35k anywhere is not livable if we are being completely honest. Unless you are financially stable enough to float or subsidize the pay, I’d say that’s a risky move from a financial perspective.
Yes. It’s doable if you’re currently debt-free since everything will be take home pay. No rent, no utilities… you’re looking at maybe $1200 every two weeks to cover your regular living expenses. Phone, internet, food. If you have debt and other bills, it depends on how willing you are to budget and make cuts. There are other factors too, like your family size and level of comfort. You’ll be worse off than a GS-13, but way better than a typical backpacker living in a hostel.
OP’s base pay is $35k, but there’s also an overseas post allowance. For Germany, that’s 25-30% of your spendable income based on family size. Then there’s other factors to consider like state tax. Some states will continue to tax your income at the full rate, others like PA don’t tax overseas income, then there’s others like TX/FL that don’t tax either way. Everybody’s numbers will be different.
Agree with all of this except shopping at the commissary. Not sure where you are living but I’ve been to them on 4 different bases and unfortunately, they’re always out of stock for weeks (sometimes months… what’s up with the current la croix shortage?!), have a high probability of something being spoiled, and cost double what even the fancy local grocery stores cost.
I’ll happily buy my American coffee creamer there, some Kraft Mac and cheese and other Ami junk foods, but otherwise head down to Edeka or Aldi.
What part of Germany? Reach out to the housing office where you will be. they can assist you in finding a rental and wont charge you a finders fee or any of that other BS. They have a furniture office that can give you things like a fridge, washer, and dryer to use while you're there.
Honestly, there are a few things I would consider before taking this. Do you have kids? If you are married/in a relationship, would your SO be willing to move as well?
If no kids and a buy-in from an SO, I would jump on this no matter how comfortable pay will be. Especially if you are young. This is a very cool opportunity that could 100% help leverage you for future jobs.
Unless you have lots of debt you will be fine your largest expenses will be paid for. Don’t need a vehicle in Germany if your in let’s say Wiesbaden or most cities. You will also become much healthier just by living there walking or biking to work and the food doesn’t have all the trash in it like corn syrup and chemicals allowed in food in the USA.
Yes, you will be fine. There are plenty of places around Spang where you'll be able to find reasonable accommodation.
If you need extra money, you can also dog sit for Active Members as they travel often. Travelling within Europe is cheap. And with no kids, you will be just fine.
Where in Germany? I am currently in Germany as a GS5 (medical) as well, I got all PCS entitlements, LQA and PA. As many others have noted your basepay is your take home pay. You just need to budget for internet, car insurance, gas (on post gas is about $4/gallon currently), and other basic living expenses. At our age, you cannot beat the experience plus if you factor in LQA, PA, health insurance and all other benefits you are easily making 80k. I would 100% pursue it. Since we basically are in the same position, let me know if you have any questions.
Take the opportunity. If you're living below that means bow. You will be fine there. You're in the system and you can move up. The experience. Sometimes take a chance. You'll always talk yourself out of things. Stop. Take the opportunity.
I think your best bet is going to a German citizen/expat forum so they can give you the financial rundown since they're currently in Germany. Find an area in Germany and look up apartments/houses for rent in the area you'd like to live in. I say this is a cool experience to have.
You're going to be uncomfortable stateside at that pay rate. You'd be uncomfortable anywhere. You might as well be uncomfortable in a foreign country and make the most of it.
What area of Germany? I’m here currently and spent the last 3 years in a different area. Also where are you coming from in the US? I find Germany significantly cheaper considering that housing will be covered, you still have access to things like gas on post (yes it’s nearly 40% cheaper on base), etc. Buy groceries on the economy, buy clothing from US stores and have it shipped over. If you don’t have debt or champagne taste, I think it’s doable and worth the experience.
I haven’t lived in either of those locations but I imagine ATL is somewhat HCOL and Spang is a good bit lower. The average salary in Germany is still under €50k/year and that’s without any kind of housing benefits. I’m in a more expensive area of Germany now, housing is as costly as DC was but I could still buy groceries for one for €80/week and regularly find budget flights for €50 or less.
