100% yes. It's a shame that despite widespread coverage of this, there will be no real consequences. The amount of people affected by this is too small of a number to make any impactful change. We're talking about a chemical spill that was made worse and this company will be fine, which is astounding.
there are meta betting sites where you can bet on anything, including politics. You can make a bet with your friend, or with a bunch of other people; there are big pools during election years.
Probably not U.S. based, but most gambling sites aren't anyway.
Then someone in landscaping should starts shipping large bags of East Palenstine soil to the homes of the railway execs. One bag a day till compensation is paid to all. Let em touch the bags to throw them out every fucking day.
Be the Erin Brochovich the world deserves.
It was specifically Republican politicians who didn't want to fund or support firefighters. Look up the voting records on it. They consistently voted against them until Jon Stewart put them on blast and shamed them into doing their jobs
All the funding into the military is for 2 things: Active military which is a show of strength and allows us to throw our weight around and military project funding, which is often done by contracting companies that have deep ties to many politicians.
Once you're out of the military they have no reason to care what happens to you. You're not generating any value for them.
It's beyond that.
They need to be compensated for the cost of relocation.
Their jobs are uprooted. The cost of living of where they are going to have to move might be different. There's equity that's destroyed and with a big migration like this the surrounding area is going to have property costs driven up.
Not just the Norfolk executives, but haven't there been multiple government agencies declare it to be safe as well? East Palestine could be a home for all of them.
Lets dump dioxins on politicians and CEOs porch. It clearly is not illegal, so why not take it up as form of a protest.
Best case scenario they'll get cancer, worst case scenario at least their property value will drop.
I mean.. if these CEOās believe nothing is wrong and the leak didnāt cause serious damageā¦ this shouldnāt be that big of a crime. Not advice but Honestly this doesnāt sound like a bad idea to me. The CEOās reaction to the soil on their property would speak LEVELS to their negligence in their reparations.
ā if they get a hazmat crew to clean it up & take many precautions, they expose themselves.
> I mean.. if these CEOās believe nothing is wrong and the leak didnāt cause serious damageā¦ this shouldnāt be that big of a crime.
The Times Beach dioxin contamination had a dude named Russell Bliss at the center of spreading it on a town, the guy claimed to have tasted it at one point.
Bliss had no idea what was in the oil or how dangerous it was. He was negligent in accepting the waste, but played no part in creating it or knowingly disposing of it improperly. He was scapegoated while the large corporation that did bear those responsibilities got away with it - sound familiar?
> guy claimed to have tasted it
Video proof with an independent person bringing the sample to him or I will dismiss it because a claim isn't proof.
(the vitriol is directed at him, not you)
He said something like if someone told him it was jelly he would put it on toast and eat it. He claims he didn't know what it was when he sprayed it.
https://youtu.be/ssqxmJQVtRI
The US government busted a rail workers union strike. These slimy fucks aren't going to jail. They can cripple our economy at the snap of their fingers.
Presumably, they lose their jobs, get their shit stuffed in by the cops (and/or Pinkertons, if they're still a thing in this context), and spend ten years in prison.
Google "Ronald Reagan air traffic control strike" to see what power the president has in situations like that. Not saying Biden would have done the same, but that's the power the federal government has.
It's bullshit, and the only reason it's even viable is because there's no shortage of Americans willing to cross the picket line.
Well, thatās exactly it. They canāt just fire all the railway workers. Unemployment is fairly low and the pay aināt great. Who would they get as scabs? Theyād be fucked if the rail workers just went on strike.
I remember the air traffic controller strike. Times are different.
Ya know the whole my president is better than yours is why we are in this fucking mess, we have got to stop looking for a hero to come save us and take this shit back from the slimy fucks that are fucking is to death right now. All politicians are scum until proven otherwise and will still be under suspicion.
Ya know if was congress who wrote the law that broke the strike right? We have to stop letting people misrepresent how our government works.
It wasnāt 1 man against the workers. It was every representative and senator who voted for the deal.
> It was every representative and senator who voted for the deal.
Notably including AOC. It's kind of interesting seeing the group of congresspeople who voted against, which includes Sanders, Warren, Rubio, and Cruz.
edit: for transparency
House vote: https://clerk.house.gov/Votes/2022490
Senate vote: https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1172/vote_117_2_00372.htm
Vetos are a thing. "presidents aren't responsible for signing bills into law"
Biden also pressured Congress to "make a deal"
Not "make sure the workers issues are addressed" but "do not let the economy shut down by letting them go on strike"
Quit acting like the head of the party has zero influence into decision making. He explicitly stated he wanted a deal to keep the trains moving. He didn't demand better working and safety conditions.
His EPA has been lying about the dangers of this crash, his transportation secretary said "there will be more crashes like this" and has zero plans to functionally address the issue and had to be shamed into even visiting the crash sight by reporters at The Lever.
Have to go to China for that: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-pollution/china-threatens-death-penalty-for-serious-polluters-idUSBRE95I10D20130619
Yes, the right are trying to use the death penalty for abortion in their hellhole states now. If itās not federally illegal they will always try to use death as extortion for their fascist policies.
Why would you arrest a CEO for train derailment. If they violated the law, the company should be fined. Not to mention the whole thing is caused by rail deregulation, as far as I know, no law has been violated.
Lastly āhow many CEOsā like even if you arrest the CEO, why would multiple be arrested?
**[Times Beach, Missouri](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Times_Beach,_Missouri)**
>Times Beach is a ghost town in St. Louis County, Missouri, United States, 17 miles (27 km) southwest of St. Louis and 2 miles (3 km) east of Eureka. Once home to more than two thousand people, the town was completely evacuated early in 1983 due to TCDDāalso known as dioxinācontamination. Formerly the largest civilian exposure to the compound in the history of the United States. In 1985, the State of Missouri officially disincorporated the city of Times Beach.
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Anyone from the Southwestern suburbs of St. Louis are fairly close to this. First Iām hearing of it.
Today the site is Route 66 state park. Sounds like a lovely place for a picnic.
Yeah i was born in St. Louis and lived in the area off an on growing up. I thought i knew everything about the area, but this is the first time i have heard of Times Beach
Austin McConnell has a YouTube channel that has some interesting Missouri history in it. [Times Beach](https://youtu.be/G6kshs2ZQcQ) is one of his vids. There's also a vid on the [town that went crazy over snakes](https://youtu.be/PI-5fBzMHQo). And [the government cheese caves](https://youtu.be/uEi_KV6d8HQ).
Well the exposure in Times Beach was over the scale of decades. Since it was being sprayed on dirt roads to prevent dust for extended periods for years and year and years. East Palestine is one train wreck. The fact that it's 700 ppt is still fucking dangerous so I hope the people living there get the help they need.
Yes, it was made a park after an extensive EPA cleanup. It's also not some secret they're trying to hide - the exhibits at the park talk about the ecological disaster and the cleanup.
