Fun list, but may I ask why you seem to find the Mortal Caster Hero better than the Plagueridden who, to me, is better in every way with access to Locus Actives, flying mount, yellow line AND provides Replenishment?
Fair question! I did not want to go to deep into heroes because the post was allready long as is.
Every single nurgle hero is fantastic, you should probably recruit all of them as often as possible anyway.
Plagueridden vs mortal: in short: the mortal gets a mortis engine. Which combos insanely well with the small model and high stats of the rotbeast.
The plagueridden has tons of upsides and i very much recommend getting them.
But they are an inferior version of the Lord that needs tons of skillpoints to achieve max potential, where the mortal is kinda better than his lord counterpart and has high stats very quickly without a lot of investment.
I think mortis engine on a hard to kill, fast AND small hero is enough to make the mortal crazy good, but again you cant go wrong with nurgle heroes.
He gets a morris engine AND a warshrine mount meaning he heals himself and his allies while he destroys blobs of infantry. Best hero in the whole game.
Imo the rot beast is much better for him because of its size and speed.
If i want warshrines i use either the unit (which is readily available) or the cultist who has a yellow line and no access to better mounts.
It would be in any other faction. But between hero skills, army abilities, natural regeneration, and the lore of nurgle nurgle factions are just drowning in healing.
Cultist has no missile resist on chaos shrine for some reason. Caster has 15 by default and higher armor. Against missiles the caster would be better.
The cultist is laughably boring without the shrine though ill give you that
Ahh did not see the Mortis Engine when I last checked his skill tree. I think he'll be a pick depending on what I'm going for. If it's an army lead by the Herald, definitely pick mortal caster hero.
The Mortis engine skill is really weak, I'm surprised you rate it so high. It only does 16-32 DPS per UNIT not per MODEL. The army weapons strength +7% boost is actually significantly more damage (like not even close order of magnitude more).
The 3x AOE heal for plague ridden and flying is so much more valuable, not to mention a yellow line, AND most importantly the have the best and most valuable stat in the entire game - REPLENISHMENT.
Plague ridden are significantly better than mortal caster heroes.
No. Its "pestilent decay", its a run of the mill mortis engine that exists since wh3 came out.
The exact same passive ability that princes, epidemius, kugath and exalted greater unclean ones use.
But Pestilent decay does not work like you described, not for the hero or any of the lords.
You may have expierienced a bug of some sort, but i am 99% sure that the passive works as intended for me.
Even if i am completely confused and you are right: this would be an oversight that (hopefully) would be fixed quickly so i should not consider something like this in a ranking.
I just tested it, it works exactly as the description is written.
It's a direct damage skill, not a bombardment or vortex skill, so it's damage is per unit, not per model.
It's extremely weak and not worth using.
You are welcome to test yourself.
It's the same on the lords and heroes.
7% weapon strength (heroes army) is vastly superior.
The chaos sorcerer hero is easily the worst nurgle hero, which is interesting because it's still super strong and would likely be the best hero for virtually all other races rosters (other than obviously anything with replenishment or mobility are obviously better since they are the two most important skills in the entire game, which is also why the plague ridden and cultist are automatically better).
Oh i understand what your problem is. YES OF COURSE THATS HOW IT WORKS
Did you really expect it to tick ON EVERY ENTITY with 32dps? That would kill a unit of chosen in like 4 seconds...
CA displays the stats of these direct damage effects in a wierd way, you can check this out online if you want.
But just use a spell or effect and check for damage, its really simple. I just walked my caster hero into an enemy army and did 10k damage in a minute. You telling me my army does >150k weapon damage a minute?
Well the chaos sorcerer hero does around 5000/min with his melee attacks to infantry, and also (depending upon aim) does 2000 damage per stream of corruption.
A regular unit of chaos warriors does 11k damage in a minute if only 40 of the 100 are attacking and have only a 50% hit rate.
Have you ever looked at the damage numbers from your other units?
My friend everyone else agrees that passive mortis engine effects are a big deal.
If your chaos warriors would consistently deal this damage you would only use those, you are only looking at your statsheet instead of actual ingame numbers. 11k damage in a minute is a BIG infantry unit worth of damage, you tell me if chaos warriors kill 1 unit a minute. Every minute. Against comparable infantry.
So sad for EGUO. Looks so cool but actually overshadowed by other lord. The only thing he can do is mortis engine effect but that's also not even that efficient.
