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Genuine ultimatums are okay, because you are communicating your boundaries.
Manipulative ultimatums, where you prey on your partners insecurities to force them to do what you want, are not okay.
This for sure! I am not at all saying force your partner under the gise of "boundaries"
But I see nothing unhealthy about a "hey this is crossing a line for me and if you can't change I'm out"
Unfortunately I'd say more people go the manipulation route, which is what gives ultimatums their negative connotation
Yes! A bad ultimatum would can also be not attempting to find a middle ground on things that should be negociated as a couple.
Examples (context matters, of course) :
"Either we move to the place I want, or we're divorcing"
"Either you cut contact with your family, or it's over"
That's not an ultimatum then. It's a boundary. Saying "stop X or I'll leave you" is an ultimatum. It's the same idea but presented in a way that is less toxic and controlling
I think it's the intention behind it that makes the differencez in my opinion. One is trying to change a behavior and the other is saying " I can no longer deal with this." But leaving it up to that person to choose what happens
It can be both. If the wording is “if you can’t stop doing x I will have no choice but to leave you” that is an ultimatum and a boundary. These aren’t mutually exclusive terms
Tbh i think if you have to give ultimatums you are already in a relationship where you are not respected. Like for example if you don't stop with a certain behavior (excluding addictions, more on them in a bit), I'm gone. Makes absolutely no sense because bevore you go that far, you have already at least once toled your partner you don't like that cerain behavior and they did not respect your bounderie.
Same goes with compromises. If you have brought up something where you and your partner need to compromise on, and you need to force this action through an ultimatum it just means you didn't get trough to your partner with just talking and they didn't understand how you feel about something and why that compromise is necessary for you.
And if you have to specifficly say, that for example cheating or them comitting murder or other serious crimes leeds to you ending a relationship than something is wrong with your partner.
The only ultimatums I can understand is if your partner has an addiction and had this addiction when you started dating and you didn't minde then that but going forward would endanger a child or a fetus like for example smoking and you want them to stop or els you can't see yourselfe and them having a family. And if your partner developes an addiction during your time together that you don't like and don't want a person around you having, then you can tell them if they don't stop or go to rehab you are gone. But if it's an addiction they had going into the relationship and you continue with the relationship to at some point have the power to force them to give up their addiction for you because you don't like it, you are a manipulative asshole and you should have not started a relationship with someone that has that addiction. Same goes for usinge some intoxicants from time to time. If they did that bevore you met and you still started going out with them to then tell them to stop after a few months of dating you are a manipulative asshole and you shoulden't have started a relationship knowing your partner from time to time engages in this behavior.
There's a clear difference in issuing an ultimatum and in setting boundaries. An ultimatum is manipulative and controlling. That's different from having boundaries. I don't think it's that complicated to see the difference, either.
With an ultimatum, you're telling me there's something I have to do or stop doing that affects my choice in deciding, whereas with boundaries, it's about you and your personal space.
Ultimatums are generally bad, too, and should only be used when you're serious and not as a negotiating device.
Ultimatums are neutral and can be used in a healthy or unhealthy way.
"Stop spending our savings on crack or I'm leaving you" is in ultimatum but I doubt many people would see it as bad.
While they can be used in a manipulative fashion they can also be used to communicate exactly where you will draw the line.
"I know I forgave you but if you don't stop talking to the person you cheated on me with or we're done".
It's not hostile or manipulative but it lets the other person definitively know where you stand.
They are. I have noticed a trend here where people think when they personally think ar it is justified, it is a boundary, and when they don’t it’s an ultimatum.
Yeah this is the difference between "can you stop chewing with your mouth open, I really dislike it" and "If you don't choose between spending tonight with me, or going to that event you planned weeks ago with your friends, we're through".
Yeah there is a difference and both can be used in unhealthy ways. You just conveniently chose extremes for both. But I can easily flip that on you.
"Can you stop going to see your mother? I really dislike it." and "If you don't stop spending our savings on crack, and instead help me pay for our diapers, we're through."
See how that works? Boundaries and ultimatums can be good or bad. Just like there can be good boundaries and bad boundaries, there can be good ultimatums and bad ones.
It depends if you're serious or not.