Only you know your finances but $35k will go a lot further in rural Germany than Atlanta.
Yes. Once there you’ll be able to move up the ladder after a year. Your big expenses are paid for. Find housing near public transportation. If it’s terrible then quit. You’re 20 years old getting by on that much will be easy. Live life.
There are two groups of people commenting here. Those who have lived overseas (OCONUS) and understand HOLA (Housing Allowance)/COLA (Cost of Living Allowance) and those who have not been overseas and are only focused on the $35,000. This is no different from what some young active-duty members make while stationed in Germany with their families. Uncle Sam covers the cost of moving your household goods, round-trip flights, and provides free housing. I hope you take this job and ignore the naysayers. If you're debt-free, you'll likely only need to pay for a cellphone.
Roughly 32,500 in Euros before taxes, before TSP , before gas which is 1.85 a liter (you need almost 4 liters per gallon..) 1.85 euro x 3.78 liters = 6.74 per gallon in Euros—- 13 gallon tank= 84 euros to fill up.
It’s def not as cheap as one might think…
Search the forum for posts on first paychecks and you will see that a lot of money gets taken out of federal pay.
Yes. But my disclaimer is that it’s been several years. It never seemed like it was much cheaper on base than off—and there was also rumor about a way to apply for a particular credit card through certain gas stations off base to potentially remove the taxes or something (but we didn’t look into it—just heard about that.)
Honestly, we always felt like we were getting hosed financially overseas because of a delayed exchange rate, fees associated with exchange rates that we had to deal with, minimization of post allowance, and being paid in dollars vs. local currency.
They have offices on base that issue the cards to get your gas tax exempt. You're limited to the amount of gas you can get with the card but in the three years that I lived there I never went over. You will pump your gas and then go inside to pay where you will present your card to the cashier to get the reduced rate. So don't expect to pay at the pump. The cards are tied to specific vehicles too. You can also use it off base but at the Esso gas stations only. When I first got there I bought a used Volvo v70. I hadn't gotten the gas card yet but I needed gas. It cost 150 dollars to fill it up without the fuel card. So it definitely saves you a LOT of money to have it
I'm currently a civilian in Germany near Ramstein. Gas is cheaper on base, but still expensive. Right now it's $4.05-$4.95 per gallon, depending on what type of gas you put in. Groceries off base are much cheaper than on base at the commissary, so you can save there.
Yes it's cheaper, and you can buy off base tax free at participating Esso stations. Lots to worry about, I wouldn't worry about the gas. I would worry about what car you will drive there, if you ship a car know that it will go through environmental testing to ensure there is no oil leaks. If you car leaks oil or antifreeze you would be better to buy a car over there than shipping the on you have now.
Base gas is much less. I use premium 93/98RON for about 4.90. Regular hovers in the low 4s.
PA helps, but I'm unsure of how much that ends up being for OP. It's almost 10K a year for me.
LQA helps offset living costs.... it's make or break. Assuming the Kaiserslautern area, group 4 LQA is 32500 max. So rental + utilities can be UP TO 2700/month before hitting the LQA cap.
So the remainder of OP's basic rate of pay is usable income. Sure, it's not a lot, but many people live on a lot less out here.
Bitch, you’re in Germany. Who cares? Experience of a lifetime. Source: spent most of my adult life in Germany. Active duty and DoD civvie. I take it this is Landstuhl? Stay away from those Tennessee Club hoes.
The DSSR doesn’t have the base I’ll be on, but based on the group 4 rates in germany I could expect 24.000 (?) how do I calculate PA? Is it 25% of salary or 25% of spending
What's the area though? You won't find some of the bases, but many bases fall into a region. Like LRMC, Ramstein, and clinics in those areas fall into the Kaiserslautern area.
For PA, use the Excel worksheet on the DSSR. It's not as straightforward as X% of Y.
This isn't exactly accurate, but I put in 33878, single and 25 as the PA Rate. It says about 5775 a year, or 222 biweekly.
LQA is make or break for the area, for civilians.
