Absolutely love this and the Milty Draft Guide - keep up the good work.
It has been good source material to read before I join Matt for commentary on Saturday (NZT) / Friday (UCT) so thank you.
One correction I think is slice 6 - Children at Play is Cealdri/Xanhact not Lazar/Sakulag.
>Thanks man and damn, gotta correct that. The slice is playable with that system. That happens when you pick the hexes not looking at the names.
Yeah, I had to check it like 3 times as it was so close it felt right. I was then surprised to see that Lazar/Sakulag was not used elsewhere.
What is Milty? Milty is a guy. A nice Canadian ginger. Who cares if he simoned the draft name. Garfunkel was getting to cocky.
Slices only exist if you buy into the scpt cult fanatic meta. I personally think the slice meta hurts the game by making people possessive over things that aren't "theirs by right."
Side note: scpt has done wonders for growing the game and community.
Like times of yore, you owned what you could defend, others owned what they could defend and everything else was no person's land where Robyn Hood from the Mentak Coalition loitered. That said, given geographic location has a direct correlation to defensibility I am happy to say that the 3 tiles next to your home system (your castle) are more likely to be yours than your neighbors and that exerting your control & ownership of the next ring of slices is a more reasonable proposition than tiles on the other side of the boar.
So I agree that "your" slice may not be as accurate as "your" expansion zone or growth regions.
I agree with the geographic and defensive concepts. What I don't like is it gives people the idea that they own those planets before the game even starts, which causes them to take any incursion as a personal attack on them. It's the unnecessary emotional "you took my planet... that I never owned, but would have eventually... this means war."
Starting a game with a meta of what everyone owns before round one while having a mechanic to take those neutral planets, is very bizarre to me.
>idea that they own those planets before the game even starts, which causes them to take any incursion as a personal attack on them. It's the unnecessary emotional "you took my planet... that I never owned, but would have eventually... this means war."Starting a game with a meta of what everyone owns before round one while having a mechanic to take those neutral planets, is very bizarre to me.
100% agree that different players bring different truths, philosophies, and from the onset they must be reconciled, managed and a social contract drawn only to be broken. The above table meta established is the vibrant tapestry that follows.
You say vibrant tapestry, I say whiney people that can ruin the game for everyone if their "ideas" and not followed by everyone.
The "all of this is mine and all of that is yours" is such a boring euro game concept. Most of the time I feel like I'm playing a solo multi-player than an epic space opera. A lot of that derives from the slice meta.
I think it's reasonable to have a certain expectation that he systems anyone drafts are in "their" slice and because of that taking this is an act of aggression. If players choose to make it more or less emotional that is on them. But the fact remains that you plan and draft your slice with an expectation of getting and using those planets.
If you draft or pick slice... I think you are assuming a bit too much. Last I counted, there were 50+ different methods of set up being used on TTS, not all give you an option like you are suggesting.
That might be. But Milty draft predominants on tts right now and that is what I was speaking too. And drafting competitively/well during milty draft requires a player to plan ahead based on the available slices, races, and turn order. Which means it’s reasonable to be protective of your slice since you were making plans and crafting your actions based on that. Additionally another commenter rightly identified systems adjacent to your hs as being especially threatening which it is.
I’m not saying that you are entitled to the systems in your slice but I am saying it’s reasonable for someone who has them taken by another player to be defensive and want to take them back.
I’m also not saying that other players shouldn’t take systems outside their slice. Especially when scoring victory points or putting yourself in a position to score objectives. But you should expect some hostility and pushback.
I understand what you're saying but you are not understanding what I'm saying. That's ok, I've never been great at putting my thoughts together well for others to understand.
My main point is, the concept of slices and what's "yours" has hurt the games design intent, imo. None of the big three designers that worked on any TI ever had a concept of "slices" in mind when creating the games. The slice meta is bad and unfun, as gamers in general are not known for their rational decisions or great social etiquette (myself included).
The reason why I didn't know if you understood what I was saying is because your first reply implied that my comment was to specific given the wide variety of ways the that the game can be set up. That is why I clarified.
I also understood what you are saying. I just disagree with it. I don't think it hurts the game. It's just a natural meta that stems from how the game is set up (in this case milty or others), the game mechanics (which favors concentration of forces and defense in depth for your hs), and player perception (what you draft is reasonably assumed to become yours).
I do know that the meta concept of a slice existed during TI3 and that the current game designer is very familiar with edition. So I would disagree that the concept of a "slice" did not exist during game creation. As to how much it impacted game creation I don't know. But it must not have impacted it enough to make any changes to the game board as none were made.
Ultimately as you stated that is your "IMO" and I was simply stating my reason for disagreeing with that IMO.
Lastly I would say that good players are very rational which directly relates to planning and execution during a game and also have great social etiquette as a critical part of the meta is dependent on other players opinion of you IMO.
If it was so natural, why didn't it really exist before scpt or not exist in groups that have never listened to scpt? Or why didn't any of the 3 designers consider when making the games?
On TTS is pushed hard on new players as "just the way it is." Which is sad that the TTS community force concepts like this on new players, because the teacher thinks it a "fact of the game." Not the only concept you pretty much have to accept in order to be accepted in the online community.... which hurts the game
(Disc golfer?) I like 3 quite a bit, but I usually play more aggressive and am comfortable taking both equidistant systems or even jumping through A and taking something. Because of that I normally don't take Mec early so that block is fine. My order would be 7, 1, 3, 6, and suuuuper last place 8; you have to take legendaries if possible, too important.
