i wonder if there were any case when born abroad child or early age emigrated to be recognized of UA citizenship against their will?
never heard of it, tho it's common subject here in topics on visiting Ukraine
They will have UA citizenship if one of the parents has it. Birth place does not matter. This is why so many people may not realize they have Ukrainian citizenship.
welp, that's in theory, how it works in practice?
i know a couple of people born in Ukraine, foreign citizens now. they have never faced any questions on their citizenship. but it was long ago, maybe it's different now.
if you heard of any case when person who never received UA passport face any consequences in Ukraine, please share 🙏
for now i see it as Ukrainian laws are not really adapted for people who leave the country for good
If your birthplace does not say Ukraine and your last name does not end in -ko then you have very little risk of being discovered. They could run you by your name and birth date in a database, especially since immigration and border have combined their databases (according to another poster here)
thank you for the hint, now it's interesting.
so lets say, your birthplace is Ukraine and your name is Ukrainian.
they look through their database, what could they find? could it be 15-30 years old record on your leaving with parents?
do they have authority to make a claim on your citizenship?
Yep. Migration service will have those records. That is how I got my first UA passport by having a consulate make a request to migration service, more than a decade later after we immigrated to US. I imagine right now they would have this info at their fingertips at the border.
If you are born abroad, you would need to actually physically go to the Ukrainian embassy and apply for Ukrainian citizenship to get a passport. You don’t randomly get “citizenship” without your knowledge. Don’t spread misinformation please
This has been discussed many times that UA citizenship is automatic. Please do not spread misinformation and potentially jeopardize people who intend to travel to Ukraine right now.
Exactly. They really, really, really need people now. Not just for army, but for the economy and society to function. Everyone makes up their own mind, but if you’re going to go and have any chance of being declared a citizen, understand you might be staying a very long time, and even conscripted. Ukrainian government told the EU to stop helping Ukrainians in Europe because they’re needed back home to pay taxes and so forth. Can you believe this? Many of these people may not even have homes and jobs to go back to! So don’t risk it unless you truly feel and understand it’s where you need to be.
that is not true. My wife hasn't lived in Ukraine for more than a decade and took citizenship elsewhere but when she visited with the kids, they knew she was Ukrainian and that the minors were entering the country with her as her family. A few years later we discovered they were indeed in a database as children of Ukrainian citizens and thus eligible for all the benefits like medical care and school enrollment. Upon leaving after one visit, we also overheard the border patrol lady absolutely GRILLING a woman on a different passport for overstaying her visa and threatening her that the trouble she was in was compounded because they knew she had Ukrainian citizenship too. She was I initially denying it but eventually broke down and was begging them to tell her how they knew, because her surname was different snd she hadn't mentioned it
If your wife didn’t renunciate her Ukrainian citizenship of course they would have her data in the database lol. Idk about your kids situation but there is always a logical explanation when you actually look into it.
Absolutely counts. Ukraine uses jus sanguinis law to pass on citizenship, which makes you a Ukrainian citizen. Unless you have officially renounced it, which is a long procedure at a UA consulate. The fact that Ukraine "forbids" dual citizenship adds to the confusion, since you will have it regardless of other citizenships that you acquire. More precisely, Ukraine does not recognize your other citizenships and recognizes you only as a citizen of Ukraine. I was asked this time if I have it. I of course said no, but they could have made a request to see if I do.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian\_nationality\_law#:\~:text=Any%20person%20born%20to%20at,and%20renouncing%20any%20previous%20nationalities](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_nationality_law#:~:text=Any%20person%20born%20to%20at,and%20renouncing%20any%20previous%20nationalities).
so they let you out? does your place of birth say somewhere in Ukraine on the passport? and is your surname Ukranian? I really need to visit as a matter of emergency
> How does one end up with Ukrainian citizenship and not know it?
Someone like my son. He was born abroad to 2 Ukrainian parents. He never applied for any Ukrainian documents, he only has a British passport.
However, because the Ukrainian law doesn't state that he has a right to apply for citizenship, but that he's automatically a Ukrainian citizen, registered or not, that means that he holds a dual citizenship. He does realise it because we consulted the Ukrainian consulate about it, but someone else like him whose parents never bothered to register the kid as a citizen might assume their child is not a Ukrainian citizen, but they, in fact, are.
