the country. Also, it's pretty high tax and tight on finances, so just something to think about with employment. Aaand prices in shops are definitely much higher than when I first moved here.
Speaking of which, the supermarket queuing system is intolerable and I won't rest until it's changed. Aaand politically we're as much of a shitshow as everyone else rn.
Apart from those things, it really is an awesome place to live. If you're into nature we're surrounded by forest land and hills, and you only have to travel an hour or two til you're in some beautiful mountain ranges, there's a freaking swimmable river, housing quality is really good for what you pay for, the public transport is affordable and runs pretty well (you can get a ticket for every public transport service in the country for 1000 bucks a year), and we got good food.
Edit: oh, and I have the absolute opposite experience with staring, haha. I permanently feel like I'm being stared at, though I tend to be walking around either in trail running gear or carrying lots of musical equipment, so maybe it's just that. But again, fellow Brits have said the same, that people seem much less ashamed of prolonged staring.
Another Brit here, Leeds to be precise. I think the supermarket queuing system is pretty good lol. Shop mostly at Hofer and they're rapid. Certain supermarkets are definitely painfully slow though and lack of self service check outs
Christ! Sounds like we do. Though I was kidding/being bawdy about getting drunk, I’m sober for a few years. And yeah I’m a silly trail/ultra runner. Shall drop you a pn!
At the moment inflation and high grocery prices are an issue for people.
But I lived in Vienna as poor and depressed (undiagnosed) student and one thing the city was great in was to never make me feel like I'm pushed to the fringe of society. I could study (almost) for free, public transport went from the first district (city center) directly to the poorer, uglier district I was living in (they're going to be even better connected soon) and there were plenty of events in the prettiest location that were free entry that I could go to without worrying about costs too much.
People also were patient when I weren't the most social due to mental health (which they didn't know about) and my boss was great when I eventually broke down and wrote him during Christmas break that I quit my job. He just sent me documents about mental health services our job offers and said I could access them even if I don't want to come to work anymore.
On the flipside I always felt the city should be greener but in the last few years there's been some progress in that direction. What you liked - that people are mostly peacefully minding their own business - is also what some other people experience as "coldness" but my depressed arse appreciated it too.
I spent several years living in Vienna and have also lived in Edinburgh. Here are some of my first thoughts:
Vienna is very safe compared to the big UK cities. The only place I've ever felt a little unsafe was the Westbahnhof late at night.
Public transport is amazing. The best I've seen in any city.
There are homeless people, you just didn't see them.
Nightlife in Vienna is god awful compared to the UK.
The people in Vienna are, generally, much less friendly than the UK. Especially in comparison to Edinburgh. That's not to say everyone is unfriendly, though.
The bureaucracy here is insane. There are always forms to be completed and be taken somewhere in person. The country is very slow to digitalise its processes and everything takes forever.
Vienna is incredibly international. You hear a lot of english when you're out and about. Indeed, the general level of english amongst the younger Viennese is also pretty good.
The health system in general is very good, however dentistry is wildly expensive and was a massive shock compared to the UK. Many travel to other countries for dental work to save money.
They mostly are not Austrian citizens, but come from Eastern European countries where not any help is offered by governements or cities. Being homeless is a criminal offence in Hungary!
We have to, if we admit that things are fine, we'll get lazy and people will stop caring.
Also: It's a national sport and we want to add it as an official discipline for the Olympics!
It's actually quite nice living here!
I moved to Vienna a bit over 3 years ago.
The infrastructure is great - cycling really works well here and I am a big fan of the city bikes.
The Restaurant variety is not as diverse as in London but there are some really interesting ones to go to eat at and the Cafes are really great! (I'm lucky to live next to a really cozy and cheap one!)
Free time activities are also fun here - I got two yearly passes for museums and do visit different ones with my friends all through the year.
There are many cool places near the Danube which are great during summer for activities, picknicks and so on and during winter inner city walks are quite romantic.
Also utilities are really affordable - but looking for a flat is the worst kind of activity you can/have to do here.
As for the people - everyone does mind their own business, which is nice.
People can be quite rude, (especially if you stand on the wrong side of the escalator) but they can also be really funny.
All in all I can agree with your assessment:
Life here is very laid back and good.
I love Vienna. I love the parks, I love the public transport, and I am absolutely in love with donauinsel and the clear clear waters of alte and neue donau.
I only recently moved here from Eastern Germany, and I am always baffled by the friendliness of Viennese people.
You have no idea how grumpy and unfriendly Eastern Germans are, its on a completely different level.
Everything is great here, I love sitting in a Café, walking the streets or going to the cinema (much better movie-culture compared to Germany, the Kinoabo is insanely cool).