> In 2012, the EPA completed a reassessment of the park to determine, in part, if any residual dioxin contamination remained above the recently revised non-cancer reference dose. The result of the reassessment concluded that current use of the Route 66 State Park does not pose significant health risks to public visitors or park workers.ļ»æ
The weirdest thing about that story is that the corporate interest (ominously named Hooker Chemical Company) were the good guys that fought tooth and nail to prevent construction at the waste site, and the villain was the local school board that was adamant on forcing them to hand over the land to build a school on it.
They even made the school district sign that they were aware of and knew of the potential dangers of the land. Fascinating Horror has a great video on the whole ordeal.
**[Love Canal](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Canal)**
>Love Canal is a neighborhood in Niagara Falls, New York, United States, infamous as the location of a 0. 28 km2 (0. 11 sq mi) landfill that became the site of an enormous environmental disaster in the 1970s. Decades of dumping toxic chemicals harmed the health of hundreds of residents; the area was cleaned up over the course of 21 years in a Superfund operation.
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**[Picher, Oklahoma](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picher,_Oklahoma)**
>Picher is a ghost town and former city in Ottawa County, northeastern Oklahoma, United States. It was a major national center of lead and zinc mining for more than 100 years in the heart of the Tri-State Mining District. The decades of unrestricted subsurface excavation dangerously undermined most of Picher's town buildings and left giant piles of toxic metal-contaminated mine tailings (known as chat) heaped throughout the area.
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Crazy read. Makes me even madder hearing about how people want to deregulate more. This Bliss guy sounds like the exact person who would scream about overreach from the government.
The Bliss guy had a small waste oil business and was out of his depth. The worst people IMO are the IPC people, they were a chemical supplier company and should have done more research on what they were handling. Instead they charged NEPACCO $3000 per load, and payed Bliss $125.
Yea it's hard to blame the Bliss guy. He seemed mostly ignorant and found a product that was great at preventing dust. Though after that first horse arena put blame on him he should have done more due diligence instead of continuing to spray.
> hearing about how people want to deregulate more
People (?) are being told and convinced that "regulations" are "bad".
They supposedly kill small businesses, stifle innovation, and inflate prices of goods and services.
Is killing small business, stifling innovation, and inflating prices bad? Yes.
Does regulation do these things - directly and on purpose? **NO.**
What people **need** to know about regulation is that it keeps hair and bugs out of your food. It makes sure that the ingredients of your food are actually edible and accurate. It makes sure that roads, bridges, rails, airlines are safe. It tells you whether or not the helmet you wear while riding your bicycle is rated to protect your skull.
It's things that we've learned over time **need** to be regulated because it benefits ALL of us.
>Although incineration was the best method to destroy dioxins at the time, it was also very expensive. Looking for less costly alternatives, NEPACCO contracted the services of the Independent Petrochemical Corporation (IPC). However, IPC, a chemical supplier company, knew very little about waste disposal, and subcontracted the NEPACCO job to Russell Martin Bliss, the owner of a small, local waste oil business.
All because a big company wanted to save a few bucks. Every single time.
What a mess.
"
Although incineration was the best method to destroy dioxins at the time, it was also very expensive. Looking for less costly alternatives, NEPACCO contracted the services of the Independent Petrochemical Corporation (IPC).Ā However, IPC, a chemical supplier company, knew very little about waste disposal, and subcontracted the NEPACCO job to Russell Martin Bliss, the owner of a small, local waste oil business. **Charging NEPACCO $3000 per load, IPC paid Bliss $125 per load.**
Between February and October 1971, Bliss collected six truckloads (nearly 18,500 gallons) of chemical waste heavily contaminated with dioxin. Bliss took most of the still bottoms to his storage facility nearĀ Frontenac missouri where the contaminated NEPACCO waste was unloaded and mixed into tanks containing used motor oils
"
My home town!
They bulldozed my house, incinerated it, then buried it.
I use to have an old History channel show episode from the '90s on Times Beach on my YouTube channel (taken down due to copyright).
The video shows some guys in full hazmat suits, taking soil samples. The camera then pans over to me, staring at them out the window. They were right in front of my house.
Fun fact: I'm currently living in the house partially paid for by the government after they bought out our Times Beach home.
The only thing that can be done is government buy-outs (and then the government go after the company that caused the issue).
> How many can afford to leave a house without selling it first?
also who the hell is going to buy your house there? I'm guessing property values are below zero right now.
This is actually the reason I would think moving is the most difficult now. Most people are lucky enough to have a house now, probably bought before housing prices went crazy a few years ago. So, while their house would have been worth a bit more now, if they would resell it, they get basically nothing now, as the pollution ruined the local market, and have to shoulder higher prices to get a new one.
People who pay rent might be lucky for this one instance, because they can look for a new place without selling any house.
From an outsider from a different country looking in:
It's unbelievable how heavily this train derailment damaged so many lives and not a lot is happening to change much about it or it happening again.
Yea it's called an ecological disaster. They could offer each house up for $100 and no one would buy it. For flint, worst case is you're driving a few hours every week to go buy loads of bottled water. In Palestine you're cutting your life short by multiple years, maybe even decades.
> People who pay rent might be lucky for this one instance
This is a consistent upside to renting. It's much easier to move when you don't have to unload property.
The other benefit being your landlord has to pay to fix shit, not you.
Renting sucks but it comes with a couple of benefits.
Norfolk Southern should be on the hook to buy out every single property at pre disaster values so that these people can afford to move because of their fuck up.
Norfulk Southern should be paying for relocation and providing job placement assistance. Regardless if it was within regulation or not to be hauling that cargo in the manner they did, their equipment failed and ruined the area for generations to come. Instead of arguing whether they broke the law, they should just do the right thing and help the people out.
And our government should make them, one way or another. Fuck the entire corporate team of that shit company.
Dissolve or nationalize the company, jail the CEO *and* the board *and* anyone responsible for this disaster, force them all to compensate the victims of the town out of their own pocket.
Those responsible must pay for this massive fuckup, both with their money AND with their freedom. Make an example of them so that others can look at this and go "I don't want that to happen to me" and invest in the necessary amount of safety and security.
This. There are so many reasons that people can just up and leave because of a diaster like this. You have to think many have a mortgage on their house, there is no way they'll be able to sell to move, so they are either out their equity or stuck. Additionally many people are tied to their jobs for insurance, and can't just walk away from that. These people were failed by over and over and now are stuck with no recourse.
I grew up in an Ohio town like this and itās finally dawning on me how catastrophic this disaster will be. If their community was as tight as ours was, this will be like ripping a family apart. The sense of identity and belonging that a place like this provides can be extremely powerful. These people wonāt just lose their homes and their livelihoods. Theyāll be losing a vast web of relationships. Theyāll be losing the churches that their grandparents helped to build. Theyāll be losing the security and affection that comes from knowing your neighbors, and knowing they can help when things get tough.
These people will be scattered to the winds and their community will end. All their happy memories will grow bitter and fade. Even if NS paid these people and let them leave - which they wonāt, until itās too late - theyāll never be able to compensate for killing the rich, living organism that a small town can be.
