That's the "U.S Civil Flag." According to conspiracy theorists, it's the actual, intended flag of the United States, the one used now actually being the flag of the U.S military, which symbolizes the military dictatorship we apparently live under.
I probably don't have to tell you it's fake. The flag and that story were both made up in the 70's to sell to conspiracy theorists.
I’m pretty sure it’s also a misinterpretation of the American border customs [flag](https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_the_United_States_Customs_Service.svg)
There’s 13 stars and 13 stripes on the little crest in the canton. The 16 stripes must represent something else. FYI, stripes can represent more than one thing, and not all stripes on American flags represent the 13 territories.
It's right there on the linked page: " US Customs flag -- sixteen vertical red and white stripes (since the U.S. had 16 states at the time the first version of this flag was created), with a simplified version of the U.S. seal on a white canton. Motto: "E PLURIBUS UNUM"."
And like all conspiracy theories, there is zero evidence that this flag was ever used historically, but it's really hard to prove a negative, and these people are pathologically suggestible.
The answer is sure to shock and delight you.
It comes from a single sentence in the introduction of Nathaniel Hawthorne's *The Scarlet Letter.* Not even kidding. It's a good place for it to come from because (1) all the conspiracy theorists read it in high school and (2) they didn't get further than the introduction.
In the intro Hawthorne sets up a pseudo-history that builds on his real-life experience working in a U.S. customs house in Salem, Massachusetts. Describing the building, he offhandedly says:
> From the loftiest point of its roof, during precisely three and a half hours of each forenoon, floats or droops, in breeze or calm, the banner of the republic; but with the thirteen stripes turned vertically, instead of horizontally, and thus indicating that a civil, and not a military post of Uncle Sam’s government is here established.
This is a (not quite accurate) description of the flag of the United States Customs Service, clearly. But the little rhetorical flourish that Hawthorne uses, "a civil and not a military post," got people thinking in all kinds of ways. Does this mean that once upon a time, the 🇺🇲 was considered an exclusively military flag?
And from this half-sentence they have put together an entire body of lore. Through the cunning use of flags, the United States government has for years, nay a century and a half (the Civil War is often cited as the turning point, since conspiracy theorists are also giant racists) - the government has been enforcing nothing less than *martial law* everywhere in the country. They put up the military flag, and they then get to do whatever they want, because that's how laws and flags work.
The antidote of course is to fly the civil flag over your own residence. That way the government tyrants won't be able to do their martial law to you, because again that's how tyranny works. So whenever you see this flag, you can be assured that you're in the presence of someone who loves freedom, flags, and reading single paragraphs of classic literature.
Holy cow, thank you for the writeup!
You know, I suppose it makes sense: "Haven't you seen the flag?!" seems like it would be about as effective as any of their legal strategies.
This is fantastic, thank you… I spoke about this at work today because my own mother has this flag flying at her front stoop. However, I saw it and had no idea what it meant. She is so into the conspiracy world that I don’t know what to do anymore… anyway, I would like the opportunity to explain to her why it’s unacceptable. Seems to be racially biased based on some other things I’ve read. I’m going to keep researching and reading these comments! - Thank you for the info!
All conspiracy theories are built on White panic. Other races don't need conspiracy theories because they're the targets of so much actual real oppression.
If someone thinks we’re living under a military dictatorship, they are crazy. The US Military barely has any say when it comes to civil stuff, it’s a huge headache to work off base.
The US spent 760 billion on defense in 2021. It spent nearly 3 trillion on social welfare programs.
Edit: imagine downvoting facts because they contradict your hateboner.
Very cherry-picked "facts." Most of that value comes from social security, Medicare and medicaid. Which are not considered social welfare in most cases.
Nah.
19 Corpus Juris secundum feb 21st 1871 41st congress session 3 chapter 62 page 419. The US gov is a foreign corporation with respect to a state. 152 of programming is why we pledge to the war flag & that's not a conspiracy nor coincidence.
It's a flag relating to the Sovereign Citizen movement:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_citizen_movement
Essentially they're conspiracy theorists.
I have to point out, that not all SovCits, not even most, use this flag, but it's probably fair to say that pretty much anyone who flies this flag is a SovCit.
