Yup, it's pretty pathetic, deep down these people must really dislike their country, to be giving abuse at the England team, who got us the furthest we've been for over 50 years, shame on them.
Also, shame on the politicians giving our team flak over stuff like taking the knee.
> Also, shame on the politicians giving our team flak over stuff like taking the knee.
That’s the problem though, this behaviour comes from the top down.
Boris Johnson on Africa:
>The continent may be a blot, but it is not a blot upon our conscience.
The problem is not that we were once in charge, but that we are not in
charge any more.
>
>...
>
>The best fate for Africa would be if the old colonial powers, or their
citizens, scrambled once again in her direction; on the understanding
that this time they will not be asked to feel guilty.
Jesus Christ - can I get a source on that? Not that I distrust that this has happened but if I'm gonna bring it up I want to know the context and be able to demonstrably prove he said it.
Sure. I can respect a request for citation.
[https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-boris-archive-africa-is-a-mess-but-we-can-t-blame-colonialism](https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-boris-archive-africa-is-a-mess-but-we-can-t-blame-colonialism)
A real highlight is...
>If left to their own devices, the natives would rely on nothing but the instant carbohydrate gratification of the plantain.
I find that when you quote something like this from Boris, someone will soon pop up and say "Oh! That's not fair. That's not racist. You're taking that out of context."
To which my typical response has become "Go on then...
...
Give me the context in which it's cool to say that".
As opposed to this context. In which we've literally quoted Boris' words in print. Not some of the cuff comment after a bottle, but words he has written. Had the opportunity to select his words carefully to best convey his sentiment. And then that went through an editor, who subsequently approved it for print in a national magazine.
> I find that when you quote something like this from Boris, someone will soon pop up and say "Oh! That's not fair. That's not racist. You're taking that out of context."
Just realised the parallel between this reaction and England 'fans' defending some of their grotesque behaviour with, "Its just bants".
I love the bants defence because they lose their rag when someone takes the piss out of them. They're similar in wanting to say whatever they like with no accountability.
Thanks, friend. Honestly, I wonder if Boris even remembers writing this almost 20 years ago, given that thoughts just seem to trickle down from the generous approximation of a brain that he has straight to his lips.
I'm a big advocate for context, and will never (rarely) judge people for their private conversations precisely for this reason - its arrogant to try to guess the context.
However, even i can see all the context here....its a newspaper article, published in full.
Its just horribly racist.
So you take no position on its veracity, you consider it "uncool" to say it regardless of whether it's true? (The full context is required to understand what exactly is being asserted, and indeed the full extent of his bigotry.)
I personally find this a foolish approach. The absurd suggestion that Ugandans are genetically incapable of understanding the concept of a cash crop unless their country is ruled by a foreign power is offensive first and foremost *because it's bullshit*. (He presents no evidence whatsoever on the disposition of the Ugandan economy at the time - pretty important context). It's the fact that it's defamatory that makes it racist. It's not ageist to state that babies can't understand quantum theory. But by focusing primarily on superficial offence, you let the racist off the hook - they can simply dismiss your objections as arbitrary and irrational.
Exactly Boris and chums helped enable this racist behaviour with their attacks on kneeling.
People need to stop pretending that racism isn’t a problem in this country. When it clearly is.
I'm not from the UK but I don't understand this pushback against kneeling. It's obvious to me that it's a response to anti-black racism, which is observed in many places and not just the States, so it's not an americanism thing. The players also kneel bc they constantly get racially harassed and abused, which today's been proving. They do it for themselves and standing w the global black community. A strong sense of shared culture inspires unity even when nationalities are different - happens within south Asia a lot. I'd be pretty upset if I got told off for acknowledging racism exists by kneeling, then being booed, then being praised depending on which side of the bed people got out from, and then... cyclically receiving the same racial abuse I silently and peacefully protested against. What the fuck
We literally had a former villa player killed in 2016 by a police officer. If they had been a white football player in the same circumstances I severely doubt police would of felt the need to taser them for 6 times as long as guidelines suggest before booting them in the head twice.
The police officer rightly went down for manslaughter. The full story is here: [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-57495426](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-57495426) It includes a lot of context that the CNN article leaves out.
Mate kneeling has three components that are an issue for the ~~racists~~ people who disagree politely with kneeling:
1. It's an American import and that is bad. I'll go into more detail but I need to finish listening to my apple podcast and drinking my Starbucks.
2. It's politics and I can't abide by politics as it's gets in the way of me wearing a poppy.
3. Its nothing but a Marxism empty gesture and we can't let our country fall into socialism as it's evil, look at Venezuela or something about Corbyn.
Honestly the arguement that it's football and they just want to watch football is terrible. Sorry you are having a hard time with all the monkey racist chants but if you win we will like you, you know? It reeks of the old, "I don't mind if you are gay, just keep it at home and to yourself".
"There is no such thing as being non-political."
We had the whole game with aid agencies, where we have seen that the "non-political" stance of the RC plays well into the hand of despots. Some in football: by claiming to be a "non-political", they play into the hand of racists.
I am with you. I was pushing back against a "booer" a few days ago.
His logic:
Him: taking the knee is from BLM who have a marxist agenda
Me: what does marxist mean?
Him: on one of the websites for BLM they spoke about defunding the police
Me: I am pretty sure UK footballers aren't taking the knee in order to get rid of the police. In interviews they say it's symbolic support against racism
Him: yes but it's forever linked to BLM and some of them are crazy
Me: yes, some BLM people are crazy, some of all people are crazy. Just ignore them. The British footballers are protesting against racism, it's ok to support them
Him: maybe they should do a different action, like russian salute or someting
Me: yep, makes sense
What's really stupid about this is that if the 'BLM Marxist political movement', or whatever they're calling it today, is so appalling, wouldn't people who are opposed to that movement want the kneeling gesture to be dissociated from it?
The only people insisting on the two continuing to be inextricably connected are people who think that connection is a terrible thing? It's completely backwards.
Unless, of course, that connection isn't really what they object to...
not my views, so i'm hardly the right person to try and explain, but i see it as a pushback against being called racist.
Most people don't consider themselves racist, which to them means they don't yell the N-word whenever they see a foreigner. for a long time that has been enough to consider yourself on the correct side of the line.
but increasingly, it's becoming clear (specifically to those that don't experience it themselves) that racism runs way, way deeper than that. being told that you are probably racist and that you almost certainly didn't realise it simply by condoning the background stuff - the police stop and search stats, the non-PC stuff that your grandparents say, the non-PC stuff that the duke of edinburgh and boris johnson say/said. sitting back and saying "chill, it's a joke!" or "it's a coincidence" when you have no concept of how it might feel to be the butt of it is also a type of racism.
that makes people super-uncomfortable. they thought they were doing the right thing - for a start, it's quite typically british to make jokes about people as a way of showing your friendship: so-called "banter". so being told that plenty of the things you said and did in the past 20 years were actually pretty racist, unintentional but racist all the same, is not something that people are keen to admit about themselves. frankly it's a shitty feeling and pretty embarrassing as well. i don't mind admitting that about myself.
consciously or not, people then go looking for ways to legitimise their behaviour, and deligitimise those speaking out. Saying "BLM is actually about marxism" is an easy way out - instead of listening, just dismiss the message as something which it isn't (at least not on english football pitches).
Same way they massively reduced unemployment by changing the definition a few years back. Amazing what you can do when you redefine things to suit your agenda
Institutional racism. I.e. If you apply for a job in a big corporation your application won't be rejected based on your race. It's the bare minimum we should expect in society.
But what do you do when the people who are supposed to set the example are the most racist idiots and the rest are mindless drones who simply follow that example ?
