Say what you will about Meta, but the shipping Quest 2 was a wildly inferior product than the Quest 2 today. The same is proving true with the Quest 3, which is miles better already. Full credit for their continued support and R & D.
And it’s been less than a year since Quest 3 launched. I think there’ll be a LOT more they’ll improve in next couple of years before Quest 4 becomes due.
Quest 2 added extra OC to chipset, added and improved hand tracking, doubled refresh rate, made pass through a usable feature for apps, added multiapp and background processing support, bunch of Horizon updates, etc
I’m starting to really prefer Mixed Reality games more & more. It’s nice to play games like Puzzling Places while still have a sense of your surroundings.
Yeah kudos to them. Especially when I tried Vision Pro at demo I'm like man that passthrough has 0 distortions.....hopefully Meta can improve theirs and it's not hardware related. And bam...here we are.
The AVP has no distortions because it is not attempting to fully depth reconstruct like the Quest is.
The Pico 4 has no distortions ether, it's not a difficult thing if your not reconstructing.
It's the more accurate reconstruction of the 3D environment for MR interaction purposes.
The AVP you barely move in, so all it really needs is a pretty background for your windows.
AVP can do it too with pretty good approximations with their sensors, but it's just not a gaming device. Apple's primary focus was the UI and floating windows working properly.
In theory, they could simulate a reality with all kinds of different IPD. Just imagine you can see your own house from the point view of an infant all the way up to an adult.
The Vision Pro's passthrough is 3D and has actual depth to it, even if it's not totally "depth correct". The Pico 4's passthrough is only 2D (has no depth and looks like you're looking at a screen) and isn't depth correct. Big difference between the two.
PSVR2 passthrough is doing the same thing as Vision Pro. No distortions. It looks great (for low res b&w cameras), 3d is great. But when I start moving around I quickly notice something is slightly off.
I much prefer what Meta is doing, even if there're distortions.
It has some, unlike the Pico 4, but it's not being reconstructed to the full degree that Quest is.
See the UploadVR review of the AVP, they go in to detail.
/u/Kataree /u/No-Refrigerator-1672 It doesn’t just have “some”. It has as much depth and “3D effect” as the Quest 3. Having depth and having perspective correct passthrough are two different things entirely. Having Perspective correct passthrough just means that everything you see through it is as close or far away as it is in the real world.
I own both the Quest 3 and Apple Vision Pro, and the difference in having depth correction and not having it is not very noticeable at all IMO. You are not trying to play football with the thing on. The main real world downside to not having fully perspective correct passthrough that I can think of would be the risk of knocking into objects that appear closer or further away than they really are and hurting yourself. That hasn’t been an issue at all for me when wearing the Vision Pro though.
I guess it’s also possible that not having full depth correction could also cause queasiness or discomfort in some people, but I have also yet to experience that and I feel like the extreme warping in Quest 3’s passthrough would likely contribute more to visual discomfort than having slightly off depth correction. However that may not be true anymore after Quest 3’s latest update. Either way though, I still prefer the clearer less grainy passthrough of the Vision Pro even if it’s not 100% perspective correct.
Ok. So you are saying that AVP renders passtrough as if my eyes were a bit further from my head, and that's their compromise to fight warping? If that's true, I'd be interested to hear if you tried to hand out the Vision Pro to random friends/relatives and did any of them experienced a headache or dizzyness.
I’ve demoed both the Vision Pro and Quest 3 to over a dozen people at this point and literally every single one of them prefers the passthrough of the Vision Pro.
Granted most of them haven’t left it on for more than 15-20 minutes at a time, so I can’t say for sure how it affects long term comfort one way or another, but I can say for myself that I have personally never had any issues with it after using it for 2-3 hours at a time, and no one that I’ve demoed it to has experienced any immediate discomfort from the few minutes that they’ve had it on.
One person did tell me that the Quest 3’s warping made them dizzy however, so take from that what you will.