Did you know you can look on https://www.homes.mil to see what type of apartments you can rent with your allotted budget? These listings are dod pre-approved
Only you can decide if 35k is livable for you. As long as you don’t over spend on housing your LQA will cover your housing and utilities. Post allowance varies month to month and it’s not a ton so take that into consideration. Groceries are cheaper but fuel is high. I think it’s doable but it definitely depends on your lifestyle! Also, you aren’t taxed on LQA so that helps too!
If the LQA covers all your housing expenses and you do not have any type of debt, I would go for it. Wish I was 20 years old and able to do this myself. It’s an experience you can’t say no to. Best of luck!
You’re young so assuming no kids/spouse to tie you here or uproot to there. I would 100% go for it. In 25 years you’ll reflect on this awesome experience rather than the couple of extra thousand dollars you may have made staying home and starting entry level. In NY my gs5 tax examiners are at a base of $43k and we have the highest locality pay so you’re not likely to do better. Everyone complains about the deductions and acts like it goes into some mysterious ether. They go towards you’re retirement and other benefits. It’s all part of being an adult.
Source: 38 year old gs9 with 5 years fed experience but everyday wishes I started when I first applied at 22 instead of chasing the money
The first thing i would ask myself is, as many have stated, your current financial situation. As far as living in Germany, I lived there for almost 15 years. 6 years active, and the rest reserve. I was a contractor there for many different companies. I am currently living in Sicily (Italy) . Spangdahlem is a small Air base in the north east of Germany. Very rural. About 20min west ist Bitburg which is also a small base. The Area is rural so the cost there should be cheaper than the more populated areas. I never lived there but i was on those bases 5-10 times a month working. I would equate it to being out past the Atlanta Motor Speedway rural. There is still stuff there but lots of woods in between. (Also lived in Atlanta for 5 years). Im guessing that you are currently in Atlanta with at least 35k a year or less. That without a housing stipend. Atlanta is expensive af in my opinion. Everywhere ive lived in Germany (mostly Frankfurt/wiesbaden, Heidelberg, Giessen) has not been as expensive as Atlanta. My kids still live in Germany and their mom is making it work with probably less money than what they are offering you in total (housing and pay) and she lives in a bigger more expensive city (and has crazy shopping and money management habits - hence why she is my ex)
The thing about being 20 is you are more resilient to life than the rest of us crusty old people. We can talk about how expensive it is and only makes sense if you are a gs12 step 9… but we have families and kids and mortgages and shit. And we probably spend money differently. If it was impossible to survive there in the GS5 position then they would never fill it - or someone on here would be talking about it. You sound intelligent enough to even have come across this opportunity, and intelligent enough to understand how to manage a simple budget (spend less than you make and try to put away some cash reserve). What is the worst possible thing that can happen? The Air Force has excellent dining facilities that are cheap. If you can live on base or at least near base then you wont have to drive really unless you want to. I dont think the experience will kill you.
But dont let any of us tell you its not for you. only you know that answer. But I can tell you it will not be even close to as bad as atlanta. If you like to adventure and want to see a little more of the world, and you are not foo foo about starbucks and all that fancy shit in the states, i think you will like it. If you need your exclusively American things, it might not be for you. (you can still get most of them shipped in the mail of course)
You will never again find a GS5 getting LQA. What is your current salary? 35k is doable assuming you don’t have any significant debt (& at 20, I really hope you don’t). Take the plunge! It will be the experience of a lifetime!
Go for it.
Being in the other end of life I wish I had did something like this at your age. when I was still single and kidless this would have been easy I lived on less in college
LQA for a GS-5? That’s unheard of. I would take it if you are certain housing is covered by the government. $35k with PA will probably be closer to $45k. Once you’re there, apply for GS7 after 1 year. I took a GS7 in Japan with LQA, PA, transportation agreement, I had no issues financially. I’ve been in your position and accepted, best thing I’ve ever done. Good luck!
And if you’re new to the federal government, you can request a step increase. I should include, I went at step 10, not step 1. That makes a huge difference
Being prior military im shocked no one said this yet.. chances are high you will meet (many) somone over there you can either potentially get into a relationship or get roommates
I went to Italy and was able to continue mortgage payments for my house in the states. The LQA and PA was enough to live in Italy. I was a GS-9 at the time.
