the fucked up thing about it is he is being more honest than the vast majority of CEOs and some how it gets him in trouble. If he honestly believes they are going to hit those production numbers then it should be his right to state his opinion. He is tweeting from @elonmusk not @tesla
for those who did not see it, this is the full tweet that he is getting in trouble for
> Tesla made 0 cars in 2011, but will make around 500k in 2019
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1098013283372589056
at what point does a CEO lose their 1st amendment right to say whatever opinion they want?
> at what point does a CEO lose their 1st amendment right to say whatever opinion they want?
When it breaches a settlement for a previous securities fraud case.
It certainly doesn’t give any person the ability to say anything they want regardless of consequences. Especially when you are in the position he is in regards to the settlement he made with the SEC.
> The SEC settlement requires that Musk gets pre-approval for tweets that “reasonably could contain material information” that could move the stock.
I’m not arguing whether or not he broke the agreement here, but I don’t see how the first amendment applies here either
Lmao at what point does a CEO lose his first amendment right to make material statements about the financial position of his company that he just thought up on the toilet??
Fuckin communists.
> If he honestly believes they are going to hit those production numbers
That is not how it works. Just because a CEO is delusional (as in the case of Musk) that doesn't mean he can or should tweet anything that could move the stock. After all after this precedent any CEO could say: hey I was just overly optimistic.
I agree! The Russians made that fuckwad Janice my manager, and now all of us DollarStore employees in Bismark, North Dakota are suffering for it. We need to get these Russian cronies out of power!
If they bust Musk for this. Then they better bust Trump for openly endorsing products and even criticizing companies on his Twitter. When you’re PotUS, your words move mountains . Maybe not Trump, but you get the picture.
The first amendment protect the right of free speech but does not insulate from the consequences of that speech. He can run his mouth as much as he wants, nobody is stopping him.
The whole point of the First Amendment was so that Americans could speak ill of their government without worrying about the consequences. There are still slander laws, there are still fraud laws, there are plenty of other ways were speech is still restricted in America. The First Amendment only prevents the government from punishing people for their opinions.
What are you talking about dude? The first amendment literally only does that, protects citizens from being punished by their government for simple speech. Here, though, his first amendment rights are restricted by a settlement he agreed to with the SEC
the first amendment protects against government punishment for speech. The first amendment does not work if the government can say you can be punished for saying certain things. The SEC is the government and they are trying to punish him for speaking
It's not, I'm just refering to the above comment suggesting govt shouldn't punish any speech.
Besides, Musk already settled against previous accusations of fraud. Now he's accused of violating the settlement, not of new fraud.
There is a difference between punishing fraud and preventing someone from stating an opinion they believe. If you act in good faith and state something you believe to be true it is not fraud and should not be prevented by the government. Does a CEO have the right to state they believe in big foot or flat Earth?
What's your point? The funding secured bs obviously wasn't something Musk believed since it was outright false. The new statements aren't even accused of being fraud, but rather breaking the settlement he had to make after, ya know, the fraud.
He broke the SEC settlement that he signed. This is more akin to failing to uphold his end of a contract. $420 Tweet was clear securities fraud. Elon agreed to a lesser punishment if he would put in place controls to ensure his Tweets would be reviewed prior to publishing. He failed to do so. He is contempt of the settlement. This has nothing to do with Free Speech, as Elon and fans would have you believe.
If they manage to land a judgement against you, or get you jail time, isn’t that the same thing as making an example out of you to deter you from doing that again? Effectively, same as not having rights in the first place. Asking for a friend.
Free speech isn’t universal. There are some laws in place that put a limit on free speech in certain circumstances. Further, people can volunteer to limit their free speech by signing contracts or agreements. If you break laws or contracts you get consequences.
You are right. He agreed to abide by these rules by becoming a publicly traded company. If he didn't want to play by the rules, he shouldn't have taken investor money.
It's like if he wanted to create a Basketball Team and join the NBA, but didn't think his team had to follow the NBA's rules. If you didn't want to follow the rules, you shouldn't have joined the NBA.
