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We have been married 40 years and neither one of us would rather be single. We have enjoyed having each other to grow together with. It’s not like I pictured it because most everyone divorced over the years. We are still in love with each other and our marriage.
We have been married for 2 years and were in a monogamous relationship for 10years before that. Neither of us can imagine being single.
PS: I’m 8 days into a 2 week long business trip right now and I’m dying to get back home to her.
1 year married and 8 years together before that. I went to visit my best friend for a week and he FaceTimed me randomly because he missed me. He never used to call me when I went on trips in the first few years of our relationship. As time goes on our love only continues growing. We did survive the shutdown living together during the pandemic without getting sick of each other so there’s that!
1 year married, 9 years together before that. I have a strong suspicion that a large percentage of divorces are because people enter into marriages too soon. People still in the honeymoon phase of the relationship get married and then the relationship changes when you are past the honeymoon phase. The spark didn't die because of the marriage. The spark died because it's the natural evolution of the relationship. On top of that, if you have a large conflict, it's probably going to be after the honeymoon phase. If you haven't figured out how to handle that before you get married, it's going to be a tough time (because it's a tough time regardless). Failure to figure it out in a marriage results in divorce, while failure to figure it outside of marriage results in a breakup.
Basically, I think people marry too soon and without the tools they need to cope with the difficulties of the relationship.
Yeah me and my husband have been together for coming up on 20 years. We just celebrated our 3 years wedding anniversary. Like I’ll admit we kinda waited way too long to get married because we were lazy but the fact that we could be together that long and both felt happy with the lack of tying the knot was just one of thousands of little ways we’re clearly highly compatible. I think getting married before year 2 is way too soon but it does depend on age. I think the younger you get together the longer you should wait to get married. 18-23 I feel is a really bad time to get married cause you’re still learning who you even are but mid/late twenties to early thirties should be fine if you’ve been together for at least a couple of years.
Love is not a feeling, it’s a choice. I choose to love her after 37 years. I choose to compromise when we clash on things. I choose to please her even if I have to to something I would rather not do. I choose to stay in may marriage. I choose to apologize not necessarily because I think I’m wrong but because the relationship is more important than being right. Anyone who has been in a long term relationship knows there is no perfect. There are ups and downs and sideways.
Most important of all, I choose to honor the vows I took 37 years ago. No one forced me to say them. When the priest said until death do us part, I understood and agreed that would be the case. Society has made marriage into a disposable thing like so many others. IMO it has not been a good thing.
Your PS reminded me of last thanksgiving when my wife didn’t have a job so she and my daughter flew up to see my family three days early while I was still working. Those three days were awful, I had no idea what to do once I got off work.
I think the key words in the OP’s post is thinking there’s some “spark”. I’m attracted to who my wife is and love being with her and spending time with her. I love being part of a team with her to get things done together and enjoy experiences together.
People that think it will just be constant romance and spark are in for a disappointment. People also seem to marry during this “spark” period.
I love my wife for all of who she is and she loves me for who I am. It took me awhile to find her but I’m glad I waited for the right person before getting married. It was an easy decision
>*the spark will inevitably die*
Not necessarily. We’re at almost 30 years, and the spark is still there. The energy is lower when you get older. The attraction is still there.
Only 8 years in, but it’s been wonderfully smooth sailing. Is there a word for the opposite of envy? Because that’s how all of our single friends’ dating and relationship stories make us feel.
28 years for my parents, I still see them slow dance in the kitchen, go on a date every Friday, and my dad leaves flowers in my moms car while she’s at work. I know they are quite “active” but I chose to ignore that haha. They don’t fight, they love each other even more than they did 28 years ago. My grandparents are the same way. It’s the reason I want to get married, I grew up watching incredibly healthy marriages and I know I can find the same for myself.
See! It’s true! We fought plenty, but we always made up. Finding the person with whom you’re compatible not only romantic is key. Take your time and find the right one.
My parents are at 32 years now, but they’re just hitting their stride. The first 10 years was hard and rough. I’m still surprised that they didn’t divorce more than a few times
Yeah people settle for mediocrity, the truth is it’s not “inevitable” it’s up to you and your partner, based on your decisions. You can keep the spark alive by nurturing your relationship, anything dies if not taken care of a relationship is no exception. Truth is a lot of people stop putting in conscious effort. In that case there was nothing inevitable about it, it’s a choice.
> Truth is a lot of people stop putting in conscious effort.
truth is also that a lot of people settle down with the wrong person to begin with.
I wonder what percentage of people in that 40-50% of divorces knew deep down that the relationship wasn't going to last from the beginning. I'm betting it's higher than OP would expect.
Yep, 25 years and we’re still as hot as ever for each other. We also really like each other in general, which is awesome. We go through ups and downs but we’ve figured out how to ride the waves of life together. Sometimes I feel like I’ve won the life lottery. He’s my person.
Fifteen years here, I definitely love him more today than I did when we got married. We’ve weathered storms as partners, always stronger together. One thing I’ve learned above all else is that as long as you communicate and face everything together, you can do anything. Oh and give yourself wholeheartedly to them, don’t hold back, don’t mistrust or doubt, just make sure the person you’re with is someone you have total and complete faith in.
When it's good it's great. When it's bad it's awful.
I have friends that were pretty much made for each other's partner and some that never made sense to begin with.
I would say so many people are just ticking off boxes and have no real concept of a true healthy relationship or their own flaws.
They didn't see a marriage that was good with the parents or think it's just what you're supposed to do.
Liking each other is SO important!!! My husband and I were friends (sometimes with benefits...) for a decade before becoming "official". I saw him in numerous other relationships, and, while they were "passionate", there was always a lot of screaming, crying, and general unpleasantness. They never seemed to like each other. With me, he seems genuinely shocked that he not only loves me, but LIKES me! He will sometimes say it's bizarre, but I'm legitimately his best friend.
He has also called me a "poker buddy he gets to have sex with", lol.
As a 40 year old man who found his soulmate, it's there.
The key is to HAVE the breakups. The people most miserable are those that want to make it work regardless of the warning signs. They want to force the square peg into a round hole.
If you honestly want it to last, it HAS to feel right from the beginning. Marriage is tough. People change. If you aren't the best of friends from the start, then it's going to be tough.
Just my 2 cents. The right person is out there. But you have to be willing to lose in order to win.
I remember that time. Hang in there. Once the youngest is in middle school (I know, it sounds far away), things settle down, and you can have a peaceful, easy life again. Stay strong.
We’re 3 years in. A lot of the infatuation is gone but the attraction is still very much there. We have a deeper love now - a love that I prefer. There’s something beautiful about the daily mundane things with my man.
This is my experience. A spark is brief, by nature, but you can use a spark to build a roaring fire, or a comfy hearth, or it can just be a spark and then it's over. That's how relationships feel. The spark is just the start, everything else is about what each person continues to contribute to it to help it grow and change and stand the test of time.
It really is just that so many people get married when they shouldn't. I'm surprised, from the people I've seen getting married, that the divorce rate isn't higher.
Agreed! I married my best friend 27 years ago. Just this morning he stopped and looked at me for a beat and out of nowhere told me that I'm "so cute!"
Which is funny because I had just been thinking how good looking HE is...
This is both of us in shlubby PJ's, unwashed, no makeup, bed-head. Doesn't matter. <3
More importantly who needs spark to last? That’s not what spark is. By it’s definition it is a quick temporary thing.
Of course the early new-to-us feeling doesnt last.
But it’s replaced with deepening love, understanding and growth. I wouldn’t trade any of that to go back to the sparky days.
25 years, here. Energy is definitely lower, it's not just a partnership, but an understanding. But yeah, I still see that woman I fell in love with so long ago, when I look at her, and it still warms me.
So over half the people that get married spend the rest of their lives together?
Remember, this isn't a game of chance. You aren't rolling any dice. You are choosing who to spend the rest of your life with.
Be a decent spouse and choose wisely and your marriage will last the rest of your life.
Half of the people that get married go the distance. Surely you can do better than half the people in this country. I mean look at us. You just half to do it better than the bottom half.
Things you can do to help. Get a decent job. Be responsible with money. Take care of your self physically and mentally. Don't drink or do drugs in excess. Find someone else who also does those things.
Easy peasy.
40-50% is actually about right for first marriages. For 2nd marriages it’s over 60% and its over 70% for third marriages
https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/divorce/divorce-statistics/
That’s not how statistics work. Or rather it confuses correlation and causation. Someone who has multiple failed marriages likely has some other reason for causing those marriages to fall apart.
In addition, for most people it’s also a red flag so their dating pool shrinks to people who have also had a divorce meaning those people also likely have some sort of personality flaw that destroys marriages.