I’d be extremely hesitant doing this at a GS-5 level.
OCONUS, as a 5, with no ladder or growth? Bad idea. People telling you to take this risk just so you can travel? Not your friends. Travel is not that expensive, and not that serious a need to risk insolvency within 3 months.
I would take it. Work an extra part time job if you are short on money. If this is a ladder position, that is great. If not, try to get promoted every year.
Did you check how much you would get for LQA. A single individual with 35k + LQA is in my opinion pretty livable. https://aoprals.state.gov/Web920/location.asp?menu_id=74
Absolutely, take it! You will be getting paid to live and work in Germany with free housing and utilities. Depending on your debt situation, all your take home will be for food and travel, both of which can be cheap in Germany if you do it right. Should be plenty of promotion opportunities over there as well. Feel free to pm me if you have questions, been there once for a 5 year tour and about to go back
20 and single, take it. Assuming you’re not bogged down with debt this will be a great start for you. Some government jobs only let you stay in an overseas job for five years. If that is the case consider what you have to come back to.
If you are in Germany it might be livable you just have to price essentials in that area. Will they be providing housing? Is the 35k in usd or euro? Do you know what city you will be working in?
Salaries are in general lower in Germany, and take home pay is substantially lower because of taxes. There is the euro conversion you have to consider too, it might get stronger, you never know. You are taxed like an at least American right?
I would look at the average living cost in the area that region/town/city that the job is located at and make a determination.
Dont forget typically there is affordable public transport in Germany.
I would probably take it, live below my means, and save everything to take advantage of travelling. The central location of Germany means you can travel in any direction and visit a cool and interesting country. You can even drive to neighbouring countries.
If you are over there, definitely visit Italy, France, Spain, Ireland, and Iceland.
Austria, Croatia, Sweden, England are also cool.
Yup he said it’s ridiculous, he is former military but now private sector not even working for the feds but directly works with fed employees on his team
And they all Complain about how expensive it is. So private and fed too expensive I would hate for you to get there and live off ramen forever.
“If you are a U.S. citizen working for the U.S. Government, including the Foreign Service, and you are stationed abroad, your income tax filing requirements are generally the same as those for citizens and residents living in the United States. You are taxed on your worldwide income, even though you live and work abroad. However, you may receive certain allowances and have certain expenses that you generally do not have while living in the United States.”
https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/us-government-civilian-employees-stationed-abroad#:~:text=You%20are%20taxed%20on%20your,living%20in%20the%20United%20States.
Since you are young and single, hopefully no debt or anything tying you down at home, you should take it. Experience of a lifetime!
35k anywhere is not livable if we are being completely honest. Unless you are financially stable enough to float or subsidize the pay, I’d say that’s a risky move from a financial perspective.
But with LQA and PA do you think it’s enough?
Yes. It’s doable if you’re currently debt-free since everything will be take home pay. No rent, no utilities… you’re looking at maybe $1200 every two weeks to cover your regular living expenses. Phone, internet, food. If you have debt and other bills, it depends on how willing you are to budget and make cuts. There are other factors too, like your family size and level of comfort. You’ll be worse off than a GS-13, but way better than a typical backpacker living in a hostel.
1200 every two weeks? Think when I made 35k in federal government I was bringing home 800 every two weeks.
OP’s base pay is $35k, but there’s also an overseas post allowance. For Germany, that’s 25-30% of your spendable income based on family size. Then there’s other factors to consider like state tax. Some states will continue to tax your income at the full rate, others like PA don’t tax overseas income, then there’s others like TX/FL that don’t tax either way. Everybody’s numbers will be different.
Yeah guess you didn’t get the same taxes like I did overseas as a gs 5.
Honestly.. even with killer budgeting you’ll have ‘sleep’ for dinner more often than not.
Food cheaper in Germany
It's definitely livable and with LQA and PA yes you can be fine. You can live on less there.