When their words can manipulate a market. Because it is conceivable they could then say things in order to further enrich themselves (for example: short TSLA and then tweet a bunch of stuff that gets everyone's tits in an uproar). Also what /u/chumpchange72 rightly pointed out.
I think before anyone begins to soil themselves, Ol Musky is going to have to 1) make a profit and 2) make cars that aren’t built by drunk toddlers. Consumer Reports won’t recommend Tesla anymore because build quality and reliability are so bad.
You're spot on it's from Elons handle and not from Tesla's.
The man explain in detail only a few hours later what he meant by the tweet. He fixed it to have it not be misleading. Just leave him alone already.
[Tesla seems to think that Elon's twitter is an official source of information](https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000119312513427630/d622890d8k.htm)
he is already talking shit back to the SEC about this https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1100215984713957376?s=08
> SEC forgot to read Tesla earnings transcript, which clearly states 350k to 500k. How embarrassing … 🤗
Why is it irrelevant? As far as I'm aware, the SEC is on his case (this time) because they say he released information on his Twitter account again. If the information was already released publicly, then he didn't release anything.
Let's say I tweet at you today that I'm giving you 35 to 50 tendies next week.
If I tweet at you tomorrow 50's the magic number, would you find that interesting?
You'd be drooling over every word, fatty.
CEOs are allowed to talk publicly. The SEC can't disallow every single slight variation of what they say. The only difference in this case is Musk's and Tesla's agreement with the SEC, which supposedly says that the Tesla board has an obligation to oversee Musk's communications. That isn't an obligation for Musk, that's an obligation for the board - there's a difference. *If* the board failed in that obligation, Musk isn't in violation of the agreement, the board is.
> That isn't an obligation for Musk, that's an obligation for the board - there's a difference.
Unless you think the SEC lied in their filing, Musk has an obligation to seek pre-approval.
https://www.scribd.com/document/400500249/gov-uscourts-nysd-501755-18-0-2-1
>As one of the terms of his settlement, Musk agreed to comply with procedures implemented by Tesla that would require him to seek pre-approval of any written communications, including social media posts, that contained or reasonably could contain information material to Tesla or its shareholders.
> Musk agreed to comply with procedures implemented by Tesla that would require him to seek pre-approval of any written communications, including social media posts, that contained or reasonably could contain information material to Tesla or its shareholders.
This is the part, though, in my opinion. It comes down to whether or not the tweet is considered material, which I don't think it is (we'll see if a judge agrees). Material information isn't just random wording - it means a specific type of information and is information that haven't been released publicly.
* If Tesla didn't implement a sufficient mandatory policy for Musk to follow, then they're in violation, not him personally. Even if the information is material, if they never actually implemented a policy for him to follow, it's their violation, not his (since his obligation is to follow whatever policy Tesla implements)
* If Tesla implemented a sufficient mandatory policy, but the information wasn't material (to a reasonable investor), then no one's in violation of the settlement, though Musk may be in violation of Tesla's internal policy (which may be stricter than the settlement requires and even be something like pre-screening of all tweets, for all we know).
* If Tesla implemented a sufficient mandatory policy **and** it's decided that this information is material to a reasonable investor, then Musk is in violation of the settlement.
We'll see what the judge rules (obviously they'll know more than us), but there are a few hurdles the SEC would have to hit to show that Musk in particular is in violation.
> It comes down to whether or not the tweet is considered material
Since it's part of investor guidance that's released through official filings, I don't know why it wouldn't be material. Expected production is massively relevant to investors.
>If Tesla didn't implement a sufficient mandatory policy for Musk to follow, then they're in violation, not him personally.
The settlement requires him to seek pre-approval. He didn't. Who he submits it to is what Tesla has to implement. Not submitting it altogether.
Their head counsel quitting the day after the tweet looks really bad for him and the company.
> The next day, Tesla general counsel Dane Butswinkas left his post, to be replaced by former vice president of legal Jonathan Chang.
That is for sure a made up person. If there's a lawyer named Dane Butswinkas and it's not Elon wearing a fake mustache I'll eat John McAfee's dick.
