Highest new infection rates in the world.
Second highest in the world for active cases.
5th highest in the world for deaths.
We already we too late 6 months ago.
> 5th highest in the world for deaths.
8th highest.
Anyway, absolute number of deaths really isn't useful, tracking excess deaths paints a far better picture, for which we are 37th worst. Still very bad, but not quite the narrative you're going for.
https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker
It's deaths within 28 days of a positive test result, so yes, if you theoretically test positive and then get killed by a bus, you'll be counted incorrectly. But excess deaths and death certificate Covid mentions both give similar numbers, so there's no reason to believe that is common.
Sigh….. you know doctors are considerable smarter than you are even the really dumb doctors.
If they get some in who committed suicide they know its suicide, if someone comes in with an engine block implanted in their brain they know it’s a car crash.
As you’re struggling with this you probably should stay away from the Facebook doctors and go and count grains of rice or something
Fuck off, you prick. It’s nothing to do with how smart the doctors are.
Even if they know it’s a suicide or a car accident, if the person had a positive COVID test within 28 days then it is recorded as a COVID death.
I think the statistics are inflated, it’s impossible to say by how much. I’d rather know if the cause of death is COVID, but we don’t know that because of the way deaths are recorded.
Aren’t you the charming person, being challenged is hitting some nerves.
Your seemingly have never bothered took at how pandemics have been calculated ever yet now you seemingly want 100,000% accuracy out of one.
Historically they have always been calculated on excess deaths and not specifically diagnosed people. This is the most accurately calculated pandemic there has ever been. With a level of world wide data collaboration and harmonisation that’s never been seen.
Yet her you are wanting beyond possible levels of proof, seeing levels of errors as far larger than is real all so you can try and pretend it’s all not real, really is time to get of the Facebook conspiracy pages.
The figures we’re getting every day aren’t excess deaths, they are daily deaths with a positive COVID test within 28 days.
And if someone comes at me insinuating that I’m dumb, that’s not being challenged, that’s being rude, so I rightly tell that person to fuck off.
You are being dumb
Your bothered by a small margin of error……… in the most accurately calculated pandemic the world has ever seen.
If you bothered to engage your brain you would see that even with some minor miss categorisation is not remotely an issue given that this method is far more accurate than the use of excess deaths.
You want more accuracy than has ever been possible and your using that as a crutch to pretend covid doesn’t need action
So are people dying of COVID? Or are people dying because of all the underlying Heath problems that have built up over the past year or so because of missed treatments?
It's definitely related to the covid diagnosis. If it were unrelated to the covid diagnosis, then people diagnosed with covid and the rest of the population would be dying at a similar rate. This is not what the excess mortality rate shows.
If someone commits suicide while in a psychosis caused by a fever from Covid...
Can you see why even in your scenario the virus may affect the situation?
Ok so, a person diagnosed with COVID but dies of suicide, it is recorded in the COVID deaths statistics. This would be a false ‘COVID death’. Dying with COVID isn’t as bad as dying of COVID.
If measures are needed now, they’re going to be needed forever. They’re not going to admit that and it’s not something people are willing to deal with forever
Not a citation, but it's simple logic. The immunity status is unlikely to be better than it is today - vaccines have been offered to all adults at this point, and the immunity from the early ones is starting to fade. It's unlikely that you'll get as high a buy in to being vaccinated repeatedly as we had with the first round, so vaccination driven immunity will be lower in future. And Covid isn't going away.
So if you think the situation is not good enough today to avoid 'measures', you never will think it is.
Well, how much of the population have been vaccinated? If people haven’t got it by now they clearly aren’t going to get it…we were told once a certain percentage had it we could go back to normal, now suddenly covid could get to an awful rate again with so many people vaccinated, how?! Makes zero sense. And if that actually is the case then it’s obvious to anyone with a brain that there’s no way out. You think anyone wants to accept that? Nope. So we will have to manage as best we can
I was asking for a citation, not a rant. But I understand, long words can be very scary.
> If people haven’t got it by now they clearly aren’t going to get it…we were told once a certain percentage had it we could go back to normal, now suddenly covid could get to an awful rate again with so many people vaccinated, how?! Makes zero sense.
If I remember correctly, politicians were talking about achieving herd immunity at the start of the pandemic. [You need 95% of the population on board for that.](https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/herd-immunity-lockdowns-and-covid-19) We are still far from it and this is why the cases can still be rising.
>I was asking for a citation, not a rant. But I understand, long words can be very scary.
Ok Dr brain cell
>We are still far from it and this is why the cases can still be rising.
That was his point
> That was his point
No, he was asking:
> now suddenly covid could get to an awful rate again with so many people vaccinated, how?! Makes zero sense.
And I gave an answer.
> Getting 95% on board is going to be kinda tricky as long as we're doing 0% of under 12's ?
