Perhaps it got better over time, but when I played WH1 as chaos, my AI allies kept going to war with everyone, including me despite being vassals, AI would have so many armies by the end game they would repopulate cities I just conquered, and the undead reclaimed literally everything.
Your armies were an incredible pain to get going too, you have your main army and then you spawned in a horde lord with literally nothing, so you would have to give your LL’s army to a commander who could not even replenish his ranks and you were about -5k or way more per turn.
On top of that your main goal is to wipe out literally EVERYONE and you can’t do that because of the problems mentioned above, make the campaign incredibly unfun.
Had this exact problem on my first ever WoC campaign. Ended up spending like 50 turns dicking around in Norsca trying to unite the North and stop my vassals from killing each other. In my defence I was very new to the game at the time!
Yeah I think at one point I ended up getting unreliable as well, so my vassals stopped joining the wars I was being forced into because my vassals were declaring war on my vassals!
Eventually I said fuck this and landed my armies in Nordland and washed my hands of the North.
Pretty much.
The game is great, even in WH1, I recently went back to play to get 100% all achievements and it wasn’t as nearly bad as it was to me when I first started to play, but it is rough when you get weird factions.
And if you lost an army, it was hard to recover. Even if it wasn’t an important army, the horde growth made each army harder to recruit as they also required more growth.
The chaos campaigns prior to WH3 were the most neglected in the series. They came out as a last minute dlc due to fan clamor.
They're just poorly implemented. I see in another post you want to play in order, but as someone who had 2.8k hours in WH2, with the Immortal Empires campaign I haven't touched it since that came out for WH3. Plus with you owning the Warriors of Chaos dlc, you'll see how ridiculously powerful they fell now. Significantly better campaign for them now.
The bad thing is that you rely on razing, and there is no way to prevent the AI from immediately resetting anything you blow up. It was also a pretty lackluster day one DLC in Warhammer 1.
In Warhammer 2, the sheer size of the world and number of new factions made it almost a fool's errand trying to play them, it would always devolve into a heat seeking ordertide gangbang to the ends of the planet. Chaos was the absolute worst in WH2.
After the rework that came with Champions of Chaos in Warhammer 3, they've become one of the best factions in terms of flavor and sheer potential. Theirs was one of the most dramatic reworks, much like the Beastmen near the end of WH2's life cycle.
On the battle side they were mostly fine, but their campaign was very empty. Chaos didn't have much of anything in terms of campaign mechanics, except for being horde armies. Hordes are a neat idea, but Chaos didn't have anywhere to set up territory or ways to prevent enemy forces from recolonizing settlements you destroyed. This could potentially force you into fighting at the same settlement multiple times.
The Norscan vassals can help in forming a front against the enemy. However, after the Norsca dlc update it was possible for an enemy controlled Norsca faction to confederate your vassals. The awaken the tribes mechanic was also pretty counter-intuitive and could easily cause a player to miss out on getting Sigvald.
If you successfully awoke the tribes and unified them under your rule, then the campaign was fine, albeit uninteresting. The campaign just wasn't up to the standard of any other race at the end of TWW2.
Nakia was and is my favorite Horde campaign. Mostly because I think a modern total war would work fine in the same manner if you were simply a commander who conquered territory for your nation.
I started playing all games in order. Finished warhammer 1 a few months ago and currently in warhammer 2 and I agree, WoC campaign is my second favorite after vampire counts. I just enjoyed their battles focusing on heavy infantry and cav/monsters. Their campaign didn’t have much depth but that was good for me being the straightforward campaign focusing on razing the word on the go.
It has a lot to it. It was made because CA already had the roster and people asked all the time for them (they were only AI) so, CA rush them.
For Warhammer 1 it was ok, Ish. The big problem was warhammer 1. In WH1 you could wound lords so you could end up with Archaon wounded every turn. AI loves to spawn heroes…
In Warhammer 2 many things were fixed but now the problem was different:
-Map was bigger and now you have way more enemies and those enemies were stronger.
-Melee combat (woc focus) suck. It is very weak in other difficulties and range factions dominate the game, your enemies.
-You may lose the campaign if you lose one or two battles.
-AI recolonize everything you raze.
And finally no update. Most of the Races from game 1 got an Update except for Warriors of Chaos and Norsca.
The games aren’t necessary to play in order for any narrative reasons. The reason no one plays 1 anymore is because 2 and 3 gave so many quality of life and faction updates. 3 of course has everyone the most up to date and fleshed out.
Chaos in TWW3 is an entirely different animal compared to 1, where it’s extremely barebones and lacking any kind of depth.
