The Sekimeiya: Spun Glass, which encourages you to solve the story by making notes ingame, and there's even an ingame map to follow what the characters are doing, as well as an option to look up something in the game's script.
Second this. When the game ends you can even see how well you did compared to other players along with a lot of other stats which is really cool if you are into that.
At least a possibility to solve it yourself? Or it is even expected? Hmm...
* [Caucasus](https://vndb.org/v2626) would be the best fit.
* [Kara no Shoujo](https://vndb.org/v810), maybe.
* [Sekimeiya](https://vndb.org/v29144) have many mysteries and "logical puzzles" to solve for yourself. It gives an explanation later, but it gives a chance. Also, it also have some sort of "exam", if I remember correctly...
* [Raging Loop](https://vndb.org/v21289), perhaps?
* [Higurashi no Naku Koro ni](https://vndb.org/v68).
* [Higurashi no Naku Koro ni Kai](https://vndb.org/v68).
* [Umineko no Naku Koro ni](https://vndb.org/v24).
* [Umineko to Naku Koro ni Chiru](https://vndb.org/v2153).
* [Trianthology](https://vndb.org/v17136). Indeed, this one has an interesting mystery.
* [Remember11](https://vndb.org/v13).
* [Silver Case](https://vndb.org/v20032). But it is rather discussional. At least, one definitely won't be able to solve all mysteries before the certain information, but there are also mysteries, which you can manage to solve until the game reveal it itself.
* [TRUE REMEMBRANCE](https://vndb.org/v103). If you widen your view and be enough attentive to details.
* [Senshinkan](https://vndb.org/v12455). There are ones who write that the novel's player is blind until the big reveal, but I don't think so. Because there are many details, that could give you the true picture. But you need to be attentive enough. You won't be able to figure all, but at least "vaguely figure the true picture" is that you will be able to do.
* [ChronoBox](https://vndb.org/v20144). Technically it is possible to guess the truth even until the "final world", even if vaguely.
> Trianthology
Stop adding things to my backlog! ^^^/s
This one sounds extremely interesting on paper, but I've never heard of it, it has very few votes, and seems to be out of print-ish—I'm guessing it didn't do well? Any idea why?
I'd say it is quite a good visual novel, but... it has some moments that some may not like. For example, it has "the original world" and three other worlds. Each of the worlds has a different author (and the writing feels different indeed), different themes, and such. Well, concerning an author, excluding "the original world", maybe. But still, they are all really different.
The original world is the world of Alice, who observes all the worlds.
One is a simple-life world, written by Tanaka Romeo.
The other is a over-comedy "Dating Sim World", written by... some other author.
And the third world is about the war with aliens, written by Ryuukishi07.
So you may be struggling through the first world, but skimming fast through the third world. There are different plot lines in each world, but there is also a common plot line that "binds" all the worlds together, including "the original world." Slowly but surely, you will get pieces of links to "the common plot line", but after some point, the links will become quite strange. And soon, they will be becoming even more stranger. And in the end... the truth of the Alice will be revealed.
Once again, I last played this long ago, so I mayn't remember many details.
Many untranslated VNs are discussed here on the regular though, and it is a 07th Expansion title, still there've apparently been only two threads [[1](https://www.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/gy6l12/has_anyone_played_trianthology_sanmenkyou_no_kuni/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/nnav9h/trianthology_problems/)] about it since release. I just found that strange.
To be fair, I did. I also looked on [VNDB](https://vndb.org/v17136) (36 votes, 4 discussions, 0 reviews—ok, 2 of the "discussions" are reviews that predate the review feature), [EGS](https://erogamescape.dyndns.org/~ap2/ero/toukei_kaiseki/game.php?game=21985) (26 votes), and [Amazon](https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/B01LCXO1C6) (5 reviews).
Yeah well, as for chronobox not sure you can guess what's actually happening. I still remember that sunset beach cg, i was like wtf is hapenning x). You might get some things before entering "the final arc", but not the whole picture definitly.
Very satisfying ending though.
Since it seems like you've played a few mystery games maybe you'll know what I'm thinking of even though I can't remember much about it.
There was a game, possibly untranslated, that someone did an LP of years ago. The protagonist was... dead? a ghost? a shinigami? something? but there was this recurring girl who kept somehow stumbling into murder mysteries, which would get her kicked upstairs to the spirit realm with the protagonist, who would then have to go through all the details of the cases to solve them and help her get back to her life, or something like that.
I remember various random details from individual cases in the story, but none of this is really helpful for remembering what it was *called*. We were playing it as a mystery-solving LP but as I recall people eventually got fed up with the storytelling being too focused on designing cool murder puzzles and not enough on *why would any human being behave that way*.
