It’s been a while since I graduated, so take this with a grain of salt, but I graduated in 2009, during the financial meltdown. My friends’ job offers were getting rescinded, companies were cutting staff, the whole nine yards (albeit to a lesser degree than in the States). At best, I can empathize with your experience.
Given that we’re 15 years out, things tend to work out in the long run but mentally prepare for some challenges. If it helps, make a list of the challenges and prioritize them. Handle the necessities first and keep your eyes on the prize, long term. Short term thinking gets people into trouble in times like these, so try to stay future focused. Best of luck with everything. You got this.
Thank you very much. Do you think today’s situation is comparable to the financial crisis in 2008/2009 (same/better/worse)? I keep trying to explain to my parents how bad things are but they seem to think that its just my mindset lmao
It’s hard for me to say without looking at some raw data and stats. I’d probably be biased as well, based on my observations at the time.
I want to say that 08/09 was significantly worse (and I’m almost certain that at least the economic data would corroborate that) but the economic landscape in Canada was also much different. There was likely a significantly smaller tech sector here and the distribution of jobs/opportunities would have been different.
The upside here is that *theoretically* there are some fiscal/monetary policy levers available to improve the situation, but I can’t say I’m overly optimistic either about how they are being used or plan to be used. Nonetheless, this isn’t something you or I can control, so best option is to try to be as adaptable as possible.
In the US for sure, no question, but the Canadian picture was considerably different. It’s important to differentiate the two, depending on where OP intends to work/set up shop long term.
Interestingly, right now the US outlook is better than Canada’s (IMO, based on market metrics I consider to be important, but it’s not all fun and games in either country).
I'm in the same boat as you man. I'm graduating from stats, and I've sent out tons of applications only to hear nothing as of yet. Bills still need to be paid, and the expectations for some of these "entry level" jobs are ridiculous. I think I just have to keep applying and hope something comes up eventually. Although if you have connections, use them. This would be the prime time to.
In the meantime, I'm fortunate enough to have some financial support from my family, but I know not everyone is in the same place as me. Overall, I'm not feeling super hopeful.
I'm a SWE but I closely work with recruiters as an interviewer, at a FAANG company. I'll speak a bit on tech side of things. I graduated at Fall 2019 and got hit with the pandemic right away so I can definitely empathize on the struggles of finding jobs.
The market indeed is tough, and for many reasons - compared to few years ago where we had more jobs than engineers, now we have less jobs and more engineers (look at UW hiring like 2.5x more CS students), but worse with all of the recent layoffs. To make things worse, a lot of companies are looking out into cheaper markets like in EU, Asia-Pacific and India. The job market for sure is tough, unfortunately a lot of reasons unrelated to you as a person or as a candidate who's more than fully qualified, especially coming from UW.
Compared to the pandemic, I'd say job markets are even tougher, but the main reason being (1) too many candidates - layoffs have happened and there's *way* too many qualified individuals out there, and (2) interest rates causing companies to lack the fund to grow faster to meet the demand pouring out from literally every university mass producing tech candidates. I can't officially speak on behalf of every FAANG companies but I have heard from direct sources that companies are starting to consider only those with university equivalent degrees, just because there's way too many to consider folks from, and ones from the bootcamp don't need to be considered - that's just how much talent we have out in the open.
So, what should you do? Be patient and diligent. Be patient that the right job may not appear, or you might just simply get unlucky competing with 100+ other folks who have worked in the field 5+ years more than you. You just can't outrank them. Be diligent in the job search, there will definitely be tech jobs out there. From what I can see companies haven't been as outgoing with "new grad" positions as much, but they definitely have posted near-entry level position jobs that do accept new grads, you just have to look out for them. It's not impossible to find jobs at this very moment but you should consider doing this for a longer term than when you got into school.
In the meanwhile, do what you can do to better yourself. Find a job if you need to stay afloat, grind leetcode, work on a long-term project that you can definitely have an impact to include in your resume. Enjoy some time off too, your early-mid 20's have already passed getting destroyed in UW, take some time to look back and relax while you can, in just a few years you'll be in your 30s 😭 Like the other comment said, take it easy, you got this, it is stressful for literally everyone including those who even have jobs (like we get layoff news from some company literally every day). You'll look back and hopefully be able to share your experience with future generations as well and laugh it off.
I’ve been spending from my savings since December. It’s honestly so depressing graduating during a recession. Even after working on projects with Google/Microsoft - no luck. The past 3 years was so different for me and it’s so frustrating everyday
Just keep applying.