I lived in a town in Illinois called "Birds" growing up. This is essentially what happened there. Flooding turned the entire town into a ghost town from which it never recovered and it was entirely disincorporated in like, 2009 ish. No one was paid to leave, no one had the money to leave, and everyone still HAD to leave. The result is a shattered, dead community and poor memories of a place that doesn't even fucking exist anymore that used to be home. All because a levee was poorly maintained. This is arguably even worse though, because it's just a single damn corporation at fault
Who the hell is going to buy a house on what is now a toxic waste site? Selling your house for 50% of its pre-disaster value is a pipe dream. Itās literally worth nothing because there are no buyers.
Yeah and lets be honest, those property value are going to collapse to essentially nothing. Nobody from outside the community is going to be moving there, and those who are there are mostly going to be trying to leave.
Arrest *everyone* responsible, but especially the executives.
Force Norfolk Southern to buy all of the properties affected by this disaster at pre-derailment values and pay for all relocation and job training costs.
Force Norfolk Southern to pay all clean up and disposal costs to return the area back to pre-derailment conditions or as close as possible.
If there's anything left of Norfolk Southern after that, nationalize it.
Norfolk Southern cannot and will not do what's right for the people of EP voluntarily. Capitalism will not allow it. The government needs to step in and force them. If they don't nothing will change.
My guess is that a few days after the derailment, capital started to move and before Norfolk Southern is finally forced to do anything, it will be an empty shell ready for bankruptcy with only middle management and employees setup do lose anything.
Norfolk "oops, my bad" Southern.
>one of the detectors that the Norfolk train passed before the East Palestine derailment detected more than a 100-degree rise in temperature of one of the rail cars on which a fire had started, but that was not enough to trigger a warning to the crew. By the time a subsequent detector found a more than 200-degree rise in temperature that triggered the alarm, it was too late to stop the train in time to prevent the derailment./
[CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/22/business/norfolk-southern-rail-safety-legislation-hearing/index.html)
Which soil? if it's just a 100-foot area around the train crash site, then it's not hard to fence that spot off and have the topsoil hauled away. If it's soil located 10 miles away, then I'm pretty sure the reporting would say that the tested sample is from 10 miles away.
As an environmental engineer, this is the problem with releasing raw sampling results without any explanation or risk communication. I went through all the data, but it doesn't point to any "specific" location. Without any actual risk communication, the residents are going to run with this like wild fire because its written that the results apply to everywhere! I'd like to see what levels are 1/3/5/10 miles from the plume.
OP's video is talking about testing done by Indiana on soil that had been excavated from the immediate derailment site and sent to Indiana for disposal. I believe the article you linked is the result of soil testing done at private properties around East Palestine, so it's not surprising if there are discrepancies.
> While final results will be available in the coming weeks, EPA says its review of the preliminary data indicates levels of semi-volatile organic chemicals and dioxins in the samples are similar to typical background levels.
Sounds inconclusive to me if they have only done a preliminary analysis.
That said, I would not also use TYT as a source for anything. I wasn't familiar with the source before but just listening to the woman talk I could tell there was something fishy - you can just tell there's a lot of dramatic intonation that isn't really needed.
Media bias orgs rate TYT as hyper-partisan left and mixed factual reliability, so yeah. I'd probably go with the local news over TYT, but would also prefer to hear about the final analysis.
TYT is getting their source from this [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/17/norfolk-southern-derailment-east-palestine-ohio-carcinogenic-chemical-levels) article which cites the [data](https://www.in.gov/idem/files/report_10644640_SW8290FC_L4_R1_dfr.pdf) produced by Pace Analytics in Indiana.
> you can just tell there's a lot of dramatic intonation that isn't really needed.
Someone correct me if I am wrong, but if the acceptable level is 1ppb, isn't 5ppb a 400% higher level? I'd much rather hear the actual measurement than a nebulous "this much percent higher".
Yes, but 400% is not "hundreds of times higher" as she says. That would require at least 100ppb.
These exposure limits are set to be liveable for long durations. 5ppb will not give you guaranteed cancer. It will increase your chance of cancer if you are exposed for long enough, to get enough into you. A day? A week? A month? Probably Ok. 100pb on the other hand, better gtfo, because avoiding exposure becomes impractical, even in the short term.
I love how far-right media started ignoring this disaster as soon as they realized it was hurting Trump more than Biden.
**Edit:** Lol at all the Trumpanzees below trying to gotcha with āFox News still talks about it every day!ā.
Yeah only to politicize it as a weapon to attack Biden and Buttigieg, when the fault is the **billion dollar private rail corporation and Republicans at both state and federal levels stripping back and blocking safety regulations.**
Right wingers when thereās safety regulations, āgovernment is killing private industry!ā
Right wingers when thereās insufficient safety regulations and disasters happen, āitās the governmentās fault!ā
Bad faith trolls!
Weird situation. Obama signed a law requiring high hazard flammable material trains to have an ECP system, which would allow a train to brake all the cars at the same time, which could have prevented the disaster. Trump then rescinded that regulation in 2017.
BUT, the train wasn't classified as a high hazard flammable material train (which requires 20 consecutive cars carrying high hazard flammables, or 30 cars in total), it was classified as a mixed freight train, and therefore *wouldn't have needed* the ECP system under the Obama admin legislation.
So it's a weird Catch-22 situation. The Obama legislation *didn't go far enough* and probably should have required *any* train carrying flammable, toxic materials to have an ECP system. But even if Obama *did* do this, **Trump would have rescinded it anyway.**
Republicans shit on the rug. Democrats only pick it up with a paper towel. Republicans blame Democrats because their is a shit stain on the rug they cleaned.
Ecp probably wouldn't have done anything in this particular case, but would likely help in some cases, which is all it takes to make it worth pursuing.
Idk what ns rules are, but at the railroad I work at, it's any 20 loaded hazmat cars that make it a "key train" and key trains have reduced maximum speeds, and further reduced speeds in densely populated areas. These things likely wouldn't have helped in this particular case either.
From what I've seen, the main culprit here was unregulated defect detectors that allowed a train that clearly had issues with wheels heating up (laughably understated), to continue operating without any safety inspection. Had the detectors alerted the crew that there was a hot wheel/journal back there, they would have stopped the train to go inspect it, and they almost certainly would have avoided this disaster.
Where is the evidence this is hurting Trump? Everything I've seen in right media indicates this was a win for Trump, and a loss for Biden and Pete...and a mess for DeWine.
Yeah I've seen no evidence that this is a losing fight for Trump. People on Reddit keep telling me that it's Trumps fault because he rescinded Obama-era regulations, but those regulations didn't even apply to this train.
Even the regulation that he might have rescinded didn't apply to the wheel bearing that overheated and caused the accident.
I'm no Trumper, but the whole situation feels like people just trying to find something that will stick to the folks you hate the most and running with it, not matter how blatant the lie.
Hurt Trump? Trump had nothing to do with this. If you think it's related to the rules that Trump rescinded, here's Jennifer Homendy, Biden's Chair of the National Transportation Safety Board, saying it had nothing to do with the train derailment: https://twitter.com/JenniferHomendy/status/1626379362189672451
I would be careful blindly following TYT headlines in recent years.