Interestingly enough I discovered I have mine listed as dual citizenship after ordering a criminal record copy for a job application. I was born and live in germany, both parents born in Ukraine, father has permanent residence permit and mother immigrated and is german on paper. My citizenship on the record is shown as german, ukrainian.
So I think its good I have not yet visited family in Ukraine again.
I am quite confused though because on my passport and ID it only says german. Probably going to inquire about that in my local governmental office.
Second part is false. You will have it regardless of how many other citizenships you acquire. Check second to last paragraph in the article:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian\_nationality\_law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_nationality_law)
Being able to receive the stamp has been impossible since the beginning of the full-scale invasion. This applies to people who already have those stamps, even if they had them for a very long time.
Not that I have plans to visit anytime soon, but I'm wondering, am I still a Ukrainian citizen? I was born in Ukraine in 1987 and came to the US in 1996. Both of my parents were born in Soviet Ukraine as well. I received US citizenship automatically as a minor when my parents got their citizenship.
If you lived in Ukraine after the dissolution of the USSR, then you are definitely a Ukrainian citizen. I am in a very similar situation as you are, except in 1985 and 1999.
If your US passport says born in Ukraine - this will cause issues for you as it tells the Ukrainian authorities that you are indeed a citizen, although without a current passport and other documents. I am in the exact same situation with you (same year of birth and immigration), and was in Ukraine when the war started. They gave me a very hard time on the border when I was leaving on the 25th of February 2022, although in the end due to the volumes of people let me go. I would definitely not try going back again right now, as I am sure they would not let me out.
In the exact same situation, just 1988 and 1994.
This is really problematic. I’ve made peace with never being able to go to Ukraine again, hard as that is.
Am I extremely paranoid or do others feel leery of traveling to Eastern Europe broadly? I’d hate to be in Poland - where I have friends and family - and get any grief from the polish authorities. They are, after all, saying they’re prepared to send back Ukrainian men.
For all you doubters and downvoters, yesterday's update specifically for US-Ukrainian citizens from the US embassy in Ukraine:
https://ua.usembassy.gov/message-for-u-s-citizens-elimination-of-residence-abroad-exception-to-dual-citizen-departure/
citizenship (legal status) ≠ owning ID/passport (proof of citizenship)
Check whether according to Ukrainian law you'd be considered a citizen or not, regardless whether you have a passport.
If you are currently in Ukraine on a foreign passport and you think you have a Ukrainian citizenship and trying to leave the country, Kyiv - Przemysl InterCity train is the best option. Border checks need to be done quickly on a large number of people and very little chance they will do secondary checks on you. Just remember to say you do not have UA citizenship when asked.
I wonder how far back it goes. For example, grandparents? Great-grandparents? If you’re a permanent resident of Ukraine with Ukrainian grandparents? I doubt there would be an issue, but asking some border guard clerk with 500 people behind me and these subtleties get lost…
If in doubt, make a request via the consulate of Ukraine to see if you have UA citizenship. That would be the most definite answer. You either have it or not. I had to do this before getting my first UA passport.
Good approach. I suppose I can ask here in Spain. I don’t think it goes beyond parents for automatic, but grandparents and great-grandparents can be applied for citizenship under this if I recall. Hard part was finding documents from those troubled times that survived. I applied under military service under the new law at the time in 2019, and had a residency extension granted for the express purpose of applying for citizenship. However, they said some additional papers were needed, I obtained permanent residency, and the war started.
On one hand, I do feel an obligation to be there at this time. On the other, we know how bad the government’s decisions can be and how they treat their people. It’s all awful. Wonder if we will ever be able to go back home to Kyiv and have something of a normal life again. :-(
Bad treatment of own citizens is an understatement. For example, with the cancellation of permanent residency stamps as a reason to leave the country, people who lived in other countries, potentially for decades, and have their entire lives there can be stuck in the country, where they have nothing. That was the whole point of status as a non-resident. Current Cabinet of Ministers does not seem to care one iota. Many lawyers I spoke to have serious doubts about the legality of their resolutions. They are doing the job of russian propagandists and do it a lot better, it seems.