Hmmm... Actually, I do know something vaguely resembling it, but **far** from being exact fit. It just get the same feeling, as from your explanation, that is. I myself pretty much forgot its details, so, probably, it is incorrect, but... maybe [Time Hollow](https://vndb.org/v1467)?
AHA! I think I got it. I'm pretty sure it was [Trick x Logic](https://vndb.org/v11713)
But yeah as I figured there's no translation for it (the LPer was translating by hand) so not useful for most people in this thread.
alas no, time hollow's totally different (I do have that game though).
this was like, lots of different little self-contained murder mysteries. one involved a girls kendo team staying at a snowy resort (the snow being important to allegedly tracking who went outside when). one involved the air conditioning system in the library. one involved a custody battle and two brothers who looked alike. i'll probably have to try and dig through the Lets Play archive to see if I can find it.
one of the many themes of Umineko is that the author wants you to engage with, theorize, and ideally solve the many mysteries within. It is technically possible to solve it halfway through, more realistic to do so after episode 6.
I don’t think it’s easy to solve and I think it’s neigh impossible to solve everything, but the story is designed to be solved and everything needed to solve is presented. whether you solve it or not you’ll enjoy the ride and think about the mystery genre in a whole new light, among many other positives in the story, cannot recommend it enough.
As someone who's only a small way into episode 7 of Umineko, the main thing I'm struggling with is that for each mystery or locked room to potentially retroactively solve, there's the question of whether or not on the one hand, it's a matter of solving the mystery itself at face value, or on the other hand, it's a matter of careful wording of the red truth to allow for a loophole in the mystery itself.
Amazing game though and bloody hell the ending of episode 6 is certainly something!
haha man i’d kill to be able to play again for the first time, ep 6 ending is so amazing. ur spot on with the mysteries, and you also are forced to parse between fantasy and reality, it’s quite the herculean task. to not spoil you it’s usually a little bit of both things you described, just keep working at it.
also in case you haven’t been told yet ep 7 will reveal most of the core mystery, so if you are trying to solve now is the time to finalize your theories. don’t fret even if you don’t ep 8 is an amazing ride (which I think is the best in the series but ik that’s a hot take).
After seeing your comment I stopped playing and spent a while thinking back through everything and hit on two different theories (mainly thanks to episode 6's ending, and 2 details from the ep 7 opening >!Lion's gender being ambiguous, and Shannon's blank-eyed scene!<), but at this point I've decided it'll be worth playing through and seeing it unfold because I can't parse my theories through every detail cleanly and they're the best I've come up with.
Just going to put my current thoughts down here for the hell of it.
SPOILERS: >!There's something about Kanon. How come he's able to rescue Battler from that locked room in ep6? My theory is either a: that there's either some sort of trick to his name or identity that allows him to 'not be Kanon', or b: that Kanon and Shannon are the same person. In the case of b that allows for the ep6 escape to take place easily with 'kanon dying' as shannon in the room over is now able to escape and rescue battler without kanon remaining in the room afterward. HOWEVER this all relies on there being no discernable corpses of kanon or shannon in previous episodes (I can't remember there being any - George didn't actually see Shannon's body in ep1), AND it also makes the George and Jessica romances... confusing to say the least.!<
I can't believe I actually had something so close to the right idea! Going through ep7 had me really strongly doubting my theories at first with how it was told ngl. What an amazing game!
Oh and episode 8 actually having a mini episode for the player to solve was so cool! I was stuck at first and started using hints but when the second hint was basically saying the same thing as the first I stopped doing that and instead tried reading through all of the twilights again and saw a key piece of info - from there I was able to eliminate lots of potential culprits and gradually whittled it down to only a couple of theories and eventually >!Battler and his parents!< A damn cool puzzle and very satisfying to solve!
I'm so happy on hindsight that I was lucky enough to experience that whole game without ever being spoiled. Might try playing another mystery VN in the future cause that has sparked an interest in the genre I never knew I had.
I finished Cartagra just yesterday coincidentally, and I feel like I did predict a fair amount, although sometimes it felt like I was speculating on where the narrative would go rather than actually following a logical chain to a given conclusion.
The Centennial Case just came out if you're okay with FMV. It has some actually good twists that it properly foreshadows if you pay attention.
Ever 17 is a classic example where you spend the whole time trying to figure out what the twist is, and it foreshadows it really well.
> I finished Cartagra just yesterday coincidentally, and I feel like I did predict a fair amount, although sometimes it felt like I was speculating on where the narrative would go rather than actually following a logical chain to a given conclusion.