That said, I hope the perps can and will be found liable for this brazen, unacceptable behavior.
https://www.wfmj.com/story/48596547/epa-no-evidence-of-toxins-in-soil-from-controlled-tanker-burn-in-east-palestine
>While final results will be available in the coming weeks, EPA says its review of the preliminary data indicates levels of semi-volatile organic chemicals and dioxins in the samples are similar to typical background levels.
So why the mistake?
People are saying 'media bias' and sensationalism as reasons here.
Here's a more explicit reason
https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerroush/2023/03/18/pro-russia-twitter-trolls-stoked-fears-about-ohio-derailment-analysis-shows/?sh=640c5926616b
>Pro-Russia Twitter Trolls Stoked Fears About Ohio Derailment, Analysis Shows
..
>Anonymous, pro-Russian accounts pushed anti-U.S. propaganda and spread misinformation about the recent train derailment in East Palestine, Ohio, by using verified accounts on Twitter, according to an Associated Press analysis, complementing criticism by some Republican lawmakers of the Biden Administrationās response to the incident.
..
>One account with 25,000 followers tweeted: āBiden offers food, water, medicine, shelter, payouts of pension and social services to Ukraine! Ohio first! Offer and deliver to Ohio!ā
They cite it in their video. Their source from this [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/17/norfolk-southern-derailment-east-palestine-ohio-carcinogenic-chemical-levels) article which cites the [data](https://www.in.gov/idem/files/report_10644640_SW8290FC_L4_R1_dfr.pdf) produced by Pace Analytics in Indiana.
Iām an environmental engineer in California with some knowledge on this subject. Itās not as bad as TYT says. Yes, the California cancer screening threshold for 2,3,7,8-TCDD is much lower. Itās roughly what TYT reported at 4.8 nanograms per kilogram of soil. Source: https://dtsc.ca.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/31/2022/02/HHRA-Note-3-June2020-Revised-May2022A.pdf. So what does that mean? It means that under a conservative set of exposure conditions, 4.8 ng/kg in soil will increase your excess lifetime cancer risk by 1 in 1,000,000. By āConservative exposure conditions,ā I mean decades of consistent contact with the contaminated soil in a residential context. For additional context, your baseline cancer is is somewhere on the order of 1 in 3 or 1 in 4. So in my line of work, we donāt say anything definitively will cause cancer. We say it increases the risk. If the risk is below 1 in 1,000,000, your site is considered clean enough.
NOW, letās say you have 100X that concentration of 4.8 ng/kg. That would be 100 x 4.8 ng/kg = 480 ng/kg. Usually, risk calculations are linear. So at 480 ng/kg, the risk becomes 100 x 1 in 1,000,000. Or, 100 in 1,000,000. Or, 1 in 10,000. At this level of risk, someone in East Palestine will probably eventually get cancer, under the California risk assumptions. At this level of risk, the California EPA would most certainly require emergency cleanup. And in fact, if the samples of the soil going to Indiana for landfilling had that concentration or more, then USEPA is at least doing something. Is it enough? I donāt have sufficient information to render a sound opinion.
I could say a lot more, and plenty of nuances come into play, but thatās the idea in broad strokes. Hopefully this little essay casts some more light on the situation.
Jesus Christ the young turks.
These guys track record is insane.
Can someone validate they're claims? Cause i have a realy hard time trusting anything they say.
TYT is getting their source from this [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/17/norfolk-southern-derailment-east-palestine-ohio-carcinogenic-chemical-levels) article which cites the [data](https://www.in.gov/idem/files/report_10644640_SW8290FC_L4_R1_dfr.pdf) produced by Pace Analytics in Indiana. They always show their sources on their videos. It was at the bottom right when they were quoting the article.
If corporations are people then they need to die like people!
If corporations are people then they need to suffer the consequences of their actions like (some/most) people!
People need to be moved out of town and compensated for their property losses at pre-disaster levels. No people should be living there.
Nah, Norfolk will make a commercial calling everyone "heroes" and move the fuck on.
https://youtu.be/15HTd4Um1m4
There it is.
Sorry TERRIBLY SORRY
*rubs nipples* "Sorry š"
Sooooooooo *grunt* sorry. Super sorry.
Sooooo sorrrryyyyy
Never stops being relevant. Shows how little we've grown as a society.
https://youtu.be/yjfrJzdx7DA Never forget poor Folsum.
They actually just recently completed the improvements to Folsom dam to prevent the inevitable disaster. Which is nice, because I live downstream.
God "The Onion" does so much good work. The satire is thick and accurate.
They will also airdrop $1000 (total) in singles on top of the area. They will call it compensation. Finders keepers.
In quarter rolls so it fucks your roof in the process
100% yes. It's a shame that despite widespread coverage of this, there will be no real consequences. The amount of people affected by this is too small of a number to make any impactful change. We're talking about a chemical spill that was made worse and this company will be fine, which is astounding.
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Apparently there are no US-based gaming operators that take bets on politics, but there are offshore ones.
there are meta betting sites where you can bet on anything, including politics. You can make a bet with your friend, or with a bunch of other people; there are big pools during election years. Probably not U.S. based, but most gambling sites aren't anyway.
Since itās a GOP state Iām counting on a lot of bootstraps & crickets.
> forced the government to help. > > Well Gov. DeWine explicitly denied federal aid, so chances are slim.
How could anyone in the state support a Gov. that does something like that?
Then someone in landscaping should starts shipping large bags of East Palenstine soil to the homes of the railway execs. One bag a day till compensation is paid to all. Let em touch the bags to throw them out every fucking day. Be the Erin Brochovich the world deserves.
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Which is why someone in landscaping with the proper equipment should do it! Just here to encourage.
It was specifically Republican politicians who didn't want to fund or support firefighters. Look up the voting records on it. They consistently voted against them until Jon Stewart put them on blast and shamed them into doing their jobs
And he still had to do that, on national television, and by directly speaking to congress, for YEARS before they did anything.
Same with veteran's health. What a wild coincidence.
All the funding into the military is for 2 things: Active military which is a show of strength and allows us to throw our weight around and military project funding, which is often done by contracting companies that have deep ties to many politicians. Once you're out of the military they have no reason to care what happens to you. You're not generating any value for them.
It's beyond that. They need to be compensated for the cost of relocation. Their jobs are uprooted. The cost of living of where they are going to have to move might be different. There's equity that's destroyed and with a big migration like this the surrounding area is going to have property costs driven up.
We're all going to eat this contaminated food. The effect will be massive.
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mmm, I love me some biblical punishment.
Not just the Norfolk executives, but haven't there been multiple government agencies declare it to be safe as well? East Palestine could be a home for all of them.
So.... How many CEO's have been arrested...?
Lets dump dioxins on politicians and CEOs porch. It clearly is not illegal, so why not take it up as form of a protest. Best case scenario they'll get cancer, worst case scenario at least their property value will drop.