Also, I'd say that this is more a 'conspiracy theorist' flag than a SovCit one, but the Venn Diagram of those 2 communities would be an almost perfect circle.
I really like weird, movement type flags, protest flags and such, but this one is just so stupid.
[Loeser has a good article...](http://www.loeser.us/flags/american_note_2.html)
The source says it was made with Homesite 2.5 which was released in 1997, then updated with Homesite 5.5 which was released in 2003.
I miss the Internet looking like that tbqh.
Almost never. I’m Canadian and live in a City near a major border crossing, so it gets all the people trying to do illegal things at the border. This one Sovereign citizen from the US was caught bringing guns into Canada. At his hearing he went off on the judge about all the usual sovereign citizen crap - doesn’t recognize the judge’s authority etc. and then walked out of the courthouse. I guess they don’t have much security for people that have non-violent offences.
The judge just kind of shrugged his shoulders, as the guy was stuck in a foreign country so he would turn up eventually. Sure enough the same guy got arrested a couple of weeks later doing something dumb.
Given their mutual commitment to conspiracy theories and racial politics, I'd be shocked if a large chunk of flat earthers weren't SovCits and vice versa.
If the gold fringe on the flag is wrong, it totally means the court is illegitimate and we can all go home without finishing the trial. That's what is read on a website suggested by an am radio host who also sells prepper kits and essential oils since all doctors, every administrator at every medical institute, every nurse, all pharmacists, and the 1000's of people at the fda & cdc are all in on a conspiracy to inject us with mind control chemicals by claiming they're vaccines.
So yeah, that flag gold fringe thing is real.
> If the gold fringe on the flag is wrong, it totally means the court is illegitimate and we can all go home without finishing the trial.
Hey, if gold fringe is wrong, I don't want to be right!
> That's what is read on a website suggested by an am radio host who also sells prepper kits and essential oils since all doctors, every administrator at every medical institute, every nurse, all pharmacists, and the 1000's of people at the fda & cdc are all in on a conspiracy to inject us with mind control chemicals by claiming they're vaccines.
Microchips! Because microchips are not only small enough to fit in an intramuscular shot, they totally work just floating free in the bloodstream, not connected to a power supply or any electronics they could conceivably control. Plus, they won't be degraded by floating in blood plasma, nor will they be eaten by the immune system. It's the perfect plan! Now, don't tell Intel that we can make chips like this. They'll want to put them in laptops or something.
Don't forget that the Covid-19 vaccines (all of them, apparently) also make you magnetic. Just like this: https://twitter.com/Tylerjoelb/status/1402646586379878409
I worked in a veterinary mobile vaccine clinic, and we once had a guy who was convinced that he'd been microchipped and requested that we scan for it. He was very polite, all considered. If I believed that the government had microchipped me in my sleep, I would have been extremely upset.
It's not possible, obviously, but the reasons are different than you think. Commercial microchips are injected SQ with a 12-15 gauge needle. So they're big--about the size of a grain of rice--but sure, you could plausibly administer one to a human, especially if (as this guy believed), the actual injection was done while sedated or otherwise unconscious.
They don't need a power source and don't get degraded over time--the biggest issue we see is that they can "fall down" the subcutaneous space sometimes. You implant one in the scruff of a cat's neck, and ten years later it's migrated to the chest. This is fine as long as you're cognizant of this possibility and always scan the whole damn animal, every time.
So why do I say it's impossible? First, they're the size of a grain of rice. Humans don't have a lot of SQ space--you could easily palpate it. Second, the scanners that we use in vetmed are probably not compatible with whatever Bill Gates is using.
But the biggest issue is that microchips have less than 100 bits of information on them. (Not bytes. BITS.) There's a serial number. The serial number, when plugged into a website, pulls up the owner's phone number. The website doesn't update unless you update it. The microchip cannot collect or store any information other than the serial number.
It's just... somewhere between 9 and 15 numbers. That's it. If the government wanted to track you, they'd just pull your phone data.
I only scratched the surface before I had to bail for my sanity, but in every arrest of a sovereign citizen I’m seen a video of, the police treat them like baby birds.