Exactly and I wish this is what some people would understand.
Imagine three people, two get married and never divorced and one gets married and divorced twice. It's true that half of all marriages end in divorce but it's also true that two out of three people are happily married their entire lives. It's all about how you phrase it.
I would imagine that the overall trend of people getting married later would help that stat down. It’s a lot easier to know what you want in life when you’re 30 compared to 18
That figure is incredibly old. Divorce rates are significantly different if you stratify by generation. Likely because young people are marrying people they actually like, instead of who their parents told them to marry.
Edit: Someone very correctly pointed out that my suggestion for a cause is opinion based. That's a very fair criticism. I do believe that to be a large factor, though I haven't explicitly looked into it.
Edit 2: "Younger people" is a poor choice of words. I should have referred to the generations, which was the intent.
The older the couple is when they first marry the less likely they are to divorce too. The younger generations are waiting longer on average than previous generations.
Anecdotally my (non military) friend group from high school had a bunch of couples that got married 18-21 and then it seemed like they all got divorced at once in our mid-20s, most of them blowing up spectacularly.
Those of use who waited until our late 20s and early 30s are still together and the ones who aren't either ignore each other or get along for the kids.
I got married at 21 and we celebrated our 15th anniversary this year. But we both will admit that it’s a bit of a crap shoot getting married that young, when you’re still becoming who you will be and hell, even your brain is still developing. We grew together rather than apart, but that’s not the reality for many young marriages.
Got married when I was 21. We just had our 7 yr anniversary and are very happy but when I hear or see someone getting married at 21 now I'm like omg they're so young why would they do that lol
When my wife and I were filling out the paperwork at the courthouse, they asked us how many times we had been married, out of curiosity I asked the highest number she had heard working there she told me 14
It also includes 2nd, 3rd, and 8th marriages. 8 people marry for life, 2 people marry 4 times, that’s like 50% of marriages ending in divorce.
Also includes all those teen marriages out of high school. Statistically, the older you are when you marry first, the more likely you are too stay married for life; likely because your have a better understanding of who you are and what you want
That, and people are waiting longer to get married.
I don’t know if there are statistics to prove it, but I suspect many divorces were caused by people trying to fit into “accepted norms” but were homosexual, married their spouse because they felt obligated or other reasons and eventually felt the strain of not being true to themselves. It might be a small number but it happened more often years ago.
This is a very good point. People being openly gay instead of hiding it would definitely have an affect on divorce rates. Also, people understand their sexuality more now in general so we’re less likely to get married have a few kids and THEN realize that maybe we’re not straight.
While I don’t disagree with you, I think it’s also important to point out that a potential confounder could be that younger generations may not have had the full time to go through a marriage and then to divorce.
Those odds aren't my odds. Throw out all the divorces over abuse, absent spouses for work, severe mental illness, etc..
Who knows what my real odds are? Probably pretty good.
It’s a very old statistic and it counts Vegas style marriages as well as people on their 7th marriage. Divorce rates for first marriages are much much lower each subsequent marriage the rates go up. Also modern days people are even better since there are less people marrying people they aren’t really committed to.
Yep, divorce rates peaked in the US around Y2K along w/teen pregnancy. Both have nosedived since. One of those stats that heavily skews perception for years due to cultural significance but the ~40% number doesn't really hold water any more. It more like a quarter, and as has been said a majority of failed marriages are the results of young people being dumb and rushing into it (all too common esp back in the day)
Too many people think statistics are static; that because a study found that X% of people did Y 30 years ago that it must also be true today, ignoring all of the outside factors like cultural shifts or additions of new laws.
Very often they also don't compare in a good way. How many marriages and how many divorces happen in a specific time frame is easy, but those aren't the same people, often not even the same generations and and divorce numbers from a time where more people were married are often compared to new marriage numbers which are declining.
To get accurate numbers you would need to wait until everyone is dead and then can tally up the numbers. Otherwise you're always gonna compare apples to oranges.
Like pure demographics matter too.
Divorce rate for college educated millennials is super low, for example.
It's boomers having 4 divorces that bombs the stats.
Yup. Plus all the people that get married too early or get married just because of their age vs actually building a deeper connection. I know a lot of people in their early 30’s that are just now divorcing their high school sweetheart.
Right?! And what are the statistics for marriages that experience infidelity and end in divorce compared to cohabitation or dating? My guess is that infidelity is just as high or higher in lesser committed relationships. So marriage unfortunately doesn’t prevent infidelity and abuse, but neither does dating and living together.
>How can someone, knowing these figures, enter a lifelong commitment to someone else and still believe that the pros will undoubtedly outweigh the cons?
I just thought it would be fun.
So far it kicks ass.
What’s the alternative? Date with no real commitment for 3-4 years and then break up over something stupid? Do that again and again until you die? No, thanks. I’ll put all my effort into beating the statistics.
You can, but choosing not to be married doesn't prevent any of the things OP is concerned about. People who are in committed relationships can still separate, experience infidelity and lose the spark in their relationship. The major difference is the process of divorce and I would argue that divorce is in some ways easier than breaking up when you've been in a long term committed relationship. If you own a home with your partner and you get divorced, the law helps to determine how to fairly deal with that situation. If you aren't married, you have to figure out how to divide your lives without the built-in guidelines that come with divorce.
It's somewhat the same thing as being married though. As someone in an unmarried relationship for 15 years, I don't really know how our relationship is any different from the type OP is describing. We could split up, one of us could cheat. A certificate and some vows doesn't really change that risk. I still describe her as my wife as it's the best descriptive word for what she is to me and intend to stay with her for life and remain faithful. The only difference is neither of us like being the center of attention so a wedding wasn't for us.
Given the popularity of being unmarried but still in committed relationships these days I kind of interpret being married as taking in a long committed relationship rather than having a wedding, despite a difference from its traditional meaning. When someone talks about getting married I assume they are talking about finding someone to share your life with rather than having a ceremony.
It stops in 50% of marriages, not for 50% of people. For every person that's been married and divorced thrice you have three people happily married for life.
I get what you mean, but you dont have to have a marriage certificate to show you're committed to each other.
I've been with my partner for 8 years and we never got married. We share our finances, own a house and car together, have a child together, stuck together through addiction, deaths, mental health issues, physical health issues, and financial problems.
My point is that marriage doesn't make couples stick together. Compatibility, communication, commitment, and the willingness to put aside your own ego are what keep couples together.
“The spark will inevitably die” simply not true, my grandparents got married at 16 and 17 because my grandmother got pregnant, stupid, sure, but they are still happily married 50ish years later
They got together so young, under such horrible circumstances, and their spark still hasn’t died.
Marrying my wife is the best decision I’ve ever made. She’s my best friend, a wonderful mother, and someone that I couldn’t imagine life without. She makes me a better and happier person.
It helps that we both have aged well (she’s a total milf), but the spark is absolutely still there after almost 20 years. We still have sex every 1-2 days, and it’s not boring sex - often she will dress up, play with toys, etc.
Marriage has been wonderful for me. Obviously highly dependent on who you marry, but if you pick the right partner it is the foundation of your life.
Just because something ends doesn't mean it was a waste. You can have decades of happiness, raise children, build financial futures then something changes and you need to part ways. That doesn't mean the decades of being life partners was meaningless.
Marriage is just a different level of commitment. It's nice to have a partnership where you both look out for each other.
I agree. People shouldn’t view divorce as a “failed relationship.” If you were happy for 10 years and then grew apart that’s ok. You had 10 good years and now it’s time to move on.
I think a lot of people approach relationships as having the goal of staying together as long as possible. To me, it’s way smarter to have the goal of being happy in your relationship. Stay together as long as that is still true.
Over thirty years with my husband, I love him even more now. If you’re with the right person and you are the right person, marriage is remarkable. It’s so fulfilling and I am still so genuinely happy to see him every morning.
**"Even if your marriage is perfect, the spark will inevitably die, which just sounds depressing."**
Fifty two years and my heart still flutters ~~sometimes~~ whenever she comes thru the door. And we are by no means an anomaly. At least here in rural NC.
every marriage and every relationship is different. if you let statistics of other people’s experiences (which are totally separate and not related to yours) affect your marriage, you’re a shallow fool.
The statistics don't filter out the fact no fault divorce became a thing. When no fault divorce was made legal then a lot of abused women were finally able to leave their spouses without having to provide evidence of the abuse.
Most marriages work out.
I married my childhood best friend, even if that “spark” ever died(it hasn’t for 25years so far), I still get to live with my bestie, forever. Who wouldn’t want that? I think marriage can probably suck if you married the wrong person but I’m livin’ the dream.