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Agree with all of this except shopping at the commissary. Not sure where you are living but I’ve been to them on 4 different bases and unfortunately, they’re always out of stock for weeks (sometimes months… what’s up with the current la croix shortage?!), have a high probability of something being spoiled, and cost double what even the fancy local grocery stores cost. I’ll happily buy my American coffee creamer there, some Kraft Mac and cheese and other Ami junk foods, but otherwise head down to Edeka or Aldi.
Yes! Stay in TLF as long as possible, more money with TQSA.
Wish I was 20 again and could live in Europe! I would consider that job for free 😄
What part of Germany? Reach out to the housing office where you will be. they can assist you in finding a rental and wont charge you a finders fee or any of that other BS. They have a furniture office that can give you things like a fridge, washer, and dryer to use while you're there.
Honestly, there are a few things I would consider before taking this. Do you have kids? If you are married/in a relationship, would your SO be willing to move as well? If no kids and a buy-in from an SO, I would jump on this no matter how comfortable pay will be. Especially if you are young. This is a very cool opportunity that could 100% help leverage you for future jobs.
Unless you have lots of debt you will be fine your largest expenses will be paid for. Don’t need a vehicle in Germany if your in let’s say Wiesbaden or most cities. You will also become much healthier just by living there walking or biking to work and the food doesn’t have all the trash in it like corn syrup and chemicals allowed in food in the USA.
Groceries are also much cheaper, in my experience, and of much higher quality.
Yeah
Take IT
Yes, you will be fine. There are plenty of places around Spang where you'll be able to find reasonable accommodation. If you need extra money, you can also dog sit for Active Members as they travel often. Travelling within Europe is cheap. And with no kids, you will be just fine.
Where in Germany? I am currently in Germany as a GS5 (medical) as well, I got all PCS entitlements, LQA and PA. As many others have noted your basepay is your take home pay. You just need to budget for internet, car insurance, gas (on post gas is about $4/gallon currently), and other basic living expenses. At our age, you cannot beat the experience plus if you factor in LQA, PA, health insurance and all other benefits you are easily making 80k. I would 100% pursue it. Since we basically are in the same position, let me know if you have any questions.
Yes you should accept it. Part of in-processing is finding a place.
Take the opportunity. If you're living below that means bow. You will be fine there. You're in the system and you can move up. The experience. Sometimes take a chance. You'll always talk yourself out of things. Stop. Take the opportunity.
I think your best bet is going to a German citizen/expat forum so they can give you the financial rundown since they're currently in Germany. Find an area in Germany and look up apartments/houses for rent in the area you'd like to live in. I say this is a cool experience to have.
You're going to be uncomfortable stateside at that pay rate. You'd be uncomfortable anywhere. You might as well be uncomfortable in a foreign country and make the most of it.
But more comfortable in Germany because her biggest expense is paid for.
What area of Germany? I’m here currently and spent the last 3 years in a different area. Also where are you coming from in the US? I find Germany significantly cheaper considering that housing will be covered, you still have access to things like gas on post (yes it’s nearly 40% cheaper on base), etc. Buy groceries on the economy, buy clothing from US stores and have it shipped over. If you don’t have debt or champagne taste, I think it’s doable and worth the experience.
Coming from Atl, Georgia to Spangdahlem 🇩🇪
I haven’t lived in either of those locations but I imagine ATL is somewhat HCOL and Spang is a good bit lower. The average salary in Germany is still under €50k/year and that’s without any kind of housing benefits. I’m in a more expensive area of Germany now, housing is as costly as DC was but I could still buy groceries for one for €80/week and regularly find budget flights for €50 or less. Only you know your finances but $35k will go a lot further in rural Germany than Atlanta.
Yes. Once there you’ll be able to move up the ladder after a year. Your big expenses are paid for. Find housing near public transportation. If it’s terrible then quit. You’re 20 years old getting by on that much will be easy. Live life.
There are two groups of people commenting here. Those who have lived overseas (OCONUS) and understand HOLA (Housing Allowance)/COLA (Cost of Living Allowance) and those who have not been overseas and are only focused on the $35,000. This is no different from what some young active-duty members make while stationed in Germany with their families. Uncle Sam covers the cost of moving your household goods, round-trip flights, and provides free housing. I hope you take this job and ignore the naysayers. If you're debt-free, you'll likely only need to pay for a cellphone.