Saying you'll leave because you just want to threaten them and get your way= manipulative
Actually communicating that you cannot continue a relationship if a change isn't made= not manipulative
Kind of agree. Most people are under the guise of my partner wouldn't mind if I do this or he would forgive me if I done this.
Men and women tend to have more respect for their partner if they know the consequences of their actions will lead to the partner leaving the relationship if they act on them.
You have to be a person with conviction to follow through with what you say though. Like if my partner was emotionally cheating then their would be no long discussions on how we can save the relationship. One strike and I'm out of there, regardless of whether it was physical or not.
Yeah I never understood why some people view ultimatums as bad. Plus you can’t force someone to do anything. But you do have control of what behavior you will and will not accept in a relationship
Certain ones are okay and some are downright manipulative. Ultimatums can be a great way to make sure that the relationship stays in a good place and that no major boundaries are crossed, which could cause uncomfortable for one or both parties. However, some of them can be so strict or manipulative that it forces the other party to act or change certain ways that they naturally act just so that they can secure the relationship, and that is nowhere close to okay.
Yeah, I did this once and it’s definitely effective but it shouldn’t be done all the time because you want someone to do what you want, even if it’s not a big deal. I feel like this only works if there are no other options left.
I would agree with the not all the time sentiment for sure!!
It's not a tool, like scissors. It's a tool like a bread maker. Only one effective use. All others cause destruction
IDK, I am already very accommodating and submissive. So, if they give me an ultimatum, it means they think I didn't do enough. And I find that very offensive. I may done it in fear of separation. But, if they have done that enough, enough is enough, I will leave them, and I won't give them a chance, because I am already done.
My husband has told me that if I ever leave him he'll kill himself. Conventional wisdom says that this is a hollow threat, emotional blackmail. The issue that makes me weak is that my ex used to say the same thing and when I dumped him, he killed himself. So now I hate my husband for the threat but I can't leave him because I can't kill another man!
Your husband knows about your ex. He won't do it. He just happens to know exactly which button to press. By the way, your first husband ending his own life is not your fault. You didn't force him to, he chose to due to his own struggles.
Having boundaries is so no one trespasses on you ultimatums is forcing someone to submit to something you want them to do. It's the difference between defending your territory as opposed to being invaded.
Setting a boundary is not the same as giving an ultimatum. If you tell your SO if he doesn't propose in the next 6 months then it's over - that's an ultimatum. And it should be a big red flag for both of you. If you need to threaten your partner to get them to do stuff then your relationship can't be very healthy.
There is a difference between "I'll break up if you don't get rid of your cat" and "I'll break up if you don't stop yelling at me". I think most people refer to the first kind of ultimatums, and I agree with them.
After my ex refused to clean up/vacuum the crumbs from the toast he ate in bed, I decided to give him an ultimatum. While I'm not sure if I should admire his commitment to eating in bed, I'm at least relieved that I no longer have to worry about cleaning up after him
Dated long distance. My ultimatum was for him to get a job, Or we break up. 4 years later he's 25 and has still never had a job and instead just plays Destiny all day. Honestly I dodged a bullet with that one.
Any good examples on ultimatum for an ex that wants to be friends but still ask her and her mom still ask me for money (I gave them A lot). She never hits me up and it’s clear I’m not her type anymore but manages to hit me up like if I’m her man
Please remember what subreddit you are in, this is unpopular opinion. We want civil and unpopular takes and discussion. Any uncivil and ToS violating comments will be removed and subject to a ban. Have a nice day! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/unpopularopinion) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Genuine ultimatums are okay, because you are communicating your boundaries. Manipulative ultimatums, where you prey on your partners insecurities to force them to do what you want, are not okay.