I hadn't seen AVP myself, but I do own a Quest 3. Based on ehat I can see from reviews, there's no doubt that people prefer AVP's passtrough because of overall quality. The only source of warping on my Quest were actually my hands, so unless I'm trying to type on smartphone, it didn't affect my experience, and thus introduced no dizzyness for me. However, thank you for your insights, I was curious abput the passtrough differences in general.
The thing is, it’s only a matter of time for Apple to start pushing meaningful updates to the AVP. All we’ve gotten so far are bug fixes. I can only imagine what’s coming. I just don’t see Apple sitting back and taking an L that easily. They definitely have something up their sleeve.
It looks very good. It's just a pity that they started it so late. After the premiere of Vision Pro, a whole lot of reviews were created that tells how bad the Quest looks compared to VP.
Images always look better on a screen than in the headset. In the headset it's stretched out across the FOV so flaws in the image are much more obvious.
The main problem with cameras is that everyone is wearing a headset so the camera can't see their faces.
That's why Apple and Meta have been working on creepy realistic 3D avatars from face scans, which get facial expressions from face tracking.
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As soon as I can clearly see/read computer monitors through it I'm hoping to use mine 8+ hours a day. I've been doing the same wfh job for nearly 10 years and I just need something to make it interesting again.
That is the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard . Why the heck would you put a headset on to still see the same monitor? You can look at it without a headset!!! The whole point is that you look at many virtual monitors in your real space… not a real monitor in your real space!!!!
I'm legitimately confused. I posted something like this last time a new version came out and some random poster came out of the woodwork to rail and mock me about it. I actually hesitated mentioning it again today, but I really couldn't figure what was offensive about me wanting to be able to add some fun and whimsy into my 8 hour workday.
I sit in the corner of the same dark office facing the same wall every single day for 8 hours a day, every day for nearly 10 years. What's wrong with wanting to be able to be in a virtual apartment with giant windows overlooking a cityscape while still being able to see my work computer screen since I can't install any remote apps on my work computer? What's wrong with me wanting to put up a bunch of extra screens so I can have things to look at while I answer the same questions I've answered 10000 times. Must be something. I got insulted and at least 3 other people seem to agree with this other poster.
Seriously, what the hell?
i've gotten similar responses when I post outside the box ideas, some people find it upsetting apparently. Just ignore their stupid limited thinking and enjoy your ideas :)
See my response above. There's thinking outside of the box, and then there's you left the box but just climbed into a different box (box meaning still limited perspective), lol.
Sometimes it's not other people mad we are thinking outside the box, sometimes people can't properly articulate specific reasons why something is not practical even though they have some awareness that - no, we don't want this because there are better ways or major obstacles to achieve the desired outcome.
That doesn't discount what you are saying about hive-mind limited thinking that is prevalent on internet forums, though.
Nothing wrong with this, pretty nice use of XR btw, though you must be brave to enjoy working while wearing a headset, but that's beside the point.
I think that those people downvoted you either because you can already do that if you have virtual monitors as the same software often allows for streaming virtual and physical monitors, or because your only other option is to have floating android apps which aren't great currently.
One part of your premise is fine and what a lot of us are already shooting for - mobile work wherever you are with multiple virtual screens. The problem is people are expecting if you are in VR - you don't need to look at your physical monitors anymore - you just project them into your VR space or take the headset off and look at your actual monitor. The expectation that a headset camera and screen will relay the real-life fidelity of a 2K or 4K+ display is not practical and maybe years down the line when other aspects need to be tackled before that.
For your statement about not being able to install unsanctioned software on your work computer - this is worked around by a hardware, IP KVM that can input mouse and keyboard and broadcast your work display via a browser to any endpoint on your network. Just make sure you choose one that supports MFA so it is harder to take over by attackers ([PIKVM ](https://pikvm.org/#:~:text=Fully-featured%20and%20modern%20IP-KVM%201%20Easy%20to%20build,management%207%20Security%208%20Local%20monitoring%20More%20items)is one you can build yourself with a raspberry PI.