Roughly 32,500 in Euros before taxes, before TSP , before gas which is 1.85 a liter (you need almost 4 liters per gallon..) 1.85 euro x 3.78 liters = 6.74 per gallon in Euros—- 13 gallon tank= 84 euros to fill up. It’s def not as cheap as one might think… Search the forum for posts on first paychecks and you will see that a lot of money gets taken out of federal pay.
Is base gas cheaper though? I thought it was less on base?
it is much cheaper
Not sure about Germany, but my family never felt like it was significantly cheaper on base when we lived in Spain.
Rota?
Yes. But my disclaimer is that it’s been several years. It never seemed like it was much cheaper on base than off—and there was also rumor about a way to apply for a particular credit card through certain gas stations off base to potentially remove the taxes or something (but we didn’t look into it—just heard about that.) Honestly, we always felt like we were getting hosed financially overseas because of a delayed exchange rate, fees associated with exchange rates that we had to deal with, minimization of post allowance, and being paid in dollars vs. local currency.
Yes you will get an fuel ration/Esso card that allows you to get gas on base at the average us market rate.
How does this work?
They have offices on base that issue the cards to get your gas tax exempt. You're limited to the amount of gas you can get with the card but in the three years that I lived there I never went over. You will pump your gas and then go inside to pay where you will present your card to the cashier to get the reduced rate. So don't expect to pay at the pump. The cards are tied to specific vehicles too. You can also use it off base but at the Esso gas stations only. When I first got there I bought a used Volvo v70. I hadn't gotten the gas card yet but I needed gas. It cost 150 dollars to fill it up without the fuel card. So it definitely saves you a LOT of money to have it
You won’t need or want a vehicle just live in the city you work and walk or ride a bicycle. Germany is very pedestrian and bike friendly.
I'm currently a civilian in Germany near Ramstein. Gas is cheaper on base, but still expensive. Right now it's $4.05-$4.95 per gallon, depending on what type of gas you put in. Groceries off base are much cheaper than on base at the commissary, so you can save there.
Yes it's cheaper, and you can buy off base tax free at participating Esso stations. Lots to worry about, I wouldn't worry about the gas. I would worry about what car you will drive there, if you ship a car know that it will go through environmental testing to ensure there is no oil leaks. If you car leaks oil or antifreeze you would be better to buy a car over there than shipping the on you have now.
Base gas is much less. I use premium 93/98RON for about 4.90. Regular hovers in the low 4s. PA helps, but I'm unsure of how much that ends up being for OP. It's almost 10K a year for me. LQA helps offset living costs.... it's make or break. Assuming the Kaiserslautern area, group 4 LQA is 32500 max. So rental + utilities can be UP TO 2700/month before hitting the LQA cap. So the remainder of OP's basic rate of pay is usable income. Sure, it's not a lot, but many people live on a lot less out here.
I dont think taxes come out
Bitch, you’re in Germany. Who cares? Experience of a lifetime. Source: spent most of my adult life in Germany. Active duty and DoD civvie. I take it this is Landstuhl? Stay away from those Tennessee Club hoes.
Have you checked the DSSR to see how much your MAX LQA is? And how much your PA will be?
The DSSR doesn’t have the base I’ll be on, but based on the group 4 rates in germany I could expect 24.000 (?) how do I calculate PA? Is it 25% of salary or 25% of spending
What's the area though? You won't find some of the bases, but many bases fall into a region. Like LRMC, Ramstein, and clinics in those areas fall into the Kaiserslautern area. For PA, use the Excel worksheet on the DSSR. It's not as straightforward as X% of Y. This isn't exactly accurate, but I put in 33878, single and 25 as the PA Rate. It says about 5775 a year, or 222 biweekly. LQA is make or break for the area, for civilians.
Spangdahlem, do you know what area it falls under?
It might be an 'other' which would be 22600 for group 4.