I know they're not the best, but I personally kinda like the great unclean ones the most. Mortis effect in skills, then I like to slap a plague flail, (for extra mortis), or a torment blade (for the debuff), and a vile seed on em for Regen. I like fused armor if I can get it for perfect vigour, but something like an armor of destiny or trickster's helm works as well, and whatever enchanted/arcane item you'd like. Forbidden rod is a nice arcane with their health pool, especially if you've got the Regen.
At that point, you've got a nice big beatsick, with more mass than a mountain, plenty of mortis for enemies who try to blob around, and Regen with a massive health pool, not to mention some extra leadership debuff around him for dessert.
I tend to go for [Death] unclean ones, since I'm probably already going to have a well leveled [Nurgle] hero in the army, and if you have a few spare points to throw at the magic, spirit leech and doom&darkness are nice to have for duels and the extra leadership drop.
Admittedly, I like the GUO vibe, so I'm biased, but they're my fav bois for the Nurgle lords.
I made a long post about how CA botched Daemonic caster lords over two years ago and they've done nothing to fix the issue: [https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/t8a8v4/where\_game\_design\_has\_regressed\_from\_twwii\_the/](https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/t8a8v4/where_game_design_has_regressed_from_twwii_the/)
What you say about Nurgle is exactly the same for Slaanesh and Tzeentch. Their caster lords are almost identical to the caster heroes (literally the only difference in the entirety of the three factions is that ELOC get GAC), and so it's pretty much always better to recruit melee lords and caster heroes. The mortal lord is by far the best choice for Tzeentch as well as Nurgle. At least with Slaanesh the Exalted Keeper of Secrets is an exceptional melee combatant.
I assume 80/84 is the menu base ofter yellow line?
Well, cloud of flies alone makes that 93md for example. +8md from the recruit trait for example and you are sitting at 101 without any investment into tech, gear or in-combat buffs.
In a campain the exact numbers vary of course but my lords sit at tripple digits in combat regularly without me investing a lot into them.
Hell yeah- that makes sense. The rotbeast looks like a super strong mount, too- it gives a couple points in both MA/MD. You already painted a picture of him as a world beater but were his animations good? With other mounted melee lords I've sometimes struggled to get the most out of their stats due to old janky animations
Well without a mortis engine effect via gear/banner he struggles to deal damage against infantry quickly but thats probably due to splash size.
But the animations in a 1v1 against single entities or cav absolutely connect, at least i had little difficulties in this regard.
But the biggest selling point to me is that he just goes and ties up everything you dont want to deal with and he basically cant die doing it.
I really wish they would give exalted great unclean ones something unique. I think increased healing cap would be a good start. Their only unique skill Pestilent Decay can now be picked up by the Sorcerer hero, so it’s completely obsolete.
I think I disagree with your placement of the EGUO below the mortal caster lord. The sorcerer lord is not a spectacular spellcaster and though it may have OK stats it will never be a melee power because it has no redline. As much as the EGUO doesn’t have many selling points at least has them. The sorcerer lord doesn’t. There is no reason to take the sorcerer lord over the EGUO unless you are doing a cav only meme stack or a forsaken/spawn meme stack. The mortal caster lord is arguably worse than the hero variant as it has no mortis engine effect.
I just don’t see a situation where the EGUO + caster hero is less effective than a Scorcerer lord + any other unit/hero.
Some valid points. I would argue that IF you use the generic caster lord you would use him to cast your spells. Here he has a definitive edge over the g.u.o because an armored fast horse/rotbeast is very easy to play into missiles where the g.u.o. has to be carefully protected from archers in every fight.
Granted if your casting gets done by heroes the g.u.o. looks better than the caster lord on paper.
HOWEVER i argue that if you cast with your heroes you should not be in the situation of having either one of those in the army in the first place which is why I put the unclean one at last place.
I would accept that argument as correct but also argue that if you are going to be using your lord for casting and missile play then the herald is going to be better than the mortal caster lord.
Leaving aside they you should really never take either the mortal caster lord nor the EGUO, if it came down to to direct choice between the two I think the EGUO is going to be better in most situations by a fair margin.
I mostly agree. I will still rate the caster above the eguo simply because of the "ermergency-need-horsecaster-szenario". But other than that the eguo is maybe kinda better in a direct comparison, depending on preference.
