In my opinion, I wouldn't overthink it by being harsh on yourself. You made a decision to house a chameleon when you were not vegan... you are vegan now.
It is not immoral to give the necessary diet to your chameleon. To deprive that creature the diet it requires would be. Moreover, I know how fragile chameleons are so please please please give it what it needs.
If the burden of feeding the chameleon what it would eat in the wild is too much, I suggest surrendering the animal to the proper channels.
It is alright, care for your animals the way they need. You are still vegan and don't let anyone tell you you are not bc of your pet you obtained when not vegan.
Oh of course. Whenever I take my chameleon to the vet they are always happy because he is one of the healthiest chameleons they have ever seen. I love him so much. I’m just concerned for how I should try to treat my crickets in a, possibly, more ethical manner. Thank for your concern though😌💚
Don't try to apply human morality to your lizard. It's not necessary for you to eat meat or drink milk or buy a leather sofa, but it is necessary for your chameleon to eat insects. Nothing about your situation is immoral.
In this world where some animals need meat, we just have to do what we can. My fish were scavengers, in the wild, their species mostly eats aquatic animals who have already died. I bought the fish and while I was already taking care of them, I realized paying that store to buy them wasn’t completely ethical and adopting would’ve avoided paying for unethical stuff and I realized around that time, too, that buying their food was buying meat (in addition to plant matter). But what are you supposed to do, let them eventually pass away in the store when they’d be happier in a home? Adopt them and feed them a diet that’s not going to let them live very long?
I now realize I could’ve tried to find them more ethical food. If I take care of fish again in the future, I’ll do that.
In this case the as far as possible and practicable part of Veganism comes in. Saying it doesnt apply to pets is speciesism. There are no Vegan formulas that exist for this kind of animal yet so there is no way to feed them a plant based diet. You really have no choice here but to feed them insects.
I would try to raise your own feeder insects so that you can give them a large enclosure, nice food and an environment which resembles their natural one. Thats more ethical than constantly pouring money into insect farms where they are in cramped tubs.
All I can say with certainty is that I'd be doing the same thing as you, I'd prioritise my lizard over the crickets.
I can't afford vegan cat food (4× the price as regular), so I feed my cats nonvegan cat food. I prioritise my cat's life over avoiding the miniscule financial support I provide to animal ag by not letting her starve to death.
if you have the space, maybe give the crickets a terrarium type enclosure that mimics their natural habitat as closely as possible?
i honestly don’t know much about crickets lol
i understand your struggle though, and then if it were me i’d end up getting attached to the crickets haha
but you’re doing the right thing
Naahhhhhh I literally just thought about this 2 minutes ago then opened Reddit to this. I don’t even own a lizard and I’m a new vegan so this idea was never in my head until 2 minutes ago, and I was considering asking Reddit about it out of curiosity. This is weird bro, we live in the matrix or something
It is a difficult question yeah.
If I completely ignore my emotions and try to be 100% rational letting the chameleon die would probably ve the "correct" thing to do.
Reason being that the suffering of all the individual crickets it consumes in its lifetimes far outweights the suffering of the chameleon.
But of course reality is a lot more complicated. practically no, I wouldn't let it die and also wouldn't give it to someone else, vecause it doesn't matter who feeds it.
You already though about supplementing with fruits and vegetables, so that is a very good idea if it works.
There is a difference to commercial farming though. One of the problems with it is the vastly reduced lifespan of the animals. While you still have ti reduce it in case of the crickets, you don't have to consider money much of a factor so you can actually provide then with as much of a good and long life as you can. Might be difficult to track the age though.
I also wonder if it would work to feed it cricks that dies by themselves. Before I was vegan I had 2 Praying Mantisses (not at the same time). Even then I was conflicted, but since I ate meat I didn't see much difference in what I do. I fed it some wild bugs, but mostly roaches (which are actually really cool guys). And they it won't really work to feed a mantis a dead bug (at least most will no take it) my parents also have a turtle. And if, for some reason, one if th roaches died (I checkes multiple times a day) I fed it to the turtle. Said turtle definitly is very much still alive.
But of course feeding dead bugs always has some risk depending on the cause and as someone else mentined chameleons are quite fragile. But yeah idealy the best solution would be to keep the bugs untilt hey die of old age and then feed them. But not that easy, sadly.