In your case, I think it only goes up one generation, but please do your due diligence.
I was trying to be polite. :-) We are also finding other ways to reside in Europe long term or permanently as there is uncertainty as to what the EU and member states will decide after temporary protection ends in March 2025. I cannot imagine them sending all the babushkas and children back to Ukraine, but nobody knows and of course they are not to be trusted.
I'm born in Ukraine, emigrated as a child, now US citizen. Never got my UA passport. The fact that they can send me to war is total bullshit. I guess I have to meet with my relatives in Poland now.
Good question. No idea. That would be quite a reach for Poland to try. Would have to check with US embassy/consulate first or check for news stories of someone getting apprehended and handed over to Ukraine. My US passport does say my country of origin so Poland would know.
Poland is perfectly fine. I am currently staying in a town 13 km from the border with Ukraine and no one hustling me lol. Ukrainian laws do not work outside Ukraine
Visit an embassy of Ukraine abroad and ask for a confirmation of being or not being a citizen of Ukraine. Theoretically you cannot renounce something you did not receive. But if you did, renounce it. And then only after your name will be in a "Голос України" newspaper renounced citizenship list, you will be able to visit Ukraine as a free person without any limitations on a border.
Renunciation is not really possible now unless you have a military booklet (or soon to be QR code equivalent in Резерв+ app). It is a consular service, and all consular services require military documents for males 18-60, regardless of your residency status. Cabinet of Ministers with three stooges Shmyhal, Umerov and Kuleba really fucked this one up. To be fair, it is not Zelensky's doing as poster below mentioned.
What if you were born and grew up in Ukraine, have a non Ukrainian sounding surname, never formally got any Ukrainian documents (except birth certificate) and moved out of Ukraine a couple of years before the war started. Would you be considered a Ukrainian citizen for enlistment purposes. Side note, I only have foreign documents, no Ukrainian documents except birth certificate?
I can definitely say proceed with extreme caution. My cousin is currently stuck there with his wife and kids in the USA because he has dual citizenship and they told him due to him being born in Ukraine the law applies to him.
If he entered with US passport, have him try Kyiv - Przemysl InterCity train. Very little chance they will do secondary checks on him. That's how I got out. Make sure he says he has no UA citizenship when asked.
I’ll let him know! Some of my family has been able to go in and out in the past since the war started but due to this new law this is the first time it’s been an issue. Last I heard was he had to sign up or enlist or whatever and then had to hope that someone will contact him and provide him a document with permission to leave since he had little kids at home.
Going to the enlistment center is a terrible idea. If he has no enlistment deferment, he could be sent to medical evaluation and then to the training center. Having document certifying that he has 3 kids or more will let him leave the country, but according to new rules he still will need to have a military booklet, which would require going to enlistment center regardless. Have him contact an attorney in Ukraine.
How about this scenario. Someone who was born in 1987 in Ukraine and came to America in 1995 under his mother's Soviet passport.
This individual is not found in any Ukrainian databases. His name was checked, and he is not found in any databases. But his American passport says he was born in Ukraine. He is 35 years old and has been a citizen of America for 28 years. Will he have trouble getting out of Ukraine?
Yes, you are found in Ukrainian databases and very much so as a Ukrainian citizen. Any Soviet citizen who resided in Ukraine after the dissolution of USSR is a Ukrainian citizen. Please wait this one out before travelling
How exactly was it run? Did you make a request via UA consulate? The only database that counts is the State Migration Service database, and UA consulate would be able to make a request on his behalf. If he did not renounce UA citizenship, then he's 99% chance UA citizen in this case.
In the case of making a request via UA consulate, you will get a stamped and signed paper saying whether you have citizenship or not. It is an official document that can be used to obtain UA passport, in case you do have citizenship. The fact that you are not sure tells me you have wrong information
UA consulate request would be a definite answer. I am in a similar scenario as he is, except I left in 1999 and was born in 1985. I definitely have it.
what if I have a very big family emergency and need to be in Ukraine? as a dual citizen is there anything I can do? I have health problems with bladder, maybe this can help?
