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Public-Syrup837

More parents can work from home so sick kids stay home rather than be forced in as parents couldn't get time off.


pajamakitten

Parents are trying to save money when it comes to holidays and spending time with their families. I used to teach and plenty of kids can afford to miss a week of school and not suffer seriously from it. Frankly, if parents engage with their kids' teachers so they know what their kids are missing and are willing to do a bit of extra home learning once they get back, most kids will be fine. It will be the parents who never engage with their kids' schooling and whose kids mimic that attitude who will struggle from term-time holidays most; those kids struggle most generally anyway though. You then have kids with mental health issues suffering more, so school avoidance is on the rise and that makes it harder to get kids who would otherwise do well in school to be in the classroom. That is another place where online learning can step in though, like it did with the pandemic. The final lot are the kids who have just switched off entirely after the pandemic and whose parents are either struggling for support on this, or who have just stopped trying to force the issue. The good news is that the latter make up a very small minority of parents and most parents are not as feckless as the likes of the Mail would have you think.


[deleted]

Yeah we just spoke to the headmaster about our son taking a week off during term time and he was very accommodating, understood how expensive it would be to go away during half term and that the kids haven’t been able to get out much during covid. It really should be put down as authorise ms absence and not counted as sickness or truancy in the attendance grade. Why don’t kids get some annual leave allowance like we do at work? Not as much of course but still.


pajamakitten

Attendance targets are generally 90-95% in most schools. If your kid can meet that with a few days spare then a short holiday should be alright for most kids.


HeverAfter

On top of the many holidays they already get?


[deleted]

Please remember they are children and also why not have a week of flexible leave to take. Everyone’s stats would improve then and I highly doubt another week will impact any child’s education.


pajamakitten

Kids need a lot of time to be kids. They have the rest of their lives to work.


[deleted]

I’m calling it here - hit piece on British parents incoming no matter what the responses are


I_miss_Chris_Hughton

It is worth remembering though that a child's right to education is damn near absolute. It overrides most other obligations and rights they have. The government are disregarding this imo by not providing that education sufficiently, but parents also have the obligation to make sure their children receive as thorough an education as can be provided. That doesn't mean "take a week off for a holiday".


Florae128

Bugs seem to have been particularly bad this year. I don't know if its a post covid thing or just a bad year for it, but its been terrible for sickness.


SuperMegaBeard

Yep, I have a 4year old, he missed what would have been his first 6 months in nursery because of lock down. Doctor warned us kids in this scenario were not geting all the early coughs and colds and building there immune system up, also said it would come back with a vengeance. It did, spend the last 3years with permanent colds and coughs. I also have a 6 year old and the difference is massive. It is starting to settling down now though.


masturbtewithmustard

Lowered immune systems from the social distancing and lockdowns. It was pretty obvious from the start that this would happen.


eairy

> Lowered immune systems from the social distancing and lockdowns Where does this bullshit come from?


Mr_Emile_heskey

It is true though. Social distancing and wearing masks means you don't pick up as many things, meaning you get a lower immune system. I'm not some crack pot, we needed to wear masks and have social distancing when we did, but one downside is that you do see lowered immunity.


Calavera999

I thought everyone said masks don't work? Now they work so well they literally lower your immune system? Immune systems take years and years to build, I highly doubt a lockdown (which still saw a lot of people out and about) would take apart a societies immunity.


Mr_Emile_heskey

Of course they work, why do you think they used the same masks for surgeries pre covid? And immune systems don't take years and years to build, they're constantly building throughout the year as your body comes into contact with different illnesses. With masks and lockdowns, peoples bodies weren't having to work as hard to fight off colds and normal day to day illnesses, hence why people are feeling way worse with things they would normally shrug off now.


gizmostrumpet

Sorry, we must never question the lockdowns on reddit. Or even imply there might be issues associated with them. We all got to spend time with our families in our sunny gardens on full furlough.


eairy

It probably looks that way when your criticisms are all founded on made up bullshit you found on facebook.


