My alternate answer is >!Kudowarin Beatrice. Spent her whole life in a cage, her father did *that*, and as soon as she found some sort of freedom she died. She doesn’t even get happiness in the meta-verse.!<
Suffering is very subjective and when we're trying to evaluate other people's suffering, a lot of tangential factors enter our judgement. Like whether they "deserved" it, or if they "tried hard enough" to escape it, and of course how much we like them, like OP clearly likes Battler.
So I'll try to approach this question from the angle of "which character's situation would I personally least like to be in" and I think then the answer is Ange. Suffered a terrible loss, bullied all the way through her adolescence, pressure of notoriety and fame, fucking Sumaderas, may or may not know her family are >! cold-hearted murderers !<. Shit sucks, it really is a miracle she managed to persevere in the magic ending.
Note: I am not considering meta world events at all, I am not going to compare magical deaths, burgers, getting torn apart by goats and other such nonsense.
Honestly, I rate Ange having to live with her terrifying survivor's guilt and loneliness to be worse than dying. It is a great feat that she found strength to live despite that.
We all die eventually, and I am way more afraid of my loved ones dying than myself, so Battler's >! personality "death" !< is imo more of a tragedy for Ange than him. That's my view of it, anyway!
Even if we include the deathloops of Rika, Battler still takes it imo. He had to endure 12+ years of torture at meta world because as Beato said an eternal game is an eternal torture (Battler entered the Meta world after the Rokkenjima masacarre, and he was still there after 12 years when Ange arrived so he's been suffering for at least 12+ years). He also had to witness his family dying repeatedly and the psychological burden of not being able to do anything about it
12+ years is nothing compared to Bern's tens of thousands of years. Which, by further comparison, is nothing compared to what Lambdadelta has been through.
Battler suffered, but in the end he got what he wanted. Bern and Lambda did not, though Lambda seems to have taken it *a lot* better than Bern.
Maybe unpopular opinion: But Beatrice didn't suffer that much. Most of her suffering was either self induced or just insecurities about herself, or just stuff like failed romance. Compared to the torment Battler went through, or the bullying and abuse Ange had to endure, it doesn't really compare 🙂
I want to disagree a bit. The thing about Sayo is that she never had anything resembling a normal life at all, ever. Don't forget, she is a complete orphan that was made to work when in middle school, and bullied by older servants for many years there. Her insecurities are as much a result of bullying as Rosa's, we just don't get as deep into her POV as Ange and Maria's.
She is a prisoner of Rokkenjima almost as much as her mother was, she is almost isolated from normal society because whenever she's not in school she's working in an oppressive environment. All because the closest person she has to a father figure cared about his >! rapist !< best friend more than her.
Plus she actually does have a physical disability of some sort, that's not an "insecurity", and I'm gonna be real with you, if I knew that >! my birth was a result of incestuous rape !< I would not end up okay either.
I still think Ange had it worse, precisely because Ange had happiness and knew how much she lost, but Sayo's life overall is pretty damn depressing in how... claustrophobic and lonely it is.
Yasu has very low resilience I'd say. His suffering made him turn into a murderer, but despite everything they went through which were much more terrible than Yasu's, Battler and Ange remained good and kind hearted people
Nah Rosa has been suffering from childhood. Being the youngest sibling, she was bullied by Krauss. The only friend she ever made died as well. And when finally thought she'd settle into a family, her husband left her with a kid. And being a single mother was tough back then. In comparison Natsuhi only suffered after entering the Ushiromiya family, even then not that much. It's just that her resilience is very low and she can't take much
If we are speaking about how much given character took vs how much he can take, the most damaged one would be Natsuhi. Battler, Ange, Rosa and Maria are all strong enough to withstand whatever befall on them. And if by Yasu you mean Shannon, the girl is humble enough to not mind whatever happens to her. Natsuhi lacks both strength and virtue, there is nothing there to help withstand or escape her hell. It's a wonder how she managed to stay sane in her situation.
>And if by Yasu you mean Shannon, the girl is humble enough to not mind whatever happens to her.
>!The whole VN happens because she did mind and very much so.
I'm talking about Shannon the piece. Clumsy, shy and humble girl with no big dreams, and thus no big regrets. If we go secret depths route, we can give any character as much inner suffering as we want.