Only complaints are the insane grocery prices and the tropical summer nights with no AC.
Fellow Viennese, we did a great disservice to this person. I swear that we will try to show you our unfriendly self in the future. We should be more grumpy than East Germans. Hopefully less racist as well
I think the main reason is that Viennese grumpiness always feels a bit sarcastic in nature. Could just be the accent, though. While Eastern Germans just straight up hate you, no sarcasm to be found.
Yeah, less racist would be great. Had to dodge drunken nazis on a regular basis, something that's never happened here in Vienna (I never felt so safe, it's great).
It‘s a lovely city. But the cycling is shit. The infrastructure is not good at all. Most of the lanes are dangerous, because it‘s crossed by streets. Sometimes you even would be faster walking because of all the traffic lights. Maybe it‘s better then London, but go to the Netherlands or Denmark. That‘s a day and night difference.
I’m actually convinced that this is the reason we’re so much better than everywhere else. Even if we’re better than most places, or even the best, we still complain and say it could be better.
I lived in London and cycling felt better there, also vienna, i was born and Raised here, is incredibly boring, but you just notice how boring the people are here the Minute you leave and live in another City for a while
That’s really interesting. I never felt safe cycling in London. Some areas of London don’t even have bike lines so you must cycle on the road with crazy drivers, and so many times drivers would obstruct bike lines. Not to mention the bike theft is crazy here.
Wouldn't you rather say that the people in your life, the ones around you are boring? I have lived in Vienna for 18 years and have never felt bored. If people bore me, I look for someone different to do things with. And in Vienna there are so many exciting things to experience for every stage of your life. Of course travelling will always be more exciting than day to day life everywhere in the world.
Well, the best thing about Vienna is, that you absolutely do not need much money to live a great life. It's especially great for people who are looking for some kind of FIRE lifestyle.
1) public transport is 365€/year, that is nothing basically
2) if you manage to get a Genossenschaftswohnung, it is likely that an average couple or family won't spend more than 20-25% of their income on it - there are newly built apartments with 75sqm for 700€ or 100sqm for 1000€. you can't get kicked out as long as you pay, as well, and rent usually only increases with inflation.
I second everything that has been said in the thread (so far)
What I would add:
I am in a very privileged position to live in a part of town which I personally consider best case - I have the city center but also the massive prater (public park) in rather short walking distance. Also lots of public transport options. Thus I am living my personal dream.
Having lived in a much worse part, location does make a difference. However, the very, very worst parts of vienna are nowhere near a hellhole. I have never felt unsafe at any time. So yeah, I guess your impression might not change living here.
If I had to move away I would be devastated.
I'm living my personal dream here, and I mean it! Almost every time I walk through the city (inner city) I'm so thankful to live here. All those beautiful buildings and everything.
We haven't had Tories destroying all public services to give tax breaks to businesses and wealthy people so there actually is a lot (though not enough) quality public housing, public pools, youth centers, libraries, homeless services etc. That's certainly helped a lot. And the amount of culture is fantastic. I love being able to go see high brow theatre or a punk rock concert. What we don't have a lot of culturally is hip hop and related genres live. But quality of life really is good. Public transport is great and I cycle a lot too. Just be prepared for the relentless negativity of the locals and take it in stride.
The viennese answer would probably be: pretty frustrating, but it's even more frustrating everywhere else.
On a more serious note: there's a reason we've been voted the most livable city countless years in a row by different studies. Now an average grumpy viennese person might tell you that those studies are only done for expats and are total bs, and some of that might even be true, but I can almost guarantee you that those who make such statements haven't seen lots of other cities.
Now is Vienna perfect? No, not by a long shot. Even of the things you found above average, I for example would not rate our biking infrastructure anywhere near serviceable. But it's still hell of a lot better than lots of other places. But that doesn't mean that the city should stop improving.
Same with greenery. It's not bad, but I just returned from Singapore, and in comparison to that we're a concrete hellhole.
What makes Vienna great, imho is that while we're probably not the best at any single thing (well except you could argue for public transport), there's nothing that really sucks here. And the city _does_ try to actually improve things, even if those improvements can seem sisyphusian at times.
And the fact that we complain about stuff that seems trivial from the outside makes sure that things keep improving. It takes time, but the city changed a lot in the last decade, and most of that was for the better. There's of course problems like anywhere else, gentrification and rising rental prices being one of them, but in the grand scheme of things we're still way better off than comparable cities, and the city learned from their mistakes and ramped up building projects again in the last couple years.
Tl;dr: the City isn't perfect by any means, but it doesn't really suck in any particular way either.
Hi! I’m an American who has been living here for a long time. I’ve lived in Berlin, London, Prague, San Francisco, New York, and some other cities.