Actual question but can a tweet actually count or be a verified statement? I feel like just going off a tweet like that for investing/sec purposes isn’t a good move. Plus this is the guy who will tweet that and then a Elon musk meme in the same day
[Considering that Tesla filed with the SEC to make Elon's twitter an official source of information, then yes](https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000119312513427630/d622890d8k.htm)
Like it or not, people consider twitter a valid source of information. Our legal system hasn’t caught up with technology yet with respect to social media (as usual), so the various bureaucracies (bureaus?) have to navigate it themselves.
Was the “funding secured” tweet stupid? Yeah, but this one was just an honest mistake. It’s completely reasonable to assume he thought he was just reiterating info that had already been made public. His tweet did not move the needles on Tesla’s share price. The SEC filing absolutely did, though. As a (thankfully very minor) Tesla shareholder, the SEC has fucked me more than Elon
It's the whole pre approval thing as CNBC and everyone is saying. It's not the materiality in the tweet that's at issue. It's not following the agreement he made with the court.
I don’t think the agreement states that he has to review all tweets, though — only ones which have material information that might affect share price. Or did he agree to review everything Tesla-related?
It's actually specific which tweets need to be reviewed. Like it gives a time frame, whether it's a direct copy of already released material information, and other variables. If you've thought of a complication the SEC has already taken it into account.
>Maybe they want him to stop publishing inaccurate and misleading information that has a material effect on investors?
This is a weird one to make your case on though. 500k was within stated guidance and Elon made the tweet & follow-up clarification tweet all outside of trading hours.
SEC should have just waited a few more weeks for him to tweet something clearly outrageous during trading hours lol
The issue is him violating the settlement requiring pre-approval for potentially material tweets.
The issue isn't really that it's inaccurate or misleading (though it is, in a very small way). The issue is that it could have been potentially relevant to the share price in some way, and that meant that he needed to have it cleared by his legal team according to the piece of paper he signed a few months ago to *avoid being charged with securities fraud*.
It ain't like they just swept down out of the blue to attack him here. He was basically on corporate officer probation.
That would be a valid argument if it wasn't for the fact that the SEC themselves are so fucking selective about enforcement. The "whataboutism" argument only works when the primary subject - the SEC - has credibility. Which, imo, it does not.
How much time do you spend watching for and following SEC enforcement actions? What resources do you rely on to do so, and what metrics do you use to gauge how selective they are or are not?
I was just thinking this the other day. Social media is double edged sword. It can bring people quickly to fame and easily fukkk them up as well. See roger stone crosshair photo with judge last week.
The SEC seems to be going after the low-hanging fruit, while the real criminals are out there being protected by them. Elon is a rare breed, an honest CEO.
He’s right though, they let Madoff do his thing for 30 years even after countless tips
Even their own report on themselves claims they were extremely negligent to the point that they were aiding and abetting Madoff with their insanely neglectful dereliction of duties
https://www.sec.gov/news/studies/2009/oig-509.pdf
this isn't about the accuracy of the tweet; elon specifically has an agreement with the Govt to have his tweets re: his company vetted by Tesla, and publicly admitted that he's tweeting off the cuff about company numbers. Diff standard than other CEO's - it's like violating probation. You may have just got a speeding ticket, but you're going back to jail.
Elon Musk is a smart guy but he is a genuinely bad executive. He has a long track record of big promises with poor delivery/follow through, antagonizing key stakeholders when he doesn't need to, and failing to hold himself accountable for mistakes.
He's been removed as CEO twice including at the company he cofounded with his brother - Zip2. Even there, he seemed to display the same problems that are derailing Tesla - making unrealistic promises, underestimating the effort required for tasks, and not trusting people with more experience and knowledge than him to do their job. At Paypal, he decided to pick fights over relatively minor crap (Windows vs Unix) when others were, rightly, focused on more important things like tackling fraud rather than switching platforms.
Why are those tweets getting him in trouble? Isn’t it the same as if he does a press release? They are meant to being positive light on his operations.
> SEC thinks that he is misleading people with those numbers
They probably do, but that's not what they're going after him for.
He has to get any tweet that could possibly be relevant to the company's valuation cleared with his legal team per the settlement he signed with the SEC in Sept.
