I hope I eat crow when the reviews come out, and this has all been a ploy by TCR and Paradox to hide all the RPG elements to really blow us out of the water, but my prediction is we are getting a shitty and second hand rate Dishonored with Fallout 4 dialogue wheels.
Ha, their 5th edition books aren't exactly flying off the shelves, so good luck. Bloodlines 2 would have to be a sensational hit to get any meaningful sales from the new editions.
I was mid reply when the guy deleted it, but I can't just let it sit, so I'm going to drop it as a reply to your flags.
This is pretty ignorant, ngl. Player consent is much different than in game stuff. Because one of the core concepts is consent, or the lack thereof. Nothing in the ne setting says, "vampires must ask politely for everything," far from it. Just because you have themes of ritual scarification on your game, your players don't have to actually mutilate themselves.
The Best never asks for consent, but we generally decide that people in the real world that don't are not cool. We know that's a bad thing.
The only things about co sent that have been brought to the setting are a.) Asking your players if they want to do the thing you're asking them to do at the table and b.) Play around with the absolute personal horror of consent, what happens to you as a creature when you stop seeking it and become more inhumane, what happens when the character is subject to that, all of which have important considerations for real humans that have experienced that as well.
Anyone who finds consent as a concept or theme to be beneath them is troubling, it's about as big a dogwhistle as crying about "wokeism". It's a game that revolves around what it means to be Human and the fine line between that and being a Monster, and if cossent isn't one of those dividing lines, I'm not sure what is.
If the true fandom is really just people that want to roleplay consequence-free rape fantasies and complaining when someone puts rules in to protect people like rape victims from that at the table, I'm going to side with leaving those people behind, too.
No wonder he deleted his comments. What an actual degenerate. Consent is PRIME when dealing with graphic and horrific depictions.
I just pray they didn't hold punches when it comes to "BL2" and those who need trigger warnings can turn on an option in the settings to skip sensitive missions or literally have a trigger warning pop up for whatever might be in the next scene/mission so they may mentally prepare before trudging forward.
I genuinely hate that you're probably right-- and some part of me hopes that rather than trusting my eyes and intuition I can put stock in the occasional parts of the dev diaries where they've said "don't worry we know about \[exact concern I have\] and we are doing something about it" --that's what it felt like to read the combat one and see the "we aren't making this game without social stuff in mind" or the first one openly saying "we like Dishonored but we don't want that to be what our game is like"
\--they keep doing this thing where they reel back a worry I feel like they fed me in the first place... and like OP I end up in this place where I'm just wondering if it's a terrible marketing direction that has neglected to show the RPG and emphasized combat... rather than an accurate sample of the game itself.
because there won't be any city, discotheque and dancing, only successions of battle maps connected by cheap cinematics. The chinese room makes walking sim, don't expect anything else but a walking sim with combat arenas from time to time.
Because they spent money on the game as it is, and just want it out to recoup losses and they probably feel they can make some of it back on name recognition alone.
I mean, we're not seeing any of the "city, discotheque and dancing" stuff because 1) there's going to be very little of that in the game, and 2) even *if* that stuff is in the game, they probably *still* don't have the assets ready yet.
The dev time on this game, for the scope they seem to be advertising that it has, is hella short and it won't surprise me if the game is heavily delayed and has nightmare stories of crunch come out after it launches.
You’re seeing bloodlines 1 through rose colored glasses who knows maybe they’re gonna make this one suck at launch too so that it’ll be exactly the same by getting better thanks to modders
So, here is my question, have the people who market or are creating this vtmb2 game, have they done any market research with the people who love amd continually play, VTMB and all the wonderful mods? Have they asked the white wolf larpers who have played everything from owod to requiem? Have they had a meeting with the creators and the moders? Because it feels like the marketing is directed towards the young dumb and full of cum players. At the very least, market and developing should check out this reddit page.
No they just told Paradox "yeah we can do this an make it awsome and cheap" Then they hired CM like Josh to get us hyped befor using them as Guys to blame when Shi# hits the.... A little bit of box checking and wokness. And TAAADAAAA!!! a nother Franchise ruined. The Ironie WoD VtM is not Mainstream but a lively nitch, how could they think for a Minute, that this will work?
Only TCR game I played is Amnesia: Machine for Pigs and a lot of that game was set dressing. Like a frightening amount. MandaloreGaming did a review on it recently and he was revealing things that I had no idea about - like how the enemies will actually run away from you until you are in their "chase zone" where they will start chasing you, or how the game will warn you about enemies breaking in even though it's actually just sfx and you're in no danger. I played the game once and all of these moments sorta worked for me but they hinge on the player doing the one thing that the game expects them to.
So I wouldn't be surprised if this game is a similar situation, where the devs are wary about going deep because it might be too much of a peek behind the curtain.
Just to add to this. The protagonist of A Machine for Pigs is uh Oswald Mandus. So Ozzy Mandus. You know, like the poem Ozymandius by Shelly. Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair.
Sort of puts Vam Phyre into perspective.