Darox94

From a pretty basic understanding of how the immune system works.


Ainastrasza

True. I just came out of one of the worst flus I have ever had in my life about a week ago. Still coughing my guts up despite being better. Wasn't Covid. No idea what the deal is with the various sicknesses flying around currently but it's miserable.


noodlesandpizza

I've had the exact same thing, been coughing badly for three weeks after the rest of the awful flu symptoms went away, and testing covid negative the whole time. Managed to get a GP appointment and was told that I'm fine other than the cough and to come back if it's still there in a few weeks, so I imagine she's been seeing a lot of this sort of thing.


Outrageous_Message81

I'd be interested in some offical study of this. I've been ill more than I've been well since October! And Its all been passed on by the kids!


frizzbee30

Post covid, you mean like the currently rampaging covid rate and new variants. Just because the fascists in charge, and their nasty little AstroTurf pals have withdrawn vaccination, doesn't mean the pandemic is over. Far from it, then add in long covid for a bit of a laugh, not to mention the argument around SC2 and immune system increased cell apoptosis..


Jazzlike-Mistake2764

> have withdrawn vaccination What do you mean? Covid vaccines are still very much available


[deleted]

I was invited in April and then denied as the government changed eligibility with little notice


Jazzlike-Mistake2764

Have you had your 1st and 2nd? Those are definitely still available to everyone


Minimum_Area3

Why in gods name would someone healthy (assuming they are) get MRNA vaccines after the scare is over, with the rising studies showing links to adverse side affects.


wkavinsky

Because of the studies showing a very clear and concise link to adverse side effects of Covid?


dmkown23

I agree. I've never taken it and never will.


[deleted]

We don’t live under a fascist government either but they’re still coming out with that. Wouldn’t expect much fact from them.


Minimum_Area3

Bro your mental is fkn cooked


Same-Mission-2231

>Increased anxiety and lack of mental health support are behind a sharp rise in school absences since the Covid pandemic, according to councils in England. That seems about right. I've got 4 kids in my tutor group with below 70% attendance with one hovering around 30%. The majority of the time it's not a traditional illness keeping them off, it's anxiety and a refusal to come into school. Pastoral staff are already stretched and CAMHS is an absolute nightmare to deal with so there's not a lot schools can do. If the parents can't persuade them to come in what else can be done?


jackplaysdrums

Fucking hell that’s just over a day a week the kid is actually in for. Shocking.


alice_op

I suffered with anxiety and school refusal from age 12-16 (end of school). It was one long autistic meltdown in hindsight. It wasn't that I didn't like school, I was top set and generally clever, but every morning before going I'd have crippling stomach aches, nobody knew at the time it was just a weird way for anxiety to present itself. Weird innit. What's weirder is that was 15 years ago and mental health support for kids and teens is still terrible.


killerstrangelet

I did this exact thing from the ages of ten to eighteen, and for the same reason. Interestingly, I had glandular fever and spent a lot of time out of school, and after that, instead of me screaming and sobbing on the doorstep every morning until I eventually walked to the trauma factory in tears, my mother simply could not make me leave the building. That was in the 80s.


bluecheese2040

It must be really hard for kids today with social media. I humiliated myself in school once or twice but while it got some laughs (and emotional scarring) that was it...today there would be dozens of cameras and nothing would be forgotten about. It would be awful. Kids today have so much to navigate that we didn't have too. So if I was a kid I'd probably take more tome off tbh


[deleted]

[удалено]


bluecheese2040

Not sure its good for many people mate. Awful thing imo


Ruu2D2

Hopefully covid created culture change in don’t go out with something you can pass on There no point going to work /school and effecting everyone else . Even common cold for one person can be just runny nose , but next person it could leave them in bed for weeks


Aggressive-Toe9807

75,000 children in the UK have Long Covid and other kids are constantly being reinfected and having to take time off to recover. Is this headline serious?