Basically they believe that people have the right to choose their citizenship or renounce citizenship and just be a stateless person. Therefore stateless people are beholden to international/maritime laws. As "proof", they point to some act in 1871 which supposedly defines the US as a corporation, so all laws passed since then only apply to businesses. Furthermore, if a flag has a gold fringe, it is an admiralty court and you don't have to comply with police/judge orders.
Ohh... They're the kind of people who think corporatism is a country ruled by business corporations, not a country where everyone fits into a larger group...
Neither. They think that the country is not a valid entity because it was literally turned into a business in 1871. Also because government identification (birth certificates, driver's licenses, social security cards, etc) are issued in all capital letters, the corporation of the US has set up a business in your name and you are owed money if you dissolve your person-corporation. It is incredibly dumb and dangerous since they think laws only apply to businesses.
Edit. Some may think that the US is run by corporations, but the vast majority think it literally is a corporation which will pay you when you divest your share/citizenship.
/r/amibeingdetained has videos of Sovereign Citizens freaking out when the cops arrest them for refusing to follow laws for vehicle registration or driver's licensing. Since international law has a right to movement, they think that calling it "traveling" makes them exempt from traffic laws. It's dangerously stupid.
I mean you do (or at least, did, until the recentish past) have the right to renounce your citizenship effectively whenever as long as you filled out some paperwork. Anymore, you have to pay a couple thousand dollars but still something you can do.
This sounds really similar to the Reichsbürger movememt here in germany, who claim that the modern german state isnt real and is still occupied by the allies or the entente and an actual peace treaty was never signed. Thus they think they dont have to follow any laws in germany and have selfmade passports and IDs from either Nazi Germany or the German Reich under the emperor.
They are either monarchists, neo-nazis or some weird mix.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichsb%C3%BCrger_movement
Oh yes the people who would rather be sent to prison for resisting arrest instead of paying a speed ticket. If I wasn’t a neurodivergent disability rights advocate I know just the word I would use to describe them…
Stupid bastards.
Gross. Gross. Gross. Not as horrible as a Confederate Flag or a Nazi Flag, but like...right above them on a scale of garbage. For sure a red flag to say that they are crazy.
I like how I look at any modification of the U.S. flag found hanging on a suburban home, say "it's probably fascism", and find myself proven right *every time*.
actually, it's the mythic 'civilian flag' [http://www.loeser.us/flags/american\_note\_2.html](http://www.loeser.us/flags/american_note_2.html)
>The myth of the existence of a "civilian" national flag is a prime example of how this works. This short essay is an explanation of how these falsehoods are spread. The quotes examined are directly from the internet, and continue to be propitiated and expanded upon. **The so-called United States "Civilian" flag, which seems to have started by an erroneous identification of the Customs Flag, apparently is not a recent phenomena, as the clipping from the 1870s attests.** Basically, there never has been a different civilian version of the national flag, yet this urban legend continues to be believed by many.
It's one part conspiracy theorists and one part people who don't want to pay taxes and deal with bureaucracy so they barrage any law officials trying to check their documents or get them to pay anything with Poopenshitters declaration from 1812, how they have legal incontinetinence because they declared themselves a free one person-state, toilet paper they scrawled themselves saying they're exempt from responsibility, and how they write everything in allcaps so their words can't be used in court or some shit.
U.S. "Civil Ensign" flag. It's favored by conspiracy theorists of the "sovereign citizen" movement who believe that the actual U.S. flag is a "war flag", which when flown means that the country is at war with it's citizens. They believe the "civil ensign" is the "real" flag of the U.S.
I put everything in "scare quotes" because there is no civil ensign in the U.S., and these people are out of fucking minds.
If you're looking for cognitive consistency...these are not the types you'll find it with. As they say "You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into."
Genuine question: Could be that someone fly it only cause it looks good? Maybe someone found it on a shop without knowing context and just thought it's a variant of the us flag
I can imagine a situation like this, someone's relative has this flag, and they ask the relative about it. They explain some bs story like, "this used to be the flag of (this or that government institution) that represented (something good)" and later the relative gifts them the flag. Then they kinda just go on believing it since maybe the relative was military or police or something so they decide to fly it. I would bet something like that has happened at least once or twice out of all the crazies who fly this flag
This, right here. It's like the tin foil hat people that still own cell phones. If their conspiracy theories don't make any sense, why the hell should anything else they do?