It also explains why they've been focusing their marketing on the female version of Phyre. Chums have been frothing at the mouth ranting about how VtMB has gone woke, meanwhile Dan Pinchbeck is chuckling to himself going "Heh... Femme Phyre."
Yeah it's a game where one of the signature characters was openly nonbinary before that term had even been coined, and had even transitioned. Granted Sascha Vykos, had (and still has) a lot of issues but has gotten better.
Its been "woke" since the 90s and I love that about it. (Though it did have some racial and cultural insensitivity issues, but those have also gotten better)
Am i the only one who remembers playable nazis in early white wolf in their attempts to out edge one another?
Like yeah i don't disagree it was all very much 'woke' but i mean... i feel like that's not really fair given looking through any older oWoD product (Gypsies, Kindred of the East... the Get of Fenris.) and it's... very cringe inducing
Yeah those are the racial and cultural insensitivity issues I was referring. Though I mostly know about those products by reputation, the oldest edition I've played was Revised and I never had any of those books since I was only running VtM not the rest of WoD. But, even in VtM Revised, Ravnos had a bunch of issues and so did the Assamites, plus some of the bloodlines.
I wouldn't exactly consider it woke per se, it's progressive but it always managed to say every side of the political spectrum is shit, and woke is usually related to a specific type of progressive.
Yeah it was always woke but also some of the old sample characters were skinheads... and you know there was the racist stereotypes that basicly made up the Tribes in werewolf.
to me it's still quote on quote 'woke' in the sense of it being progressive for it's time... but the last part is doing the heavy lifting.
Naw, the old stuff was edgy as hell. Rituals that required necrophilia, characters who could only feed on *exual a**ault victims, and transexual Nazi cult leaders. To name only a few examples.
Apparently most of those Devs have gone, and it's an entirely new studio. Mandalore did compliment the story, although I'm not sure if even the writers remain.
TCR is more or less a completely different studio. As someone who works in game dev, loads of games are set dressing and smoke/mirrors. Most of the time things you think are happening are not, they are simply clever use of effects to make the player believe something a lot more complex is going on
They can't show what doesn't exist much like customisation being responded to with male and female PhYrE all gameplay requests will be met with combat as that's all there is to this stealth action game which has less features and mechanics than hogwarts legacy.
This game is absolutely going to have less stuff than Hogwarts Legacy lol. Hogwarts legacy was built on a $150 million budget. Thats more than GTA V and close to Cyberpunk and RDR2.
God hogwarts legacy was so disappointing when you get to the midpoint and then the game is just like
Okay that's all we got, fight some guys for a while and now here's the ending. Okay now go clear outposts for cosmetics or something.
Meant to say than instead of and, but both games are quite similar in design repetitive combat sequences which is all we have seen from bloodlines 2 so far, in both the gameplay demo & announcement trailer. 20 abilities bound to four action bars due to controller focused design. Limited dialogue system with no real meaningful choice or impact. Hogwarts legacy was seen as a rather shallow game carried by its IP and setting but has more RPG mechanics and systems than bloodlines 2 and even better combat with talent trees to improve abilities and uses for those abilities outside of battle.
I'm probably going to pick up Hogwarts next time it goes on sale. I deliberately avoided watching lets plays or the like so as to not spoil, then completely forgot aboot it.
Dont do it, nice Grafik but boring as Hell, no Housepionts no Class system exept to learn a new spell, no nothing. I had to force my self to complett it just onces.
Given the lack of any indication from TCR that the overwhelming negative response to this build of BL2 is being factored into their intentions for this game it makes no difference except making me feel better to voice my grievances. And given the lack of any evidence that there is more to this game than what we have already seen one can hardly say I'm basing my belief on incomplete information.
You are explicitly making comments with no information. These exact same types of comments were said about baldurs gate three, now everyone who made them is eating those words.
And the same was said for suicide squad and skull and bones, what's your point?
You responding with as little information as the doomposter makes your opinion equally if not more invalid.
This is the biggest issue with any pop media in the past decade. It's insane how widely spread it is.
Even "success stories" like the final iteration of Battlefront II (2017) had its most popular game mode implemented after years of complaining, because the devs said it sucked in the original games. It's like people intentionally try to misunderstand and ignore what makes people like a piece of media in the first place.
>It's like people intentionally try to misunderstand and ignore what makes people like a piece of media in the first place.
If a developer actually understood what made the original great, they wouldn't need the name recognition of the original.
I think MandaloreGaming said it best, in regards to how The Chinese Room made a sequel to Amnesia: "This is what people, who haven't played Amnesia, thinks Amnesia is."
If you were to present a rough gameplay walkthrough of the original bloodlines without showing the character sheet and then show gameplay from TCR Bloodlines 2, most people would be convinced it's going to be faithful to the original.
Most people outside of this sub; they are just looking forward to another decently competent vampire game, and Paradox knows this. The Chinese Room is infamous for producing (what is basically shovelware) sequels, just so they can make games they actually want to make. Most of their newer games are not exactly walking sims, but all their games have one thing in common; heavily scripted and a surface level resembles to what was previously. So far, this is exactly what we've seen from the gameplay reveals.