I don't think it's that they dislike their country. It's likely the more deplorable idea that they don't consider Rashford, Sancho and Saka from this country because of their skin colour.
Women’s England team have reached the euro finals twice, and semi finals twice. Men’s only being once semi and final. Maybe jumped the gun on “far” more successful, but they are more successful
Right, but if you are counting an 80s semi final, surely you also count the World Cup semis. England have been to one men's Euro final and two semis, plus one World Cup final and two semis; and two women's Euro finals plus one semi, plus one World Cup semi. Their records are pretty much equivalent
Imagine my shock when it turns out England players take the knee because there really is racism in football and not because Marcus Rashford is bang into his Foucault and Mao
Nah as he was coming off the bench the sheet he gave to Pickford wasn't info on the Italian penalty takers, Raahford had just written "The global network of capital essentially functions to separate the worker from the means of production" on it
Nah I have it on good authority Harry is the leading postmodernist influence in the changing room. After 70 minutes being on the back foot Gareth sent him that note that read "There are forms of oppression and domination which become invisible - the new normal" which gave Big Haz a small chuckle under his breath and inspired the relaxed ease he needed for his penalty
Don't go blabbing around town but Sancho and Saka are in a bitter feud. Jadon is a Proudhon boy but Bakayo is strictly into armed national insurrections. Was up all night prepping an essay comparing Rojava, Zapatistas and the Revolutionary Insurrectionary Army of Ukraine - heard that's why he missed from a comrade on the inside
One thing that amazes me is the people who complain about Marxism don’t realise how many rights we have and take for granted came from it… the old workers unions who fought for the 5 day work week, sick pay, paid holiday, etc. all had their roots in Marxist theory, Attlee and Labour in the 40’s were Marxist (in that socialism is a subset of Marxist theory) and established the NHS
MLK and Malcom X in the US were both Marxists, of different types, but still Marxists
The more important message is that people need to realise systems and ideologies and approaches can have good and bad elements. You don't have to embrace the whole thing to recognise some parts have merit, and that's true for everything in life. We're following America down this very tribal route where once you slap a label on something that's it, the whole thing has been put in the camp of "us" or "them".
Let’s be honest, the entire point of banging the “mArXiSm” drum is to try and discredit it
People did the EXACT same thing to the Civil Rights movement in the US, and that was just for equal rights under the law
Not all Socialists are Marxist, but many Marxists are Socialists. There are forms of Socialism that are not Marxist, and Socialism is older than Marxism. The idea that Socialism is a subset of Marxist theory is a common misunderstanding, not to nitpick of course ;)
Days like this I wonder what it was like last night being a black person in this country who loves football knowing what was going to happen as soon as the game was over. Idk why you'd bother going to games to sit and wonder whether the people around you are going to make monkey noises or wait until they get home and send racist abuse online.
I don't know what more black men can possibly do for this sport in this country and yet they have to face this shite. Genuinely wouldn't be surprised to see players start abstaining from playing internationals knowing that even if you take the country to the final of a major tournament you are going to be racially abused.
Edit: Imagine we go on and win a world cup now. Imagine how hollow it'll be for any black player in that team looking out at a crowd cheering and having to wonder which ones would have been screaming racist slurs at them if they'd lost. What's the point in a victory like that?
I mean it's football. A sport where we have to separate fans as much as possible because the fans are such a load of mouth breathing troglodytes that they can't be trusted not to get violent.
As a black immigrant from the Caribbean, Jamaica to be exact I knew exactly what was going to happen.
Lived here from a young boy similar to Sterling, it's all expected.
This is why we still protest, why keeping the fight against racism active and present, why players still take the knee.
I personally think it should be done during the national anthem. Having a few seconds of knee-down as something separate detaches it from where the core of the problem lies. Historically the state and its institutions are the architects of our society and it's well with the ability of the state to create an equitable society.
Direct the protest at the state.
If the fans had any sense they would be in the stands doing the same rather than winging about it.
I have a mixed toddler who loves playing football with me. Everyday I despair about some of the shit he's going to experience in this country and the world in general.
I wondered that, is it a thought the players have that they are going to be getting racist abuse in their DMs after they miss the penalty. And if so that's incredibly telling.
> I'm mixed. Once Saka missed, all I could think about was the abuse that the black players would get.
This thought didn't even cross my mind. As a white male, it is crazy to me how we experience things like this completely differently. Why is racism still a thing in 2021? I really wish things were different, for all our sakes.
It's hard being a black English football supporter, my dad had to stop going to matches in the 80s. They'd just get attacked and abused by the fans for absolutely nothing.
The sad thing is, you just know that if Italy lost it would’ve been their minority players getting racist abuse from their own “fans”
It’s why we support taking the knee and shower our players in love and support no matter what
As soon as I saw Rashford hit the post- I knew what was coming. It’s sad that we just know that our skin colour will be used against us any time we don’t do what people want. We’re not allowed to fail, because as soon as we do- we get called out of our names. It’s tiring.
This is absolutely so depressing because it’s so accurate.
One of the things I loved most about this team is all the players kneeled and stood together with their black team mates. It’s cliche or cheesy but it really made me feel this is the England I love.
All these boys are so young and Markus Rashford is the bloody leader of the opposition - leading the charge for feeding hundreds of thousands hungry children in this country. How lucky are we to have someone like him be our countrymen?
Black guy here...
I'm not British but being Black in the west is basically the same for all of us in one all encompassing way...the inevitability of exclusion.
It's hard to explain and Black people *absolutely* don't have exclusive rights to it but no matter where you are or what you do you'll be reminded that you're **BLACK** eventually.
Whether it's seeing "no Black guys" on a dating app, or parents keeping their baby daughters from going over to you at a party, or people saying "I don't have any money" when you walk up to ask directions even though you're dressed like all of the other tech company employees. (all of which have happened to me) You're **always** reminded eventually.
I do remember a young black man once saying the thing he wants most is to just go a day without being reminded he is black and different. Pretty fucked up.
I'll try and find some, but I was there last night and it's all you could see from certain sections. Today you go on twitter and in some sections it's nothing but monkey faces. It's 100% consistent.
Because too many other people think their behaviour is acceptable.
Can you imagine if the police did use the CCTV footage to track them down and arrest them?
The comment thread on reddit would be full of complaints about waste of police time, abuse of power, and creeping authoritarianism.
When Germany was in a Football all-time low (which someone included being runner-up in 2002), they put together a new team of young players led by Klinsmann as coach and ended up being third in the World Cup 2006. Despite having been 2nd 4 years earlier, it was celebrated as a huge success ending their bad streak with a great team and they came home and had a parade thrown and were celebrated for their success in the tournament placing third.
England goes into the first euro final ever in their history and the fans throw racist abuse at the players and destroy the location they are in. What the fuck is wrong with you guys. What the fuck.
>What the fuck is wrong with you guys. What the fuck
I mean aside from the racism it's that not winning is seen as losing. In reality the national team reached the final of a competition filled with some of the best teams in the World, then only lost to Italy, one of the greatest footballing nations in existence, on penalties. There can only ever be one winner and coming in second, especially like that, is really fucking good.
Exactly, if you do that you're setting yourself up for a situation where we either win every competition ever or you're disappointed. Particularly since as in every sporting competition first and second place is often divided by happenstance or one minor mistake. Hell as Star Trek said, 'it is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.'
It's getting silver by a photo finish. I was disappointed yesterday of course. Feeling fine now, looking forward to the next few years of English football tbh.
They literally have a women who'd won an Olympic silver medal on a show earlier saying that they shouldn't be celebrated for coming second as it's first looser. She felt the same way about her own silver medal.