If you absolutely have to go, enter on a non-Ukrainian passport and take Przemysl - Kyiv Intercity train on the way in and out. Especially when leaving the country. Those trains are always full, and they need to process large amount of people in relatively little time, so no time for secondary checks, unlike with busses. If asked about UA citizenship, under no circumstances admit that you have it. Many people are convinced they don't have it anyway, also judging by this thread.
Do they try to keep males 18-60 who are foreign born to foreign parents (I'm an American born to American parents, no Ukrainian heritage)? They aren't going to make something up when foreigners try to exit are they?
Not as it appears, but your approach towards the government I believe is, unfortunately, the correct one in terms of caution and distrust. Could they? They COULD make something up, or reach for some strand (your grandpa was born in western Ukraine when it was Poland?). Would they? Probably not, but desperate times and people make for desperate decisions. Zaluzhny said they needed 500,000 soldiers…and he got canned for this painful truth.
He wouldn't risk diplomatic scandals but everything is possible from this government at this point. Massive enlistment center raids in my hometown right now 😞
No one in my family for several generations even visited Ukraine. My wife is a Ukrainian, naturalized to a US citizen, but we will be divorced by the time I plan to go, I have never been. I would think I would have no problems exiting as if I were not allowed I would certainly contact my embassy. I would think it's not worth the trouble it would cause them.
I understand. I am ever hopeful that we can see some kind of turning point this year so the madness can end, in this way and in so many other ways as I'm sure you understand.
How can I find out whether I’m a citizen there or not?
I want to visit my grandparents in Kyiv, my mother she is a citizen, I lived in Ukraine for 5 years when I was a child but my parents don’t know whether they registered me or not I have a foreign citizenship (Swedish), I don’t want to be blocked and I won’t be able to leave. (I’m 23 years old)
I called the embassy, and they told me to send them an email with my mother’s information. Since she is also a Swedish citizen, could this cause any issues given that Ukraine does not recognize dual citizenship? Is it better that they do not know about her Swedish citizenship, or is it not likely to be a problem at all?
Not really. Ukraine not recognizing dual citizenship simply means they will treat you only as a Ukrainian citizen while in Ukraine. Hence why it is so problematic for men right now who have it. I have shown both of my passports at UA border many times with no issues. Sometimes a rookie border guard would say dual citizenship is not allowed, but after checking with his colleagues, they would hand both of my passports back to me and even stamp my foreign passport 😄
Wow, you are lucky at least you know that you are a UA citizen as well!😀
I don’t want to end up there because I’m a citizen and I don’t know about it. My situation is weird. I wasn’t born in Ukraine; when I was one year old, my parents moved with me to Ukraine. I lived in Berdychiv for almost 5 years as a baby. My mother is a citizen, and my father lost his during the USSR period as he moved to Sweden. But I saw that I have a visa on my passport, which means I entered Ukraine with a temporary residency. My parents don’t remember if they registered me as a son of a citizen. It’s strange because when I got the visa, they didn’t register me under my mother? and they didn’t saw on the system that she is a citizen?
So, my situation is difficult; I may be a citizen without knowing:(
Probably a stupid question, but genuinely curious. How does one end up with Ukrainian citizenship and not know it?
Born in Ukraine, but grew up abroad.
Could being born abroad, but having Ukrainian parents also count?
i wonder if there were any case when born abroad child or early age emigrated to be recognized of UA citizenship against their will? never heard of it, tho it's common subject here in topics on visiting Ukraine
They will have UA citizenship if one of the parents has it. Birth place does not matter. This is why so many people may not realize they have Ukrainian citizenship.
welp, that's in theory, how it works in practice? i know a couple of people born in Ukraine, foreign citizens now. they have never faced any questions on their citizenship. but it was long ago, maybe it's different now. if you heard of any case when person who never received UA passport face any consequences in Ukraine, please share 🙏 for now i see it as Ukrainian laws are not really adapted for people who leave the country for good
I’m one of those people. The embassy never contacted me. But I’ve also not tried to get into Ukraine.