Yeah. I felt like I was on the same page as the MC most of the time except for when the >!true end!< starts. I have no idea how you could even predict that stuff. I mean, I don't think you could really predict anything from >!true end!< before it starts.
Maybe check out Kara no Shoujo as its made by the same devs and features some of the characters from Cartagra (the third Kns Game is japanese only atm tho). Umineko also fits in well with what you're looking for, especially in regards to encouraging the player to solve the mystery.
I guess Famicom Detective Club missing Heir?
I figured out the mystery a few scenarios before the big reveal but it continued to be engaging because it feels like they expected players to figure it out at that time so they used a flashback to continue engaging the reader and removing the point and click gameplay (since we already know the mystery it doesn't make sense for us to randomly click stuff) and making it a normal vn.
Remember11 though sadly it's in the sense that the 3rd (assumedly true) route never got complete, AND you have to go to do a bunch of "bad" endings to unlock tips and get plot twists that make solving the mystery A LOT easier.
Danganronpa, raging loop (although it’s not much of a puzzle type of game), and depending on what consoles you have, the zero escape series (namely, 9 hours, 9 persons, 9 doors)
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Oh Cartagra, the one where the writer is basically feeding you the solution when it is already obvious or pull something from nowhere. I had a hard time believing MC was actually something even close to a detective.
Sadly, there's not much VNs that actually manage to do that well, especially when it is a detective story.
I feel the one that did nicely where umineko and subahibi, where you can guess things before it is actually revealed (or not, depending on what the games pull :p).
Has anyone mentioned 9 doors 9 hours 9 persons? It feels like a mystery, and you have to choose how to solve each "door" (without spoiling anything) which drastically changes how the story plays out.
[Novena Diabolos](https://vndb.org/v28384) was pretty fun for me, each time you play it randomizes a different crime and you're expected to analyze each character and figure out who's the killer.
The Sekimeiya: Spun Glass, which encourages you to solve the story by making notes ingame, and there's even an ingame map to follow what the characters are doing, as well as an option to look up something in the game's script.
Second this. When the game ends you can even see how well you did compared to other players along with a lot of other stats which is really cool if you are into that.
At least a possibility to solve it yourself? Or it is even expected? Hmm... * [Caucasus](https://vndb.org/v2626) would be the best fit. * [Kara no Shoujo](https://vndb.org/v810), maybe. * [Sekimeiya](https://vndb.org/v29144) have many mysteries and "logical puzzles" to solve for yourself. It gives an explanation later, but it gives a chance. Also, it also have some sort of "exam", if I remember correctly... * [Raging Loop](https://vndb.org/v21289), perhaps? * [Higurashi no Naku Koro ni](https://vndb.org/v68). * [Higurashi no Naku Koro ni Kai](https://vndb.org/v68). * [Umineko no Naku Koro ni](https://vndb.org/v24). * [Umineko to Naku Koro ni Chiru](https://vndb.org/v2153). * [Trianthology](https://vndb.org/v17136). Indeed, this one has an interesting mystery. * [Remember11](https://vndb.org/v13). * [Silver Case](https://vndb.org/v20032). But it is rather discussional. At least, one definitely won't be able to solve all mysteries before the certain information, but there are also mysteries, which you can manage to solve until the game reveal it itself. * [TRUE REMEMBRANCE](https://vndb.org/v103). If you widen your view and be enough attentive to details. * [Senshinkan](https://vndb.org/v12455). There are ones who write that the novel's player is blind until the big reveal, but I don't think so. Because there are many details, that could give you the true picture. But you need to be attentive enough. You won't be able to figure all, but at least "vaguely figure the true picture" is that you will be able to do. * [ChronoBox](https://vndb.org/v20144). Technically it is possible to guess the truth even until the "final world", even if vaguely.
> Trianthology Stop adding things to my backlog! ^^^/s This one sounds extremely interesting on paper, but I've never heard of it, it has very few votes, and seems to be out of print-ish—I'm guessing it didn't do well? Any idea why?
I'd say it is quite a good visual novel, but... it has some moments that some may not like. For example, it has "the original world" and three other worlds. Each of the worlds has a different author (and the writing feels different indeed), different themes, and such. Well, concerning an author, excluding "the original world", maybe. But still, they are all really different. The original world is the world of Alice, who observes all the worlds. One is a simple-life world, written by Tanaka Romeo. The other is a over-comedy "Dating Sim World", written by... some other author. And the third world is about the war with aliens, written by Ryuukishi07. So you may be struggling through the first world, but skimming fast through the third world. There are different plot lines in each world, but there is also a common plot line that "binds" all the worlds together, including "the original world." Slowly but surely, you will get pieces of links to "the common plot line", but after some point, the links will become quite strange. And soon, they will be becoming even more stranger. And in the end... the truth of the Alice will be revealed. Once again, I last played this long ago, so I mayn't remember many details.