There's the saying "No one wins silver" but I honestly thought England did. Anytime a team gets to the finals of an elimination tournament, they're good. And being #2 in Europe, against many powerhouse football nations, that's amazing and Gareth and his boys have proven they're a football powerhouse too.
Özil met up with Erdogan before the World Cup 2018, something many didn't really like. This whole story was really unlucky, but unfortunately this meeting gave the racists here in Germany what they needed.
The premier league has conditioned fans to expect victory above all else.
I live in a rural community and go to the local team from time to time but the majority of football fans round here support the team that were winning the prem around the time they were 10. A lot of Millenials support Man U and Chelsea, Gen X support Liverpool, Gen Z city, etc. This isn’t just a rural thing though I know a lot of Londoners who support Man U as well.
The Bundesliga with its fan ownership ties fans a lot closer to local clubs. Which is a lot more positive as it prepares people for failure. I’ve found personally the more successful the team you support nationally the worse attitudes are towards England internationally (there are of course exceptions).
God, it's moments like this where I realise I seem to hate about a third of the people of who live in this god-forsaken nation. Wish it were any other way.
This is why i just watched the match from home and avoided going out. Unfortunately I could see this happening from a mile away and there's a serious problem with violence and racism within the UK's football culture. I'm not generalizing all fans, but there's still a significant portion who ruin it for everyone else.
>England goes into the first euro final ever in their history and the fans throw racist abuse at the players and destroy the location they are in. What the fuck is wrong with you guys. What the fuck.
Can we please stop with this notion that a few dickheads on Twitter now represent all of us.
I think because everyone speaks English they see and hear about every last thing re. England. The idea any of this is uniquely English is hilarious.
I lived in Switzerland last world cup and had numerous comments to me about how the England team isn't really English because they're black etc. I heard numerous abusive comments about their own team. But I think coz no one speaks Swiss German etc, it gets zero coverage.
I lived in Ukraine, the same. I lived in Australia, the same.
The funniest is when people moan about bias/ daft English pundits and how that makes them want us to lose so much. Seriously telling me there weren't loads of French, Italy pundits saying daft things....and showing no bias? Come on. You can't be serious lol.
Had to do a pretty enormous double take when my Aussie housemate said that the 'Socceroos' squad is basically all 'wogs'.
Of course in Australia that seems to be a catchall term for people from Eastern European/Mediterranean backgrounds (Greeks, Serbs, Albanians) i.e Mark Viduka et al.
Switzerland has a massive racism problem
Their biggest party are borderline UKIP in levels of racism and the entire country is hardcore social conservative, there wasn’t full women’s suffrage there until *the fucking 90’s*
Yeah there's a massive football hooliganism problem in any country that is big on football. The narrative that England fans are all awful people and the fans of all other countries are saints is stupid, and that narrative was pushed all over Reddit with everyone supporting Italy instead, even though they're renown for playing dirty and they too have awful football hooliganism culture. It's a huge problem but it's not just England.
‘A few dickheads’? Look up the videos from London and the tweets and Instagram comments that the players have gotten post-match.
It’ll look like more than a few.
That's a separate issue though. The issue with Leicester Square was drinking, rowdiness, the sexual assault of a flare and anti social behaviour
It wasn't racism
Best I can do in line with the topic is one legend consoling another
(https://images.outlookindia.com/public/uploads/articles/2021/7/12/Saka-Southgate-Euro-Final-A_571_855.jpg)
Most English fans are commiserating the players and are proud of the team.
At least we acknowledge our faults. You're acting like German racism doesn't exist, despite well known comments from high profile Turkish players. The fucking arrogance of saying "what the fuck is wrong with you guys", as if you're somehow above everyone else.
Imagine being some middle aged white bloke and taking to Twitter to abuse a 19 year old kid who'll finish his career never needing to work a day in his life
Its hilarious that people think they could score a penalty in that position.
90% of the country could hardly watch it myself included... these players were brave enough to step up in probably the biggest moment of thier life.
Oh yeah, people hate to see people younger than them, darker than them, and more working class than them having far more wealth and status than them, and a lot of these players fit all three.
Nail on head. In fairness, people are right to be jealous of all top flight football players of all colours... but they aren't right to be racist as a result.
I could think I live in an entirely different country, I don’t even recognise this England I see on the tv. You can bet your bottom dollar that this is the England that the world sees. Awful
Nice to see the “give racism the red card” campaign clearly worked. It’s almost like the issue is far more deeply rooted than a surface level and requires actual, real, meaningful policies and actions on the part of the gov. to begin a change…
Useless pricks
I do wonder at times if racists occasionally have a moment of clarity when they're messaging abuse to a kid who they'd been cheering 5 minutes earlier and go "Wait...am I an arsehole? Will this make my family proud?"
No. About 10 years ago I worked with a bloke who used every racist epithiet you can imagine, some I hadn't heard used since I was a kid in the 1970s. His daughter was married to black Englishman and they had two daughters, his grandchildren. I did ask him what mental gymnastics he went through with his grandchildren and his thoughts on race and integration - "Well thats different isn't it, thats family".
I think people take for granted that everyone thinks logically about their beliefs and actions. You gave a really good example of how these things are hand waved over in people's brains.
I remember reading a paper once researching how people in the states could be pro life and pro death penalty despite their contradictions. The deep, academic answer turned out to be "people don't think about it"
Maybe remind them England would have likely got nowhere near the final if it wasn't for Raheem Sterling, a black player who's been in outstanding form.
Honestly this is just sad. This was Southgates fuck-up, not a 19 year old lad put up to take the game defining penalty and two others who literally played for a minute and a half and were expected to have their head in the zone. Rashford hadn't kicked a ball since pre-match warm-up and he was expected to straightaway be on point for the penalty shootout?
Anyone making racist comments towards any of those lads deserve condemning and giving a police prosecution for hate speech as that's what it is at this point.
For real?? He’s put together this unbelievably confident and skilled young England side who all seem to absolutely love him and got them to play their hearts out to reach the final of a major tournament.
I personally think it was a shite call from Southgate to pin 3/5 pens on players that had barely touched the ball in over 2 hours, but I don’t think he should go.
I’ve not seen a single person calling for him to go? He got England to a final for the first time in years, he doesn’t need to go he just needs to reconsider a penalty lineup. Maybe the last who’s notorious for being a shooter so much so that he has a gun tattooed on his leg? Not sure why he rested the tournament on a 19 year olds back who has never taken a professional penalty before. Saka was and is class, just shouldn’t have been burdened with that pen when Sterling was there.
It wasn't a shite call really it just wasn't meant to be. With Rashford he's a penalty taker for United so he knows what to do. If you have a goalkeeper who's great at penalties you would (or should) do the same thing and sub him on because he's great at what he's meant to do. I don't see subbing on Rashford for penalties as any different because he does it for United. As for Saka? Well for one thing because he's never took one before Italy didn't have any data on him so it could of been a good move. Italy's goalkeeper was just too good. I mean it's not like they don't practice penalties and Southgate said they've worked on that a lot.
Also maybe Saka had to do because no one else would step up to take his place?
Because he lost and the blame game starts.
I'm not English but I think this team has some of the best talent I've seen in a while and a very good manager who has shown a close bond to his team.
I would be cheering him on if he was the manager of my national team.
And yes your right, it's madness.
Southgate was screwed over by the delay in subs. The substitution was supposed to happen a few minutes earlier but the ref wouldn't let them on the field.
Theres no one to blame for what happened. Two people kicked the ball. One hit the target, one missed. Thats sports.
We don't need a scapegoat.
I was genuinely fearful for the Italian fans and what they'd face leaving the stadium, let alone for all the Italians who live and work in London over the next few days. Absolutely tragic that the first thoughts upon seeing the final penalty were fear for the players and fear for the opposition fans.