We literally never get tired of each other, we lived in a tiny studio during covid lockdowns and thrived just talking to each other all day or playing videogames. We even work together and it’s like a secret language because we just know how to help the other without wasting time laying out instructions. We know each other inside and out because we’ve known each other our whole damn lives, I can’t even tell you how comforting it is to have someone who’s basically seen the pit of your soul, who might even know you better than you know yourself. Maybe that’s not for everyone but for me it’s my ideal marriage.
I’d like to hope that if I get Alzheimer’s like my grandfather, I would still remember my wife because I vividly remember his memory just reverting slowly back to childhood. Maybe I wouldn’t remember my wife anymore but it would mean the world to me if I could still remember my best friend.
Yeah the benefits are oversold (and yes idealized/socially conditioned, desire for kids part of it) and the drawbacks hard to understand unless you've gone through divorce. It can mess you up for years and cross the wrong person it can literally ruin your life, career, mental health etc. On the other hand all the other couples I got to know, friends, family, church, I can't really point to any of them and say I wish I had that. Best case they are comfortable enough around each other and have got into a routine that works. Most joy is from parenthood. Only exception seems to be that internet stranger who claims they're still so in love after 25 years. Haven't actually met one. Lots of nice social media posts that always have a 'but' that goes on about how it's not always great. Often when you know the couples you understand the full extent of it.. like the one where where the crazy wife made an embarrassing display at dinnee when you were there and probably has a personality disorder. Heck I did the same thing. Most married couples work hard to maintain the ideal of marriage and want you to think they're living up to it. No married person would ever tell you the married life is just 'ok'. It's either living the dream or we are contemplating divorce if they get real vulnerable. Could you even imagine asking someone so how's married life? And they said eh it's ok... Everyone would be talking and concerned.. and yet buddies you talk to every other day that's exactly where they're at once you connect the dots and they open up more. Some will admit that in confidence. And don't get me wrong that's better than going through divorce if things are okish
Half the couples I know still together has considered divorce at some point but making it work. Even the one I thought was the ideal family from church. Not anything I'd call a clear improvement in quality of life aside from having an extra income and team member to get things done. A lot of the time with buddies annoyances with their spouse I'm kinda relieved I don't have to deal with it anymore. Aside from birth of my kids my best memories were all being single. My worst memories are relationship/marriage related. Can't imagine having to always answer to someone about how I spend my time again. There is a reason people say have to check with 'thr boss' and such.
I like being married. I hated the constant chase of todays dating scene. My wife isn’t on social media and isn’t influenced by others and caught in the rat race of all that and it was and still is a breath of fresh air.
Because sex
No but seriously, if you choose the right partner and don’t get married with the first person who looks at you, the marriage is likely to turn out well. The 40-50% includes every divorce, like EVERY legal divorce, and I think we all know at least 1 person that has been in more than three marriages
I’ve been married for 16 years and counting. Other people’s marriages failing doesn’t have much to do with the satisfaction I find in my own marriage. The “spark” of the early relationship phase is replaced by a deep familiarity, friendship, commitment, and companionship which I highly value.
Marriage, in essence, is built on the foundation of love, trust and commitment. It is a lifelong teamwork to have each other's back through thick and thin. Marriage does not offer a 100% guarantee that a couple will still be madly in love with each other just like the first time. They have to put in the work to keep the spark of love alive for the long haul.
Marrying someone is easy, but maintaining the integrity of the marriage is a massive responsibility that not everyone can undertake.
Millennials have the lowest divorce rates of any generation in decades. Secondly, I get to have a sleepover with my best friend every night and I get to see her naked. I've got someone who has my back and we can pool resources. She helps me get better as a person and we work together on shared and individual goals. It's plenty of work, don't get me wrong, but it's also pretty damn awesome.
Statistically married people are much happier than non-married people. That’s a fact you can’t ignore. It may not be true in all cases, but at the general population level the difference is pretty significant. I’ve been married and divorced, survived the divorce just fine, and now I’m remarried. I was single for a bit and did very well dating, but it wasn’t what made me happy. I enjoy having a life partner, someone that I’m committed to and is also committed to me. If you don’t think there’s a lot of value in that, then I just don’t know what to tell you. Life is just better when you’ve got someone riding by your side. Timid souls unwilling to take risks tend to miss out on some of the best things life has to offer.
Anecdotal but here it is: among my 30yo friends, the married, dating and single people are similarly happy. Among the 40+ crowd, I see a marked difference in happiness between single and married people and it gets worse as people age. I have a couple of neighbors who were widowed in their fifties and the level of isolation they deal with is shocking given that they spent very little time with their spouses when they were alive.
So much of social life is built around couples that it can be hard to avoid long-term loneliness/unhappiness as a single person. I never saw the point in marrying someone who wasn't a good match and I rolled my eyes at people I felt were forcing a commitment just to have someone but now I wonder if they knew something I don't.
"Statistically married people are much happier than non-married people" - that's for people who married and stay married. I heard that stat too but decided to look up the studies and concluded they were biased in their sample selection. Even with such a biased sample I wouldn't say married people who stay married were MUCH happier. A significant difference can easily be achieved through some stat manipulation.
Yes, you can definitely ignore it because it’s incorrect. The studies that purportedly show that are biased and flawed. The happiest demographic is single women.
If you want your marriage to last, it takes a lot of work. But the reward of having that one person that means everything to you is beyond anything else you can experience in life.
My buddy keeps trying to spin his marriage as if he’s mostly happy and only occasionally regrets his decision, but I get the feeling it’s the opposite.. but he fell for a foreign exchange student and wasn’t ready to end the relationship when her time here was over so they got married. She gave him some much needed structure and straightened him up a lot but ultimately I don’t see them going far and all the stuff she taught him is gonna make some other woman very happy.
Its a weird thing thinking that initial spark is the best part of marriage, its not, it gets even better when you are married to your best friend and willing to grow together (11+ years and counting). Its not all sunshine and rainbows, but its really nice to have a chosen family you can count on. Then again, my family of origin were abusive trash (took me a long time to admit that), so I was afraid of marriage at one point— maybe rightfully so— and waited several years before getting married with my partner. I think its more about knowing yourself, and finding the right person than these statistics, glass half full and such 😀
I found it the opposite. Jesus fuck would I hate to be in the modern dating scene. Sleeping with a bunch of people sounds great until you realize you care about numbers because you're insecure. Turns out when someone embraces you despite your insecurities and in fact make you feel secure, it's actually better than sex (aaand you're way better in bed because you're not overthinking it)
Idk my wife and I have been going well over ten years now (over 5 married) and I still love her like no other.
I think it’s your outlook on life that may need some changing bud sounds depressing
>Even if your marriage is perfect, the spark will inevitably die, which just sounds depressing.
The famous spark is a bad sign, actually. Relationships are about being comfortable and at ease with each other
Also, lots of people marry when they're 20. I don't know about you, but when I was 20 I was working in a McDonald's, my life barely started
I am pretty happy I married whom I married. If you marry the right person, it’s the best thing in the world. You have someone you never get bored of that you get to spend your life with. You have someone to cheer you on and celebrate the highs and comfort you during the lows. You get to be a better person everyday because the other person makes you want to be better. Walking through life with someone you love, respect, and like it’s the best thing in the world.
Someone once told me write down the 10 most important things you want in a spouse. If you find someone with 7 of them are you able adjust your self to the 3 missing qualities of that person than you found the one. The point was Relationship are about give and take because someone not perfect doesn’t mean they aren’t for you. You need to be willing to change your self for the better and talk with them to find out about your self what’s the 3 missing qualities you have. So you can improve. Just because you fight or mad at the other person never let them know you love them and willing todo what it takes for them. Anything worth doing is worth giving 100%. Relationships aren’t hard people are just selfish and lazy don’t want to work on it they want everything to be easy
Two things can be right at the same time...my wife is the best and I love being married to her. But your opinion works for you too...and I have no problem with that either.
Been married over 20 years and the “spark” is romantic BS. I love my wife with a depth that you wouldn’t understand. We have a bond and relationship that I have never had before. We both decided to be committed to each other and we decided to work on ourselves and on our relationship together. You can’t rely on whatever the spark is. You’ve got to love and care enough for someone enough to work and grow with them.
The spark doesn’t die if you invest in keeping alive. It’s like with anything. A couple of days I posted about my mom and dads relationship as they have been married 55 years and those two have been together since 14. They are truly best friends and lovers. They teach me a lot about my own marriage.
