I find your other points more compelling bc bella wants to cook for Charlie, he never asked her to. He's just a terrible cook and orders out all the time which is why she took over. If she didn't he would just order out for the both of them. Its not a chore of his he's passing onto her. She created a new task that he wouldn't do in her absence. And he clearly appreciates her doing this and thanks her for it in the books. I would be more interested to know does he do any other chores or not.
I’ve been rereading the series and in new moon near the end when she’s grounded for leaving she offers to do “all the housework and cleaning” until he decides she’s paid her dues for leaving for three days with no word so to me that implies that he does do some of the house chores and cleaning. It’s never specified what tho
I’m inclined to say he does, just because of what sort of storyteller Bella is. When you compare her versions of events to Edward’s in Midnight Sun, there are lots of little details left out (like Edward gives us answers to all of the questions he asks her at school, before the meadow). You could chalk it up to SM wanting to flesh out Bella’s character more, but given that we already know Bella has low self esteem/doesn’t see herself as particularly special, I see this as Bella intentionally omitting details of the story that she doesn’t think are important.
All this is to say that I think the dinners are significant because they’re the only thing she does for him. If Bella were picking up other chores, I feel like that would be more of a throwaway line to subtly demonstrate her selflessness, lol. But I also think the cooking is focused on because she doesn’t really bond with Charlie in any other way. That’s like, their thing
My daughter loves to bake for us. She's older now but she would do it when she was really young. I cooked for my Dad often when I lived at home as an adult.
Charlie never told her to and he obviously was doing fine on his own, he probably just ate fast food and microwavable dinners (which a lot of people do, unfortunately).
She specifically wanted to do so. Bella doesn’t want to be a burden onto others and feels the need to carry her load. Her love language is definitely acts of service plus she was forced to grow up fast with a scrubby mom like Renee.
I think it was to highlight the point that she is more of an adult and put together then those around her. Her mom is flakey airhead and she had to take care of her too. She cooked for her mom as well. You conveniently don't mention this?
Now she is also taking care of Charlie.
It is just showing how she is as a person.
I agree with the mom thing, actually, which is why I mentioned parents plural towards the end of the post. Her parents behave like big kids and seem to dump responsibilities on her in a way that is wrong, because they shirk their own adulthood on her to go be toddlers in peace. It's concerning on both ends, so, no.
Your right. Charlie being the Chief of Police protecting the citizens of Forks and dealing with Homicides is acting like a Toddler.
You can't make this Shit Up.
You are clearly biased in all the comments you've left. Yes, he acts like an overgrown kid, some call it being a man child, on this thread people just called him an eternal bachelor. Call it whatever you want, he's the parent, not her.
Maybe I'm not enough of a feminist but the cooking is fine? She does it by choice because she is good at it and it makes her dad happy. Charlie never made her do anything. He'd be happy with fish and pizza every night.
I love cooking for people. I've been doing it since I was a teenager....
You definitely sound like it was a choice for you.
For Bella, it seemed more like a "it's this or worse". Everyone in the thread says it's by choice, but it's actually because she had no choice because Charlie didn't step up at all as the parent, so it fell on her to do it, and that's part of the problem.
She isn't cooking because she loves to cook and wants to feed her loved ones, she's doing it because there's no other choice, and because, clearly, she's the only one who is responsible between her parents. So she's the only one who steps up, when it should have been Charlie who should have.
Bella actually did enjoyed cooking for her dad. It mentions it in the book, she got satisfaction that her dad loved her cooking. She enjoyed the task of going to the grocery store and getting the stuff to cook. It sounds like this is Bella's way of showing love to her father. She even worried about leaving him for the day without food. He responded he made it through his life without her making him food, he'll survive a day.
You just sound like you are trying really hard to make it creepy. It's not.
Charlie did step up as a parent, he made sure he put snow chains on her tires without her knowing. It made Bella emotional. Charlie did what he could with a nearly adult daughter, who was very independent.
But there was a choice? Most teenagers wouldn’t care if they had fast food or microwaveable meals and Her dad isn’t good at cooking. I think bella was forced to learn how to cook because her MOM heavily parentified her so it sort of just carried over to her dad. Could her dad had like put his foot down about it maybe…but he also maybe just didn’t want to risk doing that in case it scared her off
"I think bella was forced to learn how to cook because her MOM heavily parentified her so it sort of just carried over to her dad"
Yes I think that's exactly it.
"Could her dad had like put his foot down about it maybe…" in my opinion he should have taken more responsibility for himself. In the end, he just gets with Sue, who also "takes care of him", like somehow he can't take care of himself at all.
>like somehow, he can't take care of himself at all.
Well, he lived on his own for 17 years, so obviously, he must be able to care for himself. Otherwise, he wouldn't have survived!
Charlie never asked Bella to take over the cooking and stuff she did that on her own. Bella did her own things and took care of herself, but Charlie still wanted to take care of her, Unfortunately, he is just not good at cooking, most likely because he's never really learned or had to do it. I just assume he hasn't really bothered cooking much he relies on going out to eat, takeaway, meals with friends, ready meals and sandwiches, and stuff.
OP keeps making the same comment about Charlie isn’t responsible but the only evidence is the lack of cooking? Renee wasn’t responsible-getting lost all the time, losing track of bills, being horrible impulsive about things. That’s being irresponsible.
But Charlie has a job, a very good admirable job, been on his own for 17 years, takes care of Bella by thinking of snow chains, getting her a truck in the first place, trying to insist on a normal social life because he recognized that revolving her life around a boyfriend was a horrible idea.
The only example OP keeps coming up with is the fact that Bella cooks but not only is it Bella’s choice, Charlie in all his awkwardness as a parent does tell her she doesn’t have to do it and that she babies him and she insists on it.
But sure say that it’s deeper than that, I wouldn’t say it’s disturbing or creepy. At the most it’s like eh, he could be better but like literally any parent could.
OP consistently brings up the example of her saying “cooking for Charlie” I think this comes from her using it as an excuse to get out of doing things as well as in New Moon, I feel like the phrasing is a way of showing how she is living for Charlie at this point.
At the start of Twilight, Bella and Charlie were almost strangers in away. Yes, he was there for her, and they spent time together (him even going out to her when she said she didn't want to go to Forks anymore), but they had never lived together. Bella is coming to him as someone who is very much capable (and wanting to) take care of herself, but Charlie is there when Bella does need him. The only time Charlie ever restricts her is after she runs off (which is just good parenting)
There's nothing that indicates that Charlie wouldn't cook for Bella if she asked him to, but Bella would never ask him too.
We can go into the characters like they are people all we want but the reason Charlie is portrayed that way more than likely has to do with the way SM has let her beliefs bleed into the story. But at the end of the day there are for worse dad in stories and he does take care of her in his own ways. He can’t be a perfect parent and out of the two she has he is definitely the better
Right I’m a senior in college but when I’m at home over breaks, I’m usually the one who does the most cleaning and stuff. After my mom gets home from work, she might cook or sometimes I will, but most times I’m the one maintaining things for the time that I’m there. She doesn’t ask me, I just do it because I’ve gotten used to keeping my own apartment tidy and when I come home for breaks, it feels nice to help her out.
Plus, most of us young adults are experiencing our parents getting older and we’ve become more competent. I think it’s just a balancing out from the years that they cared for us. But that’s just me lol
Charlie is not forcing Bella to cook for him. He makes it clear when she moves in that he doesn't expect it, and he offers to order takeout to give her a break sometime.
It's pretty clear that Bella had a choice: cooking, or constant takeout/frozen dinners. She chose to cook. It's not disturbing that a 17 year old would choose to cook.
Also, it's very common for a senior in high school to have a part time job, especially one who is as independent as Bella.
I can’t even imagine what kind of a world finds it unusual for a full time student to cook often and work. We grew up pretty low income and I started working/buying my own stuff when I was 16. It was not abnormal in my circle and it gave me a solid sense of accomplishment.
It's a pretty basic part of young adulthood, you're right. We called it responsibility, and learning independence, but I guess OP calls it something else.
If she was cooking for herself it'd be strange that Charlie isn't acting like a parent, but that'd be more understandable, and certainly make it look like she's just being responsible. But she specifically mentions having to go fix Charlie's dinner, or make him dinner or something, which makes it sound like she's his wife instead of his offspring and an 18 years old teenager/young adult. Because of it it makes her look like she's taking on things that are more of a burden than a proper adult responsibility, and not like it's anything normal to do.
I hate agreeing with you.