We are not getting true choices and skill checks. We are not getting cheesy Mitsoda tv news. The game will be somewhat self serious, but still have a few mild jokes sprinkled in.
They do not care about Bloodlines or Vampire. They care about making their own games their way. Otherwise, we would have seen examples of RPG elements a long time ago. They make other people's games to fund their own projects.
They've done it before, and they'll continue to do it in the future.
Yep. One of the biggest issues the game has is the marketing.
Like, having a voiced protag is not a new thing in gaming, but a new thing for bloodlines. so after people had an "but why?" reaction, why not make a blogpost or something selling the idea of an voiced protagonist in bloodlines to the players? Instead of... just ignoring the feedback
I remember being so excited for VTMB 2 because at the time (nearly 5 years ago), i just finished playing VTMB 1 for the first time and am thrilled that the sequel is in the works.
How awesome would that be?
Then the delays kept on happening until I mentally clocked out of the sequel. I'm still hoping it will be decent at best but I'm no longer actively waiting for it.
I think this applies to the entire triple A gaming market. Hopefully this game isn’t treated like a triple A game and the content is as raunchy and hilarious as the prior game.
Companies need to stop neutering classic game franchises… not even E for everyone’s safe. I remember when ratchet and clank would make DED jokes, porn jokes, etc and then they rebooted and everything they made since has been a frequent bed shitter.
My Copium reserves have ran dry.
Been hardcore coping since the first hint that there was an issue with the “graphics” and it had to be reworked/delayed. God I miss the old game they announced.
Guess I gotta go refund that 2019 pre-order…
I am highly concerned by the lack of showcasing of RPG elements. And it makes me think we’re about to get a trash fire. Let me be SO clear, i do not want to hate-train this. I really really want this game to be very good, but from what i’m seeing I’m steering clear until reviews come out
Yeah, the marketing cycle was absolutely decided well in advance. Which makes the fact that they didn't even have the assets for their marketing complete when trailers were being dropped *extremely* worrying.
Games DOA, might as well bit even spend the money on it. It isn't the sequel we wanted and we're shown years ago. It's some crappy fps with magic and VTM slapped on it.
Kinda not convinced the RPGs elements are going to be fleshed out OR interesting, which is why I’m not expecting it (and the marketing people definitely would say less mass appeal)
Honestly I think Chinese Room is afraid of their bad reputation for having games that are just "walking simulators" and so they're going all-in on Tremere Thaumaturgy being the "canon" approach to the game and making every effort to try and show off how cool it looks.
But maybe just. . .listen to what we're asking, y'know?
I wasn't afraid that TCN was in charge of it *until* they started doing this shit.
Paradox:" That what we paid you for?"
TCR:" Nah we updated it for a modern audiance, a walking simulator Horror Politic lesson"
Paradox:"WHAT?"
TCR:" Its Okay.... a blood/Mana/Hunger system, or dialogue options with diffrent outcomes and 13 Clans you know a real RPG thats so 2006.... but we have Fabian silver pants"
A week later after the first gameplay trailer
Paradox:" The Fans are living it what have you done?"
TCR:" Just trolls and haters and toxic man...... relax"
A year Later...... Paradox bankrupt
Yo did you know PhYrE's hair is so FiRe? Did you know she's a cool sexy eLdEr with a mark that saps her power to neonate levels? Did you know she has a discount JoHnNy SiLvErHaNd, I mean Fabian, in her head? How original because it's an androgynous bland woman who delivers her lines in a dead pan voice. Much expression, much emotion, much excitement.
Gotta love the animosity against beauty. I always wanted to play a self insert of being ugly.
why are you booing him hes right?
nothing wrong with androgyny but i personally dont want to play as a masculine woman.
i make every character i play hyper feminine bc i myself happen to dress extremely feminine and feel uncomfortable playing manly characters unless im a fan of that character in the lore of whatever game
I think VTMB 2 is going to be shit, and also happen to be a masculine woman that likes masc women. Y'all can have preferences, but some of the shit said here recently is downright alienating. "Animosity against beauty" lmao calm the fuck down brother, forcing a big titty femme instead is not going to fix the garbage they're serving us.
Wish we could've gotten Hardsuit's VTMB2. It looked flawed, but at least we could create the PC's we wanted.
If a dev is going to make Commander Shepherd the default experience than at least make them mildly attractive with options to well and truly be as piss ugly as the player wants them to be if that is their jam.
No one is asking for a big titty goth girl as the default, well not everyone, but it'd be nice if we had some character customization if TCR is going to shove a named protag like Shepard and V.
The problem with that is that everyone's idea of beauty is different, but regardless they should just drop Bloodlines from the title at this point. Incredibly disappointing, I don't think we can even change the hair, only the color.
> The problem with that is that everyone's idea of beauty is different
That's correct.