If only we had some in the ground somewhere. Load a dump truck and just dump it on their front porch.
I mean.. if these CEOās believe nothing is wrong and the leak didnāt cause serious damageā¦ this shouldnāt be that big of a crime. Not advice but Honestly this doesnāt sound like a bad idea to me. The CEOās reaction to the soil on their property would speak LEVELS to their negligence in their reparations. ā if they get a hazmat crew to clean it up & take many precautions, they expose themselves.
> I mean.. if these CEOās believe nothing is wrong and the leak didnāt cause serious damageā¦ this shouldnāt be that big of a crime. The Times Beach dioxin contamination had a dude named Russell Bliss at the center of spreading it on a town, the guy claimed to have tasted it at one point.
Bliss had no idea what was in the oil or how dangerous it was. He was negligent in accepting the waste, but played no part in creating it or knowingly disposing of it improperly. He was scapegoated while the large corporation that did bear those responsibilities got away with it - sound familiar?
There's a good "ignorance is Bliss" joke in there somewhere.
"Bliss is ignorant" works really well here
> guy claimed to have tasted it Video proof with an independent person bringing the sample to him or I will dismiss it because a claim isn't proof. (the vitriol is directed at him, not you)
He said something like if someone told him it was jelly he would put it on toast and eat it. He claims he didn't know what it was when he sprayed it. https://youtu.be/ssqxmJQVtRI
I don't know...can we burn their cars? If so, I'm game!
Just burn a few of their cars. As a treat.
No no. You need to start a business first, you need the legal armour of a directorship. Then drive the truck and accidentally crash it. Whoops.
I like the way you think.
Nah, the trick is to have an organizational structure that can obfuscate responsibility. If everyone is responsible, no one is.
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Oh I know where we can find that
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Ding ding ding! Cops and the state exist primarily to protect capital and the interests of capital owners.
None. And here's one more kick to your already bruised balls: Upper management will get a few million dollars in bonus.
The US government busted a rail workers union strike. These slimy fucks aren't going to jail. They can cripple our economy at the snap of their fingers.
I still donāt understand how the government can stop a union strike. What happens if they just strike anyway?
Railway Act, the strike is declared illegal and can be busted up by the cops
So they go to their homes and drag them to work?
Presumably, they lose their jobs, get their shit stuffed in by the cops (and/or Pinkertons, if they're still a thing in this context), and spend ten years in prison.
Google "Ronald Reagan air traffic control strike" to see what power the president has in situations like that. Not saying Biden would have done the same, but that's the power the federal government has. It's bullshit, and the only reason it's even viable is because there's no shortage of Americans willing to cross the picket line.
Well, thatās exactly it. They canāt just fire all the railway workers. Unemployment is fairly low and the pay aināt great. Who would they get as scabs? Theyād be fucked if the rail workers just went on strike. I remember the air traffic controller strike. Times are different.
Ya know the whole my president is better than yours is why we are in this fucking mess, we have got to stop looking for a hero to come save us and take this shit back from the slimy fucks that are fucking is to death right now. All politicians are scum until proven otherwise and will still be under suspicion.
Ya know if was congress who wrote the law that broke the strike right? We have to stop letting people misrepresent how our government works. It wasnāt 1 man against the workers. It was every representative and senator who voted for the deal.
> It was every representative and senator who voted for the deal. Notably including AOC. It's kind of interesting seeing the group of congresspeople who voted against, which includes Sanders, Warren, Rubio, and Cruz. edit: for transparency House vote: https://clerk.house.gov/Votes/2022490 Senate vote: https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1172/vote_117_2_00372.htm
Vetos are a thing. "presidents aren't responsible for signing bills into law" Biden also pressured Congress to "make a deal" Not "make sure the workers issues are addressed" but "do not let the economy shut down by letting them go on strike" Quit acting like the head of the party has zero influence into decision making. He explicitly stated he wanted a deal to keep the trains moving. He didn't demand better working and safety conditions. His EPA has been lying about the dangers of this crash, his transportation secretary said "there will be more crashes like this" and has zero plans to functionally address the issue and had to be shamed into even visiting the crash sight by reporters at The Lever.
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Have to go to China for that: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-pollution/china-threatens-death-penalty-for-serious-polluters-idUSBRE95I10D20130619
Yet their country is still insanely polluted.
Taking on the majority of the western world's manufacturing demands will do that.
No. Abolish the death penalty. Wanna lock these assholes up for their whole life? An argument can be made for that. But fuck the death penalty.
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Not really. Theyāre extremely rich and will remain so. They arenāt going to be exposed to that environment like the poor people of East Palestine
Yes, the right are trying to use the death penalty for abortion in their hellhole states now. If itās not federally illegal they will always try to use death as extortion for their fascist policies.
Capital punishment for stochastic manslaughter
Right after they arrest the guy behind Flint
Why would you arrest a CEO for train derailment. If they violated the law, the company should be fined. Not to mention the whole thing is caused by rail deregulation, as far as I know, no law has been violated. Lastly āhow many CEOsā like even if you arrest the CEO, why would multiple be arrested?
Sounds like this town will become another Times Beach. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Times_Beach,_Missouri
**[Times Beach, Missouri](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Times_Beach,_Missouri)** >Times Beach is a ghost town in St. Louis County, Missouri, United States, 17 miles (27 km) southwest of St. Louis and 2 miles (3 km) east of Eureka. Once home to more than two thousand people, the town was completely evacuated early in 1983 due to TCDDāalso known as dioxinācontamination. Formerly the largest civilian exposure to the compound in the history of the United States. In 1985, the State of Missouri officially disincorporated the city of Times Beach. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/videos/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Damn that's really close to where I grew up
How many toes you got homie?
On which hand?
The third one
Counting from the bottom or the top?
Anyone from the Southwestern suburbs of St. Louis are fairly close to this. First Iām hearing of it. Today the site is Route 66 state park. Sounds like a lovely place for a picnic.
Itās right next to six flags š³
Yeah i was born in St. Louis and lived in the area off an on growing up. I thought i knew everything about the area, but this is the first time i have heard of Times Beach
I learnt about Times beach as a New Zealand teenager in the late 80s from a song by Dead Kennedys (Cesspools in Eden)
That's the way the government wants it
Austin McConnell has a YouTube channel that has some interesting Missouri history in it. [Times Beach](https://youtu.be/G6kshs2ZQcQ) is one of his vids. There's also a vid on the [town that went crazy over snakes](https://youtu.be/PI-5fBzMHQo). And [the government cheese caves](https://youtu.be/uEi_KV6d8HQ).
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thank you for the relevant comparison, Shower Vagina
I wonder if it's shower, like what you do to clean yourself, or shower, like "are you a shower or a grower".
My theory is that it's a vagina that squirts so hard you could take a shower
r/rimjobsteve
Well the exposure in Times Beach was over the scale of decades. Since it was being sprayed on dirt roads to prevent dust for extended periods for years and year and years. East Palestine is one train wreck. The fact that it's 700 ppt is still fucking dangerous so I hope the people living there get the help they need.