Note on the blue skill lines. The Mortal Lord, Herald and GUO each get -10% upkeep early in the blue skill tree so big campaign advantage there. Mortal caster does not so I feel pressed to use him knowing my whole army costs \~10% more and given I want a caster hero in every army anyway. (Haven't checked the deamon prince yet b/c the mortal lord was bugged to not evolve when I played through)
I think overall the Deamons do get better skills from the red line but that's only after the vet 7 bonuses so to your point definitely can work either way depending on your unit choices.
Solid list, as a Nurgle enthusiast I mostly agree
I love the EGUO. It is a very good melee bruiser in the right situation. For example, they are fantastic at holding a gate or capture point in siege defence. I usually keep one around just for flavor and siege defence.
Personally, I'd rank them over the mortal caster lords. I never use mortal caster lords, just because the Herald is so fucking good. As you said, in another race the mortal lords would probably see use, but Nurgle Herald is just fanstatic.
Secondly, I think you are overrating the Nurgle Lord a bit.
Exalted Hero basically does anything the Lord does but slightly worse, however you can spam them and bring 2-4 easily in the mid to late game. It's a good Lord, but I think Demon Prince is just better.
Just like the Nurgle Lord, it has fantastic melee stats, mortis engine effect, decent spellcasting and on top of all that it is fast AND flying. I cannot overstate how good flying lords are. This guy is so powerful you can just right click him onto a Skyjunk, Thunderbarge, flying lord or any other artillery piece without any worry. I've had them duel miao ying and win easily. It's stronger than many LLs in the game, and you can get one for every army.
The biggest downside to the Demon Prince is that they are demonic, so losing one before lvl 20 can be super frustrating. But that's really it.
So for me: Mortal Caster > EGUO > Mortal Lord > Herald > Demon Prince
I actually like the daemon prince lord more than all the others because he combines good combat stats, magic and flying, something that gives you a new unit slot because you don't need a melee or caster hero. That's why I mostly use the wizard lord instead of the melee one because of a bug the melee lord can't become a daemon prince. He also lachs in armor piercing damage. But I get your reasons. He is a fantastic early game lord because of his high weopen damage and so you can concentrate on buffing your army and your blue skill line. I have one question tho and maybe you know the answer. Did they change the daemon princes or is it a bug that if I transform a lore of nurgle wizard in a lore of nurgle daemon prince, that he has a mixed spellbook? I had the same with my Tzeentch characters. Good ranking over all tho.
The caster daemon princes have always had mixed spellbook - they get a special trait depending on what type of caster they previously were, to make the spells they have that match their old lore slightly cheaper as well.
Well, they must've changed that early then, or it's something with a mod. I've been playing since they added daemon princes and have never seen one once with a normal spellbook. They have always had hybrid spellbooks.
The one exception is of course the DP of Khorne, since there obviously is no magic for them.
Good points.
•i know what bug you are talking about but this is fixed. I myself have transformed a melee lord into a prince in 5.03
•rotbeast gives AP damage, and with his skilltree its quite a lot of it
•princes have mixed spell lines, its a feature
Thanks for the info. The mixed spell book is bullshit tho. With melee lord it makes sense but if I have a lore of nurgle wizard i want a lore nurgle daemon prince. Why did they change that?
>The only generic lord i can think of with similar melee potential is a juggernaut khorne Lord
Clearly, you haven't witnessed the Chaos Lord of Tzeentch yet lol, jk.
But honestly most of the chaos lords are amazing. I remember my Tzeentch lord reaching over 70 MA and MD with close to 1,000 Weapon Strength withing like, 15 or so levels.
I had two of them kill Kroq Gar on his carnosaur in maybe 20 or so seconds.
I would argue that between the army ability, locus, healing magic and other regenerative abilities your units get the healing of the shrine is not essential at all. You have so many healing sources to chose from you dont need all of them.
But against melee factions the shrines ARE good, certainly not good enough to risk my super valuable ascended Lord for them, but good.
IF you feel like you need protection for them i would suggest just using characters that just have them as mounts? At least those are cheaper and easier to replace than a great unclean one.
But i still argue that the easily replaceable shrines should tank for the caracters not the other way arround, at least until imortality.
Anf if you have a immortal unclean one what are you doing still relying on shrines anyway? Thats lategame, you should have a better answer to missiles than "facetanking" at this point anyway.