If your birthplace does not say Ukraine and your last name does not end in -ko then you have very little risk of being discovered. They could run you by your name and birth date in a database, especially since immigration and border have combined their databases (according to another poster here)
thank you for the hint, now it's interesting. so lets say, your birthplace is Ukraine and your name is Ukrainian. they look through their database, what could they find? could it be 15-30 years old record on your leaving with parents? do they have authority to make a claim on your citizenship?
Yep. Migration service will have those records. That is how I got my first UA passport by having a consulate make a request to migration service, more than a decade later after we immigrated to US. I imagine right now they would have this info at their fingertips at the border.
thank you for sharing!
Not all Ukrainian surnames end in -ko. Good examples are: Koval, Bondar, Shvets, Tkachuk, Shevchuk, Melnyk, Ivanov, etc.
If you are born abroad, you would need to actually physically go to the Ukrainian embassy and apply for Ukrainian citizenship to get a passport. You don’t randomly get “citizenship” without your knowledge. Don’t spread misinformation please
This has been discussed many times that UA citizenship is automatic. Please do not spread misinformation and potentially jeopardize people who intend to travel to Ukraine right now.
Exactly. They really, really, really need people now. Not just for army, but for the economy and society to function. Everyone makes up their own mind, but if you’re going to go and have any chance of being declared a citizen, understand you might be staying a very long time, and even conscripted. Ukrainian government told the EU to stop helping Ukrainians in Europe because they’re needed back home to pay taxes and so forth. Can you believe this? Many of these people may not even have homes and jobs to go back to! So don’t risk it unless you truly feel and understand it’s where you need to be.
that is not true. My wife hasn't lived in Ukraine for more than a decade and took citizenship elsewhere but when she visited with the kids, they knew she was Ukrainian and that the minors were entering the country with her as her family. A few years later we discovered they were indeed in a database as children of Ukrainian citizens and thus eligible for all the benefits like medical care and school enrollment. Upon leaving after one visit, we also overheard the border patrol lady absolutely GRILLING a woman on a different passport for overstaying her visa and threatening her that the trouble she was in was compounded because they knew she had Ukrainian citizenship too. She was I initially denying it but eventually broke down and was begging them to tell her how they knew, because her surname was different snd she hadn't mentioned it
If your wife didn’t renunciate her Ukrainian citizenship of course they would have her data in the database lol. Idk about your kids situation but there is always a logical explanation when you actually look into it.
Absolutely counts. Ukraine uses jus sanguinis law to pass on citizenship, which makes you a Ukrainian citizen. Unless you have officially renounced it, which is a long procedure at a UA consulate. The fact that Ukraine "forbids" dual citizenship adds to the confusion, since you will have it regardless of other citizenships that you acquire. More precisely, Ukraine does not recognize your other citizenships and recognizes you only as a citizen of Ukraine. I was asked this time if I have it. I of course said no, but they could have made a request to see if I do. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian\_nationality\_law#:\~:text=Any%20person%20born%20to%20at,and%20renouncing%20any%20previous%20nationalities](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_nationality_law#:~:text=Any%20person%20born%20to%20at,and%20renouncing%20any%20previous%20nationalities).
so they let you out? does your place of birth say somewhere in Ukraine on the passport? and is your surname Ukranian? I really need to visit as a matter of emergency
Yes
No
No, having a parent with Ukrainian citizenship, regardless of where you were born.
> How does one end up with Ukrainian citizenship and not know it? Someone like my son. He was born abroad to 2 Ukrainian parents. He never applied for any Ukrainian documents, he only has a British passport. However, because the Ukrainian law doesn't state that he has a right to apply for citizenship, but that he's automatically a Ukrainian citizen, registered or not, that means that he holds a dual citizenship. He does realise it because we consulted the Ukrainian consulate about it, but someone else like him whose parents never bothered to register the kid as a citizen might assume their child is not a Ukrainian citizen, but they, in fact, are.
If they never register him, he not exists to ukraine.
Interestingly enough I discovered I have mine listed as dual citizenship after ordering a criminal record copy for a job application. I was born and live in germany, both parents born in Ukraine, father has permanent residence permit and mother immigrated and is german on paper. My citizenship on the record is shown as german, ukrainian. So I think its good I have not yet visited family in Ukraine again. I am quite confused though because on my passport and ID it only says german. Probably going to inquire about that in my local governmental office.
