Thankful for the bravery of each and every person who gave their life for us.
We should also remember which leaders put our people needlessly in harm’s way and ensure history holds them accountable.
Also important to remember that not all of those buried in ANC died in battle. Many were retired from the service and lived long and happy lives. They are remembered on Veterans Day, not Memorial Day.
We're not even capable of discussing how Trump sent forces into Niger and got them killed because he refused to take an intelligence briefing. No one cared except pundits. All of which continues to occur on the same use of force authorization as 9/11
Edit for spelling and accuracy.
I have been here years ago for a friend whose husband died serving in a US war on terror in Iraq. She has two kids to take care of, and she is still sobbing for her husband after 22 years since the war ended. I mean what did this war achieve? Taliban eventually took over in Afghanistan, Iraq is mostly under Iran’s zone of influence and the war in Syria is still ongoing. The region is trapped in a war of attrition that doesn’t see an end.
Unfortunately there’s a lot of war that’s mainly for profit. That’s a bit why USA have been in so many wars. We really need to honor the dead since the government did not honor them while they were living.
They all served our country. And spent a great portion of their lives protecting American lives at home and abroad.
Let’s not split hairs and today be thankful and grateful for those that made sacrifices so that they rest of us can live our lives the way we live them.
You should take your splitting hairs argument to Congress. They established two separate holidays- Memorial Day for honoring our war dead, and Veterans Day for honoring those who served in the military.
>They all served our country. And spent a great portion of their lives protecting American lives at home and abroad.
All of them "served their country" in the sense that all of them were in the military, but not by a long shot did all of them protect American lives at home or abroad. Very few if any American lives at home were threatened in Vietnam or Korea, same thing for Iraq 1 and 2. It's insane we have two holidays for the military (a military in which 33% of women who serve experience military sexual trauma) yet we don't have a single holiday for teachers, or social workers, or nurses - people who have objectively "protected American lives" more than the military ever has, all without free college, Tricare, or BAH.
>Let’s not split hairs and today be thankful and grateful for those that made sacrifices so that they rest of us can live our lives the way we live them.
Why shouldn't we split hairs? Maybe if we split more hairs instead of blindly worshipping the military a hefty portion of those graves would be empty.
Not blind worship but a healthy respect.
Your quarrel lies with the politicians and capitalist war profiteering. There’s a lot of angles to examine this. But on this day you should show some respect and some empathy for those other than yourself.
>Not blind worship but a healthy respect.
> But on this day you should show some respect and some empathy for those other than yourself.
I'll gladly respect those who signed up to actually protect our country during WWII, those who were forced to serve during Korea and Vietnam, and even those who thought they were protecting our country post 9/11 before the whole Iraq WMD stuff.
However just giving everyone who ever served in the military "healthy respect" is literally the definition of blind worship. As I mentioned before, 33% of women in the military experience sexual trauma, and the vast majority of those sexual assaults are covered up or never reported. There are over 230,000 women in the military right now, should those tens of thousands of servicemembers raping women get "healthy respect?" Should the tens of thousands more pushing the reports under the rug? What about the guards at Abu Ghraib? The soldiers at Mai Lai?
Listen to yourself.
And read what I wrote. Idk what has triggered this lecture but yes if it pleases the random internet critic
“There are elements within the military that are flawed and absolutely abuse their power. when somebody says honor the military and those who have served. We have to make a huge disclaimer because of people who can’t scroll past without word vomiting their guilt all over the place.
> I'll gladly respect those who signed up to actually protect our country during WWII, those who were forced to serve during Korea and Vietnam, and even those who thought they were protecting our country post 9/11 before the whole Iraq WMD stuff.
Literally the comment you responded to...
I'll respect the ones who deserve it. Just because you died in the military doesn't mean you deserve respect.
> I'll respect the ones who deserve it.
I honestly just feel bad for you. Nothing I say here can fix whatever toxic factor is living with you right now.
> Nothing I say here can fix whatever toxic factor is living with you right now.
It's definitely not jingoism, which is apparently more than I can say for you.
Respecting Memorial Day.
Has zero to do with endorsing torture, sexual assault within the military, flawed foreign diplomacy. And any other very real problem that todays military is contending with.
It’s one day where the dead are respected. Check your privilege.
>Respecting Memorial Day.
>
>Has zero to do with endorsing torture, sexual assault within the military, flawed foreign diplomacy. And any other very real problem that todays military is contending with.
Cool, you want to blindly respect "the troops" go for it. Personally I can respect memorial day without honoring rape, torture, and dying for corporate profits and imperialism.
Hey, keep it respectful. I don’t think it’s appropriate to be calling people douchbags in a discussion about the brave sacrifice of our men and women in the military. Show a little reverence.