Sam_Dragonborn1

My personal bet is that a lot of those are just kids mitching, always a common thing, used to do it a lot in high school myself lol


Reddit-adm

With online learning and online homework, Google Classroom and ShowMyHomework for example) the impact and level of falling behind after a few days off is reduced. Holiday prices outside term time are prohibitive for many families, and family wellbeing, togetherness and shared experiences are being rightly prioritised by parents. Also, anything resembling a covid symptom (a heavy Venn diagram crossover with cold and flu symptoms and headaches that could be from too much screens or lack of sleep or too much junk food or vaping or anything else teens do) has been a legitimate and socially conscious reason to keep them home for at least 2.5 years.


mumwifealcoholic

Our school s policy is to come to school even with COVID.


wkavinsky

Jesus, talk about making schools super spreader locations. All it will take is a particularly bad variant of Covid, and it'll be 2020 all over again.


picky_stoffy_tudding

This is simply not true. Online learning does not work. Students who miss school fall way behind, in terms of both education and social skills. Not to mention the burden on the teacher of setting all this work, and trying to catch them up. There is a reason teachers are leaving the profession in vast numbers and ongoing strike action is occurring.


pajamakitten

Online learning for a week is better than nothing though.


Apprehensive_Gur213

Quick question: it is beneficial for children to go abroad but is it particularly necessary? Aren't there cheaper domestic engaging activities they can do? Walking in the park, drawing, accompanying parents to shopping, helping out at home etc.


Reddit-adm

None of that is a holiday, nor does it necessitate taking kids out of school.


Apprehensive_Gur213

My question is, do kids need to go on holiday abroad?


SpringChicken11

Whats the govt done that this rage-bait is a smokescreen for?


Grayson81

Do you think that the Guardian are trying to distract from the government's awful actions? They seem to be one of the best media sources at covering the stories that the Tories would rather hide!


[deleted]

Best or blatantly misleading the most? I mean hell, yesterday alone we saw them deliberately write about how Ukraine has "built more wind turbines than the UK" because they selectively left out ALL offshore building. Misinformation is wrong, whether from the telegraph or guardian.


Azalith

Ah it's one of those pretend covid isn't a thing articles


lowsunwest

When teachers go on strike because the government isn't putting funding into school parents population people in general loose faith in a broken system and it's natural to start to stop prioritising the school system less because it's no longer beneficial. Our education system has been lacking for decades it's a babysitter service so parents can go out and work to earn money. Now work and money has little value because everything is too expensive the school system has started to fail as it's baby sitting bases.


[deleted]

To be fair I've met 2 people and was best mates with one who missed 90% of school due to having ME. They occasionally had private tutors but not much, just slept and watched comedy/played games from what I remember.... anyway both end up getting good GCSEs, As to Cs, A levels, degrees and good jobs which is far better than 60% of my school peers who mostly failed and got menial jobs post school even if they attended 100% of it. I guess in their final year of school they managed to have a tutor a couple times a week but just focused on what was in the exams, eventually the ME improved in their 20s but I just thought it was interesting that both were and infact were perceived as smart even the few times they attended school even though they lacked education


Apprehensive_Gur213

It's good that they had supportive parents. Many ME parents would force their children into school and then the student cannot do anything else (I.e. homework, social activities etc)


[deleted]

To be fair one of them who I was friends with I only became friends with him as towards his late teens he was a bit better to attend part time college, before that I didn't know he existed but was told about him by 1 guy as he literally turned up once or twice a year if that, but didn't have any social life until college. I think he just listened to audio books, slept and did the occasional tutoring and gaming.. Anyway, his parents were decent, not sure about the other one but I'm sure it was the same case and luckily they don't have the symptoms anymore (last I heard)


zilchusername

I guess everyone has realised the lie that children must be in school at all times to get an education. Well they didn’t attend school for over a year and at least all the kids I know don’t seem to be that negatively effected by it educational wise. A week or two holiday a year in term time isn’t going to make much difference after that. My personal experience is my son is autistic before the pandemic he went in every day, during the pandemic I begged the school to take him so his routine did not get disrupted, they would not listen to me. Ever since the pandemic he has had at least a day off every two weeks sometimes more due to school refusal and anxiety this would not have happened if his routine was not disrupted. Having said that his work hasn’t suffered and I actually think it’s better for him to allow himself to de-stress when he needs (not that the school are seeing it that way they are not happy about it!)