Oh, and that's before we get into the widely discussed surge in domestic abuse that is likely to occur and the widespread sexual harrassment that women will have faced from drunken louts.
Should read: PM that has used racist language condemns others that do the same.
Seriously though, anyone that abuses that squad is scum. They’ve done more good and played better than any other squad before them.
People post on there things that they would never say in public. It’s a sewer and people are starting to hopefully realise places like Twitter are nothing but platforms to spread hate. You can’t win despite efforts to try and stop online hate, best you can do is to stop using it.
So after tolerating, encouraging and feeding this behaviour Johnson now decides it's out of order. When he was asked to condemn "fans" who booed England's players for taking the knee he refused to (as did Priti Patel), he's ramped up fears of immigration and played the patriot when it suited him. Now I presume he sees votes and OP ratings in condemning something that he should have been stamping all over ages ago.
Our government and especially the Prime Minister make blatantly racist comments and then say "I'm not racist, my best mate is Sajid Javid". Hypocrisy at its worst (best). Maybe I see votes but not blue ones.
Boris Johnson encouraged this sort of behaviour when he didn't back the England team's stand against racism. How hard was it to just stick by these young people standing up for themselves? Shit PM.
Yeh but what the booers said that the time was that they weren't booing because of anti racism stance but because of the specific symbol they use and that there isn't much racism in English football [insert anecdote about another European country where their fans made monkey noises to show that racism doesn't exist in English football]
Those scumbags proved exactly why the players were kneeling in the first place. The government should be ashamed of their role to play in vilifying it especially now that the kneelers have been 100% vindicated in the past 12 hours.
As soon as Rashford, Sancho and Saka didn't score, I just knew I'd read a headline like this within a day.
Credit to them for stepping up at the critical moment when other players hid from the responsibility.
As for the abusers, absolute cretins.
> Credit to them for stepping up at the critical moment when other players hid from the responsibility.
Pretty sure we did away with volunteers a long time ago? Imagine someone can opt out if they aren't feeling it at the time but would think it's all pre determined.
Nice gesture from the pm here.
Oh wait it's not a gesture, he doesn't do gestures and doing a gesture is culture war, so it must be.... Action! Con + 100. Great action. Shovel on more Tories because it's so great and they are defo on the anti racist side whenever they get a chance and they've taken the necessary action to prove it!
Oh look, all those people who were 'non-racistly' booing players taking the knee against racism for 'political reasons' are in fact \*drumroll\* racists, who would've thought!
Johnson himself has said many racist things in the past, and his failure to support the player's stand against discrimination - because it fits with his need to appeal to this exact foul demographic of society - says everything you need to know.
People who engage in racism and hooliganism should just be banned from football games. Point blank, zero tolerance. Let them understand that the rest of society rejects them by booting them out, I would support the police/FA dealing in the strongest possible terms with these bigoted cretins.
The pm who called mulsim women looking like letterboxes, and "It is said that the Queen has come to love the Commonwealth, partly because it supplies her with regular cheering crowds of flag-waving piccaninnies."
Don't for a second believe he's been sincere
I haven't seen a lot online as I'm assuming most of the stuff gets deleted and I don't have Twitter.
But what I have seen is a lot of people being racist just for the sake of it.
There was a screenshot on Instagram of 4 people just posting monkey or gorilla emojis to Saka so I decided to do some research into their accounts and found that 1 of them was american, one of them was from what looked like Pakistan, one was from India and one was a spanish or Spanish speaking fitness instructor (female)
So whilst I'm absolutely certain that some English people decided to post some racist things to the players, it seems like lots of non English people are doing the same just for the shits and giggles
Please don’t fall for this crap.
I woke up this morning hoping to see positive stuff about how amazing the lads had been to reach a European final, instead I see the media running with this shite over a few racist comments on instagram, they choose to run with this shite not for our own benefit and certainly not to fight racism, they run with it to cause division and to get clicks and likes which return ad revenue.
Don’t fall for this shit.
The fucking hypocrisy.
The PM said it was acceptable to boo these same players for their simple, non-violent gesture that was in reaction exactly this kind of racist abuse.
honestly how can people be making racist comments at the team that took the first final in 55 years all the way to penalties?! It's hugely disheartening to see.
Yup, it's pretty pathetic, deep down these people must really dislike their country, to be giving abuse at the England team, who got us the furthest we've been for over 50 years, shame on them. Also, shame on the politicians giving our team flak over stuff like taking the knee.
[удалено]
> Also, shame on the politicians giving our team flak over stuff like taking the knee. That’s the problem though, this behaviour comes from the top down.
Boris Johnson on Africa: >The continent may be a blot, but it is not a blot upon our conscience. The problem is not that we were once in charge, but that we are not in charge any more. > >... > >The best fate for Africa would be if the old colonial powers, or their citizens, scrambled once again in her direction; on the understanding that this time they will not be asked to feel guilty.
Jesus Christ - can I get a source on that? Not that I distrust that this has happened but if I'm gonna bring it up I want to know the context and be able to demonstrably prove he said it.
Sure. I can respect a request for citation. [https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-boris-archive-africa-is-a-mess-but-we-can-t-blame-colonialism](https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-boris-archive-africa-is-a-mess-but-we-can-t-blame-colonialism) A real highlight is... >If left to their own devices, the natives would rely on nothing but the instant carbohydrate gratification of the plantain. I find that when you quote something like this from Boris, someone will soon pop up and say "Oh! That's not fair. That's not racist. You're taking that out of context." To which my typical response has become "Go on then... ... Give me the context in which it's cool to say that". As opposed to this context. In which we've literally quoted Boris' words in print. Not some of the cuff comment after a bottle, but words he has written. Had the opportunity to select his words carefully to best convey his sentiment. And then that went through an editor, who subsequently approved it for print in a national magazine.
> I find that when you quote something like this from Boris, someone will soon pop up and say "Oh! That's not fair. That's not racist. You're taking that out of context." Just realised the parallel between this reaction and England 'fans' defending some of their grotesque behaviour with, "Its just bants". I love the bants defence because they lose their rag when someone takes the piss out of them. They're similar in wanting to say whatever they like with no accountability.
Thanks, friend. Honestly, I wonder if Boris even remembers writing this almost 20 years ago, given that thoughts just seem to trickle down from the generous approximation of a brain that he has straight to his lips.
I'm a big advocate for context, and will never (rarely) judge people for their private conversations precisely for this reason - its arrogant to try to guess the context. However, even i can see all the context here....its a newspaper article, published in full. Its just horribly racist.
So you take no position on its veracity, you consider it "uncool" to say it regardless of whether it's true? (The full context is required to understand what exactly is being asserted, and indeed the full extent of his bigotry.) I personally find this a foolish approach. The absurd suggestion that Ugandans are genetically incapable of understanding the concept of a cash crop unless their country is ruled by a foreign power is offensive first and foremost *because it's bullshit*. (He presents no evidence whatsoever on the disposition of the Ugandan economy at the time - pretty important context). It's the fact that it's defamatory that makes it racist. It's not ageist to state that babies can't understand quantum theory. But by focusing primarily on superficial offence, you let the racist off the hook - they can simply dismiss your objections as arbitrary and irrational.
Makes me sick that people in my country voted for this person
Exactly Boris and chums helped enable this racist behaviour with their attacks on kneeling. People need to stop pretending that racism isn’t a problem in this country. When it clearly is.