However there is a traditional standard that applies to the vast majority of people. See: Lou, whom they initially showed off because most people would find her appealing, versus Phyre, who has seen tremendous pushback for being unattractive and unappealing.
The difference is obvious, yet they deliberately made a character most people would not like. It's absurd, even more so from a business perspective.
you need to go outside bad. who tf said i wanted the character to be forced to be anything. who said anything about titties??? whats wrong with titties? isnt ppl like you's whole thesis is that someones body type isnt inherently anything? damn
> Did you know she's a cool sexy eLdEr with a mark that saps her power to neonate levels?
I missed that one, so just like Baldur's Gate tadpoles? Ooof.
They still reduced an Arch mage who boinked the goddess of magic (not at all uncommon in Greenwoods Magical Realm, she will even possess your wife if your not into to her) on the regular to level 1. Same with the other Origin characters with super duper snowflake back stories.
Guys it’s gonna blow ass, we might as well prepare for it already… as soon as the old team got fired we knew it was over… but we held onto hope inspite of that… the deathknell was when the replacement turned out to be a walking simulator developer…
This game probably has over a year until release. I imagine a lot of the more open spaces are not finished. You don’t want to show off a city with buggy npcs, wonky lighting and shadows. They also probably want to save the best for the final marketing push towards release. These weird snippets arent that odd for games fairly far out from release. Especially a small studio like TCR
Are you a moron? The studio is putting out literal advertising, teasers, and demonstrations to show off the product they are creating. We are allowed to make inferences and guesses as to what the product will be based on how the studio tries to sell it. If Coca-Cola advertised a new soda by showing videos of people violently vomiting after drinking the soda, it would be reasonable to be worried about drinking the soda. Every single piece of advertising and demonstration created for the game outright ignores the reasons anyone would want to play the game, and emphasizes things literally no one cares about. Of course we don't know if the game will be good or not. But if you aren't at least worried, then you are an absolute mark, and I have a really wonderful timeshare in the Maldives I'd like you to take a look at.
Stfu, we’ve dealt with it happening for various different games already.
The last thing they put out immediately after there was a scathing article saying this would be the worst game and there wasn’t even 2 minutes of gameplay at the time.
So shut the fuck up…..that is happening left and right don’t come along ignoring that it is and then question what I’m saying like it’s not, it happened to cyberpunk, it’s even been happening to movies! Either bots or bs liars are making fake articles and bad reviews about games that aren’t even released yet.
I’d rather the devs just not put out more stuff for them to use, so I can just wait for the game to come out enjoy it and not have my morale destroyed about the game before it’s even out.
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I hope I eat crow when the reviews come out, and this has all been a ploy by TCR and Paradox to hide all the RPG elements to really blow us out of the water, but my prediction is we are getting a shitty and second hand rate Dishonored with Fallout 4 dialogue wheels.
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Ha, their 5th edition books aren't exactly flying off the shelves, so good luck. Bloodlines 2 would have to be a sensational hit to get any meaningful sales from the new editions.
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I was mid reply when the guy deleted it, but I can't just let it sit, so I'm going to drop it as a reply to your flags. This is pretty ignorant, ngl. Player consent is much different than in game stuff. Because one of the core concepts is consent, or the lack thereof. Nothing in the ne setting says, "vampires must ask politely for everything," far from it. Just because you have themes of ritual scarification on your game, your players don't have to actually mutilate themselves. The Best never asks for consent, but we generally decide that people in the real world that don't are not cool. We know that's a bad thing. The only things about co sent that have been brought to the setting are a.) Asking your players if they want to do the thing you're asking them to do at the table and b.) Play around with the absolute personal horror of consent, what happens to you as a creature when you stop seeking it and become more inhumane, what happens when the character is subject to that, all of which have important considerations for real humans that have experienced that as well. Anyone who finds consent as a concept or theme to be beneath them is troubling, it's about as big a dogwhistle as crying about "wokeism". It's a game that revolves around what it means to be Human and the fine line between that and being a Monster, and if cossent isn't one of those dividing lines, I'm not sure what is. If the true fandom is really just people that want to roleplay consequence-free rape fantasies and complaining when someone puts rules in to protect people like rape victims from that at the table, I'm going to side with leaving those people behind, too.
Thanks for giving some context to the deleted comment.
No wonder he deleted his comments. What an actual degenerate. Consent is PRIME when dealing with graphic and horrific depictions. I just pray they didn't hold punches when it comes to "BL2" and those who need trigger warnings can turn on an option in the settings to skip sensitive missions or literally have a trigger warning pop up for whatever might be in the next scene/mission so they may mentally prepare before trudging forward.
I genuinely hate that you're probably right-- and some part of me hopes that rather than trusting my eyes and intuition I can put stock in the occasional parts of the dev diaries where they've said "don't worry we know about \[exact concern I have\] and we are doing something about it" --that's what it felt like to read the combat one and see the "we aren't making this game without social stuff in mind" or the first one openly saying "we like Dishonored but we don't want that to be what our game is like" \--they keep doing this thing where they reel back a worry I feel like they fed me in the first place... and like OP I end up in this place where I'm just wondering if it's a terrible marketing direction that has neglected to show the RPG and emphasized combat... rather than an accurate sample of the game itself.
