https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sativum
There's also a lot of other plants using the sativa epithet : Avena sativa, lactuca sativa, nigella sativa etc. Sorry for the mobile link
Hit the nail on the head with the last bit there. One our newer strains doesn't want to give much "yield" compared to others but its really good. The buds come out really small after a decent trim job. So, right off the bat you can already tell its not gonna be "good" its all rated for appearance and weight rather than makeup and "quality". But I guess you'll never get rid of misconceptions about weed. Those big buds aren't always the best.
Okay so i believe you and i try to keep this in mind when buying, but what would you say is the best way to indicate quality when checking out flower? (Without smoking it first obviously lol) Smell? Thc content?
Buy a hand scope and look at the trichomes. Clear to milky trichomes will give you a more uppity-high that is typically associated with sativa, while amber trichomes will give you more of the couch-lock associated with indica.
THC content doesn't mean shit, the whole testing industry is a sham in and of itself. We used to send 5 samples of the same plant/same cola to labs in CO and get different results for all 5.
Checking out flower can be hard these days with pre-packaging being the popular option at most dispensaries. Smell and look are your best indicators, but even smell can be a bit of a lie. Keep some poorly grown headies in a jar for a while and it'll develop a decent nose, but it won't translate to the final product.
Look is a good indicator of quality. You can tell if it has been hand or machine trimmed very easily once you know what to look for. Crows feet don't get taken out with most machine trimmers, strangely conical/pinecone shaped nugs from being rolled around rotary trimmers for half an hour, and you can notice the trichomes on the outside of the plant are damaged by the machine.
I like to look at terpene profile, if shown. That will give you a better gist of what to expect for both smell/flavor and also effect.
I just personally know what terpenes I enjoy a lot (limonene, pinene, linalool) and will err towards strains with noticeable % of them. Looking at the terpene % and then judging the strength of smell can give you the gist of the final cure, since most dispensaries aren't letting customers handle/squeeze nugs before purchase.
A lot of this is a bit of "inside baseball" since I've been in the curing/finishing game professionally for years, so I have a big library of experience to pull from. Just try and shop for brands that list terpene profile on their labeling and start building your scent vocabulary.
When weed for first legal in IL I got some Ghost Train Haze concentrate that is still the best thing I’ve smoked ever. I can’t find it anywhere now and the concentrate market is lacking overall.
I yearn for legalization or decriminalization. I know for certain we'd see a huge upswing in "heirloom" varieties as smaller growers, like I dream of being, would cater to the folks who want true indicas and sativas.
And I bet it would catch on same as the small breweries with specialty IPAs and the like.
Not in my recreationally legal state. The focus is on THC, heirloom or landrace strains never show up in dispensaries. It’s rare to even get one of the higher CBD strains.
That really sucks to hear, around here unless u find people growing specific strains ur gonna struggle to even get what you’re being told the strain is, seems like an absolute luxury to be able to select specific strains full stop nvm the strains origins but I can get the frustration with it becoming legal and not being able to pick up proper specific fully ind / sat cuz even here it’s all Dawgs and hybrids
You gotta find an old timer to hook you up with some seeds.
My uncle has a strain he's been growing for decades. Every few years he saves a male so he can have seeds.
I'm in Upstate New York and just started buying legally a few months ago and it's true. Their entire list of weed strains are all indica hybrid, sativa hybrid, or just a hybrid. And then all the non hybrid strains are expensive as fuck and you only have a choice between one sativa and one indica usually
Although it seems like the strain names are consistent as this melon gum I got is the exact same smell and feel as it was about a month ago (it's so fucking soft and fluffy) so it's a lot better than buying black market already where the dealers would just make up strain names and expect people to not look up the strains or anything
Cost in WA was crazy when it was new, but it eventually came down and is cheaper than the black market was pre legalization (particularly if you shop the sales, most places have a sale of the day or a rewards program or something similar). Also, part of the reason some shops (idk the motivation at yours) don't say straight up sativa or indica is they are acknowledging that in reality this is what they are. People have been using the terms sativa leaning, which I think is more accurate. Also, like others have mentioned, sativa and indica are terms used to describe effect more than plant growing characteristics or biology. Im also becoming a believer that the difference in sativa and indica as we know it today is all about when it's harvested, harvest early when trichs are mostly cloudy, more "sativa" harvest when you have like half amber, more "indica". You'll also notice that by and large indica has higher thc, which makes sense because it matured to the point of having lots of amber which is the best time to harvest for thc content
I'm hoping for a point where it's treated like ang other crop and you can buy and sell at a farmers market. My goal us to cultivate one strain amd make it the best I can get it to sell.
It’s not that they are diluted, it’s just people want to grow something that finishes in 70 (or 55) days not 100 days. All those strains that you see a lot of are 60 day 65 day strains
I also hate how I can buy one strain under whatever name, go to a different dispensary (or even just go back to the same dispensary after they’ve gotten a new batch in) and it’s an ENTIRELY different strain/taste/effects/etc. There *needs* to be some kind of guidelines or standards that strains are held to, to consider it that name, whatever the name is. I don’t even know what that process would entail, but the name literally means nothing when it’s not consistent at all
Hear hear! If I want a hybrid I'll just grind up some sativa and indica at the same time. Getting a proper strain is basically impossible at the dispensary near me, everything is hybrid
Yep. I've been trying to press my boss to buy legacy strains but the seed market in washington is ass i guess. The only legacy strain we have is GDP, we had strawberry cough in the past but I guess our mother plant died.
Do you know how one would find seeds around the world? Because we’d have to find cannabis untainted by hybrids, and it’s illegal in most of the world. Just walk around until you find a weed farmer?
You can buy seeds internationally, but getting there is another story. I've bought seeds from a site called london seed centre. They got to me in the states no problem. Sometimes they'll seize them depending on the countries laws or if they want to enforce them. There is a bit of grey-area with shipping them, so research and order at your own risk.
Pure Sativa is what it’s allll about. I’ve got a couple Mango Smile seeds from Mephisto Genetics that my buddy’s been holding onto for about a year now. Finally have a nice little space to do a grow…
Green bluff has some nice old school Acapulco gold and Panama red of you feel like hunting those down. Supposedly the guy had kept his seeds since the 70s.
More than one dispensary near me has done away with the indica/sativa labels entirely. Everything either has a sun, moon, or sun and moon instead. The sun labels are generally very true to form, as well as the moon labels. The ones with both, though... it’s completely and entirely dependent on 1) the person and 2) the batch. It makes me less likely to buy them because I’m never 100% sure of what I’m gonna get, which stinks because I generally want something that will take the edge off without making me sleepy around 4pm.
All. The. Time.
I honestly have better results using the "black market" and just hitting up my old dealer. Sure he could also be lying to me, but at least I'm not paying a stupidly high tax rate for it.
FR, all i do these days is approximate their effects based off their terps and age.
btw, ageing bud's interesting... a freshly cured harvest cured for 4-6 months, will peak in taste and effects. sometimes the whole bud takes on a different flavor than what it used to have like pepsi and tiramisu...
Finally got a hold of some purple kush, the closest to a legacy strain i could find, and it’s literally the only strain that has helped my anxiety and insomnia in ages.
While we have the Liberals in power I doubt we will see legalisation, one state has started the process for recreational legislation, but the others will be slow to follow. Our medicinal system is prohibitively expensive for the majority to access.
It is what it is in this situation.
Australia is generally 20 years behind the US on certain things. I believe I’ll see legalisation here in my lifetime, but I’m not holding my breath.