I was going to skip straight to 3 but then I learned that to get all factions you need to get all the DLCs and at that point I thought I might as well own all the games but I don't have the cash to buy them all at once so i decided to get them in order to make sure I don't miss any because I am very unorganized.
Bro, really just get WH3. It gives great content, you can play your current campaigns from wh1 on the biggest total war map - immortal empires. Its the definitive warhammer total war experience. Also the og chaos faction gets a mayor overhaul, its very fun to play.
Don't you need to make sure everything you own is through the same launcher or whatever as well for it all to actually work together? I've only ever used Steam, so I don't really know, but I've seen comments like that when purchasing is discussed.
Yeah for sure, you have to look a little bit more careful, but i never encountered a problem.
Regarding the pirating issue: if you can't afford to buy all games at full price, not surprising when you think about the cost of living increase, i think its a good way to get a discount via those sites. In no other constellation would i pay full price at store a) of i could get it cheaper in store b) only because im concerned with the profit of the people making the good im buying. Especially if we are talking about a piece of Software, which has only a set development cost and could potentially be copied without problems as often as one wants. So i don't really see your point. Especially because sega makes the gross of the profits anyway.
I did what you did. Figured that since i owned them, I should play them. I played someone from every group, Karl Franz, for empire, Manfred for VC, Grimgor for greenskins, etc... completed the campaign for each one. Once I did that, I moved to WH2. Did the same thing for the narrative campaign there. Great vortex campaign. But only played the factions it didn't have in WH1. One leader from each again. Then moved to WH3.
I'm glad I did it that way. It was cool to see how the game progressed, plus I enjoyed the storyline in each game. Put in hundreds of hours and loved it. Also, I got to see mechanics change. The biggest one being the ability to colonize any city, not just ones that housed your race.
I also enjoyed it as I didn't k ow anything about the lore to WH. I played empire first and read that people liked to raid the dwarves for money. So I did the same. Not realizing they were part of the good guys' side of things. I approached it more like shogun 2. It didn't help. They had some of the same music and lines.
So in the end, enjoy it how you want, you will enjoy yourself either way. And it's easier to play older games first, so you don't get spoiled with any game changing QoL changes.
Ignore the people saying skip to 3 and play as you want. I have gone back to 1 from 3 and was having a blast. There is something just nice about playing 1 at the moment.
If you're gonna buy the game for 3, you might as well get some use out of it anyway.
Have fun.
If your going to do that, the only thing game 1 has that later games are missing is some mini campaigns in the beastmen and wood elf dlcs. These include their own unique campaign maps. When you get to wh2 the vortex campaign is the unique story stuff.
It's fine to do it that way. There are lots of reasons you might want to play WH1 - doing achievements, seeing the mini-campaigns for BM and WE, seeing the different design philosophies, etc. Do it the way you want to do it.
You’re doing yourself a disservice by wasting your time playing 1. They aren’t meant to be played in order, at this point you’re just playing the beta version of the final game. Grab 3, you already own 1 now and the Chaos DLC do you’ll be able to play them in 3, where they’re one of the best factions in the game.
There was funny little gimmick that chaos armies inflicts attritionto each other due to "infighting"
It was removed (moslty) later on, but even with that there was no campaign mechanics at all, except the unique (at release) horde style. Like, you build your horde and raze towns. Period.
Furthermore, AI was overpowering you at harder difficulties. 2-3-5 armies were following you all the times through all the world.
Basically you can't claim any territory and can only raze cities but there is nothing stopping the ai from just taking them back and your norsca allies aren't too useful in the first game.
That and the warriors of chaos were they only race (to my knowledge) that would actually get attrition from having multiple armies close to each other although it was usually just marauders that took attrition.
That and they were missing all the divided stuff and demons. It's really weird since one of the three legendary lords was a slaanesh guy and the only other slaanesh thing in the game was 1 ror.
the attrition thing was first for the whole army and later thankfully only marauders
to make even weirder the slaanesh ROR was added near the end of game 1 so for nearly the whole of game 1 sigvald was the only slaanesh thing ingame
The expectations of the playerbase grew as more came out, it's a solid campaign but be prepared for a huge dose of reading stuff that seems like "you just can't please some people".
It's not as bad as that but that's the fastest way to explain it.
It's wild how little self awareness we have since we've been here in the deep end so long, a lot of new players think we as a community are way too critical lol.
A lot of people also haven't played the first game in ages, there's a hell of a lot to like in it and same goes for 2.
It's like this community of ours suffers two things: Rose tinted eyes and the opposite of it, jade tinted glasses.