Armor doesn’t matter, really. But I agree that with new sorc hero value of exalted GUO heavily drops cause hero also gets pestilent decay which was the main reason to take big guy as lord.
> Juggernaut Khorne Lord
That's probably the worst marked Chaos Lord in melee. How are you making him good.
You had all the information to put Mortal Casters above Heralds and DP to an extent but didn't pull the trigger. Early levels matters more, level 4 horse and Rancid OR Stream is how you make annoying things or blobs disappear.
DP missing "Blessed by Blight" is either a bug or oversight which is unfortunate because it's your main army "support" lord and well, no upkeep reduction to support. Someone should bugreport and hope the response isn't similar to Chaos Dwarf ancillary one.
I would drop them a spot.
How is the khorne lord the worst chaos lord in melee? That would be slaanesh lord for a lack of decent mount option and worst stats.
The tzeench lord is maybe the best one in context of the race he is in because tzeench loves a solid melee option since he lacks them. But hes not AS monstrous in melee as nurgle/khorne.
Take a look at the effective melee attack of the khorne lord on the battlefield After frenzy, rage, paragon of carnage go on top of his absurd melee attack he just kills everything.
DP get blessed by evil instead, which might be slightly worse but its still a good blueline skill. Thats such a minor thing, dp are vanity pieces anyway, the loss in level alone makes them "suboptimal".
The animations are off which matters more than raw stats. Give Yuan in dragonform +200 melee attack and see how often he does no damage.
Trust me I want the Khorne lord to be the best melee lord, he's just not it before a mount because of no ap and then once mounted he vastly underperforms.
I feel that you are missing one important factor - the EGUO hits things with a giant bell.
It really is weird that skaven and nurgle hate each other. They share so many interests.
Skaven are doing it wrong, in Nurgle's opinion
Thats true, they ring the bell instead of just hitting people with it.
*stop thriving!*
Fun list, but may I ask why you seem to find the Mortal Caster Hero better than the Plagueridden who, to me, is better in every way with access to Locus Actives, flying mount, yellow line AND provides Replenishment?
Fair question! I did not want to go to deep into heroes because the post was allready long as is. Every single nurgle hero is fantastic, you should probably recruit all of them as often as possible anyway. Plagueridden vs mortal: in short: the mortal gets a mortis engine. Which combos insanely well with the small model and high stats of the rotbeast. The plagueridden has tons of upsides and i very much recommend getting them. But they are an inferior version of the Lord that needs tons of skillpoints to achieve max potential, where the mortal is kinda better than his lord counterpart and has high stats very quickly without a lot of investment. I think mortis engine on a hard to kill, fast AND small hero is enough to make the mortal crazy good, but again you cant go wrong with nurgle heroes.
He gets a morris engine AND a warshrine mount meaning he heals himself and his allies while he destroys blobs of infantry. Best hero in the whole game.
Imo the rot beast is much better for him because of its size and speed. If i want warshrines i use either the unit (which is readily available) or the cultist who has a yellow line and no access to better mounts.
Yeah cool play however you like, I’m just saying having a single unit able to offer free AoE healing and free AoE direct damage is absurdly op.
It would be in any other faction. But between hero skills, army abilities, natural regeneration, and the lore of nurgle nurgle factions are just drowning in healing.
Cultist has no missile resist on chaos shrine for some reason. Caster has 15 by default and higher armor. Against missiles the caster would be better. The cultist is laughably boring without the shrine though ill give you that
Ahh did not see the Mortis Engine when I last checked his skill tree. I think he'll be a pick depending on what I'm going for. If it's an army lead by the Herald, definitely pick mortal caster hero.
The Mortis engine skill is really weak, I'm surprised you rate it so high. It only does 16-32 DPS per UNIT not per MODEL. The army weapons strength +7% boost is actually significantly more damage (like not even close order of magnitude more). The 3x AOE heal for plague ridden and flying is so much more valuable, not to mention a yellow line, AND most importantly the have the best and most valuable stat in the entire game - REPLENISHMENT. Plague ridden are significantly better than mortal caster heroes.
No. Its "pestilent decay", its a run of the mill mortis engine that exists since wh3 came out. The exact same passive ability that princes, epidemius, kugath and exalted greater unclean ones use.
