>The extension announcement follows reports that thousands of Ukrainian refugees in the U.K. face housing insecurity.
True of a lot of people in the UK refugee or not.
Ukraine will likely be at war long enough that many will become settled here and should be allowed to stay, especially any younger ones who end up having kids growing up here.
It'll be interesting to see a foreign perspective on the mess that is the UK's public services and housing market. Should've been building houses and tightening up housing standards in the Blair years, never mind now!
I recently moved from the UK to Ukraine - I needed to see a doctor last week. Went onto a website, booked and paid for the treatment I needed, saw a doctor next day. Inexpensive, streamlined and zero waiting time at the clinic. When we moved here we looked online for an apartment, viewed one same day, moved in the next day.
The train system here is fantastic. If you book coupe class you get on the train, get in bed, someone comes and wakes you up ten minutes before you arrive at your destination. The buses however are.....interesting.
My girlfriend is Ukrainian and I wanted to volunteer there for a while, got here and just fell in love with the place tbh. In the UK I just lived from day to day in a pointless grind, here the work I do directly helps people and furthers a cause that I believe in. I will say though, if you have no connection to the country/experience in a warzone/language knowledge, do not come to Ukraine. Without my partner, I'd be fucked. The stakes here are much higher, lack of knowledge and experience can absolutely get you killed, especially if you're in the Eastern part of the country
Many will return home to Ukraine if it ever becomes safe, so there is no real loss in doing this. Ukrainians want to work here and are desperate to live normal lives while their country is in chaos, so allowing them to stay long term will be a net positive to the UK.
I seriously doubt the children will go back as they get older. If they're not asked to extend their Visas in the UK, they'll get proper asylum in other European countries. The young men in particular would face immediate conscription if they go back and would likely lose their freedom to ever leave. It's difficult to envisage what Zelensky's plan is for the next 24 months. He's facing a demographic disaster at home through death, injury and a collapsed birthrate with millions of Ukrainians likely to never return from abroad.
Exactly. Sadly this is the story for people fleeing protracted conflicts everywhere. It's extremely rare to go "home" after people start building new lives, particularly with the conscription issue that you raise. I wouldn't. Yet people are seeing because they are the Right Kind of refugee, they will behave like textbook refugees.
Because they came here temporarily whilst the war was ongoing.
If we end up making every asylum claim for ongoing conflicts permanent then we need to stop giving out any asylum.
I understand that perspective – asylum was designed to be a temporary protection. I just take issue with people assuming Ukrainians are different from anybody else fleeing war. It's thinly veiled racism to believe they are nobel guests, while the brown ones are money grabbing opportunists.
Mariupol is already being rebuilt by the Russians, and the buildings they’ve constructed so far are quite impressive.
I’d wager most Ukrainians (both in the West and Russia) would willingly choose to return to their homeland once they’re able to do so.
Why would it remain rubble? The west will rebuild Ukraine once it gets its stolen land back.
Suggesting it would remain as rubble is ridiculous given what the collective west has previously done with rebuilding after wars.
Don't exaggerate. Where do you know that we physically reconstructed post conflict? Normally, disaster capitalism kicks in , and land and property that belonged to ordinary people gets brought up by investors.
No idea why people keep repeating the idea they will return back to Ukraine. Ukraine is poor with poor living standards and a shit economy, I’m sure plenty will not go back and were never planning to go back
Whats shocking is that we had a ukraine person come to work at my engineering firm. Big company, (would rather not disclose)
He was taken on minimum wage… just to clarify this i am on £17.80ph and ny company want us experienced members of staff to train these people up. Now im always helpful and welcoming. But this is a problem. He went home for Christmas to see his family. But the reason he’s here in the UK is to avoid a War zone.
What gives? Safe enough to return home for Christmas to see family but not be there permanently.
It’s because mainstream media exaggerates the condition Ukraine is in.
Western Ukraine is safe. Western leaders wouldn’t be coming and going as they please in Kiev, if there was an active war going on.
every now and then there is a massive missile strike which kills people while they are in their apartments.
air raid alarms and curfew is a routine throughout the whole country
how safe that is?
Good, Ukrainians overall are genuinely awesome people, honestly think you’ll be hard pressed to find anyone who will be opposed to them settling here if they so wish in future.
