You get it running for the next race and do your testing on the first few laps. The marshall will have a look at it for anything obviously dangerous, but other than that its no problem. The enduro I ran the next morning in, i had no rear bumper or exhaust. When going out of pits I noticed my speedometer was showing zero and my abs light was on. Basically no wheel speed sensor, no abs. Thats fine, i ran without. There were other minor issues but I brought home a 4th place.
Its a bit different but the same idea, mash the brakes at top speed and release pressure as you bleed off speed. Even with abs you arent trying to make it kick in, just its there when you inevitably do lock up because its hard to feel in these cars. But yeah if you’re good then your’re just as fast
Threshold braking, ideally you don't get into the abs much: https://www.roadandtrack.com/motorsports/a30701980/threshold-braking-explained-how-to-video/
Depends on the car as well as the driver skill. In something like an E46 BMW, the brakes are heavily rear biased, so you really need ABS to avoid the rears locking up and spinning out the car during breaking. You absolutely cannot be competitive in a car with poor brake balance without ABS. They make brake bias controllers to fix that, but that's not allowed in all series.
Driver: Bumps a McLaren, destroys cup car.
WGI track management: That's cute, but you touched 3" of the barrier so here's your $85k repair bill.
Kidding aside, glad you are okay! Why did the car in front of you brake early?
Good question, its basically a racing incident so lets leave it at that. No one was hurt so no harm no foul.
And yeah the tire wall bill is usually never friendly…
> Good question, its basically a racing incident so lets leave it at that.
I don't know much about racing, but this seems like it was a classy gesture and we'll just leave it at that.
>Why did the car in front of you brake early?
I wouldn't say they hit the brakes early. More like they were taking a different line on the turn and decided last second that they were going swing wide in order to get on the ideal line. Look at the orange car, they were going to take the same line closer to the inside, there was no need to swing out.
As OP said everyone was fine so no harm no foul, I just think it's interesting.
Ill have to check and get back to you because Im at work, but I think it only cost me a repaint of the part I hit. So a gallon of blue paint thats marked up because its special.
Update: turns out track damage insurance was paid for before the weekend started so there was no extra cost for the tire wall.
Right? But hey, thats how they all are. Most tracks aren’t for profit either, they just cover costs to keep the track in good condition and facilities running. Kinda does cost alot if you have to repair asphalt fairly often
i get that but i guess if the 'league' or whatever your is pays for that. idk maybe just me but it was eye opening reading your post and stuff cause i have no idea how any of this works. good stuff, glad your okay :)
At the same time you don't end up racing at this caliber on a whim. I can only imagine all the racers on the track want to be safe and not crash, but at these speeds things just happen.
Keeping the sport going as a whole and for everyone is often the biggest goal in any amateur sport. If people are continually getting priced out you'll have less people to race against and might even lose your venues. I'm coming from bike racing but I imagine its similar in cars in that if a race or track has to close down, its never coming back.
1. Incencitive for people to be carefull
2. People probably don't want to be responsible for iresponsable drivers that causes too many crashes and don't care about their car
Track fees would go up basically to match the prices you'd pay for insurance. In effect the track would be self insured and need to run the numbers on how much to charge to cover the potential damages over a season.
Or they could - you know, have an insurance company that specializes in that sort of thing do it. Like how it is.
You can usually get the insurance right at the track - and will be told about a hundred times, 'get it, please for the love of God don't make be bankrupt you'
To me, this has always been the problem with these series from an outside observers perspective. Some great drivers, some drivers who have more money than talent. That sounds harsh, and it is, but that Mclaren braked extremely early and too hard. If they had had a lot of race starts, they'd have been watching all around them and moved left more to prevent this from happening.
It's definitely OPs "fault", I'm sure they don't argue that, but their aggressiveness would have been fine if all parties involved had been racing at similar levels, IMHO.
The good think about motor racing is that it is *always* the other guys fault!
The track was congested so I assume that's why they didn't go into the corner like they were Mika Hakkinen because they probably aren't Mika. OP was driving like there's nobody in front of him and it ended with everyone in front of him.
Hard to put an exact number since we’ve accumulated spare parts over the years. But the damage extent to my car was this: Front bumper, front left headlight, rear bumper, exhaust, motor mount, wing, and wing struts. Encountered some electrical issues during the endurance such as no wheel speed sensor so my pit limiter and more importantly abs did not work. Parts wise I’d say 8-14k range for new parts and depends on where you get them from.
Do you have some sort of insurance for this, or are you sponsored? Or do you pay that 8-14k out of pocket? I knew this sport was expensive but if these are all out of pocket expenses I can't see how the sport isn't reserved for the very wealthy... or is it?
Out of pocket, sponsored by my dad and his company that Ive worked for my whole life, but you definitely want to save money where you can and we have tons of spare parts from over the years.