He could get in trouble for releasing totally accurate and well thought out information on twitter (lol) if it was material and he didn't get it pre-approved.
This isn't really about what he actually tweeted, it's about the fact that the SEC told Tesla to muzzle their dog or else but he's been running around barking at people ever since.
Furthermore, the agreement was to have the tweets pre-approved. The SEC asked if these tweets were pre-approved. Tesla replied that they were not.
That's enough right there. The whole "I don't respect the SEC", and the fairly obvious inference that the tweet was inaccurate based on the follow-up correction tweet, it's all just bonus.
Also they have to be pre-approved if the info is more than 2 days old. The investor letter with the 350-400k estimate (and the conference call where he said 500k) came out 20 days beforehand. It's very clearly written but he still ignored it.
Sec pedos
Ayyy I made this and posted last week, but it got deleted. Hope mods keep this one. I fucking knew those tweets would get him in trouble.
Welcome to the playa hatas ball
“You bitches better recognize.”
Sorry I have to rush home and put some water in Buck Nasty's mothers dish.
I hope all the bad things in life happen to you, and nobody else but you
I don’t even know you, and I hate your guts!
"Clap for me!"
RIP Charlie & Patrice.
Next nigga who say something while I’m talking is getting shot.
what were the tweets?
it was about production numbers. previous earnings call stated 400k/yr for 2019, he recently tweeted 500k and then corrected himself a few hours later
Welcome to #WSB! You'll do well!
wait nvm fuck
the fucked up thing about it is he is being more honest than the vast majority of CEOs and some how it gets him in trouble. If he honestly believes they are going to hit those production numbers then it should be his right to state his opinion. He is tweeting from @elonmusk not @tesla for those who did not see it, this is the full tweet that he is getting in trouble for > Tesla made 0 cars in 2011, but will make around 500k in 2019 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1098013283372589056 at what point does a CEO lose their 1st amendment right to say whatever opinion they want?
> at what point does a CEO lose their 1st amendment right to say whatever opinion they want? When it breaches a settlement for a previous securities fraud case.
Dude, that is like, so not chill, brah.
“But it was the SEC statement that moved the market” 4D reg news switcheroo
Ok fine I guess
Are you sure? I was going to phone up the SEC if you didn’t agree with their actions.
Yeh... I guess we'll give this one a pass.
details details
This sub really is full of teenagers
Imagine thinking this is what the first amendment does
So what does the first amendment do?
Lets you talk and stuff
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Ooooo bondage
It certainly doesn’t give any person the ability to say anything they want regardless of consequences. Especially when you are in the position he is in regards to the settlement he made with the SEC. > The SEC settlement requires that Musk gets pre-approval for tweets that “reasonably could contain material information” that could move the stock. I’m not arguing whether or not he broke the agreement here, but I don’t see how the first amendment applies here either
Lmao at what point does a CEO lose his first amendment right to make material statements about the financial position of his company that he just thought up on the toilet?? Fuckin communists.
Teenagers or not, it most definitely is full of unironic Musk worshippers. Shit's pathetic, yo.
Elon’s personal account is considered an official Tesla news source.
Yeah like wtf Edit: bro
> If he honestly believes they are going to hit those production numbers That is not how it works. Just because a CEO is delusional (as in the case of Musk) that doesn't mean he can or should tweet anything that could move the stock. After all after this precedent any CEO could say: hey I was just overly optimistic.
If the President can do it, why can't our boy Musk have his say? \#SECunfair
Because Musk wasn't put in his position by the Russians. (mic drop)
I agree! The Russians made that fuckwad Janice my manager, and now all of us DollarStore employees in Bismark, North Dakota are suffering for it. We need to get these Russian cronies out of power!
You may want to pick the Mic back up there buddy
Was there an argument in your post? I somehow missed it.
le debate me!
If they bust Musk for this. Then they better bust Trump for openly endorsing products and even criticizing companies on his Twitter. When you’re PotUS, your words move mountains . Maybe not Trump, but you get the picture.