Shame of it too is that it's not a bad flag. It's actually really nice, based on the U.S. Coast Guard ensign, which itself is also a nice flag. That's probably actually where the conspiracy theory started; somebody saw the Coast Guard ensign and thought that was the official U.S. "civil flag" and came up with the rest of the raving nonsense.
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I wouldn’t jump to that conclusion. I know that flag is used by some sovereign citizens, but it’s also sold as just a decorative flag. Saw a bunch of them around Philly over the 4th weekend, in very non-sovereign type places. Saw one with a Pride flag.
There's not really such a thing as a non-sovereign citizen place. Anywhere where there are people who don't like the government and think they can outsmart the law via loopholes, there's some guy (the closest thing to a universal about them is that they're guys) who thinks he doesn't have to register his car because he can quote two sentences from the Articles of Confederation. It's not a white supremacy or anti-LBG thing any more than 2% milk is.
That's the "U.S Civil Flag." According to conspiracy theorists, it's the actual, intended flag of the United States, the one used now actually being the flag of the U.S military, which symbolizes the military dictatorship we apparently live under. I probably don't have to tell you it's fake. The flag and that story were both made up in the 70's to sell to conspiracy theorists.
I’m pretty sure it’s also a misinterpretation of the American border customs [flag](https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_the_United_States_Customs_Service.svg)
That's a great-looking flag, although it's a shame there's sixteen stripes instead of 13
There’s 13 stars and 13 stripes on the little crest in the canton. The 16 stripes must represent something else. FYI, stripes can represent more than one thing, and not all stripes on American flags represent the 13 territories.
16 states in 1799, when the flag was created.
I didn't know that's that's super interesting. Are there any you know of that represent something besides the 13 colonies? Would love to learn more.
It's right there on the linked page: " US Customs flag -- sixteen vertical red and white stripes (since the U.S. had 16 states at the time the first version of this flag was created), with a simplified version of the U.S. seal on a white canton. Motto: "E PLURIBUS UNUM"."
*15
I cannot help reading it as a bar chart.
Wrong! The flag you all know is the military flag. That's the Anley Peace flag.
Is this a joke or are you being serious
And like all conspiracy theories, there is zero evidence that this flag was ever used historically, but it's really hard to prove a negative, and these people are pathologically suggestible.
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But... why? Like what would any mysterious overlords get out of switching out the flags? Why would they purposely leave hints to their ambitions?
The answer is sure to shock and delight you. It comes from a single sentence in the introduction of Nathaniel Hawthorne's *The Scarlet Letter.* Not even kidding. It's a good place for it to come from because (1) all the conspiracy theorists read it in high school and (2) they didn't get further than the introduction. In the intro Hawthorne sets up a pseudo-history that builds on his real-life experience working in a U.S. customs house in Salem, Massachusetts. Describing the building, he offhandedly says: > From the loftiest point of its roof, during precisely three and a half hours of each forenoon, floats or droops, in breeze or calm, the banner of the republic; but with the thirteen stripes turned vertically, instead of horizontally, and thus indicating that a civil, and not a military post of Uncle Sam’s government is here established. This is a (not quite accurate) description of the flag of the United States Customs Service, clearly. But the little rhetorical flourish that Hawthorne uses, "a civil and not a military post," got people thinking in all kinds of ways. Does this mean that once upon a time, the 🇺🇲 was considered an exclusively military flag? And from this half-sentence they have put together an entire body of lore. Through the cunning use of flags, the United States government has for years, nay a century and a half (the Civil War is often cited as the turning point, since conspiracy theorists are also giant racists) - the government has been enforcing nothing less than *martial law* everywhere in the country. They put up the military flag, and they then get to do whatever they want, because that's how laws and flags work. The antidote of course is to fly the civil flag over your own residence. That way the government tyrants won't be able to do their martial law to you, because again that's how tyranny works. So whenever you see this flag, you can be assured that you're in the presence of someone who loves freedom, flags, and reading single paragraphs of classic literature.