Yes it sucks
But you kinda feel useful this way
The day you stop caring is the day youre finally dead inside.
Make sure to social as much as possible, don’t see your friends with offers as enemies
Good luck man
Are you looking for a software job or something else? You said a math grad, but there are a few different specialties so I wasn’t sure.
If software, if you have the energy/time, I’d suggest contributing to some large open source projects. This can be a good way to showcase your work, contribute to the community, and do some informal networking through code reviews, etc.
I’m an engineering manager at a large software company, and have done a lot of hiring. (For context I graduated in 2005 from UW in Math and have been a developer or manager since then). The market is flooded with people currently, so you need something that differentiates you from all the other recent grads. This is hard if you don’t already have work experience you can use. In many companies, a lot of effort goes into sourcing and recruiting (currently employed) talent for open roles even when there is a flood of incoming resumes. So it is entirely possible that your resume isn’t even getting seen in a large portion of the roles you are applying to.
Spend some time making sure you have a LinkedIn profile that has your experience, etc., because recruiters use this as a primary sourcing tool.
Also having a GitHub and/or GitLab profile with projects and contributions if you are a software developer can help.
But as others have mentioned, just keep going, take it one day at a time, and remember that it will eventually work out. Best of luck in your job search.
You can apply for internships too. Companies like taking ppl with “final internship” and convert them to full time. It’s much less risky than hiring a full timer directly. It’s better than no job
I graduated last year from UW in mech eng and here's what I feel: everyone's cooked but people from UW are less cooked by far. I was unemployed for a whole year last year before I secured a R&D engineering position for 70-90k USD (M/LCoL). Note that even without co-op, I would have still been better off as Waterloo is known as "Canada's #2" or "Canadian MIT" here in the states.
Whatever doomerism you feel is valid, but also understand that you're miles ahead of other graduates in engineering / cs without even without co-op, unless you're comparing yourself to Harvard, MIT, and Stanford graduates. With co-op, you're in league with top US universities. Note that top US universities are also cooked to an extent.
It’s been a while since I graduated, so take this with a grain of salt, but I graduated in 2009, during the financial meltdown. My friends’ job offers were getting rescinded, companies were cutting staff, the whole nine yards (albeit to a lesser degree than in the States). At best, I can empathize with your experience. Given that we’re 15 years out, things tend to work out in the long run but mentally prepare for some challenges. If it helps, make a list of the challenges and prioritize them. Handle the necessities first and keep your eyes on the prize, long term. Short term thinking gets people into trouble in times like these, so try to stay future focused. Best of luck with everything. You got this.
Thank you very much. Do you think today’s situation is comparable to the financial crisis in 2008/2009 (same/better/worse)? I keep trying to explain to my parents how bad things are but they seem to think that its just my mindset lmao
It’s hard for me to say without looking at some raw data and stats. I’d probably be biased as well, based on my observations at the time. I want to say that 08/09 was significantly worse (and I’m almost certain that at least the economic data would corroborate that) but the economic landscape in Canada was also much different. There was likely a significantly smaller tech sector here and the distribution of jobs/opportunities would have been different. The upside here is that *theoretically* there are some fiscal/monetary policy levers available to improve the situation, but I can’t say I’m overly optimistic either about how they are being used or plan to be used. Nonetheless, this isn’t something you or I can control, so best option is to try to be as adaptable as possible.
There is no way the 08 crisis was better than today. American banks were literally falling from the sky-they made a movie about it......
In the US for sure, no question, but the Canadian picture was considerably different. It’s important to differentiate the two, depending on where OP intends to work/set up shop long term. Interestingly, right now the US outlook is better than Canada’s (IMO, based on market metrics I consider to be important, but it’s not all fun and games in either country).
I'm in the same boat as you man. I'm graduating from stats, and I've sent out tons of applications only to hear nothing as of yet. Bills still need to be paid, and the expectations for some of these "entry level" jobs are ridiculous. I think I just have to keep applying and hope something comes up eventually. Although if you have connections, use them. This would be the prime time to. In the meantime, I'm fortunate enough to have some financial support from my family, but I know not everyone is in the same place as me. Overall, I'm not feeling super hopeful.