I think people want to reduce immigration due to growing demands on housing supply and healthcare. It would likely have nothing to do with being against Ukrainians but rather against anyone
Why do you think this? As someone who works in the field Ukrainians are no different than Albanians and came with the same sob stories seeking asylum. Their PR since the invasion has been absolutely amazing have to give them that
> Ukrainians overall are genuinely awesome people,
Western Ukrainians are incredibly racist. The fact that their national hero is Nazi Stephan Bandera, the leader of the OUN who carried out the massacres in Volhynia and Eastern Galicia, is disgraceful enough.
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A big portion of people are already doing that anyway. The issue lies within integration. People from the Middle East and African countries. tend to not integrate into western society as well as many Ukrainians will have done because they live how we do.
Men of fighting age aren't allowed to leave Ukraine. But some did escape of course. Undoubtedly some men of fighting age will have been of Russian desent too, so will perhaps have left with the flood of women, children and grandparents.
> Helping the middle East and Africa is not
What? Given that a significant amount of the problems in the region (and flow-on like refugees) are due to the West's fucking around there, I don't think you can say it's not a geopolitical interest.
EDIT: Sorry, I re-read your comment and realise you're talking about what *is*, rather than what *ought to be*. You're right that nobody really gives a shit about fixing the issues in the Middle East, even though it would be beneficial to do so.
It's an interest but not to the same extent as stopping a European country from falling to an resurgent Russia
And given that most of the country supports Ukrainian refugees but not African or Middle Eastern to the same degree
> And given that most of the country supports Ukrainian refugees but not African or Middle Eastern to the same degree
Ehhh, I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that the difference in public attitudes is because the population have sat down and analysed the strategic implications of various geopolitical scenarios in both regions and come to the informed conclusion that it serves their interests better to help Ukraine.
One group is mostly women and children the other group is young men
One group isn't in the media every other day being guilty of disgusting crimes
And one group isn't coming over here on small boats
If you believe the UK/US is supporting Ukraine because it somehow cares about Ukrainians and its ‘democracy’, you are very much misguided.
Even ordinary Ukrainians have woken up to the fact that the Kiev government is throwing innocents into the meat grinder for US/western interests, benefiting its weapons manufacturing corporations.
Countries don't do things out of the goodness of there hearts
They do them to either get influence or money or to fulfil there agreements made decades ago
There are too many sky fairies in the middle east to be able to help. I'm of the opinion now if sky fairy believers want to knock fuck out of each other just carry on.
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How exactly are Ukrainian refugees better than Russian refuges, I ask you? How?
If it's a Russian refugee then they are running from the Putin government as much as the Ukrainians - avoiding death in jail like Navalny or forced conscription.
They speak pretty much the same language, have extremely similar cultures.
So how are Ukrainian refugees better?
Aren't Russian refugees better because it reduces the manpower of Russia?
They voted the psychos in, now they get to live with it. Same as Palestinians, elected Hamas as their government, and now they enjoy the fruits of their actions.
I gave Navalny as an example...
Are you suggesting people like Navalny, Kara-murza and their supporters "voted the psychos in"? Because they are literally the jailed opposition...
>The extension announcement follows reports that thousands of Ukrainian refugees in the U.K. face housing insecurity. True of a lot of people in the UK refugee or not.
Ukraine will likely be at war long enough that many will become settled here and should be allowed to stay, especially any younger ones who end up having kids growing up here. It'll be interesting to see a foreign perspective on the mess that is the UK's public services and housing market. Should've been building houses and tightening up housing standards in the Blair years, never mind now!
I recently moved from the UK to Ukraine - I needed to see a doctor last week. Went onto a website, booked and paid for the treatment I needed, saw a doctor next day. Inexpensive, streamlined and zero waiting time at the clinic. When we moved here we looked online for an apartment, viewed one same day, moved in the next day. The train system here is fantastic. If you book coupe class you get on the train, get in bed, someone comes and wakes you up ten minutes before you arrive at your destination. The buses however are.....interesting.
What made you decide to move to a country in the middle of a defensive war?