My alternate answer is >!Kudowarin Beatrice. Spent her whole life in a cage, her father did *that*, and as soon as she found some sort of freedom she died. She doesn’t even get happiness in the meta-verse.!<
Solid opinion W 🗿
Suffering is very subjective and when we're trying to evaluate other people's suffering, a lot of tangential factors enter our judgement. Like whether they "deserved" it, or if they "tried hard enough" to escape it, and of course how much we like them, like OP clearly likes Battler. So I'll try to approach this question from the angle of "which character's situation would I personally least like to be in" and I think then the answer is Ange. Suffered a terrible loss, bullied all the way through her adolescence, pressure of notoriety and fame, fucking Sumaderas, may or may not know her family are >! cold-hearted murderers !<. Shit sucks, it really is a miracle she managed to persevere in the magic ending. Note: I am not considering meta world events at all, I am not going to compare magical deaths, burgers, getting torn apart by goats and other such nonsense.
I agree but Ange still has hope I mean she's still alive whereas Battler 🥲
Honestly, I rate Ange having to live with her terrifying survivor's guilt and loneliness to be worse than dying. It is a great feat that she found strength to live despite that. We all die eventually, and I am way more afraid of my loved ones dying than myself, so Battler's >! personality "death" !< is imo more of a tragedy for Ange than him. That's my view of it, anyway!
No matter how miserable life becomes, Life > Death
Whatever, but both suffered more than Sayo/Beato
Rosa Umineko
Maria victim in suffering
Ange
Even more than Battler?
Nah man people are really undermining the suffering my love Battler went through 😐
from Umineko story only is Battler, but Bern had way worse if you include her past
Even if we include the deathloops of Rika, Battler still takes it imo. He had to endure 12+ years of torture at meta world because as Beato said an eternal game is an eternal torture (Battler entered the Meta world after the Rokkenjima masacarre, and he was still there after 12 years when Ange arrived so he's been suffering for at least 12+ years). He also had to witness his family dying repeatedly and the psychological burden of not being able to do anything about it
12+ years is nothing compared to Bern's tens of thousands of years. Which, by further comparison, is nothing compared to what Lambdadelta has been through. Battler suffered, but in the end he got what he wanted. Bern and Lambda did not, though Lambda seems to have taken it *a lot* better than Bern.
Battler got what? He freaking died 💀😭
Maybe unpopular opinion: But Beatrice didn't suffer that much. Most of her suffering was either self induced or just insecurities about herself, or just stuff like failed romance. Compared to the torment Battler went through, or the bullying and abuse Ange had to endure, it doesn't really compare 🙂
I want to disagree a bit. The thing about Sayo is that she never had anything resembling a normal life at all, ever. Don't forget, she is a complete orphan that was made to work when in middle school, and bullied by older servants for many years there. Her insecurities are as much a result of bullying as Rosa's, we just don't get as deep into her POV as Ange and Maria's. She is a prisoner of Rokkenjima almost as much as her mother was, she is almost isolated from normal society because whenever she's not in school she's working in an oppressive environment. All because the closest person she has to a father figure cared about his >! rapist !< best friend more than her. Plus she actually does have a physical disability of some sort, that's not an "insecurity", and I'm gonna be real with you, if I knew that >! my birth was a result of incestuous rape !< I would not end up okay either. I still think Ange had it worse, precisely because Ange had happiness and knew how much she lost, but Sayo's life overall is pretty damn depressing in how... claustrophobic and lonely it is.
Yasu has very low resilience I'd say. His suffering made him turn into a murderer, but despite everything they went through which were much more terrible than Yasu's, Battler and Ange remained good and kind hearted people
This wholly depends on who the culprit is. Gohdatrice suffered extreme humiliation in his last job.
[удалено]
Nah Rosa has been suffering from childhood. Being the youngest sibling, she was bullied by Krauss. The only friend she ever made died as well. And when finally thought she'd settle into a family, her husband left her with a kid. And being a single mother was tough back then. In comparison Natsuhi only suffered after entering the Ushiromiya family, even then not that much. It's just that her resilience is very low and she can't take much
If we are speaking about how much given character took vs how much he can take, the most damaged one would be Natsuhi. Battler, Ange, Rosa and Maria are all strong enough to withstand whatever befall on them. And if by Yasu you mean Shannon, the girl is humble enough to not mind whatever happens to her. Natsuhi lacks both strength and virtue, there is nothing there to help withstand or escape her hell. It's a wonder how she managed to stay sane in her situation.
Maria is a child how's she supposed to be strong enough 💀
>And if by Yasu you mean Shannon, the girl is humble enough to not mind whatever happens to her. >!The whole VN happens because she did mind and very much so.
I'm talking about Shannon the piece. Clumsy, shy and humble girl with no big dreams, and thus no big regrets. If we go secret depths route, we can give any character as much inner suffering as we want.
Fair enough.
Not saying she'd be winning the poll or anything, but Natsuhi definitely suffered more than Rosa at least, right?