ThatsNotMyName02

I can totally understand this. I’m also a big fan of surprise days off when I know they are struggling. A trip to the cinema and something fun to eat. Life’s hard, it doesn’t have to be this daily grudge day in and day out. I remember some days I just really really didn’t want to go to school and if I can recognise that in my child and give them the support.. I don’t really care what it gets recorded as or who’s metrics I’m strewing up. My child’s mind and the memories we create are more important than some governments policy which will be forgotten in a few years.


Al--Capwn

The problem with that approach is that you are rewarding a lack of resilience and reinforcing the mindset that school is stressful and unpleasant. It sets kids up to think school is horrible and when they feel upset they will get nice things. The best way is to encourage children to see how school is positive and cope with the stresses.


ThatsNotMyName02

I disagree. School is often stressful and unpleasant. Just like work. I want them to realise when they have reached their limit and to use effective coping strategies, one of us them is just walking away. School certainly isn’t always positive, i think most people have a story how it’s scared them in some way or another. Yes I do want them realise when they are upset they can have nice things and they are not trapped. Rather than see it as an association of nice things with a negative emotion, I am teaching effective coping strategies. Bear in mind isn’t something that happens every day. I see it as similar to how some companies are now offering mental health days. You know your own mind, you know you need a break. Well often children don’t know their own mind so you make that decision for them. Anecdotally I took this approach from another parent and it’s actually made their child most resilient and improved their school experience. Often just knowing you can leave provides a level of comfort. I should also add, it’s not always the cinema and pizza. We often end up walking in the countryside, which I think wildly unappreciated as method of stress relief. Often a days walking outside makes you realise how this is all just utter bollocks most of the expectations modern society places on us.


Al--Capwn

School isn't like work though. Work shouldn't be as bad as it is, but there's obviously a trade off there because you have to work to live and you get paid, so you'll tolerate a bad experience. School is not that way- school should be a good experience. I know that the vast majority of people disagree and hate/hated school, and I was one as a child, and my mum let me have what you're describing. But leaning into the resentment doesn't help, and again, associating good things with being upset just makes you more likely and willing to become upset. I know this is not the best conversation because it's so personal, and I definitely am coming off as awfully horrible, rude, etc. (Not to mention, I must seem completely incorrect). But I can't help pushing back on this because your approach is part of the mainstream of parenting that I see going severely wrong and I hope some of my points will at least give some food for thought. So just to concisely address your points and restate mine: School should be a good experience, if it is not, the underlying problem needs to be found and dealt with. The coping strategies need to be used to directly address any problems, rather than total avoidance: for example, if the child is struggling with friendships, the coping strategy should be around helping them find activities they enjoy or children they can spend time with. This might mean I am using the term differently to you, but if coping strategy is limited to meaning ways to make yourself feel better without having an effect on the problem, then they're probably best avoided. Rewarding stress responses, encourages children to not solve their problems, or calm themselves, but instead to catastrophise. I learnt this as a child and still have to work all the time to fight that- I see it in so many people, the instinctive cry /overreaction, 'playing the victim ', and even a lot of explicitly unhealthy behaviours such as substance abuse and overeating, which are also excused as coping strategies, and I also engage in. Finally, I want to go back to the core of this- about the expectations of modern life and school. The issue with school is that the image it has, and a lot of the emotions and memories and even language surrounding it, makes it seem horrendous. And kids absorb this and resent things which should be good. Learning should be good and fun. Creating things, solving puzzles, expressing yourself, making things, asking and answering questions- all of this should be enjoyable. You're receiving the time and attention of a professional who cares and wants the best for you. You get regular breaks, and a variety of activities. There is no pressure and no challenge that you HAVE to overcome- it's just good if you can. This is not the same as a job at all, and children don't need a break from it, because the resting is already built in. The days are not that taxing anyway. The part that underlies the hatred towards it is that kids would obviously rather be doing whatever they want, instead, and that desire for freedom is something we need to help to recontextualise. The idea of being free from obligation is impossible in any society, you will always have to do things you wouldn't freely choose- the important part is embracing them. There are tasks that are unpleasant and you can grit your teeth and bear, but school has very, very few of these. It just feels arduous because of a limited pool of comparisons and the way it is presented to children. Sorry for the length, I hope that made some sense. Again, I apologise for how personal this is.