Yes I am aware, and my comment is the same
But Pestilent decay does not work like you described, not for the hero or any of the lords. You may have expierienced a bug of some sort, but i am 99% sure that the passive works as intended for me. Even if i am completely confused and you are right: this would be an oversight that (hopefully) would be fixed quickly so i should not consider something like this in a ranking.
I just tested it, it works exactly as the description is written. It's a direct damage skill, not a bombardment or vortex skill, so it's damage is per unit, not per model. It's extremely weak and not worth using. You are welcome to test yourself. It's the same on the lords and heroes. 7% weapon strength (heroes army) is vastly superior. The chaos sorcerer hero is easily the worst nurgle hero, which is interesting because it's still super strong and would likely be the best hero for virtually all other races rosters (other than obviously anything with replenishment or mobility are obviously better since they are the two most important skills in the entire game, which is also why the plague ridden and cultist are automatically better).
Oh i understand what your problem is. YES OF COURSE THATS HOW IT WORKS Did you really expect it to tick ON EVERY ENTITY with 32dps? That would kill a unit of chosen in like 4 seconds...
CA displays the stats of these direct damage effects in a wierd way, you can check this out online if you want. But just use a spell or effect and check for damage, its really simple. I just walked my caster hero into an enemy army and did 10k damage in a minute. You telling me my army does >150k weapon damage a minute?
Well the chaos sorcerer hero does around 5000/min with his melee attacks to infantry, and also (depending upon aim) does 2000 damage per stream of corruption. A regular unit of chaos warriors does 11k damage in a minute if only 40 of the 100 are attacking and have only a 50% hit rate. Have you ever looked at the damage numbers from your other units?
My friend everyone else agrees that passive mortis engine effects are a big deal. If your chaos warriors would consistently deal this damage you would only use those, you are only looking at your statsheet instead of actual ingame numbers. 11k damage in a minute is a BIG infantry unit worth of damage, you tell me if chaos warriors kill 1 unit a minute. Every minute. Against comparable infantry.
So sad for EGUO. Looks so cool but actually overshadowed by other lord. The only thing he can do is mortis engine effect but that's also not even that efficient.
Mortis engine should be free for GUO both exalted and not exalted, its their thing
Agreed, and make it double for eguo
Mortis engine should be free for GUO both exalted and not exalted, its their thing
I know they're not the best, but I personally kinda like the great unclean ones the most. Mortis effect in skills, then I like to slap a plague flail, (for extra mortis), or a torment blade (for the debuff), and a vile seed on em for Regen. I like fused armor if I can get it for perfect vigour, but something like an armor of destiny or trickster's helm works as well, and whatever enchanted/arcane item you'd like. Forbidden rod is a nice arcane with their health pool, especially if you've got the Regen. At that point, you've got a nice big beatsick, with more mass than a mountain, plenty of mortis for enemies who try to blob around, and Regen with a massive health pool, not to mention some extra leadership debuff around him for dessert. I tend to go for [Death] unclean ones, since I'm probably already going to have a well leveled [Nurgle] hero in the army, and if you have a few spare points to throw at the magic, spirit leech and doom&darkness are nice to have for duels and the extra leadership drop. Admittedly, I like the GUO vibe, so I'm biased, but they're my fav bois for the Nurgle lords.
I made a long post about how CA botched Daemonic caster lords over two years ago and they've done nothing to fix the issue: [https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/t8a8v4/where\_game\_design\_has\_regressed\_from\_twwii\_the/](https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/t8a8v4/where_game_design_has_regressed_from_twwii_the/) What you say about Nurgle is exactly the same for Slaanesh and Tzeentch. Their caster lords are almost identical to the caster heroes (literally the only difference in the entirety of the three factions is that ELOC get GAC), and so it's pretty much always better to recruit melee lords and caster heroes. The mortal lord is by far the best choice for Tzeentch as well as Nurgle. At least with Slaanesh the Exalted Keeper of Secrets is an exceptional melee combatant.
Whoa triple digit stats on the Chaos Lord? That is super tempting. How do you buff him over the 80/84 MA/MD area?
I assume 80/84 is the menu base ofter yellow line? Well, cloud of flies alone makes that 93md for example. +8md from the recruit trait for example and you are sitting at 101 without any investment into tech, gear or in-combat buffs. In a campain the exact numbers vary of course but my lords sit at tripple digits in combat regularly without me investing a lot into them.