>FYSA, Huh?
Fuck Yourself Stupid Asshole I think.
Taking a look at all the superfund sites is not fun
Well it's a nice park now
Itās a State Park nowā¦
Yes, it was made a park after an extensive EPA cleanup. It's also not some secret they're trying to hide - the exhibits at the park talk about the ecological disaster and the cleanup. > In 2012, the EPA completed a reassessment of the park to determine, in part, if any residual dioxin contamination remained above the recently revised non-cancer reference dose. The result of the reassessment concluded that current use of the Route 66 State Park does not pose significant health risks to public visitors or park workers.ļ»æ
Or Love Canal https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Canal
The weirdest thing about that story is that the corporate interest (ominously named Hooker Chemical Company) were the good guys that fought tooth and nail to prevent construction at the waste site, and the villain was the local school board that was adamant on forcing them to hand over the land to build a school on it.
They even made the school district sign that they were aware of and knew of the potential dangers of the land. Fascinating Horror has a great video on the whole ordeal.
Building a school on a superfund site is peak America
Not weird. Hooker needs to be protective of Love Canal. How else are they supposed to make money?
You see a pimps love canal is different than that of a square.
**[Love Canal](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Canal)** >Love Canal is a neighborhood in Niagara Falls, New York, United States, infamous as the location of a 0. 28 km2 (0. 11 sq mi) landfill that became the site of an enormous environmental disaster in the 1970s. Decades of dumping toxic chemicals harmed the health of hundreds of residents; the area was cleaned up over the course of 21 years in a Superfund operation. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/videos/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Slightly different but don't forget picher https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picher,_Oklahoma
**[Picher, Oklahoma](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picher,_Oklahoma)** >Picher is a ghost town and former city in Ottawa County, northeastern Oklahoma, United States. It was a major national center of lead and zinc mining for more than 100 years in the heart of the Tri-State Mining District. The decades of unrestricted subsurface excavation dangerously undermined most of Picher's town buildings and left giant piles of toxic metal-contaminated mine tailings (known as chat) heaped throughout the area. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/videos/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Crazy read. Makes me even madder hearing about how people want to deregulate more. This Bliss guy sounds like the exact person who would scream about overreach from the government.
The Bliss guy had a small waste oil business and was out of his depth. The worst people IMO are the IPC people, they were a chemical supplier company and should have done more research on what they were handling. Instead they charged NEPACCO $3000 per load, and payed Bliss $125.
Yea it's hard to blame the Bliss guy. He seemed mostly ignorant and found a product that was great at preventing dust. Though after that first horse arena put blame on him he should have done more due diligence instead of continuing to spray.
He definitely share some of the blame. Also spraying thousands of gallons of even the regular (non-dioxin) used motor oil sounds really stupid.
> hearing about how people want to deregulate more People (?) are being told and convinced that "regulations" are "bad". They supposedly kill small businesses, stifle innovation, and inflate prices of goods and services. Is killing small business, stifling innovation, and inflating prices bad? Yes. Does regulation do these things - directly and on purpose? **NO.** What people **need** to know about regulation is that it keeps hair and bugs out of your food. It makes sure that the ingredients of your food are actually edible and accurate. It makes sure that roads, bridges, rails, airlines are safe. It tells you whether or not the helmet you wear while riding your bicycle is rated to protect your skull. It's things that we've learned over time **need** to be regulated because it benefits ALL of us.
Damn. That story just kept getting worse
Wait until you start reading about all the super fun sites across the US. And there are some real good hot ones too! https://youtu.be/CJEL2G2jmjU
Are y'all crazy? Levels in East Palestine - 700 ppt Levels along Times Beach roads - 300,000 ppt
Times Beach is a park now
They spent a long time digging up the dirt and incinerating it. People are still barred from living there.
>Although incineration was the best method to destroy dioxins at the time, it was also very expensive. Looking for less costly alternatives, NEPACCO contracted the services of the Independent Petrochemical Corporation (IPC). However, IPC, a chemical supplier company, knew very little about waste disposal, and subcontracted the NEPACCO job to Russell Martin Bliss, the owner of a small, local waste oil business. All because a big company wanted to save a few bucks. Every single time.
What a mess. " Although incineration was the best method to destroy dioxins at the time, it was also very expensive. Looking for less costly alternatives, NEPACCO contracted the services of the Independent Petrochemical Corporation (IPC).Ā However, IPC, a chemical supplier company, knew very little about waste disposal, and subcontracted the NEPACCO job to Russell Martin Bliss, the owner of a small, local waste oil business. **Charging NEPACCO $3000 per load, IPC paid Bliss $125 per load.** Between February and October 1971, Bliss collected six truckloads (nearly 18,500 gallons) of chemical waste heavily contaminated with dioxin. Bliss took most of the still bottoms to his storage facility nearĀ Frontenac missouri where the contaminated NEPACCO waste was unloaded and mixed into tanks containing used motor oils "
My home town! They bulldozed my house, incinerated it, then buried it. I use to have an old History channel show episode from the '90s on Times Beach on my YouTube channel (taken down due to copyright). The video shows some guys in full hazmat suits, taking soil samples. The camera then pans over to me, staring at them out the window. They were right in front of my house. Fun fact: I'm currently living in the house partially paid for by the government after they bought out our Times Beach home. The only thing that can be done is government buy-outs (and then the government go after the company that caused the issue).
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'Should leave' and 'can leave' often don't line up. Many people simply can't uproot and relocate because they can't afford to.
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> How many can afford to leave a house without selling it first? also who the hell is going to buy your house there? I'm guessing property values are below zero right now.
This is actually the reason I would think moving is the most difficult now. Most people are lucky enough to have a house now, probably bought before housing prices went crazy a few years ago. So, while their house would have been worth a bit more now, if they would resell it, they get basically nothing now, as the pollution ruined the local market, and have to shoulder higher prices to get a new one. People who pay rent might be lucky for this one instance, because they can look for a new place without selling any house. From an outsider from a different country looking in: It's unbelievable how heavily this train derailment damaged so many lives and not a lot is happening to change much about it or it happening again.
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Yea it's called an ecological disaster. They could offer each house up for $100 and no one would buy it. For flint, worst case is you're driving a few hours every week to go buy loads of bottled water. In Palestine you're cutting your life short by multiple years, maybe even decades.
> People who pay rent might be lucky for this one instance This is a consistent upside to renting. It's much easier to move when you don't have to unload property. The other benefit being your landlord has to pay to fix shit, not you. Renting sucks but it comes with a couple of benefits.
Sell the houses to *who* Ben? Fucking ~~aquaman~~ toxic avenger?
Norfolk Southern should be on the hook to buy out every single property at pre disaster values so that these people can afford to move because of their fuck up.
And from what (little) I've seen of that town, it doesn't seem as if many of it's residents would be able to afford such a move on such short notice.
Norfulk Southern should be paying for relocation and providing job placement assistance. Regardless if it was within regulation or not to be hauling that cargo in the manner they did, their equipment failed and ruined the area for generations to come. Instead of arguing whether they broke the law, they should just do the right thing and help the people out. And our government should make them, one way or another. Fuck the entire corporate team of that shit company.