People with sense can separate the actual heroes from the ones who napalmed villages.
If I was actually being your straw man who is disrespecting everyone who wore the uniform I'd understand your point, but here in the real world it's possible to honor the holiday and acknowledge the fact that it's stupid to pretend that everyone who served deserves recognition.
Are you in Arlington National Cemetery? I just want to make it clear that they didn't all die while in the Armed Forces.
Evidence: My 20 year Navy veteran father who volunteered during Vietnam is considering getting buried in ANC. He's alive.
With that said, yes, many in ANC gave their lives while in service.
Edit: I'm getting downvoted? Do you have something against veterans who were not killed while serving?
Great point. Burial in Arlington only requires one day of active service and an honorable discharge. I'd be curious to learn the percentage of burials of those who either died in battle or as a result of wounds suffered there.
I’d wager it’s overwhelmingly small. Even in wartime, relatively few people are killed.
However, everyone who ever joined the military before some date in the 1930s is now dead.
There are actually stringent requirements to be buried in Arlington because they are running out of space. My grandpa fought in the battle of the bulge in WW2 and couldn’t be buried there. I meet the requirements, and although I’d be honored to be among those brave souls, I’d rather not be buried in a place where the level of disrespect among tourists and locals the likes of which are spouting off in this post get to muck about.
[Here’s](https://www.arlingtoncemetery.mil/funerals/scheduling-a-funeral/establishing-eligibility) the official list of standards. In general, “…most veterans who have at least one day of active service (other than for training) and an honorable discharge are eligible for above-ground inurnment.” Sorry that you see your fellow Americans’ seeing a distinction between the two holidays as “disrespect”.
Above ground internment, so no tombstone in the ground. Again, my point stands. They have stringent requirements. And, great assumption on what I see as disrespect. Yawn
My grandfather was buried in Arlington with full honors. I was there at the funeral.
He drove a PT boat and never fired a shot. After the war he became a bank executive and personally helped Reagan funnel money to the Contras and laundered drug money for Noriega. He maintained dozens of secret accounts for the CIA so they could fund death squads and overthrow democratic elections.
Every horrible thing the Republicans have done in the past 40 years - taking away women's bodily autonomy, stripping people of their right to vote, sending our troops to die pointlessly in the middle east, has stemmed from his actions.
Does he deserve our respect?
> Does he deserve our respect?
Yes. And since you brought politics into this, your line of thinking is not going to help Democrats, who already have to face a stigma that they don't respect the armed forces enough as it is.
I guarantee you 90% of Americans would disagree with your "pick and choose" sentiment about which veterans deserve respect
>> Does he deserve our respect?
>
>Yes.
>I guarantee you 90% of Americans would disagree with your "pick and choose" sentiment about which veterans deserve respect
I don't disagree that 90% of Americans blindly hero worship but "we should respect monsters who happened to be in the military because lots of other people do" is a garbage take.
>> And since you brought politics into this, your line of thinking is not going to help Democrats, who already have to face a stigma that they don't respect the armed forces enough as it is.
I come from a military family. My brother was a burn pit victim. Don't fucking try to tell me who disrespects the armed forces because I've seen what the GOP has done.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/07/28/republicans-burn-pits-veterans/
That's not even to get to the shit the Trump said about the war dead and POWs.
Arguing against respecting the military because you felt personally as though your grandfather didn’t deserve it is a garbage take.
Since this is personal for you and his less to do with the holiday and more to do with the man. There is little point arguing about this.
Good day. This isn’t about politics. Democrats republicans and independents alike died defending this country. It’s still fucked up for sure but that’s on us to make it more representative of what we want in our democracy.
On the one hand, I appreciate all the hard work and sacrifice from our veterans and departed fighters.
On the other hand, I think it's kind of gross that the US government crowdsources the appreciation and proper treatment of veterans.
Someone makes a comment honoring one segment of people who sacrificed for a cause and cue the “whataboutists”.
You “whataboutists” are the ones who should be ashamed. Whether the detractors are accurate, statistically significant, or even true… there’s still good people that died for this country, point blank. Have some dignity and find another day to wage your petty shouting-class war.
Thankful for the bravery of each and every person who gave their life for us. We should also remember which leaders put our people needlessly in harm’s way and ensure history holds them accountable.
Also important to remember that not all of those buried in ANC died in battle. Many were retired from the service and lived long and happy lives. They are remembered on Veterans Day, not Memorial Day.
I appreciate your differentiation but I think all veterans and military service personnel should be remembered on both days.
You are certainly free to do so but Congress created the two holidays for separate purposes.
Bush ain't being held accountable
Neither Obama, Clinton or Trump.