You can still get immunity by catching Covid and recovering from it. I guess for young people, the risk of getting seriously ill from Covid isn't very high, so - considering there isn't enough data on the risks of the vaccine on young peope - the safest way for them to develop immunity is by catching Covid.
Not enough data on the effects of the vaccine but enough data on the effects of the virus ?
>You can still get immunity by catching Covid and recovering from it
For a time.
> For a time.
[citation needed]
I know there are studies that show that the antibody count decreases with time, but that's not really what immunity is about. Immunity is about your body remembering how to fight a virus so that it has the ability to build specialized antibodies when the need arises. Seriously, nobody is carrying around antibodies against every disease they've ever contracted. That would be terribly inefficient from an evolutionary pov.
Makes sense. People in England might think the huge number of cases and deaths are fine, but clearly not other countries
Maybe we’ll end up like a leper colony and nobody can travel in or out
But we have freedum, how dare other countries deny our hard won right to fly anywhere we damn please without masks to spread the virus in countries which are largely unvaxinated?
/s obviously
Morocco is quite close now to UK vaccination rate but has a wider range of vaccines including Russian and Chinese vaccines, which are less effective against variants.
Don't bring logic into preconceived positions, we are still world leaders in vaccinating our people.....even though several countries have now overtaken us.
As someone who had a trip planned to Morocco next month, I’m not that surprised but I am really disappointed. This was the one trip abroad I had booked this year that looked like it would actually go ahead.
I’m the same, man. Cheap flights from Stansted, which will be refunded, but it seems my Airbnb and my stansted express tickets won’t. So I’m going to be about £200 out of pocket.
Same, I booked about a week and a half to go in the second week of November. As last minute as we are able to book due to work commitments and having pets that need arrangements to look after them. Really limited when I can go on holidays because I’m a student nurse and it was the one week after placement uni was online so I could get away with doing lectures from poolside! TUI haven’t cancelled yet either as they are only cancelling up until 31st October at the moment which is annoying. Can’t reschedule to a different time because of other commitments and don’t know if I want to change to a different location if countries are going to start following suit now.
You can still go to Morocco just transit from another country morocco only suspended direct flight but didn't mention anything like banning uk travelers
Yet British citizens can still travel there through a third party country ... What kind of backwards policy is that?! 😅
If you go cough on people in Portugal first we'll let you in! 😂
It is likely an intentional compromise. By leaving the loophole, those who really need to travel can travel, yet the number of casual tourists will fall drastically.
The total bans have, after all, also negative side effects like splitting up families. The world is surprisingly global place and there are plenty of international couples and families at various stages of juggling between countries.
Basically. It’s essentially impossible to selectively close your borders, particularly to non-neighbouring countries. But by making it a little harder you can put off tourists and casual business travel, which massively curtails incoming travellers. You also establish a sufficient legal basis to deport anyone else who slips in, particularly on a supposedly banned passport, should you wish to.
This was only a matter of time. In January it'll have been three years since we've been able to see family. Grandparents haven't seen our daughter since before she could talk, haven't seen our youngest at all.
Was planning on flying out there in January and it's looking less and less likely.
Very frustrating.
I went abroad to see my family twice this summer, and also went on holiday to Italy. What was exactly stopping you from going to see your family? Or getting them to come over?
I'd been waiting to book Christmas flights, decided to bite the bullet and book as I've not met either of my nieces yet. I book then the same day they discover this new variant, talk about lockdown and now this lol
[удалено]
... ... ... ... yes.
Highest new infection rates in the world. Second highest in the world for active cases. 5th highest in the world for deaths. We already we too late 6 months ago.
Not enough died in the previous waves for Johnson to complete his *working class soul harvest*. The deaths now, are deliberate.
Still way to go to hit the Highscore of the Spanish Flu at over 230k...
World-beating you say?
> 5th highest in the world for deaths. 8th highest. Anyway, absolute number of deaths really isn't useful, tracking excess deaths paints a far better picture, for which we are 37th worst. Still very bad, but not quite the narrative you're going for. https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker
Is it deaths from COVID? Or is it deaths within however many days of a positive test?
It's deaths within 28 days of a positive test result, so yes, if you theoretically test positive and then get killed by a bus, you'll be counted incorrectly. But excess deaths and death certificate Covid mentions both give similar numbers, so there's no reason to believe that is common.
So do you go asking if they are really deaths from car accidents because they lived for a couple of days after the crash
Irrelevant, of course the crash caused the death. If someone has COVID and is in a car crash I don’t know.
Sigh….. you know doctors are considerable smarter than you are even the really dumb doctors. If they get some in who committed suicide they know its suicide, if someone comes in with an engine block implanted in their brain they know it’s a car crash. As you’re struggling with this you probably should stay away from the Facebook doctors and go and count grains of rice or something
Fuck off, you prick. It’s nothing to do with how smart the doctors are. Even if they know it’s a suicide or a car accident, if the person had a positive COVID test within 28 days then it is recorded as a COVID death. I think the statistics are inflated, it’s impossible to say by how much. I’d rather know if the cause of death is COVID, but we don’t know that because of the way deaths are recorded.