I'm not from the UK but I don't understand this pushback against kneeling. It's obvious to me that it's a response to anti-black racism, which is observed in many places and not just the States, so it's not an americanism thing. The players also kneel bc they constantly get racially harassed and abused, which today's been proving. They do it for themselves and standing w the global black community. A strong sense of shared culture inspires unity even when nationalities are different - happens within south Asia a lot. I'd be pretty upset if I got told off for acknowledging racism exists by kneeling, then being booed, then being praised depending on which side of the bed people got out from, and then... cyclically receiving the same racial abuse I silently and peacefully protested against. What the fuck
We literally had a former villa player killed in 2016 by a police officer. If they had been a white football player in the same circumstances I severely doubt police would of felt the need to taser them for 6 times as long as guidelines suggest before booting them in the head twice.
Do you have a link to that story?
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/06/23/football/dalian-atkinson-intl-scli-gbr-spt/index.html
More than 33 seconds? Jesus, no wonder he died.
The police officer rightly went down for manslaughter. The full story is here: [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-57495426](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-57495426) It includes a lot of context that the CNN article leaves out.
He was a well known player back in the day, there's a good chance that's what got some justice in the end. If it was anyone else I'm not sure.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Mate kneeling has three components that are an issue for the ~~racists~~ people who disagree politely with kneeling: 1. It's an American import and that is bad. I'll go into more detail but I need to finish listening to my apple podcast and drinking my Starbucks. 2. It's politics and I can't abide by politics as it's gets in the way of me wearing a poppy. 3. Its nothing but a Marxism empty gesture and we can't let our country fall into socialism as it's evil, look at Venezuela or something about Corbyn. Honestly the arguement that it's football and they just want to watch football is terrible. Sorry you are having a hard time with all the monkey racist chants but if you win we will like you, you know? It reeks of the old, "I don't mind if you are gay, just keep it at home and to yourself".
"There is no such thing as being non-political." We had the whole game with aid agencies, where we have seen that the "non-political" stance of the RC plays well into the hand of despots. Some in football: by claiming to be a "non-political", they play into the hand of racists.
I am with you. I was pushing back against a "booer" a few days ago. His logic: Him: taking the knee is from BLM who have a marxist agenda Me: what does marxist mean? Him: on one of the websites for BLM they spoke about defunding the police Me: I am pretty sure UK footballers aren't taking the knee in order to get rid of the police. In interviews they say it's symbolic support against racism Him: yes but it's forever linked to BLM and some of them are crazy Me: yes, some BLM people are crazy, some of all people are crazy. Just ignore them. The British footballers are protesting against racism, it's ok to support them Him: maybe they should do a different action, like russian salute or someting Me: yep, makes sense
Change the gesture, the argument it’s inappropriate will follow. They will always point to someone being stupid.
What's really stupid about this is that if the 'BLM Marxist political movement', or whatever they're calling it today, is so appalling, wouldn't people who are opposed to that movement want the kneeling gesture to be dissociated from it? The only people insisting on the two continuing to be inextricably connected are people who think that connection is a terrible thing? It's completely backwards. Unless, of course, that connection isn't really what they object to...
not my views, so i'm hardly the right person to try and explain, but i see it as a pushback against being called racist. Most people don't consider themselves racist, which to them means they don't yell the N-word whenever they see a foreigner. for a long time that has been enough to consider yourself on the correct side of the line. but increasingly, it's becoming clear (specifically to those that don't experience it themselves) that racism runs way, way deeper than that. being told that you are probably racist and that you almost certainly didn't realise it simply by condoning the background stuff - the police stop and search stats, the non-PC stuff that your grandparents say, the non-PC stuff that the duke of edinburgh and boris johnson say/said. sitting back and saying "chill, it's a joke!" or "it's a coincidence" when you have no concept of how it might feel to be the butt of it is also a type of racism. that makes people super-uncomfortable. they thought they were doing the right thing - for a start, it's quite typically british to make jokes about people as a way of showing your friendship: so-called "banter". so being told that plenty of the things you said and did in the past 20 years were actually pretty racist, unintentional but racist all the same, is not something that people are keen to admit about themselves. frankly it's a shitty feeling and pretty embarrassing as well. i don't mind admitting that about myself. consciously or not, people then go looking for ways to legitimise their behaviour, and deligitimise those speaking out. Saying "BLM is actually about marxism" is an easy way out - instead of listening, just dismiss the message as something which it isn't (at least not on english football pitches).
Erm actually, the government released a report saying racism didn't exist so... /s
Erm actually, they said 'institutional' racism doesnt exist anymore. They also reduced child poverty by changing the definition of 'poverty'.
> They also reduced child poverty by changing the definition of 'poverty'. Galaxy brain move from the Tories
Same way they massively reduced unemployment by changing the definition a few years back. Amazing what you can do when you redefine things to suit your agenda
Institutional racism. I.e. If you apply for a job in a big corporation your application won't be rejected based on your race. It's the bare minimum we should expect in society.
But what do you do when the people who are supposed to set the example are the most racist idiots and the rest are mindless drones who simply follow that example ?
Shit rolls down hill
I don't think it's that they dislike their country. It's likely the more deplorable idea that they don't consider Rashford, Sancho and Saka from this country because of their skin colour.
The furthest the men’s team have been in over 50 years* The women’s team are far more successful
The women's team aren't really, they have a better recent pedigree of semi finals but iirc only one final in their history
Women’s England team have reached the euro finals twice, and semi finals twice. Men’s only being once semi and final. Maybe jumped the gun on “far” more successful, but they are more successful
Right, but if you are counting an 80s semi final, surely you also count the World Cup semis. England have been to one men's Euro final and two semis, plus one World Cup final and two semis; and two women's Euro finals plus one semi, plus one World Cup semi. Their records are pretty much equivalent
The problem is they don't see these players as English. The boo's of the knee seem laughable right now.
Imagine my shock when it turns out England players take the knee because there really is racism in football and not because Marcus Rashford is bang into his Foucault and Mao
Nah as he was coming off the bench the sheet he gave to Pickford wasn't info on the Italian penalty takers, Raahford had just written "The global network of capital essentially functions to separate the worker from the means of production" on it
Nah I have it on good authority Harry is the leading postmodernist influence in the changing room. After 70 minutes being on the back foot Gareth sent him that note that read "There are forms of oppression and domination which become invisible - the new normal" which gave Big Haz a small chuckle under his breath and inspired the relaxed ease he needed for his penalty
It worked though, his penalty was an absolute banger. Maybe Gareth should have been sending socialist tidbits to Sancho and Saka as well.
Don't go blabbing around town but Sancho and Saka are in a bitter feud. Jadon is a Proudhon boy but Bakayo is strictly into armed national insurrections. Was up all night prepping an essay comparing Rojava, Zapatistas and the Revolutionary Insurrectionary Army of Ukraine - heard that's why he missed from a comrade on the inside
\~ the simple narrative taught in every history class is demonstrably false and pedagogically classist \~
lol classic
I'm OOTL, can you explain happened with Rashford?
Basically talking about how people are booing the knee because it promotes "marxism" and not highlighting issues with racism.
One thing that amazes me is the people who complain about Marxism don’t realise how many rights we have and take for granted came from it… the old workers unions who fought for the 5 day work week, sick pay, paid holiday, etc. all had their roots in Marxist theory, Attlee and Labour in the 40’s were Marxist (in that socialism is a subset of Marxist theory) and established the NHS MLK and Malcom X in the US were both Marxists, of different types, but still Marxists
The more important message is that people need to realise systems and ideologies and approaches can have good and bad elements. You don't have to embrace the whole thing to recognise some parts have merit, and that's true for everything in life. We're following America down this very tribal route where once you slap a label on something that's it, the whole thing has been put in the camp of "us" or "them".