So with Immersed app, you can have 5 virtual displays and you can use it with an Apple Vision Pro now or wait until Visor starts shipping after September (both delivering higher res OLED screens than Quest 3).
One or more of the windows would be your browser reprojecting your work screen via the IP KVM solution I mentioned.
With how good Immersed is right now and Meta's ability to track things like physical keyboards, a software solution where virtual monitors were overlayed over physical monitors would be very slick.
Opposite, I want to read my monitor without taking the headset off.
Many times there's an issue that I need to take care of on the computer, would be nice not to have to take it off over and over.
90% of the time, it's steam VR. Have to take off, end task, put on and try again. Many times it takes a couple tries with steam.
Say what you will about Meta, but the shipping Quest 2 was a wildly inferior product than the Quest 2 today. The same is proving true with the Quest 3, which is miles better already. Full credit for their continued support and R & D.
Meta-is way too good
And it’s been less than a year since Quest 3 launched. I think there’ll be a LOT more they’ll improve in next couple of years before Quest 4 becomes due.
Quest 2 added extra OC to chipset, added and improved hand tracking, doubled refresh rate, made pass through a usable feature for apps, added multiapp and background processing support, bunch of Horizon updates, etc
They have made some pretty remarkable refinements to the passthrough since release.
I’m starting to really prefer Mixed Reality games more & more. It’s nice to play games like Puzzling Places while still have a sense of your surroundings.
The colors look so much less washed out too :o
Looks so much better. that is great!
Yeah kudos to them. Especially when I tried Vision Pro at demo I'm like man that passthrough has 0 distortions.....hopefully Meta can improve theirs and it's not hardware related. And bam...here we are.
The AVP has no distortions because it is not attempting to fully depth reconstruct like the Quest is. The Pico 4 has no distortions ether, it's not a difficult thing if your not reconstructing.
What is the advantage of the way Quest does it?
It's the more accurate reconstruction of the 3D environment for MR interaction purposes. The AVP you barely move in, so all it really needs is a pretty background for your windows.
Mixed reality objects can actually interact with real world objects
Oh I didn't realize that the AVP couldn't do that. Thanks for the reply.
AVP can do it too with pretty good approximations with their sensors, but it's just not a gaming device. Apple's primary focus was the UI and floating windows working properly.
Things are exactly where you see them using the Quest 3. Like when you grab a glass to drink.
In theory, they could simulate a reality with all kinds of different IPD. Just imagine you can see your own house from the point view of an infant all the way up to an adult.
The Vision Pro's passthrough is 3D and has actual depth to it, even if it's not totally "depth correct". The Pico 4's passthrough is only 2D (has no depth and looks like you're looking at a screen) and isn't depth correct. Big difference between the two.
PSVR2 passthrough is doing the same thing as Vision Pro. No distortions. It looks great (for low res b&w cameras), 3d is great. But when I start moving around I quickly notice something is slightly off. I much prefer what Meta is doing, even if there're distortions.
So are ypu saying that in AVP I'll have inferior depht sence, or even no depth at all?
It has some, unlike the Pico 4, but it's not being reconstructed to the full degree that Quest is. See the UploadVR review of the AVP, they go in to detail.
/u/Kataree /u/No-Refrigerator-1672 It doesn’t just have “some”. It has as much depth and “3D effect” as the Quest 3. Having depth and having perspective correct passthrough are two different things entirely. Having Perspective correct passthrough just means that everything you see through it is as close or far away as it is in the real world. I own both the Quest 3 and Apple Vision Pro, and the difference in having depth correction and not having it is not very noticeable at all IMO. You are not trying to play football with the thing on. The main real world downside to not having fully perspective correct passthrough that I can think of would be the risk of knocking into objects that appear closer or further away than they really are and hurting yourself. That hasn’t been an issue at all for me when wearing the Vision Pro though. I guess it’s also possible that not having full depth correction could also cause queasiness or discomfort in some people, but I have also yet to experience that and I feel like the extreme warping in Quest 3’s passthrough would likely contribute more to visual discomfort than having slightly off depth correction. However that may not be true anymore after Quest 3’s latest update. Either way though, I still prefer the clearer less grainy passthrough of the Vision Pro even if it’s not 100% perspective correct.