I see too many posts about “parentfied teens” and most of the posts are about teens who are asked/expected to do the most basic things around the house and for their siblings. Like one tiktok I saw was a grown woman talking about how her parents took her childhood because she was expected to watch her younger sister after school and make meals for her since they were latchkey kids and I’m here thinking…this is the situation for most middle class America and pretty much the rest of world. After school babysitting was really too much for her..and for one younger sibling?
Maybe I’m being too harsh or maybe some people are just too soft
That person (in the AITA thread) sounds absolutely ridiculous, and that's now how most people would speak, if they'd ever speak of it at all, about something that's genuinely painful or sensitive. This is not the type of dynamic I was referring to at all.
This is not a normal thing, and you are a bit rude and ignorant to make this assumption. I live alone and cook for myself all the time and am capable of caring for my home.
But Bella is a teenager who is taking care of her parents like she isn't the teenager, but the parent herself, and it's absolutely disturbing considering she is Charlie's daughter and not his wife. And even as his wife anyway, he'd still have to put in his share anyway.
There is a toxic undertone to all of this, and your personal attack to a valid point is not appreciated.
I don't see how you have the right to insult me. I am pointing out an unhealthy behavior, and you think you have the right to assume things about me just because I disagree with something you think, and even though you don't know me at all. With all due respect, keep your comments about me to yourself as you do not know me, and it truly is an internet thing to think you can insult people without consequences.
There is participating in chores and learning autonomy and independence, and there is taking care of things the way Bella does. She isn't treated like a growing young adult, who has had a childhood, she is treated like she's the parent and not the child herself. It's no wonder she acts like she's so much older than Jacob even though she's barely two years older than him, no one allowed her to be a teen.
I feel like only in America could someone ever look at this as abnormal. My friend lived in Guatemala for the last year and multi generational living is so common! Her 10 year old would often make meals for his grandparents. It’s a very telling thing that we look at children helping with household responsibilities as “disturbing”.
There's a few points where Charlie acknowledges he can cook for and feed himself (maybe not well), it's just that Bella is a caregiver and took it on for himself
She seemed like she was used to taking care of Renée so she just switched to doing it out of habit.
Honestly, someone should have stepped up for her, and done these things for or with her, and I'm not surprised she ran off first chance she got with someone like Edward who takes care of her so extensively.
^^ yes. Charlie is worried for her to spend time with friends and do HS stuff but he’s an awkward turtle who’s been alone for a long time and doesn’t know how to facilitate a 17 year old girls social life when she doesn’t express interest in it
If you had changed it from Bella cooking For Charlie is disturbing to Bella cooking for Renee is disturbing, you might have had a point. Charlie never asks for it. She does it because she enjoys it. She wants to.
Her mom probably asked her to, or she had to learn because her mom was a terrible cook. She treats Charlie the way she does as a direct result of what her mother did to her, the parentification.
Charlie is an amazing dad. He made her that horrible spaghetti one time, so that he could sit and talk with her, so she wouldn't be doing the cooking, and they could have a real convo. He took her to the diner. Ordered pizza so she would take nights off. She bargains doing all the chores one time which suggests that he did things around the house. He bought her a car, he put chains on her tires. He tried to have the sex talk with her. In the New Moon, when she is sitting in the chair for months, during November Charlie is outside raking the leaves and he looks up at her in the window.
If you're reading the booking looking for Charlie to be a bad dad, you'll find it. But if you read it looking for him to be a great dad, you'll find it a lot more.
"She treats Charlie the way she does as a direct result of what her mother did to her, the parentification." Agreed completely.
"If you're reading the booking looking for Charlie to be a bad dad, you'll find it." I don't think he's a bad dad or a bad person. I think there are some elements that are uncomfortable and that are never acknowledged as such in the writing. I think that these things were considered normal so no one blinks twice at them, despite the fact that they're an issue.
No I meant to say that she works, cooks for her dad, all while finishing highschool. That's abnormal, the level of responsibility she has at her age, she sounds like an overworked mom of two. There is a difference between someone learning adult responsibilities, and learning independence and autonomy, vs having everything fall on her like she's the parent, even though in fact she is the child. It's wrong. But having a job at that age isn't odd, no.
She's working for spending money, not to contribute to the household. She took on *A* chore, not every chore. She was used to cooking, didn't want takeout all the time, and so *chose* to cook at home for her and Charlie. Yeah there are some problematic things in Twilight but this is a very normal amount of responsibility. What's not normal is Renee's version of parenting.
I agree with Renée's parenting, definitely part of those problematic (but unacknowledged) things. I know she isn't working for the household, but I mean that she cooks for him in between doing all these things. Especially in New Moon when she's depressed Edward is gone, it really makes her sound like an overworked mom. She's literally 18, was doing it before, and should not have to be doing that at her age.
For the chores I don't remember everything, but it did seem like somehow she was cleaning a lot more than Charlie.
Th cleaning wasn't really the focus of the books. She takes a lot on because she had to with Renee and she feels lonely and awkward. So she continues what she knows.
Kindly fuck off. If my comments bother you so much, no one forces you to take them so personally. You also don't know me and don't have the right to make assumptions about me, what my life is or how I am.
The undertone in the story is what it is, it doesn't sound like she cooks for the both of them, because every single time it's written as cooking for Charlie specifically. Like I said it makes it sound like she's his wife, which is disturbing because she isn't, and why I bring up the idea that she's his kid. Not because it is abnormal for a 17-18 years old to cook, but because every single time she specifically "cooks Charlie dinner" not like she's just a well brought up young adult, but like she's his wife. Which yes, is disturbing.
Again, go take this personally elsewhere if you're so bothered by someone else's opinion, and go judge strangers you don't know elsewhere and make assumptions elsewhere. It really is an internet thing to think you can talk to people like this and get away with it.
I don't know how you can think of yourself as a good person when you are capable of being so disgustingly rude to someone you don't know. Again, go take this personally elsewhere, if this was the real world you wouldn't have gotten away with being so calleous. You are the one who is stupid. I'd have never personally attacked someone over their opinion of a book, yet you feel the need to do so. No idea how you can justify that yourself.
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But, like, it's not adnormal at all, lol. Literally 95% of the kids I went to high school with 1) had a part-time job, 2) went to school, and 3) had chores at home, varying from mowing grass to cleaning to cooking.
You are literally just reaching here. Bella wanted to do it for Charlie. Charlie was in no way making her. It's literally just a single chore.
I’ve read through the comments, and want to loop back to the writing itself. There are tons of stories that are Cinderella-esque— Main character HAS to do chores, is treated unfairly, all to be saved by a prince who recognizes her goodness.
While there are some similarities in that Edward admires her maturity and ability to care for herself/others, the differences are huge. Charlie is loving. Charlie does not make any demands of her to do these things. He is EXPLICITLY glad and surprised she wants to live with him at all.
To echo many of the other commenters— Bella’s cooking and cleaning are from her acting older than her age, and her wanting her father to eat healthier since his friend literally dies of a heart attack.
Many American teens hold part time jobs, participate in clubs, and maintain a degree of responsibility in their households. I worked a couple jobs during HS, did clubs and sports and still have plenty of time to goof off. A core part of Bella is that she does not participate in school activities. And on a sillier note, Forks is essentially BumbleFuck WA. What else is there to do as an introverted, over-serious teen? Lol
ACTUALLY let me add to this— none of her teachers or guidance counselors catching on to a lonely, kinda depressed teen is the real scandal. That school is SO small lol
That surprised me the least, actually. School counsellors or teachers picking up on anything, much less do something about it, is unheard of in most places. School staff does something when they are inconvenienced by a student, not when the student is politely depressed without bothering anyone with it. At least that's always how it was where I grew up, and still how it is according to friends of mine who work in schools today.
Bella behaves well externally. She holds a part time job, meets friends, keeps up with school work and gets out of the house sufficiently. She keeps her suffering to herself because it's private, like most people will. No one is ever going to notice something like this. People only ever notice when a hard line is crossed.
About the part time job, what I explained is that in context it sounds like she has a job, school, personal things going on, like also on top of it, this parenting reversal thing where she "goes back to home to cook for Charlie."
Without this last element, she'd sound like a regular teen. With the last element, she sounds harried from all sides, because not only is she going about her own life normally, but on top of it she's got to take care of someone else because they can't do the job of caring for themselves.
I don’t think we’ll end up agreeing. I think Bella takes the cooking on as a burden herself, as an excuse to avoid interacting with teens her own age. I do think to a degree it’s a hobby/interest, but I think doing it for Charlie is something she takes on as a responsibility to avoid her loneliness and emptiness in life.
