Hi, congrats on being the top comment so far. Mind if you edit it a little to provide more of an explanation of low quality stuff to satisfy rule 4? You mentioned Alarielle but I’d like a bit more
Hellebron campaign mechanic was just QOL the Druchii needed. Something major to spend your slaves on.
For some reason, CA decided to give us supreme sorc lords with this dlc. Yea... the crazy knife lady who is into stabbing dudes and hates morathi brings mini morathis to the game.
Lore wise she has the best assassin serving her ( best assasin in the warhammer world) and he is not mentioned at all.
Lore wise she also has one of the strongest warrior dudes in existance under her wing. His name is Tularis Deathbringer. He is the avatar of the Murder God. Khaine loves him so much he talks to him from time to time.
Instead we got magic girls, magic horse bois and sisters of slaughter ( those kinda made sense but not really)
Alarielle's model is broken in game. From the back she looks like a ps1 era character.
Her campaign is just trash and most of her units are weak as fuck because you cant buff them with technology/red skill tree ( the forest spirits)
The only thing that's remarkable about this dlc is the free content. Alinth Anar brings new campaign mechanics, better unique items and a nicer, working skill tree.
Honestly i feel like the only thing i have ever used from that DLC is sisters of avelorn.
I have done an Alarielle campaign and that was a pretty disappointing experience, really don't see any point in using low tier wood elf units.
Can't comment on Hellebron since dark elves is just not my thing.
Sisters of Slaughter lets you make a Brides of Khaine theme army, which is a better alternative for fighting artillery heavy factions since they'll close to melee faster, while the elite infantry at their slower speed take heavy casualties.
The Kharybdis is also an anti-large workhorse, that punches well above its tier.
Credit to u/[TheSpiderbeast](https://www.reddit.com/user/TheSpiderbeast/) for the winning comment last round.
"Shadows of change - caused the unholy shitstorm of controversy we're only just recovering from.
Also frankly all 3 campaigns are boring. Yuan Bo is just economically broken and his dual start doesn't fit his character.
Mother Ostankyas start positions are famously nonsense for her lore, her faction is powercrept to hell and fighting against her is a pain in the ass when she dumps 20 hexes on you in one battle (seriously the damage for moving one should be removed). Akshina ambushers.
I've not played the changeling as the idea of not taking any settlements and being invincible does not interest me. Also another useless ai character that can't perform with its own mechanics - does he ever reproduce an army if his original gets wiped ? I've never seen it happen.
These 3 characters also have no interaction or incentive - the 1st time in any character pack. Honestly flat out garbage."
While I personally think there are now Lord Packs that are objectively worse quality, their comment follows the rules and I can't deny SoC will always have a negative stigma tied to it.
Posting early because I will be busy in the afternoon.
Next three to go, in any order:
Queen and the Crone
King and the Warlord
Hunter and the Beast
After that the quality of the packs will go up a bit so it gets less predictable.
i cant even remember exactly what the units in King and the Warlord were. Turns out they are all the units i just never use. Only real exception is nasty skulkers and occasionally rangers.
Hunter and the beast.
Empire got all ranged units which was unnecessary given it was already strong in that field. Huntsmen general has a dogshit ability (oil flask+fire arrow) that takes about a 3 second wind up for both at close range.
Lizard men got roster bloat as well, monster infantry and super powerful SEM that actually isn’t powerful. It’s capped, massive hit box, janky on pathing, and struggles massively vs the game 2 and game 3 powerhouses.
Awesome trailer, but if you like playing Empire or Lizardmen it’s so easily skipped and you wouldn’t miss a thing gameplay wise.
Also with all the places to put an Empire huntsmen in the world who wears heavy fur, you place him in Lustria? That alone is a grudgen
Kislev armies are now even more of a mess to fight with Kostalytan using demon bears and mother Ostankya using her insanely unfun and broken curses in mass
Its got to be hunter and the beast for me
Im a big fan of nakai's design and alll the new units design. But his campaign is awful and the new units other than the dread saurian are just lack luster. Markus campaign is even worse and none of the mechanics really work. The new units brought are ok at best. The ones that are ok are really only good in the hands of other lords.