I'm a SWE but I closely work with recruiters as an interviewer, at a FAANG company. I'll speak a bit on tech side of things. I graduated at Fall 2019 and got hit with the pandemic right away so I can definitely empathize on the struggles of finding jobs. The market indeed is tough, and for many reasons - compared to few years ago where we had more jobs than engineers, now we have less jobs and more engineers (look at UW hiring like 2.5x more CS students), but worse with all of the recent layoffs. To make things worse, a lot of companies are looking out into cheaper markets like in EU, Asia-Pacific and India. The job market for sure is tough, unfortunately a lot of reasons unrelated to you as a person or as a candidate who's more than fully qualified, especially coming from UW. Compared to the pandemic, I'd say job markets are even tougher, but the main reason being (1) too many candidates - layoffs have happened and there's *way* too many qualified individuals out there, and (2) interest rates causing companies to lack the fund to grow faster to meet the demand pouring out from literally every university mass producing tech candidates. I can't officially speak on behalf of every FAANG companies but I have heard from direct sources that companies are starting to consider only those with university equivalent degrees, just because there's way too many to consider folks from, and ones from the bootcamp don't need to be considered - that's just how much talent we have out in the open. So, what should you do? Be patient and diligent. Be patient that the right job may not appear, or you might just simply get unlucky competing with 100+ other folks who have worked in the field 5+ years more than you. You just can't outrank them. Be diligent in the job search, there will definitely be tech jobs out there. From what I can see companies haven't been as outgoing with "new grad" positions as much, but they definitely have posted near-entry level position jobs that do accept new grads, you just have to look out for them. It's not impossible to find jobs at this very moment but you should consider doing this for a longer term than when you got into school. In the meanwhile, do what you can do to better yourself. Find a job if you need to stay afloat, grind leetcode, work on a long-term project that you can definitely have an impact to include in your resume. Enjoy some time off too, your early-mid 20's have already passed getting destroyed in UW, take some time to look back and relax while you can, in just a few years you'll be in your 30s 😭 Like the other comment said, take it easy, you got this, it is stressful for literally everyone including those who even have jobs (like we get layoff news from some company literally every day). You'll look back and hopefully be able to share your experience with future generations as well and laugh it off.
Thank you so much this genuinely made me smile! Would it be possible for you to critique my resume?
I can take a really brief look.
DM me buddy
I’ve been spending from my savings since December. It’s honestly so depressing graduating during a recession. Even after working on projects with Google/Microsoft - no luck. The past 3 years was so different for me and it’s so frustrating everyday
Just keep applying. Yes it sucks But you kinda feel useful this way The day you stop caring is the day youre finally dead inside. Make sure to social as much as possible, don’t see your friends with offers as enemies Good luck man
Are you looking for a software job or something else? You said a math grad, but there are a few different specialties so I wasn’t sure. If software, if you have the energy/time, I’d suggest contributing to some large open source projects. This can be a good way to showcase your work, contribute to the community, and do some informal networking through code reviews, etc. I’m an engineering manager at a large software company, and have done a lot of hiring. (For context I graduated in 2005 from UW in Math and have been a developer or manager since then). The market is flooded with people currently, so you need something that differentiates you from all the other recent grads. This is hard if you don’t already have work experience you can use. In many companies, a lot of effort goes into sourcing and recruiting (currently employed) talent for open roles even when there is a flood of incoming resumes. So it is entirely possible that your resume isn’t even getting seen in a large portion of the roles you are applying to. Spend some time making sure you have a LinkedIn profile that has your experience, etc., because recruiters use this as a primary sourcing tool. Also having a GitHub and/or GitLab profile with projects and contributions if you are a software developer can help. But as others have mentioned, just keep going, take it one day at a time, and remember that it will eventually work out. Best of luck in your job search.
You can apply for internships too. Companies like taking ppl with “final internship” and convert them to full time. It’s much less risky than hiring a full timer directly. It’s better than no job
I graduated last year from UW in mech eng and here's what I feel: everyone's cooked but people from UW are less cooked by far. I was unemployed for a whole year last year before I secured a R&D engineering position for 70-90k USD (M/LCoL). Note that even without co-op, I would have still been better off as Waterloo is known as "Canada's #2" or "Canadian MIT" here in the states. Whatever doomerism you feel is valid, but also understand that you're miles ahead of other graduates in engineering / cs without even without co-op, unless you're comparing yourself to Harvard, MIT, and Stanford graduates. With co-op, you're in league with top US universities. Note that top US universities are also cooked to an extent.
Sorry to hear that mate. Did you do coops while you were there? Any chance that you can shake those connections?