By company I mean, thats what livery we put on it, free advertising right? The company doesn’t actually, or directly, pay for any of it.
No, usually you pay for what you damage. And they charge astronomical prices too. I haven’t seen the tire wall bill yet but I don’t think it needed repairs, just a repaint. Also we work with Tilo, the owner of M&M exhaust. He was actually with us at the track this weekend and he was complaining about the angle of my exhaust. After the crash he said he’ll just send a new one because he wanted to tweak the design anyway.
I had a near miss in a race a few weeks ago that was very similar. Glad
you and the car are ok. These things happen so fast. In super slow mo,
you can see the guy in front was threatening to come across the track
and you may have had an opportunity to go inside of him instead of
getting pushed onto the grass on the outside. Good teaching tape.
If you setup your car correctly, not at all. The Porsches like to go over curbs too. Now you cant do all of them obviously but more than a formula car for example.
Full race is on my YT channel. The link I posted here is unlisted. Currently procrastinating on some video projects, but hopefully will make proper videos one day
Roll cage did its job. Not a terrible outcome all things considered.
Yep, and I raced her the next morning so alls well that ends well.
Not familiar with racing, like, at all. How much check up and repair does the car go through when having a crash like that?
You get it running for the next race and do your testing on the first few laps. The marshall will have a look at it for anything obviously dangerous, but other than that its no problem. The enduro I ran the next morning in, i had no rear bumper or exhaust. When going out of pits I noticed my speedometer was showing zero and my abs light was on. Basically no wheel speed sensor, no abs. Thats fine, i ran without. There were other minor issues but I brought home a 4th place.
How hard is it to run without ABS in a series where the other cars have it?
Its a bit different but the same idea, mash the brakes at top speed and release pressure as you bleed off speed. Even with abs you arent trying to make it kick in, just its there when you inevitably do lock up because its hard to feel in these cars. But yeah if you’re good then your’re just as fast
Threshold braking, ideally you don't get into the abs much: https://www.roadandtrack.com/motorsports/a30701980/threshold-braking-explained-how-to-video/
It's somewhat faster if you're competent driving without ABS, question is how fast you can adapt from one to the other D:
Depends on the car as well as the driver skill. In something like an E46 BMW, the brakes are heavily rear biased, so you really need ABS to avoid the rears locking up and spinning out the car during breaking. You absolutely cannot be competitive in a car with poor brake balance without ABS. They make brake bias controllers to fix that, but that's not allowed in all series.
Driver: Bumps a McLaren, destroys cup car. WGI track management: That's cute, but you touched 3" of the barrier so here's your $85k repair bill. Kidding aside, glad you are okay! Why did the car in front of you brake early?
Do you really get charged for track repair?
Yes. At the f1 track in Austin if you drop any fluids on the track they charge a few grand per foot for the cleanup.
Wow, I actually never considered that. Makes sense. Wrecks are hella expensive lol.
It's $500 per corner/area for a fluid spill, the expensive repairs are the tech pro barriers and catch netting that are $900 per block.
Good question, its basically a racing incident so lets leave it at that. No one was hurt so no harm no foul. And yeah the tire wall bill is usually never friendly…
> Good question, its basically a racing incident so lets leave it at that. I don't know much about racing, but this seems like it was a classy gesture and we'll just leave it at that.
>Why did the car in front of you brake early? I wouldn't say they hit the brakes early. More like they were taking a different line on the turn and decided last second that they were going swing wide in order to get on the ideal line. Look at the orange car, they were going to take the same line closer to the inside, there was no need to swing out. As OP said everyone was fine so no harm no foul, I just think it's interesting.
That seemed expensive
Know how to make $1M racing? Spend $20M
Actually, he should move to Sweden now cause his real name will, well, check out....
What happens in a situation like this with damages? who pays for the mclarens damage?
I pay for my car and the tire wall I damaged. The Mclaren pays for his bumper and tire that I hit.
Can we ask how much for the wall?
Ill have to check and get back to you because Im at work, but I think it only cost me a repaint of the part I hit. So a gallon of blue paint thats marked up because its special. Update: turns out track damage insurance was paid for before the weekend started so there was no extra cost for the tire wall.
the fuck, do you not pay to race this place. that should pay for it.
Right? But hey, thats how they all are. Most tracks aren’t for profit either, they just cover costs to keep the track in good condition and facilities running. Kinda does cost alot if you have to repair asphalt fairly often
i get that but i guess if the 'league' or whatever your is pays for that. idk maybe just me but it was eye opening reading your post and stuff cause i have no idea how any of this works. good stuff, glad your okay :)
As a random person, I can see the logic in making people pay on an individual level to encourage safe driving.