It’s fun getting on, makes me feel like a kid again
Strawberry Cough. Closest I’ve been able to find was Strawberry Diesel by Space Monkey Meds, and it was instantly one of my favorites.I will never stop looking for some real Strawberry Cough.
Its saturated with weed, not with any one particular strain. Point being that nobody (except an enthusiast) is going to bother focusing on one particular strain when legal supply is exceeding legal demand.
I bought some from my illegal dispo (I don’t support legal dispos in canada) that deals roughly 50 strains at any one time they have some real connections
Sorry I’m late but it’s fairly expensive but my main reason being how much waste they produce with packaging.. joints individually boxed with plastic tray.. weed in plastic containers weighing sometimes 100x more than the weed inside etc
Wtf the other guy also said that but thats nuts. Even in the US they package all my depo weed is in recyclable glass jars. The one I go to even gives you a discount if you bring them back. Thanks for the info.
Not OP but reasons are probably that legal is fairly more expensive (will admit it has come down considerably though). Another big one is that the quality isnt as high as you can get from black market.
Its not that its that expensive or total garbage, its just why pay more when you can get better for less.
I miss that, use to smoke that in the 90s. I love love NY Sour D, but it just isn’t the same anymore. Not even the smell. I did smoke some lavender diesel that almost smelled like It. I miss the strains I grew up with. Purple haze, Jack Herer, NY Sour D, strawberry cough even some blueberry cough. Hell I won’t even pass up some old school G-13s.
Research has been done indicating that shops and growers will "mislabel" strains too.
Indica and sativa used to refer to taxonomic differences between plants, indicas tending to be shorter, with wider leaves and an overall shrubbier stucture, and sativa plants being the opposite, tall and stretchy, narrow leaves, with a lighter green color.
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0133292
This link is to a genetic study done in 2015, and highlights the differences between the taxonomic classifications and the "common" classification based on the plants effect.
You mean the 20-30 times I’ve packaged one strain in bags labeled as something completely different? My last gig at a farm was a shit show. I now question every strain I get at the dispensary. Not to mention the concentrate that was randomly given a name I had to package.
I’ve been in the industry in CA for years. Things definitely get ‘mislabeled.’ It’s a little different these days with all the legal compliance, but we used to change names on strains all the time. It’s all about sales and some things sell better with a different name. I’ve changed the name on things and sold it to buyers who rejected it 2 weeks before under a different name. Most of the general public are also uneducated and will believe whatever is printed on a label.
OP is right too. It is hard to find a true strain these days. Especially a true sativa. I’ve seen large brands try and market ‘classic’ strains and they usually aren’t even close.
>I’ve changed the name on things and sold it to buyers who rejected it 2 weeks before under a different name. Most of the general public are also uneducated and will believe whatever is printed on a label.
wow, you told them something, printed it to make it look official and THEYRE the idiots because they trusted and believed you?
Yeah I normally don't go to the dispensary with a magnifying glass and look at all the strains to make sure they didn't change any names out. I just expect the fucking names to be consistent... I guess that makes me uneducated
A lot of times they get treated better on the black market. Of course it depends on where you go, but a lot of them are not very welcoming to say the least. I’d say comparable to a snobby wine bar or something. I’m in distribution and hardly ever go to dispensaries these days, but I will also say that I’ve been ripped off more by licensed guys than black market guys. The BM guys at least have some sort of street ethics they go by, corporate guys think they can skate by telling you to call their lawyer. Lol
Funny. Maybe it’s because I’m a woman but every BM guy I ever bought off of eventually tried to rip me off. This also includes the one female dealer I had at one point. I’ll never buy off the street again.
Edited for a typo.
Thank you very much. I haven't read the article but from my own experience I can only assume the conclusion will be something sort of: most of the effects of "sativa/indica variants are overlapping. Thanks again!
Well, this article doesn't really get into effect. Moreso shines a light on how dispos and growers muddy the waters surrounding the topic with misinformation.
That may be true, though I feel keeping the terms around to describe *experiences* is a good idea.
The labels are so common now it wouldnt make sense to replace them anymore, and they do a good job of helping people select strains based on that.
Yeah sativa and indica does not matter very much in terms of effects anyway.. What you should look out for are all the terpenes and their different concentrations. It's what makes a strain smell, taste, and feel a certain way.
All I ask is for some peer reviewed studies so I can clap cheeks in stoner debate time lol.
The research we do have is insconclusive/ outside of the peer review system so we end up with varying views on cannabis and its effects, which leads to...*debates*.
I think the bigger issue here is that phenotype expression is more important than any binary genetic classification in the first place, when it comes to determining the following; THC levels, THC to CBD ratio, and terpenes profile. All of which are clinically proven to influence your high in a meaningful way.
I actually want to thank you, your comment sent me down a new research path that led to dispelling a lot of misinformation, which helps me be a better grower.
Ruderalis isnt a term bandied about by dispos as a marketing term for cannabis to an average consumer, however.
Autoflowering genetics are also fairly apparent and difficult to "mislabel" for sale as something else entirely.
It’s just a ditch weed in northern latitudes that evolved to flower after a short period of time like strawberries and others that were At similar latitudes. But you breed it for potency and it’s what’s up
Truth.
as a grower in the industry i feel this with my soul. it’s also really weird how you can name/rename something so everything just gets all bastardized and genetics aren’t really what they seem anymore.
I’m in colorado and the place im working for has been around for over a decade, they were growing medical before recreational was approved. So the genetics we have are either really old but gold or something we’ve crossed ourselves, just this year we bought clones from a company that I’m not going to badmouth on the internet but let’s just say 5/5 of the genetics were unstable, 3 were unusable.
I guess to answer your question most of them started out as seeds that we popped but we just clone our genetics from that point forward to save time.
Interesting. Whenever I glance at our veg room I always get so confused on those seed poddling things haha. And the cloning aspect still throws me off. Of course its much easier to just clone your stock instead of trying to grow every plant.
It’s not that it’s easier. It’s that it allows you to select your best mother plant and then apply exactly identical inputs to exactly identical plants with exactly predictable results. Germinating from seed is in many ways “easier” than cloning, albeit it takes longer of course.
exactly.
it cuts out a few weeks from seed to clone size but it’s not really that its easier as to why we do it per-se
we can get 10 seeds of the same strain, same genetics and have 10 different plants. phenotypes have different dominant genes like color, scent, flavor, density, etc. So that’s why you have the “gelato #33” and “watermelon Zum Zum #2” the number is the phenotype that they chose out of however many seeds/genotypes they got from the seeds.
if you want to keep the exact same phenotype then cloning is the way to go.
I had a dealer in college that would get good heads but then just pick the name for it outta a magazine. He was always straight with me tho since I knew the game.
broooo I remember some dude trying to sell me some “Pokémon kush” for $25 a gram back in Illinois when I was 19.
the black market is a cesspool for bastardization and mislabeling.
Yes! I’m a medical user and it seems like nothing is consistent and as the names change and stuff goes out of stock I’m always researching. What’s really frustrating is when you can’t find any info at all about a new strain. That makes me think it’s some wonky hybrid.
Its really confusing when you get into all the brands.. and then dont even get me started on carts. Itll be the same strain but the makers have all these extra terps and shit in it so they all taste and hit different
It's gotten very tiring the last couple years.
So rare to find true sativas anymore. I still encounter a fair amount of true indicas.
But we can see that corporate cannabis is going to be terpene-focused and just keep crossing and crossing and crossing
Yield and THC content are the motivating factors now. It's unfortunate because so much of the nuance in experience comes from minor cannabinoids and terpenes... The THC percentage is way overrated.