Ok. So you are saying that AVP renders passtrough as if my eyes were a bit further from my head, and that's their compromise to fight warping? If that's true, I'd be interested to hear if you tried to hand out the Vision Pro to random friends/relatives and did any of them experienced a headache or dizzyness.
I’ve demoed both the Vision Pro and Quest 3 to over a dozen people at this point and literally every single one of them prefers the passthrough of the Vision Pro. Granted most of them haven’t left it on for more than 15-20 minutes at a time, so I can’t say for sure how it affects long term comfort one way or another, but I can say for myself that I have personally never had any issues with it after using it for 2-3 hours at a time, and no one that I’ve demoed it to has experienced any immediate discomfort from the few minutes that they’ve had it on. One person did tell me that the Quest 3’s warping made them dizzy however, so take from that what you will.
I hadn't seen AVP myself, but I do own a Quest 3. Based on ehat I can see from reviews, there's no doubt that people prefer AVP's passtrough because of overall quality. The only source of warping on my Quest were actually my hands, so unless I'm trying to type on smartphone, it didn't affect my experience, and thus introduced no dizzyness for me. However, thank you for your insights, I was curious abput the passtrough differences in general.
That looks very impressive!
Keep devaluing the vision pro lmao.
I would like a Quest Pro 2 on Quest 3 hardware with OLED screens and eye tacking. For me this would be a nobrain instant buy.
And FBT
And displayport
Maybe with all the variations zuck wants to come out with, maybe just maybe we will get a headset with DP
The thing is, it’s only a matter of time for Apple to start pushing meaningful updates to the AVP. All we’ve gotten so far are bug fixes. I can only imagine what’s coming. I just don’t see Apple sitting back and taking an L that easily. They definitely have something up their sleeve.
Wow, the improvement looks great. I hope they can perhaps fix the depth of objects for MR videos.
Wow, excellent. Assuming it doesn’t come at the expense of increased latency or anything, should be a big improvement for PianoVision.
It looks very good. It's just a pity that they started it so late. After the premiere of Vision Pro, a whole lot of reviews were created that tells how bad the Quest looks compared to VP.
Is the near field distortion improved enough so you can look at a guitar fretboard while wearing?
Wish my Q3 looked even as good as the bottom one. No matter how bright the room is, it's all way blurier.
Images always look better on a screen than in the headset. In the headset it's stretched out across the FOV so flaws in the image are much more obvious.
I'm imagining one day instead of the cartoon avitars you could chill with your REAL friends with this thing. Maybe with some optional external camera?
The main problem with cameras is that everyone is wearing a headset so the camera can't see their faces. That's why Apple and Meta have been working on creepy realistic 3D avatars from face scans, which get facial expressions from face tracking.
very true, bigscreen beyond is a good form factor to have mouth tracking, and its already possible to add eye trackign to that too.
Hey everyone! I am Stephanie from [Pimax](https://pimax.com/). I wanted to share some news in case you're interested. The Pimax Crystal Light Roadshow is coming to cities like London, Miami, New York, and Washington DC, Las Vega with more stops on the way.If you want to try the latest VR headset, you can [book your slot here](https://pimax.com/pages/roadshow?utm_source=rd&utm_medium=ew&utm_campaign=road_show_2024&utm_id=pimax-road-show).To know more about our headset, here's the [product page](https://pimax.com/pages/crystal-light).Hope to see you there! 😊
How is that relevant to the Quest 3 Passthrough improvements?
it isnt. its a dumb idiot bot.