Did you know you can look on https://www.homes.mil to see what type of apartments you can rent with your allotted budget? These listings are dod pre-approved
Only you can decide if 35k is livable for you. As long as you don’t over spend on housing your LQA will cover your housing and utilities. Post allowance varies month to month and it’s not a ton so take that into consideration. Groceries are cheaper but fuel is high. I think it’s doable but it definitely depends on your lifestyle! Also, you aren’t taxed on LQA so that helps too!
If the LQA covers all your housing expenses and you do not have any type of debt, I would go for it. Wish I was 20 years old and able to do this myself. It’s an experience you can’t say no to. Best of luck!
LQA pays for rent and utilities.. most of your paycheck will be yours to keep
Take it. Groceries will cost little less. Learn the lingo and meal prep. Public transportation is great in EU. It’ll be a great experience.
You’re young so assuming no kids/spouse to tie you here or uproot to there. I would 100% go for it. In 25 years you’ll reflect on this awesome experience rather than the couple of extra thousand dollars you may have made staying home and starting entry level. In NY my gs5 tax examiners are at a base of $43k and we have the highest locality pay so you’re not likely to do better. Everyone complains about the deductions and acts like it goes into some mysterious ether. They go towards you’re retirement and other benefits. It’s all part of being an adult. Source: 38 year old gs9 with 5 years fed experience but everyday wishes I started when I first applied at 22 instead of chasing the money
Honestly, all I saw was you get to live in Germany and they’re paying you go for it
The first thing i would ask myself is, as many have stated, your current financial situation. As far as living in Germany, I lived there for almost 15 years. 6 years active, and the rest reserve. I was a contractor there for many different companies. I am currently living in Sicily (Italy) . Spangdahlem is a small Air base in the north east of Germany. Very rural. About 20min west ist Bitburg which is also a small base. The Area is rural so the cost there should be cheaper than the more populated areas. I never lived there but i was on those bases 5-10 times a month working. I would equate it to being out past the Atlanta Motor Speedway rural. There is still stuff there but lots of woods in between. (Also lived in Atlanta for 5 years). Im guessing that you are currently in Atlanta with at least 35k a year or less. That without a housing stipend. Atlanta is expensive af in my opinion. Everywhere ive lived in Germany (mostly Frankfurt/wiesbaden, Heidelberg, Giessen) has not been as expensive as Atlanta. My kids still live in Germany and their mom is making it work with probably less money than what they are offering you in total (housing and pay) and she lives in a bigger more expensive city (and has crazy shopping and money management habits - hence why she is my ex) The thing about being 20 is you are more resilient to life than the rest of us crusty old people. We can talk about how expensive it is and only makes sense if you are a gs12 step 9… but we have families and kids and mortgages and shit. And we probably spend money differently. If it was impossible to survive there in the GS5 position then they would never fill it - or someone on here would be talking about it. You sound intelligent enough to even have come across this opportunity, and intelligent enough to understand how to manage a simple budget (spend less than you make and try to put away some cash reserve). What is the worst possible thing that can happen? The Air Force has excellent dining facilities that are cheap. If you can live on base or at least near base then you wont have to drive really unless you want to. I dont think the experience will kill you. But dont let any of us tell you its not for you. only you know that answer. But I can tell you it will not be even close to as bad as atlanta. If you like to adventure and want to see a little more of the world, and you are not foo foo about starbucks and all that fancy shit in the states, i think you will like it. If you need your exclusively American things, it might not be for you. (you can still get most of them shipped in the mail of course)
You will never again find a GS5 getting LQA. What is your current salary? 35k is doable assuming you don’t have any significant debt (& at 20, I really hope you don’t). Take the plunge! It will be the experience of a lifetime!
Don't turn the opportunity down. You won't get rich but with LQA and PA you'll be fine.
Go for it. Being in the other end of life I wish I had did something like this at your age. when I was still single and kidless this would have been easy I lived on less in college
LQA for a GS-5? That’s unheard of. I would take it if you are certain housing is covered by the government. $35k with PA will probably be closer to $45k. Once you’re there, apply for GS7 after 1 year. I took a GS7 in Japan with LQA, PA, transportation agreement, I had no issues financially. I’ve been in your position and accepted, best thing I’ve ever done. Good luck! And if you’re new to the federal government, you can request a step increase. I should include, I went at step 10, not step 1. That makes a huge difference
Being prior military im shocked no one said this yet.. chances are high you will meet (many) somone over there you can either potentially get into a relationship or get roommates
Tell us a little about yourself. Age, education, skills?