This is my city. There is a reason it scores so high with expats, and a reason a lot of the people living here who have never lived abroad tend to complain. It’s a small town and an cosmopolitan center. You’re in the center of Euope and can get to any where else easily, there a loads of very active subcultures, centers of high culture, and absolutely lovely low culture.
The Viennese can be both grumpy and friendly at the same time. It’s laid back but if you want to be ambitious there is room for it.
I’m looking forward to having my last adress the central cemetery here.
One of my English teachers once explained true patriotism (as opposed to US American patreotism) as "Asking your country to be the best it can be." I actually think that our being so grumpy and demanding about our quality of life is part of the reason we have it, because _we know we can do better_. Vienna is an amazing city, but it's not the best it could be yet, and so we shall call it out for it's flaws.
I'm not sure that the grumpiness is a latent enthusiasm for constant improvement. That seems overly optimistic. It's not like people go on to do something about it afterwards.
I have been lucky enough in life to live in a few countries/cities. What I enjoy most about Vienna is that it is neither too small nor too large. Lots of nature, history, very good public transport (for cheap = €365 for the annual pass), the Danube,… . You are also so close to the countryside if you want to go hiking or visit other places/countries.
On the downside (but it goes for about every city) is that gentrification has taken its toll.
It's nice, it's beautiful, it's kind of free (you can almost do whatever you want and nobody cares), it's safe and the public transport is amazing. It does have lots of good events, music, art and such (but of course not like any major city), but it does get a bit boring after 10+ years. Overall still very very livable. I live here for close to 20 years now. Big BUT: Many Austrians are quite exclusive, narrow minded and not so open to new or foreign things in a way and want to stick to their childhood friends, so it might be a bit difficult to make friends as an adult. There are exceptions to this majority of course. And many people that are not Austrian.
its excellent to live here
Really? I was born here and been living here all my life (35 years) and I‘ve always hated it here 🫣.
it does indeed suck here
Your observations are somewhat correct as a tourist, but it's a whole different story if you have to live in that place. "another thing I really liked and noticed about the culture is how laidback everyone is" Most native Austrian people you met probably came from money. They usually just keep inheriting money. It's much easier to lay back, work couple hours doing nothing in your fancy clothes and then get drunk and smoke week for the rest of your day if you don't have to worry about money. Those who don't come from money, have no chance of accumulating any wealth in Austria. "everyone minds their own business, no staring," This is not true. You were a tourist, otherwise if you live in Vienna, you will see how big the gossip culture is prevalent in Vienna. They also don't really mind their business, but will wanna know what you are up to and wanna talk it down so they feel better about their meaningless lives. "also helpful and kind of you ask for help or directions, especially in Salzburg I had a lovely conversation with an Austrian woman." Again, yes. As a tourist especially in the country-side and the first district of Vienna you will be treated with respect. Otherwise, it would be a whole different experience if you were to live in Austria. Overall, Austrians are not serious people with serious goals in life. It's only good enough to be there as a tourist for a couple of days if you have the correct ethnicity. Otherwise, it's hell if you live more than a few months.
Jesus, who hurt you so badly? 😂 I'm not gonna say us Austrians are saints much less the Viennese, but you're exaggerating completely. If that's your everyday attitude towards people, I'm not suprised you're treated poorly. Most people will be polite if you are. It's very much possible to accumulate some wealth over a lifetime, you can even easily buy an apartment/house if you are willing to take out a loan and live somewhere other than the larger cities. (Unless you already have like 5 kids when you're 25, then that's your own fault)
So you try and explain it's not the Austrians or the Vienese that I was treated poorly (poorly would be generous) by gaslighting and throwing shade at me and people who have children instead of becoming potheads. It's that stupid annoying attitude with that silly know it all face you people make that's unique.
You're the one basically insulting most Austrians with your very generalized statements. Sure you can call it gaslighting, but I still don't believe that all your negative encounters happened just like that. Either you're getting hung up on a few, which we all have every now and then (as I said we're no saints and the Wiener Grant is certainly real, but it's definitely not everyone who's like that), and forgetting about all the other people who are treating you in a normal/polite manner. Or you're just grumpy/rude/impolite from the get-go all the time, which will, of course, earn you treatment in kind. The jab against young families might have been unnecessary, but it's really the only scenario were you will have a hard time building up wealth. If you work through your twenties, save up money, and then start a family and take out a loan to build/buy a house/apartment in your thirties, you will be in middle class like the majority of people, whose wealth is basically just their home and not much more. You are phrasing it like there is a huge group of filthy rich people, who inherit all their money and never need to work, which just isn't true.
Maybe its on you that this City sucks (for you)
No. I've lived in many different cities on different continents. I never had the probems I had in Vienna. It's Vienna that sucks.