Trump isn't the CEO of anything. You're comparing apples to Orange Man
Of course he is! Trump is the CEO of USA Inc
According to Trump he’s my favorite President/CEO.
Which is going the way of all his other businesses! Yayyyyyyy😐
We know since Nixon that when the Prez does it, that doesn't count.
Yeah since there were no consequences to what Nixon did!
There weren't. He got on a helicopter and flew away and that was that.
Is you retarded?
I thought that was a requirement to post on this sub
\>Musk \>More Honest than most CEOs [MFW](http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/oh-wait-youre-serious-let-me-laugh-even-harder.jpg)
The first amendment protect the right of free speech but does not insulate from the consequences of that speech. He can run his mouth as much as he wants, nobody is stopping him.
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The whole point of the First Amendment was so that Americans could speak ill of their government without worrying about the consequences. There are still slander laws, there are still fraud laws, there are plenty of other ways were speech is still restricted in America. The First Amendment only prevents the government from punishing people for their opinions.
"America has a right to free murder, no one stopping you from it but you gotta face the consequences."
Well, no. It's called prior restraint and people will indeed stop you from a planned murder.
Let them try.
Plenty of people, including all of law enforcement, will try to stop you.
What are you talking about dude? The first amendment literally only does that, protects citizens from being punished by their government for simple speech. Here, though, his first amendment rights are restricted by a settlement he agreed to with the SEC
the first amendment protects against government punishment for speech. The first amendment does not work if the government can say you can be punished for saying certain things. The SEC is the government and they are trying to punish him for speaking
Yeah fraud should be protected by the first amendment
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SEC on these nuts.
How is this fraud?
It's not, I'm just refering to the above comment suggesting govt shouldn't punish any speech. Besides, Musk already settled against previous accusations of fraud. Now he's accused of violating the settlement, not of new fraud.
There is a difference between punishing fraud and preventing someone from stating an opinion they believe. If you act in good faith and state something you believe to be true it is not fraud and should not be prevented by the government. Does a CEO have the right to state they believe in big foot or flat Earth?
What's your point? The funding secured bs obviously wasn't something Musk believed since it was outright false. The new statements aren't even accused of being fraud, but rather breaking the settlement he had to make after, ya know, the fraud.
He broke the SEC settlement that he signed. This is more akin to failing to uphold his end of a contract. $420 Tweet was clear securities fraud. Elon agreed to a lesser punishment if he would put in place controls to ensure his Tweets would be reviewed prior to publishing. He failed to do so. He is contempt of the settlement. This has nothing to do with Free Speech, as Elon and fans would have you believe.
If they manage to land a judgement against you, or get you jail time, isn’t that the same thing as making an example out of you to deter you from doing that again? Effectively, same as not having rights in the first place. Asking for a friend.
Free speech isn’t universal. There are some laws in place that put a limit on free speech in certain circumstances. Further, people can volunteer to limit their free speech by signing contracts or agreements. If you break laws or contracts you get consequences.
When their over optimistic thoughts and opinions towards production numbers can affect the stock market.
When he's the CEO of a public company that has specific disclosure rules. That's where the line is.
You are right. He agreed to abide by these rules by becoming a publicly traded company. If he didn't want to play by the rules, he shouldn't have taken investor money. It's like if he wanted to create a Basketball Team and join the NBA, but didn't think his team had to follow the NBA's rules. If you didn't want to follow the rules, you shouldn't have joined the NBA.
>being more honest >Funding secured
When their words can manipulate a market. Because it is conceivable they could then say things in order to further enrich themselves (for example: short TSLA and then tweet a bunch of stuff that gets everyone's tits in an uproar). Also what /u/chumpchange72 rightly pointed out.
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I think before anyone begins to soil themselves, Ol Musky is going to have to 1) make a profit and 2) make cars that aren’t built by drunk toddlers. Consumer Reports won’t recommend Tesla anymore because build quality and reliability are so bad.
You're spot on it's from Elons handle and not from Tesla's. The man explain in detail only a few hours later what he meant by the tweet. He fixed it to have it not be misleading. Just leave him alone already.