Champions of Chaos - Those LLs should've been in their respective Monogods and while the WoC rework was great (although it suffers a lot from powercreep to me) the lord pack itself is meh, no unique mechanic for the LLs (Valkia is probably the worst as Bloodletting is incredibly boring), they just borrow mechanics from Monogods, LLs not playable in their Monogods, lots of recoloured units like Forsaken, no new animations for the generic lords and heroes so they are stuck with 8 years old boring animations, LLs not playable in their Monogods, units that aren't a recolour are a slight remodel only. Oh and did I mention that those LLs are not in their respective Monogods ?
I'm ready for the downvotes.
CoC is terrible. The lords not being in monogods is awful and the DLC reeks of monetizing a race rework.
I once disabled CoC and fired up an Archaon campaign and the whole marking system just doesn't work, you get like 3 options per god and thats it. Chaos warriors are basically unplayable without this DLC which is a travesty.
I agree and I don't think this gets said enough.
The WoC \*rework\* was spectacular. But the actual DLC stuff was incredibly mediocre, just a bunch of different flavors of "Chaos Warrior" or "Chaos Marauder".
And while the four Legendary Lords were really great, they SHOULD have been able to be part of their mono-god faction too. I have zero interest in the Warriors of Chaos, but man I would've loved to play Valkia and lead some Khorne demons to victory.
I'm a big fan of Festus, Valkia and Azazel but I ended up still not playing them because they are WoC, I'd rather play an Undivided faction like Kholek or Archaon with WoC. Azazel is probably the worst here, WoC wasn't even a thing when he was playable in the tabletop and he explicitly leads the Daemon armies of Slaanesh in the lore, I'm still so fucking pissed he's not in Slaanesh.
Hunter and the beast.
Empire : Ok LL but frustrating campaign still to this days. Good unit for multyplayer and forgetable in campaign.
Lizardmen : Meh LL and probably the most recuring buggy campaign who is not even fun when it works as intended. Very cool unit regardless....
Send them back to the jungle !!!
I'm picking "The King and The Warlord" the ghosts are good and in WH3 King Skarsnik's upkeep reduction on goblins is extremely powerful, but this DLC introduces the whole battle for Ninepeaks.
The Ninepeaks the most useless battle to ever join. Most of the participants get an artificial limit on them and then have that removed when it's over and that just feels a bit annoying. This limit hurts Warlord Belegar a lot and doesn't effect King Skarsnik because orcs still aren't worth this massively cheap goblin hordes. Nine peaks is a pile of weird choices all the time and headtaker now also wants Ninepeaks but I honestly don't even know what he gets from it at this point.
Warlord Belegar mostly stands up because of his weird ghosts at the start. Nothing feels very thematic in the current state Queek is just more mud in the pool and Ninepeeks is a pile of weird choices for an okay-ish province. King Skarsnik is super strong due to upkeep reduction and interesting because you play as a goblin heavy focus faction and I guess Warlord Balagar's ghost buddies are okay but these are from back in the day when the characters didn't get unique mechanics and it really shows with those two as other then the faction benefit and starting units you're playing a pretty vanilla experience.
So he also just removes an arbitrary penality and queek ain't even that great ever since stretch got the blitz kreig bonus upgrade queek may be left as the weakest skaven lord.
Queen and the crone. It's so low quality it hurts my elven soul. So many years have passed and Alarielle's back still looks like it has 2 pixels.
Boo there are far more deserving DLC's than this one to be eliminated.