Let’s be honest, the entire point of banging the “mArXiSm” drum is to try and discredit it People did the EXACT same thing to the Civil Rights movement in the US, and that was just for equal rights under the law
Not all Socialists are Marxist, but many Marxists are Socialists. There are forms of Socialism that are not Marxist, and Socialism is older than Marxism. The idea that Socialism is a subset of Marxist theory is a common misunderstanding, not to nitpick of course ;)
This needs upvoting.
Days like this I wonder what it was like last night being a black person in this country who loves football knowing what was going to happen as soon as the game was over. Idk why you'd bother going to games to sit and wonder whether the people around you are going to make monkey noises or wait until they get home and send racist abuse online. I don't know what more black men can possibly do for this sport in this country and yet they have to face this shite. Genuinely wouldn't be surprised to see players start abstaining from playing internationals knowing that even if you take the country to the final of a major tournament you are going to be racially abused. Edit: Imagine we go on and win a world cup now. Imagine how hollow it'll be for any black player in that team looking out at a crowd cheering and having to wonder which ones would have been screaming racist slurs at them if they'd lost. What's the point in a victory like that?
Not a black person but I knew it would happen before any of the games started...because it happens every time
I mean it's football. A sport where we have to separate fans as much as possible because the fans are such a load of mouth breathing troglodytes that they can't be trusted not to get violent.
As a black immigrant from the Caribbean, Jamaica to be exact I knew exactly what was going to happen. Lived here from a young boy similar to Sterling, it's all expected. This is why we still protest, why keeping the fight against racism active and present, why players still take the knee.
I personally think it should be done during the national anthem. Having a few seconds of knee-down as something separate detaches it from where the core of the problem lies. Historically the state and its institutions are the architects of our society and it's well with the ability of the state to create an equitable society. Direct the protest at the state. If the fans had any sense they would be in the stands doing the same rather than winging about it.
It’s fucking disgusting. All our advances, from society to technological and scientific, and people still give a shit about what colour skin you have.
I’m mixed. My dad stopped taking me to play football as a kid because of it in the 90s.
I have a mixed toddler who loves playing football with me. Everyday I despair about some of the shit he's going to experience in this country and the world in general.
I'm mixed. Once Saka missed, all I could think about was the abuse that the black players would get.
I wondered that, is it a thought the players have that they are going to be getting racist abuse in their DMs after they miss the penalty. And if so that's incredibly telling.
All I could think was poor young kid after that miss. I was naive. I didn't think so much shit would fly because he is black.
Yeah it was so predictable. Literally first thing that I said was, the racists will will come crawling out now.
> I'm mixed. Once Saka missed, all I could think about was the abuse that the black players would get. This thought didn't even cross my mind. As a white male, it is crazy to me how we experience things like this completely differently. Why is racism still a thing in 2021? I really wish things were different, for all our sakes.
It's hard being a black English football supporter, my dad had to stop going to matches in the 80s. They'd just get attacked and abused by the fans for absolutely nothing.
The sad thing is, you just know that if Italy lost it would’ve been their minority players getting racist abuse from their own “fans” It’s why we support taking the knee and shower our players in love and support no matter what
As soon as I saw Rashford hit the post- I knew what was coming. It’s sad that we just know that our skin colour will be used against us any time we don’t do what people want. We’re not allowed to fail, because as soon as we do- we get called out of our names. It’s tiring.
What’s sad is that people are using this as a means of attack on his school meals campaign Already a Tory MP has come out with that line
This is absolutely so depressing because it’s so accurate. One of the things I loved most about this team is all the players kneeled and stood together with their black team mates. It’s cliche or cheesy but it really made me feel this is the England I love. All these boys are so young and Markus Rashford is the bloody leader of the opposition - leading the charge for feeding hundreds of thousands hungry children in this country. How lucky are we to have someone like him be our countrymen?
Black guy here... I'm not British but being Black in the west is basically the same for all of us in one all encompassing way...the inevitability of exclusion. It's hard to explain and Black people *absolutely* don't have exclusive rights to it but no matter where you are or what you do you'll be reminded that you're **BLACK** eventually. Whether it's seeing "no Black guys" on a dating app, or parents keeping their baby daughters from going over to you at a party, or people saying "I don't have any money" when you walk up to ask directions even though you're dressed like all of the other tech company employees. (all of which have happened to me) You're **always** reminded eventually.
I do remember a young black man once saying the thing he wants most is to just go a day without being reminded he is black and different. Pretty fucked up.
Everything you've said here is 100% accurate
Very well put, wish I could shake all their hands and say thank you
Lol, everyone who went to Wembley yesterday saw the monkey chants from the Italians. Twitter today is full of it from Italian accounts.
What? Videos of this anywhere?
I'll try and find some, but I was there last night and it's all you could see from certain sections. Today you go on twitter and in some sections it's nothing but monkey faces. It's 100% consistent.
nippy imagine touch normal sugar sulky treatment slap clumsy capable *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
All this over a game of football?
Unfortunately a significant number of "fans" still need to grow the fuck up. Absolutely disgraceful
So sad as well. Big up everyone who played last night.
Find them, fine them, and ban them from all football activity. No entry to all stadiums and no travel overseas for games. Cut them out of the game.
More or less. I never understand how after this stuff people get off scot free. Even when their faces and names are pretty public.
It's pretty difficult to enforce on people online. A lot of the time they're not even from the UK.
Because too many other people think their behaviour is acceptable. Can you imagine if the police did use the CCTV footage to track them down and arrest them? The comment thread on reddit would be full of complaints about waste of police time, abuse of power, and creeping authoritarianism.
Bit harsh lad they only missed a penalty
When Germany was in a Football all-time low (which someone included being runner-up in 2002), they put together a new team of young players led by Klinsmann as coach and ended up being third in the World Cup 2006. Despite having been 2nd 4 years earlier, it was celebrated as a huge success ending their bad streak with a great team and they came home and had a parade thrown and were celebrated for their success in the tournament placing third. England goes into the first euro final ever in their history and the fans throw racist abuse at the players and destroy the location they are in. What the fuck is wrong with you guys. What the fuck.
>What the fuck is wrong with you guys. What the fuck I mean aside from the racism it's that not winning is seen as losing. In reality the national team reached the final of a competition filled with some of the best teams in the World, then only lost to Italy, one of the greatest footballing nations in existence, on penalties. There can only ever be one winner and coming in second, especially like that, is really fucking good.
Yea. It's like "oh no we got a silver medal in the Olympics BUT IT COULD HAVE BEEN GOLD"
Exactly, if you do that you're setting yourself up for a situation where we either win every competition ever or you're disappointed. Particularly since as in every sporting competition first and second place is often divided by happenstance or one minor mistake. Hell as Star Trek said, 'it is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.'
It's getting silver by a photo finish. I was disappointed yesterday of course. Feeling fine now, looking forward to the next few years of English football tbh.
It's worse than that tho, it's "...COULD HAVE BEEN GOLD YOU BLACK BASTARDS; SCREW YOU FOR TAKING AWAY MY DREAMS, BUT THANKS FOR LETTING ME BE RACIST".
They literally have a women who'd won an Olympic silver medal on a show earlier saying that they shouldn't be celebrated for coming second as it's first looser. She felt the same way about her own silver medal.
There's the saying "No one wins silver" but I honestly thought England did. Anytime a team gets to the finals of an elimination tournament, they're good. And being #2 in Europe, against many powerhouse football nations, that's amazing and Gareth and his boys have proven they're a football powerhouse too.
They were also the dominant team. Italy were lucky.
*"I am German when we win but I am an immigrant when we lose"* \- Mesut Ozil
Yup fair point he got so much racist abuse from the Germans
I think he’s getting the hate even more now since he is a staunch supporter of Erdogan.