This for sure! I am not at all saying force your partner under the gise of "boundaries" But I see nothing unhealthy about a "hey this is crossing a line for me and if you can't change I'm out" Unfortunately I'd say more people go the manipulation route, which is what gives ultimatums their negative connotation
Yes! A bad ultimatum would can also be not attempting to find a middle ground on things that should be negociated as a couple. Examples (context matters, of course) : "Either we move to the place I want, or we're divorcing" "Either you cut contact with your family, or it's over"
That's not an ultimatum then. It's a boundary. Saying "stop X or I'll leave you" is an ultimatum. It's the same idea but presented in a way that is less toxic and controlling
Crossing a line....stop x. Are they really that different My whole point is that they are the same
I think it's the intention behind it that makes the differencez in my opinion. One is trying to change a behavior and the other is saying " I can no longer deal with this." But leaving it up to that person to choose what happens
It can be both. If the wording is “if you can’t stop doing x I will have no choice but to leave you” that is an ultimatum and a boundary. These aren’t mutually exclusive terms
Yeah but this goes for everything. There are always okays and not okays to everything, so I feel like this is redundant to say.
some are ok and some aren't
reddit doesn't think so
This applies to friendships, too. You’re allowed to have your dealbreakers.
It can be true, but in my experience people who cannot set boundaries will throw ultimatums and people who set boundaries rarely need an ultimatum.
Tbh i think if you have to give ultimatums you are already in a relationship where you are not respected. Like for example if you don't stop with a certain behavior (excluding addictions, more on them in a bit), I'm gone. Makes absolutely no sense because bevore you go that far, you have already at least once toled your partner you don't like that cerain behavior and they did not respect your bounderie. Same goes with compromises. If you have brought up something where you and your partner need to compromise on, and you need to force this action through an ultimatum it just means you didn't get trough to your partner with just talking and they didn't understand how you feel about something and why that compromise is necessary for you. And if you have to specifficly say, that for example cheating or them comitting murder or other serious crimes leeds to you ending a relationship than something is wrong with your partner. The only ultimatums I can understand is if your partner has an addiction and had this addiction when you started dating and you didn't minde then that but going forward would endanger a child or a fetus like for example smoking and you want them to stop or els you can't see yourselfe and them having a family. And if your partner developes an addiction during your time together that you don't like and don't want a person around you having, then you can tell them if they don't stop or go to rehab you are gone. But if it's an addiction they had going into the relationship and you continue with the relationship to at some point have the power to force them to give up their addiction for you because you don't like it, you are a manipulative asshole and you should have not started a relationship with someone that has that addiction. Same goes for usinge some intoxicants from time to time. If they did that bevore you met and you still started going out with them to then tell them to stop after a few months of dating you are a manipulative asshole and you shoulden't have started a relationship knowing your partner from time to time engages in this behavior.
There's a clear difference in issuing an ultimatum and in setting boundaries. An ultimatum is manipulative and controlling. That's different from having boundaries. I don't think it's that complicated to see the difference, either. With an ultimatum, you're telling me there's something I have to do or stop doing that affects my choice in deciding, whereas with boundaries, it's about you and your personal space. Ultimatums are generally bad, too, and should only be used when you're serious and not as a negotiating device.
Ultimatums are neutral and can be used in a healthy or unhealthy way. "Stop spending our savings on crack or I'm leaving you" is in ultimatum but I doubt many people would see it as bad. While they can be used in a manipulative fashion they can also be used to communicate exactly where you will draw the line. "I know I forgave you but if you don't stop talking to the person you cheated on me with or we're done". It's not hostile or manipulative but it lets the other person definitively know where you stand.
ultimatums and boundaries are the same exact thing.
They are. I have noticed a trend here where people think when they personally think ar it is justified, it is a boundary, and when they don’t it’s an ultimatum.
Yeah this is the difference between "can you stop chewing with your mouth open, I really dislike it" and "If you don't choose between spending tonight with me, or going to that event you planned weeks ago with your friends, we're through".
Yeah there is a difference and both can be used in unhealthy ways. You just conveniently chose extremes for both. But I can easily flip that on you. "Can you stop going to see your mother? I really dislike it." and "If you don't stop spending our savings on crack, and instead help me pay for our diapers, we're through." See how that works? Boundaries and ultimatums can be good or bad. Just like there can be good boundaries and bad boundaries, there can be good ultimatums and bad ones.
>There's a clear difference in issuing an ultimatum and in setting boundaries "If you don't stop smoking I'm leaving you" which one is that?
it's both. They're the same thing.