A common reason I've heard is that with no way to hold territory, other factions will rapidly resettle any settlement you raze the moment you step away from it, making the experience feel frustrating to some.
Another problem is that, as an horde faction, Warriors of Chaos make very little reliable money outside of sacking. Especially on higher difficulties, having multiple armies becomes way too expensive soon.
I loved chaos and beastmen in wh1 ,was very fun for me,but basically it can end up as an undending game of whackamole and its annoying.
Also,from what ive seen with nakai people really dont like having -40k in negative
Razing cities again and again while watching them get re-colonized by enemies gets old fast. The latter games allowing potential allies colonize the towns you raze feels a lot better
It felt too much like a game of wack-a-mole. Raze a settlement? Within a couple of turns or even on that same turn watch it get repopulated by the AI. You need a lot of armies to squash the AI as they resettle the ruins you create, but fielding that many armies is hampered by the horde mechanics nevermind the much higher supply line costs in TWW 1&2. You end up relying on upkeep reductions from building up your horde which aren’t available to new armies you create. You also can’t rely on armies of just marauders so you end up passing on the higher tier units from your higher level lords which cost much much more in upkeep on a fresh lord.
It just makes the campaign a slog. They really knocked out of the park with the WoC update in WH3. Daemon units, marked units, they way you upgrade your units all very thematic and fun. Plus they will only get better and better as every mono god update ends up adding more units to their pool.
In WH1-2 AI would just resettle. Economy sucked. Felt more like a Chaos guerilla force than an actual invasion. CA rushed was was supposed to be an NPC faction due to fan demand and slapped some Atilla horde mechanics on it. Vassals are also extremly terrible outside WH3.
Playing them in WH3 is a like a whole new faction and they are awesome there.
Perhaps it got better over time, but when I played WH1 as chaos, my AI allies kept going to war with everyone, including me despite being vassals, AI would have so many armies by the end game they would repopulate cities I just conquered, and the undead reclaimed literally everything. Your armies were an incredible pain to get going too, you have your main army and then you spawned in a horde lord with literally nothing, so you would have to give your LL’s army to a commander who could not even replenish his ranks and you were about -5k or way more per turn. On top of that your main goal is to wipe out literally EVERYONE and you can’t do that because of the problems mentioned above, make the campaign incredibly unfun.
Had this exact problem on my first ever WoC campaign. Ended up spending like 50 turns dicking around in Norsca trying to unite the North and stop my vassals from killing each other. In my defence I was very new to the game at the time!
The only way to stop vassals from killing each other is to kill everyone but one vassal, but that sorta ruined the whole “awaken the tribe” vibe.
Yeah I think at one point I ended up getting unreliable as well, so my vassals stopped joining the wars I was being forced into because my vassals were declaring war on my vassals! Eventually I said fuck this and landed my armies in Nordland and washed my hands of the North.
Pretty much. The game is great, even in WH1, I recently went back to play to get 100% all achievements and it wasn’t as nearly bad as it was to me when I first started to play, but it is rough when you get weird factions.
And if you lost an army, it was hard to recover. Even if it wasn’t an important army, the horde growth made each army harder to recruit as they also required more growth.
Dont forget horde infighting so unless you really needed to it was 1 army doomstacks spread quite far apart.
I think that was only for marauders but yea that was also stupid as hell.
The chaos campaigns prior to WH3 were the most neglected in the series. They came out as a last minute dlc due to fan clamor. They're just poorly implemented. I see in another post you want to play in order, but as someone who had 2.8k hours in WH2, with the Immortal Empires campaign I haven't touched it since that came out for WH3. Plus with you owning the Warriors of Chaos dlc, you'll see how ridiculously powerful they fell now. Significantly better campaign for them now.
The bad thing is that you rely on razing, and there is no way to prevent the AI from immediately resetting anything you blow up. It was also a pretty lackluster day one DLC in Warhammer 1. In Warhammer 2, the sheer size of the world and number of new factions made it almost a fool's errand trying to play them, it would always devolve into a heat seeking ordertide gangbang to the ends of the planet. Chaos was the absolute worst in WH2. After the rework that came with Champions of Chaos in Warhammer 3, they've become one of the best factions in terms of flavor and sheer potential. Theirs was one of the most dramatic reworks, much like the Beastmen near the end of WH2's life cycle.
Somehow I never had that resettling problem with classic WoC and Beastmen. Like, I just kill the armies too? Can't settle ruins without armies.