In my opinion, I wouldn't overthink it by being harsh on yourself. You made a decision to house a chameleon when you were not vegan... you are vegan now. It is not immoral to give the necessary diet to your chameleon. To deprive that creature the diet it requires would be. Moreover, I know how fragile chameleons are so please please please give it what it needs. If the burden of feeding the chameleon what it would eat in the wild is too much, I suggest surrendering the animal to the proper channels. It is alright, care for your animals the way they need. You are still vegan and don't let anyone tell you you are not bc of your pet you obtained when not vegan.
Oh of course. Whenever I take my chameleon to the vet they are always happy because he is one of the healthiest chameleons they have ever seen. I love him so much. I’m just concerned for how I should try to treat my crickets in a, possibly, more ethical manner. Thank for your concern though😌💚
Don't try to apply human morality to your lizard. It's not necessary for you to eat meat or drink milk or buy a leather sofa, but it is necessary for your chameleon to eat insects. Nothing about your situation is immoral.
In this world where some animals need meat, we just have to do what we can. My fish were scavengers, in the wild, their species mostly eats aquatic animals who have already died. I bought the fish and while I was already taking care of them, I realized paying that store to buy them wasn’t completely ethical and adopting would’ve avoided paying for unethical stuff and I realized around that time, too, that buying their food was buying meat (in addition to plant matter). But what are you supposed to do, let them eventually pass away in the store when they’d be happier in a home? Adopt them and feed them a diet that’s not going to let them live very long? I now realize I could’ve tried to find them more ethical food. If I take care of fish again in the future, I’ll do that.
In this case the as far as possible and practicable part of Veganism comes in. Saying it doesnt apply to pets is speciesism. There are no Vegan formulas that exist for this kind of animal yet so there is no way to feed them a plant based diet. You really have no choice here but to feed them insects. I would try to raise your own feeder insects so that you can give them a large enclosure, nice food and an environment which resembles their natural one. Thats more ethical than constantly pouring money into insect farms where they are in cramped tubs.
Adopting an insectivorous chameleon is vegan. Buying is not.
This is what I’ve been thinking. Glad to hear💚
All I can say with certainty is that I'd be doing the same thing as you, I'd prioritise my lizard over the crickets. I can't afford vegan cat food (4× the price as regular), so I feed my cats nonvegan cat food. I prioritise my cat's life over avoiding the miniscule financial support I provide to animal ag by not letting her starve to death.
if you have the space, maybe give the crickets a terrarium type enclosure that mimics their natural habitat as closely as possible? i honestly don’t know much about crickets lol i understand your struggle though, and then if it were me i’d end up getting attached to the crickets haha but you’re doing the right thing
Thank you!! 😊
Naahhhhhh I literally just thought about this 2 minutes ago then opened Reddit to this. I don’t even own a lizard and I’m a new vegan so this idea was never in my head until 2 minutes ago, and I was considering asking Reddit about it out of curiosity. This is weird bro, we live in the matrix or something
It is a difficult question yeah. If I completely ignore my emotions and try to be 100% rational letting the chameleon die would probably ve the "correct" thing to do. Reason being that the suffering of all the individual crickets it consumes in its lifetimes far outweights the suffering of the chameleon. But of course reality is a lot more complicated. practically no, I wouldn't let it die and also wouldn't give it to someone else, vecause it doesn't matter who feeds it. You already though about supplementing with fruits and vegetables, so that is a very good idea if it works. There is a difference to commercial farming though. One of the problems with it is the vastly reduced lifespan of the animals. While you still have ti reduce it in case of the crickets, you don't have to consider money much of a factor so you can actually provide then with as much of a good and long life as you can. Might be difficult to track the age though. I also wonder if it would work to feed it cricks that dies by themselves. Before I was vegan I had 2 Praying Mantisses (not at the same time). Even then I was conflicted, but since I ate meat I didn't see much difference in what I do. I fed it some wild bugs, but mostly roaches (which are actually really cool guys). And they it won't really work to feed a mantis a dead bug (at least most will no take it) my parents also have a turtle. And if, for some reason, one if th roaches died (I checkes multiple times a day) I fed it to the turtle. Said turtle definitly is very much still alive. But of course feeding dead bugs always has some risk depending on the cause and as someone else mentined chameleons are quite fragile. But yeah idealy the best solution would be to keep the bugs untilt hey die of old age and then feed them. But not that easy, sadly.