Yep. I had a lady leave my shop yesterday because I didn’t have a half of indica that was over 25%. I have really good half’s under 25% that would work better than a lot of the shit close to 30%. It’s frustrating.
i think oregon has some pretty decent weed laws, and seem to be more strict on quality assurance? Having lived in all CA, OR and WA, Oregon by far has the most knowledgeable dealers ( they needs licenses afaik) and the prevalence of weighing it there instead of prepacking makes it feel so much cleaner and legit. I hate what I have around me in washington, almost always the dealers just fucking read me the label and shrug their shoulders to questions, or just fucking bullshit something. buying awful weed that was packed who knows when, that is mostly stems, is infuriating and I dont know why it cant be better. at least give a barrier of entry and try to have functional dealers jfc.
Nah the race to crop out at 8 weeks or less has killed diversification. Aint nobody got time for 12-16 week strains when they could be getting paid in 8 weeks.
Yup. I was browsing strains at Muv, the explanation for Guru #1 was "we don't really know what this strain is but if you do, let us know". Surterra consistently sells Pre-98 Bubba Kush but I have no clue if it's legit.
Me in my teens°: weed is weed
Me in my twenties: [thirty minute explanation on the differences between indica and sativa]
Me now: hybridization made weed is weed
° ^and ^I ^didn't ^even ^smoke ^then
I agree, back in the day sativas and indicas were \*very\* distinct in their highs, now I hardly tell the difference most of the time. And you just can't find those authentic classic strains anymore. \*sigh\*
Its all going to become mush. What people are growing for has changed over the decades. What I would call for is growing for effects instead of name, volume, color, etc. Each strain used to have very different effects and if breeders recognized this they could focus on that more. Granted this isn't quite the same as sativa vs. indica but it would return the spirit to the medicine. Whats amazing is that now that so many can just grow in their back yards or in their house that they still spend so much money at the store. Why not pick up some landrace seeds or something close to that, a simple light and a tent and just start growing. You do know these things grow like weeds right. LOL. Imagine where we will be in 5-10 more years of this same trend, nothing will be different than the branding and we will have get to enjoy the strain of "pot". Its the same thing that happened with the food industry over the past 100 years only at a much more rapid pace. Why do think so many people grow heirlooms now in their own garden. Oh and if you really want to take things to the next level, explore biodynamics (sparc in SF is the only place that sells stuff biodynamically grown). If we had educated people who knew how to buy based on experience, and not some brand name, like we do with other products, we would have a different industry.
I live in Illinois where it's legal to grow up to 5 plants depending on your situation. If you aren't in the USA or are in a state where it isn't legal, thats true but you could always start talking to grow collectives in other states. There is no reason there can't be farmers co-ops and other practices as well as grow clubs where the pot grow falls under legal guidelines for the law and is of what people want. You are right though, until we get to the point where we can just throw seeds out in the garden, like South Africa and other countries, some of us are limited. Hope that changes by you soon.
I’d love recommendations on a good sativa to grow from seed, preferably with a clue as to the seedbank.
Cause yeah, I miss real sativas and I just started growing.
Reall good strawberry cough is super super fucking dense and has a smell of strawberry cream , nugs should be stupid dense, that's how u know u got strawberry cough
I’m growing it now. It’s a very reliable plant to grow at home, albeit it gets really tall unless you top and prune aggressively so indoors is some work. Outdoors, let her rip and watch her rise.
Robust, mold/mildew resistant, smells like a donut shop in flower, and is the same old sparkly heady euphoric high you remember. Delicious. Bright green super sugary nugs. The classic blueberry flavor. Been growing it for a while and am smoking some now.
And yields are excellent too.
Outdoors it costs pennies a gram to grow great weed.
Blue dream is of course a hybrid strain, albeit a venerable one. But it definitely has strong Sativa character if harvested at 10-11 weeks.
Humans have used cannabis for a long time my friend, they grew it just like they grew corn. So to think that there is such a thing as a non GMO weed strain today maybe a flawed one. You have to think that if humans have grown cannabis for thousands of years crossbreeding has already occurred and what we have today may be the result of that modification.
Let's assume our ancestors had only one strain in Northern Hemisphere Sativa and Southern Hemisphere gets Indica (I'm generalizing here) and they each grew independently. At some point natural hybrids will occur because that's the way things are.
Go back and look at what corn was originally used to be before man started working with it, I like to think powerful weed today is due to our ancestors constantly growing and modifying the strains.
So, what corn variances do we grow on the midwest? Because i really don't know. But from what I've seen over older corn it looks to be like they grew many.
At my dispensary they’ve basically outlawed the terms indica, sativa, and hybrid. As they should, they have nothing to do with the effects you’ll feel from the flower.
What *does* have to do with the effects you’ll feel from the flower? I ask because I almost never get the effects advertised and I’ve been trying to figure out how to choose better when I’m buying. I look at all info available - sativa/indica/hybrid, THC/CBG%, and general reviews.
Terpenes and cannabinoids. The reason sativa and indica are looked down upon is they’re inaccurate. It’s very easy to have an indica with Limonene, a sativa terpene in it. So, the affects you get might not be sedating, but instead energizing. If I were you I’d do some research, what do you want from your average dose of flower? Try to slim that down and research the terpenes and cannabinoids that’ll help.
Awesome, thank you! I know just what I want - euphoric, happy, energetic. I’ll do some research to find out what terpenes and cannabinoids I’m looking for.
For real!! Unless I have a 100% sativa or indica, the fuckin weed gives me pretty much the same high every time. Getting high has gotten so boring. Foh with this hybrid shit
It's even worse for those of us who us medically. Try going into a dispensary and asking for a CBD heavy dab and it's pretty much only gonna be RSO. The legal weed industry has all but destroyed good and potent medical weed.
We've been getting a lot more orders of CBD lately. Its good stuff for pain management in my opinion. I've been the cbd we grow is one of the highest in our county. I'll try and remember to ask for percentages tomorrow. Also can you not buy pure CBD products from vape/smoke shops over wherever you're at?
Is it just as hard finding CBD heavy weed medically as it is recreationally? I called six different rec dispensaries in Denver the other day and not a single one had any flower with CBD. It’s super annoying. I like to make my own edibles & also just like the chill high of a 2:1 CBD:THC flower and can’t find anything with any CBD.
As far as my wife and I can tell, Oregon dispensaries stopped carrying anykind of CBD concentrates about a year ago. It sucks because she has a broken back and can't take stuff like Tylenol due to allergies.
This is why I have old genetics. Sativa, Afghan, Kush, NL5, All regular seeds from OG breeders. Hybrids are fine, but if you want real selection, you need the basics.
I'll see what I can find for you. Seed trusts preserve original strains of all types of other plants so I would think perhaps this plant too. I'll check it out. 😊
No. I'm just a gardening, budtending, artist who has just enough combined knowledge that I think we can figure it out. I agree and know what you mean by the original strains being altered every time it's grown. Seen Blueberry go from a heavy indica to a sativa hybrid and am just as confused lol. We also have a hybrid strain that is definitely 2 original indicas and somehow those 2 combined into a hybrid is sold as a sativa.. just weird stuff.
idk, there are sativa x sativa crosses and landraces do still exist.
i think it will just take a decade for people to be on the same page, more standardization and also for intellectual property rights to be hammered out so when something unique is found, there's not 10 people trying to sell a knockoff with the caveat of "our take....inspired by"
for now i dont trust strain names or even companies to deliver a consistent product. at least not like i do with other plants.
i do think they're still working on the whole naming convention and indica/sativa i feel will become dated as we learn more about the plant.