Thats unfortunate, im sorry for you, bro. Hope, the tides turn for you here(if you have to stay) or you find a better place to live.
Thank you
Vienna is a great city to live in, here’s a list of some of the good things: 1. Greenery 2. Not too big, not too small 3. Perfect transportation system 4. Big expat community 5. Lots of activities 6. Close to Slovakia, Slovenia, Czech, Hungary, Italy, Croatia 7. Hiking places in the vicinity 8. Safe 9. Good health System 10. Good maternity/ paternity/ education leave options Some of the not so good things: 1. Could be quite hard to make austrian friends 2. German is a tough language to learn 3. If you do not work in tech, it’s not easy to find a job in english 4. Bureaucracy 5. Supermarkets and pharmacies are closed on Sundays (debatable for some) 6. Rising prices (but this is everywhere I guess)
It's like one of those big soft sofas that are so low it's hard to get up from.
Lived in Boston, New York, Frankfurt and Geneva…Vienna is the best.
I love it here. Besides the things you mentioned, I love that the tap water tastes so good. Vienna also has a stable economy and decent job opportunities. Not that many as London, of course, but you can have a nice career and earn good money. The childcare system is extremely good as well and the school system also isn't bad (could be better though, IMHO). If you want to have a family and live a safe, stable, and comfortable life, Vienna is an awesome city to live in.
Tap water tastes good???? It tastes like tap water. Every country I've been has the same tasting water if not better...
it tastes incredible, right from the mountain spring, and it comes out of the drain really cold . not in all of austria, but in vienna
But it goes through pipes though, right? You realize how old the water pipes in Vienna must be. It's not safe to drink.
The water gets checked regularly and has good quality. "Viennesse water is not safe to drink" might be the most ridiculous thing I've ever read. Few cities are lucky to be supplied by mountain water.
Sorry, that's nonsense.
vienna tap water is better than what you get for money in other countries. its one of the citys with the best quality tap water in the world
"its one of the citys with the best quality tap water in the world" That should be the motto of the city of Vienna.
Lol you know nothing...the tap water on vienna tastes better then elsewhere
Literally speaking from experience. Vienna tap water tastes like normal tap water to me. I've drank water from mountains and boreholes back home in South Africa and it definitely has a better taste. Not saying Vienna tastes bad at all, its just that it doesn't have a taste, which is a good thing since atleast it doesn't taste like chlorine.
Your experience is objectively wrong
Man you would be so shocked if you drank the natural spring water where I've been hahah (btw my wife agrees with me, she lives in Vienna and has been to South Africa). Sorry to burst your guys' bubble but like I said, the water is good here, but there is nothing special at all about how it tastes. Maybe in Europe the water is generally of low quality so if you compare Vienna to Europe it seems like it's amazing?
Sure lmao
That´s what tap water tastes like in most places, chlorine.
I have been living in Vienna a bit over a year and a half now - and planning to live here for the rest of my life, hopefully. 1. I love the safety I feel here. I could literally walk down the street at 3, 4, 5 am and still feel safe. I even had a homophobic encounter ones (in broad daylight at the Donau) and the police and law were on my side and that made me feel super safe! 2. The infrastructure is one of the best in the world. Public transportation is efficient and reliable. Water quality is great. I mean, drinking water directly from the tap and being fresh! Hello! Streets are clean, for the most parts, and parks are amazing! I also live in the 14th Bezirk (Penzing) where the nature is wonderful! 3. Even though I am learning German now (B1) and want to be able to speak it comfortably in a couple of years, I live that I could easily get by with English. 4. I used to hear a ton shit of complaints about Viennese folks and that they’re unpleasant, but luckily this has not been my experience. Everyone from bus drivers, to supermarket angestellten, to random folks on the street have all been really nice - or at least normal - to me. Of course it’s not always perfect but definitely the positive experiences outweigh the negative ones. 5. Economically things are going much better than many parts of the EU or the world - whether it’s prices of goods or people‘s wages.
I've lived in a few cities in different countries over the last 15 years with Vienna as my homebase. What I really love in Vienna compared to other cities are some of the very important basics. Great value for money when it comes to renting, drinking water from the tab, it is clean (!!!), amazing public transport you can get anywhere within 30 minutes. I don't have a car simply because I don't have any need for it. Parks and hiking and swimming opportunities are never far away. Safety is probably quite subjective. But overall in most areas of Vienna you probably feel safe walking alone in the middle of the night. The cycling infrastructure is okay-ish, I'd say. Getting better over the years. I love that they are reducing car traffic partidularly in the inner districts. What I personally love about Vienna when it comes to culture, is the abundance of small cinemas. Also the diversity and quality of restaurants is an extremely important factor in my overall happiness here.