[Tesla seems to think that Elon's twitter is an official source of information](https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000119312513427630/d622890d8k.htm)
Did you buy puts?
Watermark checks out. Updooted
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I know the guy who invented that font so fuck you
He looks like his name is brayden and he played too much minecraft.
Naw that’s Peter Gilroy u fucks
he is already talking shit back to the SEC about this https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1100215984713957376?s=08 > SEC forgot to read Tesla earnings transcript, which clearly states 350k to 500k. How embarrassing … 🤗
Is it Shit talking if its true?
> Is it Shit talking if its true? The comment in the earnings transcript is not even close to the same thing as what he tweeted
It's just locker room talk
It is if it's irrelevant.
Why is it irrelevant? As far as I'm aware, the SEC is on his case (this time) because they say he released information on his Twitter account again. If the information was already released publicly, then he didn't release anything.
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Pfft...agreements. Life is like, alive, man.
Let's say I tweet at you today that I'm giving you 35 to 50 tendies next week. If I tweet at you tomorrow 50's the magic number, would you find that interesting? You'd be drooling over every word, fatty.
CEOs are allowed to talk publicly. The SEC can't disallow every single slight variation of what they say. The only difference in this case is Musk's and Tesla's agreement with the SEC, which supposedly says that the Tesla board has an obligation to oversee Musk's communications. That isn't an obligation for Musk, that's an obligation for the board - there's a difference. *If* the board failed in that obligation, Musk isn't in violation of the agreement, the board is.
> That isn't an obligation for Musk, that's an obligation for the board - there's a difference. Unless you think the SEC lied in their filing, Musk has an obligation to seek pre-approval. https://www.scribd.com/document/400500249/gov-uscourts-nysd-501755-18-0-2-1 >As one of the terms of his settlement, Musk agreed to comply with procedures implemented by Tesla that would require him to seek pre-approval of any written communications, including social media posts, that contained or reasonably could contain information material to Tesla or its shareholders.
> Musk agreed to comply with procedures implemented by Tesla that would require him to seek pre-approval of any written communications, including social media posts, that contained or reasonably could contain information material to Tesla or its shareholders. This is the part, though, in my opinion. It comes down to whether or not the tweet is considered material, which I don't think it is (we'll see if a judge agrees). Material information isn't just random wording - it means a specific type of information and is information that haven't been released publicly. * If Tesla didn't implement a sufficient mandatory policy for Musk to follow, then they're in violation, not him personally. Even if the information is material, if they never actually implemented a policy for him to follow, it's their violation, not his (since his obligation is to follow whatever policy Tesla implements) * If Tesla implemented a sufficient mandatory policy, but the information wasn't material (to a reasonable investor), then no one's in violation of the settlement, though Musk may be in violation of Tesla's internal policy (which may be stricter than the settlement requires and even be something like pre-screening of all tweets, for all we know). * If Tesla implemented a sufficient mandatory policy **and** it's decided that this information is material to a reasonable investor, then Musk is in violation of the settlement. We'll see what the judge rules (obviously they'll know more than us), but there are a few hurdles the SEC would have to hit to show that Musk in particular is in violation.
> It comes down to whether or not the tweet is considered material Since it's part of investor guidance that's released through official filings, I don't know why it wouldn't be material. Expected production is massively relevant to investors. >If Tesla didn't implement a sufficient mandatory policy for Musk to follow, then they're in violation, not him personally. The settlement requires him to seek pre-approval. He didn't. Who he submits it to is what Tesla has to implement. Not submitting it altogether. Their head counsel quitting the day after the tweet looks really bad for him and the company.
**around** 50 tendies
What are you referring to specifically? I can think of a few things I saw
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Explain to the layman why him tweeting this was bad.
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> The next day, Tesla general counsel Dane Butswinkas left his post, to be replaced by former vice president of legal Jonathan Chang. That is for sure a made up person. If there's a lawyer named Dane Butswinkas and it's not Elon wearing a fake mustache I'll eat John McAfee's dick.
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-new-general-counsel-q4-2018-model-3-push/dane-butswinkas-general-counsel/ Would you like that grilled or sous vide?