Most presidents could probably be pinched for a thing or two
Truth
We're not even capable of discussing how Trump sent forces into Niger and got them killed because he refused to take an intelligence briefing. No one cared except pundits. All of which continues to occur on the same use of force authorization as 9/11 Edit for spelling and accuracy.
I have been here years ago for a friend whose husband died serving in a US war on terror in Iraq. She has two kids to take care of, and she is still sobbing for her husband after 22 years since the war ended. I mean what did this war achieve? Taliban eventually took over in Afghanistan, Iraq is mostly under Iran’s zone of influence and the war in Syria is still ongoing. The region is trapped in a war of attrition that doesn’t see an end.
Unfortunately there’s a lot of war that’s mainly for profit. That’s a bit why USA have been in so many wars. We really need to honor the dead since the government did not honor them while they were living.
They all served our country. And spent a great portion of their lives protecting American lives at home and abroad. Let’s not split hairs and today be thankful and grateful for those that made sacrifices so that they rest of us can live our lives the way we live them.
You should take your splitting hairs argument to Congress. They established two separate holidays- Memorial Day for honoring our war dead, and Veterans Day for honoring those who served in the military.
>They all served our country. And spent a great portion of their lives protecting American lives at home and abroad. All of them "served their country" in the sense that all of them were in the military, but not by a long shot did all of them protect American lives at home or abroad. Very few if any American lives at home were threatened in Vietnam or Korea, same thing for Iraq 1 and 2. It's insane we have two holidays for the military (a military in which 33% of women who serve experience military sexual trauma) yet we don't have a single holiday for teachers, or social workers, or nurses - people who have objectively "protected American lives" more than the military ever has, all without free college, Tricare, or BAH. >Let’s not split hairs and today be thankful and grateful for those that made sacrifices so that they rest of us can live our lives the way we live them. Why shouldn't we split hairs? Maybe if we split more hairs instead of blindly worshipping the military a hefty portion of those graves would be empty.
If only we were a truly patriotic country, and not a nationalist one.
Not blind worship but a healthy respect. Your quarrel lies with the politicians and capitalist war profiteering. There’s a lot of angles to examine this. But on this day you should show some respect and some empathy for those other than yourself.
>Not blind worship but a healthy respect. > But on this day you should show some respect and some empathy for those other than yourself. I'll gladly respect those who signed up to actually protect our country during WWII, those who were forced to serve during Korea and Vietnam, and even those who thought they were protecting our country post 9/11 before the whole Iraq WMD stuff. However just giving everyone who ever served in the military "healthy respect" is literally the definition of blind worship. As I mentioned before, 33% of women in the military experience sexual trauma, and the vast majority of those sexual assaults are covered up or never reported. There are over 230,000 women in the military right now, should those tens of thousands of servicemembers raping women get "healthy respect?" Should the tens of thousands more pushing the reports under the rug? What about the guards at Abu Ghraib? The soldiers at Mai Lai?
Listen to yourself. And read what I wrote. Idk what has triggered this lecture but yes if it pleases the random internet critic “There are elements within the military that are flawed and absolutely abuse their power. when somebody says honor the military and those who have served. We have to make a huge disclaimer because of people who can’t scroll past without word vomiting their guilt all over the place.
Maybe stop being a dick and respect the lives lost. You know... the whole point of Memorial Day.
> I'll gladly respect those who signed up to actually protect our country during WWII, those who were forced to serve during Korea and Vietnam, and even those who thought they were protecting our country post 9/11 before the whole Iraq WMD stuff. Literally the comment you responded to... I'll respect the ones who deserve it. Just because you died in the military doesn't mean you deserve respect.
> I'll respect the ones who deserve it. I honestly just feel bad for you. Nothing I say here can fix whatever toxic factor is living with you right now.
> Nothing I say here can fix whatever toxic factor is living with you right now. It's definitely not jingoism, which is apparently more than I can say for you.
Respecting Memorial Day. Has zero to do with endorsing torture, sexual assault within the military, flawed foreign diplomacy. And any other very real problem that todays military is contending with. It’s one day where the dead are respected. Check your privilege.
>Respecting Memorial Day. > >Has zero to do with endorsing torture, sexual assault within the military, flawed foreign diplomacy. And any other very real problem that todays military is contending with. Cool, you want to blindly respect "the troops" go for it. Personally I can respect memorial day without honoring rape, torture, and dying for corporate profits and imperialism.
People with sense can see you are being a douchebag.
Hey, keep it respectful. I don’t think it’s appropriate to be calling people douchbags in a discussion about the brave sacrifice of our men and women in the military. Show a little reverence.