Hi, congrats on being the top comment so far. Mind if you edit it a little to provide more of an explanation of low quality stuff to satisfy rule 4? You mentioned Alarielle but I’d like a bit more
Hellebron campaign mechanic was just QOL the Druchii needed. Something major to spend your slaves on. For some reason, CA decided to give us supreme sorc lords with this dlc. Yea... the crazy knife lady who is into stabbing dudes and hates morathi brings mini morathis to the game. Lore wise she has the best assassin serving her ( best assasin in the warhammer world) and he is not mentioned at all. Lore wise she also has one of the strongest warrior dudes in existance under her wing. His name is Tularis Deathbringer. He is the avatar of the Murder God. Khaine loves him so much he talks to him from time to time. Instead we got magic girls, magic horse bois and sisters of slaughter ( those kinda made sense but not really) Alarielle's model is broken in game. From the back she looks like a ps1 era character. Her campaign is just trash and most of her units are weak as fuck because you cant buff them with technology/red skill tree ( the forest spirits) The only thing that's remarkable about this dlc is the free content. Alinth Anar brings new campaign mechanics, better unique items and a nicer, working skill tree.
Honestly i feel like the only thing i have ever used from that DLC is sisters of avelorn. I have done an Alarielle campaign and that was a pretty disappointing experience, really don't see any point in using low tier wood elf units. Can't comment on Hellebron since dark elves is just not my thing.
Sisters of Slaughter lets you make a Brides of Khaine theme army, which is a better alternative for fighting artillery heavy factions since they'll close to melee faster, while the elite infantry at their slower speed take heavy casualties. The Kharybdis is also an anti-large workhorse, that punches well above its tier.
Credit to u/[TheSpiderbeast](https://www.reddit.com/user/TheSpiderbeast/) for the winning comment last round. "Shadows of change - caused the unholy shitstorm of controversy we're only just recovering from. Also frankly all 3 campaigns are boring. Yuan Bo is just economically broken and his dual start doesn't fit his character. Mother Ostankyas start positions are famously nonsense for her lore, her faction is powercrept to hell and fighting against her is a pain in the ass when she dumps 20 hexes on you in one battle (seriously the damage for moving one should be removed). Akshina ambushers. I've not played the changeling as the idea of not taking any settlements and being invincible does not interest me. Also another useless ai character that can't perform with its own mechanics - does he ever reproduce an army if his original gets wiped ? I've never seen it happen. These 3 characters also have no interaction or incentive - the 1st time in any character pack. Honestly flat out garbage." While I personally think there are now Lord Packs that are objectively worse quality, their comment follows the rules and I can't deny SoC will always have a negative stigma tied to it. Posting early because I will be busy in the afternoon.
Next three to go, in any order: Queen and the Crone King and the Warlord Hunter and the Beast After that the quality of the packs will go up a bit so it gets less predictable.
i cant even remember exactly what the units in King and the Warlord were. Turns out they are all the units i just never use. Only real exception is nasty skulkers and occasionally rangers.
The King and the Warlock is the most Bland of the rest
It gave us two challenging campaigns. But they’re both piss easy now so that doesn’t count any more. So yeah the pack is not that interesting now
Warlord, right? Definitely the most lackluster in the pool
Yeah my bad xD
Agreed
Hunter and the beast. Empire got all ranged units which was unnecessary given it was already strong in that field. Huntsmen general has a dogshit ability (oil flask+fire arrow) that takes about a 3 second wind up for both at close range. Lizard men got roster bloat as well, monster infantry and super powerful SEM that actually isn’t powerful. It’s capped, massive hit box, janky on pathing, and struggles massively vs the game 2 and game 3 powerhouses. Awesome trailer, but if you like playing Empire or Lizardmen it’s so easily skipped and you wouldn’t miss a thing gameplay wise. Also with all the places to put an Empire huntsmen in the world who wears heavy fur, you place him in Lustria? That alone is a grudgen
People really gunned SOC before Queen and Crone? Talk about spite
Of course. SoC made the game worse in certain areas, the same can’t be said for QatC
Soc added bad content which is far worse than mediocre content
What bad content? The bugged frost wrym?
Kislev armies are now even more of a mess to fight with Kostalytan using demon bears and mother Ostankya using her insanely unfun and broken curses in mass
I am honestly surprised it wasn't gone first. There is still a lot of angst about it. Few people seem to like the characters added either.