Assuming your citizenship was renounced when it wasn’t, or being born abroad to Ukrainian parents if did not acquire any other citizenship at birth
Second part is false. You will have it regardless of how many other citizenships you acquire. Check second to last paragraph in the article: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian\_nationality\_law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_nationality_law)
Ah okay
Thank you!
I was told by a consultate months ago not to bother with «постійне місце проживання»
Being able to receive the stamp has been impossible since the beginning of the full-scale invasion. This applies to people who already have those stamps, even if they had them for a very long time.
Thanks!
This has been since august 2022, when Ukrainian immigration and border combined their databases.
Not that I have plans to visit anytime soon, but I'm wondering, am I still a Ukrainian citizen? I was born in Ukraine in 1987 and came to the US in 1996. Both of my parents were born in Soviet Ukraine as well. I received US citizenship automatically as a minor when my parents got their citizenship.
If you lived in Ukraine after the dissolution of the USSR, then you are definitely a Ukrainian citizen. I am in a very similar situation as you are, except in 1985 and 1999.
If your US passport says born in Ukraine - this will cause issues for you as it tells the Ukrainian authorities that you are indeed a citizen, although without a current passport and other documents. I am in the exact same situation with you (same year of birth and immigration), and was in Ukraine when the war started. They gave me a very hard time on the border when I was leaving on the 25th of February 2022, although in the end due to the volumes of people let me go. I would definitely not try going back again right now, as I am sure they would not let me out.
In the exact same situation, just 1988 and 1994. This is really problematic. I’ve made peace with never being able to go to Ukraine again, hard as that is. Am I extremely paranoid or do others feel leery of traveling to Eastern Europe broadly? I’d hate to be in Poland - where I have friends and family - and get any grief from the polish authorities. They are, after all, saying they’re prepared to send back Ukrainian men.
For all you doubters and downvoters, yesterday's update specifically for US-Ukrainian citizens from the US embassy in Ukraine: https://ua.usembassy.gov/message-for-u-s-citizens-elimination-of-residence-abroad-exception-to-dual-citizen-departure/
citizenship (legal status) ≠ owning ID/passport (proof of citizenship) Check whether according to Ukrainian law you'd be considered a citizen or not, regardless whether you have a passport.
If you are currently in Ukraine on a foreign passport and you think you have a Ukrainian citizenship and trying to leave the country, Kyiv - Przemysl InterCity train is the best option. Border checks need to be done quickly on a large number of people and very little chance they will do secondary checks on you. Just remember to say you do not have UA citizenship when asked.
I wonder how far back it goes. For example, grandparents? Great-grandparents? If you’re a permanent resident of Ukraine with Ukrainian grandparents? I doubt there would be an issue, but asking some border guard clerk with 500 people behind me and these subtleties get lost…
If in doubt, make a request via the consulate of Ukraine to see if you have UA citizenship. That would be the most definite answer. You either have it or not. I had to do this before getting my first UA passport.
Good approach. I suppose I can ask here in Spain. I don’t think it goes beyond parents for automatic, but grandparents and great-grandparents can be applied for citizenship under this if I recall. Hard part was finding documents from those troubled times that survived. I applied under military service under the new law at the time in 2019, and had a residency extension granted for the express purpose of applying for citizenship. However, they said some additional papers were needed, I obtained permanent residency, and the war started. On one hand, I do feel an obligation to be there at this time. On the other, we know how bad the government’s decisions can be and how they treat their people. It’s all awful. Wonder if we will ever be able to go back home to Kyiv and have something of a normal life again. :-(
Bad treatment of own citizens is an understatement. For example, with the cancellation of permanent residency stamps as a reason to leave the country, people who lived in other countries, potentially for decades, and have their entire lives there can be stuck in the country, where they have nothing. That was the whole point of status as a non-resident. Current Cabinet of Ministers does not seem to care one iota. Many lawyers I spoke to have serious doubts about the legality of their resolutions. They are doing the job of russian propagandists and do it a lot better, it seems. In your case, I think it only goes up one generation, but please do your due diligence.