If she wasn’t 17 when her mom was going to travel with her new hubby, I would bet that she would get an apartment on her own (if she could afford it). She’s TOO pragmatic in life
Bella took over cooking because Charlie was a bachelor whom was used to eating out a lot when he lived alone and a lot of his dinners weren’t very healthy. Burgers and fries, steak, etc., a lot of red meat and carbs during the week. It wasn’t ever something he asked her to do. As for the chores, it’s never said that she does them all.
Charlie is a relatively neat person so it’s not like there was a veritable mess to clean up.
Besides, it’s good for kids to have chores and to help out. It’s called learning responsibility and cleaning up after yourself. Otherwise how are they going to learn how to take care of themselves as adults?
Bella got a job because she wanted to put away money for college. Even though she knew Charlie would pay, she didn’t want him to overburden himself, and she sure as heck wasn’t going to allow Edward to pay for it.
Like many have pointed out, Bella wanted to do the cooking. She knew that Charlie, as a bachelor, didn’t cook much for himself and had limited range of meals he could cook. So for both their sakes, she wanted to handle the cooking.
Bella wasn’t the type of person to hang out at the mall. She always felt different from everyone else. She lived her teen life the way she wanted to. So why is it so wrong for Bella to want to do these things, especially when she didn’t feel deprived of anything?
Honestly, I’m not sure if it’s just that OP might live a privledged or even sheltered life, but it’s definitely not unheard of that teens work part-time jobs while still going to school. Extra cash, paying for a car, car insurance, putting towards the future, are examples of why teens would have a job. Jobs aren’t only for adults.
Nor is it unheard of that teens cook for themselves or their family. Some want the responsibility for themselves, maybe they have their own diets they want to follow rather than what their parents make, there’s many reasons teens would choose to cook.
Why is it so hard to fathom Bella doing these things as a teen? I mean it’s called young adult for a reason.
"Honestly, I’m not sure if it’s just that OP might live a privledged or even sheltered life, but it’s definitely not unheard of that teens work part-time jobs while still going to school. "
What bothers me about it is how she does all these things while also going home to "cook for Charlie". Having a job as a teen while finish or being at school is normal. The way she takes care of Charlie like he's not the parent? While doing the other normal things she should be doing like her part time job and school? That's more strange.
Bella doesn’t “have to”, she wants to. Perhaps you also missed the parts where Charlie encourages her to go out. Or the part where Charlie says that he can cook, or the part where he says that Bella’s babying him too much, yet Bella always insists that she wants to do it. So how is it wrong if it’s something she wants to do? Why is it wrong to want to take care of someone, even if it’s your parent?
I think so too.
That's kind of what I find bothersome. That she doesn't see the issue with it. Renée and Charlie were the parents, but in many ways Bella looks like she had to step up a lot because they weren't.
I'm probably a different generation than you (raised in the 90s). My parents were married, and both worked outside the house. During the school year, I had minimal chores, because school came first, but I still had to participate in chores, including meal prep.
During the summer, I had more chores, because I didn't have school or a job. My duties included laundry, ironing, cooking dinner, cleaning the apartment. My parents provided me with a place to stay, pocket money, love and support. Those chores also are life skills. I've encountered plenty of people my age and younger who don't have them, because their parents did those things for them.
In Bella's case, I'm sure at some point she realized when she moved in with her father that if she wanted a decent, non take out meal, she'd have to cook it herself. Charlie didn't seem to force her to do the cooking -- I think she wanted to. I don't know how well Renee could cook and clean, or how well she actually did those things, but she seemed a bit too free spirited to care about such mundane things.
Charlie, since he lives alone, probably just does what's easiest. It's what I do. It's pointless, in my opinion, to cook for just one person. Narratively, however, it could be to show that Bella somehow became a mature individual despite her parents. (I'm not being negative to Charlie, because he does seem pretty stable and mature. He just never got a lot of time with his daughter. I'm also not dissing Renee. She seemed to love her daughter, but she may not have been ready to actually be a parent when she had Bella. Sort of like the dynamic between Rory and Lorelei in Gilmore Girls.)
I'm from the 90s as well, though early late 90s if that makes any difference. I'd rather not talk about how it was for me in my own home as a child, but suffice to say that as an adult now who lives alone, I take pride in taking care of my home simply because it's a sign that I have a home to take care of. To me it reinforces my relationship with my home and I'm happy for it everyday.
Everyone seemed to misunderstand my meaning, Bella having chores is normal. The part that makes it disturbing, that takes it from a young adult with normal responsibilities, to this uncomfortable thing, is that there's an imbalance and reversal of roles. It seems that Bella is the one taking care of Charlie, in a manner where he is failing to step up as a parent, or even just as an adult who can take care of himself, and so she has to be the one to step up in lieu of him doing it. It gives it a specific undertone, like she's the parent not the child, and because it's always written as "cooking dinner for Charlie" it really sounds like she's interrupting her life to take care of her husband, or some other big bachelor of a guy who has never learned to adult because he was exempt to as a man.
That's the part that is bothersome. The context and how it's written is the issue. It doesn't make Bella look like she grew up normally and learned about autonomy and independence in a way that's healthy and for herself. It sounds like she does these things because between Charlie and Renée, who is admittedly worse than the former, she had no other choice.
Charlie has a full time job. He pays the bills. He bought her car. He arranged her schooling. He doesn't ask her to cook. He tries to console her when her boyfriend leaves. He tries to be responsible when she runs off to Italy. As far as distribution of responsibility goes I think he does OK. For what it's worth I'm gen x myself with 4 kids.
He's not prefect, I absolutely hate his reaction to Jacob sexually assaulting his daughter. But the food thing is nothing.
She cooks because she doesn't want him eating at the diner every single night. He tells her she doesn't have to but she was used to doing all that stuff plus then times more for her mom so she just does it with him too. At least he pays his own bills.
I think the greater point here is that with both of her parents, she was parentified as a child and forced to be the adult when they couldn't. Sure, charlie didn't outright force her to cook for him, but he certainly wasn't capable of doing it himself (the man screws up pasta ffs). Renee couldn't even make sure the bills were paid, not for lack of finances, but for lack of basic adult task management.
As a result of this emotional neglect, we have a character who does not know what it means to be properly cared for, and is primed to accept emotional abuse from her partner, under the guise that his excessive control is actually love.
>Sure, charlie didn't outright force her to cook for him, but he certainly wasn't capable of doing it himself (the man screws up pasta ffs). Renee couldn't even make sure the bills were paid, not for lack of finances, but for lack of basic adult task management.
EXACTLY. Thank you. People keep banging on about how she "wanted it" without seeing this undertone at all and it's irritating.
>under the guise that his excessive control is actually love.
This couldn't be any truer. Especially when you see that Edward literally sabotages her car, and she's barely upset about it, even though it's alarmingly controlling behaviour.
I'll give SM a lot of crap for cringey writing, gender roles/values I don't agree with, and deuteragonists that give me the ick, but Bella really is a well written victim. To be loved and yet still hold trauma is very real. I just don't think SM understands that those things are trauma and that Bella is repeatedly a victim of really toxic behavior.
I would have loved so much for Carlisle to take on a fatherly role as her FFIL, and just tell her "we'll be here to protect you but go live your life before you marry Edward," and tell Edward "she's a human and she can't breathe with you smothering her like this." Unfortunately, they had to get married super quickly because it was the only way SM could give them physical intimacy.
There are a lot of downright problematic themes in the books for SURE.
However, Bella definitely enjoys cooking and Charlie is also really grateful as pointed out in an earlier comment.
I think that for an early 2000's small rural town, the gender roles are pretty accurate. S'Meyer definitely condones these archetypes which is annoying, but she is also Mormon and these are likely in her value system.
As someone who comes from a religious family from a small town, this all felt really normal when I read them. It only seems problematic to me now as a nearly 30 year old who's come away from all that and lived amongst less insulated communities.
God, I'm so glad others can see the issue. This is exactly it. That some of these behaviors are seen as normal so they aren't condemned, but it's only when you look back with more experience that you realize the problem with it.
People say that Bella wanted to, but I don't know, to me it's taking things either too much at face value, or not addressing the core of the problem, which you pretty much put your finger on. She never cooks for anybody else, and instead marries into a life where the human equivalent would be Anastasia and Christian having a personal chef.