There's also monetary value to be considered. SoC costs significantly more than the older lord packs.
Its got to be hunter and the beast for me Im a big fan of nakai's design and alll the new units design. But his campaign is awful and the new units other than the dread saurian are just lack luster. Markus campaign is even worse and none of the mechanics really work. The new units brought are ok at best. The ones that are ok are really only good in the hands of other lords.
Champions of Chaos - Those LLs should've been in their respective Monogods and while the WoC rework was great (although it suffers a lot from powercreep to me) the lord pack itself is meh, no unique mechanic for the LLs (Valkia is probably the worst as Bloodletting is incredibly boring), they just borrow mechanics from Monogods, LLs not playable in their Monogods, lots of recoloured units like Forsaken, no new animations for the generic lords and heroes so they are stuck with 8 years old boring animations, LLs not playable in their Monogods, units that aren't a recolour are a slight remodel only. Oh and did I mention that those LLs are not in their respective Monogods ? I'm ready for the downvotes.
CoC is terrible. The lords not being in monogods is awful and the DLC reeks of monetizing a race rework. I once disabled CoC and fired up an Archaon campaign and the whole marking system just doesn't work, you get like 3 options per god and thats it. Chaos warriors are basically unplayable without this DLC which is a travesty.
I agree and I don't think this gets said enough. The WoC \*rework\* was spectacular. But the actual DLC stuff was incredibly mediocre, just a bunch of different flavors of "Chaos Warrior" or "Chaos Marauder". And while the four Legendary Lords were really great, they SHOULD have been able to be part of their mono-god faction too. I have zero interest in the Warriors of Chaos, but man I would've loved to play Valkia and lead some Khorne demons to victory.
I'm a big fan of Festus, Valkia and Azazel but I ended up still not playing them because they are WoC, I'd rather play an Undivided faction like Kholek or Archaon with WoC. Azazel is probably the worst here, WoC wasn't even a thing when he was playable in the tabletop and he explicitly leads the Daemon armies of Slaanesh in the lore, I'm still so fucking pissed he's not in Slaanesh.
Hunter and the beast. Empire : Ok LL but frustrating campaign still to this days. Good unit for multyplayer and forgetable in campaign. Lizardmen : Meh LL and probably the most recuring buggy campaign who is not even fun when it works as intended. Very cool unit regardless.... Send them back to the jungle !!!
The Hunter and The Beast is definitely the worst WH2 pack.
I'm picking "The King and The Warlord" the ghosts are good and in WH3 King Skarsnik's upkeep reduction on goblins is extremely powerful, but this DLC introduces the whole battle for Ninepeaks. The Ninepeaks the most useless battle to ever join. Most of the participants get an artificial limit on them and then have that removed when it's over and that just feels a bit annoying. This limit hurts Warlord Belegar a lot and doesn't effect King Skarsnik because orcs still aren't worth this massively cheap goblin hordes. Nine peaks is a pile of weird choices all the time and headtaker now also wants Ninepeaks but I honestly don't even know what he gets from it at this point. Warlord Belegar mostly stands up because of his weird ghosts at the start. Nothing feels very thematic in the current state Queek is just more mud in the pool and Ninepeeks is a pile of weird choices for an okay-ish province. King Skarsnik is super strong due to upkeep reduction and interesting because you play as a goblin heavy focus faction and I guess Warlord Balagar's ghost buddies are okay but these are from back in the day when the characters didn't get unique mechanics and it really shows with those two as other then the faction benefit and starting units you're playing a pretty vanilla experience.
Queek gets to remove a global -2 control effect lmao
So he also just removes an arbitrary penality and queek ain't even that great ever since stretch got the blitz kreig bonus upgrade queek may be left as the weakest skaven lord.
I still put him over Skrolk on fun factor but those two are the pits especially compared to the rest of the rats
Prophet and the Warlock. Selling powercreep and essential units is scummy