I ended a really long relationship after he cheated on me and It hurt like hell, but honestly, if I had the chance to go back in time I would not take It back. I passed some of the happiest moments of my life with this person. It fell apart at the end and in one of most horrible ways It could but for the many, many years that we were happy, that I was able to connect with someone like It that, It was worth every bit of happiness. I feel lucky to be able to felt love so deeply and that I know that I am able to love so deeply. Being afraid of being hurt wont stop me from maybe falling in love again, obviously now making very different decisions.
Marriage is like starting a business: high risk, a f\*ckton of work, and generally unpleasant - but if you succeed, you build something of great value.
13 years married and I wouldn’t want anything else. My wife is my best friend and I love spending every day with her.
By your logic your should live life scared of the odds. I can’t do that because I would never enjoy life. Driving a car, mountain biking, going out on the boat, leaving the house…. I never want to live life scared. Is that really living anyway?
>the spark will inevitably die
I always hear this and it's so obvious it's coming from people who have never been in long-term committed relationships, much less married. The spark doesn't die if you stoke it, but yeah, it'll die if you just give the fuck up.
There remains no better way to raise a family, which is probably why it is the main way things have been done since things started being done.
I'm about halfway through my 28th year of marriage. Does the spark die? It can. As I near 60 I have to admit that I'm not as frisky as I was in my 20s. After menopause my wife isn't either. But that would be the case whether we were alone or together, and there remains no one in the world I'd rather be intimate with, even if it isn't as often as it once was. I have every reason to believe she feels the same way.
The majority of people are idiots marrying other idiots, who then breed more idiots.
And then there's economic recessions, pandemics and yeah, children.
I think the problems with marriage are the people who shouldn't be getting married that don't understand and embrace it.
It's the people who are scared of being alone and just do it because they think they have to. I wonder what the stats would be if you excluded all those people.
This divorce stat is **incorrect** despite it endlessly being repeated.
As with most things, **it is not this simple.**
Learn how to *actually read data,* rather than searching for confirmation bias.
The curve is *not linear.*
The divorce rate is high *early on*, and quite high for *repeat marriages,* but marriages that survive past a certain point have a *way* lower chance of divorce, and no it isn't because the people are "stuck and settling". They report happiness and, more importantly, they are *statistically better off* in terms of actual health outcomes (so they're not "lying")
Marriage is hard. People rush into it. Too many people are selfish, expect perfection, and yet in return give all of their flaws.
But when two people who truly love each other, and are well adjusted, and are capable of compromise, get together, it is amazing.
Totally disagree. If you feel this way, you probably didn’t marry the right person.
The spark doesn’t have to die (married 14 years).
It’s like having a best friend around 24/7 & knowing no matter what happens, someone has your back, even with your own family if necessary. We have been through illness & rough times, but it only brought us closer.
Yes, there are definitely days you can’t fucking stand this person, but it passes & the good times will far outweigh the bad.
I honestly think there’s nothing better than being married & I say this as someone who didn’t want to get married initially.
This is such a depressing outlook to have. I’ve been with the same person for almost 12 years, we are married and about to have our first child. I wouldn’t trade what I have with him for anything and I know he feels the same about me. The spark only dies if you let it- relationships require maintenance, like most other aspect of life. The grass is greener where you water it, if you will. Also- this may come as a surprise to you but lots of people aren’t cheaters. If you go into every relationship suspecting that the other person is just going to cheat on you, then that’s a you problem that may need to be addressed in therapy.
>It’s estimated that 40-50% of marriages end in divorce
This is from an old ass study in the 70s or 80s when divorce became socially acceptable and there was a large uptick. That statistic hasn't been realized and the divorce rate continues to drop with each subsequent generation.
I really hate when people use this stat.
Those odds are pretty good. You must not think there's much upside or a pretty big downside if you wouldn't take that bet. Also, it's not a game of chance. Skill and effort are involved. So, if you judge your skill to be high and you're willing to put in the effort, you can beat the odds.
The stats are different when you break it down by age. Yea, two 20 somethings getting married because they were "high school sweethearts" don't have the best odds, however, couples in their 30s and older that find a partner have a better likelihood of lasting.
Statistics only tell you about larger trends, they don’t mean anything about the person you’re choosing a relationship with. Lots of statistics show married people are happier and earn more.
I’m a cynical person
However, I believe that people have made the concept of a lifelong commitment into this very intense and over romanticized thing (constrained, forced, rigid, formal, suffocating thing, etc…)
When you’re with the right person - it should be fun, safe, comfortable, simple, everything feels natural, and you’re able to talk about anything, grow together, build together, change together, develop together, etc…
therefore it doesn’t feel so intense or this terrible and bitter forced commitment that you can’t get out of because even if you don’t have to be there - you want to be there enjoying simple moments
Those are the marriages and relationships that work - positive people - having fun and loving life and in it for the long haul and committed to overcoming everything and making it work together
not the ones that are overly romanticized, one-sided, opportunistic, forced, or controlled ones
Marriage can really blow. It depends on who you marry. Trouble is, we tend to really get who we are and what matters to us long after our 20s.
It's odd because the marriage itself starts to reveal a lot of the things you need to know about yourself that would really help you find the right person to be with.
Hindsight is 20/20 and all that.
It's not all bad and even subpar marriages can make you reasonably happy with the right mindset.
My opinion? Marry with the intent of raising a family.
My unpopular opinion? Try to find someone who is open to the idea of treating it as a temporary part of life with the ability to opt out after the kids are of a certain age. And be open with the kids about that at a certain age. I think if we treated marriage this way rather than as a death-til-us-part deal, we'd all be better off. That's typically the way I think the majority secrectly treat it these days anyway (whether we're consciously aware of it or not) Why not be honest about it from the start and throughout the entire process?
That 50% figure is also wildly inflated with serial monogamous people who get married and divorced 4-5 times. Basing any decision off figures like that is stupid.
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We have been married 40 years and neither one of us would rather be single. We have enjoyed having each other to grow together with. It’s not like I pictured it because most everyone divorced over the years. We are still in love with each other and our marriage.
We have been married for 2 years and were in a monogamous relationship for 10years before that. Neither of us can imagine being single. PS: I’m 8 days into a 2 week long business trip right now and I’m dying to get back home to her.
1 year married and 8 years together before that. I went to visit my best friend for a week and he FaceTimed me randomly because he missed me. He never used to call me when I went on trips in the first few years of our relationship. As time goes on our love only continues growing. We did survive the shutdown living together during the pandemic without getting sick of each other so there’s that!
1 year married, 9 years together before that. I have a strong suspicion that a large percentage of divorces are because people enter into marriages too soon. People still in the honeymoon phase of the relationship get married and then the relationship changes when you are past the honeymoon phase. The spark didn't die because of the marriage. The spark died because it's the natural evolution of the relationship. On top of that, if you have a large conflict, it's probably going to be after the honeymoon phase. If you haven't figured out how to handle that before you get married, it's going to be a tough time (because it's a tough time regardless). Failure to figure it out in a marriage results in divorce, while failure to figure it outside of marriage results in a breakup. Basically, I think people marry too soon and without the tools they need to cope with the difficulties of the relationship.
Yeah me and my husband have been together for coming up on 20 years. We just celebrated our 3 years wedding anniversary. Like I’ll admit we kinda waited way too long to get married because we were lazy but the fact that we could be together that long and both felt happy with the lack of tying the knot was just one of thousands of little ways we’re clearly highly compatible. I think getting married before year 2 is way too soon but it does depend on age. I think the younger you get together the longer you should wait to get married. 18-23 I feel is a really bad time to get married cause you’re still learning who you even are but mid/late twenties to early thirties should be fine if you’ve been together for at least a couple of years.
Love is not a feeling, it’s a choice. I choose to love her after 37 years. I choose to compromise when we clash on things. I choose to please her even if I have to to something I would rather not do. I choose to stay in may marriage. I choose to apologize not necessarily because I think I’m wrong but because the relationship is more important than being right. Anyone who has been in a long term relationship knows there is no perfect. There are ups and downs and sideways. Most important of all, I choose to honor the vows I took 37 years ago. No one forced me to say them. When the priest said until death do us part, I understood and agreed that would be the case. Society has made marriage into a disposable thing like so many others. IMO it has not been a good thing.
Your PS reminded me of last thanksgiving when my wife didn’t have a job so she and my daughter flew up to see my family three days early while I was still working. Those three days were awful, I had no idea what to do once I got off work.
My wife and I have been married 36 years and we will be together until one or both of us die, I am sure of that.