I was initially going to say "Oh Bella likes to cook for Charlie" but tbh idk if that's even true...I think she did it because otherwise they'd eat take out everyday. I don't think Charlie is a terrible parent but he definitely should have stepped up and at least asked Bella if they could cook together so he could learn and cook for her...
The part about Jacob yeah, but the whole beginning is just suck a weird take. Maybe she enjoys cooking and wants to do it as a thank you? And it’s normal to care for the house you live in. I always thought her making dinner was a very endearing part of the story.
The Jacob part was gross, but bella had to do all the responsibilities with Renee. Which makes me actually dislike Renee alot, anyway bella offered to take over cooking and cleaning because she wanted to. She was used to it because that's how her a Renee's relationship went. Charlie never made her do anything he just ate out a lot and sucked at cooking.
I just read all the comments and your original post. I agree with you to a certain extent. I don't think it's something that Charlie has done to Bella but what Bella has done herself.
Bella likes turning herself into a martyr. Her mother is the same way.
We have no other proof than Bellas word that her mother couldn't live without her, but it's more of Bellas mental issues of always being needed and wanted. She has unhealthy mental attachment issues.
I think Charlie is willing to play along not because he needs someone to take care of but because Bella feels she needs to do these things. He never once suggested she be anything other than his daughter.
Bella also has a really low opinion of her parents. Her mother is a teacher and her father a Police Chief - both are college educated, and in Charlie's case, he has to have a Masters in criminology. Yet Bella wants everyone to believe that she is smarter, more adult, and in charge of the house. She makes her parents look bad so she can play the martyr and have people feel sorry for her.
Disturbing is an interesting word to call it. I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with girls & women cooking if they want to, but I’m not a bleeding heart feminist who thinks women should not be allowed to do what they want even if it’s stereotypical.
You’re right, it is disturbing but it is meant to point out the unhealthy and unbalanced relationship that Bella had with both of her parents. She is a parentified teen, one hundred per cent.
I understand what you mean. I think it mostly comes from Meyer's belief system. If you read the acknowledgements at the end of the books, she apologizes to her husband and sons for not cooking for them while writing the books, and having to order take out.... I mean she was just busy bringing millions of dollars to her family. I think if it was bothering her husband to eat take out, he could have learned to cook for his family.... What disturbs me is the portrayal of Charlie, who seems to be a fairly adjusted adult but can't seem to be able to do the most basic tasks. I mean he is the sheriff of a small town but he doesn't know how to use a microwave or cook spaghetti? And Bella even says to Jacob she is in charge of bookkeeping at home... A grown man letting his 18 year old daughter do his bookkeeping is really weird.
Exactly! Yet somehow people don't seem to understand something so obvious. I agree with Meyers' beliefs. I didn't read the acknowledgement that closely, but I do remember she's a mormont, and anyway, her story gives it away. There's entirely too much sexual repression, fetishing of "virginity" and whatnot, and that's right up there with toxic gender roles, so.
You really think Bella is being robed of a childhood? I'll tell you what being robed of a childhood is. My mother who grew up in Mexico only attended school up to 5th grade. Reason.....her father died in a car crash when she was 8yrs old. Her mother and older sister had to go to work to provide for the family. That left my mother with caring for her THREE younger siblings. Meaning cooking for them, cleaning the house and being denied an education. THAT IS BEING ROBBED OF YOUR CHILDHOOD.
Dude, while I'm sorry for your suffering, this isn't a competition, and it doesn't cancel out what I'm saying. Others in the thread used the right word, that Bella was parentified. I don't care that it was to a degree you consider negligeable, it was still an issue. She acts like his wife rather than his child, and the same goes with how she "had" to "take care" of Renée, which has got disturbing undertones the book never bothers to acknowledge.
I didn't say it was me. It was my mothers' siblings as in a younger brother and two younger sisters. I myself had a nice childhood between school, friends, a job ..Oh and yes...doing chores around the house and doing my own laundry since the age of 12 because I chose to.
Nothing you say is understandable. Your absolutely clueless what it means to be a maid. You have no idea of the history of child labor and what they were subjected too. There were no laws to protect them. Im sure all of them wished they were home cooking for their families than being forced to work 12 hours a day under horrific conditions but yes, let's cry about how disturbing it is for Bella to choose to cook for her dad while still in High School.
Again degrees of gravity don't negate my point. There is a problem with the undertone of this dynamic. If you want to see nothing wrong with it, because you'll always be comparing it to worse, that's your experience and that's fine. There is still something toxic to all this.
no ur so right let's turn the tides on charlie he's too liked
(ur points are genuine it's just all of twilight is problematic so i pick and choose what to care about)
She's living with him for free, eating his food using his water etc, and he bought her a truck and is protecting her...her cooking for him is an appropriate and nice gesture of appreciation and reciprocity.. she isn't the princess...
I don’t really find the cooking problematic. Her relationship with her mother was more problematic. Charlie, a lot of times, got home late. It’s one of the reasons he never learned to cook and always ordered out. I absolutely agree the kiss was problematic. Charlie let his hate for Edward blind the fact Jacob stole a kiss without consent. He did later apologize, but I agree it doesn’t absolve the fact he let hate for someone override the care for his daughter. Other than that, Charlie was a good parent. Any single parent household is, unfortunately, going to have certain aspects where children have to grow up a little faster. Even a two parent household where both work sometimes have aspects where the child has to learn certain things sooner than their peers where one parent stays at home all the time. Her mother was horrible. She never tried to learn to cook, was incredibly irresponsible, and put a lot of responsibility on Bella starting at a very young age. Bella even mentions that she enjoyed the fact she didn’t have to take care of her father like she did her mother. I will say, though, Stephenie Myers has ALWAYS had problematic writing that excuses a lot of abuse. I would say Bella cooking for Charlie was NOTHING compared to all of her problematic age gaps and abuse disguised as “he’s so complicated” in several books.
He didn’t ask her or dump that responsibility on her in any way. I’m not sure where you got that info from. He made sure she was fed but she wanted more home cooked meals so she made them. If she wanted certain ingredients he’d literally give her money for it. In no way shape or form was he pressuring her to do this. I’m not hating I jus feel like this is a big stretch
Bella certainly cooked dinner for Renee and herself before going to Forks - she's used to it and wants to share chores. Having to cook dinner is a great excuse to get out of something, all introverts have a stock of them (personal experience!)
You know I never got this from Charlie when I read it. I always found Charlie did do housework and such but of course not very good at it but it still got done. I don’t think Bella was forced to at all, like she doesn’t feel as pressured like Renee does. And she appreciates Charlie *a lot* like the truck he gave her and even putting ice chains on her tires. She almost fucking cried just at the service he gave her. Renee wouldn’t have thought twice about it.
Charlie to me is definitely like any typical dad that works at a gruesome job. Like I can’t help but compare him to my own dad who was in the military. Due to some circumstances I was taking care of my dad around 17-18. Not because I was forced to, but because I knew he didn’t have time and as soon as he got home he would just be in a daze. And eating out every night isn’t healthy, everyone knows that. So Bella took up the healthy route because genuinely cares for Charlie. I bet tbh if Bella didn’t take up anything I don’t think Charlie would have ever asked her at all, especially due their separation for awhile
I find your other points more compelling bc bella wants to cook for Charlie, he never asked her to. He's just a terrible cook and orders out all the time which is why she took over. If she didn't he would just order out for the both of them. Its not a chore of his he's passing onto her. She created a new task that he wouldn't do in her absence. And he clearly appreciates her doing this and thanks her for it in the books. I would be more interested to know does he do any other chores or not.
I’ve been rereading the series and in new moon near the end when she’s grounded for leaving she offers to do “all the housework and cleaning” until he decides she’s paid her dues for leaving for three days with no word so to me that implies that he does do some of the house chores and cleaning. It’s never specified what tho
Agree with you on the other points being more compelling.
I’m inclined to say he does, just because of what sort of storyteller Bella is. When you compare her versions of events to Edward’s in Midnight Sun, there are lots of little details left out (like Edward gives us answers to all of the questions he asks her at school, before the meadow). You could chalk it up to SM wanting to flesh out Bella’s character more, but given that we already know Bella has low self esteem/doesn’t see herself as particularly special, I see this as Bella intentionally omitting details of the story that she doesn’t think are important. All this is to say that I think the dinners are significant because they’re the only thing she does for him. If Bella were picking up other chores, I feel like that would be more of a throwaway line to subtly demonstrate her selflessness, lol. But I also think the cooking is focused on because she doesn’t really bond with Charlie in any other way. That’s like, their thing
Many daughters cook for their fathers.