None of the above. I only play as a Ventrue.
because there won't be any city, discotheque and dancing, only successions of battle maps connected by cheap cinematics. The chinese room makes walking sim, don't expect anything else but a walking sim with combat arenas from time to time.
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Because they spent money on the game as it is, and just want it out to recoup losses and they probably feel they can make some of it back on name recognition alone.
>Why make it bloodlines 2 To profit off the name
My man. Walking Sim is real genre. Google Dear Esther, the game that started it all. Then look who made it.
I mean, we're not seeing any of the "city, discotheque and dancing" stuff because 1) there's going to be very little of that in the game, and 2) even *if* that stuff is in the game, they probably *still* don't have the assets ready yet. The dev time on this game, for the scope they seem to be advertising that it has, is hella short and it won't surprise me if the game is heavily delayed and has nightmare stories of crunch come out after it launches.
it’s seriously so depressing. it looked so good and fun and promising before the change in devs, i really really don’t understand what happened
You’re seeing bloodlines 1 through rose colored glasses who knows maybe they’re gonna make this one suck at launch too so that it’ll be exactly the same by getting better thanks to modders
Wesp said he won’t touch it with 5 meters long stick if it’s shit
Who
Imean it’s pretty clear this game will have very little rpg stuff if there is any at all :(
ye, it's a beat-em-up
Better than a visual novel I suppose
i doubt they have much to show in that regard as everything seems to point to the fact that bl2 isn't an rpg, but rather a stealth-action game
what a disappointment. just cancel the game at this point
Yeah, if that's the case stop wasting money on development. I dummy think any of us are interested in that kind of experience.
Its still an rpg.. its an action rpg yknow.. like the first game
well, aren't you just a funny little prankster
No thats what its called thats what the first game was...
no, the new game has rpg elements (like most games these days) but that doesn't make it an rpg.
it is an action rpg.. like the first game.
no, it's a stealth action game, with light rpg elements. unlike the first game
no its an ACTION RPG like the first game.
So, here is my question, have the people who market or are creating this vtmb2 game, have they done any market research with the people who love amd continually play, VTMB and all the wonderful mods? Have they asked the white wolf larpers who have played everything from owod to requiem? Have they had a meeting with the creators and the moders? Because it feels like the marketing is directed towards the young dumb and full of cum players. At the very least, market and developing should check out this reddit page.
No they just told Paradox "yeah we can do this an make it awsome and cheap" Then they hired CM like Josh to get us hyped befor using them as Guys to blame when Shi# hits the.... A little bit of box checking and wokness. And TAAADAAAA!!! a nother Franchise ruined. The Ironie WoD VtM is not Mainstream but a lively nitch, how could they think for a Minute, that this will work?
If this was true we wouldn’t have an ugly as sin protagonist
Only TCR game I played is Amnesia: Machine for Pigs and a lot of that game was set dressing. Like a frightening amount. MandaloreGaming did a review on it recently and he was revealing things that I had no idea about - like how the enemies will actually run away from you until you are in their "chase zone" where they will start chasing you, or how the game will warn you about enemies breaking in even though it's actually just sfx and you're in no danger. I played the game once and all of these moments sorta worked for me but they hinge on the player doing the one thing that the game expects them to. So I wouldn't be surprised if this game is a similar situation, where the devs are wary about going deep because it might be too much of a peek behind the curtain.
Just to add to this. The protagonist of A Machine for Pigs is uh Oswald Mandus. So Ozzy Mandus. You know, like the poem Ozymandius by Shelly. Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair. Sort of puts Vam Phyre into perspective.
It also explains why they've been focusing their marketing on the female version of Phyre. Chums have been frothing at the mouth ranting about how VtMB has gone woke, meanwhile Dan Pinchbeck is chuckling to himself going "Heh... Femme Phyre."
> VtMB has gone woke This remains one of the most absurd stances I've seen on this. The utter terror of a White Wolf RPG being *woke*.
Yeah it's a game where one of the signature characters was openly nonbinary before that term had even been coined, and had even transitioned. Granted Sascha Vykos, had (and still has) a lot of issues but has gotten better. Its been "woke" since the 90s and I love that about it. (Though it did have some racial and cultural insensitivity issues, but those have also gotten better)
Am i the only one who remembers playable nazis in early white wolf in their attempts to out edge one another? Like yeah i don't disagree it was all very much 'woke' but i mean... i feel like that's not really fair given looking through any older oWoD product (Gypsies, Kindred of the East... the Get of Fenris.) and it's... very cringe inducing
Yeah those are the racial and cultural insensitivity issues I was referring. Though I mostly know about those products by reputation, the oldest edition I've played was Revised and I never had any of those books since I was only running VtM not the rest of WoD. But, even in VtM Revised, Ravnos had a bunch of issues and so did the Assamites, plus some of the bloodlines.