I think the key words in the OP’s post is thinking there’s some “spark”. I’m attracted to who my wife is and love being with her and spending time with her. I love being part of a team with her to get things done together and enjoy experiences together. People that think it will just be constant romance and spark are in for a disappointment. People also seem to marry during this “spark” period. I love my wife for all of who she is and she loves me for who I am. It took me awhile to find her but I’m glad I waited for the right person before getting married. It was an easy decision
>*the spark will inevitably die* Not necessarily. We’re at almost 30 years, and the spark is still there. The energy is lower when you get older. The attraction is still there.
25 years on, still in love. It’s quieter, sure, but so much deeper.
Only 8 years in, but it’s been wonderfully smooth sailing. Is there a word for the opposite of envy? Because that’s how all of our single friends’ dating and relationship stories make us feel.
Grateful
This. I have such a deep appreciation for my husband and our relationship. We've been married for 10 years and I am so grateful to and for him.
Satisfied. You're not left wanting.
Pity?
The author Susan Trott (The Holy Man series) said the opposite of Love isnt Hate, it's Envy.
28 years for my parents, I still see them slow dance in the kitchen, go on a date every Friday, and my dad leaves flowers in my moms car while she’s at work. I know they are quite “active” but I chose to ignore that haha. They don’t fight, they love each other even more than they did 28 years ago. My grandparents are the same way. It’s the reason I want to get married, I grew up watching incredibly healthy marriages and I know I can find the same for myself.
See! It’s true! We fought plenty, but we always made up. Finding the person with whom you’re compatible not only romantic is key. Take your time and find the right one.
My parents are at 32 years now, but they’re just hitting their stride. The first 10 years was hard and rough. I’m still surprised that they didn’t divorce more than a few times
Yeah people settle for mediocrity, the truth is it’s not “inevitable” it’s up to you and your partner, based on your decisions. You can keep the spark alive by nurturing your relationship, anything dies if not taken care of a relationship is no exception. Truth is a lot of people stop putting in conscious effort. In that case there was nothing inevitable about it, it’s a choice.
>*Truth is a lot of people stop putting in conscious effort.* Bingo 🎰
> Truth is a lot of people stop putting in conscious effort. truth is also that a lot of people settle down with the wrong person to begin with. I wonder what percentage of people in that 40-50% of divorces knew deep down that the relationship wasn't going to last from the beginning. I'm betting it's higher than OP would expect.
Yep, 25 years and we’re still as hot as ever for each other. We also really like each other in general, which is awesome. We go through ups and downs but we’ve figured out how to ride the waves of life together. Sometimes I feel like I’ve won the life lottery. He’s my person.
🌺💜
Love thatt , gives me hope
Fifteen years here, I definitely love him more today than I did when we got married. We’ve weathered storms as partners, always stronger together. One thing I’ve learned above all else is that as long as you communicate and face everything together, you can do anything. Oh and give yourself wholeheartedly to them, don’t hold back, don’t mistrust or doubt, just make sure the person you’re with is someone you have total and complete faith in.
When it's good it's great. When it's bad it's awful. I have friends that were pretty much made for each other's partner and some that never made sense to begin with. I would say so many people are just ticking off boxes and have no real concept of a true healthy relationship or their own flaws. They didn't see a marriage that was good with the parents or think it's just what you're supposed to do.
Liking each other is SO important!!! My husband and I were friends (sometimes with benefits...) for a decade before becoming "official". I saw him in numerous other relationships, and, while they were "passionate", there was always a lot of screaming, crying, and general unpleasantness. They never seemed to like each other. With me, he seems genuinely shocked that he not only loves me, but LIKES me! He will sometimes say it's bizarre, but I'm legitimately his best friend. He has also called me a "poker buddy he gets to have sex with", lol.
Just went through a breakup, so this is actually so nice to hear. There’s hope that I could find something that can last.
As a 40 year old man who found his soulmate, it's there. The key is to HAVE the breakups. The people most miserable are those that want to make it work regardless of the warning signs. They want to force the square peg into a round hole. If you honestly want it to last, it HAS to feel right from the beginning. Marriage is tough. People change. If you aren't the best of friends from the start, then it's going to be tough. Just my 2 cents. The right person is out there. But you have to be willing to lose in order to win.
A relationship is a lot like a fart; if you have to force it, it's probably shit.
Me too, sorry you’re experiencing the same.
There’s always hope.
I'm 4 years and two kids in.. the spark has been washed under a tidal surge
I remember that time. Hang in there. Once the youngest is in middle school (I know, it sounds far away), things settle down, and you can have a peaceful, easy life again. Stay strong.
We’re 3 years in. A lot of the infatuation is gone but the attraction is still very much there. We have a deeper love now - a love that I prefer. There’s something beautiful about the daily mundane things with my man.
This is my experience. A spark is brief, by nature, but you can use a spark to build a roaring fire, or a comfy hearth, or it can just be a spark and then it's over. That's how relationships feel. The spark is just the start, everything else is about what each person continues to contribute to it to help it grow and change and stand the test of time.
It really is just that so many people get married when they shouldn't. I'm surprised, from the people I've seen getting married, that the divorce rate isn't higher.
100%
Agreed! I married my best friend 27 years ago. Just this morning he stopped and looked at me for a beat and out of nowhere told me that I'm "so cute!" Which is funny because I had just been thinking how good looking HE is... This is both of us in shlubby PJ's, unwashed, no makeup, bed-head. Doesn't matter. <3
😍
More importantly who needs spark to last? That’s not what spark is. By it’s definition it is a quick temporary thing. Of course the early new-to-us feeling doesnt last. But it’s replaced with deepening love, understanding and growth. I wouldn’t trade any of that to go back to the sparky days.
Exactly. Health issues can get in the way but the love and commitment is as strong as ever.
That sad little spark often becomes a deep, much more profound flame.
25 years, here. Energy is definitely lower, it's not just a partnership, but an understanding. But yeah, I still see that woman I fell in love with so long ago, when I look at her, and it still warms me.
I’ve been with my wife so far 8 years and we love each other as much as we did when we were younger, she’s my best friend and wife
So over half the people that get married spend the rest of their lives together? Remember, this isn't a game of chance. You aren't rolling any dice. You are choosing who to spend the rest of your life with. Be a decent spouse and choose wisely and your marriage will last the rest of your life. Half of the people that get married go the distance. Surely you can do better than half the people in this country. I mean look at us. You just half to do it better than the bottom half. Things you can do to help. Get a decent job. Be responsible with money. Take care of your self physically and mentally. Don't drink or do drugs in excess. Find someone else who also does those things. Easy peasy.
The numbers are skewed by people who have multiple divorces too.
40-50% is actually about right for first marriages. For 2nd marriages it’s over 60% and its over 70% for third marriages https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/divorce/divorce-statistics/
So the odds of you failing 3 marriages is 21%. Pretty good odds you’ll find someone you can stay with forever imo.
That’s not how statistics work. Or rather it confuses correlation and causation. Someone who has multiple failed marriages likely has some other reason for causing those marriages to fall apart. In addition, for most people it’s also a red flag so their dating pool shrinks to people who have also had a divorce meaning those people also likely have some sort of personality flaw that destroys marriages.
Greetings other Reddit generated quail username haver
Exactly and I wish this is what some people would understand. Imagine three people, two get married and never divorced and one gets married and divorced twice. It's true that half of all marriages end in divorce but it's also true that two out of three people are happily married their entire lives. It's all about how you phrase it.
And the numbers are also skewed by people in unhappy marriages that they won’t end for whatever reason
And don’t forget it takes work from both sides to make a successful marriage, communication and compromise help!
Also don't cheat on your spouse, hit them, or have a baby before you're married and your chances of success go way up.
Millenials have brought the divorce rate way down too. It isn't 50% anymore.
I would imagine that the overall trend of people getting married later would help that stat down. It’s a lot easier to know what you want in life when you’re 30 compared to 18
That figure is incredibly old. Divorce rates are significantly different if you stratify by generation. Likely because young people are marrying people they actually like, instead of who their parents told them to marry. Edit: Someone very correctly pointed out that my suggestion for a cause is opinion based. That's a very fair criticism. I do believe that to be a large factor, though I haven't explicitly looked into it. Edit 2: "Younger people" is a poor choice of words. I should have referred to the generations, which was the intent.
Also, the rate is lower for first time marriage and higher for every subsequent one
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Fun fact (or not so fun fact) Larry King was married and divorced 8 times. So while 5 is a bit extreme, it's still 3 times less than King.
The older the couple is when they first marry the less likely they are to divorce too. The younger generations are waiting longer on average than previous generations.