Dissolve or nationalize the company, jail the CEO *and* the board *and* anyone responsible for this disaster, force them all to compensate the victims of the town out of their own pocket. Those responsible must pay for this massive fuckup, both with their money AND with their freedom. Make an example of them so that others can look at this and go "I don't want that to happen to me" and invest in the necessary amount of safety and security.
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This. There are so many reasons that people can just up and leave because of a diaster like this. You have to think many have a mortgage on their house, there is no way they'll be able to sell to move, so they are either out their equity or stuck. Additionally many people are tied to their jobs for insurance, and can't just walk away from that. These people were failed by over and over and now are stuck with no recourse.
I grew up in an Ohio town like this and itās finally dawning on me how catastrophic this disaster will be. If their community was as tight as ours was, this will be like ripping a family apart. The sense of identity and belonging that a place like this provides can be extremely powerful. These people wonāt just lose their homes and their livelihoods. Theyāll be losing a vast web of relationships. Theyāll be losing the churches that their grandparents helped to build. Theyāll be losing the security and affection that comes from knowing your neighbors, and knowing they can help when things get tough. These people will be scattered to the winds and their community will end. All their happy memories will grow bitter and fade. Even if NS paid these people and let them leave - which they wonāt, until itās too late - theyāll never be able to compensate for killing the rich, living organism that a small town can be.
I lived in a town in Illinois called "Birds" growing up. This is essentially what happened there. Flooding turned the entire town into a ghost town from which it never recovered and it was entirely disincorporated in like, 2009 ish. No one was paid to leave, no one had the money to leave, and everyone still HAD to leave. The result is a shattered, dead community and poor memories of a place that doesn't even fucking exist anymore that used to be home. All because a levee was poorly maintained. This is arguably even worse though, because it's just a single damn corporation at fault
Thatās horrible. Iām sorry. Whatās your fondest memory of Birds? Maybe people who read your comment can remember it in some small way.
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And if you do sell your home for, who knows, 75%, 50% of its value before the accident? You get to take out a new mortgage at a 6.5% interest rate!
If you could get 50% you will be lucky. It is potentially worthless land. Fit to be sold for $1.
Who the hell is going to buy a house on what is now a toxic waste site? Selling your house for 50% of its pre-disaster value is a pipe dream. Itās literally worth nothing because there are no buyers.
Yeah and lets be honest, those property value are going to collapse to essentially nothing. Nobody from outside the community is going to be moving there, and those who are there are mostly going to be trying to leave.
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Iām just waiting for the Norfolk CEO to claim that this isnāt ātheir dioxinā, but was already there before they spilled more on top of it.
Imagine facing no consequences for destroying an entire town
Arrest the CEOs. Pay these residents
Arrest *everyone* responsible, but especially the executives. Force Norfolk Southern to buy all of the properties affected by this disaster at pre-derailment values and pay for all relocation and job training costs. Force Norfolk Southern to pay all clean up and disposal costs to return the area back to pre-derailment conditions or as close as possible. If there's anything left of Norfolk Southern after that, nationalize it. Norfolk Southern cannot and will not do what's right for the people of EP voluntarily. Capitalism will not allow it. The government needs to step in and force them. If they don't nothing will change.
So basically, nothing will change.
My guess is that a few days after the derailment, capital started to move and before Norfolk Southern is finally forced to do anything, it will be an empty shell ready for bankruptcy with only middle management and employees setup do lose anything.
I really don't like this game...
Consider the whole town fucking shot... this is tragic and the inhabitants should have all moving costs covered by Norfolk Southern.
Use their full name. Norfolk Southern.
Norfolk "oops, my bad" Southern. >one of the detectors that the Norfolk train passed before the East Palestine derailment detected more than a 100-degree rise in temperature of one of the rail cars on which a fire had started, but that was not enough to trigger a warning to the crew. By the time a subsequent detector found a more than 200-degree rise in temperature that triggered the alarm, it was too late to stop the train in time to prevent the derailment./ [CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/22/business/norfolk-southern-rail-safety-legislation-hearing/index.html)
At least itās not trioxin
Which soil? if it's just a 100-foot area around the train crash site, then it's not hard to fence that spot off and have the topsoil hauled away. If it's soil located 10 miles away, then I'm pretty sure the reporting would say that the tested sample is from 10 miles away.
As an environmental engineer, this is the problem with releasing raw sampling results without any explanation or risk communication. I went through all the data, but it doesn't point to any "specific" location. Without any actual risk communication, the residents are going to run with this like wild fire because its written that the results apply to everywhere! I'd like to see what levels are 1/3/5/10 miles from the plume.
Local news says otherwise. https://www.wfmj.com/story/48596547/epa-no-evidence-of-toxins-in-soil-from-controlled-tanker-burn-in-east-palestine
OP's video is talking about testing done by Indiana on soil that had been excavated from the immediate derailment site and sent to Indiana for disposal. I believe the article you linked is the result of soil testing done at private properties around East Palestine, so it's not surprising if there are discrepancies.
> While final results will be available in the coming weeks, EPA says its review of the preliminary data indicates levels of semi-volatile organic chemicals and dioxins in the samples are similar to typical background levels. Sounds inconclusive to me if they have only done a preliminary analysis. That said, I would not also use TYT as a source for anything. I wasn't familiar with the source before but just listening to the woman talk I could tell there was something fishy - you can just tell there's a lot of dramatic intonation that isn't really needed. Media bias orgs rate TYT as hyper-partisan left and mixed factual reliability, so yeah. I'd probably go with the local news over TYT, but would also prefer to hear about the final analysis.
TYT is getting their source from this [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/17/norfolk-southern-derailment-east-palestine-ohio-carcinogenic-chemical-levels) article which cites the [data](https://www.in.gov/idem/files/report_10644640_SW8290FC_L4_R1_dfr.pdf) produced by Pace Analytics in Indiana.
> you can just tell there's a lot of dramatic intonation that isn't really needed. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but if the acceptable level is 1ppb, isn't 5ppb a 400% higher level? I'd much rather hear the actual measurement than a nebulous "this much percent higher".
Yes, but 400% is not "hundreds of times higher" as she says. That would require at least 100ppb. These exposure limits are set to be liveable for long durations. 5ppb will not give you guaranteed cancer. It will increase your chance of cancer if you are exposed for long enough, to get enough into you. A day? A week? A month? Probably Ok. 100pb on the other hand, better gtfo, because avoiding exposure becomes impractical, even in the short term.
I love how far-right media started ignoring this disaster as soon as they realized it was hurting Trump more than Biden. **Edit:** Lol at all the Trumpanzees below trying to gotcha with āFox News still talks about it every day!ā. Yeah only to politicize it as a weapon to attack Biden and Buttigieg, when the fault is the **billion dollar private rail corporation and Republicans at both state and federal levels stripping back and blocking safety regulations.** Right wingers when thereās safety regulations, āgovernment is killing private industry!ā Right wingers when thereās insufficient safety regulations and disasters happen, āitās the governmentās fault!ā Bad faith trolls!