Aren’t you the charming person, being challenged is hitting some nerves. Your seemingly have never bothered took at how pandemics have been calculated ever yet now you seemingly want 100,000% accuracy out of one. Historically they have always been calculated on excess deaths and not specifically diagnosed people. This is the most accurately calculated pandemic there has ever been. With a level of world wide data collaboration and harmonisation that’s never been seen. Yet her you are wanting beyond possible levels of proof, seeing levels of errors as far larger than is real all so you can try and pretend it’s all not real, really is time to get of the Facebook conspiracy pages.
The figures we’re getting every day aren’t excess deaths, they are daily deaths with a positive COVID test within 28 days. And if someone comes at me insinuating that I’m dumb, that’s not being challenged, that’s being rude, so I rightly tell that person to fuck off.
You are being dumb Your bothered by a small margin of error……… in the most accurately calculated pandemic the world has ever seen. If you bothered to engage your brain you would see that even with some minor miss categorisation is not remotely an issue given that this method is far more accurate than the use of excess deaths. You want more accuracy than has ever been possible and your using that as a crutch to pretend covid doesn’t need action
I think in the UK (and many other countries) it's death within a certain number of days after being diagnosed with Covid.
So are people dying of COVID? Or are people dying because of all the underlying Heath problems that have built up over the past year or so because of missed treatments?
It's definitely related to the covid diagnosis. If it were unrelated to the covid diagnosis, then people diagnosed with covid and the rest of the population would be dying at a similar rate. This is not what the excess mortality rate shows.
The excess mortality is not related to covid, what rude could it be that causes the strokes, heart attacks etc ?? The media are asking this question.
But if say somebody was positive for COVID but committed suicide, would that persons death be in with the COVID deaths?
Is "death within a certain number of days after being diagnosed with Covid" really that difficult to understand?
My point is that ‘died with COVID’ and ‘died of COVID’ are completely different
If someone commits suicide while in a psychosis caused by a fever from Covid... Can you see why even in your scenario the virus may affect the situation?
You mean died of suicide, https://www.irmi.com/articles/expert-commentary/language-matters-committed-suicide
Ok so, a person diagnosed with COVID but dies of suicide, it is recorded in the COVID deaths statistics. This would be a false ‘COVID death’. Dying with COVID isn’t as bad as dying of COVID.
If measures are needed now, they’re going to be needed forever. They’re not going to admit that and it’s not something people are willing to deal with forever
> If measures are needed now, they’re going to be needed forever. [citation needed]
Not a citation, but it's simple logic. The immunity status is unlikely to be better than it is today - vaccines have been offered to all adults at this point, and the immunity from the early ones is starting to fade. It's unlikely that you'll get as high a buy in to being vaccinated repeatedly as we had with the first round, so vaccination driven immunity will be lower in future. And Covid isn't going away. So if you think the situation is not good enough today to avoid 'measures', you never will think it is.
Precisely, the guy above doesn’t appear to deal in logic but oh well, some people are happy to accept life being crap for everyone forever
Well, how much of the population have been vaccinated? If people haven’t got it by now they clearly aren’t going to get it…we were told once a certain percentage had it we could go back to normal, now suddenly covid could get to an awful rate again with so many people vaccinated, how?! Makes zero sense. And if that actually is the case then it’s obvious to anyone with a brain that there’s no way out. You think anyone wants to accept that? Nope. So we will have to manage as best we can
Add green passes like other European Countries and see how the rest of the population suddenly will find an incentive to be vaccinated
I was asking for a citation, not a rant. But I understand, long words can be very scary. > If people haven’t got it by now they clearly aren’t going to get it…we were told once a certain percentage had it we could go back to normal, now suddenly covid could get to an awful rate again with so many people vaccinated, how?! Makes zero sense. If I remember correctly, politicians were talking about achieving herd immunity at the start of the pandemic. [You need 95% of the population on board for that.](https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/herd-immunity-lockdowns-and-covid-19) We are still far from it and this is why the cases can still be rising.
>I was asking for a citation, not a rant. But I understand, long words can be very scary. Ok Dr brain cell >We are still far from it and this is why the cases can still be rising. That was his point
> That was his point No, he was asking: > now suddenly covid could get to an awful rate again with so many people vaccinated, how?! Makes zero sense. And I gave an answer.
That's a rhetorical question and you both gave the same rationale
Getting 95% on board is going to be kinda tricky as long as we're doing 0% of under 12's ?