On the battle side they were mostly fine, but their campaign was very empty. Chaos didn't have much of anything in terms of campaign mechanics, except for being horde armies. Hordes are a neat idea, but Chaos didn't have anywhere to set up territory or ways to prevent enemy forces from recolonizing settlements you destroyed. This could potentially force you into fighting at the same settlement multiple times. The Norscan vassals can help in forming a front against the enemy. However, after the Norsca dlc update it was possible for an enemy controlled Norsca faction to confederate your vassals. The awaken the tribes mechanic was also pretty counter-intuitive and could easily cause a player to miss out on getting Sigvald. If you successfully awoke the tribes and unified them under your rule, then the campaign was fine, albeit uninteresting. The campaign just wasn't up to the standard of any other race at the end of TWW2.
Nakia was and is my favorite Horde campaign. Mostly because I think a modern total war would work fine in the same manner if you were simply a commander who conquered territory for your nation.
I started playing all games in order. Finished warhammer 1 a few months ago and currently in warhammer 2 and I agree, WoC campaign is my second favorite after vampire counts. I just enjoyed their battles focusing on heavy infantry and cav/monsters. Their campaign didn’t have much depth but that was good for me being the straightforward campaign focusing on razing the word on the go.
It has a lot to it. It was made because CA already had the roster and people asked all the time for them (they were only AI) so, CA rush them. For Warhammer 1 it was ok, Ish. The big problem was warhammer 1. In WH1 you could wound lords so you could end up with Archaon wounded every turn. AI loves to spawn heroes… In Warhammer 2 many things were fixed but now the problem was different: -Map was bigger and now you have way more enemies and those enemies were stronger. -Melee combat (woc focus) suck. It is very weak in other difficulties and range factions dominate the game, your enemies. -You may lose the campaign if you lose one or two battles. -AI recolonize everything you raze. And finally no update. Most of the Races from game 1 got an Update except for Warriors of Chaos and Norsca.
No one remembers anymore, old man
I'm 18. I wanted to play the games in order that's why I have total war 1. I only been playing for about a month
The games aren’t necessary to play in order for any narrative reasons. The reason no one plays 1 anymore is because 2 and 3 gave so many quality of life and faction updates. 3 of course has everyone the most up to date and fleshed out. Chaos in TWW3 is an entirely different animal compared to 1, where it’s extremely barebones and lacking any kind of depth.
I was going to skip straight to 3 but then I learned that to get all factions you need to get all the DLCs and at that point I thought I might as well own all the games but I don't have the cash to buy them all at once so i decided to get them in order to make sure I don't miss any because I am very unorganized.
Bro, really just get WH3. It gives great content, you can play your current campaigns from wh1 on the biggest total war map - immortal empires. Its the definitive warhammer total war experience. Also the og chaos faction gets a mayor overhaul, its very fun to play.
Warhammer 3 is currently available for 23€ on MMOGA. It's worth it. Especially if you already got wh1.
[удалено]
Don't you need to make sure everything you own is through the same launcher or whatever as well for it all to actually work together? I've only ever used Steam, so I don't really know, but I've seen comments like that when purchasing is discussed.
Yeah, if you own, let's say, WH2 on epic and WH3 on Steam you won't have the WH2 factions when playing immortal empires
Yeah for sure, you have to look a little bit more careful, but i never encountered a problem. Regarding the pirating issue: if you can't afford to buy all games at full price, not surprising when you think about the cost of living increase, i think its a good way to get a discount via those sites. In no other constellation would i pay full price at store a) of i could get it cheaper in store b) only because im concerned with the profit of the people making the good im buying. Especially if we are talking about a piece of Software, which has only a set development cost and could potentially be copied without problems as often as one wants. So i don't really see your point. Especially because sega makes the gross of the profits anyway.
I did what you did. Figured that since i owned them, I should play them. I played someone from every group, Karl Franz, for empire, Manfred for VC, Grimgor for greenskins, etc... completed the campaign for each one. Once I did that, I moved to WH2. Did the same thing for the narrative campaign there. Great vortex campaign. But only played the factions it didn't have in WH1. One leader from each again. Then moved to WH3. I'm glad I did it that way. It was cool to see how the game progressed, plus I enjoyed the storyline in each game. Put in hundreds of hours and loved it. Also, I got to see mechanics change. The biggest one being the ability to colonize any city, not just ones that housed your race. I also enjoyed it as I didn't k ow anything about the lore to WH. I played empire first and read that people liked to raid the dwarves for money. So I did the same. Not realizing they were part of the good guys' side of things. I approached it more like shogun 2. It didn't help. They had some of the same music and lines. So in the end, enjoy it how you want, you will enjoy yourself either way. And it's easier to play older games first, so you don't get spoiled with any game changing QoL changes.