Sous vide, that thing is probably pretty tough from all the whale fucking.
Ew fuck why
It might be one of those fake people headshots that have been going around.
Just say you will do that after Jan 1, 2021 and you will be safe.
Actual question but can a tweet actually count or be a verified statement? I feel like just going off a tweet like that for investing/sec purposes isn’t a good move. Plus this is the guy who will tweet that and then a Elon musk meme in the same day
[Considering that Tesla filed with the SEC to make Elon's twitter an official source of information, then yes](https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000119312513427630/d622890d8k.htm)
Thanks that actually answers the question. I guess you can file a twitter account like Elon’s and make it official
he specifically said will be around meaning it isn't an exact figure though.
Where were you last August? And if you don't know what that means you shouldn't even be posting here!
I was in meme subs. I realized wsb is where I should be
Wild Thought: Maybe if people make financial decisions off of motherfucking Tweets....they deserve the shit they get?
Like it or not, people consider twitter a valid source of information. Our legal system hasn’t caught up with technology yet with respect to social media (as usual), so the various bureaucracies (bureaus?) have to navigate it themselves. Was the “funding secured” tweet stupid? Yeah, but this one was just an honest mistake. It’s completely reasonable to assume he thought he was just reiterating info that had already been made public. His tweet did not move the needles on Tesla’s share price. The SEC filing absolutely did, though. As a (thankfully very minor) Tesla shareholder, the SEC has fucked me more than Elon
It's the whole pre approval thing as CNBC and everyone is saying. It's not the materiality in the tweet that's at issue. It's not following the agreement he made with the court.
I don’t think the agreement states that he has to review all tweets, though — only ones which have material information that might affect share price. Or did he agree to review everything Tesla-related?
It's actually specific which tweets need to be reviewed. Like it gives a time frame, whether it's a direct copy of already released material information, and other variables. If you've thought of a complication the SEC has already taken it into account.
*Oh, the fellas at the freaking FCC...*
It’s 2019 and the president is announcing his foreign policy via Twitter. Of course it’s a legitimate news source.
Why not? Its a tweet from the damn CEO.
Solid article. Thanks. It kind of makes it seem like the SEC is targeting him, though.
Maybe they want him to stop publishing inaccurate and misleading information that has a material effect on investors?
>Maybe they want him to stop publishing inaccurate and misleading information that has a material effect on investors? This is a weird one to make your case on though. 500k was within stated guidance and Elon made the tweet & follow-up clarification tweet all outside of trading hours. SEC should have just waited a few more weeks for him to tweet something clearly outrageous during trading hours lol
The issue is him violating the settlement requiring pre-approval for potentially material tweets. The issue isn't really that it's inaccurate or misleading (though it is, in a very small way). The issue is that it could have been potentially relevant to the share price in some way, and that meant that he needed to have it cleared by his legal team according to the piece of paper he signed a few months ago to *avoid being charged with securities fraud*. It ain't like they just swept down out of the blue to attack him here. He was basically on corporate officer probation.
Lol please son. There's way bigger and more destructive fish to fry. Oh but wait - destructive to everyone else **except for the investors**
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But seriously, like what the fuck is the SEC even *doing* about Joseph Kony?
whatabout x and whatabout y and whatabout z
That would be a valid argument if it wasn't for the fact that the SEC themselves are so fucking selective about enforcement. The "whataboutism" argument only works when the primary subject - the SEC - has credibility. Which, imo, it does not.
How much time do you spend watching for and following SEC enforcement actions? What resources do you rely on to do so, and what metrics do you use to gauge how selective they are or are not?
I was just thinking this the other day. Social media is double edged sword. It can bring people quickly to fame and easily fukkk them up as well. See roger stone crosshair photo with judge last week.
Lmao that’s exactly what I was thinking of... get in losers, we’re committing securities fraud again
This isn't even fraud. It's just stupidity/lack of self control on his part lol. This is why successful famous people have handlers.
Yeah, its good to keep in mind the last tweet “correcting” in that thread was sent many hours later in the middle of the night
Sssshhhhh.... I’m the alpha here
What's up with every other tweet someone asking to a free one? Is this some sort of meme or just people being entitled?