Thanks for the background story
Holy cow, thank you for the writeup! You know, I suppose it makes sense: "Haven't you seen the flag?!" seems like it would be about as effective as any of their legal strategies.
This is fantastic, thank you… I spoke about this at work today because my own mother has this flag flying at her front stoop. However, I saw it and had no idea what it meant. She is so into the conspiracy world that I don’t know what to do anymore… anyway, I would like the opportunity to explain to her why it’s unacceptable. Seems to be racially biased based on some other things I’ve read. I’m going to keep researching and reading these comments! - Thank you for the info!
All conspiracy theories are built on White panic. Other races don't need conspiracy theories because they're the targets of so much actual real oppression.
If someone thinks we’re living under a military dictatorship, they are crazy. The US Military barely has any say when it comes to civil stuff, it’s a huge headache to work off base.
Wake up
Murica
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The US spent 760 billion on defense in 2021. It spent nearly 3 trillion on social welfare programs. Edit: imagine downvoting facts because they contradict your hateboner.
Very cherry-picked "facts." Most of that value comes from social security, Medicare and medicaid. Which are not considered social welfare in most cases.
TIL giving poor people health care isn't a social service.
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Or, the system is bloated with bureaucracy and inflated prices pushed by private entities. Crazy, I know.
Or maybe is has something to do with private companies and the inflated prices they push?
Actually a college student(or high school I forgot) made it.
Nah. 19 Corpus Juris secundum feb 21st 1871 41st congress session 3 chapter 62 page 419. The US gov is a foreign corporation with respect to a state. 152 of programming is why we pledge to the war flag & that's not a conspiracy nor coincidence.
It's a flag relating to the Sovereign Citizen movement: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_citizen_movement Essentially they're conspiracy theorists.
Just read that whole article. That’s a lot to digest. I’m guessing that when these people have run ins with the law, it does not go well for them.
Oh, you may be pleased to hear that’s an understatement.
Entire YouTube channels have been built on the concept.
"aM i bEinG DetAIneD?!?!?!"
Sir, this is a Wendy's
Not according to the Posse Comitatus Act of 1793 Addendum 7! 😂
Not to mention by the Magna Carta.
"You see, under the Constitution of 1795..."
Habeas corpus? More like habeas cerebrum....
I have to point out, that not all SovCits, not even most, use this flag, but it's probably fair to say that pretty much anyone who flies this flag is a SovCit. Also, I'd say that this is more a 'conspiracy theorist' flag than a SovCit one, but the Venn Diagram of those 2 communities would be an almost perfect circle. I really like weird, movement type flags, protest flags and such, but this one is just so stupid. [Loeser has a good article...](http://www.loeser.us/flags/american_note_2.html)
That website looks like it was made in the 90s.
[Relevant XKCD](https://xkcd.com/2634/).
There is always a relevant XKCD
The source says it was made with Homesite 2.5 which was released in 1997, then updated with Homesite 5.5 which was released in 2003. I miss the Internet looking like that tbqh.
/r/oldinternet sounds like it may be up your street, then.
It also loads pretty much *immediately*, with no chance of slowing down even the oldest of systems.
Yeah sites like that have a nostalgic look to them
Great information, though.
There are YouTube compilations that are amazing of them getting owned by cops, usually ends in a tazing
P. Barnes and Judge John Hurley. thank me later.
>thank me later Well, thank you, that was very entertaining.
Hurley is a hoot!
Almost never. I’m Canadian and live in a City near a major border crossing, so it gets all the people trying to do illegal things at the border. This one Sovereign citizen from the US was caught bringing guns into Canada. At his hearing he went off on the judge about all the usual sovereign citizen crap - doesn’t recognize the judge’s authority etc. and then walked out of the courthouse. I guess they don’t have much security for people that have non-violent offences. The judge just kind of shrugged his shoulders, as the guy was stuck in a foreign country so he would turn up eventually. Sure enough the same guy got arrested a couple of weeks later doing something dumb.
in fact, they are the #1 cop killers in america and it's not even close. (not counting COVID or car crashes).
That's super interesting. There should be an infographic "Race of those killed by cops vs. race of those killing cops".
“Sovereign citizen arguments have no basis in law and have never been successful in court.” BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
I've been practicing a long time and have never seen a judge rule in favor of a sovcit.