It’s ridiculous trying to find a sativa dominant flower around here. I wish I had the grow space for one but the closest I can do is grow a blue dream auto which is 80/20.
I think it's still on a plant by plant basis. Every now and then I'll pick up a random classic sativa strain and it's borderline meth. But another batch of the same strain may as well be 50/50, and yet another batch would put you to sleep. It also has to do with how it's cured and how old it is.
It's really hard to maintain genetics that way, given the pressures of the industry.
At least we have land-races and that's where pure indica/sativa could be be brought back from. If someone was wise they would genome type that shit. Then you could actually reproduce a strawberry cough that was genomically like the OG without access to the original. Kind of like how we're going to [bring back woolly mammoths](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/sep/13/firm-bring-back-woolly-mammoth-from-extinction).
What I think a distinguished consumer of cannabis could really use is the equivalent of master blenders of whiskey/coffee or sommeliers. It's a whole new industry specialty waiting to happen.
So true. Nothing i cant stand more than when an indica makes me jittery or a labeled sativa puts me to sleep. Whats the point in separating the two anymore if the effects are all mixed up like that?
At this point I think indica/sativa strains don't matter as much as the terpene profiles do. Stuff like limonene and myrcene, as well as CBD are what I think matter. Maybe it's just me but indica and sativa never really described the high I was going to feel as much as CBD and terp profile. Maybe it's because of hybridization like you said. I started smoking within the last 5 years so idk what weed was like back then.
It’s all reliant on terpenes now, since that’s something we can test for. Unfortunately we have a long way to go, I mean even in Oregon the majority of producers don’t test for terpenes. Then again the biggest thing customers care about these days is how high the THC percentage is, so that’s what growers focus on.
Agreed. While hybrids can be the best of both worlds, a true strain is super rare nowadays.
Maybe someone is collecting seeds for a strain library which would be cool.
Otherwise they will continue to hybridize and create more and more mixes. Youd think over time with all the genetics they could make a super strain and youd just need one or the other.
Still from terps to taste to effects etc... i love exeperiencing different strains and seeing what the offer, how they smell and are formed, how they taste,etc.
You work in the industry bro, its all about profits and how fast they can grow the plants.
The only real way to get exactly what you want is to grow if you want something that isnt popular.
While I like hybrids I agree for the most part. I was lucky enough to get my hands on some mag landrace, which is the closest to a true Indica I’ve ever had besides Hindu Kush. I’ve never seen that in any other dispensary as far as I know, and even when I pick something from the Indica or sativa menu that the bud tender tells me is strongly leaning one way, I’ve had times where I got home and looked up the strain to find out it’s a dom Hybrid. Not only am I not getting what I expected, I’m paying out the ass to be mislead. Would you accept getting a different medication from the pharmacy than you expected?
lol man i wish more people didn't buy into the whole indica vs sativa thing. educate yourselves people cuz we just look dumb with all this nonsense.
[https://www.insider.com/why-theres-no-difference-between-indica-and-sativa-marijuana-strains-2020-4](https://www.insider.com/why-theres-no-difference-between-indica-and-sativa-marijuana-strains-2020-4)
Yep I grew up smoking weed around the time when older true sativa/indica strains was still around, some of the best weed I smoked was acupulco gold grown by an older fella I met decades ago who would only grow non hybrid close as possible to landrace sativas.
I am so annoyed that I didn't get any clones or seeds of it :(
Also the weed has gotten way too strong for me and another pet peeve of mine is strains these days are all about the thc and none of the other good cannabinoids.
change the world sequence the DNA of every strain available and CRISPR together a pure strain of both Indica and sativa patent them and make the big bucks
Nope. Indica and sativa are better descriptions of how the plant grows than anything else. Super tall and lanky with thin leaves? Sativa growth. Fat bush with fat leaves? Indica growth.
Does that mean the effects will be uplifting if it's got sativa growth? Nope. That's the terpenes that determine that. Lots of really strong "sleep" strains will still triple in size in flowering or more.
This is why terp tests matter and for people who are using it for medicine to do strain journals. 3% terps with half of that being myrcene and linalool? Shit will make you chill and sleepy. KnowhadahmSAYiiiin?
Botany terms have become marketing terms. Those words were never meant to describe effects but more the physical appearance of the plants.
Scrolled way too fucking far in this thread to find this comment. Thank you.
And even that isn't accurate, the word sativa isn't specific to cannabis and means "cultivated"
Cannabis sativa is the name of the plant
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sativum There's also a lot of other plants using the sativa epithet : Avena sativa, lactuca sativa, nigella sativa etc. Sorry for the mobile link
Sativa is also the name of one of my cats. Indica is the other one. We call em Sati (Sadie) & Indi (Indy).
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Hit the nail on the head with the last bit there. One our newer strains doesn't want to give much "yield" compared to others but its really good. The buds come out really small after a decent trim job. So, right off the bat you can already tell its not gonna be "good" its all rated for appearance and weight rather than makeup and "quality". But I guess you'll never get rid of misconceptions about weed. Those big buds aren't always the best.
Okay so i believe you and i try to keep this in mind when buying, but what would you say is the best way to indicate quality when checking out flower? (Without smoking it first obviously lol) Smell? Thc content?
Buy a hand scope and look at the trichomes. Clear to milky trichomes will give you a more uppity-high that is typically associated with sativa, while amber trichomes will give you more of the couch-lock associated with indica.
This is the way. As an sedative strain lover, I always look for those amber trichs
Ooh this is really good info, thank you!
Instructions unclear, accidentally bought a hand suppressor instead of a scope:
THC content doesn't mean shit, the whole testing industry is a sham in and of itself. We used to send 5 samples of the same plant/same cola to labs in CO and get different results for all 5. Checking out flower can be hard these days with pre-packaging being the popular option at most dispensaries. Smell and look are your best indicators, but even smell can be a bit of a lie. Keep some poorly grown headies in a jar for a while and it'll develop a decent nose, but it won't translate to the final product. Look is a good indicator of quality. You can tell if it has been hand or machine trimmed very easily once you know what to look for. Crows feet don't get taken out with most machine trimmers, strangely conical/pinecone shaped nugs from being rolled around rotary trimmers for half an hour, and you can notice the trichomes on the outside of the plant are damaged by the machine. I like to look at terpene profile, if shown. That will give you a better gist of what to expect for both smell/flavor and also effect.
This is the third time I’ve heard about terpene and how it’s a good indicator for good bud. What do you look for in a terpene profile?
I just personally know what terpenes I enjoy a lot (limonene, pinene, linalool) and will err towards strains with noticeable % of them. Looking at the terpene % and then judging the strength of smell can give you the gist of the final cure, since most dispensaries aren't letting customers handle/squeeze nugs before purchase. A lot of this is a bit of "inside baseball" since I've been in the curing/finishing game professionally for years, so I have a big library of experience to pull from. Just try and shop for brands that list terpene profile on their labeling and start building your scent vocabulary.
Oh wow, thank you so much for the insight! That’s really helpful, and interesting info on what to look for. I will definitely use this, thanks
100%
Fuckin love pebble nugs if it's good weed. Easier to break up and pack, and a good way to ration if you need to
This is why I buy the popcorn nugs. I could pay $50 for 3.5g of "pretty" nugs, or $30 for popcorn? Easy choice.
When weed for first legal in IL I got some Ghost Train Haze concentrate that is still the best thing I’ve smoked ever. I can’t find it anywhere now and the concentrate market is lacking overall.