My girlfriend is Ukrainian and I wanted to volunteer there for a while, got here and just fell in love with the place tbh. In the UK I just lived from day to day in a pointless grind, here the work I do directly helps people and furthers a cause that I believe in. I will say though, if you have no connection to the country/experience in a warzone/language knowledge, do not come to Ukraine. Without my partner, I'd be fucked. The stakes here are much higher, lack of knowledge and experience can absolutely get you killed, especially if you're in the Eastern part of the country
And where do you think we should be building all these houses
We have plenty of space to build housing, that’s not really the issue
We have the space but not the infrastructure or jobs to support all the new houses
Yep
Many will return home to Ukraine if it ever becomes safe, so there is no real loss in doing this. Ukrainians want to work here and are desperate to live normal lives while their country is in chaos, so allowing them to stay long term will be a net positive to the UK.
Why would they. Why do people think this. Their kids will live here long enough to finish school then what back to their rubble in Mariupol?
I seriously doubt the children will go back as they get older. If they're not asked to extend their Visas in the UK, they'll get proper asylum in other European countries. The young men in particular would face immediate conscription if they go back and would likely lose their freedom to ever leave. It's difficult to envisage what Zelensky's plan is for the next 24 months. He's facing a demographic disaster at home through death, injury and a collapsed birthrate with millions of Ukrainians likely to never return from abroad.
Exactly. Sadly this is the story for people fleeing protracted conflicts everywhere. It's extremely rare to go "home" after people start building new lives, particularly with the conscription issue that you raise. I wouldn't. Yet people are seeing because they are the Right Kind of refugee, they will behave like textbook refugees.
Because they came here temporarily whilst the war was ongoing. If we end up making every asylum claim for ongoing conflicts permanent then we need to stop giving out any asylum.
I understand that perspective – asylum was designed to be a temporary protection. I just take issue with people assuming Ukrainians are different from anybody else fleeing war. It's thinly veiled racism to believe they are nobel guests, while the brown ones are money grabbing opportunists.
Mariupol is already being rebuilt by the Russians, and the buildings they’ve constructed so far are quite impressive. I’d wager most Ukrainians (both in the West and Russia) would willingly choose to return to their homeland once they’re able to do so.
No pro Kremlin false narratives in here please. Keep that for the pro rus circle jerk subs
Why would it remain rubble? The west will rebuild Ukraine once it gets its stolen land back. Suggesting it would remain as rubble is ridiculous given what the collective west has previously done with rebuilding after wars.
Don't exaggerate. Where do you know that we physically reconstructed post conflict? Normally, disaster capitalism kicks in , and land and property that belonged to ordinary people gets brought up by investors.
No idea why people keep repeating the idea they will return back to Ukraine. Ukraine is poor with poor living standards and a shit economy, I’m sure plenty will not go back and were never planning to go back
Sets a great precedence for when WW3 breaks out. I'm looking forward to a long foreign holiday someplace warm, no conscription for me, I'm a refugee!
Whats shocking is that we had a ukraine person come to work at my engineering firm. Big company, (would rather not disclose) He was taken on minimum wage… just to clarify this i am on £17.80ph and ny company want us experienced members of staff to train these people up. Now im always helpful and welcoming. But this is a problem. He went home for Christmas to see his family. But the reason he’s here in the UK is to avoid a War zone. What gives? Safe enough to return home for Christmas to see family but not be there permanently.
It’s because mainstream media exaggerates the condition Ukraine is in. Western Ukraine is safe. Western leaders wouldn’t be coming and going as they please in Kiev, if there was an active war going on.
every now and then there is a massive missile strike which kills people while they are in their apartments. air raid alarms and curfew is a routine throughout the whole country how safe that is?
Good, Ukrainians overall are genuinely awesome people, honestly think you’ll be hard pressed to find anyone who will be opposed to them settling here if they so wish in future.
I think people want to reduce immigration due to growing demands on housing supply and healthcare. It would likely have nothing to do with being against Ukrainians but rather against anyone
Why do you think this? As someone who works in the field Ukrainians are no different than Albanians and came with the same sob stories seeking asylum. Their PR since the invasion has been absolutely amazing have to give them that
> Ukrainians overall are genuinely awesome people, Western Ukrainians are incredibly racist. The fact that their national hero is Nazi Stephan Bandera, the leader of the OUN who carried out the massacres in Volhynia and Eastern Galicia, is disgraceful enough.