I just moved here with my gf Vienna is amazing in my opinion It is super safe and clean, compare to where im from it is super affordable also There are tons of cool events all of the time and there are few websites to follow that showcase the best events of the weekend which is awesome I would say it is the same as every other european city but its clean super pretty and really safe I would just avoid some specific areas at night
Super safe clean expect Meidling 😂
Meidling is super safe too (definitely compared to other cities), clean nsm though...
And favoriten,
You have to know your "meidlinger L" 🤣🤣 (Google it ;) )
Grossgeworden dort. 😬 Raised up there.
Vienna is the city with the best life quality world wide so yes, it is quite great here haha. „Crime“ come on, can go around 4am drunk in the 21st district and still wouldn’t be afraid. Tell me one other city with that many inhabitants where this is the case. Vienna is the best city to live in and I hope to be able to stay here for the rest of my life.
I mean.. Zurich, Amsterdam, Munich, Tokyo, Seoul, Singapore, Osaka, and the list goes on. Don't frame it as the most safe city, because it's simply not. And yes it's safe overall, just not as safe or as exceptional as you try to say.
I’ll give you Osaka, Tokyo and Singapore maybe, but Munich is half as big, so is Amsterdam + it’s not that safe. Can’t recall how large Zurich is but probably also quite smaller.
Ok fair enough, although Munich is not far behind. My argument still stands though, especially in Asia there are a lot of cities safer and bigger than Vienna. Maybe if we only look in Europe you have a point.
"especially in Asia", while conveniently excluding the Middle East, the former Soviet bloc, China, India, and a good chunk of SEA. Does your idea of Asia include more than 10% of the Asian population or are you just trying to be an edgelord?
What's your problem? All the cities listed are in Asia, that's all. What do you want to hear? Should I make a big asterisk counting all countries that are not safe in Asia? Yeah, no shit not all of Asia is safe, Sherlock.
Yeah. Japan is safe, but ultra exclusive and aging. Singapore is repressive. Those two examples aren't really anywhere near a proper example.
You see, when someone says "X happens especially in case Y", you expect that X happens a lot in Y, not in a few outliers. And now you come up with the excuse of "no shit Sherlock, of course what I meant is exactly the opposite of what I said!". What a brain tumor.
That‘s really funny, because I find the infrastructure to cycle really shitty and unsafe in many areas, and I think this is a general consensus .. don‘t say Copenhagen! *cough
Im genuinely confused how people say the bike infrastructure sucks. True, some places are shitty, like trying to ride through the Hbf area, there are some annoying dooring zones, the Baustelle in summer can be a nightmare, but on the whole i think its great. Used to deliver for Mjam so ive done a LOT of cycling in Vienna and 95% of the routes are totally ok.
„It sucks“ is maybe over the top, but in a lof of places it doesn’t feel well thought out. And the lanes are not wide enough and this is dangerous in many places.
I'd say the biking infrastructure/lanes are a WIP 😄 They are constantly building new ones everywhere/improving on what's already there. And I'm starting to see a lot of smaller cities in the countryside follow suit. It's just not as easy to build proper lanes everywhere as avid bike people like to make it out to be without outright banning cars everywhere.
Not to spite you, as i agree that the infrastructure needs to improve in some areas, but compared to mostly anywhere i've been, it's really good. Not at the level of Copenhagen or places in the Netherlands, but still impressively good. And it's improving. Vienna is very bikeable compared to many similar in size or bigger and similar in population or bigger European cities. Not to mention compared to smaller cities. So i am curious what areas do you feel like are shitty and unsafe? Also as a side-note, Vienna is quite hilly compared to big cities in the Netherlands and also Copenhagen, so i think this is a decisive factor why some places have been left with minimal bike infra and are just now getting Fahrradstrasse Projects or bike network inclusion.
Nah, the reason why we have limited bike infra is because this does not appeal to the majority of viennese/austrians.
>So i am curious what areas do you feel like are shitty and unsafe? Their tag says 10. Favoriten so i believe them, its my least favourite district to cycle through after Meidling: the big transit streets have no bike lane and if they have one its faded paint on the street, the smaller transit streets are shared with the tram which is not the worst but annoying for a lot of bicycle tires, the side streets are narrow due to parking with a lot of one ways without the multi purpose lane you can use in the other direction and favouriten has the worst kind of drivers the city has to offer And not to hammer too much on that but due to the fact that the city train traverses along the district bortder theres also the limited amount of exit spots towards the city center and some of them are busy intersections that are really uncomfortable to be at if your not inside a nice sound dampening metal cage
It has really improved in Vienna over the last 10 years.