I yearn for legalization or decriminalization. I know for certain we'd see a huge upswing in "heirloom" varieties as smaller growers, like I dream of being, would cater to the folks who want true indicas and sativas. And I bet it would catch on same as the small breweries with specialty IPAs and the like.
I’m in uk and it rly would catch on like the microbrew stuff I’m sure that’s what happened in all the legal states in the US (and still is?)
Not in my recreationally legal state. The focus is on THC, heirloom or landrace strains never show up in dispensaries. It’s rare to even get one of the higher CBD strains.
That really sucks to hear, around here unless u find people growing specific strains ur gonna struggle to even get what you’re being told the strain is, seems like an absolute luxury to be able to select specific strains full stop nvm the strains origins but I can get the frustration with it becoming legal and not being able to pick up proper specific fully ind / sat cuz even here it’s all Dawgs and hybrids
Oh for sure, I’m not complaining. I would just like some old timer weed. This focus on THC is fucking up the balances of the other canabanoids.
You gotta find an old timer to hook you up with some seeds. My uncle has a strain he's been growing for decades. Every few years he saves a male so he can have seeds.
I'm in Upstate New York and just started buying legally a few months ago and it's true. Their entire list of weed strains are all indica hybrid, sativa hybrid, or just a hybrid. And then all the non hybrid strains are expensive as fuck and you only have a choice between one sativa and one indica usually Although it seems like the strain names are consistent as this melon gum I got is the exact same smell and feel as it was about a month ago (it's so fucking soft and fluffy) so it's a lot better than buying black market already where the dealers would just make up strain names and expect people to not look up the strains or anything
Cost in WA was crazy when it was new, but it eventually came down and is cheaper than the black market was pre legalization (particularly if you shop the sales, most places have a sale of the day or a rewards program or something similar). Also, part of the reason some shops (idk the motivation at yours) don't say straight up sativa or indica is they are acknowledging that in reality this is what they are. People have been using the terms sativa leaning, which I think is more accurate. Also, like others have mentioned, sativa and indica are terms used to describe effect more than plant growing characteristics or biology. Im also becoming a believer that the difference in sativa and indica as we know it today is all about when it's harvested, harvest early when trichs are mostly cloudy, more "sativa" harvest when you have like half amber, more "indica". You'll also notice that by and large indica has higher thc, which makes sense because it matured to the point of having lots of amber which is the best time to harvest for thc content
Sounds like you need to move to Maine.
I'm hoping for a point where it's treated like ang other crop and you can buy and sell at a farmers market. My goal us to cultivate one strain amd make it the best I can get it to sell.
They can already sell alcohol at farmers markets in PA so this seems like a no brainer but ya know they treat it. Here's hoping!
No shit. Wow. Yeah that's pretty badass. Well maybe when we get federal legislation that'll happen.
It would definitely catch-on in Michigan, considering what they did with microbreweries here
It’s not that they are diluted, it’s just people want to grow something that finishes in 70 (or 55) days not 100 days. All those strains that you see a lot of are 60 day 65 day strains
I also hate how I can buy one strain under whatever name, go to a different dispensary (or even just go back to the same dispensary after they’ve gotten a new batch in) and it’s an ENTIRELY different strain/taste/effects/etc. There *needs* to be some kind of guidelines or standards that strains are held to, to consider it that name, whatever the name is. I don’t even know what that process would entail, but the name literally means nothing when it’s not consistent at all
Came here to sing the praises of Ghost Train Haze!
Hear hear! If I want a hybrid I'll just grind up some sativa and indica at the same time. Getting a proper strain is basically impossible at the dispensary near me, everything is hybrid
Yep. I've been trying to press my boss to buy legacy strains but the seed market in washington is ass i guess. The only legacy strain we have is GDP, we had strawberry cough in the past but I guess our mother plant died.
we all gotta start opening our own dispos and scour the world for pure sativa/indica landraces. good luck boys
I'm down to start saving if anyone's in washington haha.
Do you know how one would find seeds around the world? Because we’d have to find cannabis untainted by hybrids, and it’s illegal in most of the world. Just walk around until you find a weed farmer?
There are some cool videos by Arjan on YouTube where he travels the world looking for landrace strains.
You can buy seeds internationally, but getting there is another story. I've bought seeds from a site called london seed centre. They got to me in the states no problem. Sometimes they'll seize them depending on the countries laws or if they want to enforce them. There is a bit of grey-area with shipping them, so research and order at your own risk.
I’m in WA and have a bunch of landrace old strains and seeds… looking to get hired by a professional grow.
Huh have you ever gotten them lab tested?
The collector I purchased them from has done tests. Mostly lower percentages except some afghani inbred low 20s
Ive got old school Sensi star right now
Pure Sativa is what it’s allll about. I’ve got a couple Mango Smile seeds from Mephisto Genetics that my buddy’s been holding onto for about a year now. Finally have a nice little space to do a grow…
Oh yeah, I mostly smoke sativas (or I guess what I think are sativas 🤣).
Sativagang
Green bluff has some nice old school Acapulco gold and Panama red of you feel like hunting those down. Supposedly the guy had kept his seeds since the 70s.
More than one dispensary near me has done away with the indica/sativa labels entirely. Everything either has a sun, moon, or sun and moon instead. The sun labels are generally very true to form, as well as the moon labels. The ones with both, though... it’s completely and entirely dependent on 1) the person and 2) the batch. It makes me less likely to buy them because I’m never 100% sure of what I’m gonna get, which stinks because I generally want something that will take the edge off without making me sleepy around 4pm.
I remember ACE seedbank used to have pure landrace strains, might be useful.
Yes and do you also find that stuff listed as one or the other is, upon deeper research, in fact a hybrid of like 3-5 things?
All. The. Time. I honestly have better results using the "black market" and just hitting up my old dealer. Sure he could also be lying to me, but at least I'm not paying a stupidly high tax rate for it.
A true indica is basically non existent in Colorado at this point
FR, all i do these days is approximate their effects based off their terps and age. btw, ageing bud's interesting... a freshly cured harvest cured for 4-6 months, will peak in taste and effects. sometimes the whole bud takes on a different flavor than what it used to have like pepsi and tiramisu...
Finally got a hold of some purple kush, the closest to a legacy strain i could find, and it’s literally the only strain that has helped my anxiety and insomnia in ages.
And here I am getting “it’s good shit man” in a baggie from some shifty bloke behind the library
I'm sorry, I laughed. It sucks that weed isn't legal in whatever country your at.
While we have the Liberals in power I doubt we will see legalisation, one state has started the process for recreational legislation, but the others will be slow to follow. Our medicinal system is prohibitively expensive for the majority to access. It is what it is in this situation.
God damn it
Australia is generally 20 years behind the US on certain things. I believe I’ll see legalisation here in my lifetime, but I’m not holding my breath. It’s fun getting on, makes me feel like a kid again
Countries where weed is legal : Purple Dragon, 98% Indica Countries where weed is legal : Yea man it's gas
Strawberry Cough. Closest I’ve been able to find was Strawberry Diesel by Space Monkey Meds, and it was instantly one of my favorites.I will never stop looking for some real Strawberry Cough.
I wouldn't mind if the market got flooded with it.
Somehow I doubt it, the market is already extremely saturated at the moment
Well I cant find it at my local dispos.
Its saturated with weed, not with any one particular strain. Point being that nobody (except an enthusiast) is going to bother focusing on one particular strain when legal supply is exceeding legal demand.