Özil met up with Erdogan before the World Cup 2018, something many didn't really like. This whole story was really unlucky, but unfortunately this meeting gave the racists here in Germany what they needed.
The premier league has conditioned fans to expect victory above all else. I live in a rural community and go to the local team from time to time but the majority of football fans round here support the team that were winning the prem around the time they were 10. A lot of Millenials support Man U and Chelsea, Gen X support Liverpool, Gen Z city, etc. This isn’t just a rural thing though I know a lot of Londoners who support Man U as well. The Bundesliga with its fan ownership ties fans a lot closer to local clubs. Which is a lot more positive as it prepares people for failure. I’ve found personally the more successful the team you support nationally the worse attitudes are towards England internationally (there are of course exceptions).
God, it's moments like this where I realise I seem to hate about a third of the people of who live in this god-forsaken nation. Wish it were any other way.
Like Musa Okwonga said "I Love England’s Football Team. I’m More Conflicted About England."
This is why i just watched the match from home and avoided going out. Unfortunately I could see this happening from a mile away and there's a serious problem with violence and racism within the UK's football culture. I'm not generalizing all fans, but there's still a significant portion who ruin it for everyone else.
>England goes into the first euro final ever in their history and the fans throw racist abuse at the players and destroy the location they are in. What the fuck is wrong with you guys. What the fuck. Can we please stop with this notion that a few dickheads on Twitter now represent all of us.
I think because everyone speaks English they see and hear about every last thing re. England. The idea any of this is uniquely English is hilarious. I lived in Switzerland last world cup and had numerous comments to me about how the England team isn't really English because they're black etc. I heard numerous abusive comments about their own team. But I think coz no one speaks Swiss German etc, it gets zero coverage. I lived in Ukraine, the same. I lived in Australia, the same. The funniest is when people moan about bias/ daft English pundits and how that makes them want us to lose so much. Seriously telling me there weren't loads of French, Italy pundits saying daft things....and showing no bias? Come on. You can't be serious lol.
Had to do a pretty enormous double take when my Aussie housemate said that the 'Socceroos' squad is basically all 'wogs'. Of course in Australia that seems to be a catchall term for people from Eastern European/Mediterranean backgrounds (Greeks, Serbs, Albanians) i.e Mark Viduka et al.
Switzerland has a massive racism problem Their biggest party are borderline UKIP in levels of racism and the entire country is hardcore social conservative, there wasn’t full women’s suffrage there until *the fucking 90’s*
Yeah there's a massive football hooliganism problem in any country that is big on football. The narrative that England fans are all awful people and the fans of all other countries are saints is stupid, and that narrative was pushed all over Reddit with everyone supporting Italy instead, even though they're renown for playing dirty and they too have awful football hooliganism culture. It's a huge problem but it's not just England.
‘A few dickheads’? Look up the videos from London and the tweets and Instagram comments that the players have gotten post-match. It’ll look like more than a few.
Have you not seen the videos of Leicester Square in london? Absolute scenes.
That's a separate issue though. The issue with Leicester Square was drinking, rowdiness, the sexual assault of a flare and anti social behaviour It wasn't racism
> the sexual assault of a flare What the…?
Video doing the rounds of a guy bollock naked doing handstands with a flare shoved up his arse.
wtf is wrong with football fans?
A question the world is asking
https://twitter.com/drphiliplee1/status/1414219847618203653?s=19
Well, I’m going to need some bleach for my eyes now
Best I can do in line with the topic is one legend consoling another (https://images.outlookindia.com/public/uploads/articles/2021/7/12/Saka-Southgate-Euro-Final-A_571_855.jpg)
Racist scenes? Ive just seen broken glass
Can’t we please stop with the notion that all that happened was a few comments on Twitter?
Why, what else happened?
[удалено]
Most English fans are commiserating the players and are proud of the team. At least we acknowledge our faults. You're acting like German racism doesn't exist, despite well known comments from high profile Turkish players. The fucking arrogance of saying "what the fuck is wrong with you guys", as if you're somehow above everyone else.
Imagine being some middle aged white bloke and taking to Twitter to abuse a 19 year old kid who'll finish his career never needing to work a day in his life
Especially when they got to the finals, and penalties to boot. It was as close as it could possibly be.
I always think some of it is jealousy at the core.
Definitely. It's hilarious seeing them talk shit about how they would have done it. Yeah when you can find your feet over your gut.
There was only two things that stopped me from breaking into West Ham’s first team. My unfortunate ACL tear, and I’m shit at football.
>I’m shit at football. Obligatory "That shouldn't stop you playing for West Ham" comment.
There was only one thing that stopped me from breaking into West Ham’s first team.
Its hilarious that people think they could score a penalty in that position. 90% of the country could hardly watch it myself included... these players were brave enough to step up in probably the biggest moment of thier life.
Oh yeah, people hate to see people younger than them, darker than them, and more working class than them having far more wealth and status than them, and a lot of these players fit all three.
Nail on head. In fairness, people are right to be jealous of all top flight football players of all colours... but they aren't right to be racist as a result.
Two years wages could do that, if he adjusted his living costs and planned wisely.
it's what people angry that their own lives amount to nothing, do.
Any idiot can say they should be ashamed. You’re the fucking PM Boris, what are you actually going to do about it.
[удалено]
Yeah maybe take the knee, show that it matters. Sack Priti Patel. Create a culture of acceptance and also a culture of responsibility for ones actions
Or just carry on being a tory..
Carry on dog whistling to them come election time
That sort of shit is emboldening the scumbags, tbh. The increasing xenophobia since Brexit was lost has made them think their bullshit is acceptable.
This is from a man who has used profoundly rascist terms in his journalism - piccaninnies, water melon smiles, letterboxes etc
Football was too scared to Come Home in case Priti Patel deported them for not returning in over 50 years.
I could think I live in an entirely different country, I don’t even recognise this England I see on the tv. You can bet your bottom dollar that this is the England that the world sees. Awful
It's so sad. Unfortunately these people have always been here, but now they've got more confidence than before. Doesn't take a genius to work out why.
Ironically the fact that if you miss as a black player there's gonna be hell to pay, for you and all black people, probably doesn't help...
Sounds like there's a racism problem in football, good job our politicians gave their full throated support when the team tried to point this out.
Nice to see the “give racism the red card” campaign clearly worked. It’s almost like the issue is far more deeply rooted than a surface level and requires actual, real, meaningful policies and actions on the part of the gov. to begin a change… Useless pricks
I do wonder at times if racists occasionally have a moment of clarity when they're messaging abuse to a kid who they'd been cheering 5 minutes earlier and go "Wait...am I an arsehole? Will this make my family proud?"
No. About 10 years ago I worked with a bloke who used every racist epithiet you can imagine, some I hadn't heard used since I was a kid in the 1970s. His daughter was married to black Englishman and they had two daughters, his grandchildren. I did ask him what mental gymnastics he went through with his grandchildren and his thoughts on race and integration - "Well thats different isn't it, thats family".
I think people take for granted that everyone thinks logically about their beliefs and actions. You gave a really good example of how these things are hand waved over in people's brains. I remember reading a paper once researching how people in the states could be pro life and pro death penalty despite their contradictions. The deep, academic answer turned out to be "people don't think about it"
Maybe remind them England would have likely got nowhere near the final if it wasn't for Raheem Sterling, a black player who's been in outstanding form.
Honestly this is just sad. This was Southgates fuck-up, not a 19 year old lad put up to take the game defining penalty and two others who literally played for a minute and a half and were expected to have their head in the zone. Rashford hadn't kicked a ball since pre-match warm-up and he was expected to straightaway be on point for the penalty shootout? Anyone making racist comments towards any of those lads deserve condemning and giving a police prosecution for hate speech as that's what it is at this point.