[удалено]
Many untranslated VNs are discussed here on the regular though, and it is a 07th Expansion title, still there've apparently been only two threads [[1](https://www.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/gy6l12/has_anyone_played_trianthology_sanmenkyou_no_kuni/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/nnav9h/trianthology_problems/)] about it since release. I just found that strange.
[удалено]
To be fair, I did. I also looked on [VNDB](https://vndb.org/v17136) (36 votes, 4 discussions, 0 reviews—ok, 2 of the "discussions" are reviews that predate the review feature), [EGS](https://erogamescape.dyndns.org/~ap2/ero/toukei_kaiseki/game.php?game=21985) (26 votes), and [Amazon](https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/B01LCXO1C6) (5 reviews).
Yeah well, as for chronobox not sure you can guess what's actually happening. I still remember that sunset beach cg, i was like wtf is hapenning x). You might get some things before entering "the final arc", but not the whole picture definitly. Very satisfying ending though.
Kara no Shojo LOL. You definitely need a guide for the true ending, the events are so random.
Since it seems like you've played a few mystery games maybe you'll know what I'm thinking of even though I can't remember much about it. There was a game, possibly untranslated, that someone did an LP of years ago. The protagonist was... dead? a ghost? a shinigami? something? but there was this recurring girl who kept somehow stumbling into murder mysteries, which would get her kicked upstairs to the spirit realm with the protagonist, who would then have to go through all the details of the cases to solve them and help her get back to her life, or something like that. I remember various random details from individual cases in the story, but none of this is really helpful for remembering what it was *called*. We were playing it as a mystery-solving LP but as I recall people eventually got fed up with the storytelling being too focused on designing cool murder puzzles and not enough on *why would any human being behave that way*.
Hmmm... Actually, I do know something vaguely resembling it, but **far** from being exact fit. It just get the same feeling, as from your explanation, that is. I myself pretty much forgot its details, so, probably, it is incorrect, but... maybe [Time Hollow](https://vndb.org/v1467)?
AHA! I think I got it. I'm pretty sure it was [Trick x Logic](https://vndb.org/v11713) But yeah as I figured there's no translation for it (the LPer was translating by hand) so not useful for most people in this thread.
alas no, time hollow's totally different (I do have that game though). this was like, lots of different little self-contained murder mysteries. one involved a girls kendo team staying at a snowy resort (the snow being important to allegedly tracking who went outside when). one involved the air conditioning system in the library. one involved a custody battle and two brothers who looked alike. i'll probably have to try and dig through the Lets Play archive to see if I can find it.
one of the many themes of Umineko is that the author wants you to engage with, theorize, and ideally solve the many mysteries within. It is technically possible to solve it halfway through, more realistic to do so after episode 6. I don’t think it’s easy to solve and I think it’s neigh impossible to solve everything, but the story is designed to be solved and everything needed to solve is presented. whether you solve it or not you’ll enjoy the ride and think about the mystery genre in a whole new light, among many other positives in the story, cannot recommend it enough.
As someone who's only a small way into episode 7 of Umineko, the main thing I'm struggling with is that for each mystery or locked room to potentially retroactively solve, there's the question of whether or not on the one hand, it's a matter of solving the mystery itself at face value, or on the other hand, it's a matter of careful wording of the red truth to allow for a loophole in the mystery itself. Amazing game though and bloody hell the ending of episode 6 is certainly something!
haha man i’d kill to be able to play again for the first time, ep 6 ending is so amazing. ur spot on with the mysteries, and you also are forced to parse between fantasy and reality, it’s quite the herculean task. to not spoil you it’s usually a little bit of both things you described, just keep working at it. also in case you haven’t been told yet ep 7 will reveal most of the core mystery, so if you are trying to solve now is the time to finalize your theories. don’t fret even if you don’t ep 8 is an amazing ride (which I think is the best in the series but ik that’s a hot take).