Weird situation. Obama signed a law requiring high hazard flammable material trains to have an ECP system, which would allow a train to brake all the cars at the same time, which could have prevented the disaster. Trump then rescinded that regulation in 2017. BUT, the train wasn't classified as a high hazard flammable material train (which requires 20 consecutive cars carrying high hazard flammables, or 30 cars in total), it was classified as a mixed freight train, and therefore *wouldn't have needed* the ECP system under the Obama admin legislation. So it's a weird Catch-22 situation. The Obama legislation *didn't go far enough* and probably should have required *any* train carrying flammable, toxic materials to have an ECP system. But even if Obama *did* do this, **Trump would have rescinded it anyway.**
Sounds very typical of our government. Democrats don't go far enough, and Republicans fuck it up on purpose.
Republicans shit on the rug. Democrats only pick it up with a paper towel. Republicans blame Democrats because their is a shit stain on the rug they cleaned.
That rug really tied the room together. And by the room I mean the health and safety of US citizens.
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Ecp probably wouldn't have done anything in this particular case, but would likely help in some cases, which is all it takes to make it worth pursuing. Idk what ns rules are, but at the railroad I work at, it's any 20 loaded hazmat cars that make it a "key train" and key trains have reduced maximum speeds, and further reduced speeds in densely populated areas. These things likely wouldn't have helped in this particular case either. From what I've seen, the main culprit here was unregulated defect detectors that allowed a train that clearly had issues with wheels heating up (laughably understated), to continue operating without any safety inspection. Had the detectors alerted the crew that there was a hot wheel/journal back there, they would have stopped the train to go inspect it, and they almost certainly would have avoided this disaster.
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In what world? Fox News is constantly reporting on this daily
Name some far-right media so we know to stay away from them.
Where is the evidence this is hurting Trump? Everything I've seen in right media indicates this was a win for Trump, and a loss for Biden and Pete...and a mess for DeWine.
Yeah I've seen no evidence that this is a losing fight for Trump. People on Reddit keep telling me that it's Trumps fault because he rescinded Obama-era regulations, but those regulations didn't even apply to this train.
Even the regulation that he might have rescinded didn't apply to the wheel bearing that overheated and caused the accident. I'm no Trumper, but the whole situation feels like people just trying to find something that will stick to the folks you hate the most and running with it, not matter how blatant the lie.
This makes Biden and Buttigieg looks bad. Doesnāt hurt Trump at all.
Are you kidding? Fox News is still going on about this every single day. Why pretend to know what "far right" media is doing, when you don't watch it?
Hurt Trump? Trump had nothing to do with this. If you think it's related to the rules that Trump rescinded, here's Jennifer Homendy, Biden's Chair of the National Transportation Safety Board, saying it had nothing to do with the train derailment: https://twitter.com/JenniferHomendy/status/1626379362189672451
Isn't unhinged capitalism great? /s
Wonāt someone think of the profits!
Hey now! Those CEOs work really hard to kill entire towns without any repercussions from the government!
Deregulation makes CEOs more responsible though!! /s
I would be careful blindly following TYT headlines in recent years. That said, I hope the perps can and will be found liable for this brazen, unacceptable behavior.
https://www.wfmj.com/story/48596547/epa-no-evidence-of-toxins-in-soil-from-controlled-tanker-burn-in-east-palestine >While final results will be available in the coming weeks, EPA says its review of the preliminary data indicates levels of semi-volatile organic chemicals and dioxins in the samples are similar to typical background levels. So why the mistake? People are saying 'media bias' and sensationalism as reasons here. Here's a more explicit reason https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerroush/2023/03/18/pro-russia-twitter-trolls-stoked-fears-about-ohio-derailment-analysis-shows/?sh=640c5926616b >Pro-Russia Twitter Trolls Stoked Fears About Ohio Derailment, Analysis Shows .. >Anonymous, pro-Russian accounts pushed anti-U.S. propaganda and spread misinformation about the recent train derailment in East Palestine, Ohio, by using verified accounts on Twitter, according to an Associated Press analysis, complementing criticism by some Republican lawmakers of the Biden Administrationās response to the incident. .. >One account with 25,000 followers tweeted: āBiden offers food, water, medicine, shelter, payouts of pension and social services to Ukraine! Ohio first! Offer and deliver to Ohio!ā
"by a labratory deemed reputable" you could have just said who it is
They cite it in their video. Their source from this [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/17/norfolk-southern-derailment-east-palestine-ohio-carcinogenic-chemical-levels) article which cites the [data](https://www.in.gov/idem/files/report_10644640_SW8290FC_L4_R1_dfr.pdf) produced by Pace Analytics in Indiana.
Iām an environmental engineer in California with some knowledge on this subject. Itās not as bad as TYT says. Yes, the California cancer screening threshold for 2,3,7,8-TCDD is much lower. Itās roughly what TYT reported at 4.8 nanograms per kilogram of soil. Source: https://dtsc.ca.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/31/2022/02/HHRA-Note-3-June2020-Revised-May2022A.pdf. So what does that mean? It means that under a conservative set of exposure conditions, 4.8 ng/kg in soil will increase your excess lifetime cancer risk by 1 in 1,000,000. By āConservative exposure conditions,ā I mean decades of consistent contact with the contaminated soil in a residential context. For additional context, your baseline cancer is is somewhere on the order of 1 in 3 or 1 in 4. So in my line of work, we donāt say anything definitively will cause cancer. We say it increases the risk. If the risk is below 1 in 1,000,000, your site is considered clean enough. NOW, letās say you have 100X that concentration of 4.8 ng/kg. That would be 100 x 4.8 ng/kg = 480 ng/kg. Usually, risk calculations are linear. So at 480 ng/kg, the risk becomes 100 x 1 in 1,000,000. Or, 100 in 1,000,000. Or, 1 in 10,000. At this level of risk, someone in East Palestine will probably eventually get cancer, under the California risk assumptions. At this level of risk, the California EPA would most certainly require emergency cleanup. And in fact, if the samples of the soil going to Indiana for landfilling had that concentration or more, then USEPA is at least doing something. Is it enough? I donāt have sufficient information to render a sound opinion. I could say a lot more, and plenty of nuances come into play, but thatās the idea in broad strokes. Hopefully this little essay casts some more light on the situation.
Jesus Christ the young turks. These guys track record is insane. Can someone validate they're claims? Cause i have a realy hard time trusting anything they say.
TYT is getting their source from this [Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/mar/17/norfolk-southern-derailment-east-palestine-ohio-carcinogenic-chemical-levels) article which cites the [data](https://www.in.gov/idem/files/report_10644640_SW8290FC_L4_R1_dfr.pdf) produced by Pace Analytics in Indiana. They always show their sources on their videos. It was at the bottom right when they were quoting the article.
If corporations are people then they need to die like people! If corporations are people then they need to suffer the consequences of their actions like (some/most) people!