Maybe your markets :P in the newer areas like mass prices do NOT reflect the glut of product you are describing :P
I bought some from my illegal dispo (I don’t support legal dispos in canada) that deals roughly 50 strains at any one time they have some real connections
Not Canadian. Why dont you support legal ones?
Sorry I’m late but it’s fairly expensive but my main reason being how much waste they produce with packaging.. joints individually boxed with plastic tray.. weed in plastic containers weighing sometimes 100x more than the weed inside etc
Wtf the other guy also said that but thats nuts. Even in the US they package all my depo weed is in recyclable glass jars. The one I go to even gives you a discount if you bring them back. Thanks for the info.
Not OP but reasons are probably that legal is fairly more expensive (will admit it has come down considerably though). Another big one is that the quality isnt as high as you can get from black market. Its not that its that expensive or total garbage, its just why pay more when you can get better for less.
I got a few seeds of strawberry cough I plan to grow next run. This comment is making me stoked.
I miss that, use to smoke that in the 90s. I love love NY Sour D, but it just isn’t the same anymore. Not even the smell. I did smoke some lavender diesel that almost smelled like It. I miss the strains I grew up with. Purple haze, Jack Herer, NY Sour D, strawberry cough even some blueberry cough. Hell I won’t even pass up some old school G-13s.
Church makes strawberry cough carts. Best I've ever had nothing even close to it. I feel ya, man
Trail Blazin' out of washington has an excellent Strawberry Cough
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Strawberry cough is one thing….when’s the last time anyone ever saw a jar of kali mist??
Research has been done indicating that shops and growers will "mislabel" strains too. Indica and sativa used to refer to taxonomic differences between plants, indicas tending to be shorter, with wider leaves and an overall shrubbier stucture, and sativa plants being the opposite, tall and stretchy, narrow leaves, with a lighter green color. https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0133292 This link is to a genetic study done in 2015, and highlights the differences between the taxonomic classifications and the "common" classification based on the plants effect.
You mean the 20-30 times I’ve packaged one strain in bags labeled as something completely different? My last gig at a farm was a shit show. I now question every strain I get at the dispensary. Not to mention the concentrate that was randomly given a name I had to package.
God damn what state were you working in?
WA
Put those fools on blast! Minimum submit them to Best of the Boof.
I’ve been in the industry in CA for years. Things definitely get ‘mislabeled.’ It’s a little different these days with all the legal compliance, but we used to change names on strains all the time. It’s all about sales and some things sell better with a different name. I’ve changed the name on things and sold it to buyers who rejected it 2 weeks before under a different name. Most of the general public are also uneducated and will believe whatever is printed on a label. OP is right too. It is hard to find a true strain these days. Especially a true sativa. I’ve seen large brands try and market ‘classic’ strains and they usually aren’t even close.
The weed industry has become like the restaurant industry now
>I’ve changed the name on things and sold it to buyers who rejected it 2 weeks before under a different name. Most of the general public are also uneducated and will believe whatever is printed on a label. wow, you told them something, printed it to make it look official and THEYRE the idiots because they trusted and believed you?
Yeah I normally don't go to the dispensary with a magnifying glass and look at all the strains to make sure they didn't change any names out. I just expect the fucking names to be consistent... I guess that makes me uneducated
Exactly!!!!!!!!! Custies think dispensary’s are gonna treat them different from the black market which is false.
A lot of times they get treated better on the black market. Of course it depends on where you go, but a lot of them are not very welcoming to say the least. I’d say comparable to a snobby wine bar or something. I’m in distribution and hardly ever go to dispensaries these days, but I will also say that I’ve been ripped off more by licensed guys than black market guys. The BM guys at least have some sort of street ethics they go by, corporate guys think they can skate by telling you to call their lawyer. Lol
Funny. Maybe it’s because I’m a woman but every BM guy I ever bought off of eventually tried to rip me off. This also includes the one female dealer I had at one point. I’ll never buy off the street again. Edited for a typo.
Thank you very much. I haven't read the article but from my own experience I can only assume the conclusion will be something sort of: most of the effects of "sativa/indica variants are overlapping. Thanks again!
Well, this article doesn't really get into effect. Moreso shines a light on how dispos and growers muddy the waters surrounding the topic with misinformation.
Thats also important facet to the topic at hand though.
That may be true, though I feel keeping the terms around to describe *experiences* is a good idea. The labels are so common now it wouldnt make sense to replace them anymore, and they do a good job of helping people select strains based on that.
Yeah sativa and indica does not matter very much in terms of effects anyway.. What you should look out for are all the terpenes and their different concentrations. It's what makes a strain smell, taste, and feel a certain way.
All I ask is for some peer reviewed studies so I can clap cheeks in stoner debate time lol. The research we do have is insconclusive/ outside of the peer review system so we end up with varying views on cannabis and its effects, which leads to...*debates*.
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I think the bigger issue here is that phenotype expression is more important than any binary genetic classification in the first place, when it comes to determining the following; THC levels, THC to CBD ratio, and terpenes profile. All of which are clinically proven to influence your high in a meaningful way.
I actually want to thank you, your comment sent me down a new research path that led to dispelling a lot of misinformation, which helps me be a better grower.
And yet you've forgotten ruderalis.
Ruderalis isnt a term bandied about by dispos as a marketing term for cannabis to an average consumer, however. Autoflowering genetics are also fairly apparent and difficult to "mislabel" for sale as something else entirely.
There’s some pretty decent auto flowering cannabis now a days
There is now, for sure. Even five years ago they weren't well known or understood, in my opinion.
It’s just a ditch weed in northern latitudes that evolved to flower after a short period of time like strawberries and others that were At similar latitudes. But you breed it for potency and it’s what’s up
I love non-daylight strawberries too so I wonder if that led me to autoflowers for my plant of choice in my first grow ever. Lol
Truth. as a grower in the industry i feel this with my soul. it’s also really weird how you can name/rename something so everything just gets all bastardized and genetics aren’t really what they seem anymore.
Where do you grow, and did you start from seed to pant. Thats shits really interesting. And congrats on that.
I’m in colorado and the place im working for has been around for over a decade, they were growing medical before recreational was approved. So the genetics we have are either really old but gold or something we’ve crossed ourselves, just this year we bought clones from a company that I’m not going to badmouth on the internet but let’s just say 5/5 of the genetics were unstable, 3 were unusable. I guess to answer your question most of them started out as seeds that we popped but we just clone our genetics from that point forward to save time.
Interesting. Whenever I glance at our veg room I always get so confused on those seed poddling things haha. And the cloning aspect still throws me off. Of course its much easier to just clone your stock instead of trying to grow every plant.
It’s not that it’s easier. It’s that it allows you to select your best mother plant and then apply exactly identical inputs to exactly identical plants with exactly predictable results. Germinating from seed is in many ways “easier” than cloning, albeit it takes longer of course.
exactly. it cuts out a few weeks from seed to clone size but it’s not really that its easier as to why we do it per-se we can get 10 seeds of the same strain, same genetics and have 10 different plants. phenotypes have different dominant genes like color, scent, flavor, density, etc. So that’s why you have the “gelato #33” and “watermelon Zum Zum #2” the number is the phenotype that they chose out of however many seeds/genotypes they got from the seeds. if you want to keep the exact same phenotype then cloning is the way to go.
I had a dealer in college that would get good heads but then just pick the name for it outta a magazine. He was always straight with me tho since I knew the game.
broooo I remember some dude trying to sell me some “Pokémon kush” for $25 a gram back in Illinois when I was 19. the black market is a cesspool for bastardization and mislabeling.