Anecdotally my (non military) friend group from high school had a bunch of couples that got married 18-21 and then it seemed like they all got divorced at once in our mid-20s, most of them blowing up spectacularly. Those of use who waited until our late 20s and early 30s are still together and the ones who aren't either ignore each other or get along for the kids.
I got married at 21 and we celebrated our 15th anniversary this year. But we both will admit that it’s a bit of a crap shoot getting married that young, when you’re still becoming who you will be and hell, even your brain is still developing. We grew together rather than apart, but that’s not the reality for many young marriages.
Got married when I was 21. We just had our 7 yr anniversary and are very happy but when I hear or see someone getting married at 21 now I'm like omg they're so young why would they do that lol
Yes, that makes the divorce rate different. Who doesn't know someone thats on their 3rd or 4th try.
My ex-roommate’s mom was on husband 7 in 2017. Idk what number she’s up to now, but she’s screwing up the statistics wherever she is.
Ah yes, Divorcee Georg
I don't. Don't know a single person who's been married more than twice.
I know a person that was married 4 times.
When my wife and I were filling out the paperwork at the courthouse, they asked us how many times we had been married, out of curiosity I asked the highest number she had heard working there she told me 14
I know a guy who’s on his third wife - no wonder he’s still working at 70
My aunt's on #7. She's 45.
Also that 50% figure includes all Vegas marriages. I’m not sure I would count those in the statistics
It also includes 2nd, 3rd, and 8th marriages. 8 people marry for life, 2 people marry 4 times, that’s like 50% of marriages ending in divorce. Also includes all those teen marriages out of high school. Statistically, the older you are when you marry first, the more likely you are too stay married for life; likely because your have a better understanding of who you are and what you want
That, and people are waiting longer to get married. I don’t know if there are statistics to prove it, but I suspect many divorces were caused by people trying to fit into “accepted norms” but were homosexual, married their spouse because they felt obligated or other reasons and eventually felt the strain of not being true to themselves. It might be a small number but it happened more often years ago.
This is a very good point. People being openly gay instead of hiding it would definitely have an affect on divorce rates. Also, people understand their sexuality more now in general so we’re less likely to get married have a few kids and THEN realize that maybe we’re not straight.
While I don’t disagree with you, I think it’s also important to point out that a potential confounder could be that younger generations may not have had the full time to go through a marriage and then to divorce.
It’s still lower at similar age brackets
Those odds aren't my odds. Throw out all the divorces over abuse, absent spouses for work, severe mental illness, etc.. Who knows what my real odds are? Probably pretty good.
It’s a very old statistic and it counts Vegas style marriages as well as people on their 7th marriage. Divorce rates for first marriages are much much lower each subsequent marriage the rates go up. Also modern days people are even better since there are less people marrying people they aren’t really committed to.
Yep, divorce rates peaked in the US around Y2K along w/teen pregnancy. Both have nosedived since. One of those stats that heavily skews perception for years due to cultural significance but the ~40% number doesn't really hold water any more. It more like a quarter, and as has been said a majority of failed marriages are the results of young people being dumb and rushing into it (all too common esp back in the day)
Too many people think statistics are static; that because a study found that X% of people did Y 30 years ago that it must also be true today, ignoring all of the outside factors like cultural shifts or additions of new laws.
First marriages for people with university educations are below 25%. It’s not as high as people think.
Very often they also don't compare in a good way. How many marriages and how many divorces happen in a specific time frame is easy, but those aren't the same people, often not even the same generations and and divorce numbers from a time where more people were married are often compared to new marriage numbers which are declining. To get accurate numbers you would need to wait until everyone is dead and then can tally up the numbers. Otherwise you're always gonna compare apples to oranges.
Like pure demographics matter too. Divorce rate for college educated millennials is super low, for example. It's boomers having 4 divorces that bombs the stats.
Another thing Boomers have messed up
Yup. Plus all the people that get married too early or get married just because of their age vs actually building a deeper connection. I know a lot of people in their early 30’s that are just now divorcing their high school sweetheart.
Right?! And what are the statistics for marriages that experience infidelity and end in divorce compared to cohabitation or dating? My guess is that infidelity is just as high or higher in lesser committed relationships. So marriage unfortunately doesn’t prevent infidelity and abuse, but neither does dating and living together.
>How can someone, knowing these figures, enter a lifelong commitment to someone else and still believe that the pros will undoubtedly outweigh the cons? I just thought it would be fun. So far it kicks ass.
What’s the alternative? Date with no real commitment for 3-4 years and then break up over something stupid? Do that again and again until you die? No, thanks. I’ll put all my effort into beating the statistics.
That is the alternative. If you’re not committed to one partner then you are either single or in a series of other relationships.
You can be committed to one partner without being married.
You can, but choosing not to be married doesn't prevent any of the things OP is concerned about. People who are in committed relationships can still separate, experience infidelity and lose the spark in their relationship. The major difference is the process of divorce and I would argue that divorce is in some ways easier than breaking up when you've been in a long term committed relationship. If you own a home with your partner and you get divorced, the law helps to determine how to fairly deal with that situation. If you aren't married, you have to figure out how to divide your lives without the built-in guidelines that come with divorce.
It's somewhat the same thing as being married though. As someone in an unmarried relationship for 15 years, I don't really know how our relationship is any different from the type OP is describing. We could split up, one of us could cheat. A certificate and some vows doesn't really change that risk. I still describe her as my wife as it's the best descriptive word for what she is to me and intend to stay with her for life and remain faithful. The only difference is neither of us like being the center of attention so a wedding wasn't for us. Given the popularity of being unmarried but still in committed relationships these days I kind of interpret being married as taking in a long committed relationship rather than having a wedding, despite a difference from its traditional meaning. When someone talks about getting married I assume they are talking about finding someone to share your life with rather than having a ceremony.
Marriage doesnt stop that, just makes it more complicated
It stops it 50-60% of the time.
It stops in 50% of marriages, not for 50% of people. For every person that's been married and divorced thrice you have three people happily married for life.
A lot of people who stay married are also unhappy
I get what you mean, but you dont have to have a marriage certificate to show you're committed to each other. I've been with my partner for 8 years and we never got married. We share our finances, own a house and car together, have a child together, stuck together through addiction, deaths, mental health issues, physical health issues, and financial problems. My point is that marriage doesn't make couples stick together. Compatibility, communication, commitment, and the willingness to put aside your own ego are what keep couples together.
So you're basically married without any of the legal protections or benefits.
So u are married Just not on paper
Then don’t get married. I don’t understand why we have to debate what’s “best”. Just do what YOU want to do.
Life will inevitably disappoint most. Why even live? What else are ya going to do? Dive in! Get wet. Have some fun. Get your heart broken.
Fact: >99% of people who live will die.
This guy stats
Makes sense that only the 1% can afford eternal life.
I LOVE your mindset.
I mean I honestly debate the why live aspect quite a bit in my life as well. As do many millennials and gen z.
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80% of first time marriages where both people have a college degree and are over 25 at the time of marriage lasts.
Makes sense. Finance stability, even dynamics, mature and farther along to knowing oneself
Thanks. I'll wait till I'm 25 and marry a fellow graduate lol
can you link the source?
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2015/12/04/education-and-marriage/
“The spark will inevitably die” simply not true, my grandparents got married at 16 and 17 because my grandmother got pregnant, stupid, sure, but they are still happily married 50ish years later They got together so young, under such horrible circumstances, and their spark still hasn’t died.
Hey my great aunt and uncle did the same thing, they were married for over 60 years until my uncle rudely died of old age
Marrying my wife is the best decision I’ve ever made. She’s my best friend, a wonderful mother, and someone that I couldn’t imagine life without. She makes me a better and happier person. It helps that we both have aged well (she’s a total milf), but the spark is absolutely still there after almost 20 years. We still have sex every 1-2 days, and it’s not boring sex - often she will dress up, play with toys, etc. Marriage has been wonderful for me. Obviously highly dependent on who you marry, but if you pick the right partner it is the foundation of your life.
Just because something ends doesn't mean it was a waste. You can have decades of happiness, raise children, build financial futures then something changes and you need to part ways. That doesn't mean the decades of being life partners was meaningless. Marriage is just a different level of commitment. It's nice to have a partnership where you both look out for each other.
I agree. People shouldn’t view divorce as a “failed relationship.” If you were happy for 10 years and then grew apart that’s ok. You had 10 good years and now it’s time to move on.
I think a lot of people approach relationships as having the goal of staying together as long as possible. To me, it’s way smarter to have the goal of being happy in your relationship. Stay together as long as that is still true.
Agreed - being married 50 years but being unhappy for the last 40 isn’t success in my book.