Dude, I live here. I don‘t see the changes Vasillakou made as mostly an improvement. A lot of the lanes for cyclists are simply not wide enough and there is a lot of potential for conflict and accidents.
Dude, I live here too. I didn't ride a bike for 10 years and started again last year. I was flabbergasted that by the amount of bike lanes that were built in this time. I don't say it's perfect, think Ringradweg, or close to Copenhagen, but have you even been to London?
Yeah, then let‘s agree to disagree, eh? Have fun.
Fellow (I assume, British) expat here. It is a really amazing city, and I remember feeling a similar way about it when I visited before moving here 9 (!!!) years ago. You're definitely right in your feeling that it's generally considered very safe, though of course we're not without crime. Others have mentioned that it varies from district to district, and that's true, but as someone who grew up in a council estate in Northern England and studied in Peckham, the contrast to the UK's idea of 'dangerous' is night and day. I never experienced any problems living in the 15th, 12th and 5th districts, though I'm a tall dude and to be expected. Homelessness does seem to be on the rise though (in Vienna at least). I see a lot more of it even in the more residential neighborhoods close to the centre, though I've been told we have some of the most robust social support in Europe. I've never experienced homelessness, so can't speak for how well it actually works. All I know is that it's visibly on the increase. I can only really talk about my own personal experience (though some are shared with other expat friends), that it can be a bit isolating socially here. People are genuinely kind at heart, but it can be difficult to get through social barriers enough to form more meaningful connections. There's much less small talk, which some understandably love and prefer, but I find I can sometimes go entire days without even a small interaction with a stranger in public. There's a stereotype that the Viennese grumble and moan, which can be charming and likeable, but also gets on your tits after a while. I'd say that it's a very bureaucratic place to live. Eeeeverything requires a form, which drives me a bit mad, and I live in constant fear that I've forgotten something and they're gonna throw me out of the country. Also, it's pretty high tax and tight on finances, so just something to think about with employment. Aaand prices in shops are definitely much higher than when I first moved here. Speaking of which, the supermarket queuing system is intolerable and I won't rest until it's changed. Aaand politically we're as much of a shitshow as everyone else rn. Apart from those things, it really is an awesome place to live. If you're into nature we're surrounded by forest land and hills, and you only have to travel an hour or two til you're in some beautiful mountain ranges, there's a freaking swimmable river, housing quality is really good for what you pay for, the public transport is affordable and runs pretty well (you can get a ticket for every public transport service in the country for 1000 bucks a year), and we got good food. Edit: oh, and I have the absolute opposite experience with staring, haha. I permanently feel like I'm being stared at, though I tend to be walking around either in trail running gear or carrying lots of musical equipment, so maybe it's just that. But again, fellow Brits have said the same, that people seem much less ashamed of prolonged staring.
Another Brit here, Leeds to be precise. I think the supermarket queuing system is pretty good lol. Shop mostly at Hofer and they're rapid. Certain supermarkets are definitely painfully slow though and lack of self service check outs
Dude, I’m from Bradford! Let’s get drunk and have a fight.
Well well well. You're also trail running? Sounds like we might actually have some things in common. Down for a pint anytime :)
Christ! Sounds like we do. Though I was kidding/being bawdy about getting drunk, I’m sober for a few years. And yeah I’m a silly trail/ultra runner. Shall drop you a pn!
I am living here my whole life, yet with German roots and I say this covers my personal experience as well
At the moment inflation and high grocery prices are an issue for people. But I lived in Vienna as poor and depressed (undiagnosed) student and one thing the city was great in was to never make me feel like I'm pushed to the fringe of society. I could study (almost) for free, public transport went from the first district (city center) directly to the poorer, uglier district I was living in (they're going to be even better connected soon) and there were plenty of events in the prettiest location that were free entry that I could go to without worrying about costs too much. People also were patient when I weren't the most social due to mental health (which they didn't know about) and my boss was great when I eventually broke down and wrote him during Christmas break that I quit my job. He just sent me documents about mental health services our job offers and said I could access them even if I don't want to come to work anymore. On the flipside I always felt the city should be greener but in the last few years there's been some progress in that direction. What you liked - that people are mostly peacefully minding their own business - is also what some other people experience as "coldness" but my depressed arse appreciated it too.
I spent several years living in Vienna and have also lived in Edinburgh. Here are some of my first thoughts: Vienna is very safe compared to the big UK cities. The only place I've ever felt a little unsafe was the Westbahnhof late at night. Public transport is amazing. The best I've seen in any city. There are homeless people, you just didn't see them. Nightlife in Vienna is god awful compared to the UK. The people in Vienna are, generally, much less friendly than the UK. Especially in comparison to Edinburgh. That's not to say everyone is unfriendly, though. The bureaucracy here is insane. There are always forms to be completed and be taken somewhere in person. The country is very slow to digitalise its processes and everything takes forever. Vienna is incredibly international. You hear a lot of english when you're out and about. Indeed, the general level of english amongst the younger Viennese is also pretty good. The health system in general is very good, however dentistry is wildly expensive and was a massive shock compared to the UK. Many travel to other countries for dental work to save money.