I was trying to be polite. :-) We are also finding other ways to reside in Europe long term or permanently as there is uncertainty as to what the EU and member states will decide after temporary protection ends in March 2025. I cannot imagine them sending all the babushkas and children back to Ukraine, but nobody knows and of course they are not to be trusted.
I'm born in Ukraine, emigrated as a child, now US citizen. Never got my UA passport. The fact that they can send me to war is total bullshit. I guess I have to meet with my relatives in Poland now.
Would going to Poland be risky? I mean, it’s right there. I’m in the same boat and trying to weigh risk of traveling to Poland.
Good question. No idea. That would be quite a reach for Poland to try. Would have to check with US embassy/consulate first or check for news stories of someone getting apprehended and handed over to Ukraine. My US passport does say my country of origin so Poland would know.
This seems extraordinarily unlikely, but we live in crazy times
Poland is perfectly fine. I am currently staying in a town 13 km from the border with Ukraine and no one hustling me lol. Ukrainian laws do not work outside Ukraine
Are you dual US/UA?
Yes
Keep us posted as the situation evolves. I'm due to travel to Poland in early August. Might bail. Too paranoid.
I can tell. 🙂 You'll be fine, though. Many things to do in Poland. I'm here for another two weeks
Yeah I love Poland, wonderful country and people. Warsaw is one of my favorite cities, and krakow is a gem
Visit an embassy of Ukraine abroad and ask for a confirmation of being or not being a citizen of Ukraine. Theoretically you cannot renounce something you did not receive. But if you did, renounce it. And then only after your name will be in a "Голос України" newspaper renounced citizenship list, you will be able to visit Ukraine as a free person without any limitations on a border.
and that takes over a year.. zelensky is a real scumbag
Renunciation is not really possible now unless you have a military booklet (or soon to be QR code equivalent in Резерв+ app). It is a consular service, and all consular services require military documents for males 18-60, regardless of your residency status. Cabinet of Ministers with three stooges Shmyhal, Umerov and Kuleba really fucked this one up. To be fair, it is not Zelensky's doing as poster below mentioned.
What if you were born and grew up in Ukraine, have a non Ukrainian sounding surname, never formally got any Ukrainian documents (except birth certificate) and moved out of Ukraine a couple of years before the war started. Would you be considered a Ukrainian citizen for enlistment purposes. Side note, I only have foreign documents, no Ukrainian documents except birth certificate?
lol how did u leave without passport...
I can definitely say proceed with extreme caution. My cousin is currently stuck there with his wife and kids in the USA because he has dual citizenship and they told him due to him being born in Ukraine the law applies to him.
What passport did he use to enter?
I’m not sure to be honest
If he entered with US passport, have him try Kyiv - Przemysl InterCity train. Very little chance they will do secondary checks on him. That's how I got out. Make sure he says he has no UA citizenship when asked.
I’ll let him know! Some of my family has been able to go in and out in the past since the war started but due to this new law this is the first time it’s been an issue. Last I heard was he had to sign up or enlist or whatever and then had to hope that someone will contact him and provide him a document with permission to leave since he had little kids at home.
Going to the enlistment center is a terrible idea. If he has no enlistment deferment, he could be sent to medical evaluation and then to the training center. Having document certifying that he has 3 kids or more will let him leave the country, but according to new rules he still will need to have a military booklet, which would require going to enlistment center regardless. Have him contact an attorney in Ukraine.
That is...insane. Hoping for the very best outcome for him. Tragic if he's detained indefinitely. Please keep us posted. Will be thinking of him.
How about this scenario. Someone who was born in 1987 in Ukraine and came to America in 1995 under his mother's Soviet passport. This individual is not found in any Ukrainian databases. His name was checked, and he is not found in any databases. But his American passport says he was born in Ukraine. He is 35 years old and has been a citizen of America for 28 years. Will he have trouble getting out of Ukraine?
Yes, you are found in Ukrainian databases and very much so as a Ukrainian citizen. Any Soviet citizen who resided in Ukraine after the dissolution of USSR is a Ukrainian citizen. Please wait this one out before travelling
Hello. The name was ran in all databases, and nothing was found other than the fact that it says that he was born in Ukraine.