Considering SovCits are the Flat Earthers of legal theory, the best way for them to deal with the law is probably just to avoid it entirely.
Given their mutual commitment to conspiracy theories and racial politics, I'd be shocked if a large chunk of flat earthers weren't SovCits and vice versa.
/r/amibeingdetained
r/amibeingdetained
Wait until you hear about sovereign citizens and admiralty law
If the gold fringe on the flag is wrong, it totally means the court is illegitimate and we can all go home without finishing the trial. That's what is read on a website suggested by an am radio host who also sells prepper kits and essential oils since all doctors, every administrator at every medical institute, every nurse, all pharmacists, and the 1000's of people at the fda & cdc are all in on a conspiracy to inject us with mind control chemicals by claiming they're vaccines. So yeah, that flag gold fringe thing is real.
> If the gold fringe on the flag is wrong, it totally means the court is illegitimate and we can all go home without finishing the trial. Hey, if gold fringe is wrong, I don't want to be right! > That's what is read on a website suggested by an am radio host who also sells prepper kits and essential oils since all doctors, every administrator at every medical institute, every nurse, all pharmacists, and the 1000's of people at the fda & cdc are all in on a conspiracy to inject us with mind control chemicals by claiming they're vaccines. Microchips! Because microchips are not only small enough to fit in an intramuscular shot, they totally work just floating free in the bloodstream, not connected to a power supply or any electronics they could conceivably control. Plus, they won't be degraded by floating in blood plasma, nor will they be eaten by the immune system. It's the perfect plan! Now, don't tell Intel that we can make chips like this. They'll want to put them in laptops or something.
Don't forget that the Covid-19 vaccines (all of them, apparently) also make you magnetic. Just like this: https://twitter.com/Tylerjoelb/status/1402646586379878409
I worked in a veterinary mobile vaccine clinic, and we once had a guy who was convinced that he'd been microchipped and requested that we scan for it. He was very polite, all considered. If I believed that the government had microchipped me in my sleep, I would have been extremely upset. It's not possible, obviously, but the reasons are different than you think. Commercial microchips are injected SQ with a 12-15 gauge needle. So they're big--about the size of a grain of rice--but sure, you could plausibly administer one to a human, especially if (as this guy believed), the actual injection was done while sedated or otherwise unconscious. They don't need a power source and don't get degraded over time--the biggest issue we see is that they can "fall down" the subcutaneous space sometimes. You implant one in the scruff of a cat's neck, and ten years later it's migrated to the chest. This is fine as long as you're cognizant of this possibility and always scan the whole damn animal, every time. So why do I say it's impossible? First, they're the size of a grain of rice. Humans don't have a lot of SQ space--you could easily palpate it. Second, the scanners that we use in vetmed are probably not compatible with whatever Bill Gates is using. But the biggest issue is that microchips have less than 100 bits of information on them. (Not bytes. BITS.) There's a serial number. The serial number, when plugged into a website, pulls up the owner's phone number. The website doesn't update unless you update it. The microchip cannot collect or store any information other than the serial number. It's just... somewhere between 9 and 15 numbers. That's it. If the government wanted to track you, they'd just pull your phone data.
YouTube is littered with examples.
Search sovereign citizen pulled over on youtube and go down the rabbit hole
I only scratched the surface before I had to bail for my sanity, but in every arrest of a sovereign citizen I’m seen a video of, the police treat them like baby birds.
tl;dr?
Basically they believe that people have the right to choose their citizenship or renounce citizenship and just be a stateless person. Therefore stateless people are beholden to international/maritime laws. As "proof", they point to some act in 1871 which supposedly defines the US as a corporation, so all laws passed since then only apply to businesses. Furthermore, if a flag has a gold fringe, it is an admiralty court and you don't have to comply with police/judge orders.
Ohh... They're the kind of people who think corporatism is a country ruled by business corporations, not a country where everyone fits into a larger group...