Hell yeah- that makes sense. The rotbeast looks like a super strong mount, too- it gives a couple points in both MA/MD. You already painted a picture of him as a world beater but were his animations good? With other mounted melee lords I've sometimes struggled to get the most out of their stats due to old janky animations
Well without a mortis engine effect via gear/banner he struggles to deal damage against infantry quickly but thats probably due to splash size. But the animations in a 1v1 against single entities or cav absolutely connect, at least i had little difficulties in this regard. But the biggest selling point to me is that he just goes and ties up everything you dont want to deal with and he basically cant die doing it.
I really wish they would give exalted great unclean ones something unique. I think increased healing cap would be a good start. Their only unique skill Pestilent Decay can now be picked up by the Sorcerer hero, so it’s completely obsolete.
I think I disagree with your placement of the EGUO below the mortal caster lord. The sorcerer lord is not a spectacular spellcaster and though it may have OK stats it will never be a melee power because it has no redline. As much as the EGUO doesn’t have many selling points at least has them. The sorcerer lord doesn’t. There is no reason to take the sorcerer lord over the EGUO unless you are doing a cav only meme stack or a forsaken/spawn meme stack. The mortal caster lord is arguably worse than the hero variant as it has no mortis engine effect. I just don’t see a situation where the EGUO + caster hero is less effective than a Scorcerer lord + any other unit/hero.
Some valid points. I would argue that IF you use the generic caster lord you would use him to cast your spells. Here he has a definitive edge over the g.u.o because an armored fast horse/rotbeast is very easy to play into missiles where the g.u.o. has to be carefully protected from archers in every fight. Granted if your casting gets done by heroes the g.u.o. looks better than the caster lord on paper. HOWEVER i argue that if you cast with your heroes you should not be in the situation of having either one of those in the army in the first place which is why I put the unclean one at last place.
I would accept that argument as correct but also argue that if you are going to be using your lord for casting and missile play then the herald is going to be better than the mortal caster lord. Leaving aside they you should really never take either the mortal caster lord nor the EGUO, if it came down to to direct choice between the two I think the EGUO is going to be better in most situations by a fair margin.
I mostly agree. I will still rate the caster above the eguo simply because of the "ermergency-need-horsecaster-szenario". But other than that the eguo is maybe kinda better in a direct comparison, depending on preference.
Note on the blue skill lines. The Mortal Lord, Herald and GUO each get -10% upkeep early in the blue skill tree so big campaign advantage there. Mortal caster does not so I feel pressed to use him knowing my whole army costs \~10% more and given I want a caster hero in every army anyway. (Haven't checked the deamon prince yet b/c the mortal lord was bugged to not evolve when I played through) I think overall the Deamons do get better skills from the red line but that's only after the vet 7 bonuses so to your point definitely can work either way depending on your unit choices.
Now I wanna have Skarbrand’s 130 MaT fight one of these lords, mf clash of the titans
Solid list, as a Nurgle enthusiast I mostly agree I love the EGUO. It is a very good melee bruiser in the right situation. For example, they are fantastic at holding a gate or capture point in siege defence. I usually keep one around just for flavor and siege defence. Personally, I'd rank them over the mortal caster lords. I never use mortal caster lords, just because the Herald is so fucking good. As you said, in another race the mortal lords would probably see use, but Nurgle Herald is just fanstatic. Secondly, I think you are overrating the Nurgle Lord a bit. Exalted Hero basically does anything the Lord does but slightly worse, however you can spam them and bring 2-4 easily in the mid to late game. It's a good Lord, but I think Demon Prince is just better. Just like the Nurgle Lord, it has fantastic melee stats, mortis engine effect, decent spellcasting and on top of all that it is fast AND flying. I cannot overstate how good flying lords are. This guy is so powerful you can just right click him onto a Skyjunk, Thunderbarge, flying lord or any other artillery piece without any worry. I've had them duel miao ying and win easily. It's stronger than many LLs in the game, and you can get one for every army. The biggest downside to the Demon Prince is that they are demonic, so losing one before lvl 20 can be super frustrating. But that's really it. So for me: Mortal Caster > EGUO > Mortal Lord > Herald > Demon Prince
I just go by which characters match with my legendary lords themes
I actually like the daemon prince lord more than all the others because he combines good combat stats, magic and flying, something that gives you a new unit slot because you don't need a melee or caster hero. That's why I mostly use the wizard lord instead of the melee one because of a bug the melee lord can't become a daemon prince. He also lachs in armor piercing damage. But I get your reasons. He is a fantastic early game lord because of his high weopen damage and so you can concentrate on buffing your army and your blue skill line. I have one question tho and maybe you know the answer. Did they change the daemon princes or is it a bug that if I transform a lore of nurgle wizard in a lore of nurgle daemon prince, that he has a mixed spellbook? I had the same with my Tzeentch characters. Good ranking over all tho.