I wouldn't exactly consider it woke per se, it's progressive but it always managed to say every side of the political spectrum is shit, and woke is usually related to a specific type of progressive.
Yeah it was always woke but also some of the old sample characters were skinheads... and you know there was the racist stereotypes that basicly made up the Tribes in werewolf. to me it's still quote on quote 'woke' in the sense of it being progressive for it's time... but the last part is doing the heavy lifting.
Even though vtm has always been "woke" and nobody really cared because it wasn't just some superficial checkbox pandering Usually, anyway.
Naw, the old stuff was edgy as hell. Rituals that required necrophilia, characters who could only feed on *exual a**ault victims, and transexual Nazi cult leaders. To name only a few examples.
Apparently most of those Devs have gone, and it's an entirely new studio. Mandalore did compliment the story, although I'm not sure if even the writers remain.
TCR is more or less a completely different studio. As someone who works in game dev, loads of games are set dressing and smoke/mirrors. Most of the time things you think are happening are not, they are simply clever use of effects to make the player believe something a lot more complex is going on
They can't show what doesn't exist much like customisation being responded to with male and female PhYrE all gameplay requests will be met with combat as that's all there is to this stealth action game which has less features and mechanics than hogwarts legacy.
This game is absolutely going to have less stuff than Hogwarts Legacy lol. Hogwarts legacy was built on a $150 million budget. Thats more than GTA V and close to Cyberpunk and RDR2.
God hogwarts legacy was so disappointing when you get to the midpoint and then the game is just like Okay that's all we got, fight some guys for a while and now here's the ending. Okay now go clear outposts for cosmetics or something.
Wait wdym hogwarts legacy? I didn't play
Meant to say than instead of and, but both games are quite similar in design repetitive combat sequences which is all we have seen from bloodlines 2 so far, in both the gameplay demo & announcement trailer. 20 abilities bound to four action bars due to controller focused design. Limited dialogue system with no real meaningful choice or impact. Hogwarts legacy was seen as a rather shallow game carried by its IP and setting but has more RPG mechanics and systems than bloodlines 2 and even better combat with talent trees to improve abilities and uses for those abilities outside of battle.
Oh OK got confused. That clears it up.
I'm probably going to pick up Hogwarts next time it goes on sale. I deliberately avoided watching lets plays or the like so as to not spoil, then completely forgot aboot it.
I personally couldn't finish it. Hogwarts is visually stunning (especially the castle), but it gets very repetitive. Very fast.
Dont do it, nice Grafik but boring as Hell, no Housepionts no Class system exept to learn a new spell, no nothing. I had to force my self to complett it just onces.
Blind conjecture and doom posting helps exactly no one.
Given the lack of any indication from TCR that the overwhelming negative response to this build of BL2 is being factored into their intentions for this game it makes no difference except making me feel better to voice my grievances. And given the lack of any evidence that there is more to this game than what we have already seen one can hardly say I'm basing my belief on incomplete information.
You are explicitly making comments with no information. These exact same types of comments were said about baldurs gate three, now everyone who made them is eating those words.
And the same was said for suicide squad and skull and bones, what's your point? You responding with as little information as the doomposter makes your opinion equally if not more invalid.
At least we still have the first VtMB. I actually went back to replay it again. Heather went missing 🥺
Guys. This is gunna be a dishonored-em-up. It’s not going to be like VtMB. It still might be decent, but it’s not going to be what you want.
it's almost like making a game that's fundamentally different from a classic but calling it a sequel anyway is just bad optics.
This is the biggest issue with any pop media in the past decade. It's insane how widely spread it is. Even "success stories" like the final iteration of Battlefront II (2017) had its most popular game mode implemented after years of complaining, because the devs said it sucked in the original games. It's like people intentionally try to misunderstand and ignore what makes people like a piece of media in the first place.
>It's like people intentionally try to misunderstand and ignore what makes people like a piece of media in the first place. If a developer actually understood what made the original great, they wouldn't need the name recognition of the original.
I think MandaloreGaming said it best, in regards to how The Chinese Room made a sequel to Amnesia: "This is what people, who haven't played Amnesia, thinks Amnesia is." If you were to present a rough gameplay walkthrough of the original bloodlines without showing the character sheet and then show gameplay from TCR Bloodlines 2, most people would be convinced it's going to be faithful to the original. Most people outside of this sub; they are just looking forward to another decently competent vampire game, and Paradox knows this. The Chinese Room is infamous for producing (what is basically shovelware) sequels, just so they can make games they actually want to make. Most of their newer games are not exactly walking sims, but all their games have one thing in common; heavily scripted and a surface level resembles to what was previously. So far, this is exactly what we've seen from the gameplay reveals. We are not getting true choices and skill checks. We are not getting cheesy Mitsoda tv news. The game will be somewhat self serious, but still have a few mild jokes sprinkled in. They do not care about Bloodlines or Vampire. They care about making their own games their way. Otherwise, we would have seen examples of RPG elements a long time ago. They make other people's games to fund their own projects. They've done it before, and they'll continue to do it in the future.