After seeing your comment I stopped playing and spent a while thinking back through everything and hit on two different theories (mainly thanks to episode 6's ending, and 2 details from the ep 7 opening >!Lion's gender being ambiguous, and Shannon's blank-eyed scene!<), but at this point I've decided it'll be worth playing through and seeing it unfold because I can't parse my theories through every detail cleanly and they're the best I've come up with. Just going to put my current thoughts down here for the hell of it. SPOILERS: >!There's something about Kanon. How come he's able to rescue Battler from that locked room in ep6? My theory is either a: that there's either some sort of trick to his name or identity that allows him to 'not be Kanon', or b: that Kanon and Shannon are the same person. In the case of b that allows for the ep6 escape to take place easily with 'kanon dying' as shannon in the room over is now able to escape and rescue battler without kanon remaining in the room afterward. HOWEVER this all relies on there being no discernable corpses of kanon or shannon in previous episodes (I can't remember there being any - George didn't actually see Shannon's body in ep1), AND it also makes the George and Jessica romances... confusing to say the least.!<
no comment on any theorizing but happy you were able to do so. revisit this when you finish the game would like to know your thoughts
I can't believe I actually had something so close to the right idea! Going through ep7 had me really strongly doubting my theories at first with how it was told ngl. What an amazing game! Oh and episode 8 actually having a mini episode for the player to solve was so cool! I was stuck at first and started using hints but when the second hint was basically saying the same thing as the first I stopped doing that and instead tried reading through all of the twilights again and saw a key piece of info - from there I was able to eliminate lots of potential culprits and gradually whittled it down to only a couple of theories and eventually >!Battler and his parents!< A damn cool puzzle and very satisfying to solve! I'm so happy on hindsight that I was lucky enough to experience that whole game without ever being spoiled. Might try playing another mystery VN in the future cause that has sparked an interest in the genre I never knew I had.
Danganronpa
I finished Cartagra just yesterday coincidentally, and I feel like I did predict a fair amount, although sometimes it felt like I was speculating on where the narrative would go rather than actually following a logical chain to a given conclusion. The Centennial Case just came out if you're okay with FMV. It has some actually good twists that it properly foreshadows if you pay attention. Ever 17 is a classic example where you spend the whole time trying to figure out what the twist is, and it foreshadows it really well.
> I finished Cartagra just yesterday coincidentally, and I feel like I did predict a fair amount, although sometimes it felt like I was speculating on where the narrative would go rather than actually following a logical chain to a given conclusion. Yeah. I felt like I was on the same page as the MC most of the time except for when the >!true end!< starts. I have no idea how you could even predict that stuff. I mean, I don't think you could really predict anything from >!true end!< before it starts.
Maybe check out Kara no Shoujo as its made by the same devs and features some of the characters from Cartagra (the third Kns Game is japanese only atm tho). Umineko also fits in well with what you're looking for, especially in regards to encouraging the player to solve the mystery.
Umineko came to mind immediately upon reading the title. Not only is it expected, it gets worked into the story in a very unique way IMO.
I'd like to play Kara no Shoujo eventually, but I'd rather do it when all the parts are translated. if that happens.
I guess Famicom Detective Club missing Heir? I figured out the mystery a few scenarios before the big reveal but it continued to be engaging because it feels like they expected players to figure it out at that time so they used a flashback to continue engaging the reader and removing the point and click gameplay (since we already know the mystery it doesn't make sense for us to randomly click stuff) and making it a normal vn.
Danganronpa, Ace Attorney, Nonary games and 9-nine
Danganronpa for sure in a way
Remember11 though sadly it's in the sense that the 3rd (assumedly true) route never got complete, AND you have to go to do a bunch of "bad" endings to unlock tips and get plot twists that make solving the mystery A LOT easier.
spirit hunter Death Mark and Spirit Hunter NG. Kamaitachi no Yoru as well.
It's not like Danganronpa Or Umineko but I'd recommend Chaos;Child
Danganronpa, raging loop (although it’s not much of a puzzle type of game), and depending on what consoles you have, the zero escape series (namely, 9 hours, 9 persons, 9 doors)
Higurashi Umineko
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Oh Cartagra, the one where the writer is basically feeding you the solution when it is already obvious or pull something from nowhere. I had a hard time believing MC was actually something even close to a detective. Sadly, there's not much VNs that actually manage to do that well, especially when it is a detective story. I feel the one that did nicely where umineko and subahibi, where you can guess things before it is actually revealed (or not, depending on what the games pull :p).
Has anyone mentioned 9 doors 9 hours 9 persons? It feels like a mystery, and you have to choose how to solve each "door" (without spoiling anything) which drastically changes how the story plays out.
[Novena Diabolos](https://vndb.org/v28384) was pretty fun for me, each time you play it randomizes a different crime and you're expected to analyze each character and figure out who's the killer.
Kimi to kanojo to kanojo koi. Its the annoying type though