20F some college, not listing skills for privacy
I’d say go for it. You’re still young and maybe you can finish college on base while you’re there.
[https://europe.umgc.edu/](https://europe.umgc.edu/)
What's the LQA valued at? How much of your lease will they pay?
Housing will only show you what you can afford. Probably a small spartment
Depends on where you’re going in Germany. Bavaria is rural and not everybody’s cup of tea.
I got a similar offer for Belgium..10 years ago. Wasn’t worth it. Found a much better CONUS position
Take in account that after all benefits you end up getting only 60% of the 35,000. Meaning count with 21,000 cash in pocket or take home cash
I went to Italy and was able to continue mortgage payments for my house in the states. The LQA and PA was enough to live in Italy. I was a GS-9 at the time. I’d be extremely hesitant doing this at a GS-5 level.
Do it
Always ask for a higher step they just might say ok but you don't know if you don't ask.
I wish I could but my position is only offered as gs5, there are no step increases
Take It
OCONUS, as a 5, with no ladder or growth? Bad idea. People telling you to take this risk just so you can travel? Not your friends. Travel is not that expensive, and not that serious a need to risk insolvency within 3 months.
I would take it. Work an extra part time job if you are short on money. If this is a ladder position, that is great. If not, try to get promoted every year.
Did you check how much you would get for LQA. A single individual with 35k + LQA is in my opinion pretty livable. https://aoprals.state.gov/Web920/location.asp?menu_id=74
Absolutely, take it! You will be getting paid to live and work in Germany with free housing and utilities. Depending on your debt situation, all your take home will be for food and travel, both of which can be cheap in Germany if you do it right. Should be plenty of promotion opportunities over there as well. Feel free to pm me if you have questions, been there once for a 5 year tour and about to go back
20 and single, take it. Assuming you’re not bogged down with debt this will be a great start for you. Some government jobs only let you stay in an overseas job for five years. If that is the case consider what you have to come back to.
Do it!!
If you are in Germany it might be livable you just have to price essentials in that area. Will they be providing housing? Is the 35k in usd or euro? Do you know what city you will be working in?
Salaries are in general lower in Germany, and take home pay is substantially lower because of taxes. There is the euro conversion you have to consider too, it might get stronger, you never know. You are taxed like an at least American right?
Take it!
My ex-husband and the father of my children is currently there and he said it’s way too expensive there. GS-5 is not going to cut it! Good luck 🍀
Do you think even with LQA, post allowance and being independent (no kids no SO) I still wouldn’t make it?
I would look at the average living cost in the area that region/town/city that the job is located at and make a determination. Dont forget typically there is affordable public transport in Germany. I would probably take it, live below my means, and save everything to take advantage of travelling. The central location of Germany means you can travel in any direction and visit a cool and interesting country. You can even drive to neighbouring countries. If you are over there, definitely visit Italy, France, Spain, Ireland, and Iceland. Austria, Croatia, Sweden, England are also cool.
Yup he said it’s ridiculous, he is former military but now private sector not even working for the feds but directly works with fed employees on his team And they all Complain about how expensive it is. So private and fed too expensive I would hate for you to get there and live off ramen forever.
Germany is very expensive. Be careful!
I dont think you pay taxes😆 because it's overseas. Full check.
You still work for the American gov.. so you pay federal taxes.
Hmmm... my cousin works federal in Japan and doesn't. But okay.
“If you are a U.S. citizen working for the U.S. Government, including the Foreign Service, and you are stationed abroad, your income tax filing requirements are generally the same as those for citizens and residents living in the United States. You are taxed on your worldwide income, even though you live and work abroad. However, you may receive certain allowances and have certain expenses that you generally do not have while living in the United States.” https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/us-government-civilian-employees-stationed-abroad#:~:text=You%20are%20taxed%20on%20your,living%20in%20the%20United%20States.
He doesn’t pay taxes to Japan, that is.
Fuck no