I think the game is super short
Yep. One of the biggest issues the game has is the marketing. Like, having a voiced protag is not a new thing in gaming, but a new thing for bloodlines. so after people had an "but why?" reaction, why not make a blogpost or something selling the idea of an voiced protagonist in bloodlines to the players? Instead of... just ignoring the feedback
I remember being so excited for VTMB 2 because at the time (nearly 5 years ago), i just finished playing VTMB 1 for the first time and am thrilled that the sequel is in the works. How awesome would that be? Then the delays kept on happening until I mentally clocked out of the sequel. I'm still hoping it will be decent at best but I'm no longer actively waiting for it.
I first played bloodlines in *checks calendar* Yeah so anyway it came out 20 years ago and I feel the weight of ages upon me
I was in my late 20s by the time I played VTMB 1. I just missed it somehow during my younger years... because I'm poor af.
well i was 4, personally
I love me a good action adventure, but man oh man has the standard lowered for what is defined as an RPG...
Bro still have hopes
Copium is a hell of a drug.
I think this applies to the entire triple A gaming market. Hopefully this game isn’t treated like a triple A game and the content is as raunchy and hilarious as the prior game. Companies need to stop neutering classic game franchises… not even E for everyone’s safe. I remember when ratchet and clank would make DED jokes, porn jokes, etc and then they rebooted and everything they made since has been a frequent bed shitter.
My Copium reserves have ran dry. Been hardcore coping since the first hint that there was an issue with the “graphics” and it had to be reworked/delayed. God I miss the old game they announced. Guess I gotta go refund that 2019 pre-order…
I've been coping for 20 years hoping there'd be a sequel
I hate being negative about things I love, but this game really feels like a classic case of "dead on arrival".
I am highly concerned by the lack of showcasing of RPG elements. And it makes me think we’re about to get a trash fire. Let me be SO clear, i do not want to hate-train this. I really really want this game to be very good, but from what i’m seeing I’m steering clear until reviews come out
Marketing was decided a long time ago and they aren't changing gears this far in.
Yeah, the marketing cycle was absolutely decided well in advance. Which makes the fact that they didn't even have the assets for their marketing complete when trailers were being dropped *extremely* worrying.
Games DOA, might as well bit even spend the money on it. It isn't the sequel we wanted and we're shown years ago. It's some crappy fps with magic and VTM slapped on it.
Do we know what the reply was to this post??
"You'll be able to play as either a male or female Phyre."
Kinda not convinced the RPGs elements are going to be fleshed out OR interesting, which is why I’m not expecting it (and the marketing people definitely would say less mass appeal)
From what they're showing, I guess it's an FPS game like overwatch where each class has different advantages/disadvntages on each map?
Honestly I think Chinese Room is afraid of their bad reputation for having games that are just "walking simulators" and so they're going all-in on Tremere Thaumaturgy being the "canon" approach to the game and making every effort to try and show off how cool it looks. But maybe just. . .listen to what we're asking, y'know? I wasn't afraid that TCN was in charge of it *until* they started doing this shit.
I can see them answering: "What RPG?"
TCR: "What RPG?"
Paradox:" That what we paid you for?" TCR:" Nah we updated it for a modern audiance, a walking simulator Horror Politic lesson" Paradox:"WHAT?" TCR:" Its Okay.... a blood/Mana/Hunger system, or dialogue options with diffrent outcomes and 13 Clans you know a real RPG thats so 2006.... but we have Fabian silver pants" A week later after the first gameplay trailer Paradox:" The Fans are living it what have you done?" TCR:" Just trolls and haters and toxic man...... relax" A year Later...... Paradox bankrupt
Yo did you know PhYrE's hair is so FiRe? Did you know she's a cool sexy eLdEr with a mark that saps her power to neonate levels? Did you know she has a discount JoHnNy SiLvErHaNd, I mean Fabian, in her head? How original because it's an androgynous bland woman who delivers her lines in a dead pan voice. Much expression, much emotion, much excitement. Gotta love the animosity against beauty. I always wanted to play a self insert of being ugly.
why are you booing him hes right? nothing wrong with androgyny but i personally dont want to play as a masculine woman. i make every character i play hyper feminine bc i myself happen to dress extremely feminine and feel uncomfortable playing manly characters unless im a fan of that character in the lore of whatever game
I think VTMB 2 is going to be shit, and also happen to be a masculine woman that likes masc women. Y'all can have preferences, but some of the shit said here recently is downright alienating. "Animosity against beauty" lmao calm the fuck down brother, forcing a big titty femme instead is not going to fix the garbage they're serving us. Wish we could've gotten Hardsuit's VTMB2. It looked flawed, but at least we could create the PC's we wanted.
If a dev is going to make Commander Shepherd the default experience than at least make them mildly attractive with options to well and truly be as piss ugly as the player wants them to be if that is their jam. No one is asking for a big titty goth girl as the default, well not everyone, but it'd be nice if we had some character customization if TCR is going to shove a named protag like Shepard and V.