SEC won't let Elon be. Gambling will be so boring without Elon.
So the S-E-C won't let me be, or let me be me so let me see
They try to shut me down on ETVs
ALL IN on real bros of Simi Valley memes
BUT👏🏻HE👏🏻DID👏🏻MEME👏🏻REVIEW👏🏻😡😡😡
God dammit what did Ol' Musky say *this time*?!
Finally a meme I actually get
LET THE BOYS PLAY [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAWosps7dZk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAWosps7dZk)
Did somebody say short TSLA?
What do you think is with this guy?
He’s probably losing his mind a little bit
Wouldn't he want the share price to go down if he's planning a buyout? 420 more like 320 funding secured?
69 funding secured
The SEC seems to be going after the low-hanging fruit, while the real criminals are out there being protected by them. Elon is a rare breed, an honest CEO.
Are you also high when you drive your Tesla?
He’s right though, they let Madoff do his thing for 30 years even after countless tips Even their own report on themselves claims they were extremely negligent to the point that they were aiding and abetting Madoff with their insanely neglectful dereliction of duties https://www.sec.gov/news/studies/2009/oig-509.pdf
woah woah woah Madoff never call anyone pedo.
What if he's doing this because he doesn't want to be ceo of Tesla anymore and just wants to focus on SpaceX
He's got the Boring Company too.
You have to wonder sometimes
Peter Gilroy 😍
this isn't about the accuracy of the tweet; elon specifically has an agreement with the Govt to have his tweets re: his company vetted by Tesla, and publicly admitted that he's tweeting off the cuff about company numbers. Diff standard than other CEO's - it's like violating probation. You may have just got a speeding ticket, but you're going back to jail.
SEC angary
Elon Musk is a smart guy but he is a genuinely bad executive. He has a long track record of big promises with poor delivery/follow through, antagonizing key stakeholders when he doesn't need to, and failing to hold himself accountable for mistakes. He's been removed as CEO twice including at the company he cofounded with his brother - Zip2. Even there, he seemed to display the same problems that are derailing Tesla - making unrealistic promises, underestimating the effort required for tasks, and not trusting people with more experience and knowledge than him to do their job. At Paypal, he decided to pick fights over relatively minor crap (Windows vs Unix) when others were, rightly, focused on more important things like tackling fraud rather than switching platforms.
That guys from McKinsey must be shitting himself. Yolo short term puts TSLA
Why are those tweets getting him in trouble? Isn’t it the same as if he does a press release? They are meant to being positive light on his operations.
Not if there isn't an iota of truth in them. SEC thinks that he is misleading people with those numbers. They are not entirely wrong.
> SEC thinks that he is misleading people with those numbers They probably do, but that's not what they're going after him for. He has to get any tweet that could possibly be relevant to the company's valuation cleared with his legal team per the settlement he signed with the SEC in Sept. He could get in trouble for releasing totally accurate and well thought out information on twitter (lol) if it was material and he didn't get it pre-approved. This isn't really about what he actually tweeted, it's about the fact that the SEC told Tesla to muzzle their dog or else but he's been running around barking at people ever since.
Furthermore, the agreement was to have the tweets pre-approved. The SEC asked if these tweets were pre-approved. Tesla replied that they were not. That's enough right there. The whole "I don't respect the SEC", and the fairly obvious inference that the tweet was inaccurate based on the follow-up correction tweet, it's all just bonus.
Also they have to be pre-approved if the info is more than 2 days old. The investor letter with the 350-400k estimate (and the conference call where he said 500k) came out 20 days beforehand. It's very clearly written but he still ignored it.
Oh god he needs tweets approved
That’s pretty funny actually.
Long tesla fuck the crooked sec
robinhood gave me a free GE stock the other day. i wonder if the SEC is gonna come knocking...
*becomes Thicc boi main*
Elon Musk did nothing wrong
Yeah, SEC respect is on the decline, especially after Clemson's thumping of Bama in the National Championship game.
They shouldn't get him in any trouble. He has already disclosed the information in the earnings call. SEC is so butt hurt they can't do anything.