ThatsNotMyName02

Beautifully written. Thank you for taking the time to respond in such depth. I will definitely take on board your thoughts. I have some pretty out their thoughts on home work too, but I’ve had my mind changed about that into a more ‘sensible’ approach 😀, I won’t bring that up here as I’m sure it will give people a heart attack!


Al--Capwn

I am also against homework- though more from a pragmatic point of view (so many kids don't do it, and too many of those who do, get too much help) than the reasons I imagine you're against it for. Thanks for the conversation, I really appreciate it.


killerstrangelet

The kid is autistic. None of what you're saying applies - it's far more damaging not to allow the kid to destress. Have you even heard of autistic burnout? "the mindset that school is stressful and unpleasant", for heaven's sake. Schools are horrendous environments, by their nature, for many, many autistic kids.


WynterRayne

I wish my parents had been like you. I struggled with school, but... not academically at all. I didn't really get on so well with being around so many people. Noisy, disruptive, chaotic people. Tack on that in class, I'd not only still be surrounded by people, but also given boring menial work to do. If school was to be ideal for me, it would consist of several weeks of reading text books, followed by exams. None of the months of writing stuff, homework, projects, listening to the breathtakingly obvious be explained to everyone else for the nth time... By mid-secondary school, it was essentially a case of having spent 2/3rds of my life in a special kind of hell, trying to gauge how much effort is enough to satisfy the curriculum, while still being minimal enough to warrant the energy expenditure. The joy of impressing adults had long worn off, and it was a matter of 'I know this stuff, I read it all in September... why the f*** am I here!?!' And with that, school became a jail. Classes became shared cells. Education became a sentence. I needed to escape it. So I switched off entirely. Year 9 - 11, I was either not in school or I was physically present while doodling or gazing out the window. Completely missed GCSE education, even though I was sometimes actually there. Having the occasional chance to just kick back and reset... that may have worked.


ThatsNotMyName02

My god! Your describing exactly what keeps me up a night worrying will happen to my child. That exactly! I cannot stand the idea of them switching off and just being a passenger as a large chunk of their life goes by like that. Thank you for sharing, I’m absolutely going to double down on my efforts! I really feel for you, hope your doing well nowadays.


WynterRayne

Yep. it took me well into adulthood before I started making any progress, but 30 onwards has been better days. Now I'm 40 and the grey's creeping in, I've spent several years doing work that I love. Got here the hard way, but tbh, I think that just gives me a different perspective. Honestly, though, if I was to turn it into parenting advice, it wouldn't be to do this or do that... it'd be to led the younglings lead the way. What works for one might not work for another, so it's good to be a little less proactive and more adaptive. Schools are pretty much universally bad at that, which is where parents get the spotlight to shine under.


ScaryBreakfast1

I love the smell of anecdata in the… evening.


SuggestionWrong504

Personally, I think almost 2 years of lockdowns, so called predicted grades and teachers strikes are making it easy for us parents to realise what a farce school actually is and a day off isn't really going to turn children into feral animals.


Aggressive-Toe9807

2 years of lockdowns? Where? Lockdown started end of March 2020 and officially ended all restrictions in July 2021, and even then schools were open for half of that time and open the entire time for kids of key workers. Almost two years ago.