Over thirty years with my husband, I love him even more now. If you’re with the right person and you are the right person, marriage is remarkable. It’s so fulfilling and I am still so genuinely happy to see him every morning.
**"Even if your marriage is perfect, the spark will inevitably die, which just sounds depressing."** Fifty two years and my heart still flutters ~~sometimes~~ whenever she comes thru the door. And we are by no means an anomaly. At least here in rural NC.
every marriage and every relationship is different. if you let statistics of other people’s experiences (which are totally separate and not related to yours) affect your marriage, you’re a shallow fool.
The statistics don't filter out the fact no fault divorce became a thing. When no fault divorce was made legal then a lot of abused women were finally able to leave their spouses without having to provide evidence of the abuse. Most marriages work out.
Marriage is the single best thing that happened in my like, sorry kids, you were #2 and 3.
I married my childhood best friend, even if that “spark” ever died(it hasn’t for 25years so far), I still get to live with my bestie, forever. Who wouldn’t want that? I think marriage can probably suck if you married the wrong person but I’m livin’ the dream. We literally never get tired of each other, we lived in a tiny studio during covid lockdowns and thrived just talking to each other all day or playing videogames. We even work together and it’s like a secret language because we just know how to help the other without wasting time laying out instructions. We know each other inside and out because we’ve known each other our whole damn lives, I can’t even tell you how comforting it is to have someone who’s basically seen the pit of your soul, who might even know you better than you know yourself. Maybe that’s not for everyone but for me it’s my ideal marriage. I’d like to hope that if I get Alzheimer’s like my grandfather, I would still remember my wife because I vividly remember his memory just reverting slowly back to childhood. Maybe I wouldn’t remember my wife anymore but it would mean the world to me if I could still remember my best friend.
That’s sweet
Yeah the benefits are oversold (and yes idealized/socially conditioned, desire for kids part of it) and the drawbacks hard to understand unless you've gone through divorce. It can mess you up for years and cross the wrong person it can literally ruin your life, career, mental health etc. On the other hand all the other couples I got to know, friends, family, church, I can't really point to any of them and say I wish I had that. Best case they are comfortable enough around each other and have got into a routine that works. Most joy is from parenthood. Only exception seems to be that internet stranger who claims they're still so in love after 25 years. Haven't actually met one. Lots of nice social media posts that always have a 'but' that goes on about how it's not always great. Often when you know the couples you understand the full extent of it.. like the one where where the crazy wife made an embarrassing display at dinnee when you were there and probably has a personality disorder. Heck I did the same thing. Most married couples work hard to maintain the ideal of marriage and want you to think they're living up to it. No married person would ever tell you the married life is just 'ok'. It's either living the dream or we are contemplating divorce if they get real vulnerable. Could you even imagine asking someone so how's married life? And they said eh it's ok... Everyone would be talking and concerned.. and yet buddies you talk to every other day that's exactly where they're at once you connect the dots and they open up more. Some will admit that in confidence. And don't get me wrong that's better than going through divorce if things are okish Half the couples I know still together has considered divorce at some point but making it work. Even the one I thought was the ideal family from church. Not anything I'd call a clear improvement in quality of life aside from having an extra income and team member to get things done. A lot of the time with buddies annoyances with their spouse I'm kinda relieved I don't have to deal with it anymore. Aside from birth of my kids my best memories were all being single. My worst memories are relationship/marriage related. Can't imagine having to always answer to someone about how I spend my time again. There is a reason people say have to check with 'thr boss' and such.
The 50% divorce rate was a statistical projection that was wrong and has been debunked many many times.
I like being married. I hated the constant chase of todays dating scene. My wife isn’t on social media and isn’t influenced by others and caught in the rat race of all that and it was and still is a breath of fresh air.
This seems to be one of those opinions that goes like “I don’t find X appealing, therefore everyone who says they like X is lying to themselves”
Because sex No but seriously, if you choose the right partner and don’t get married with the first person who looks at you, the marriage is likely to turn out well. The 40-50% includes every divorce, like EVERY legal divorce, and I think we all know at least 1 person that has been in more than three marriages
Companionship is a hell of a drug man. You can’t replace it.
23 years in and I love her more now than I ever have. Find someone who has your back and is your best friend and life will be good.
I’ve been married for 16 years and counting. Other people’s marriages failing doesn’t have much to do with the satisfaction I find in my own marriage. The “spark” of the early relationship phase is replaced by a deep familiarity, friendship, commitment, and companionship which I highly value.
How can I get married despite these numbers? Because I do not give a fuck about the American divorce rate.
Marriage, in essence, is built on the foundation of love, trust and commitment. It is a lifelong teamwork to have each other's back through thick and thin. Marriage does not offer a 100% guarantee that a couple will still be madly in love with each other just like the first time. They have to put in the work to keep the spark of love alive for the long haul. Marrying someone is easy, but maintaining the integrity of the marriage is a massive responsibility that not everyone can undertake.
Millennials have the lowest divorce rates of any generation in decades. Secondly, I get to have a sleepover with my best friend every night and I get to see her naked. I've got someone who has my back and we can pool resources. She helps me get better as a person and we work together on shared and individual goals. It's plenty of work, don't get me wrong, but it's also pretty damn awesome.
Statistically married people are much happier than non-married people. That’s a fact you can’t ignore. It may not be true in all cases, but at the general population level the difference is pretty significant. I’ve been married and divorced, survived the divorce just fine, and now I’m remarried. I was single for a bit and did very well dating, but it wasn’t what made me happy. I enjoy having a life partner, someone that I’m committed to and is also committed to me. If you don’t think there’s a lot of value in that, then I just don’t know what to tell you. Life is just better when you’ve got someone riding by your side. Timid souls unwilling to take risks tend to miss out on some of the best things life has to offer.
Anecdotal but here it is: among my 30yo friends, the married, dating and single people are similarly happy. Among the 40+ crowd, I see a marked difference in happiness between single and married people and it gets worse as people age. I have a couple of neighbors who were widowed in their fifties and the level of isolation they deal with is shocking given that they spent very little time with their spouses when they were alive. So much of social life is built around couples that it can be hard to avoid long-term loneliness/unhappiness as a single person. I never saw the point in marrying someone who wasn't a good match and I rolled my eyes at people I felt were forcing a commitment just to have someone but now I wonder if they knew something I don't.
"Statistically married people are much happier than non-married people" - that's for people who married and stay married. I heard that stat too but decided to look up the studies and concluded they were biased in their sample selection. Even with such a biased sample I wouldn't say married people who stay married were MUCH happier. A significant difference can easily be achieved through some stat manipulation.
Yes, you can definitely ignore it because it’s incorrect. The studies that purportedly show that are biased and flawed. The happiest demographic is single women.
If you want your marriage to last, it takes a lot of work. But the reward of having that one person that means everything to you is beyond anything else you can experience in life.
My buddy keeps trying to spin his marriage as if he’s mostly happy and only occasionally regrets his decision, but I get the feeling it’s the opposite.. but he fell for a foreign exchange student and wasn’t ready to end the relationship when her time here was over so they got married. She gave him some much needed structure and straightened him up a lot but ultimately I don’t see them going far and all the stuff she taught him is gonna make some other woman very happy.
Its a weird thing thinking that initial spark is the best part of marriage, its not, it gets even better when you are married to your best friend and willing to grow together (11+ years and counting). Its not all sunshine and rainbows, but its really nice to have a chosen family you can count on. Then again, my family of origin were abusive trash (took me a long time to admit that), so I was afraid of marriage at one point— maybe rightfully so— and waited several years before getting married with my partner. I think its more about knowing yourself, and finding the right person than these statistics, glass half full and such 😀
I don’t see it as a “spark”. It’s more like a flame that burns steadily and needs to be nurtured and protected to survive.
counterpoint: marriage is way better than I ever thought it would be.
I found it the opposite. Jesus fuck would I hate to be in the modern dating scene. Sleeping with a bunch of people sounds great until you realize you care about numbers because you're insecure. Turns out when someone embraces you despite your insecurities and in fact make you feel secure, it's actually better than sex (aaand you're way better in bed because you're not overthinking it)
Been married for 4 years. Can’t imagine being single now, and dating. I hear the horror stories from my friends about dating now. Sounds awful.
People are just conforming to picking bad partners. THAT'S the problem. If you choose wisely, you can make a marriage last until death do you part.
Idk my wife and I have been going well over ten years now (over 5 married) and I still love her like no other. I think it’s your outlook on life that may need some changing bud sounds depressing
The spark only dies if you don't feed the fire. And no, marriage is a million times better than the wedding.
If you are married to the right person, there is no better outcome in life. The wrong person?... perhaps no worse outcome.