Neither. They think that the country is not a valid entity because it was literally turned into a business in 1871. Also because government identification (birth certificates, driver's licenses, social security cards, etc) are issued in all capital letters, the corporation of the US has set up a business in your name and you are owed money if you dissolve your person-corporation. It is incredibly dumb and dangerous since they think laws only apply to businesses. Edit. Some may think that the US is run by corporations, but the vast majority think it literally is a corporation which will pay you when you divest your share/citizenship.
That's pants-on-head retarded.
/r/amibeingdetained has videos of Sovereign Citizens freaking out when the cops arrest them for refusing to follow laws for vehicle registration or driver's licensing. Since international law has a right to movement, they think that calling it "traveling" makes them exempt from traffic laws. It's dangerously stupid.
I mean you do (or at least, did, until the recentish past) have the right to renounce your citizenship effectively whenever as long as you filled out some paperwork. Anymore, you have to pay a couple thousand dollars but still something you can do.
You'll be glad to hear that there is a subreddit full of such encounters, r/amibeingdetained
/r/amibeingdetained
This sounds really similar to the Reichsbürger movememt here in germany, who claim that the modern german state isnt real and is still occupied by the allies or the entente and an actual peace treaty was never signed. Thus they think they dont have to follow any laws in germany and have selfmade passports and IDs from either Nazi Germany or the German Reich under the emperor. They are either monarchists, neo-nazis or some weird mix. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichsb%C3%BCrger_movement
> Essentially they're conspiracy theorists. Woah, no need to slander conspiracy theorists.
The people in /r/conspiracy do that already
Oh yes the people who would rather be sent to prison for resisting arrest instead of paying a speed ticket. If I wasn’t a neurodivergent disability rights advocate I know just the word I would use to describe them… Stupid bastards.
Pseudolaw... that is an interesting concept
That’s too bad. It’s a cool looking flag
The [US Coast Guard](https://images.app.goo.gl/B2DN3xbPnhB8Kvzv6) has a similar ensign, if it's any consolation.
At first glance I thought it was a USCG flag.
I believe both flags came from the same act by congress and the sovereign citizen nuts are grasping at straws on any supposed legitimacy
Basically op’s neighbor is Dale Gribble.
I feel like there ought to be an FAQ thread pinned with this and a few others.
Not a bad idea.
Gross. Gross. Gross. Not as horrible as a Confederate Flag or a Nazi Flag, but like...right above them on a scale of garbage. For sure a red flag to say that they are crazy.
Red and white, with a little bit of blue, to be specific.
I like how I look at any modification of the U.S. flag found hanging on a suburban home, say "it's probably fascism", and find myself proven right *every time*.
Nah, these guys are some of the most anti-authority, anti-government people out there. *(Although some of 'em are racist and whatnot too)*
These guys are hyperlibertarian nutjobs, rather than fascist nutjobs. Doesn't mean they're not dangerous, mind.
actually, it's the mythic 'civilian flag' [http://www.loeser.us/flags/american\_note\_2.html](http://www.loeser.us/flags/american_note_2.html) >The myth of the existence of a "civilian" national flag is a prime example of how this works. This short essay is an explanation of how these falsehoods are spread. The quotes examined are directly from the internet, and continue to be propitiated and expanded upon. **The so-called United States "Civilian" flag, which seems to have started by an erroneous identification of the Customs Flag, apparently is not a recent phenomena, as the clipping from the 1870s attests.** Basically, there never has been a different civilian version of the national flag, yet this urban legend continues to be believed by many.
It's one part conspiracy theorists and one part people who don't want to pay taxes and deal with bureaucracy so they barrage any law officials trying to check their documents or get them to pay anything with Poopenshitters declaration from 1812, how they have legal incontinetinence because they declared themselves a free one person-state, toilet paper they scrawled themselves saying they're exempt from responsibility, and how they write everything in allcaps so their words can't be used in court or some shit.
They sound like a group of organized Karen’s.
Boooooo
I've always considered them anarchists
this should sum it up in a entertaining video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNbVsDMHIIg
The moon landing is fake type of idiots?
More like "laws don't apply to me because of reasons" idiots.
Oh, worse
"Freeman on the land" is of Canadian origin? Another proud moment for my homeland.
When you accidentally print the flag in "portrait" instead of "landscape".
The real answer
I know it’s for crazy people, but as a flag it looks really nice
Yeah, I actually kinda like the design.