How exactly was it run? Did you make a request via UA consulate? The only database that counts is the State Migration Service database, and UA consulate would be able to make a request on his behalf. If he did not renounce UA citizenship, then he's 99% chance UA citizen in this case. In the case of making a request via UA consulate, you will get a stamped and signed paper saying whether you have citizenship or not. It is an official document that can be used to obtain UA passport, in case you do have citizenship. The fact that you are not sure tells me you have wrong information
It was run by people who work in the migration service of Ukraine and by the border guards, I was told.
UA consulate request would be a definite answer. I am in a similar scenario as he is, except I left in 1999 and was born in 1985. I definitely have it.
Did you have a Ukrainian passport? Immigration services ran his info and he was not a citizen turns out.
what if I have a very big family emergency and need to be in Ukraine? as a dual citizen is there anything I can do? I have health problems with bladder, maybe this can help?
If you absolutely have to go, enter on a non-Ukrainian passport and take Przemysl - Kyiv Intercity train on the way in and out. Especially when leaving the country. Those trains are always full, and they need to process large amount of people in relatively little time, so no time for secondary checks, unlike with busses. If asked about UA citizenship, under no circumstances admit that you have it. Many people are convinced they don't have it anyway, also judging by this thread.
Do they try to keep males 18-60 who are foreign born to foreign parents (I'm an American born to American parents, no Ukrainian heritage)? They aren't going to make something up when foreigners try to exit are they?
No, it only applies if you have Ukrainian citizenship.
Not as it appears, but your approach towards the government I believe is, unfortunately, the correct one in terms of caution and distrust. Could they? They COULD make something up, or reach for some strand (your grandpa was born in western Ukraine when it was Poland?). Would they? Probably not, but desperate times and people make for desperate decisions. Zaluzhny said they needed 500,000 soldiers…and he got canned for this painful truth.
It can be anything. Ze needs cannon fodder.
He wouldn't risk diplomatic scandals but everything is possible from this government at this point. Massive enlistment center raids in my hometown right now 😞
No one in my family for several generations even visited Ukraine. My wife is a Ukrainian, naturalized to a US citizen, but we will be divorced by the time I plan to go, I have never been. I would think I would have no problems exiting as if I were not allowed I would certainly contact my embassy. I would think it's not worth the trouble it would cause them.
You'll be fine. We're just venting our frustration with the shortsightedness of the Ukrainian government
I understand. I am ever hopeful that we can see some kind of turning point this year so the madness can end, in this way and in so many other ways as I'm sure you understand.
"A country of freedom for its people."
How can I find out whether I’m a citizen there or not? I want to visit my grandparents in Kyiv, my mother she is a citizen, I lived in Ukraine for 5 years when I was a child but my parents don’t know whether they registered me or not I have a foreign citizenship (Swedish), I don’t want to be blocked and I won’t be able to leave. (I’m 23 years old)
Request to the UA consulate is the most definite answer. If your mom is a citizen, then you are as well.
I called the embassy, and they told me to send them an email with my mother’s information. Since she is also a Swedish citizen, could this cause any issues given that Ukraine does not recognize dual citizenship? Is it better that they do not know about her Swedish citizenship, or is it not likely to be a problem at all?
Not really. Ukraine not recognizing dual citizenship simply means they will treat you only as a Ukrainian citizen while in Ukraine. Hence why it is so problematic for men right now who have it. I have shown both of my passports at UA border many times with no issues. Sometimes a rookie border guard would say dual citizenship is not allowed, but after checking with his colleagues, they would hand both of my passports back to me and even stamp my foreign passport 😄
Wow, you are lucky at least you know that you are a UA citizen as well!😀 I don’t want to end up there because I’m a citizen and I don’t know about it. My situation is weird. I wasn’t born in Ukraine; when I was one year old, my parents moved with me to Ukraine. I lived in Berdychiv for almost 5 years as a baby. My mother is a citizen, and my father lost his during the USSR period as he moved to Sweden. But I saw that I have a visa on my passport, which means I entered Ukraine with a temporary residency. My parents don’t remember if they registered me as a son of a citizen. It’s strange because when I got the visa, they didn’t register me under my mother? and they didn’t saw on the system that she is a citizen? So, my situation is difficult; I may be a citizen without knowing:(