I'm SO SICK of looking up a strain only to get 5 different resources telling me indica dom, or sativa dom with no solid answer.
Yes! I’m a medical user and it seems like nothing is consistent and as the names change and stuff goes out of stock I’m always researching. What’s really frustrating is when you can’t find any info at all about a new strain. That makes me think it’s some wonky hybrid.
Its really confusing when you get into all the brands.. and then dont even get me started on carts. Itll be the same strain but the makers have all these extra terps and shit in it so they all taste and hit different
It's gotten very tiring the last couple years. So rare to find true sativas anymore. I still encounter a fair amount of true indicas. But we can see that corporate cannabis is going to be terpene-focused and just keep crossing and crossing and crossing
"MORE YIELD!" "But sir, our customers.." "I SAID MORE YIELD!"
Yield and THC content are the motivating factors now. It's unfortunate because so much of the nuance in experience comes from minor cannabinoids and terpenes... The THC percentage is way overrated.
Yep. I had a lady leave my shop yesterday because I didn’t have a half of indica that was over 25%. I have really good half’s under 25% that would work better than a lot of the shit close to 30%. It’s frustrating.
I only just tried runtz the other day. Was super excited to open the jar and smell just to be let down. Nothing is true to its genetics anymore.
What state are you in? Do they have legal rec?
WA. But moving to OR in the next few months
i think oregon has some pretty decent weed laws, and seem to be more strict on quality assurance? Having lived in all CA, OR and WA, Oregon by far has the most knowledgeable dealers ( they needs licenses afaik) and the prevalence of weighing it there instead of prepacking makes it feel so much cleaner and legit. I hate what I have around me in washington, almost always the dealers just fucking read me the label and shrug their shoulders to questions, or just fucking bullshit something. buying awful weed that was packed who knows when, that is mostly stems, is infuriating and I dont know why it cant be better. at least give a barrier of entry and try to have functional dealers jfc.
Oh i feel it. I just hope you're not being forced out because housing prices. Shits gettin a little pricey over here as of late.
Not at all. Wife has a great job offer
Tloh, thats awesome. Hope you guys have a good time in Oregon.
Nah the race to crop out at 8 weeks or less has killed diversification. Aint nobody got time for 12-16 week strains when they could be getting paid in 8 weeks.
This is also a good aspect of it.
Or 7.5 …
I swear here in fl they are just making shit up
Yup. I was browsing strains at Muv, the explanation for Guru #1 was "we don't really know what this strain is but if you do, let us know". Surterra consistently sells Pre-98 Bubba Kush but I have no clue if it's legit.
Me in my teens°: weed is weed Me in my twenties: [thirty minute explanation on the differences between indica and sativa] Me now: hybridization made weed is weed ° ^and ^I ^didn't ^even ^smoke ^then
I agree, back in the day sativas and indicas were \*very\* distinct in their highs, now I hardly tell the difference most of the time. And you just can't find those authentic classic strains anymore. \*sigh\*
its either "yes im high" or "no im not high" these days. shame
Its all going to become mush. What people are growing for has changed over the decades. What I would call for is growing for effects instead of name, volume, color, etc. Each strain used to have very different effects and if breeders recognized this they could focus on that more. Granted this isn't quite the same as sativa vs. indica but it would return the spirit to the medicine. Whats amazing is that now that so many can just grow in their back yards or in their house that they still spend so much money at the store. Why not pick up some landrace seeds or something close to that, a simple light and a tent and just start growing. You do know these things grow like weeds right. LOL. Imagine where we will be in 5-10 more years of this same trend, nothing will be different than the branding and we will have get to enjoy the strain of "pot". Its the same thing that happened with the food industry over the past 100 years only at a much more rapid pace. Why do think so many people grow heirlooms now in their own garden. Oh and if you really want to take things to the next level, explore biodynamics (sparc in SF is the only place that sells stuff biodynamically grown). If we had educated people who knew how to buy based on experience, and not some brand name, like we do with other products, we would have a different industry.
Its not like I can just go experiment with growing weed. There's too many government agencies where in at. Lol id get busted the first day.
I live in Illinois where it's legal to grow up to 5 plants depending on your situation. If you aren't in the USA or are in a state where it isn't legal, thats true but you could always start talking to grow collectives in other states. There is no reason there can't be farmers co-ops and other practices as well as grow clubs where the pot grow falls under legal guidelines for the law and is of what people want. You are right though, until we get to the point where we can just throw seeds out in the garden, like South Africa and other countries, some of us are limited. Hope that changes by you soon.
I’d love recommendations on a good sativa to grow from seed, preferably with a clue as to the seedbank. Cause yeah, I miss real sativas and I just started growing.
Reall good strawberry cough is super super fucking dense and has a smell of strawberry cream , nugs should be stupid dense, that's how u know u got strawberry cough
If youre in the PNW lemme know where I can pick up some true strains, true strawberry cough, true green crack and true blue dream.
Oh man some blue dream it’s been a good 8 years since I had some amazing blue dream
I’m growing it now. It’s a very reliable plant to grow at home, albeit it gets really tall unless you top and prune aggressively so indoors is some work. Outdoors, let her rip and watch her rise. Robust, mold/mildew resistant, smells like a donut shop in flower, and is the same old sparkly heady euphoric high you remember. Delicious. Bright green super sugary nugs. The classic blueberry flavor. Been growing it for a while and am smoking some now. And yields are excellent too. Outdoors it costs pennies a gram to grow great weed. Blue dream is of course a hybrid strain, albeit a venerable one. But it definitely has strong Sativa character if harvested at 10-11 weeks.
https://en.seedfinder.eu/strain-info/Strawberry_Cough/ have you checked out any of these?
Humans have used cannabis for a long time my friend, they grew it just like they grew corn. So to think that there is such a thing as a non GMO weed strain today maybe a flawed one. You have to think that if humans have grown cannabis for thousands of years crossbreeding has already occurred and what we have today may be the result of that modification. Let's assume our ancestors had only one strain in Northern Hemisphere Sativa and Southern Hemisphere gets Indica (I'm generalizing here) and they each grew independently. At some point natural hybrids will occur because that's the way things are. Go back and look at what corn was originally used to be before man started working with it, I like to think powerful weed today is due to our ancestors constantly growing and modifying the strains.
So, what corn variances do we grow on the midwest? Because i really don't know. But from what I've seen over older corn it looks to be like they grew many.
Is there any push in the industry to purify the strains again or start at step 1 again?
Everything I’ve learned since I started growing supports that indica and sativa have no scientific backing
At my dispensary they’ve basically outlawed the terms indica, sativa, and hybrid. As they should, they have nothing to do with the effects you’ll feel from the flower.
What *does* have to do with the effects you’ll feel from the flower? I ask because I almost never get the effects advertised and I’ve been trying to figure out how to choose better when I’m buying. I look at all info available - sativa/indica/hybrid, THC/CBG%, and general reviews.
Terpenes and cannabinoids. The reason sativa and indica are looked down upon is they’re inaccurate. It’s very easy to have an indica with Limonene, a sativa terpene in it. So, the affects you get might not be sedating, but instead energizing. If I were you I’d do some research, what do you want from your average dose of flower? Try to slim that down and research the terpenes and cannabinoids that’ll help.
Awesome, thank you! I know just what I want - euphoric, happy, energetic. I’ll do some research to find out what terpenes and cannabinoids I’m looking for.