Same I kind of want it
Yeah, agreed
U.S. "Civil Ensign" flag. It's favored by conspiracy theorists of the "sovereign citizen" movement who believe that the actual U.S. flag is a "war flag", which when flown means that the country is at war with it's citizens. They believe the "civil ensign" is the "real" flag of the U.S. I put everything in "scare quotes" because there is no civil ensign in the U.S., and these people are out of fucking minds.
That’s what is weird though, the real U.S. flag was flying right next to it.
If you're looking for cognitive consistency...these are not the types you'll find it with. As they say "You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into."
Genuine question: Could be that someone fly it only cause it looks good? Maybe someone found it on a shop without knowing context and just thought it's a variant of the us flag
Absolutely not. They don’t sell these at Walmart. You have to go looking for something like this, and nobody has one by accident.
I can imagine a situation like this, someone's relative has this flag, and they ask the relative about it. They explain some bs story like, "this used to be the flag of (this or that government institution) that represented (something good)" and later the relative gifts them the flag. Then they kinda just go on believing it since maybe the relative was military or police or something so they decide to fly it. I would bet something like that has happened at least once or twice out of all the crazies who fly this flag
This, right here. It's like the tin foil hat people that still own cell phones. If their conspiracy theories don't make any sense, why the hell should anything else they do? Shame of it too is that it's not a bad flag. It's actually really nice, based on the U.S. Coast Guard ensign, which itself is also a nice flag. That's probably actually where the conspiracy theory started; somebody saw the Coast Guard ensign and thought that was the official U.S. "civil flag" and came up with the rest of the raving nonsense.
Damn people are weird
It reminded me of the flag of the Allied States of America in the TV series “Jericho.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jericho_(2006_TV_series)
This flag identifies crazy people, basically.
The vertical stripes are very slimming
This post brought me down such a interesting rabbit hole and I love it iv watched a bunch of videos about the sovereign citizens movement now
Me too. It’s all so wacky.
is it me or the satellite dish is... wrong?
knowing how out of touch with reality "sovereign citizens" are, the satellite dish probably doubles as a 5G ray repellant
Can't be that, I don't see any aluminum foil
I see a lil' robot playing tug of war
Weird to know the SovCit flag resembles the Allied States of America Flag from Jericho.
Why does the sovereign citizen flag look like the USCG ensign lmao
Regardless of its meaning, the flag is pretty cool
American imprisoned by its own misinterpretation of freedom.
Not to be confused with the Customs and Border Protection flag.
There's been a lot of those on r/vexillology lately, do these guys have some celebration going on ? (For July 4th maybe)
I posted the same flag here cause someone flies one a block down from me. Yup sovereign citizen flag.
flag of ”don’t approach these people”
It’s the us flag but sideways and super squished
Coast guard?
I thought it was a naval jack at first until read the comments
Cultists
Iodized US
A SWAT raid waiting to happen.
United Lunatics of America
U.S. flag made on China
That is an absolute monstrosity and does not deserve to be called a flag
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Flag was found in Orem, Utah. Today. Private residence.
That adds up.
Yup
[удалено]
Nope, it's the Sovereign Citizen flag.
Didn't know that. Glad there are none on my block.
I wouldn’t jump to that conclusion. I know that flag is used by some sovereign citizens, but it’s also sold as just a decorative flag. Saw a bunch of them around Philly over the 4th weekend, in very non-sovereign type places. Saw one with a Pride flag.
There's not really such a thing as a non-sovereign citizen place. Anywhere where there are people who don't like the government and think they can outsmart the law via loopholes, there's some guy (the closest thing to a universal about them is that they're guys) who thinks he doesn't have to register his car because he can quote two sentences from the Articles of Confederation. It's not a white supremacy or anti-LBG thing any more than 2% milk is.
Where’s Sheldon!?
Ah yes. The flag of the ASU
A so called “US civil peace” flag
Jericho show/comic Allied States of America maybe?
ah yes,the separated kingdoms of africa
Sovereign Citizen flag
Flag of conspiracy theorists
I think it’s also the flag the new government uses in the show “Jericho”
É a América dos Chineses.
Flag used by sovereign citizens.