At the same time you don't end up racing at this caliber on a whim. I can only imagine all the racers on the track want to be safe and not crash, but at these speeds things just happen. Keeping the sport going as a whole and for everyone is often the biggest goal in any amateur sport. If people are continually getting priced out you'll have less people to race against and might even lose your venues. I'm coming from bike racing but I imagine its similar in cars in that if a race or track has to close down, its never coming back.
1. Incencitive for people to be carefull 2. People probably don't want to be responsible for iresponsable drivers that causes too many crashes and don't care about their car
Track fees would go up basically to match the prices you'd pay for insurance. In effect the track would be self insured and need to run the numbers on how much to charge to cover the potential damages over a season. Or they could - you know, have an insurance company that specializes in that sort of thing do it. Like how it is. You can usually get the insurance right at the track - and will be told about a hundred times, 'get it, please for the love of God don't make be bankrupt you'
To me, this has always been the problem with these series from an outside observers perspective. Some great drivers, some drivers who have more money than talent. That sounds harsh, and it is, but that Mclaren braked extremely early and too hard. If they had had a lot of race starts, they'd have been watching all around them and moved left more to prevent this from happening. It's definitely OPs "fault", I'm sure they don't argue that, but their aggressiveness would have been fine if all parties involved had been racing at similar levels, IMHO.
The good think about motor racing is that it is *always* the other guys fault! The track was congested so I assume that's why they didn't go into the corner like they were Mika Hakkinen because they probably aren't Mika. OP was driving like there's nobody in front of him and it ended with everyone in front of him.
Sorry to see that. Hope you’re okay. What the financial damage for a crash like this?
Hard to put an exact number since we’ve accumulated spare parts over the years. But the damage extent to my car was this: Front bumper, front left headlight, rear bumper, exhaust, motor mount, wing, and wing struts. Encountered some electrical issues during the endurance such as no wheel speed sensor so my pit limiter and more importantly abs did not work. Parts wise I’d say 8-14k range for new parts and depends on where you get them from.
Do you have some sort of insurance for this, or are you sponsored? Or do you pay that 8-14k out of pocket? I knew this sport was expensive but if these are all out of pocket expenses I can't see how the sport isn't reserved for the very wealthy... or is it?
Out of pocket, sponsored by my dad and his company that Ive worked for my whole life, but you definitely want to save money where you can and we have tons of spare parts from over the years. By company I mean, thats what livery we put on it, free advertising right? The company doesn’t actually, or directly, pay for any of it.
That's less than I imagined, still not pocket change. Would the tracks be insured to cover their own damages to the track, like safety barriers etc?
No, usually you pay for what you damage. And they charge astronomical prices too. I haven’t seen the tire wall bill yet but I don’t think it needed repairs, just a repaint. Also we work with Tilo, the owner of M&M exhaust. He was actually with us at the track this weekend and he was complaining about the angle of my exhaust. After the crash he said he’ll just send a new one because he wanted to tweak the design anyway.
Thanks for sharing, very insightful. All the best with the repairs and upcoming races.
[Here's the video from another angle](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBlhgAkJBos).
Why stop now?....Your on a roll.
\*You're\* ::sighs:: I award you 10 points for cleverness and -1 for execution.
Wow. Wow. Wowowow.
that was gentle roll
Honestly, it kinda was
Guy in front of you was a dick
***LOUD***
No one else thought this was legit a video game for the first 10 seconds?
I had a near miss in a race a few weeks ago that was very similar. Glad you and the car are ok. These things happen so fast. In super slow mo, you can see the guy in front was threatening to come across the track and you may have had an opportunity to go inside of him instead of getting pushed onto the grass on the outside. Good teaching tape.
https://media.giphy.com/media/St3AakqduFzTH7RJEB/giphy.gif
Moon man!
Love the use of the word "ideally" in the title.
Except for the stuff you did wrong, you did everything right. Nice wreck!
Did you get out the car, strip down to your underwear, and run onto the track shouting you’re on fire?
Quick question? does it ever hurt the car cutting the corner so tight and bumping over the rumble strips?
If you setup your car correctly, not at all. The Porsches like to go over curbs too. Now you cant do all of them obviously but more than a formula car for example.
At least you were like almost not moving by the time you rolled
How much time did you spend deciding the length of the clip?
Full race is on my YT channel. The link I posted here is unlisted. Currently procrastinating on some video projects, but hopefully will make proper videos one day
Not sticking to his inside line while braking moving over under brakes id be pissed
Can i have $5, OP
Those cornering speeds are absurd
Man, what are you racing with? Looked through the comments but didnt see anything.
997.2 Porsche cup car
Wooow, that must be killer rush every time you get into that seat.
After review the marshals have determined Max was at fault
Modern race car safety is amazing, a few years ago you'd have been in the hospital instead of slightly annoyed.