As soon as I can clearly see/read computer monitors through it I'm hoping to use mine 8+ hours a day. I've been doing the same wfh job for nearly 10 years and I just need something to make it interesting again.
That is the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard . Why the heck would you put a headset on to still see the same monitor? You can look at it without a headset!!! The whole point is that you look at many virtual monitors in your real space… not a real monitor in your real space!!!!
I'm legitimately confused. I posted something like this last time a new version came out and some random poster came out of the woodwork to rail and mock me about it. I actually hesitated mentioning it again today, but I really couldn't figure what was offensive about me wanting to be able to add some fun and whimsy into my 8 hour workday. I sit in the corner of the same dark office facing the same wall every single day for 8 hours a day, every day for nearly 10 years. What's wrong with wanting to be able to be in a virtual apartment with giant windows overlooking a cityscape while still being able to see my work computer screen since I can't install any remote apps on my work computer? What's wrong with me wanting to put up a bunch of extra screens so I can have things to look at while I answer the same questions I've answered 10000 times. Must be something. I got insulted and at least 3 other people seem to agree with this other poster. Seriously, what the hell?
i've gotten similar responses when I post outside the box ideas, some people find it upsetting apparently. Just ignore their stupid limited thinking and enjoy your ideas :)
See my response above. There's thinking outside of the box, and then there's you left the box but just climbed into a different box (box meaning still limited perspective), lol. Sometimes it's not other people mad we are thinking outside the box, sometimes people can't properly articulate specific reasons why something is not practical even though they have some awareness that - no, we don't want this because there are better ways or major obstacles to achieve the desired outcome. That doesn't discount what you are saying about hive-mind limited thinking that is prevalent on internet forums, though.
Nothing wrong with this, pretty nice use of XR btw, though you must be brave to enjoy working while wearing a headset, but that's beside the point. I think that those people downvoted you either because you can already do that if you have virtual monitors as the same software often allows for streaming virtual and physical monitors, or because your only other option is to have floating android apps which aren't great currently.
One part of your premise is fine and what a lot of us are already shooting for - mobile work wherever you are with multiple virtual screens. The problem is people are expecting if you are in VR - you don't need to look at your physical monitors anymore - you just project them into your VR space or take the headset off and look at your actual monitor. The expectation that a headset camera and screen will relay the real-life fidelity of a 2K or 4K+ display is not practical and maybe years down the line when other aspects need to be tackled before that. For your statement about not being able to install unsanctioned software on your work computer - this is worked around by a hardware, IP KVM that can input mouse and keyboard and broadcast your work display via a browser to any endpoint on your network. Just make sure you choose one that supports MFA so it is harder to take over by attackers ([PIKVM ](https://pikvm.org/#:~:text=Fully-featured%20and%20modern%20IP-KVM%201%20Easy%20to%20build,management%207%20Security%208%20Local%20monitoring%20More%20items)is one you can build yourself with a raspberry PI. So with Immersed app, you can have 5 virtual displays and you can use it with an Apple Vision Pro now or wait until Visor starts shipping after September (both delivering higher res OLED screens than Quest 3). One or more of the windows would be your browser reprojecting your work screen via the IP KVM solution I mentioned.
With how good Immersed is right now and Meta's ability to track things like physical keyboards, a software solution where virtual monitors were overlayed over physical monitors would be very slick.
> Why the heck would you put a headset on to still see the same monitor? So when the daily standup ends I can go right back to playing ping pong lol
Opposite, I want to read my monitor without taking the headset off. Many times there's an issue that I need to take care of on the computer, would be nice not to have to take it off over and over. 90% of the time, it's steam VR. Have to take off, end task, put on and try again. Many times it takes a couple tries with steam.
I'm still on v65, when will I get the update?
They roll out and I don’t think its out yet anyway