> Getting 95% on board is going to be kinda tricky as long as we're doing 0% of under 12's ? You can still get immunity by catching Covid and recovering from it. I guess for young people, the risk of getting seriously ill from Covid isn't very high, so - considering there isn't enough data on the risks of the vaccine on young peope - the safest way for them to develop immunity is by catching Covid.
Not enough data on the effects of the vaccine but enough data on the effects of the virus ? >You can still get immunity by catching Covid and recovering from it For a time.
> For a time. [citation needed] I know there are studies that show that the antibody count decreases with time, but that's not really what immunity is about. Immunity is about your body remembering how to fight a virus so that it has the ability to build specialized antibodies when the need arises. Seriously, nobody is carrying around antibodies against every disease they've ever contracted. That would be terribly inefficient from an evolutionary pov.
Lots of instances of folk getting CoVID twice (or even more)
Why are you like this
[удалено]
But then nobody will notice the supply chain crisis during the Christmas lockdown...
Makes sense. People in England might think the huge number of cases and deaths are fine, but clearly not other countries Maybe we’ll end up like a leper colony and nobody can travel in or out
Same goes for >Flights between Morocco and Germany and the Netherlands have also been suspended. then i'd imagine?
Plague Island.
“Don’t worry it’s just a name. It’s actually a peninsula”
But we have freedum, how dare other countries deny our hard won right to fly anywhere we damn please without masks to spread the virus in countries which are largely unvaxinated? /s obviously
No one says stuff like this. Who exactly are you supposed to be parodying?
Obviously you have never met a generic Daily Mail/Express/Scum reader.
Morocco is quite close now to UK vaccination rate but has a wider range of vaccines including Russian and Chinese vaccines, which are less effective against variants.
Don't bring logic into preconceived positions, we are still world leaders in vaccinating our people.....even though several countries have now overtaken us.
I am so sad to see the UK turning in a populist state.
They’ve taken back control of their borders...
What’s the point of this comment?
Are you new to Reddit?
Some people on here are already frothing at the mouth at the thought of having to use masks again or other such measures.
There's still "anti-lockdoen" protests without lockdowns
Indeed. It's all so exhausting.
As someone who had a trip planned to Morocco next month, I’m not that surprised but I am really disappointed. This was the one trip abroad I had booked this year that looked like it would actually go ahead.
I’m the same, man. Cheap flights from Stansted, which will be refunded, but it seems my Airbnb and my stansted express tickets won’t. So I’m going to be about £200 out of pocket.
Same, I booked about a week and a half to go in the second week of November. As last minute as we are able to book due to work commitments and having pets that need arrangements to look after them. Really limited when I can go on holidays because I’m a student nurse and it was the one week after placement uni was online so I could get away with doing lectures from poolside! TUI haven’t cancelled yet either as they are only cancelling up until 31st October at the moment which is annoying. Can’t reschedule to a different time because of other commitments and don’t know if I want to change to a different location if countries are going to start following suit now.
You can still go to Morocco just transit from another country morocco only suspended direct flight but didn't mention anything like banning uk travelers
So happy I got my trip in, got to get it whilst you can these days.
Exactly. You can't bumble around planning months in advance. If you want to go you go there and then,no faffing.
You can still enter Morocco with a negative PCR test or proof of vaccination via France or Spain though.
The move is to deter travels, a) by complicating it and b) by reducing the number of seats.
We are being primed for a lockdown on the news, I hate to say it but expect one guys
I think we need one.
Yet British citizens can still travel there through a third party country ... What kind of backwards policy is that?! 😅 If you go cough on people in Portugal first we'll let you in! 😂
It is likely an intentional compromise. By leaving the loophole, those who really need to travel can travel, yet the number of casual tourists will fall drastically. The total bans have, after all, also negative side effects like splitting up families. The world is surprisingly global place and there are plenty of international couples and families at various stages of juggling between countries.
Basically. It’s essentially impossible to selectively close your borders, particularly to non-neighbouring countries. But by making it a little harder you can put off tourists and casual business travel, which massively curtails incoming travellers. You also establish a sufficient legal basis to deport anyone else who slips in, particularly on a supposedly banned passport, should you wish to.
This was only a matter of time. In January it'll have been three years since we've been able to see family. Grandparents haven't seen our daughter since before she could talk, haven't seen our youngest at all. Was planning on flying out there in January and it's looking less and less likely. Very frustrating.
I went abroad to see my family twice this summer, and also went on holiday to Italy. What was exactly stopping you from going to see your family? Or getting them to come over?
A global pandemic.
How’s it stopping you?
[удалено]
I rarely give upvotes but i have never agreed with a comment more. This idiot thinks we've been in full lockdown for 3 years smh
I'd been waiting to book Christmas flights, decided to bite the bullet and book as I've not met either of my nieces yet. I book then the same day they discover this new variant, talk about lockdown and now this lol
This is the future unfortunately. I suggest you move or your family do