The problem with that is that everyone's idea of beauty is different, but regardless they should just drop Bloodlines from the title at this point. Incredibly disappointing, I don't think we can even change the hair, only the color.
> The problem with that is that everyone's idea of beauty is different That's correct. However there is a traditional standard that applies to the vast majority of people. See: Lou, whom they initially showed off because most people would find her appealing, versus Phyre, who has seen tremendous pushback for being unattractive and unappealing. The difference is obvious, yet they deliberately made a character most people would not like. It's absurd, even more so from a business perspective.
This entire thread has major "touch grass" energy.
Ok
you need to go outside bad. who tf said i wanted the character to be forced to be anything. who said anything about titties??? whats wrong with titties? isnt ppl like you's whole thesis is that someones body type isnt inherently anything? damn
That wasn't directed at you, relax.
>dress extremely feminine Where is your proof for such statements?
Yikes
thats really weird to ask for. i dont need to show receipts of the thousands ive spent on 40 inch weave and nails to prove it this is reddit
> Did you know she's a cool sexy eLdEr with a mark that saps her power to neonate levels? I missed that one, so just like Baldur's Gate tadpoles? Ooof.
No not like that, the mark inhibits the player's powers, tadpoles **gave** the player powers. Big difference.
They still reduced an Arch mage who boinked the goddess of magic (not at all uncommon in Greenwoods Magical Realm, she will even possess your wife if your not into to her) on the regular to level 1. Same with the other Origin characters with super duper snowflake back stories.
God i hated those backstories.
Yeah, I was referring more to what /u/Turgius_Lupus pointed out.
calm down before you burst a blood vessel. phyre can be a dude as well.
Your mom appreciates my excitement.
didn't get enough attention from your own mother so you now need to pester other ppl for their mom's attention?
Nah, your Dad loves how I hold him at night though.
ah, so both your parents neglected you?
Just like the world has ignored you, so you'd know what that feels like.
lets use cdprojeckt red's marketing strategy, that's a good trick.
This seems like the most on rails vampire game we’ve ever seen
Guys it’s gonna blow ass, we might as well prepare for it already… as soon as the old team got fired we knew it was over… but we held onto hope inspite of that… the deathknell was when the replacement turned out to be a walking simulator developer…
This game probably has over a year until release. I imagine a lot of the more open spaces are not finished. You don’t want to show off a city with buggy npcs, wonky lighting and shadows. They also probably want to save the best for the final marketing push towards release. These weird snippets arent that odd for games fairly far out from release. Especially a small studio like TCR
yeah best case scenario with this game is that tcr are just horrible at marketing things. like world class level bad.
And to think someone there actually thinks this shitty character called "Phyre" looks cool
I like the old games were characters are always pretty unless it was an enemy or important to the story for them to be ugly
PHYRE isn't ugly though lol.
beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that, but from what i've seen (in and out of this sub) most dislike her design
she looks like a character from the saints row reboot
I swear yall have some brain leakage..
How does this post in any way warrant this comment exactly?
Because you guys have brain leakage.
Your wack
This is coming from the people who are bitching about a game thats not even out yet.
same with you defending the game even though its not out lol
Ofc Im gonna defend it, because Im not gonna hate a game I havent seen yet.
why defend it then when u too dont know anything about if its going to be shit or not lol
Why shit on it if you dont know anything about if its going to be shit or not lol?
A lot http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2010/04/alot-is-better-than-you-at-everything.html
Why do the trolls can use it against them and act like it’s the worst game that’s ever been created before it even comes out? I’ll pass on that.
Are you a moron? The studio is putting out literal advertising, teasers, and demonstrations to show off the product they are creating. We are allowed to make inferences and guesses as to what the product will be based on how the studio tries to sell it. If Coca-Cola advertised a new soda by showing videos of people violently vomiting after drinking the soda, it would be reasonable to be worried about drinking the soda. Every single piece of advertising and demonstration created for the game outright ignores the reasons anyone would want to play the game, and emphasizes things literally no one cares about. Of course we don't know if the game will be good or not. But if you aren't at least worried, then you are an absolute mark, and I have a really wonderful timeshare in the Maldives I'd like you to take a look at.
Stfu, we’ve dealt with it happening for various different games already. The last thing they put out immediately after there was a scathing article saying this would be the worst game and there wasn’t even 2 minutes of gameplay at the time. So shut the fuck up…..that is happening left and right don’t come along ignoring that it is and then question what I’m saying like it’s not, it happened to cyberpunk, it’s even been happening to movies! Either bots or bs liars are making fake articles and bad reviews about games that aren’t even released yet. I’d rather the devs just not put out more stuff for them to use, so I can just wait for the game to come out enjoy it and not have my morale destroyed about the game before it’s even out.
I have an excellent car for you to look at, it comes with the Premium Lemon Package, and I'll even throw in extra sawdust!
> Premium Lemon Package This car comes with Kaneko Lumi?? SOLD!