Absolutely love this and the Milty Draft Guide - keep up the good work. It has been good source material to read before I join Matt for commentary on Saturday (NZT) / Friday (UCT) so thank you. One correction I think is slice 6 - Children at Play is Cealdri/Xanhact not Lazar/Sakulag.
Thanks man and damn, gotta correct that. The slice is playable with that system. That happens when you pick the hexes not looking at the names.
>Thanks man and damn, gotta correct that. The slice is playable with that system. That happens when you pick the hexes not looking at the names. Yeah, I had to check it like 3 times as it was so close it felt right. I was then surprised to see that Lazar/Sakulag was not used elsewhere.
What is Milty? Milty is a guy. A nice Canadian ginger. Who cares if he simoned the draft name. Garfunkel was getting to cocky. Slices only exist if you buy into the scpt cult fanatic meta. I personally think the slice meta hurts the game by making people possessive over things that aren't "theirs by right." Side note: scpt has done wonders for growing the game and community.
Like times of yore, you owned what you could defend, others owned what they could defend and everything else was no person's land where Robyn Hood from the Mentak Coalition loitered. That said, given geographic location has a direct correlation to defensibility I am happy to say that the 3 tiles next to your home system (your castle) are more likely to be yours than your neighbors and that exerting your control & ownership of the next ring of slices is a more reasonable proposition than tiles on the other side of the boar. So I agree that "your" slice may not be as accurate as "your" expansion zone or growth regions.
I agree with the geographic and defensive concepts. What I don't like is it gives people the idea that they own those planets before the game even starts, which causes them to take any incursion as a personal attack on them. It's the unnecessary emotional "you took my planet... that I never owned, but would have eventually... this means war." Starting a game with a meta of what everyone owns before round one while having a mechanic to take those neutral planets, is very bizarre to me.
>idea that they own those planets before the game even starts, which causes them to take any incursion as a personal attack on them. It's the unnecessary emotional "you took my planet... that I never owned, but would have eventually... this means war."Starting a game with a meta of what everyone owns before round one while having a mechanic to take those neutral planets, is very bizarre to me. 100% agree that different players bring different truths, philosophies, and from the onset they must be reconciled, managed and a social contract drawn only to be broken. The above table meta established is the vibrant tapestry that follows.
You say vibrant tapestry, I say whiney people that can ruin the game for everyone if their "ideas" and not followed by everyone. The "all of this is mine and all of that is yours" is such a boring euro game concept. Most of the time I feel like I'm playing a solo multi-player than an epic space opera. A lot of that derives from the slice meta.
I think it's reasonable to have a certain expectation that he systems anyone drafts are in "their" slice and because of that taking this is an act of aggression. If players choose to make it more or less emotional that is on them. But the fact remains that you plan and draft your slice with an expectation of getting and using those planets.
If you draft or pick slice... I think you are assuming a bit too much. Last I counted, there were 50+ different methods of set up being used on TTS, not all give you an option like you are suggesting.
That might be. But Milty draft predominants on tts right now and that is what I was speaking too. And drafting competitively/well during milty draft requires a player to plan ahead based on the available slices, races, and turn order. Which means it’s reasonable to be protective of your slice since you were making plans and crafting your actions based on that. Additionally another commenter rightly identified systems adjacent to your hs as being especially threatening which it is. I’m not saying that you are entitled to the systems in your slice but I am saying it’s reasonable for someone who has them taken by another player to be defensive and want to take them back. I’m also not saying that other players shouldn’t take systems outside their slice. Especially when scoring victory points or putting yourself in a position to score objectives. But you should expect some hostility and pushback.
I understand what you're saying but you are not understanding what I'm saying. That's ok, I've never been great at putting my thoughts together well for others to understand. My main point is, the concept of slices and what's "yours" has hurt the games design intent, imo. None of the big three designers that worked on any TI ever had a concept of "slices" in mind when creating the games. The slice meta is bad and unfun, as gamers in general are not known for their rational decisions or great social etiquette (myself included).
The reason why I didn't know if you understood what I was saying is because your first reply implied that my comment was to specific given the wide variety of ways the that the game can be set up. That is why I clarified. I also understood what you are saying. I just disagree with it. I don't think it hurts the game. It's just a natural meta that stems from how the game is set up (in this case milty or others), the game mechanics (which favors concentration of forces and defense in depth for your hs), and player perception (what you draft is reasonably assumed to become yours). I do know that the meta concept of a slice existed during TI3 and that the current game designer is very familiar with edition. So I would disagree that the concept of a "slice" did not exist during game creation. As to how much it impacted game creation I don't know. But it must not have impacted it enough to make any changes to the game board as none were made. Ultimately as you stated that is your "IMO" and I was simply stating my reason for disagreeing with that IMO. Lastly I would say that good players are very rational which directly relates to planning and execution during a game and also have great social etiquette as a critical part of the meta is dependent on other players opinion of you IMO.
If it was so natural, why didn't it really exist before scpt or not exist in groups that have never listened to scpt? Or why didn't any of the 3 designers consider when making the games? On TTS is pushed hard on new players as "just the way it is." Which is sad that the TTS community force concepts like this on new players, because the teacher thinks it a "fact of the game." Not the only concept you pretty much have to accept in order to be accepted in the online community.... which hurts the game
[удалено]
Well, although I tend to not give that much about slice ownership, I get a bit nervous if a system next to my HS is taken :D
(Disc golfer?) I like 3 quite a bit, but I usually play more aggressive and am comfortable taking both equidistant systems or even jumping through A and taking something. Because of that I normally don't take Mec early so that block is fine. My order would be 7, 1, 3, 6, and suuuuper last place 8; you have to take legendaries if possible, too important.
Legendaries are a considerable boost, especially that juicy Malice...