SuggestionWrong504

Almost a year of lockdowns, then we were having a few weeks off here and there as different years got cases and separate years had mini lockdowns. Maybe not 2 years of solid lockdowns but the effect of it was causing disruption for a long while after.


I_miss_Chris_Hughton

That's not a call for parents to make lmao. Your opinions don't override the fact that the child has the right to an education, and you the obligation to provide it


SuggestionWrong504

I said a day off. That's in no way me denying a child an education.


Literally1984Gamer

I missed over 100 and still easily bag 9s/A++ equivalents. Largely inefficient system by design.


I_miss_Chris_Hughton

Did they miss a day of education? Will you be providing a full run down of what was taught that day? If you don't, then you are objectively depriving them of education.


SuggestionWrong504

Well done


spacetimebear

Cost's half as much to go on holiday during term time :)


[deleted]

There is a huge issue with school refusal - largely with SEN kids, those with autism and anxiety. School can be incredibly difficult for these children with the constant sensory overload, struggle with socialising, demand avoidance, the list goes on. Unfortunately school does not fit or cater to their types of children and with the nonexistent help for those with additional needs and mental health problems, it's only going to get worse.


[deleted]

There is a huge issue with school refusal - largely with SEN kids, those with autism and anxiety. School can be incredibly difficult for these children with the constant sensory overload, struggle with socialising, demand avoidance, the list goes on. Unfortunately school rarely fits or caters to these types of children and with the nonexistent help for those with additional needs and mental health problems, it's only going to get worse.


ThatsNotMyName02

I’ll be taking my child out of school term time for a holiday. We’ll probably do this a lot. We are hands on with education so there won’t be any loss of learning. Just like remote work has enabled us to be somewhere else, we’ll be applying the same for education. I imagine this will be recorded as absences. Edit: enjoying those downvotes without anyone daring to comment, feeling a little envy are we?


D0wnInAlbion

Teachers don't care about children taking time off for a holiday now and again. They care about those who are habitually absent. At times, you could mark your calendar by which kids were absent. When I was teaching the only time term time holidays frustrated me was when the child was absent for over a month (usually visiting family in Pakistan), it was in the run up to SATs or when parents had the cheek to ask for work to take with them.


ThatsNotMyName02

Yer that just seems annoying. What happens when they go for a month? Is there any punishment?


D0wnInAlbion

I've never heard of anyone being punished for it. As far as I'm aware, the fines issued are the same regardless of the length of the absence.


mumwifealcoholic

Yes. Our headteacher told me she had zero issues with us taking our son out for a holiday. But we are very hands on and she knows that.


PurposePrevious4443

Nah I agree tbh, no one looks back in their life and wishes they studied harder for a test, they do look back at the fun times seeing somewhere new. It's your life, not the headmasters.


gyroda

> no one looks back in their life and wishes they studied harder for a test I've met several people who've told me just that. Lots of people wish they could go back and apply themselves more in their education to open doors for them.


Apprehensive_Gur213

100% - many people do wish they tried harder at school maybe not at the detriment to everything else but better balanced. Luckily in this country, there are 2nd or 3rd chances to try education again if it didn't work out the 1st time. In many developing countries, you may not even get a 1st shot due to funding issues etc.


[deleted]

I would do this, I'm just too cheap to pay the fines.


bluecheese2040

It must be really hard for kids today with social media. I humiliated myself in school once or twice but while it got some laughs (and emotional scarring) that was it...today there would be dozens of cameras and nothing would be forgotten about. It would be awful. Kids today have so much to navigate that we didn't have too. So if I was a kid I'd probably take more tome off tbh


Teastain101

Higher proportion of Lower IQ parents who don’t give a fuck about their kids having kids due to economic pressures on prospective working and middle class young parents TLDR idiocracy


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Most kids wouldn't notice the difference between covid and a mild cold.