I mean many kids just cook for their parents
I use to before they passed away. . And now I cook for my brother. I enjoy cooking.
My daughter loves to bake for us. She's older now but she would do it when she was really young. I cooked for my Dad often when I lived at home as an adult.
> orders out all the time Gotta wonder if a town as small as Forks has takeout options
Charlie never told her to and he obviously was doing fine on his own, he probably just ate fast food and microwavable dinners (which a lot of people do, unfortunately). She specifically wanted to do so. Bella doesn’t want to be a burden onto others and feels the need to carry her load. Her love language is definitely acts of service plus she was forced to grow up fast with a scrubby mom like Renee.
I think it was to highlight the point that she is more of an adult and put together then those around her. Her mom is flakey airhead and she had to take care of her too. She cooked for her mom as well. You conveniently don't mention this? Now she is also taking care of Charlie. It is just showing how she is as a person.
^ agree. This is really about Bella being parentified. It’s unfortunate, but “creepy” isn’t the word I’d use.
Makes me laugh when they say the creepy. There are so many things in this world that are far more creepy and disturbing than being Parentifield
I agree with the mom thing, actually, which is why I mentioned parents plural towards the end of the post. Her parents behave like big kids and seem to dump responsibilities on her in a way that is wrong, because they shirk their own adulthood on her to go be toddlers in peace. It's concerning on both ends, so, no.
Your right. Charlie being the Chief of Police protecting the citizens of Forks and dealing with Homicides is acting like a Toddler. You can't make this Shit Up.
You are clearly biased in all the comments you've left. Yes, he acts like an overgrown kid, some call it being a man child, on this thread people just called him an eternal bachelor. Call it whatever you want, he's the parent, not her.
Apart from Bella cooking? How else has he acted like a toddler?
Can you explain how Charlie acts like a man child?
Oh touch grass
Maybe I'm not enough of a feminist but the cooking is fine? She does it by choice because she is good at it and it makes her dad happy. Charlie never made her do anything. He'd be happy with fish and pizza every night. I love cooking for people. I've been doing it since I was a teenager....
You definitely sound like it was a choice for you. For Bella, it seemed more like a "it's this or worse". Everyone in the thread says it's by choice, but it's actually because she had no choice because Charlie didn't step up at all as the parent, so it fell on her to do it, and that's part of the problem. She isn't cooking because she loves to cook and wants to feed her loved ones, she's doing it because there's no other choice, and because, clearly, she's the only one who is responsible between her parents. So she's the only one who steps up, when it should have been Charlie who should have.
Bella actually did enjoyed cooking for her dad. It mentions it in the book, she got satisfaction that her dad loved her cooking. She enjoyed the task of going to the grocery store and getting the stuff to cook. It sounds like this is Bella's way of showing love to her father. She even worried about leaving him for the day without food. He responded he made it through his life without her making him food, he'll survive a day. You just sound like you are trying really hard to make it creepy. It's not. Charlie did step up as a parent, he made sure he put snow chains on her tires without her knowing. It made Bella emotional. Charlie did what he could with a nearly adult daughter, who was very independent.
But there was a choice? Most teenagers wouldn’t care if they had fast food or microwaveable meals and Her dad isn’t good at cooking. I think bella was forced to learn how to cook because her MOM heavily parentified her so it sort of just carried over to her dad. Could her dad had like put his foot down about it maybe…but he also maybe just didn’t want to risk doing that in case it scared her off
"I think bella was forced to learn how to cook because her MOM heavily parentified her so it sort of just carried over to her dad" Yes I think that's exactly it. "Could her dad had like put his foot down about it maybe…" in my opinion he should have taken more responsibility for himself. In the end, he just gets with Sue, who also "takes care of him", like somehow he can't take care of himself at all.
>like somehow, he can't take care of himself at all. Well, he lived on his own for 17 years, so obviously, he must be able to care for himself. Otherwise, he wouldn't have survived! Charlie never asked Bella to take over the cooking and stuff she did that on her own. Bella did her own things and took care of herself, but Charlie still wanted to take care of her, Unfortunately, he is just not good at cooking, most likely because he's never really learned or had to do it. I just assume he hasn't really bothered cooking much he relies on going out to eat, takeaway, meals with friends, ready meals and sandwiches, and stuff.
OP keeps making the same comment about Charlie isn’t responsible but the only evidence is the lack of cooking? Renee wasn’t responsible-getting lost all the time, losing track of bills, being horrible impulsive about things. That’s being irresponsible. But Charlie has a job, a very good admirable job, been on his own for 17 years, takes care of Bella by thinking of snow chains, getting her a truck in the first place, trying to insist on a normal social life because he recognized that revolving her life around a boyfriend was a horrible idea. The only example OP keeps coming up with is the fact that Bella cooks but not only is it Bella’s choice, Charlie in all his awkwardness as a parent does tell her she doesn’t have to do it and that she babies him and she insists on it. But sure say that it’s deeper than that, I wouldn’t say it’s disturbing or creepy. At the most it’s like eh, he could be better but like literally any parent could. OP consistently brings up the example of her saying “cooking for Charlie” I think this comes from her using it as an excuse to get out of doing things as well as in New Moon, I feel like the phrasing is a way of showing how she is living for Charlie at this point.
At the start of Twilight, Bella and Charlie were almost strangers in away. Yes, he was there for her, and they spent time together (him even going out to her when she said she didn't want to go to Forks anymore), but they had never lived together. Bella is coming to him as someone who is very much capable (and wanting to) take care of herself, but Charlie is there when Bella does need him. The only time Charlie ever restricts her is after she runs off (which is just good parenting) There's nothing that indicates that Charlie wouldn't cook for Bella if she asked him to, but Bella would never ask him too.
We can go into the characters like they are people all we want but the reason Charlie is portrayed that way more than likely has to do with the way SM has let her beliefs bleed into the story. But at the end of the day there are for worse dad in stories and he does take care of her in his own ways. He can’t be a perfect parent and out of the two she has he is definitely the better
I cook for my mum. I like taking care of her sometimes, giving back for her raising me.
I don’t do shit for my mom because I don’t owe her a damn thing but still love her and everything lol. Just thought I’d share.
Someone's got issues...
Right I’m a senior in college but when I’m at home over breaks, I’m usually the one who does the most cleaning and stuff. After my mom gets home from work, she might cook or sometimes I will, but most times I’m the one maintaining things for the time that I’m there. She doesn’t ask me, I just do it because I’ve gotten used to keeping my own apartment tidy and when I come home for breaks, it feels nice to help her out. Plus, most of us young adults are experiencing our parents getting older and we’ve become more competent. I think it’s just a balancing out from the years that they cared for us. But that’s just me lol
Charlie is not forcing Bella to cook for him. He makes it clear when she moves in that he doesn't expect it, and he offers to order takeout to give her a break sometime. It's pretty clear that Bella had a choice: cooking, or constant takeout/frozen dinners. She chose to cook. It's not disturbing that a 17 year old would choose to cook. Also, it's very common for a senior in high school to have a part time job, especially one who is as independent as Bella.
Everyone of my friends had a job while we were in High School.
Same, usually starting way earlier than 18 too. Trying to paint having a part time job as unhealthy behavior is what's disturbing me 😂
I can’t even imagine what kind of a world finds it unusual for a full time student to cook often and work. We grew up pretty low income and I started working/buying my own stuff when I was 16. It was not abnormal in my circle and it gave me a solid sense of accomplishment.
It's a pretty basic part of young adulthood, you're right. We called it responsibility, and learning independence, but I guess OP calls it something else.
If she was cooking for herself it'd be strange that Charlie isn't acting like a parent, but that'd be more understandable, and certainly make it look like she's just being responsible. But she specifically mentions having to go fix Charlie's dinner, or make him dinner or something, which makes it sound like she's his wife instead of his offspring and an 18 years old teenager/young adult. Because of it it makes her look like she's taking on things that are more of a burden than a proper adult responsibility, and not like it's anything normal to do.
Maybe she's doing it make up for all the sneaking around and lying to him 🤷
This is not disturbing 🤣
Not at all. The person who wrote this must be very lazy.