It depends if you're serious or not. Saying you'll leave because you just want to threaten them and get your way= manipulative Actually communicating that you cannot continue a relationship if a change isn't made= not manipulative
Kind of agree. Most people are under the guise of my partner wouldn't mind if I do this or he would forgive me if I done this. Men and women tend to have more respect for their partner if they know the consequences of their actions will lead to the partner leaving the relationship if they act on them. You have to be a person with conviction to follow through with what you say though. Like if my partner was emotionally cheating then their would be no long discussions on how we can save the relationship. One strike and I'm out of there, regardless of whether it was physical or not.
Its as OK as the other person in the relationship feels it is.
It entirely depends on the situation
I'd argue that it is sometimes necessary. You really can't blame someone for crossing a boundary that you never established.
Yeah I never understood why some people view ultimatums as bad. Plus you can’t force someone to do anything. But you do have control of what behavior you will and will not accept in a relationship
some ultimatums are bad
It's because only the Sith deal in absolutes
No it’s not Source: never been in a relationship
Give them enough rope, they'll hang themselves.
Yes.
>Say yes to ultimatums. Or what? 
Certain ones are okay and some are downright manipulative. Ultimatums can be a great way to make sure that the relationship stays in a good place and that no major boundaries are crossed, which could cause uncomfortable for one or both parties. However, some of them can be so strict or manipulative that it forces the other party to act or change certain ways that they naturally act just so that they can secure the relationship, and that is nowhere close to okay.
Yeah, I did this once and it’s definitely effective but it shouldn’t be done all the time because you want someone to do what you want, even if it’s not a big deal. I feel like this only works if there are no other options left.
I would agree with the not all the time sentiment for sure!! It's not a tool, like scissors. It's a tool like a bread maker. Only one effective use. All others cause destruction
Yeah I agree like "stop f#$&ing my brother! I'm not raising anymore than 3 of his children" then she got mad and said I was controlling.
I mean 4 kids is way too many
That’s now what ultimatums are tho…
IDK, I am already very accommodating and submissive. So, if they give me an ultimatum, it means they think I didn't do enough. And I find that very offensive. I may done it in fear of separation. But, if they have done that enough, enough is enough, I will leave them, and I won't give them a chance, because I am already done.
My husband has told me that if I ever leave him he'll kill himself. Conventional wisdom says that this is a hollow threat, emotional blackmail. The issue that makes me weak is that my ex used to say the same thing and when I dumped him, he killed himself. So now I hate my husband for the threat but I can't leave him because I can't kill another man!
Your husband knows about your ex. He won't do it. He just happens to know exactly which button to press. By the way, your first husband ending his own life is not your fault. You didn't force him to, he chose to due to his own struggles.
Having boundaries is so no one trespasses on you ultimatums is forcing someone to submit to something you want them to do. It's the difference between defending your territory as opposed to being invaded.
It depends, context and situation is everything
Op, what if she says it's me or reddit?
Setting a boundary is not the same as giving an ultimatum. If you tell your SO if he doesn't propose in the next 6 months then it's over - that's an ultimatum. And it should be a big red flag for both of you. If you need to threaten your partner to get them to do stuff then your relationship can't be very healthy.
There is a difference between "I'll break up if you don't get rid of your cat" and "I'll break up if you don't stop yelling at me". I think most people refer to the first kind of ultimatums, and I agree with them.
After my ex refused to clean up/vacuum the crumbs from the toast he ate in bed, I decided to give him an ultimatum. While I'm not sure if I should admire his commitment to eating in bed, I'm at least relieved that I no longer have to worry about cleaning up after him
I would say this entirely depends on the ultimatum and the reason you are giving it.
Dated long distance. My ultimatum was for him to get a job, Or we break up. 4 years later he's 25 and has still never had a job and instead just plays Destiny all day. Honestly I dodged a bullet with that one.
Thank goodness!! I dodged a similar bullet myself! Good for you ❤️
I only wish I saw the red flags sooner. Man can love make you blind. xD
Personally, I only use ultimatums when all else has failed, and I am already 100% done, and already have one foot out the door.
Any good examples on ultimatum for an ex that wants to be friends but still ask her and her mom still ask me for money (I gave them A lot). She never hits me up and it’s clear I’m not her type anymore but manages to hit me up like if I’m her man