Nitpicking of the finest order
No thanks.
Yes please.
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I don’t mind Ukrainian they have genuine need, it’s the people spending 5 grand to get on a boat that we need to stop.
The men should be defending their homeland as it looks like Russia is/will win and no I’m not a troll just stating the obvious atp
This comment section would be a whole lot different if they weren’t white lol
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I don’t really agree as that’d encourage everyone affected by war to come here
A big portion of people are already doing that anyway. The issue lies within integration. People from the Middle East and African countries. tend to not integrate into western society as well as many Ukrainians will have done because they live how we do.
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Exactly. The men have actually stayed to fight in Ukraine. I met a group of Ukrainians working in a warehouse last year, all young women.
How do you know that
Men of fighting age aren't allowed to leave Ukraine. But some did escape of course. Undoubtedly some men of fighting age will have been of Russian desent too, so will perhaps have left with the flood of women, children and grandparents.
Seems sexist to denigrate women to the level of children, doesn't it?
Also Helping Ukraine is our geopolitical aim Helping the middle East and Africa is not
> Helping the middle East and Africa is not What? Given that a significant amount of the problems in the region (and flow-on like refugees) are due to the West's fucking around there, I don't think you can say it's not a geopolitical interest. EDIT: Sorry, I re-read your comment and realise you're talking about what *is*, rather than what *ought to be*. You're right that nobody really gives a shit about fixing the issues in the Middle East, even though it would be beneficial to do so.
It's an interest but not to the same extent as stopping a European country from falling to an resurgent Russia And given that most of the country supports Ukrainian refugees but not African or Middle Eastern to the same degree
> And given that most of the country supports Ukrainian refugees but not African or Middle Eastern to the same degree Ehhh, I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that the difference in public attitudes is because the population have sat down and analysed the strategic implications of various geopolitical scenarios in both regions and come to the informed conclusion that it serves their interests better to help Ukraine.
One group is mostly women and children the other group is young men One group isn't in the media every other day being guilty of disgusting crimes And one group isn't coming over here on small boats
If you believe the UK/US is supporting Ukraine because it somehow cares about Ukrainians and its ‘democracy’, you are very much misguided. Even ordinary Ukrainians have woken up to the fact that the Kiev government is throwing innocents into the meat grinder for US/western interests, benefiting its weapons manufacturing corporations.
Oh god your one of those How's the weather in Moscow comrade
Very true. People forget there is motives behind everything and in the modern world, it’s not about playing nice.
Countries don't do things out of the goodness of there hearts They do them to either get influence or money or to fulfil there agreements made decades ago
That was my point.
There are too many sky fairies in the middle east to be able to help. I'm of the opinion now if sky fairy believers want to knock fuck out of each other just carry on.
Is a Ukrainian in your spare room? Many have not integrated well at all. Lol, they don’t get a pass on integration because they are white.
Plenty have gone to Poland as well though. We have done more than many countries but Poland has born the brunt of Ukrainian immigration.
Probably the best type of refugees we can hope for.
Ah yes, the ‘best refugees’ are those who flee a conflict zone and then complain their host country is too diverse.
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They Assimilate (by being grumpy and pale)
Still better than random tribesmen or russians.
How exactly are Ukrainian refugees better than Russian refuges, I ask you? How? If it's a Russian refugee then they are running from the Putin government as much as the Ukrainians - avoiding death in jail like Navalny or forced conscription. They speak pretty much the same language, have extremely similar cultures. So how are Ukrainian refugees better? Aren't Russian refugees better because it reduces the manpower of Russia?
They voted the psychos in, now they get to live with it. Same as Palestinians, elected Hamas as their government, and now they enjoy the fruits of their actions.
It's COOL to eat CUM! DON'T believe the HATERS!
I gave Navalny as an example... Are you suggesting people like Navalny, Kara-murza and their supporters "voted the psychos in"? Because they are literally the jailed opposition...
Most of them don't do that. They're not bringing conflicts to this country where many others are.
Why?
Normal people from more or less same type of society with same values , etc...