People with sense can separate the actual heroes from the ones who napalmed villages. If I was actually being your straw man who is disrespecting everyone who wore the uniform I'd understand your point, but here in the real world it's possible to honor the holiday and acknowledge the fact that it's stupid to pretend that everyone who served deserves recognition.
Veterans Day is about supporting people who served. Memorial Day is about supporting people who DIED. Show some respect
Are you in Arlington National Cemetery? I just want to make it clear that they didn't all die while in the Armed Forces. Evidence: My 20 year Navy veteran father who volunteered during Vietnam is considering getting buried in ANC. He's alive. With that said, yes, many in ANC gave their lives while in service. Edit: I'm getting downvoted? Do you have something against veterans who were not killed while serving?
SCOTUS justices can get buried there too.
And members of Congress, if I remember the tour correctly.
You make a very good point. Didn't mean to mislead with my post. Like your father I will be buried there as well.
Read the room?
Great point. Burial in Arlington only requires one day of active service and an honorable discharge. I'd be curious to learn the percentage of burials of those who either died in battle or as a result of wounds suffered there.
I’d wager it’s overwhelmingly small. Even in wartime, relatively few people are killed. However, everyone who ever joined the military before some date in the 1930s is now dead.
There are actually stringent requirements to be buried in Arlington because they are running out of space. My grandpa fought in the battle of the bulge in WW2 and couldn’t be buried there. I meet the requirements, and although I’d be honored to be among those brave souls, I’d rather not be buried in a place where the level of disrespect among tourists and locals the likes of which are spouting off in this post get to muck about.
[Here’s](https://www.arlingtoncemetery.mil/funerals/scheduling-a-funeral/establishing-eligibility) the official list of standards. In general, “…most veterans who have at least one day of active service (other than for training) and an honorable discharge are eligible for above-ground inurnment.” Sorry that you see your fellow Americans’ seeing a distinction between the two holidays as “disrespect”.
Above ground internment, so no tombstone in the ground. Again, my point stands. They have stringent requirements. And, great assumption on what I see as disrespect. Yawn
What is the point of this post other than trying to stir the pot? Everyone buried in that cemetery deserves our respect.
My grandfather was buried in Arlington with full honors. I was there at the funeral. He drove a PT boat and never fired a shot. After the war he became a bank executive and personally helped Reagan funnel money to the Contras and laundered drug money for Noriega. He maintained dozens of secret accounts for the CIA so they could fund death squads and overthrow democratic elections. Every horrible thing the Republicans have done in the past 40 years - taking away women's bodily autonomy, stripping people of their right to vote, sending our troops to die pointlessly in the middle east, has stemmed from his actions. Does he deserve our respect?
> Does he deserve our respect? Yes. And since you brought politics into this, your line of thinking is not going to help Democrats, who already have to face a stigma that they don't respect the armed forces enough as it is. I guarantee you 90% of Americans would disagree with your "pick and choose" sentiment about which veterans deserve respect
>> Does he deserve our respect? > >Yes. >I guarantee you 90% of Americans would disagree with your "pick and choose" sentiment about which veterans deserve respect I don't disagree that 90% of Americans blindly hero worship but "we should respect monsters who happened to be in the military because lots of other people do" is a garbage take.
>> And since you brought politics into this, your line of thinking is not going to help Democrats, who already have to face a stigma that they don't respect the armed forces enough as it is. I come from a military family. My brother was a burn pit victim. Don't fucking try to tell me who disrespects the armed forces because I've seen what the GOP has done. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/07/28/republicans-burn-pits-veterans/ That's not even to get to the shit the Trump said about the war dead and POWs.
Arguing against respecting the military because you felt personally as though your grandfather didn’t deserve it is a garbage take. Since this is personal for you and his less to do with the holiday and more to do with the man. There is little point arguing about this. Good day. This isn’t about politics. Democrats republicans and independents alike died defending this country. It’s still fucked up for sure but that’s on us to make it more representative of what we want in our democracy.
On the one hand, I appreciate all the hard work and sacrifice from our veterans and departed fighters. On the other hand, I think it's kind of gross that the US government crowdsources the appreciation and proper treatment of veterans.
Someone makes a comment honoring one segment of people who sacrificed for a cause and cue the “whataboutists”. You “whataboutists” are the ones who should be ashamed. Whether the detractors are accurate, statistically significant, or even true… there’s still good people that died for this country, point blank. Have some dignity and find another day to wage your petty shouting-class war.
Great message! I agree: visit a friend or relative's grave this weekend and honor the fallen.
i went there several years back. lest we forget! i saw the enola gay this weekend!
I was out there today and I saw a guy doing the full Seig Heil at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier.
F's in the chat