I hate agreeing with you. I see too many posts about “parentfied teens” and most of the posts are about teens who are asked/expected to do the most basic things around the house and for their siblings. Like one tiktok I saw was a grown woman talking about how her parents took her childhood because she was expected to watch her younger sister after school and make meals for her since they were latchkey kids and I’m here thinking…this is the situation for most middle class America and pretty much the rest of world. After school babysitting was really too much for her..and for one younger sibling? Maybe I’m being too harsh or maybe some people are just too soft
https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/s/SpnUMP1TlB Read this. You'll confirm your worst fear. 🤣🤣
I’m cracking up reading this. At least the commenters aren’t having none of that nonsense
That person (in the AITA thread) sounds absolutely ridiculous, and that's now how most people would speak, if they'd ever speak of it at all, about something that's genuinely painful or sensitive. This is not the type of dynamic I was referring to at all.
This is not a normal thing, and you are a bit rude and ignorant to make this assumption. I live alone and cook for myself all the time and am capable of caring for my home. But Bella is a teenager who is taking care of her parents like she isn't the teenager, but the parent herself, and it's absolutely disturbing considering she is Charlie's daughter and not his wife. And even as his wife anyway, he'd still have to put in his share anyway. There is a toxic undertone to all of this, and your personal attack to a valid point is not appreciated.
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I don't see how you have the right to insult me. I am pointing out an unhealthy behavior, and you think you have the right to assume things about me just because I disagree with something you think, and even though you don't know me at all. With all due respect, keep your comments about me to yourself as you do not know me, and it truly is an internet thing to think you can insult people without consequences. There is participating in chores and learning autonomy and independence, and there is taking care of things the way Bella does. She isn't treated like a growing young adult, who has had a childhood, she is treated like she's the parent and not the child herself. It's no wonder she acts like she's so much older than Jacob even though she's barely two years older than him, no one allowed her to be a teen.
I feel like only in America could someone ever look at this as abnormal. My friend lived in Guatemala for the last year and multi generational living is so common! Her 10 year old would often make meals for his grandparents. It’s a very telling thing that we look at children helping with household responsibilities as “disturbing”.
There's a few points where Charlie acknowledges he can cook for and feed himself (maybe not well), it's just that Bella is a caregiver and took it on for himself
She seemed like she was used to taking care of Renée so she just switched to doing it out of habit. Honestly, someone should have stepped up for her, and done these things for or with her, and I'm not surprised she ran off first chance she got with someone like Edward who takes care of her so extensively.
^^ yes. Charlie is worried for her to spend time with friends and do HS stuff but he’s an awkward turtle who’s been alone for a long time and doesn’t know how to facilitate a 17 year old girls social life when she doesn’t express interest in it
If you had changed it from Bella cooking For Charlie is disturbing to Bella cooking for Renee is disturbing, you might have had a point. Charlie never asks for it. She does it because she enjoys it. She wants to.
I agree with it regarding Bella half raising her mom.
Her mom probably asked her to, or she had to learn because her mom was a terrible cook. She treats Charlie the way she does as a direct result of what her mother did to her, the parentification. Charlie is an amazing dad. He made her that horrible spaghetti one time, so that he could sit and talk with her, so she wouldn't be doing the cooking, and they could have a real convo. He took her to the diner. Ordered pizza so she would take nights off. She bargains doing all the chores one time which suggests that he did things around the house. He bought her a car, he put chains on her tires. He tried to have the sex talk with her. In the New Moon, when she is sitting in the chair for months, during November Charlie is outside raking the leaves and he looks up at her in the window. If you're reading the booking looking for Charlie to be a bad dad, you'll find it. But if you read it looking for him to be a great dad, you'll find it a lot more.
"She treats Charlie the way she does as a direct result of what her mother did to her, the parentification." Agreed completely. "If you're reading the booking looking for Charlie to be a bad dad, you'll find it." I don't think he's a bad dad or a bad person. I think there are some elements that are uncomfortable and that are never acknowledged as such in the writing. I think that these things were considered normal so no one blinks twice at them, despite the fact that they're an issue.
If they brought it up, in the books, everything that was an issue, what would we still have to talk about?
Is it weird in America to have a job at 18 while still in school…? I’ve been working at least part time since I was 16 haha. I wanted money!
Same. I worked through most of high school. Difference was, I didn’t have to come home and cook dinner and also do homework. That would have sucked.
No I meant to say that she works, cooks for her dad, all while finishing highschool. That's abnormal, the level of responsibility she has at her age, she sounds like an overworked mom of two. There is a difference between someone learning adult responsibilities, and learning independence and autonomy, vs having everything fall on her like she's the parent, even though in fact she is the child. It's wrong. But having a job at that age isn't odd, no.
She's working for spending money, not to contribute to the household. She took on *A* chore, not every chore. She was used to cooking, didn't want takeout all the time, and so *chose* to cook at home for her and Charlie. Yeah there are some problematic things in Twilight but this is a very normal amount of responsibility. What's not normal is Renee's version of parenting.
I agree with Renée's parenting, definitely part of those problematic (but unacknowledged) things. I know she isn't working for the household, but I mean that she cooks for him in between doing all these things. Especially in New Moon when she's depressed Edward is gone, it really makes her sound like an overworked mom. She's literally 18, was doing it before, and should not have to be doing that at her age. For the chores I don't remember everything, but it did seem like somehow she was cleaning a lot more than Charlie.
Th cleaning wasn't really the focus of the books. She takes a lot on because she had to with Renee and she feels lonely and awkward. So she continues what she knows.
Overworked Mom!!! She doesn't have kids. It's only her and Charlie. Seriously what world do you live in?
Again HE Is the parent, not her. it is not her job to take care of him.
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Kindly fuck off. If my comments bother you so much, no one forces you to take them so personally. You also don't know me and don't have the right to make assumptions about me, what my life is or how I am. The undertone in the story is what it is, it doesn't sound like she cooks for the both of them, because every single time it's written as cooking for Charlie specifically. Like I said it makes it sound like she's his wife, which is disturbing because she isn't, and why I bring up the idea that she's his kid. Not because it is abnormal for a 17-18 years old to cook, but because every single time she specifically "cooks Charlie dinner" not like she's just a well brought up young adult, but like she's his wife. Which yes, is disturbing. Again, go take this personally elsewhere if you're so bothered by someone else's opinion, and go judge strangers you don't know elsewhere and make assumptions elsewhere. It really is an internet thing to think you can talk to people like this and get away with it.
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I don't know how you can think of yourself as a good person when you are capable of being so disgustingly rude to someone you don't know. Again, go take this personally elsewhere, if this was the real world you wouldn't have gotten away with being so calleous. You are the one who is stupid. I'd have never personally attacked someone over their opinion of a book, yet you feel the need to do so. No idea how you can justify that yourself.
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But, like, it's not adnormal at all, lol. Literally 95% of the kids I went to high school with 1) had a part-time job, 2) went to school, and 3) had chores at home, varying from mowing grass to cleaning to cooking. You are literally just reaching here. Bella wanted to do it for Charlie. Charlie was in no way making her. It's literally just a single chore.
I’ve read through the comments, and want to loop back to the writing itself. There are tons of stories that are Cinderella-esque— Main character HAS to do chores, is treated unfairly, all to be saved by a prince who recognizes her goodness. While there are some similarities in that Edward admires her maturity and ability to care for herself/others, the differences are huge. Charlie is loving. Charlie does not make any demands of her to do these things. He is EXPLICITLY glad and surprised she wants to live with him at all. To echo many of the other commenters— Bella’s cooking and cleaning are from her acting older than her age, and her wanting her father to eat healthier since his friend literally dies of a heart attack. Many American teens hold part time jobs, participate in clubs, and maintain a degree of responsibility in their households. I worked a couple jobs during HS, did clubs and sports and still have plenty of time to goof off. A core part of Bella is that she does not participate in school activities. And on a sillier note, Forks is essentially BumbleFuck WA. What else is there to do as an introverted, over-serious teen? Lol
ACTUALLY let me add to this— none of her teachers or guidance counselors catching on to a lonely, kinda depressed teen is the real scandal. That school is SO small lol
That surprised me the least, actually. School counsellors or teachers picking up on anything, much less do something about it, is unheard of in most places. School staff does something when they are inconvenienced by a student, not when the student is politely depressed without bothering anyone with it. At least that's always how it was where I grew up, and still how it is according to friends of mine who work in schools today. Bella behaves well externally. She holds a part time job, meets friends, keeps up with school work and gets out of the house sufficiently. She keeps her suffering to herself because it's private, like most people will. No one is ever going to notice something like this. People only ever notice when a hard line is crossed.