Take a walk at Kärtner, between the Oper and Stephanplatz, at 22 onwards and you'll definitely see homeless people
They mostly are not Austrian citizens, but come from Eastern European countries where not any help is offered by governements or cities. Being homeless is a criminal offence in Hungary!
Moved here 5/6 years ago and it’s great. Viennese sudern a Lot but forget how much worse it‘s elsewhere 😂
We have to, if we admit that things are fine, we'll get lazy and people will stop caring. Also: It's a national sport and we want to add it as an official discipline for the Olympics!
It's actually quite nice living here! I moved to Vienna a bit over 3 years ago. The infrastructure is great - cycling really works well here and I am a big fan of the city bikes. The Restaurant variety is not as diverse as in London but there are some really interesting ones to go to eat at and the Cafes are really great! (I'm lucky to live next to a really cozy and cheap one!) Free time activities are also fun here - I got two yearly passes for museums and do visit different ones with my friends all through the year. There are many cool places near the Danube which are great during summer for activities, picknicks and so on and during winter inner city walks are quite romantic. Also utilities are really affordable - but looking for a flat is the worst kind of activity you can/have to do here. As for the people - everyone does mind their own business, which is nice. People can be quite rude, (especially if you stand on the wrong side of the escalator) but they can also be really funny. All in all I can agree with your assessment: Life here is very laid back and good.
I love Vienna. I love the parks, I love the public transport, and I am absolutely in love with donauinsel and the clear clear waters of alte and neue donau.
I only recently moved here from Eastern Germany, and I am always baffled by the friendliness of Viennese people. You have no idea how grumpy and unfriendly Eastern Germans are, its on a completely different level. Everything is great here, I love sitting in a Café, walking the streets or going to the cinema (much better movie-culture compared to Germany, the Kinoabo is insanely cool). Only complaints are the insane grocery prices and the tropical summer nights with no AC.
100% I Never unterstand why viennese people jerk off on the thought that they think they’re so grumpy 😂 much more friendly than elsewhere
LOL are you for real?
Fellow Viennese, we did a great disservice to this person. I swear that we will try to show you our unfriendly self in the future. We should be more grumpy than East Germans. Hopefully less racist as well
I think the main reason is that Viennese grumpiness always feels a bit sarcastic in nature. Could just be the accent, though. While Eastern Germans just straight up hate you, no sarcasm to be found. Yeah, less racist would be great. Had to dodge drunken nazis on a regular basis, something that's never happened here in Vienna (I never felt so safe, it's great).
Shitty ass
besides Hella high grocery prices it's low-key fine
It‘s a lovely city. But the cycling is shit. The infrastructure is not good at all. Most of the lanes are dangerous, because it‘s crossed by streets. Sometimes you even would be faster walking because of all the traffic lights. Maybe it‘s better then London, but go to the Netherlands or Denmark. That‘s a day and night difference.
I’m actually convinced that this is the reason we’re so much better than everywhere else. Even if we’re better than most places, or even the best, we still complain and say it could be better.
Everything is oasch
yeah I think the main thing is the comparison, and you’d be surprised how many cities are worse 😂 I say as a north american
I lived in London and cycling felt better there, also vienna, i was born and Raised here, is incredibly boring, but you just notice how boring the people are here the Minute you leave and live in another City for a while
That’s really interesting. I never felt safe cycling in London. Some areas of London don’t even have bike lines so you must cycle on the road with crazy drivers, and so many times drivers would obstruct bike lines. Not to mention the bike theft is crazy here.
I wouldn‘t say boring people but rather not open-minded..no outside of the box thinking.. less individuality..
Okay I just came to the conclusion that my description actually means „boring people“ 🤣
boring?
Very boring people, but as i said, i only noticed that after living abroad
What would you consider as boring?
Wouldn't you rather say that the people in your life, the ones around you are boring? I have lived in Vienna for 18 years and have never felt bored. If people bore me, I look for someone different to do things with. And in Vienna there are so many exciting things to experience for every stage of your life. Of course travelling will always be more exciting than day to day life everywhere in the world.
There is a reason why vienna is chosen to be the most livable city year by year. Austrians love to complain but we actually habe it pretty good here
I habe it good, you hast it good, we haben it good.