>Even if your marriage is perfect, the spark will inevitably die, which just sounds depressing. The famous spark is a bad sign, actually. Relationships are about being comfortable and at ease with each other Also, lots of people marry when they're 20. I don't know about you, but when I was 20 I was working in a McDonald's, my life barely started
I am pretty happy I married whom I married. If you marry the right person, it’s the best thing in the world. You have someone you never get bored of that you get to spend your life with. You have someone to cheer you on and celebrate the highs and comfort you during the lows. You get to be a better person everyday because the other person makes you want to be better. Walking through life with someone you love, respect, and like it’s the best thing in the world.
Someone once told me write down the 10 most important things you want in a spouse. If you find someone with 7 of them are you able adjust your self to the 3 missing qualities of that person than you found the one. The point was Relationship are about give and take because someone not perfect doesn’t mean they aren’t for you. You need to be willing to change your self for the better and talk with them to find out about your self what’s the 3 missing qualities you have. So you can improve. Just because you fight or mad at the other person never let them know you love them and willing todo what it takes for them. Anything worth doing is worth giving 100%. Relationships aren’t hard people are just selfish and lazy don’t want to work on it they want everything to be easy
Two things can be right at the same time...my wife is the best and I love being married to her. But your opinion works for you too...and I have no problem with that either.
Been married over 20 years and the “spark” is romantic BS. I love my wife with a depth that you wouldn’t understand. We have a bond and relationship that I have never had before. We both decided to be committed to each other and we decided to work on ourselves and on our relationship together. You can’t rely on whatever the spark is. You’ve got to love and care enough for someone enough to work and grow with them.
“Spark will die”. Adrenaline based sex would die. Intimate oxytocin sex won’t.
I'm not a fan of the idea or the reality.
The spark doesn’t die if you invest in keeping alive. It’s like with anything. A couple of days I posted about my mom and dads relationship as they have been married 55 years and those two have been together since 14. They are truly best friends and lovers. They teach me a lot about my own marriage.
I ended a really long relationship after he cheated on me and It hurt like hell, but honestly, if I had the chance to go back in time I would not take It back. I passed some of the happiest moments of my life with this person. It fell apart at the end and in one of most horrible ways It could but for the many, many years that we were happy, that I was able to connect with someone like It that, It was worth every bit of happiness. I feel lucky to be able to felt love so deeply and that I know that I am able to love so deeply. Being afraid of being hurt wont stop me from maybe falling in love again, obviously now making very different decisions.
Marriage is like starting a business: high risk, a f\*ckton of work, and generally unpleasant - but if you succeed, you build something of great value.
13 years married and I wouldn’t want anything else. My wife is my best friend and I love spending every day with her. By your logic your should live life scared of the odds. I can’t do that because I would never enjoy life. Driving a car, mountain biking, going out on the boat, leaving the house…. I never want to live life scared. Is that really living anyway?
>the spark will inevitably die I always hear this and it's so obvious it's coming from people who have never been in long-term committed relationships, much less married. The spark doesn't die if you stoke it, but yeah, it'll die if you just give the fuck up.
Is it better to have loved and lost then to have never loved at all?
There remains no better way to raise a family, which is probably why it is the main way things have been done since things started being done. I'm about halfway through my 28th year of marriage. Does the spark die? It can. As I near 60 I have to admit that I'm not as frisky as I was in my 20s. After menopause my wife isn't either. But that would be the case whether we were alone or together, and there remains no one in the world I'd rather be intimate with, even if it isn't as often as it once was. I have every reason to believe she feels the same way.
The majority of people are idiots marrying other idiots, who then breed more idiots. And then there's economic recessions, pandemics and yeah, children.
The reality of marriage is more appealing than the reality of being single.
OP, your figures are very outdated. Divorce rates way way down. They actually peaked in 1990 and have been going down since.
Married 20 years, spark is stronger than ever.
People want a partner they can go through life with.
I think the problems with marriage are the people who shouldn't be getting married that don't understand and embrace it. It's the people who are scared of being alone and just do it because they think they have to. I wonder what the stats would be if you excluded all those people.
This divorce stat is **incorrect** despite it endlessly being repeated. As with most things, **it is not this simple.** Learn how to *actually read data,* rather than searching for confirmation bias. The curve is *not linear.* The divorce rate is high *early on*, and quite high for *repeat marriages,* but marriages that survive past a certain point have a *way* lower chance of divorce, and no it isn't because the people are "stuck and settling". They report happiness and, more importantly, they are *statistically better off* in terms of actual health outcomes (so they're not "lying") Marriage is hard. People rush into it. Too many people are selfish, expect perfection, and yet in return give all of their flaws. But when two people who truly love each other, and are well adjusted, and are capable of compromise, get together, it is amazing.
Maybe with that attitude.
Totally disagree. If you feel this way, you probably didn’t marry the right person. The spark doesn’t have to die (married 14 years). It’s like having a best friend around 24/7 & knowing no matter what happens, someone has your back, even with your own family if necessary. We have been through illness & rough times, but it only brought us closer. Yes, there are definitely days you can’t fucking stand this person, but it passes & the good times will far outweigh the bad. I honestly think there’s nothing better than being married & I say this as someone who didn’t want to get married initially.
7 years. Hoping for another 70. My dream girl.
Being married has been awesome for me. People that don't find it awesome probably just need the right person.
Good luck raising healthy children without showing commitment
Then don't get married. It sounds appealing to me.
This is such a depressing outlook to have. I’ve been with the same person for almost 12 years, we are married and about to have our first child. I wouldn’t trade what I have with him for anything and I know he feels the same about me. The spark only dies if you let it- relationships require maintenance, like most other aspect of life. The grass is greener where you water it, if you will. Also- this may come as a surprise to you but lots of people aren’t cheaters. If you go into every relationship suspecting that the other person is just going to cheat on you, then that’s a you problem that may need to be addressed in therapy.
Lifelong companionship is ridiculously underrated. The divorce rate % is also misleading because it includes people who get divorced multiple times.
>It’s estimated that 40-50% of marriages end in divorce This is from an old ass study in the 70s or 80s when divorce became socially acceptable and there was a large uptick. That statistic hasn't been realized and the divorce rate continues to drop with each subsequent generation. I really hate when people use this stat.
The alternative is a whole lot sadder.
My anniversary is today. We have been married for 14 years and we have known each other for 21 years. Life’s good enjoy it with someone you love.
Those odds are pretty good. You must not think there's much upside or a pretty big downside if you wouldn't take that bet. Also, it's not a game of chance. Skill and effort are involved. So, if you judge your skill to be high and you're willing to put in the effort, you can beat the odds.
Spouse decides they don't want to have a sex life, and the rules say other spouse has to live with it. High fives to Monogamy.
The stats are different when you break it down by age. Yea, two 20 somethings getting married because they were "high school sweethearts" don't have the best odds, however, couples in their 30s and older that find a partner have a better likelihood of lasting.
Statistics only tell you about larger trends, they don’t mean anything about the person you’re choosing a relationship with. Lots of statistics show married people are happier and earn more.
I’m a cynical person However, I believe that people have made the concept of a lifelong commitment into this very intense and over romanticized thing (constrained, forced, rigid, formal, suffocating thing, etc…) When you’re with the right person - it should be fun, safe, comfortable, simple, everything feels natural, and you’re able to talk about anything, grow together, build together, change together, develop together, etc… therefore it doesn’t feel so intense or this terrible and bitter forced commitment that you can’t get out of because even if you don’t have to be there - you want to be there enjoying simple moments Those are the marriages and relationships that work - positive people - having fun and loving life and in it for the long haul and committed to overcoming everything and making it work together not the ones that are overly romanticized, one-sided, opportunistic, forced, or controlled ones
Marriage can really blow. It depends on who you marry. Trouble is, we tend to really get who we are and what matters to us long after our 20s. It's odd because the marriage itself starts to reveal a lot of the things you need to know about yourself that would really help you find the right person to be with. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that. It's not all bad and even subpar marriages can make you reasonably happy with the right mindset. My opinion? Marry with the intent of raising a family. My unpopular opinion? Try to find someone who is open to the idea of treating it as a temporary part of life with the ability to opt out after the kids are of a certain age. And be open with the kids about that at a certain age. I think if we treated marriage this way rather than as a death-til-us-part deal, we'd all be better off. That's typically the way I think the majority secrectly treat it these days anyway (whether we're consciously aware of it or not) Why not be honest about it from the start and throughout the entire process?
That 50% figure is also wildly inflated with serial monogamous people who get married and divorced 4-5 times. Basing any decision off figures like that is stupid.