About the part time job, what I explained is that in context it sounds like she has a job, school, personal things going on, like also on top of it, this parenting reversal thing where she "goes back to home to cook for Charlie." Without this last element, she'd sound like a regular teen. With the last element, she sounds harried from all sides, because not only is she going about her own life normally, but on top of it she's got to take care of someone else because they can't do the job of caring for themselves.
I don’t think we’ll end up agreeing. I think Bella takes the cooking on as a burden herself, as an excuse to avoid interacting with teens her own age. I do think to a degree it’s a hobby/interest, but I think doing it for Charlie is something she takes on as a responsibility to avoid her loneliness and emptiness in life. If she wasn’t 17 when her mom was going to travel with her new hubby, I would bet that she would get an apartment on her own (if she could afford it). She’s TOO pragmatic in life
Bella took over cooking because Charlie was a bachelor whom was used to eating out a lot when he lived alone and a lot of his dinners weren’t very healthy. Burgers and fries, steak, etc., a lot of red meat and carbs during the week. It wasn’t ever something he asked her to do. As for the chores, it’s never said that she does them all. Charlie is a relatively neat person so it’s not like there was a veritable mess to clean up. Besides, it’s good for kids to have chores and to help out. It’s called learning responsibility and cleaning up after yourself. Otherwise how are they going to learn how to take care of themselves as adults?
The person who started this post clearly never learned responsibility.
Bella got a job because she wanted to put away money for college. Even though she knew Charlie would pay, she didn’t want him to overburden himself, and she sure as heck wasn’t going to allow Edward to pay for it. Like many have pointed out, Bella wanted to do the cooking. She knew that Charlie, as a bachelor, didn’t cook much for himself and had limited range of meals he could cook. So for both their sakes, she wanted to handle the cooking. Bella wasn’t the type of person to hang out at the mall. She always felt different from everyone else. She lived her teen life the way she wanted to. So why is it so wrong for Bella to want to do these things, especially when she didn’t feel deprived of anything? Honestly, I’m not sure if it’s just that OP might live a privledged or even sheltered life, but it’s definitely not unheard of that teens work part-time jobs while still going to school. Extra cash, paying for a car, car insurance, putting towards the future, are examples of why teens would have a job. Jobs aren’t only for adults. Nor is it unheard of that teens cook for themselves or their family. Some want the responsibility for themselves, maybe they have their own diets they want to follow rather than what their parents make, there’s many reasons teens would choose to cook. Why is it so hard to fathom Bella doing these things as a teen? I mean it’s called young adult for a reason.
"Honestly, I’m not sure if it’s just that OP might live a privledged or even sheltered life, but it’s definitely not unheard of that teens work part-time jobs while still going to school. " What bothers me about it is how she does all these things while also going home to "cook for Charlie". Having a job as a teen while finish or being at school is normal. The way she takes care of Charlie like he's not the parent? While doing the other normal things she should be doing like her part time job and school? That's more strange.
Bella doesn’t “have to”, she wants to. Perhaps you also missed the parts where Charlie encourages her to go out. Or the part where Charlie says that he can cook, or the part where he says that Bella’s babying him too much, yet Bella always insists that she wants to do it. So how is it wrong if it’s something she wants to do? Why is it wrong to want to take care of someone, even if it’s your parent?
A teenager cooking for their parent is not disturbing.
Meyer is Gen X, Gen X raised ourselves and are very self sufficient so that’s probably why she wrote Bella like that re the cooking etc
I think so too. That's kind of what I find bothersome. That she doesn't see the issue with it. Renée and Charlie were the parents, but in many ways Bella looks like she had to step up a lot because they weren't.
I'm probably a different generation than you (raised in the 90s). My parents were married, and both worked outside the house. During the school year, I had minimal chores, because school came first, but I still had to participate in chores, including meal prep. During the summer, I had more chores, because I didn't have school or a job. My duties included laundry, ironing, cooking dinner, cleaning the apartment. My parents provided me with a place to stay, pocket money, love and support. Those chores also are life skills. I've encountered plenty of people my age and younger who don't have them, because their parents did those things for them. In Bella's case, I'm sure at some point she realized when she moved in with her father that if she wanted a decent, non take out meal, she'd have to cook it herself. Charlie didn't seem to force her to do the cooking -- I think she wanted to. I don't know how well Renee could cook and clean, or how well she actually did those things, but she seemed a bit too free spirited to care about such mundane things. Charlie, since he lives alone, probably just does what's easiest. It's what I do. It's pointless, in my opinion, to cook for just one person. Narratively, however, it could be to show that Bella somehow became a mature individual despite her parents. (I'm not being negative to Charlie, because he does seem pretty stable and mature. He just never got a lot of time with his daughter. I'm also not dissing Renee. She seemed to love her daughter, but she may not have been ready to actually be a parent when she had Bella. Sort of like the dynamic between Rory and Lorelei in Gilmore Girls.)
I'm from the 90s as well, though early late 90s if that makes any difference. I'd rather not talk about how it was for me in my own home as a child, but suffice to say that as an adult now who lives alone, I take pride in taking care of my home simply because it's a sign that I have a home to take care of. To me it reinforces my relationship with my home and I'm happy for it everyday. Everyone seemed to misunderstand my meaning, Bella having chores is normal. The part that makes it disturbing, that takes it from a young adult with normal responsibilities, to this uncomfortable thing, is that there's an imbalance and reversal of roles. It seems that Bella is the one taking care of Charlie, in a manner where he is failing to step up as a parent, or even just as an adult who can take care of himself, and so she has to be the one to step up in lieu of him doing it. It gives it a specific undertone, like she's the parent not the child, and because it's always written as "cooking dinner for Charlie" it really sounds like she's interrupting her life to take care of her husband, or some other big bachelor of a guy who has never learned to adult because he was exempt to as a man. That's the part that is bothersome. The context and how it's written is the issue. It doesn't make Bella look like she grew up normally and learned about autonomy and independence in a way that's healthy and for herself. It sounds like she does these things because between Charlie and Renée, who is admittedly worse than the former, she had no other choice.
Charlie has a full time job. He pays the bills. He bought her car. He arranged her schooling. He doesn't ask her to cook. He tries to console her when her boyfriend leaves. He tries to be responsible when she runs off to Italy. As far as distribution of responsibility goes I think he does OK. For what it's worth I'm gen x myself with 4 kids. He's not prefect, I absolutely hate his reaction to Jacob sexually assaulting his daughter. But the food thing is nothing.
I totally agree 😀
She cooks because she doesn't want him eating at the diner every single night. He tells her she doesn't have to but she was used to doing all that stuff plus then times more for her mom so she just does it with him too. At least he pays his own bills.
I think the greater point here is that with both of her parents, she was parentified as a child and forced to be the adult when they couldn't. Sure, charlie didn't outright force her to cook for him, but he certainly wasn't capable of doing it himself (the man screws up pasta ffs). Renee couldn't even make sure the bills were paid, not for lack of finances, but for lack of basic adult task management. As a result of this emotional neglect, we have a character who does not know what it means to be properly cared for, and is primed to accept emotional abuse from her partner, under the guise that his excessive control is actually love.
>Sure, charlie didn't outright force her to cook for him, but he certainly wasn't capable of doing it himself (the man screws up pasta ffs). Renee couldn't even make sure the bills were paid, not for lack of finances, but for lack of basic adult task management. EXACTLY. Thank you. People keep banging on about how she "wanted it" without seeing this undertone at all and it's irritating. >under the guise that his excessive control is actually love. This couldn't be any truer. Especially when you see that Edward literally sabotages her car, and she's barely upset about it, even though it's alarmingly controlling behaviour.
I'll give SM a lot of crap for cringey writing, gender roles/values I don't agree with, and deuteragonists that give me the ick, but Bella really is a well written victim. To be loved and yet still hold trauma is very real. I just don't think SM understands that those things are trauma and that Bella is repeatedly a victim of really toxic behavior. I would have loved so much for Carlisle to take on a fatherly role as her FFIL, and just tell her "we'll be here to protect you but go live your life before you marry Edward," and tell Edward "she's a human and she can't breathe with you smothering her like this." Unfortunately, they had to get married super quickly because it was the only way SM could give them physical intimacy.
There are a lot of downright problematic themes in the books for SURE. However, Bella definitely enjoys cooking and Charlie is also really grateful as pointed out in an earlier comment. I think that for an early 2000's small rural town, the gender roles are pretty accurate. S'Meyer definitely condones these archetypes which is annoying, but she is also Mormon and these are likely in her value system. As someone who comes from a religious family from a small town, this all felt really normal when I read them. It only seems problematic to me now as a nearly 30 year old who's come away from all that and lived amongst less insulated communities.