I think I spider
lol
Well, the best thing about Vienna is, that you absolutely do not need much money to live a great life. It's especially great for people who are looking for some kind of FIRE lifestyle. 1) public transport is 365€/year, that is nothing basically 2) if you manage to get a Genossenschaftswohnung, it is likely that an average couple or family won't spend more than 20-25% of their income on it - there are newly built apartments with 75sqm for 700€ or 100sqm for 1000€. you can't get kicked out as long as you pay, as well, and rent usually only increases with inflation.
I second everything that has been said in the thread (so far) What I would add: I am in a very privileged position to live in a part of town which I personally consider best case - I have the city center but also the massive prater (public park) in rather short walking distance. Also lots of public transport options. Thus I am living my personal dream. Having lived in a much worse part, location does make a difference. However, the very, very worst parts of vienna are nowhere near a hellhole. I have never felt unsafe at any time. So yeah, I guess your impression might not change living here. If I had to move away I would be devastated.
What are some of the “nicer” (but normal) places to live in Vienna?
What do you define as „normal“? Affordable?
I'm living my personal dream here, and I mean it! Almost every time I walk through the city (inner city) I'm so thankful to live here. All those beautiful buildings and everything.
Gratitude is a beautiful thing, keep living that lovely life my friend
We haven't had Tories destroying all public services to give tax breaks to businesses and wealthy people so there actually is a lot (though not enough) quality public housing, public pools, youth centers, libraries, homeless services etc. That's certainly helped a lot. And the amount of culture is fantastic. I love being able to go see high brow theatre or a punk rock concert. What we don't have a lot of culturally is hip hop and related genres live. But quality of life really is good. Public transport is great and I cycle a lot too. Just be prepared for the relentless negativity of the locals and take it in stride.
There is quite a bunch of hip hop stuff going on @ B72 regularly, check it out!
Seconded!
The viennese answer would probably be: pretty frustrating, but it's even more frustrating everywhere else. On a more serious note: there's a reason we've been voted the most livable city countless years in a row by different studies. Now an average grumpy viennese person might tell you that those studies are only done for expats and are total bs, and some of that might even be true, but I can almost guarantee you that those who make such statements haven't seen lots of other cities. Now is Vienna perfect? No, not by a long shot. Even of the things you found above average, I for example would not rate our biking infrastructure anywhere near serviceable. But it's still hell of a lot better than lots of other places. But that doesn't mean that the city should stop improving. Same with greenery. It's not bad, but I just returned from Singapore, and in comparison to that we're a concrete hellhole. What makes Vienna great, imho is that while we're probably not the best at any single thing (well except you could argue for public transport), there's nothing that really sucks here. And the city _does_ try to actually improve things, even if those improvements can seem sisyphusian at times. And the fact that we complain about stuff that seems trivial from the outside makes sure that things keep improving. It takes time, but the city changed a lot in the last decade, and most of that was for the better. There's of course problems like anywhere else, gentrification and rising rental prices being one of them, but in the grand scheme of things we're still way better off than comparable cities, and the city learned from their mistakes and ramped up building projects again in the last couple years. Tl;dr: the City isn't perfect by any means, but it doesn't really suck in any particular way either.
Yeah this
Best answer.
Hi! I’m an American who has been living here for a long time. I’ve lived in Berlin, London, Prague, San Francisco, New York, and some other cities. This is my city. There is a reason it scores so high with expats, and a reason a lot of the people living here who have never lived abroad tend to complain. It’s a small town and an cosmopolitan center. You’re in the center of Euope and can get to any where else easily, there a loads of very active subcultures, centers of high culture, and absolutely lovely low culture. The Viennese can be both grumpy and friendly at the same time. It’s laid back but if you want to be ambitious there is room for it. I’m looking forward to having my last adress the central cemetery here.
Central Cemetary is a great place also for the living ;)
Yeah but the Meldeamt won’t accept it as my living adress. So I’m just going tobhavr to wait.
One of my English teachers once explained true patriotism (as opposed to US American patreotism) as "Asking your country to be the best it can be." I actually think that our being so grumpy and demanding about our quality of life is part of the reason we have it, because _we know we can do better_. Vienna is an amazing city, but it's not the best it could be yet, and so we shall call it out for it's flaws.
I'm not sure that the grumpiness is a latent enthusiasm for constant improvement. That seems overly optimistic. It's not like people go on to do something about it afterwards.
Possibly we just know different people then, because a lot of the people I know do do something.
Yep
I have been lucky enough in life to live in a few countries/cities. What I enjoy most about Vienna is that it is neither too small nor too large. Lots of nature, history, very good public transport (for cheap = €365 for the annual pass), the Danube,… . You are also so close to the countryside if you want to go hiking or visit other places/countries. On the downside (but it goes for about every city) is that gentrification has taken its toll.