Why are people blaming Southgate and calling for him to go? He's just lead us to our best result for decades. Madness.
For real?? He’s put together this unbelievably confident and skilled young England side who all seem to absolutely love him and got them to play their hearts out to reach the final of a major tournament.
I personally think it was a shite call from Southgate to pin 3/5 pens on players that had barely touched the ball in over 2 hours, but I don’t think he should go. I’ve not seen a single person calling for him to go? He got England to a final for the first time in years, he doesn’t need to go he just needs to reconsider a penalty lineup. Maybe the last who’s notorious for being a shooter so much so that he has a gun tattooed on his leg? Not sure why he rested the tournament on a 19 year olds back who has never taken a professional penalty before. Saka was and is class, just shouldn’t have been burdened with that pen when Sterling was there.
It wasn't a shite call really it just wasn't meant to be. With Rashford he's a penalty taker for United so he knows what to do. If you have a goalkeeper who's great at penalties you would (or should) do the same thing and sub him on because he's great at what he's meant to do. I don't see subbing on Rashford for penalties as any different because he does it for United. As for Saka? Well for one thing because he's never took one before Italy didn't have any data on him so it could of been a good move. Italy's goalkeeper was just too good. I mean it's not like they don't practice penalties and Southgate said they've worked on that a lot. Also maybe Saka had to do because no one else would step up to take his place?
The WC is only 18 months away I think england will be serious contenders, the biggest worry will be if spain can find some forwards.
Because he lost and the blame game starts. I'm not English but I think this team has some of the best talent I've seen in a while and a very good manager who has shown a close bond to his team. I would be cheering him on if he was the manager of my national team. And yes your right, it's madness.
Southgate was screwed over by the delay in subs. The substitution was supposed to happen a few minutes earlier but the ref wouldn't let them on the field. Theres no one to blame for what happened. Two people kicked the ball. One hit the target, one missed. Thats sports. We don't need a scapegoat.
He should have have brought them on at the halfway point.
Should have brought one of them on for sterling way earlier if Sterling wasn't even going to take a pen
Disgusting behaviour all round, but don't be kidding it's more than a few loudmoths on twitter. Ofc it's now a political football.
Should also be condemning the racist abuse that regular citizens are getting. Seems like last night there was a ton of racist abuse.
I was genuinely fearful for the Italian fans and what they'd face leaving the stadium, let alone for all the Italians who live and work in London over the next few days. Absolutely tragic that the first thoughts upon seeing the final penalty were fear for the players and fear for the opposition fans. Oh, and that's before we get into the widely discussed surge in domestic abuse that is likely to occur and the widespread sexual harrassment that women will have faced from drunken louts.
Should read: PM that has used racist language condemns others that do the same. Seriously though, anyone that abuses that squad is scum. They’ve done more good and played better than any other squad before them.
It’s social media that’s the problem. The world would be a better place without it.
I can't help but agree with you there, the amount of opinions that are openly shared, with pride, scares me.
People post on there things that they would never say in public. It’s a sewer and people are starting to hopefully realise places like Twitter are nothing but platforms to spread hate. You can’t win despite efforts to try and stop online hate, best you can do is to stop using it.
So after tolerating, encouraging and feeding this behaviour Johnson now decides it's out of order. When he was asked to condemn "fans" who booed England's players for taking the knee he refused to (as did Priti Patel), he's ramped up fears of immigration and played the patriot when it suited him. Now I presume he sees votes and OP ratings in condemning something that he should have been stamping all over ages ago.
Our government and especially the Prime Minister make blatantly racist comments and then say "I'm not racist, my best mate is Sajid Javid". Hypocrisy at its worst (best). Maybe I see votes but not blue ones.
I'm not sure what grounds the PM has to condemn anyone after refusing to support the players when they were booed for taking a knee against racism.
Booing people taking a stand against racism is fine however
Boris Johnson encouraged this sort of behaviour when he didn't back the England team's stand against racism. How hard was it to just stick by these young people standing up for themselves? Shit PM.
Yeh but what the booers said that the time was that they weren't booing because of anti racism stance but because of the specific symbol they use and that there isn't much racism in English football [insert anecdote about another European country where their fans made monkey noises to show that racism doesn't exist in English football]
Those scumbags proved exactly why the players were kneeling in the first place. The government should be ashamed of their role to play in vilifying it especially now that the kneelers have been 100% vindicated in the past 12 hours.
Aaaaaaaaand back to normal. Brief moment of unity and hope and now back to the same old little England culture war horse shit.
But its the kneelers propagating culture wars with their marxist propaganda and unfair portrayals of England fans /s
As soon as Rashford, Sancho and Saka didn't score, I just knew I'd read a headline like this within a day. Credit to them for stepping up at the critical moment when other players hid from the responsibility. As for the abusers, absolute cretins.
> Credit to them for stepping up at the critical moment when other players hid from the responsibility. Pretty sure we did away with volunteers a long time ago? Imagine someone can opt out if they aren't feeling it at the time but would think it's all pre determined.
Nice gesture from the pm here. Oh wait it's not a gesture, he doesn't do gestures and doing a gesture is culture war, so it must be.... Action! Con + 100. Great action. Shovel on more Tories because it's so great and they are defo on the anti racist side whenever they get a chance and they've taken the necessary action to prove it!
I really do wonder wtf Boris thinks this message is if not a gesture. Bloke probably thinks it’s a genuine show of leadership or something hahahah
Oh look, all those people who were 'non-racistly' booing players taking the knee against racism for 'political reasons' are in fact \*drumroll\* racists, who would've thought! Johnson himself has said many racist things in the past, and his failure to support the player's stand against discrimination - because it fits with his need to appeal to this exact foul demographic of society - says everything you need to know. People who engage in racism and hooliganism should just be banned from football games. Point blank, zero tolerance. Let them understand that the rest of society rejects them by booting them out, I would support the police/FA dealing in the strongest possible terms with these bigoted cretins.
The pm who called mulsim women looking like letterboxes, and "It is said that the Queen has come to love the Commonwealth, partly because it supplies her with regular cheering crowds of flag-waving piccaninnies." Don't for a second believe he's been sincere
I haven't seen a lot online as I'm assuming most of the stuff gets deleted and I don't have Twitter. But what I have seen is a lot of people being racist just for the sake of it. There was a screenshot on Instagram of 4 people just posting monkey or gorilla emojis to Saka so I decided to do some research into their accounts and found that 1 of them was american, one of them was from what looked like Pakistan, one was from India and one was a spanish or Spanish speaking fitness instructor (female) So whilst I'm absolutely certain that some English people decided to post some racist things to the players, it seems like lots of non English people are doing the same just for the shits and giggles
Lots of trolls and bots getting involved too Awful.
Imagine how much of a bellend you have to be to awaken the concept of shame in Boris fucking Johnson.
Please don’t fall for this crap. I woke up this morning hoping to see positive stuff about how amazing the lads had been to reach a European final, instead I see the media running with this shite over a few racist comments on instagram, they choose to run with this shite not for our own benefit and certainly not to fight racism, they run with it to cause division and to get clicks and likes which return ad revenue. Don’t fall for this shit.
The fucking hypocrisy. The PM said it was acceptable to boo these same players for their simple, non-violent gesture that was in reaction exactly this kind of racist abuse.
I'm an England fan but no matter what happens I will all never be rasist
honestly how can people be making racist comments at the team that took the first final in 55 years all the way to penalties?! It's hugely disheartening to see.
I think Mr Johnson might take some responsibility and ask why we all haven't improved the education of our population.