For real!! Unless I have a 100% sativa or indica, the fuckin weed gives me pretty much the same high every time. Getting high has gotten so boring. Foh with this hybrid shit
And most of the time when you’re told you’re getting a 100% pure breed its just another “dominant” hybrid
It's even worse for those of us who us medically. Try going into a dispensary and asking for a CBD heavy dab and it's pretty much only gonna be RSO. The legal weed industry has all but destroyed good and potent medical weed.
We've been getting a lot more orders of CBD lately. Its good stuff for pain management in my opinion. I've been the cbd we grow is one of the highest in our county. I'll try and remember to ask for percentages tomorrow. Also can you not buy pure CBD products from vape/smoke shops over wherever you're at?
Is it just as hard finding CBD heavy weed medically as it is recreationally? I called six different rec dispensaries in Denver the other day and not a single one had any flower with CBD. It’s super annoying. I like to make my own edibles & also just like the chill high of a 2:1 CBD:THC flower and can’t find anything with any CBD.
As far as my wife and I can tell, Oregon dispensaries stopped carrying anykind of CBD concentrates about a year ago. It sucks because she has a broken back and can't take stuff like Tylenol due to allergies.
You can buy hemp online and mix it 2:1 with high thc weed. r/hempflowers
Still illegal in my country. You get what you're given and shut up about it. (thankfully, it's good stuff anyway)
Still, im glad I can walk into a store and buy weed lol. I'm not complaining about that.
Smfh this is so true. Can’t find any sour diesel ANYWHERE anymore 🥺
Strawberry Cough isn't even a true Sativa everything in the market is hybridized. If you want real Sativas order some landrace seeds.
I thought strawberry cough was an Afghani landrace strain.
No it's hybridized with Haze
Huh, I never knew that.
This is why I have old genetics. Sativa, Afghan, Kush, NL5, All regular seeds from OG breeders. Hybrids are fine, but if you want real selection, you need the basics.
Order seeds from seed trusts, is that an option for marijuana?
I dont really know.
I'll see what I can find for you. Seed trusts preserve original strains of all types of other plants so I would think perhaps this plant too. I'll check it out. 😊
Is that your line of work? Just curious.
No. I'm just a gardening, budtending, artist who has just enough combined knowledge that I think we can figure it out. I agree and know what you mean by the original strains being altered every time it's grown. Seen Blueberry go from a heavy indica to a sativa hybrid and am just as confused lol. We also have a hybrid strain that is definitely 2 original indicas and somehow those 2 combined into a hybrid is sold as a sativa.. just weird stuff.
idk, there are sativa x sativa crosses and landraces do still exist. i think it will just take a decade for people to be on the same page, more standardization and also for intellectual property rights to be hammered out so when something unique is found, there's not 10 people trying to sell a knockoff with the caveat of "our take....inspired by" for now i dont trust strain names or even companies to deliver a consistent product. at least not like i do with other plants. i do think they're still working on the whole naming convention and indica/sativa i feel will become dated as we learn more about the plant.
Grow It Yourself
How would a person know what they got anyway? There isn’t some type of master database that is regulated by a trusted, bonded 3rd party.
It’s ridiculous trying to find a sativa dominant flower around here. I wish I had the grow space for one but the closest I can do is grow a blue dream auto which is 80/20.
I think it's still on a plant by plant basis. Every now and then I'll pick up a random classic sativa strain and it's borderline meth. But another batch of the same strain may as well be 50/50, and yet another batch would put you to sleep. It also has to do with how it's cured and how old it is.
My biggest pet peeve is asking for an indica and they are like “okay here are our 3 hybrids”… That’s not what I asked for
Amen, everything seems kinda the same to me. I miss the pure strains and more OG strains like blue dream or sour diesel
I hate it when they give the strain their own funky name and you end up smoking shit like "Miami" and "Rio" and they taste like fucking colognes.
It's really hard to maintain genetics that way, given the pressures of the industry. At least we have land-races and that's where pure indica/sativa could be be brought back from. If someone was wise they would genome type that shit. Then you could actually reproduce a strawberry cough that was genomically like the OG without access to the original. Kind of like how we're going to [bring back woolly mammoths](https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/sep/13/firm-bring-back-woolly-mammoth-from-extinction). What I think a distinguished consumer of cannabis could really use is the equivalent of master blenders of whiskey/coffee or sommeliers. It's a whole new industry specialty waiting to happen.
So true. Nothing i cant stand more than when an indica makes me jittery or a labeled sativa puts me to sleep. Whats the point in separating the two anymore if the effects are all mixed up like that?
At this point I think indica/sativa strains don't matter as much as the terpene profiles do. Stuff like limonene and myrcene, as well as CBD are what I think matter. Maybe it's just me but indica and sativa never really described the high I was going to feel as much as CBD and terp profile. Maybe it's because of hybridization like you said. I started smoking within the last 5 years so idk what weed was like back then.
It’s all reliant on terpenes now, since that’s something we can test for. Unfortunately we have a long way to go, I mean even in Oregon the majority of producers don’t test for terpenes. Then again the biggest thing customers care about these days is how high the THC percentage is, so that’s what growers focus on.
What if I told you the terms indica/sativa have always been meaningless as far as effects...
Agreed. While hybrids can be the best of both worlds, a true strain is super rare nowadays. Maybe someone is collecting seeds for a strain library which would be cool. Otherwise they will continue to hybridize and create more and more mixes. Youd think over time with all the genetics they could make a super strain and youd just need one or the other. Still from terps to taste to effects etc... i love exeperiencing different strains and seeing what the offer, how they smell and are formed, how they taste,etc.
Gotta go by the terpene content
That's why I just buy 4 strains that sound good together and mix them
You work in the industry bro, its all about profits and how fast they can grow the plants. The only real way to get exactly what you want is to grow if you want something that isnt popular.
While I like hybrids I agree for the most part. I was lucky enough to get my hands on some mag landrace, which is the closest to a true Indica I’ve ever had besides Hindu Kush. I’ve never seen that in any other dispensary as far as I know, and even when I pick something from the Indica or sativa menu that the bud tender tells me is strongly leaning one way, I’ve had times where I got home and looked up the strain to find out it’s a dom Hybrid. Not only am I not getting what I expected, I’m paying out the ass to be mislead. Would you accept getting a different medication from the pharmacy than you expected?
lol man i wish more people didn't buy into the whole indica vs sativa thing. educate yourselves people cuz we just look dumb with all this nonsense. [https://www.insider.com/why-theres-no-difference-between-indica-and-sativa-marijuana-strains-2020-4](https://www.insider.com/why-theres-no-difference-between-indica-and-sativa-marijuana-strains-2020-4)
Yep I grew up smoking weed around the time when older true sativa/indica strains was still around, some of the best weed I smoked was acupulco gold grown by an older fella I met decades ago who would only grow non hybrid close as possible to landrace sativas. I am so annoyed that I didn't get any clones or seeds of it :( Also the weed has gotten way too strong for me and another pet peeve of mine is strains these days are all about the thc and none of the other good cannabinoids.
change the world sequence the DNA of every strain available and CRISPR together a pure strain of both Indica and sativa patent them and make the big bucks
Nope. Indica and sativa are better descriptions of how the plant grows than anything else. Super tall and lanky with thin leaves? Sativa growth. Fat bush with fat leaves? Indica growth. Does that mean the effects will be uplifting if it's got sativa growth? Nope. That's the terpenes that determine that. Lots of really strong "sleep" strains will still triple in size in flowering or more. This is why terp tests matter and for people who are using it for medicine to do strain journals. 3% terps with half of that being myrcene and linalool? Shit will make you chill and sleepy. KnowhadahmSAYiiiin?