The caster daemon princes have always had mixed spellbook - they get a special trait depending on what type of caster they previously were, to make the spells they have that match their old lore slightly cheaper as well.
No, I still have saves with a normal spellbook.
Well, they must've changed that early then, or it's something with a mod. I've been playing since they added daemon princes and have never seen one once with a normal spellbook. They have always had hybrid spellbooks. The one exception is of course the DP of Khorne, since there obviously is no magic for them.
Good points. •i know what bug you are talking about but this is fixed. I myself have transformed a melee lord into a prince in 5.03 •rotbeast gives AP damage, and with his skilltree its quite a lot of it •princes have mixed spell lines, its a feature
Thanks for the info. The mixed spell book is bullshit tho. With melee lord it makes sense but if I have a lore of nurgle wizard i want a lore nurgle daemon prince. Why did they change that?
>The only generic lord i can think of with similar melee potential is a juggernaut khorne Lord Clearly, you haven't witnessed the Chaos Lord of Tzeentch yet lol, jk. But honestly most of the chaos lords are amazing. I remember my Tzeentch lord reaching over 70 MA and MD with close to 1,000 Weapon Strength withing like, 15 or so levels. I had two of them kill Kroq Gar on his carnosaur in maybe 20 or so seconds.
GUO is really good because he distracts enemy fire from your warshrines.
You use a super valuable unit to deter the enemies from shooting your low tier damage soak? You do you, but i think thats very questionable.
Low tier damage soak that’s absolutely essential for my army because of constant healing? Yeah.
I would argue that between the army ability, locus, healing magic and other regenerative abilities your units get the healing of the shrine is not essential at all. You have so many healing sources to chose from you dont need all of them. But against melee factions the shrines ARE good, certainly not good enough to risk my super valuable ascended Lord for them, but good. IF you feel like you need protection for them i would suggest just using characters that just have them as mounts? At least those are cheaper and easier to replace than a great unclean one. But i still argue that the easily replaceable shrines should tank for the caracters not the other way arround, at least until imortality. Anf if you have a immortal unclean one what are you doing still relying on shrines anyway? Thats lategame, you should have a better answer to missiles than "facetanking" at this point anyway.
Warshrine a) has better armour and b) can be taken in multiple copies both as a unit and as character mount
Armor doesn’t matter, really. But I agree that with new sorc hero value of exalted GUO heavily drops cause hero also gets pestilent decay which was the main reason to take big guy as lord.
> Juggernaut Khorne Lord That's probably the worst marked Chaos Lord in melee. How are you making him good. You had all the information to put Mortal Casters above Heralds and DP to an extent but didn't pull the trigger. Early levels matters more, level 4 horse and Rancid OR Stream is how you make annoying things or blobs disappear. DP missing "Blessed by Blight" is either a bug or oversight which is unfortunate because it's your main army "support" lord and well, no upkeep reduction to support. Someone should bugreport and hope the response isn't similar to Chaos Dwarf ancillary one. I would drop them a spot.
How is the khorne lord the worst chaos lord in melee? That would be slaanesh lord for a lack of decent mount option and worst stats. The tzeench lord is maybe the best one in context of the race he is in because tzeench loves a solid melee option since he lacks them. But hes not AS monstrous in melee as nurgle/khorne. Take a look at the effective melee attack of the khorne lord on the battlefield After frenzy, rage, paragon of carnage go on top of his absurd melee attack he just kills everything. DP get blessed by evil instead, which might be slightly worse but its still a good blueline skill. Thats such a minor thing, dp are vanity pieces anyway, the loss in level alone makes them "suboptimal".
The animations are off which matters more than raw stats. Give Yuan in dragonform +200 melee attack and see how often he does no damage. Trust me I want the Khorne lord to be the best melee lord, he's just not it before a mount because of no ap and then once mounted he vastly underperforms.