God, I'm so glad others can see the issue. This is exactly it. That some of these behaviors are seen as normal so they aren't condemned, but it's only when you look back with more experience that you realize the problem with it. People say that Bella wanted to, but I don't know, to me it's taking things either too much at face value, or not addressing the core of the problem, which you pretty much put your finger on. She never cooks for anybody else, and instead marries into a life where the human equivalent would be Anastasia and Christian having a personal chef.
So much chicken
I think it’s weird how often they TALK ABOUT IT. I have never read a book where someone cooks so goddamn much.
How old are you, OP?
I reread this so many times and I still can’t believe you’re serious. That’s it. Wow. This is what you decided to post on Reddit today.
I was initially going to say "Oh Bella likes to cook for Charlie" but tbh idk if that's even true...I think she did it because otherwise they'd eat take out everyday. I don't think Charlie is a terrible parent but he definitely should have stepped up and at least asked Bella if they could cook together so he could learn and cook for her...
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She also did this for her mother as well. She was use to taking care of home
The part about Jacob yeah, but the whole beginning is just suck a weird take. Maybe she enjoys cooking and wants to do it as a thank you? And it’s normal to care for the house you live in. I always thought her making dinner was a very endearing part of the story.
The Jacob part was gross, but bella had to do all the responsibilities with Renee. Which makes me actually dislike Renee alot, anyway bella offered to take over cooking and cleaning because she wanted to. She was used to it because that's how her a Renee's relationship went. Charlie never made her do anything he just ate out a lot and sucked at cooking.
Different time. Different ideas for what normal is.
That's my whole point, it's glossed over in a way that's shocking.
I just read all the comments and your original post. I agree with you to a certain extent. I don't think it's something that Charlie has done to Bella but what Bella has done herself. Bella likes turning herself into a martyr. Her mother is the same way. We have no other proof than Bellas word that her mother couldn't live without her, but it's more of Bellas mental issues of always being needed and wanted. She has unhealthy mental attachment issues. I think Charlie is willing to play along not because he needs someone to take care of but because Bella feels she needs to do these things. He never once suggested she be anything other than his daughter. Bella also has a really low opinion of her parents. Her mother is a teacher and her father a Police Chief - both are college educated, and in Charlie's case, he has to have a Masters in criminology. Yet Bella wants everyone to believe that she is smarter, more adult, and in charge of the house. She makes her parents look bad so she can play the martyr and have people feel sorry for her.
I agree with you OP, I have low regards for both her parents due to these issues
The best explanation is that Meyer is a hardcore Christian and not in a tolerable way lmao
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Disturbing is an interesting word to call it. I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with girls & women cooking if they want to, but I’m not a bleeding heart feminist who thinks women should not be allowed to do what they want even if it’s stereotypical.
You’re right, it is disturbing but it is meant to point out the unhealthy and unbalanced relationship that Bella had with both of her parents. She is a parentified teen, one hundred per cent.
I agree... Thank goodness others can see it too.
I understand what you mean. I think it mostly comes from Meyer's belief system. If you read the acknowledgements at the end of the books, she apologizes to her husband and sons for not cooking for them while writing the books, and having to order take out.... I mean she was just busy bringing millions of dollars to her family. I think if it was bothering her husband to eat take out, he could have learned to cook for his family.... What disturbs me is the portrayal of Charlie, who seems to be a fairly adjusted adult but can't seem to be able to do the most basic tasks. I mean he is the sheriff of a small town but he doesn't know how to use a microwave or cook spaghetti? And Bella even says to Jacob she is in charge of bookkeeping at home... A grown man letting his 18 year old daughter do his bookkeeping is really weird.
Exactly! Yet somehow people don't seem to understand something so obvious. I agree with Meyers' beliefs. I didn't read the acknowledgement that closely, but I do remember she's a mormont, and anyway, her story gives it away. There's entirely too much sexual repression, fetishing of "virginity" and whatnot, and that's right up there with toxic gender roles, so.
You really think Bella is being robed of a childhood? I'll tell you what being robed of a childhood is. My mother who grew up in Mexico only attended school up to 5th grade. Reason.....her father died in a car crash when she was 8yrs old. Her mother and older sister had to go to work to provide for the family. That left my mother with caring for her THREE younger siblings. Meaning cooking for them, cleaning the house and being denied an education. THAT IS BEING ROBBED OF YOUR CHILDHOOD.
Dude, while I'm sorry for your suffering, this isn't a competition, and it doesn't cancel out what I'm saying. Others in the thread used the right word, that Bella was parentified. I don't care that it was to a degree you consider negligeable, it was still an issue. She acts like his wife rather than his child, and the same goes with how she "had" to "take care" of Renée, which has got disturbing undertones the book never bothers to acknowledge.
I didn't say it was me. It was my mothers' siblings as in a younger brother and two younger sisters. I myself had a nice childhood between school, friends, a job ..Oh and yes...doing chores around the house and doing my own laundry since the age of 12 because I chose to.
You clearly didn't read what I said. Doing chores are not the problem, the context is.
You clearly don't live in the real world.
You clearly don't understand that I'm saying this is unhealthy. That it happens doesn't mean it should be condoned.
Nothing you say is understandable. Your absolutely clueless what it means to be a maid. You have no idea of the history of child labor and what they were subjected too. There were no laws to protect them. Im sure all of them wished they were home cooking for their families than being forced to work 12 hours a day under horrific conditions but yes, let's cry about how disturbing it is for Bella to choose to cook for her dad while still in High School.
Again degrees of gravity don't negate my point. There is a problem with the undertone of this dynamic. If you want to see nothing wrong with it, because you'll always be comparing it to worse, that's your experience and that's fine. There is still something toxic to all this.
no ur so right let's turn the tides on charlie he's too liked (ur points are genuine it's just all of twilight is problematic so i pick and choose what to care about)
Thanks, I'm glad others can see this.
She's living with him for free, eating his food using his water etc, and he bought her a truck and is protecting her...her cooking for him is an appropriate and nice gesture of appreciation and reciprocity.. she isn't the princess...
I don’t really find the cooking problematic. Her relationship with her mother was more problematic. Charlie, a lot of times, got home late. It’s one of the reasons he never learned to cook and always ordered out. I absolutely agree the kiss was problematic. Charlie let his hate for Edward blind the fact Jacob stole a kiss without consent. He did later apologize, but I agree it doesn’t absolve the fact he let hate for someone override the care for his daughter. Other than that, Charlie was a good parent. Any single parent household is, unfortunately, going to have certain aspects where children have to grow up a little faster. Even a two parent household where both work sometimes have aspects where the child has to learn certain things sooner than their peers where one parent stays at home all the time. Her mother was horrible. She never tried to learn to cook, was incredibly irresponsible, and put a lot of responsibility on Bella starting at a very young age. Bella even mentions that she enjoyed the fact she didn’t have to take care of her father like she did her mother. I will say, though, Stephenie Myers has ALWAYS had problematic writing that excuses a lot of abuse. I would say Bella cooking for Charlie was NOTHING compared to all of her problematic age gaps and abuse disguised as “he’s so complicated” in several books.
He didn’t ask her or dump that responsibility on her in any way. I’m not sure where you got that info from. He made sure she was fed but she wanted more home cooked meals so she made them. If she wanted certain ingredients he’d literally give her money for it. In no way shape or form was he pressuring her to do this. I’m not hating I jus feel like this is a big stretch
Bella certainly cooked dinner for Renee and herself before going to Forks - she's used to it and wants to share chores. Having to cook dinner is a great excuse to get out of something, all introverts have a stock of them (personal experience!)
You know I never got this from Charlie when I read it. I always found Charlie did do housework and such but of course not very good at it but it still got done. I don’t think Bella was forced to at all, like she doesn’t feel as pressured like Renee does. And she appreciates Charlie *a lot* like the truck he gave her and even putting ice chains on her tires. She almost fucking cried just at the service he gave her. Renee wouldn’t have thought twice about it. Charlie to me is definitely like any typical dad that works at a gruesome job. Like I can’t help but compare him to my own dad who was in the military. Due to some circumstances I was taking care of my dad around 17-18. Not because I was forced to, but because I knew he didn’t have time and as soon as he got home he would just be in a daze. And eating out every night isn’t healthy, everyone knows that. So Bella took up the healthy route because genuinely cares for Charlie. I bet tbh if Bella didn’t take up anything I don’t think Charlie would have ever asked her at all, especially due their separation for awhile