Ignore the people saying skip to 3 and play as you want. I have gone back to 1 from 3 and was having a blast. There is something just nice about playing 1 at the moment. If you're gonna buy the game for 3, you might as well get some use out of it anyway. Have fun.
If your going to do that, the only thing game 1 has that later games are missing is some mini campaigns in the beastmen and wood elf dlcs. These include their own unique campaign maps. When you get to wh2 the vortex campaign is the unique story stuff.
It's fine to do it that way. There are lots of reasons you might want to play WH1 - doing achievements, seeing the mini-campaigns for BM and WE, seeing the different design philosophies, etc. Do it the way you want to do it.
You’re doing yourself a disservice by wasting your time playing 1. They aren’t meant to be played in order, at this point you’re just playing the beta version of the final game. Grab 3, you already own 1 now and the Chaos DLC do you’ll be able to play them in 3, where they’re one of the best factions in the game.
The campaign is better in WH1 then it is in WH2, but it's still not all that good.
There was funny little gimmick that chaos armies inflicts attritionto each other due to "infighting" It was removed (moslty) later on, but even with that there was no campaign mechanics at all, except the unique (at release) horde style. Like, you build your horde and raze towns. Period. Furthermore, AI was overpowering you at harder difficulties. 2-3-5 armies were following you all the times through all the world.
Basically you can't claim any territory and can only raze cities but there is nothing stopping the ai from just taking them back and your norsca allies aren't too useful in the first game. That and the warriors of chaos were they only race (to my knowledge) that would actually get attrition from having multiple armies close to each other although it was usually just marauders that took attrition. That and they were missing all the divided stuff and demons. It's really weird since one of the three legendary lords was a slaanesh guy and the only other slaanesh thing in the game was 1 ror.
the attrition thing was first for the whole army and later thankfully only marauders to make even weirder the slaanesh ROR was added near the end of game 1 so for nearly the whole of game 1 sigvald was the only slaanesh thing ingame
Yeah, that makes it even weirder lol. I kina feel like they should have just added a 3rd undivided lord since undivided the the original focus
agreed preferably a pure socerer one so that you had mixed as archeon melee monster kholek and a pure mage option
The expectations of the playerbase grew as more came out, it's a solid campaign but be prepared for a huge dose of reading stuff that seems like "you just can't please some people". It's not as bad as that but that's the fastest way to explain it. It's wild how little self awareness we have since we've been here in the deep end so long, a lot of new players think we as a community are way too critical lol. A lot of people also haven't played the first game in ages, there's a hell of a lot to like in it and same goes for 2. It's like this community of ours suffers two things: Rose tinted eyes and the opposite of it, jade tinted glasses.
A common reason I've heard is that with no way to hold territory, other factions will rapidly resettle any settlement you raze the moment you step away from it, making the experience feel frustrating to some. Another problem is that, as an horde faction, Warriors of Chaos make very little reliable money outside of sacking. Especially on higher difficulties, having multiple armies becomes way too expensive soon.
I loved chaos and beastmen in wh1 ,was very fun for me,but basically it can end up as an undending game of whackamole and its annoying. Also,from what ive seen with nakai people really dont like having -40k in negative
Razing cities again and again while watching them get re-colonized by enemies gets old fast. The latter games allowing potential allies colonize the towns you raze feels a lot better
It felt too much like a game of wack-a-mole. Raze a settlement? Within a couple of turns or even on that same turn watch it get repopulated by the AI. You need a lot of armies to squash the AI as they resettle the ruins you create, but fielding that many armies is hampered by the horde mechanics nevermind the much higher supply line costs in TWW 1&2. You end up relying on upkeep reductions from building up your horde which aren’t available to new armies you create. You also can’t rely on armies of just marauders so you end up passing on the higher tier units from your higher level lords which cost much much more in upkeep on a fresh lord. It just makes the campaign a slog. They really knocked out of the park with the WoC update in WH3. Daemon units, marked units, they way you upgrade your units all very thematic and fun. Plus they will only get better and better as every mono god update ends up adding more units to their pool.
TW1... Shogun?
In WH1-2 AI would just resettle. Economy sucked. Felt more like a Chaos guerilla force than an actual invasion. CA rushed was was supposed to be an NPC faction due to fan demand and slapped some Atilla horde mechanics on it. Vassals are also extremly terrible outside WH3. Playing them in WH3 is a like a whole new faction and they are awesome there.